IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 30 March 2009 (all times are UTC)
| 00:00 | <Quiliro> exactly Ryan52
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| 00:01 | <Ryan52> do you know how to program? :)
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| 00:01 | options:
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| 00:01 | <Quiliro> a little
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| 00:01 | <Ryan52> 1. make the users choose it
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| 00:01 | 2. modify the code yourself
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| 00:01 | 3. pay somebody to write the code
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| 00:01 | <Quiliro> are you available?
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| 00:02 | to contract
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| 00:03 | <Ryan52> hm. I suppose so.
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| 00:03 | <Quiliro> will you pm me to agree?
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| 00:05 | * Ryan52 pmed | |
| 00:24 | <Ahmuck> you would need a authentication server that would direct the user to a particular ltsp server
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| 00:34 | <Quiliro> Ahmuck: true...but i don't see how it would authenticate a workstation with no OS
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| 00:35 | <cyberorg> Quiliro, LDM_SERVER variable in lts.conf under [MAC:ADD:RESS] section can make particular client log in to server you want
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| 00:37 | <Quiliro> cyberorg: i don't want a server to boot a workstation but a user. a workstation may have multiple usernames
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| 00:38 | userA and userB might use the same workstation and boot from different servers
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| 00:39 | <cyberorg> Quiliro, ok, then Ryan52 will have to write a code that does if $USER is from "list of users A" LDM_SERVER = someserverA
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| 00:40 | booting will still be from same server
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| 00:40 | <Ryan52> ya
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| 00:40 | there's no way to boot it form different servers...you find out the user after it boots.
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| 00:41 | from*
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| 00:41 | <Quiliro> true cyberorg
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| 00:42 | after the client boots, will it be able to hook up to the other server if the user belongs to the other server?
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| 00:42 | <Ryan52> well, what do you mean by "hook up to".
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| 00:42 | they will be logged in there, yes.
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| 00:43 | but it will still be getting it's nfs root off of the main server.
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| 00:43 | there's no way to change that.
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| 00:43 | note that you can have a 3rd separate server that they boot from, then the two other servers that they log in to.
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| 00:44 | <Quiliro> no 3rd server possible...it is important that if server 2 is removed we are still able to work with server 1
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| 00:44 | <Ryan52> and vice versa?
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| 00:44 | <Quiliro> server 2 can be removed at one time or another
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| 00:44 | vice versa is not necesary
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| 00:45 | <Ryan52> ok, then they'll boot off of server 1, and decide whether to log into server 1 or server 2 based on the username.
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| 00:45 | but, of course, users of server 2 will be SOL if server 2 is gone..
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| 00:46 | <Quiliro> no problem with that ryan52
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| 00:48 | it is important to remove any log of users of server2 on server1 and vice versa
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| 00:48 | i guess they want one company independent from the other company even on the logs
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| 00:50 | will users of server 2 need server 1 once they are working?
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| 00:51 | <Ryan52> yes
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| 00:51 | <Quiliro> :-(
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| 00:51 | * Ryan52 thought that that was covered by: 22:44 < Quiliro> vice versa is not necesary | |
| 00:52 | <Quiliro> not necesary but the logs will remain
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| 00:53 | and the authentication is the only way server 1 will be necesary for users of server 2
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| 00:54 | and we need 0 logs of users of server 1 on server 2 and vice versa
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| 00:54 | <Ryan52> the only reason that users of server 2 need server 1 is because the thin client they are sitting at is booted off of it.
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| 00:56 | <Quiliro> is it possible to reboot from server 2 right after authentication?
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| 00:57 | and remove logs pertaining to that authentication
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| 00:57 | from server 1
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| 01:00 | <cyberorg> Quiliro, i dont get whats with the logs, there are no user's log on other server, they are only on the server they log into
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| 01:00 | booting does not have any logs that is associated with users
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| 01:03 | <Quiliro> logs of the machine (mac) should be removed
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| 01:03 | don't like it but i was asked to do it
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| 01:04 | they should be removed if that machine was used to log into the other server
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| 01:04 | <cyberorg> explain them that booting and user accounts are not related
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| 01:04 | <Quiliro> the other server should have that log but not the authentication server
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| 01:05 | cyberorg: dont understan your question
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| 01:05 | i understand now
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| 01:06 | they want booting and user accounts to be related
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| 01:06 | the want users A and B to boot from server 1 and user C to boot from server 2
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| 01:06 | <cyberorg> Quiliro, then you need to go with clients with embedded OS, not network booting
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| 01:07 | till you boot and get login screen we dont know the user
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| 01:07 | <Quiliro> cyberorg: no way to have ithte way i am asking?
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| 01:07 | <Quiliro> ok cyberorg
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| 01:08 | what were you proposing then ryan52?
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| 02:26 | <mahdi_ja> hi all.
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| 02:31 | in our network computers get ip address from switch.
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| 02:31 | i need install dhcp in my ltsp server.
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| 02:33 | do i need install dhcp in my ltsp server ?
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| 02:34 | <Ryan52> you need to have your "switch" give out special dhcp options.
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| 02:38 | <mahdi_ja> Ryan52, this means i must change my switch configuration .
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| 02:41 | <mahdi_ja> Ryan52 i must change dhcp server from "switch" to ltsp server ?
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| 02:43 | <Ryan52> either way.
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| 02:43 | might not be possible with your switch, tho.
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| 02:43 | probably best to have the ltsp server be the dhcp server.
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| 02:44 | <mahdi_ja> Ryan52, thank you.
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| 04:29 | <NeonLicht> Does anybody knows whether it is possible to use MPD with LTSP and have the sound out to the thin clients, please?
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| 04:33 | <cyberorg> NeonLicht, mpd is supposed to play sound on the server, you need streaming media server like sockso
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| 04:35 | you can also use icecast +MPD to create streaming server or configure audio_output { } to point wherever else you need
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| 04:35 | <NeonLicht> and what about ruynning MPD as a localapp?
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| 04:36 | <cyberorg> what exactly is your requirement?
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| 04:38 | <NeonLicht> I have all OGG files on a file server (FreeNAS) and a couple of LTSP servers on the server room. I also have 5 thin clients on the office area. I want to play music and be able to hear it on the office area (of course, not in the server room). Ideally, I'd like the queue to be controlled by any of the thin clients and, even if possible, having the sound output through all thin clients
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| 04:39 | Not sure if I'm asking too much :-)
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| 05:00 | <cyberorg> NeonLicht, things like sockso will let clients handle their own queues
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| 05:00 | its trivial to setup, it has browser based interface with choice of players
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| 05:01 | <NeonLicht> thanks, cyberorg, I'll have a look at it then
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| 05:16 | <NeonLicht> sockso is already discarded, it's a Java (wich I don't want to run at all) program
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| 05:17 | <cyberorg> NeonLicht, ok, then look at mpd +icecast
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| 05:17 | <NeonLicht> tx, cyberorg, I'm doing so :-)
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| 05:19 | that looks much better, both are also included on Debian GNU/Linux 5.0 (aka Lenny)
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| 06:15 | <NeonLicht> cyberorg, I have set up Icecast2 to "listen" to MPD on the LTSP server. I now can login into the server and run ncmpc and I can see the music database, make a playlist and play it but the sound doesn't come to the thin client... how am I suppossed to get it there?
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| 06:16 | cyberorg, are you the same guy as the one on dev.compiz-fusion.org?
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| 06:16 | <cyberorg> use any icecast client on the client
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| 06:17 | one and only :)
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| 06:18 | <NeonLicht> haha, I've just found your post about iPhone touch remote control and streaming media, were you talk about Icecast, MPD and Sockso XD
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| 06:24 | * NeonLicht is looking for Icecast2 clients w/o much success | |
| 06:26 | <NeonLicht> mmmhhh.. they seem to be the "3rd Party Applications"
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| 06:50 | <cyberorg> NeonLicht, i think all media players can play from icecast, audacious, mplayer etc
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| 06:56 | <NeonLicht> I think I'll give up
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| 07:00 | <maginot> Good morning all
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| 07:01 | <NeonLicht> hi, maginot
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| 07:01 | almost evening here XDD
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| 07:03 | <maginot> NeonLicht, what are you trying to do ?
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| 07:08 | <NeonLicht> maginot, setting up MPD+Icecast on LTSP
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| 07:08 | maginot, I wanted to have an MPD queue on the LTSP server which I could listen to on the thin clients
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| 07:09 | and cyberorg has suggested me to use Icecast to do streaming to them from the server
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| 07:09 | <maginot> Hmmm looks interesting, but I dont know anything about this MPD stuff
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| 07:10 | are you talking about sound in the clients?
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| 07:10 | <NeonLicht> I always use MPD for music, and I'd like to do it on the LTSPs as well
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| 07:11 | maginot, sure, I want to listen to the music on the clients, not on the server, which it's on the server room
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| 07:12 | <maginot> Hmm this isnt something to do with pulseaudio ?
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| 07:13 | <NeonLicht> I think pulseaudio is running fine, since I can reproduce music (and video) on the thin clients already
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| 07:14 | I guess it will have to do something with it at some point, but I don't know when and how, though :-)
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| 07:41 | <maginot> Hmm something weird happened with a client firefox running as localapp, after firefox freezes I did a pkill on the user (after just killing firefox wasn't being enought firefox was always loading with the last memory) the problem is that after the user relogin he had all firefox preferences lost, so I told him to reboot wich solved the problem, firefox loaded with all prefes again ... ??? I can't figure out why
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| 07:46 | <cyberorg> maginot, who says reboot does not fix problems in linux too :)
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| 07:47 | <maginot> cyberorg, hehe well, what Im thinking odd here is why is firefox losing preferences after killing the user? doesn't make sense
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| 09:00 | <likuidkewl> Anyone successfully use this network controller in LTSP5 Ubuntu 8.04.2 - BCM4401-B0 100Base-TX (rev 02) ???
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| 09:47 | <Ryan52> dmaran: it shouldn't matter..
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| 09:47 | dmaran: I mean, anything that works in normal ubuntu should work with ltsp.
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| 09:48 | so you'll have more luck asking in #ubuntu.
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| 09:48 | ir #$distro
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| 10:01 | <dmaran> Ryan52: It does matter, as it "works" in ubuntu but dies trying to load the image in ltsp
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| 10:02 | <Ryan52> "dies"
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| 10:02 | ?
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| 10:03 | "the image in ltsp"?
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| 10:03 | really broad, please be more specific.
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| 10:08 | <ogra> Ryan52, whats that changelog thing you added ?
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| 10:08 | i thought we had agreed to not use a changelog file but bzr logs
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| 10:09 | to not add confusion through duplication and possible out of sync-ness
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| 10:09 | <dmaran> Ryan52: To be more specific it dies @ Initrd the PXE boot goes ok then it gets to a fore mentioned point and stops. There is nothing wrong with the setup all our other 100+ clients work fine, we are just trying to add a client with this network card to the existing and it doesn't work. So, if you are using a BCM4401-B0 100Base-TX (rev 02) based network card on LTSP I would love to know what you did to get it working. I know the B44 driver has some
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| 10:13 | <Ryan52> ogra: yes, apparently unless you set something special in release.conf mkdst doesn't generate the ChangeLog anymore...
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| 10:14 | so I added the needed variable to release.conf.
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| 10:14 | <ogra> yes, because we deliberately disabled it
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| 10:14 | <Ryan52> really?
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| 10:14 | <ogra> i was wondering if there was a new decision about it
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| 10:14 | yes
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| 10:14 | <Ryan52> no, I thought that we were still intending on using it...
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| 10:14 | when did that change?
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| 10:15 | <ogra> since forever ?
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| 10:15 | <Ryan52> recently when I wasn't paying attention? :P
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| 10:15 | <ogra> we have bzr log
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| 10:15 | <Ryan52> ok....then how did Fedora's package ever build?
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| 10:15 | <ogra> i think we discussed it at freegeek to just use bzr log to avoid confusion
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| 10:16 | if you find it important, feel free to bring up a discussion about it again, but based on the decision that we dont release tarballs iirc we decided to just go with one changelog system
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| 10:16 | <Ryan52> no, I don't at all.
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| 10:16 | I only enabled it because Fedora's package is trying to copy it somewhere..
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| 10:17 | I just wonder where Fedora's package got it from before..
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| 10:17 | <ogra> not sure it used it actually, ask warren
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| 10:17 | i know he had massive probs with the huge size it has
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| 10:18 | (at least if you generate it properly from the first commit its immense)
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| 10:22 | <Ryan52> ok, I'll revert it later today.
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| 10:24 | <cliebow> ogra: any trick to capturing strace..sudo starce aproggie>/home/cliebow/Desktop/filename..
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| 10:24 | or strace
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| 10:24 | <ogra> man strace :)
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| 10:24 | use -o
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| 10:24 | <cliebow> 8~)
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| 10:25 | <Ryan52> %doc ChangeLog COPYING TODO server/doc/lts-parameters.txt
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| 10:25 | * Ryan52 doesn't see how this ever built...maybe me and warren were using old versions of mkdst before. | |
| 10:26 | <ogra> is that file even there ?
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| 10:26 | i thougth we removed it at some point
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| 10:26 | <Ryan52> removed which one?
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| 10:26 | <ogra> ChangeLog
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| 10:26 | from the branch
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| 10:26 | <Ryan52> no, it's not anymore.
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| 10:26 | <ogra> right
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| 12:07 | <_UsUrPeR_> ok, so working with Fedora 10. Are we supposed to be using the ltspbr0 still?
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| 12:08 | Last I had heard from Warren, that was no longer in use.
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| 12:08 | yet it's still built when installing ltsp-server
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| 12:21 | <_UsUrPeR_> anyone have any insight into Fedora's LTSP environment?
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| 12:26 | <johnny> talk to warren :)
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| 12:26 | post to the mail list?
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| 12:53 | <warren> CAN-o-SPAM: ping
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| 12:54 | <CAN-o-SPAM> warren: pong
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| 12:59 | stgrabber: ping
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| 13:32 | <maginot> is anyone on? If the client get kill with pkill -u <user> He will come back to the login screen, But if he login again when he opens firefox it will be without his configuration (firefox will open reseted, no prefs or configuration, bookmarks, history... nothing). If the client reboot the box and login them when opening firefox it will be normal. Only happen with firefox running as localapp
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| 13:43 | <din_os> maginot: just curious, if you login on the server as same user and change firefox settings, do you get the new changes after login in with the client?
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| 13:45 | <maginot> din_os, do you mean running firefox as localapp in the client?
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| 13:45 | <din_os> no, use the server to login as the clients user
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| 13:46 | add a bookmark, logout, then login using the client, see if the bookmark stays
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| 13:46 | <maginot> I understand, but you know that Im running firefox in the client as localapp right ?
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| 13:47 | <din_os> yeah, I know, that's why I was curious...
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| 13:47 | <maginot> okay, lets give a try ...
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| 13:48 | <din_os> as far as I know localapps is still kind of experimental, so doing some tests like that might lead to a better understanding of how it works with firefox
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| 13:50 | <maginot> din_os, yeah, Im testing hard this ... because is a need here
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| 14:11 | <maginot> din_os, after disconnecting the client if the user login again firefox will come reseted, all prefs, configs, bookmarks everything is lost
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| 14:16 | <maginot> I cant figure out why after a logoff if the client isnt rebooted all preferences in firefox get lost (running as localapp)
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| 14:48 | <dmarkey> does ltsp5 have rdesktop support?
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| 14:49 | <maginot> I think rdesktop is deprecated
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| 14:49 | <dmarkey> in favour of what
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> dmarkey: yes, there is a basic rdesktop script
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| 14:51 | <dmarkey> cool, and how is usb redirection achieved
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> You can specify SCREEN_07=rdesktop and set the parameters to which server it'll connect etc
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| 14:51 | Does rdesktop support usb redirection? I've never used that...
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| 14:52 | <dmarkey> well, drive redirection
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| 14:52 | "usb key"
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| 14:52 | <alkisg> Yes, you can set that with the rdesktop parameters (in a different lts.conf entry)
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| 14:52 | (which I don't remember the name of)
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| 14:52 | !lts.conf
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| 14:52 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "lts.conf" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtsConf
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| 14:52 | <NeonLicht> it does, dmarkey
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| 14:52 | <dmarkey> hmm.. it has a special fuse filesystem doesnt it
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| 14:53 | <maginot> I think I've read something about rdestop been deprecated, but looking in the logs was otherthings about rdesktop scripts
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| 14:54 | <dmarkey> i cant imagine what would replace it
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| 14:55 | <alkisg> !docs
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| 14:55 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "docs" is For the most current documentation, see http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
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| 14:56 | <alkisg> maginot: maybe you mean startx?
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| 14:56 | "startx (depreciated)" - from the docs...
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| 14:58 | <dmarkey> hmm.. dont see anything about drive redirection in ldm.conf
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| 14:58 | <alkisg> dmarkey: RDP_OPTIONS and RDP_SERFVER
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| 14:58 | *RDP_SERVER
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| 14:58 | <maginot> alkisg, well, maybe... was something I read here, but you can ignore my previous comments. they mean nothing real
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| 14:59 | <alkisg> dmarkey: In RDP_OPTIONS you put all the rdesktop parameters for redirection etc, so you should read `man rdesktop`
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| 14:59 | <dmarkey> ye, i know rdesktop pretty well, but where are usb drives mounted on the client
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| 15:01 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: busy releasing ltsp version, eh?
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| 15:01 | <Ryan52> more like busy screwing up ltsp versions...
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| 15:01 | but sure, let's go with that.
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| 15:01 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 15:02 | <NeonLicht> vagrantc, is it possible to do localapps on Lenny or will I need some backports?
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| 15:02 | <vagrantc> NeonLicht: you'll need backports.
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| 15:02 | NeonLicht: http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto
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| 15:03 | <NeonLicht> tx, vagrantc :-)
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| 15:04 | <johnny> what's a good photo management application..
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| 15:05 | f-spot is almost good enough.. almost..
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| 15:07 | <alkisg> johnny: http://picasa.google.com/linux/ ?
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| 15:07 | <johnny> no.. that's google
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| 15:07 | <alkisg> (I prefer fspot, though)
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| 15:07 | <johnny> i wish gnome had built in versioning .. to get rid of the silly (Original) in file names
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| 15:07 | <NeonLicht> what about gqview?
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| 15:07 | <maginot> well, localapps for firefox isnt something I would recommend for a production enviornment... here is very unstable for what I can see, some plugins can consume a lot of memory of the client which can make the box very slow
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| 15:08 | and I notice some crashes
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| 15:08 | I think I will put this server in production without localapps and prepare a new one forthe next year
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| 15:09 | <dmarkey> hmm.. cant see in the docs where USB drives are mounted on the client so i can export them via rdesktop
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| 15:09 | <maginot> s/would/wouldn't/g
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| 15:09 | <NeonLicht> I want to have localapps to be able to do dd to USB sticks on the clients, that's all :)
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| 15:12 | * Lumiere would guess they'll show up as /dev/sd? and be mounted to something like /media/disk | |
| 15:12 | pmatulis has quit IRC | |
| 15:15 | * vagrantc notices that commit email notifications for ldm-trunk appear to be broken | |
| 15:15 | <maginot> NeonLicht, well, I don't know exactly what you want to do, but you have access to pen-drives from the client ...
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| 15:15 | <vagrantc> unless it doesn't send commits that i made...
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| 15:15 | <NeonLicht> maginot, I do also, but I cannot do dd to them
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| 15:16 | <maginot> NeonLicht, if you install dd on the client I think you can use it as localapp without prolem... what issue you're having?
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| 15:17 | johnny has left #ltsp | |
| 15:17 | * Ryan52 noticed that as well (the commit emails thing) | |
| 15:17 | <NeonLicht> maginot, I don't have any issue, I just asked here yesterday whether or not it was possible to do dd to USB sticks on the clients, and I was told I needed localapps for that
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| 15:18 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: i got all your recent ltsp-trunk commits ...
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| 15:18 | <maginot> I see ...
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| 15:18 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: did you get my recent ldm-trunk commits?
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| 15:18 | <Ryan52> vagrantc: nope, and I didn't get when I committed alkisg's translation either.
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| 15:18 | vagrantc: appears to be ldm-trunk only.
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| 15:18 | <vagrantc> hmm..
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| 15:18 | <maginot> well... have to go now, c you guys tomorrow ! [ ]'s
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| 15:18 | maginot has quit IRC | |
| 15:19 | <NeonLicht> maginot, that's why I've asked vagrantc whether I needed backports to get localapps runing on Lenny
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| 15:19 | <Ryan52> last one I got was 1140.
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| 15:19 | (apparently)
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| 15:28 | <dmarkey> what filesystems are supported?
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| 15:30 | Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC | |
| 15:32 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: ldm-trunk 1140 is also the last one i got
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| 15:49 | Ryan52: i'm in #launchpad troubleshooting the issue ...
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| 16:18 | <alkisg> A beta proxydhcp implementation from the dnsmasq developer: http://lists.thekelleys.org.uk/pipermail/dnsmasq-discuss/2009q1/002883.html - calls for testing by anyone interested
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| 16:18 | This can be used in networks with an existing DHCP server - it only sends the filename, next server etc, not leases.
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| 19:23 | <Trey__> hey guys
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| 19:23 | I am new to ltsp and am using k12linux, very interesting stuff
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| 19:25 | <bud313> Hey Trey.
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| 19:25 | I am new as well. How has your experience been so far?
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| 19:25 | <Trey__> it's been rough
| |
| 19:25 | the initial setup is very easy and straight forward
| |
| 19:26 | but i've been hacking away at it, trying to get it to run on one nic, and trying to get to work with a windows dhcp server
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| 19:26 | I've had success and failure but today managed to get it to work on virtualbox as my testbed with just one nic
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| 19:27 | <bud313> I agree. The initial setup was easy, but trying to customize it has proven a little more difficult
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| 19:27 | <Trey__> are you using two nics or just one
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| 19:27 | <bud313> I am using two
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| 19:28 | Are you planning on adding the thin clients to your current windows environment?
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| 19:28 | <Trey__> yes
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| 19:28 | <bud313> Are they going to run linux or an rdp session to a ts?
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| 19:28 | <Trey__> rdp session to a ts
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| 19:29 | ts servers setup on top of vmware esx
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| 19:29 | what I've finally come to is letting the k12linux box hand out dhcp for just the thin clients
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| 19:29 | but have it working with using only 1 nic
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| 19:30 | <bud313> Very cool
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| 19:30 | <Trey__> I didn't want to have to put a k12linux box in every lab, and din't want to have to vlan switch ports all over the building
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| 19:31 | once I finish my testing sometime this week, I am going to update the wiki on a single nic deployment
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| 19:31 | <bud313> Awesome. That is great.
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| 19:32 | How is the performance so far?
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| 19:32 | <Trey__> Well right now I'm testing with virtual machines on my laptop, so not great
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| 19:32 | but for being on a virtual machine, definitely not slow
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| 19:33 | what does your setup look like
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| 19:34 | <bud313> I am using opensuse and kiwi-ltsp
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| 19:34 | We have a Novell Environment so I started in that direction
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| 19:34 | <Trey__> cool
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| 19:34 | <bud313> I have been booting linux thin clients, running firefox locally, and logging in with the novell client
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| 19:34 | <Trey__> how do you like novell?
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| 19:34 | <bud313> Its a love hate relationship
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| 19:35 | <Trey__> so you like the kiwi-ltsp
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| 19:35 | i read on the opensuse website about a graphical setup for ltsp
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| 19:35 | <bud313> It is nice, but the documentation is lagging the development
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| 19:36 | <Trey__> same thing for k12linux
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| 19:36 | <bud313> By the time I try something they already have a better or different way to accomplish it and the packages have updated
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| 19:36 | <Trey__> but the mailing list for k12linux is great
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| 19:36 | <bud313> Thats good to hear
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| 19:37 | The only real problem I have is that when a client logs in the server hits 100% cpu for about 15 seconds
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| 19:37 | How long have you had a ts server?
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| 19:38 | <Trey__> I work for a contractor that currently manages 5 schools
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| 19:39 | each of those schools, are 95% terminal services
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| 19:39 | I've been the head tech for about a year and 1/2
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| 19:39 | ts is also a love hate thing
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| 19:39 | what process is maxing out?
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| 19:39 | how big is the cpu?
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| 19:39 | <bud313> What do you love and what do you hate?
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| 19:40 | <Trey__> i love the central management
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| 19:40 | i love the capabilities
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| 19:40 | i hate the slowness
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| 19:40 | it's slow for certain things
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| 19:40 | fast as hell for others
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| 19:40 | i think if they made the connection a little stronger, it would be unbeatable
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| 19:41 | our users open microsoft outlook and it opens in less than a second
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| 19:41 | it's almost instant
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| 19:41 | same thing for word, excel, power point
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| 19:41 | <bud313> I haven't been able to determine what is maxing out. It looks like it is a bunch of processes being launched and closed, but it doesn't make sense. Even with one user logging in "Lab01" in my test environment I see processes for different users who are not on.
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| 19:41 | <Trey__> photoshop
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| 19:41 | all fast
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| 19:41 | but using them is slow
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| 19:42 | <bud313> Will the next versions of server 2008 help?
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| 19:42 | <Trey__> strange
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| 19:42 | <bud313> It is almost like the login launches a whole slew or random process for random users.
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| 19:42 | <Trey__> not sure about server 2008
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| 19:42 | i hope so
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| 19:42 | haven't had a chance to check it out
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| 19:43 | <bud313> I was reading about remoteapp I think and it sounded good. Microsoft has always had marketing down though
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| 19:43 | <loather-work> yeah, if their development department were half as good as their marketing department their stuff wouldn't suck nearly as bad
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| 19:44 | <Trey__> I couldn't agree more
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| 19:44 | <bud313> The server is running esxi. It has two opteron dual core 2.4 ghz processors and 32 gb of ram. The only other thing running is a windows xp vm.
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| 19:44 | <Trey__> what do you think of ts?
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| 19:44 | <loather-work> the terminal services protocol actually isn't bad.
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| 19:44 | the wire protocol, i mean
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| 19:45 | the fact that it's windows, and that windows doesn't multitask well, is another story
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| 19:45 | so again, another case of good idea, poor implementation
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| 19:46 | <Trey__> if you guys were to run a test ltsp server, would you run it on virtualbox or vmware desktop (run esx at work)
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| 19:47 | <loather-work> xen :D
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| 19:47 | <Trey__> xen?
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| 19:47 | <loather-work> yup. another virtualization suite
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| 19:48 | <Trey__> cool
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| 19:48 | unfortenly have to test it on my work laptop for now
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| 19:48 | <loather-work> virtualbox is always a good choice. it seems to work pretty well for desktop systems
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| 19:49 | <Trey__> yea it's just really slow installing k12linux
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| 19:49 | today I finally got k12linux working with 1 nic, handing out dhcp
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| 19:49 | so I am writing my howto
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| 19:50 | is xen free?
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| 19:50 | <bud313> There are free versions of xen
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| 19:51 | xen can be installed in linux
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| 19:51 | They also have more stand alone versions
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| 19:51 | like esx
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| 19:51 | I think they have a basic free one, and you can pay for more advanced features
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| 19:52 | <Trey__> cool
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| 19:52 | I think i'll stay with virtualbox
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| 19:53 | getting virtualbox to work under ubuntu intrepid about kicked my ass
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| 19:53 | <bud313> I like virtualbox as well.
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| 19:54 | Do you run ubuntu on your laptop?
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| 19:54 | <Trey__> yes
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| 19:54 | dual booted with xp
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| 19:54 | i hate having to keep xp, but in the event ubuntu crashes, i bounce over to xp
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| 19:54 | <bud313> Can I ask why you chose k12linux over edubuntu?
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| 19:55 | Just wondering if there are benefits
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| 19:55 | <Trey__> k12linux was the first one i stumbled across
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| 19:55 | i've tried ubuntu
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| 19:55 | had similiar problems
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| 19:55 | but now that you reminded me
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| 19:55 | i wanted to try edubuntu instead
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| 19:55 | with the single nic setup
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| 19:55 | i like ubuntu much more than I like fedora
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| 19:55 | <bud313> I run ubuntu at home and love it. It just seems simpler to me
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| 19:57 | <Trey__> i couldn't agree more
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| 19:57 | you run gnome or kde
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| 19:57 | <bud313> I have seen a lot of opensource projects that will boot to an rdp session. We were actually thinking about setting us a windows ts and connecting to it but we don't have enough microsoft knowledge to do it well
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| 19:57 | <Trey__> i've always been a huge kde fan, but not lately, prefer gnomer
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| 19:57 | <bud313> I am LXDE right now, but I usually use gnome
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| 19:57 | <Trey__> why lxde
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| 19:58 | <bud313> I was trying to find a suitable lighter desktop environment for our ltsp server
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| 19:58 | I think this would do the job
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| 19:58 | <Trey__> wow
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| 19:58 | ubuntu is installing super fast in virtualbox
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| 19:58 | <bud313> It is lighter then kde and gnome but not as light as ice or blackbox or those really like ones
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| 19:59 | <Trey__> awesome
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| 20:00 | this is actually the frist time i've used IRC
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| 20:01 | BTW setting up a microsoft TS is a piece of cake
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| 20:01 | <bud313> I set one up as a test, but am afraid of putting it into production
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| 20:01 | <Trey__> what would you be running on it
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| 20:01 | <bud313> Openoffice, ie, novell client
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| 20:02 | <Trey__> hell, give it a try
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| 20:02 | just don't put ie7 on it
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| 20:02 | <bud313> why not?
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| 20:02 | <Trey__> well
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| 20:02 | might not matter if using novell to login
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| 20:03 | have a problem with a few client's servers that i haven't debugged yet
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| 20:03 | slow logins, takes 35 seconds - 2 minutes to login
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| 20:03 | easiest fix was to uninstall ie7
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| 20:03 | microsoft released a hotfix
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| 20:03 | didn't help at all my sites
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| 20:03 | the servers are identical to each other at customerA, and CustomerB but behave differently
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| 20:04 | <bud313> What version of server do you use?
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| 20:04 | <Trey__> they don't mind using ie6, i don't mind worrying about it
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| 20:04 | server 2003 on the affected customers
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| 20:05 | <bud313> I stumbled on this yesterday have you looked into it for your thin clients? http://openthinclient.org/
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| 20:06 | they have nomad which allows me to connect via rdp to an suse box so I was looking up things that booted rdp sessions
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| 20:06 | <Trey__> yes I've looked at it
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| 20:06 | <bud313> There are so many options it is really mind blowing
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| 20:07 | <Trey__> oh i know
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| 20:07 | all of my clients get donated computers
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| 20:07 | in the low p4 range
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| 20:07 | 2.2ghz
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| 20:07 | no cdrom's, no hard drives
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| 20:08 | 2-3 gigs of ram, p4 2.2ghz
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| 20:08 | pxe booting them is perfect
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| 20:08 | <bud313> Can't complain about free computers like that
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| 20:08 | <Trey__> yea but then they ask me, a network engineer, to reimage 500 of them
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| 20:08 | lol
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| 20:09 | my soltuion, ltsp :)
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| 20:09 | <bud313> that is true
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| 20:09 | lol
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| 20:09 | <Trey__> i just need to deliver
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| 20:09 | <bud313> It sounds like you have it almost all worked out
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| 20:11 | <bud313> Does anyone else use ltsp to boot thin clients to connect to a windows terminal server?
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| 20:13 | Has anyone experienced high cpu utilization with auto logging in clients?
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| 20:14 | <rjune_> yes, people have done it, no clue what cpu load is like
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| 20:15 | <bud313> I am using ldm to auto login thin clients to linux. The cpu tops out for about 20 seconds each time a thin client auto logs in
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| 20:15 | <Trey__> does it top out when they manually login?
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| 20:16 | <bud313> Yes but it isn't as noticeable. Mainly I think because of the break up of the total time
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| 20:17 | It sits at a log in screen. I type a user name and password. So it takes 45 seconds to get to a login screen, then 30 seconds to a minute to login
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| 20:17 | When they autologin it takes a long time for a desktop to show up
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| 20:18 | Thats will just one as well. If I boot two the time to the login screen is about the same but the login time increases quite a bit
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| 20:19 | I started with a smallish server but more than double the ram and processors and it didn't have that much of an effect
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| 20:20 | I started with gnome, and then went down to icewm and it still behaved the same way
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| 20:20 | I just can't seem to determine what it does at login time that would tax a cpu that much
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| 20:21 | If I have one client booted it is not useable while another one logs in
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| 20:21 | After it is logged it they both run great
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| 20:22 | I booted 20. It took 10 minutes for them all to log in. They were un useable until the last client was up
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| 20:22 | <Trey__> very interesting
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| 20:23 | <bud313> I may just being picky as well. They are going to be mainly used for library kiosk type machines, and should be left on most of the time
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| 20:24 | I would like to at least understand why the all four cores go to 100% when a client logs in though
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| 20:24 | Its almost like those old dos programs with a wait state
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| 20:29 | <Trey__> very interesting
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| 20:29 | a quick search of google for kiwi-ltsp and max cpu comes up with almost nothing
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| 20:29 | you using 32 or 64 bit
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| 20:30 | <bud313> 32 bit
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| 20:30 | I am going to try 64 tomorrow
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| 20:30 | Do you think that could be the issue?
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| 20:31 | <Trey__> doubt it
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| 20:31 | if you were using 64 i would think maybe a bug
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| 20:31 | but 32 should be solid
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| 20:32 | sure it's not a network problem?
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| 20:33 | I'm no help there, with a novell network
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| 20:34 | <bud313> I guess it could be, a network issue causing high cpu utilization? Having to resend alot?
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| 20:34 | Or a buggy network card driver
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| 20:35 | <Trey__> my guess would be dns
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| 20:36 | but couldn't be dns because they work
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| 20:36 | what you could do those is
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| 20:36 | tail -f /var/log/messages on the ltsp server
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| 20:36 | while a client boots up, see what it spits out
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| 20:36 | maybe a reoccuring looping error?
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| 20:36 | <bud313> Thats a good idea
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| 20:37 | A loop, maybe something that has to time out before it continues
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| 20:37 | <Trey__> yup
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| 20:37 | or tries soo many times
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| 20:37 | <bud313> That might make the "random" processes make sense as well
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| 20:37 | <Trey__> the tftp traffic should be quick and minimal
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| 20:38 | yup
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| 20:38 | starting to make more sense
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| 20:39 | <bud313> Thank you. That makes me feel like I have a shot at figuring it out. Instead of watching scratching my head
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| 20:41 | <Trey__> anytime
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| 20:41 | can you send private messages on here?
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| 20:42 | <bud313> I am using pidgeon, so I tried but I just set this up tonight
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| 20:42 | <Trey__> brb
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| 20:43 | well hopefully i'll see you on here again
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| 20:43 | <bud313> Same to you
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| 20:43 | Have a great night
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| 20:43 | <Trey__> oh i'm not leaving yet
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| 20:44 | <bud313> Oh
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| 20:44 | <Trey__> still waiting on my edubuntu
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| 20:44 | <bud313> :)
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| 20:44 | <Trey__> i wanted to give my email to see if your problem was fixed
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| 20:44 | but don't want to get spammed
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| 20:44 | and the damn wife is all over me tonight
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| 20:46 | <bud313> my throw away account is bud313 at yahoo
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| 20:46 | <Trey__> cool
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| 20:46 | will email you, let me know how it turns out when you test it
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| 20:46 | <bud313> Sure
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| 20:47 | I would be curious what you end up using as your final solution as well
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| 20:47 | when nomad is fully developed we could switch to a rdp session to save a lot of headaches
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| 20:47 | <Trey__> does nomad require a local install
| |
| 20:50 | <bud313> Nomad is an rdp server on suse
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| 20:50 | So yes as far as I know
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| 20:50 | You can then just connect with any rdp client, like windows or rdesktop
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| 20:51 | I'm not sure if I answered your question though
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| 20:55 | <Trey__> thats awesome
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| 20:55 | yes you did
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| 20:55 | a linux ts
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| 20:57 | would it just redirect to say something like vnc with sessions
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| 20:57 | <bud313> Yeah. It doesn't support sound or usb redirection by itself yet though
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| 20:58 | <bud313> with ltsp you can have sound and usb though with it
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| 20:58 | Its at the same stage I would say that Server 2008 is with trying to increase remote performance
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| 20:58 | They are working on it, hopefully they both get it figured out
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| 20:59 | <Trey__> would be awesome
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| 20:59 | brb
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| 21:01 | Trey__ has joined #ltsp | |
| 21:01 | <Trey__> back
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| 21:01 | cool, like the way this looks better
| |
| 21:02 | i'm running irssi inside putty now
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| 21:03 | <bud313> Wow
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| 21:04 | It seems funny how complex some things sound
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| 21:08 | <Trey__> what do you mean
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| 21:09 | ohh lol
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| 21:09 | irssi is the irc client
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| 21:09 | putty is an all in one tool that does ssh, telnet, serial/com, and apparently irc
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| 21:09 | <bud313> I never realized that putty did irc
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| 21:10 | <Trey__> i'm running xp right now, and the client i downloaded, irssi, gave that as an option
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| 21:11 | <Trey__> getting late
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| 21:11 | hurry ubuntu, had to start my install over
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| 21:11 | forgot to setup 2 nics for it
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| 21:12 | <bud313> I hate having to wait for things to install
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| 21:14 | <Trey__> how do you change yoru nic on here?
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| 21:15 | ?
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| 21:16 | <bud313> Change what?
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| 21:16 | Number of nics? or ip addresses?
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| 21:16 | <Trey__> my nic on here
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| 21:16 | nick name
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| 21:18 | <bud313> oh
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| 21:19 | I'm not sure I have never connected the way you are.
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| 21:19 | <Trey__> CTCP version
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| 21:19 | help
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| 21:19 | sec
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| 21:20 | Trey__ is now known as dropally | |
| 21:20 | <dropally> ahhh
| |
| 21:20 | thats better
| |
| 21:20 | went to help to learn how to change my name
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| 21:21 | brb
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| 21:21 | exit
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| 21:22 | Trey__ has joined #ltsp | |
| 21:22 | <Trey__> oh well
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| 21:22 | lol
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| 21:22 | i give up
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| 21:23 | well i'm off to bed
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| 21:23 | email me
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| 21:23 | have a good one
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| 21:23 | nice talking to you
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| 21:24 | <bud313> Thanks nice talking with you as well
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| 22:44 | <grant2990> hello
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| 22:45 | Question for someone, anyone try out the intel 945GC atom mobo for pxe booting?
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| 22:49 | <grant2990> no one?
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| 22:50 | anyone got any recomendations for pci nic
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| 22:50 | that still offers pxe boot capabilities?
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| 22:50 | <vagrantc> most pci NICs these days support pxe boot
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| 22:51 | <grant2990> I am trigger shy because I went through about 8 at work today that did not, or required a seperate rom chip to make it work.
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| 22:51 | <loather-work> if it's new it generally will
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| 22:51 | most all the intel ones do
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| 22:52 | <grant2990> that is my prob, I have no Idea how new these others were, Will pick up a few on the way to work tommorrow and give it a shot
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| 22:53 | <loather-work> my advice is to avoid the garbage ones. i'm very happy with the intel-branded ones i've got
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| 22:53 | <grant2990> ok, will do
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| 22:54 | I believe I can get the built in one on these new atom boards working as well, just do not have the know how and have not been given the time to read up on compiling a newer kernel
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| 22:54 | <vagrantc> see a lot of intel cards at freegeek. 3com were easier to flash with custom boot roms.
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| 22:54 | grant2990: shouldn't require anything new in the kernel, PXE happens long before the kernel is even loaded.
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| 22:55 | <grant2990> It picks up the dhcp server, gets the kernel from the tftp server then hits a kernel panic halfway through
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| 22:55 | it does not recognize the realtek nic
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| 22:55 | * loather-work goes home | |
| 22:55 | <loather-work> bbl.
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| 22:56 | <grant2990> many peep had the same problem with pre 2.5 or so kernels
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| 22:58 | <vagrantc> pre 2.5 ? that's aeons ago.
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| 22:58 | <grant2990> my numbers could be wrong, as with many things I say.
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| 22:58 | the images used for booting are at least 2 yrs old
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| 22:59 | <vagrantc> !release
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| 23:00 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "release" is please mention the linux distro and release you're using :)
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| 23:00 | <grant2990> one sec
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| 23:01 | * vagrantc notes that 2.6.12 was out in 2005 ... | |
| 23:03 | <grant2990> I want to say it is kubuntu and libc version is 2.3.6
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| 23:03 | ok sorry, 2.4.27
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| 23:04 | then the newest in use is 2.6.24
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| 23:05 | The newest images I have avail to use are 2.6.17.8
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| 23:05 | and they all lead me to that kernel panic
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| 23:12 | <vagrantc> grant2990: are you booting LTSP ?
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| 23:12 | <grant2990> yes
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| 23:12 | <vagrantc> grant2990: what version of kubuntu are you running?
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| 23:13 | ubuntu has never had a 2.4 kernel, as far as i'm aware.
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| 23:15 | <grant2990> 8.04.02
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| 23:15 | that 2.4 was on a debian 3.1 login server
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| 23:16 | <vagrantc> !ver
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| 23:16 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "ver" is ti get version info on debian/ubuntu (please use the pastebot): COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l 'ltsp*' 'ldm*' | awk '/^ii/{print $2,$3}' ; COLUMNS=200 dpkg --root=/opt/ltsp/i386 -l 'ltsp*' ldm | awk '/^ii/{print $2,$3}'
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| 23:16 | <vagrantc> !pastebot
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| 23:16 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
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| 23:18 | <grant2990> pastebot has me confused, is that the preffered method of pasting a lot if info, or a url?
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| 23:19 | <vagrantc> grant2990: it's both
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| 23:19 | grant2990: i.e. go to http://pastebot.ltsp.org and cut and paste to it
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| 23:19 | so you don't flood the channel
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| 23:20 | <grant2990> I was looking at it, interesting, ok, thats what I was wondering
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| 23:20 | <vagrantc> grant2990: so run the whole command above (use cut and paste) and paste the output to the pastebot ...
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| 23:22 | <grant2990> ok, give me a sec, have to start up a vm
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| 23:23 | * alkisg wonders if COLUMNS is really needed... I thought it was always considered = infinite when redirection is used... | |
| 23:24 | <vagrantc> alkisg: definitely needed.
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| 23:24 | alkisg: at least on all the machines i've ever used...
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| 23:25 | <alkisg> It doesn't make any difference on my ubuntu :(
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| 23:25 | <vagrantc> alkisg: probably depends on how long the package names and versions are.
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| 23:25 | <grant2990> command failed, no packages found matching ltsp
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| 23:25 | let me try another server
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| 23:26 | <vagrantc> grant2990: maybe the one running ltsp? :P
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| 23:27 | <grant2990> that is a wonderful idea, I am just a horrible search, I would love to be able to tell you I found it, but every server I have returns the same missing packages
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| 23:28 | so I am pretty confused now, sorry
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| 23:28 | looking for any process running that mentions lts I only it a in.tftpd process
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| 23:29 | * chupacabra eats homade blue corn tortillas | |
| 23:29 | <alkisg> grant2990: look at a client booting, it should say the ip where it loads the kernel...
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| 23:29 | <grant2990> would like to but I am at home now
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| 23:30 | would that be the dhcp server ip?
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| 23:30 | <chupacabra> ha
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| 23:30 | <alkisg> If LTSP-server == DHCP server, probably, but not neccessarily...
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| 23:31 | <grant2990> Im wondering, Not finding much going on with a LTSP server
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| 23:32 | I know that when a client boots, it gets its ip from the DHCP server, then gets a kernel via tftp
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| 23:33 | <alkisg> Yes, but the tftp server may be on a different machine
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| 23:33 | <grant2990> I have three tftp servers running
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| 23:36 | The log files that the process points to show the atftpd process serving 2.6.178-ltsp-1/pxelinux.0 to various ip addresses
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| 23:37 | <alkisg> grant2990: I think you may do `dhclient -n eth0` from your server to fake requesting a dhcp lease, without actually doing it, and then look at the tftp server provided...
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| 23:39 | <grant2990> hmm that did not go well
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| 23:40 | well I have to thank you all for the info you have given me, I really need to get some sleep for the night
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| 23:40 | I will bang my head against the wall some more tomorrow with something I do not know enough about. Thank you
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