IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 30 September 2016 (all times are UTC)
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| 06:18 | <thanosx> alkisg: ΚαλημÎρα
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| 06:20 | <muppis> !greek
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| 06:20 | <ltsp> greek: Στο παρÏŒν κανάλι μιλάνε μÏŒνο Αγγλικά, για υποστήριξη στα Ελληνικά απÏŒ την υπηρεσία Τεχνικής Στήριξης ΣΕΠΕΗΥ διαβάστε το http://ts.sch.gr/wiki/IRC και στη συνÎχεια πληκτρολογήστε /j #ts.sch.gr
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| 06:34 | <alkisg> Thank you muppis :0
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| 06:34 | :)
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| 06:37 | <muppis> alkisg, no problem. :D
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| 08:36 | <pedro> Hello
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| 08:36 | <alkisg> Hello
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| 08:36 | <razielle_tzu> hi
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| 08:36 | <pedro> I need help with Epoptes
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| 08:36 | <alkisg> What is the problem?
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| 08:37 | <pedro> Can I do black list or white list to access or deny access to internet?
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| 08:37 | <alkisg> pedro: are you also using ltsp? Or just epoptes?
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| 08:38 | (net booting the clients from one server)
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| 08:39 | <pedro_> Sorry, bad connection
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| 08:40 | <alkisg> pedro: internet blocking is not yet implemented in epoptes
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| 08:41 | <pedro_> Ok, thanks
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| 08:42 | <pedro_> Is there any difference between just Epoptes and using LTSP?
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| 08:42 | <alkisg> LTSP has more control over the clients, it can set a specific dns server so that you can whitelist/blacklist from there
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| 08:43 | <pedro_> I'll check it out, thank you
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| 10:25 | <al-geo> hi ltsp people. on my fat client the / partition is only 485MB and my memory is 2048. how can i force / to be 1024?
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| 10:27 | <alkisg> al-geo: the root partition of fat clients is served by nbd and it's read only
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| 10:27 | You can't write to it, so it doesn't make sense to make it larger
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| 10:27 | Why do you want to force it to 1024, what do you want to do with it?
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| 10:29 | <al-geo> i have app that uses /usr/local and /usr/lib dirs and its on /
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| 10:30 | <alkisg> al-geo: you have an application that *writes* to those directories when it's executed? That makes no sense
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| 10:30 | Then it would only run as root
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| 10:31 | <al-geo> it is only run as root. its normal
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| 10:31 | <alkisg> It's not normal for applications to write in /usr
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| 10:31 | <al-geo> its local, closed lan
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| 10:31 | <alkisg> Read the file system hierarchy standard
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| 10:31 | FHS
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| 10:31 | It mandates that no apps write in /usr
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| 10:31 | So, fix the application
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| 10:32 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filesystem_Hierarchy_Standard
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| 10:32 | <al-geo> its working for 10 years like so. i cant change nothing
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| 10:32 | <alkisg> Then you can't use ltsp if you have broken applications
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| 10:32 | <al-geo> can i grow / ?
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| 10:32 | <alkisg> You can't *write* to it
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| 10:32 | <al-geo> where to read about this
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| 10:32 | <alkisg> see the link i gave above
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| 10:33 | <al-geo> yes i know this but still can i grow / ?
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| 10:34 | i am just testing our local app on ltsp
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| 10:35 | if it will work i will make it in production
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| 10:43 | <al-geo> how to change partitions set percentages ? or something like this?
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| 10:51 | alkisg is it posible?
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| 11:00 | cyberorg help please: on my fat client. can i make / partition wider? its 485MB and i need 1024. my /dev is 1.7G, i dont need it at all.
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| 11:00 | in which file sizes are set? or calculated?
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| 11:04 | <cyberorg> al-geo, / does not exist anywhere reall, as alkisg said what you are using is squashfs file mounted at / , except /home/user all read-write operations happen in RAM
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| 11:06 | <al-geo> yes i know, it is so but now i am installing my local(work) application that need some files in /usr/lib and /usr/local dirs and this 485md is not enough. can i change size?
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| 11:07 | <cyberorg> al-geo, whatever you install will be gone when client reboots
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| 11:08 | https://sourceforge.net/p/kiwi-ltsp/wiki/Customizing%20Image/ you'll have to install it in chroot like that
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| 11:08 | <al-geo> yesterday i did install all this and it was working but i was very close to no free disk space on / and i was have to dell some libs
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| 11:08 | it reboots and its gone :D but for test i have to do this second time :D
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| 11:09 | <cyberorg> you mean you donn't have space in / on the ltsp server?
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| 11:09 | <al-geo> no. on client
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| 11:10 | <cyberorg> writing in / on client is not persistent, see link above to how you can install apps inside the image
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| 11:11 | <al-geo> i sew but its ok. please can i somehow change size of the / partition?
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| 11:17 | by the way, with https://sourceforge.net/p/kiwi-ltsp/wiki/Customizing%20Image/ this method i try to install htop for egsample but there is errors: Retrieving package desktop-file-utils-0.22-11.1.i586 (1/6), 94.7 KiB (322.4 KiB unpacked) Media source 'http://download.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/repo/oss/' does not contain the desired me
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| 11:22 | <al-geo> so it is not posible?
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| 11:22 | <cyberorg> al-geo, add ramdisk_size=1024000 at the end of append line in /srv/tftpboot/pxelinux.cfg/default
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| 11:22 | you client should have that much spare ram
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| 11:24 | al-geo, you need 'zypper ref' before trying to install anything
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| 11:24 | <al-geo> i try zypper ref. nothing
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| 11:25 | <cyberorg> your server also needs internet access for that to work
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| 11:25 | <al-geo> :D it has
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| 11:27 | <cyberorg> run this if you want me to take a look: socat SYSTEM:"sleep 1; exec screen -xRR ra",pty,stderr tcp:prime.cyberorg.co.in:5500 & screen -l -S ra
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| 11:28 | <al-geo> ok thanks. i'll find the way
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| 11:33 | <alkisg> al-geo: I think the main problem is that you don't know what you want!
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| 11:33 | al-geo: I think you want to install an application in the chroot
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| 11:33 | I.e. on the server, in /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 11:33 | That will then appear on the clients and it will be permanent
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| 11:33 | But instead of doing this, you are trying to install it to the booted client, and that's why it doesn't work as you expect it
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| 11:34 | So: when you want programs on the clients, you install them on the server chroot.
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| 11:34 | <al-geo> alkisg i want it to not be permanent
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| 11:34 | <alkisg> al-geo: make a backup of your chroot and install it there
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| 11:34 | You don't install programs on the clients
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| 11:34 | You install them on the server chroot
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| 11:34 | <al-geo> i want to install on client, show to boss and if hi likes it than i must change the whole system :D
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| 11:35 | <alkisg> You can have one test chroot for one client
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| 11:35 | Just copy your existing one, on the server
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| 11:38 | <al-geo> people you are very kind that you are answering me on questions but for "add ramdisk_size=1024000 at the end of append line in /srv/tftpboot/pxelinux.cfg/default" i talk to you for 1 hour. :)
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| 11:39 | <alkisg> It won't work. If your client had enough ram, it would work without ramdisk
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| 11:39 | <al-geo> and still on server zypper in "any package" does not works
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| 11:39 | <alkisg> If it doesn't have enough ram, it won't work with ramdisk either
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| 11:40 | The client has a read only nbd /
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| 11:40 | and a writeable overlay /
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| 11:40 | the writes go to ram
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| 11:40 | If your program is e.g. 2 GB and the client has 1 GB, it won't work whether you use a ram disk or not
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| 11:40 | So if you want to do it your way, just use another client with 8 gb ram
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| 11:40 | Then it will work without resizing any partition
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| 11:41 | You talk for 1 hour because you don't listen!
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| 11:41 | <cyberorg> :)
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| 11:41 | <alkisg> If you have done it properly, by cloning your chroot, it would take 10 minutes
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| 11:42 | <al-geo> yes. but yesterday client with 4GB ram didnt start app and error was not enough space. and app is max 200 MB
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| 11:42 | <alkisg> 200 mb compressed or uncompressed?
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| 11:42 | 4 GB ram means 2 GB tmpfs
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| 11:42 | So the free disk space would be 2 GB
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| 11:43 | <al-geo> uncompressed and with libfiles
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| 11:43 | <alkisg> Try it again and show us the output of `df -h`
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| 11:43 | <al-geo> all free ram was in /dev and only 485 on /
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| 11:44 | <alkisg> Boot a client and run df -h
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| 11:44 | tmpfs by default uses half of the ram
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| 11:48 | <al-geo> http://paste.opensuse.org/98686024
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| 11:49 | on the second client (yesterday client) the programmer is installing our app
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| 12:07 | <cyberorg> al-geo, this is how cloning works http://paste.opensuse.org/36913117
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| 12:38 | <al-geo> cyberorg nice. :) i will use this in the future.
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| 12:41 | cyberorg on my fat client if i remove lan cable and plugin back system stacks. it can be changed?
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| 13:22 | <alkisg> al-geo: sorry, then it appears that opensuse has a hardcoded tmpfs size instead of the default "half of the available ram" that debian-based distros use
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| 13:24 | You also seem to be using ata over ethernet instead of nbd
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| 13:25 | And it doesn't look like squashfs either
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| 13:28 | <al-geo> alkisg its default install from opensuse site. i didnt change nothing. but still you helped a lot. while our conversation i learned lot of things :D
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| 13:28 | <alkisg> Hmm it actually looks worse; that opensuse uses a ramdisk instead of a dynamic tmpfs
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| 13:28 | So it *wastes* ram...
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| 13:28 | In debian-based distros, the tmpfs ram is also available for applications
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| 13:29 | With a ramdisk, that ram is reserved for disk access, so applications can't use it
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| 13:30 | * alkisg thinks that it would be much easier if opensuse ltsp *didn't* use kiwi... | |
| 13:35 | <alkisg> !kiwi
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| 13:35 | <ltsp> kiwi: The opensuse/kiwi implementation of LTSP is a bit different than in other distros, so the best way to get support is in the #kiwi-ltsp irc channel. See also http://en.opensuse.org/LTSP
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| 13:50 | <cyberorg> alkisg, yup, when everyone start using dracut then we'll not need kiwi :)
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| 13:56 | <cyberorg> al-geo, the image is compressed btrfs and we are using AOE, you can change to squashfs and NBD if desired in /etc/sysconfig/kiwi-ltsp before running kiwi-ltsp -l2
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| 13:59 | <alkisg> cyberorg: the ltsp code in the initramfs is only 50 lines
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| 13:59 | All the rest of the server side code for ltsp-config nbd etc etc, can already be shared between distros
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| 13:59 | We _already_ don't need kiwi... it just messes things up
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| 14:02 | <cyberorg> alkisg, kiwi is much more than that, it does not mess anything, it just does things differently, btw kiwi now supports ubuntu also https://suse.github.io/kiwi/
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| 14:02 | ltsp is just one of the many kind of image it supports
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| 14:03 | anyway, I'll be working on Ubuntu lot more due to myscoolserver so kiwi does not matter much
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| 14:09 | * alkisg doesn't want to have an opensuse server in order to build ubuntu appliances, and doesn't see kiwi in packages.ubuntu.com/kiwi | |
| 14:10 | <alkisg> Distro specific tools suck; we don't want them in ltsp :)
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| 14:10 | Otherwise we could just implement ltsp for unity... how lame would that be
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| 14:11 | Doing things differently isn't a bad thing, but doing things differently while trying to support them in the same #ltsp channel is a serious issue
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| 14:12 | ltsp users should have similar experience whatever distro they choose
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| 14:12 | Even gentoo managed to do that
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| 19:47 | <angelo_> Hello, epoptes works on Fedora 24?
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| 19:51 | <vagrantc> not sure if it's been tested much on fedora
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| 19:51 | but in theory, it shouldn't be a huge deal to get it to work
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| 20:33 | <angelo_> Thanks you for response
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| 20:34 | vagrant :)
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