IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 20 November 2007 (all times are UTC)
| 00:02 | <vagrantc> daduke: no idea. works for me.
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| 00:02 | can't test it again till mid december
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| 00:08 | <daduke> vagrantc: you said earlier that it just installs ltsp-client and its deps. Could I add pulseaudio-esound-compat to this list?
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| 00:08 | <vagrantc> daduke: you can try, but i can't see how that would change it
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| 00:09 | daduke: ltsp-build-client --early-packages
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| 00:09 | <daduke> vagrantc: it's the best idea I have atm.
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| 00:09 | <vagrantc> daduke: ltsp-build-client --early-packages "ltsp-client pulseaudio-esound-compat"
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| 00:10 | actually, i can test the build ... i just don't have a client to boot
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| 00:10 | <daduke> vagrantc: running it now...
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| 00:20 | vagrantc: it worked! thanks, now I'm gonna test the build.
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| 00:21 | <vagrantc> seems to be working for me without explicitly specifying pulseaudio-esound-compat, but whatever.
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| 00:21 | <daduke> vagrantc: hmmmm
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| 00:29 | vagrantc: boots just fine, but X doesn't start, even with explicit SCREEN_01 = startx. The config's fine though, running X from the console works.
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| 00:33 | <vagrantc> daduke: specifying SCREEN_ 01-06 will likely break
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| 00:34 | daduke: default is SCREEN_07=ldm if no screen sessions are defined
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| 00:34 | <daduke> vagrantc: startx, ldm vt0 :0, I get the login window, but logging in takes forever and doesn't work - ldm quits. I've seen this will all new (non-stock etch) versions of ltsp/ldm
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| 00:34 | vagrantc: I
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| 00:35 | vagrantc: 'm trying 07=ldm now...
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| 00:35 | <vagrantc> only problem i had with LDM with these backports was that ldm didn't display the background wallpaper
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| 00:36 | <daduke> vagrantc: nope, no ldm. The logo is there if I start it like described above, but I cannot log in.
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| 00:36 | <vagrantc> etch hasn't changed much
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| 00:36 | don't really understand why it breaks for you in this way.
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| 00:37 | <daduke> vagrantc: also trying to change the session kills ldm: ldmgtkgreet:1906 glib-critical g_strsplit: assertion string != NULL failed
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| 00:38 | vagrantc: real bummer, we'd like to use it for our new student rooms. But we need USB.
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| 00:40 | * vagrantc tries with qemu | |
| 00:40 | <vagrantc> i don't release software without testing on real hardware
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| 00:41 | unless it's really trivial fixes... but i definitely tested sound, usb cdrom and floppy support with the current etch backport.
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| 00:41 | <daduke> vagrantc: we happily provide all the help we can.
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| 00:41 | <vagrantc> daduke: you're using standard etch mirrors, plus the etch-ltsp-backport ?
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| 00:42 | <daya> daduke, hi , have you tested the sound in ltsp client in debian
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| 00:42 | <daduke> vagrantc: when I try to log in, it stays with 'Verifying pw, pls wait' for 2 mins, then crashes.
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| 00:42 | <vagrantc> ok, so qemu test booted to ldm by default
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| 00:42 | daduke: have you removed /opt/ltsp after creating it?
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| 00:43 | <daduke> vagrantc: assertion failed. Yes, we have our own mirror debian.ethz.ch, plus the alioth repo.
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| 00:43 | daya: yup, sound works fine, but local USB devices don
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| 00:43 | <vagrantc> daduke: debian.ethz.ch is a full debian mirror?
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| 00:44 | <daya> daduke, How, it works is it in etch?
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| 00:44 | daduke, I have tried using backport, as directed by vagranct But still not able to work
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| 00:44 | <daduke> vagrantc: you mean in between the runs? yep, I cleaned it. debian.ethz.ch is a full mirror, we install/update 500+ machines from it.
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| 00:45 | <daya> daduke, I don't know where I have committed mistake,
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| 00:45 | <daduke> daya: this is what we're talking about, there still seem to be some glitches in here...
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| 00:47 | vagrantc: where are you? Should we send you some hardware? :-)
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| 00:48 | <vagrantc> daduke: i'm travelling
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| 00:49 | daduke: when i get back, i'll have all of freegeek at my disposal (http://freegeek.org) as well as at least one model from disklessworkstations.com
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| 00:49 | <daduke> vagrantc: ok, a second laptop then.
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| 00:50 | <vagrantc> definitely looking for a tiny PXE capable laptop
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| 00:51 | <daduke> vagrantc: I have a 12" Asus, but I never tried PXE booting. Are you in the US?
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| 00:52 | <vagrantc> daduke: mostly
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| 00:52 | daduke: whereabouts are you?
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| 00:52 | <daduke> vagrantc: Switzerland (still), but I could send it to you next time I'm in CA..
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| 00:53 | <vagrantc> well, the md5sum on debian.ethz.ch's Packages file is identical to the mirror i've been using ...
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| 00:53 | so i don't understand why it works so differently for you
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| 00:53 | <daduke> vagrantc: *relieved*
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| 00:54 | <vagrantc> daduke: CA as in canada, or california?
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| 00:54 | <daduke> vagrantc: neither do I. But our friend daya seems to have some probs too... let's figure it out, shall we?
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| 00:54 | basanta has joined #ltsp | |
| 00:54 | <daduke> vagrantc: Bay Area, CA
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| 00:54 | <vagrantc> daduke: i'll probably mostly be in portland, oregon next year
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| 00:54 | <daya> daduke, `why not, I am seeeking it since some months
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| 00:55 | <vagrantc> i've tried to help daya for quite some time, but i am stumped
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| 00:55 | <daduke> vagrantc: I'm pretty sure USPS can handle that...
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| 00:55 | <vagrantc> and not really able to do proper testing at the moment
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| 00:55 | <daya> daduke, do u remeber have u made some configuration or install pkgs, other that is provided in the readme file,
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| 00:55 | <daduke> vagrantc: let me be your workbench
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| 00:56 | daya: nope, I start from scratch every time.
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| 00:56 | <vagrantc> ltsp-build-client --mirror http://debian.ethz.ch/debian/ --apt-keys /etc/apt/trusted.gpg --copy-package-lists --copy-package-cache -
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| 00:56 | -extra-mirror "http://pkg-ltsp.alioth.debian.org/debian etch-ltsp-backports main"
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| 00:56 | seems to be working fine for me
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| 00:57 | <daduke> daya: if you don't need local USB, you can use plain vanilla etch, w/o alioth. Sound is working.
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| 00:57 | <vagrantc> oh, --copy-package-lists is a custom plugin from 5.0.39debian1
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| 00:57 | sound works with esd with the older versions, but not alsa ...
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| 00:58 | <daduke> vagrantc: coming from debian.ethz.ch? A had a colleague compile a backport, but it shouldn't be in there
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| 00:58 | <vagrantc> daduke: that's the exact commandline i ran
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| 00:58 | <daduke> vagrantc: and it boots into X and ldm works (or can't you test?) ?
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| 00:59 | <vagrantc> ltsp-server 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1 on an etch system
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| 00:59 | daduke: it boots into X, and ldm starts up. i can't really test if it logs in.
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| 01:00 | <daya> daduke, plain vanilla etch ,
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| 01:00 | ?
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| 01:01 | daduke, can I download it , and start from the scratch to build ltsp I didn't get it
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| 01:01 | <daduke> vagrantc: trying it here.... says unrecognized --copy-package-lists
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| 01:01 | <vagrantc> daduke: yeah, it's a plugin i grabbed from the newer packages
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| 01:02 | daduke: that's the only non-standard thing i have
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| 01:02 | <daduke> vagrantc: right, sorry, forgot.
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| 01:02 | <vagrantc> it basically just copies /var/lib/apt/lists/*Packages into the chroot ...
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| 01:02 | should save some downloading time
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| 01:07 | <daduke> vagrantc: the above line (sans --copy-package-lists) is missing pulseaudio again.
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| 01:12 | <vagrantc> daduke: not for me
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| 01:16 | <daduke> vagrantc: I don't know. Another question: in /etc/ltsp.conf on the TS it still says PKG_SOURCE=http://ltsp.mirrors.tds.net/pub/ltsp/ltsp-4.2/, shouldn't this be 5.0 now? I changed it to 5, but I don't see a difference.
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| 01:18 | <vagrantc> daduke: TS is .. the server ?
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| 01:18 | <daduke> vagrantc: terminal server, yes.
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| 01:18 | <vagrantc> daduke: /etc/ltsp.conf isn't used at all.
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| 01:18 | daduke: do you have ltsp-utils installed?
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| 01:18 | <daduke> vagrantc: I do.
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| 01:19 | <vagrantc> daduke: ltsp-utils is incompatible with ltsp5
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| 01:19 | <daduke> vagrantc: does it mess things up?
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| 01:19 | <vagrantc> daduke: it can
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| 01:19 | <daduke> vagrantc: purging it RIGHT NOW
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| 01:20 | <vagrantc> daduke: dpkg -l ltsp-server
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| 01:20 | <daduke> vagrantc: ii ltsp-server 0.99debian11 Basic LTSP server environment
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| 01:20 | <vagrantc> daduke: ah.
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| 01:20 | this is getting a little clearer.
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| 01:21 | <daduke> vagrantc: ah?
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| 01:21 | <vagrantc> daduke: you should install the backported ltsp-server package
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| 01:21 | <daduke> vagrantc: I thought I did
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| 01:21 | <vagrantc> clearly not :P
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| 01:21 | <daduke> vagrantc: I see that, but why not?
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| 01:22 | <vagrantc> daduke: because you didn't install it?
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| 01:22 | <daduke> vagrantc: I added alioth to the sources.list... ok, let me retry.
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| 01:22 | Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC | |
| 01:23 | <vagrantc> daduke: you followed the instructions on: http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto
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| 01:23 | ?
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| 01:23 | <daduke> vagrantc: yep.
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| 01:24 | Egyptian[Home] has joined #ltsp | |
| 01:24 | <vagrantc> daduke: apt-key list | egrep 13D61A99
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| 01:25 | <daduke> vagrantc: I have a suspicion... I added the sources last night, but it's missing now. Our automated distributed configuration system might've overwritten it. Sorry, my bad!
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| 01:26 | <vagrantc> i see. :P
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| 01:26 | <daya> daduke, what u have kept int sources.lst file,
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| 01:28 | <daduke> vagrantc: now we're talking: ii ltsp-server 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1
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| 01:29 | <vagrantc> daduke: now i know why you were getting the pulseaudio problems ...
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| 01:29 | daduke: 0.99debian11 adds esound as an explicit dependency ...
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| 01:29 | er, not a dependency ... it includes it in the list of packages to install
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| 01:30 | which conflicts with some pulseaudio-esound-compat
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| 01:30 | <daduke> vagrantc: I see. Rebooting now. stand by...
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| 01:30 | <vagrantc> shouldn't need to reboot ... but sure
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| 01:30 | <daduke> vagrantc: the thin client.... I think I should ;)
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| 01:31 | <vagrantc> ah, yes.
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| 01:31 | <daduke> vagrantc: hmm, still no X
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| 01:32 | <vagrantc> daduke: what's in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf ?
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| 01:32 | daduke: note the comment at the bottom of the Howto
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| 01:32 | <daduke> vagrantc: [Default]
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| 01:32 | LOCALDEV = True
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| 01:32 | LOCAL_STORAGE = True
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| 01:32 | SOUND = True
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| 01:32 | XF86CONFIG_FILE = /etc/X11/xorg.alix.conf
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| 01:32 | <vagrantc> LOCAL_STORAGE is unused if LOCALDEV is set.
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| 01:33 | <daduke> vagrantc: well, the cfg in my /etc/X11/xorg.alix.conf works fine, it just doesn't start
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| 01:33 | <vagrantc> SOUND is enabled if the sound stuff is installed
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| 01:35 | daduke: how does it work fine if it doesn't start?
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| 01:35 | <daduke> vagrantc: startx on console. Started ldm again manually, logging in still doesn't work.
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| 01:36 | vagrantc: I think I'll reinstall everything from scratch, who knows what's still lurking around in my system now....
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| 01:49 | <daya> vagrantc, which mirror it to use that provided in wiki or that you mention earlier,
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| 01:49 | ltsp-build-client --mirror http://debian.ethz.ch/debian/ --apt-keys /etc/apt/trusted.gpg --copy-package-lists --copy-package-cache -
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| 01:49 | -extra-mirror "http://pkg-ltsp.alioth.debian.org/debian etch-ltsp-backports main"
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| 01:50 | <daduke> daya: I'm not always sure what you're trying to ask, but the above is one line, that's what the \ is for.
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| 01:52 | daya: and debian.ethz.ch was just mentioned because it's our mirror. Use the one from the wiki
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| 01:53 | <daya> daduke, :), sorry for misunderstanding, I mean this link is not exact that is provided in the http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto,
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| 01:53 | daduke, I mean is there any difference in using any one of them,
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| 01:53 | <daduke> daya: use the one from the wiki, the mirrors are identical (vagrantc just checked)
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| 01:54 | <vagrantc> daya: --copy-package-cache and --copy-package-lists just save download time
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| 01:55 | daya: and using a different --mirror might save download time if the mirror is near you
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| 01:55 | <daya> vagrantc, daduke ok thanks
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| 01:55 | <vagrantc> daya: but it might also be out of date
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| 01:56 | daya: though etch doesn't change much, so most mirrors are probably up to date
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| 02:04 | <daya> vagrantc, I have used installed pulseaudio and managed to use pulseaudio in xmms as output sound plugins, when I run pulseaudio in client in tty1 it says main.c:"Daemon startup fails"
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| 02:05 | vagrantc, But sound in server is working with pulseaudio
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| 02:05 | <vagrantc> daya: i have only used pulseaudio with LTSP as described in the README.Debian.sound
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| 02:10 | <daya> vagrantc, I am a bit confused what libasound2-plugins does, Is it only the plugin for alsa to use pulse,could you please clarify it
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| 02:16 | <vagrantc> daya: it is the plugin for alsa to use pulseaudio, yes.
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| 02:25 | cyberorg has joined #ltsp | |
| 02:32 | <daya> vagrantc,But we don't install pulseaudio and don't run pulseaudio process in server,
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| 02:51 | <vagrantc> daya: yes, it's not necessary if you use libasound2-plugins
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| 02:51 | the pulseaudio libraries are installed
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| 02:51 | the binaries aren't needed
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| 02:52 | <daya> vagrantc,ye
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| 02:52 | vagrantc, But I am too tired why it don't work in case of mine :(
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| 02:58 | <daduke> vagrantc: yihaaaaa! I can log in!
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| 02:58 | vagrantc: even the background image works :)
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| 02:58 | <vagrantc> daduke: really?
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| 02:59 | the background image never worked for me
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| 02:59 | <daduke> vagrantc: yup. sound too.
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| 02:59 | <vagrantc> daduke: now that you're an expert, maybe you can help daya :)
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| 03:00 | <daduke> vagrantc: drumroll..... plugging in the USB stick now....
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| 03:01 | <daya> daduke, vagrantc yes great !
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| 03:01 | <daduke> vagrantc: WORKING!
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| 03:01 | vagrantc: thanks a lot!
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| 03:02 | <vagrantc> daduke: glad we finally figured it out :)
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| 03:03 | <daduke> vagrantc: me too, believe me.
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| 03:03 | <vagrantc> hmmm... i guess 5.0.39debian1 doesn't really introduce many significant changes
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| 03:05 | <daya> daduke, vagrantc can we now once again debug my prblem,
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| 03:06 | <daduke> daya: what did you do, and what is your problem?
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| 03:06 | <daya> daduke, sound problem in client,
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| 03:07 | <daduke> daya: this only answers the second part of my question.
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| 03:07 | <daya> daduke, I have installed LTSP in etch by follwing instrction in http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto, the lower one
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| 03:08 | daduke, I have configure the server as told in README.Debian.sound
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| 03:09 | daduke, and I managed the the player (xmms ) to use alsa as output plugin in client, But still sound don't work
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| 03:11 | <daduke> daya: I did not configure anything, xmms is using esound. It's a bit choppy from time to time, but working. will try README.Debian.sound now...
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| 03:11 | <daya> daduke, hm,
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| 03:20 | <daduke> daya: I followed README.Debian.sound now, configured xmms for alsa, and it works w/o any probs. Not even choppy!
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| 03:20 | <daya> daduke, but it didn't on me, no any sound,
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| 03:21 | <daduke> daya: and you're using the right jack, the alsa devices are not muted?
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| 03:22 | <daya> daduke, yes, I have tested the jack, and no mute , It is fine in ubuntu in the same machine
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| 03:26 | <daduke> daya: check alsamixer again, I've had it before that the standard sound output was muted. The setting does not survice a reboot, hence ubuntu is not proof here.
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| 03:26 | <vagrantc> uploaded some new backported packages: deb http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/debian etch-backports/
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| 03:26 | will move them to the pkg-ltsp project on alioth when i get a chance to test them
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| 03:27 | <daduke> vagrantc: .. what's the difference? I'm so happy everything is working now (I can even watch fullscreen video on the client!) that I don't want to break things again. But I'll test them of course.
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| 03:28 | <vagrantc> daduke: mostly just trying to keep it in sync with unstable ... not many differences
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| 03:29 | maybe won't even bother to upload a new official backport until i've gotten more bugs fixed in unstable
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| 03:29 | <daduke> vagrantc: ok, I'm being brave...
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| 03:30 | <vagrantc> updated translations for many languages :)
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| 03:35 | well, my initial build at least partially worked
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| 03:37 | klausade: new backports for etch, if you care to test them
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| 03:37 | <daduke> vagrantc: ok, updated everything, rebooting now....
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| 03:39 | <klausade> vagrantc: do they work for you?
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| 03:39 | <vagrantc> klausade: i'm not fully able to test them
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| 03:39 | klausade: not for a few weeks at least ... testing with qemu right now ...
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| 03:40 | <daduke> vagrantc: sound is working, but for local usb I get 'X11 connection rejected because of wrong authentication' in the TS log.
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| 03:40 | <klausade> vagrantc: I'll test them. Is there a changelog, what's new, right now i'm happily using 5.0.8debian3.
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| 03:40 | <vagrantc> klausade: ah, you're still on that!
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| 03:40 | klausade: quite a long list of changelog entries, then.
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| 03:41 | klausade: i think you had tried one of the newer backports since, but didn't have much luck with it ... ?
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| 03:41 | hmmm... i'm getting no X ...
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| 03:42 | worked with 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1 ... but 5.0.39debian1~40.etch.0 seems borked
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| 03:42 | maybe qemu is just being very slow ...
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| 03:47 | <klausade> vagrantc: yes, I once tried a newer backport, but got no X.
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| 03:50 | <daduke> vagrantc: X is working for me, and the local usb probs can be resolved by # env['DISPLAY'] = 'localhost:10.0' in ltspfsmounter and ssh -X -S ${LDM_SOCKET} in S10-delayed-mounter
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| 03:51 | <vagrantc> daduke: this is good news!
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| 03:51 | <daduke> vagrantc: happy to be able to provide some at least...
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| 03:53 | <daduke> vagrantc: I'm _very_ happy now, everything's working fine, and it's even integrated into our LDAP setup.
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| 03:53 | vagrantc: thanks again for your help.
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| 03:54 | <vagrantc> daduke: very glad to hear
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| 04:06 | <klausade> daduke: what inm ltsp (besides auth) do you have integrated into ldap?
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| 04:08 | <daduke> klausade: well I installed ltsp-server on one of our machines which is integrated into our 500+ machines LDAP setup. Hence my LTSP uses our full system. Very nice.
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| 04:09 | <klausade> daduke: and you have etch installed?
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| 04:10 | <daduke> klausade: yup.
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| 04:12 | <klausade> daduke: i'm also using backported xorg 7.3 in the chroot, gives me all the cool new features from xorg, like mirrored display with intel cards.
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| 04:12 | <daduke> klausade: out for lunch, back in 20 min...
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| 04:12 | daya has joined #ltsp | |
| 04:13 | <vagrantc> klausade: i would expect the newer backports to work decently with newer xorg
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| 04:13 | <klausade> daduke: same here (free lunch with a customer having a POS machines from us)
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| 04:13 | free lunch .....?
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| 04:15 | meduxa has joined #ltsp | |
| 04:15 | <daya> vagrantc, Sound is now working , !
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| 04:15 | <vagrantc> daya: excellent!
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| 04:16 | daya: what was the fix?
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| 04:17 | <daya> vagrantc, I don't know how it works
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| 04:17 | <vagrantc> ah, well, you'll have fun trying to figure it out next time :)
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| 04:21 | <daya> vagrantc, I have tried it in a new laptop,
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| 04:22 | vagrantc, Many many thanks for your cogent help and support,
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| 04:23 | vagrantc, I think My clients machine were the main reason
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| 04:23 | <vagrantc> daya: of course :)
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| 04:23 | meduxa is now known as toscalix | |
| 04:23 | <daya> vagrantc, It works on esd, pulseaudio,and alsa, but not in oss,
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| 04:23 | vagrantc, when I choose oss, its get played on server
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| 04:23 | <vagrantc> ah, yes.
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| 04:24 | daya: that's to be expected
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| 04:24 | daya: if it only supports oss, you can use the padsp wrapper to get it to work sometimes
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| 04:25 | <daya> vagrantc, padsp wrapper,is it a package or what ?
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| 04:26 | vagrantc, I mean which pacakge should I install to use it,
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| 04:27 | <vagrantc> daya: i don't remember which package it is in ...
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| 04:27 | daya: but it's really a last resort
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| 04:28 | <daya> vagrantc, ok
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| 04:28 | vagrantc, Now I am curious about usb,
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| 04:28 | vagrantc, It is detected in clinet, as I can see from tty1, dmesg, and fdisk -l,
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| 04:29 | vagrantc, But how can I use it in GUI client.
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| 04:29 | <vagrantc> daya: pulseaudio-utils is the package that has padsp
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| 04:29 | daya: it should get mounted in /media/USER/DEVICE
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| 04:35 | <daya> vagrantc, in gui or tty
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| 04:35 | vagrantc, it is not automounted
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| 04:35 | <vagrantc> daya: on the server
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| 04:36 | i must get some sleep before the sun comes up
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| 04:36 | <daya> vagrantc, in chrooted env
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| 04:36 | vagrantc, just some min,
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| 04:37 | <vagrantc> daya: on the server
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| 04:37 | /media/USER on the server
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| 04:37 | on the server
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| 04:37 | also you can see if it's getting mounted: mount | grep ltspfs
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| 04:37 | <daya> vagrantc, I don't get any /media/USER on the server,
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| 04:37 | <vagrantc> then it's broken
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| 04:38 | i was hoping to get to sleep about 5 hours ago.
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| 04:38 | good luck
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| 05:05 | <XTaran> Hi daduke! *g*
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| 05:06 | <XTaran> .oO( The [IRC] world is small. :)
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| 05:21 | tsurc has joined #ltsp | |
| 05:22 | <tsurc> does anyone know the port numbers need between client and server on an edubuntu system.
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| 05:22 | needed*
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| 05:25 | <tsurc> I wrote instructions for a transparent proxy but to make it work I've had to use iptables, thing is locally it works but it stops remote logins from thin clients
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| 08:58 | <sbalneav> Morning all
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| 08:58 | <ogra> !s
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| 08:58 | <ltspbot> ogra: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 08:58 | <ogra> he's alive !
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| 08:59 | <sbalneav> heh
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| 08:59 | yeah, busy few days.
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| 09:00 | Lost a raid unit yesterday, weekend we had a huge snowstorm, so had to get snowtires on, and get the snowblower going
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| 09:00 | etc etc
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| 09:03 | plamengr has left #ltsp | |
| 09:03 | <ogra> can you merge my tree ?
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| 09:04 | i think warren would like ot have something he can base on
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| 09:05 | <warren> yes please
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| 09:12 | sonjag has joined #ltsp | |
| 09:16 | <ogra> warren, when we taled about polkit you said fedora only uses it hand in hand with selinux ... is that to overcome any kind of weakness in policykit ?
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| 09:16 | *talked
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| 09:16 | (we're just discussing inclusion in ubuntu again)
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| 09:17 | apparently there are some issues with ptrace()
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| 09:17 | <warren> ogra, that doesn't sound right.
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| 09:17 | <ogra> thats what i understood from our conversation
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| 09:17 | (but there was sam adams involved ... so dont count on my mind :) )
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| 09:17 | <warren> ogra, we're pretty paranoid about security and don't allow lots of stuff that is unsound by design. SELinux is not meant to be the first line of defense ever.
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| 09:18 | <ogra> yeah, i understood that, but it sounded like you need that second line of defense with polkit
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| 09:18 | but i get thats not the case
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| 09:19 | <warren> I'm trying to find somebody with a clue who can answer this.
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| 09:20 | Hmm... 2.6.21 seems to never crash the T170
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| 09:20 | this might be a newer kernel bug
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| 09:22 | <ogra> my t170 runs fine with 2.6.22
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| 09:22 | (thats what we use in the current release)
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| 09:28 | where does it die ?
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| 09:28 | on kernel unpacking ? in the initramfs ? during mount of / ?
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| 09:28 | <warren> ogra, really early kernel
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| 09:28 | ogra, hpet_late_init
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| 09:28 | ogra, intermittent kernel memory corruption
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| 09:28 | <ogra> hmm, i dont see that here ...
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| 09:28 | <warren> testing 2.6.22 now
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| 09:28 | <ogra> culd it be your RAM =
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| 09:28 | ?
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| 09:29 | <warren> ogra, I suspect it is new in 2.6.23
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| 09:29 | ogra, yeah I should test that to be sure.
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| 09:29 | <ogra> ah, we dont have any built of .23 yet
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| 09:29 | *build
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| 09:29 | and i wont compile my own :)
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| 09:31 | <warren> ogra, I asked a few of our desktop people about PolicyKit. They suggested if there are concerns about the security architecture it should be posted on upstream discussion lists. But there are a few general comments...
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| 09:31 | <ogra> i'm following the hal list ...
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| 09:31 | <warren> Like... Red Hat wouldn't work on it if it were not a sound architecture, especially given the entire point of it is to be a security framework it BETTER be secure, even without SELinux.
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| 09:32 | <ogra> but i'm no security expert to judge ... we have people for that i like to delegate such stuff to :)
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| 09:32 | <warren> And I personally would add, it is easier to audit the narrow set of what PolicyKit does, than to audit all the setuid crap that it is meant to replace.
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| 09:33 | <ogra> well, the ubuntu way of using pmount with a ten line-of-code suid sub binary was actually pretty appealing
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| 09:34 | * ogra likes it if the security relevant pieces are separate and as trivial as possible | |
| 09:34 | <warren> ogra, PolicyKit is meant for other scenarios of desktop automation that are more complicated than those simple cases.
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| 09:34 | <ogra> polkit is a beast compared to that ... but then it offers more than mounting
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| 09:34 | right
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| 09:35 | <warren> ultimately we need something like this
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| 09:35 | perhaps this or another implementation
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| 09:35 | but I"m glad somebody is thinking about it
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| 09:36 | <ogra> indeed, it surely will improve
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| 09:37 | <tsurc> I hate to jump in but what ports are/could be used between cleint and server on an edubuntu gutsy server. I'm playing tith a transparent proxy that with an iptables rule stops users from loggin in from a client.
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| 09:37 | with*
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| 09:37 | <ogra> tsurc, look in /etc/inetd.conf
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| 09:37 | <tsurc> thanks ;-)
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| 09:38 | <ogra> usually its only 2000 for the nbd image and tftp nowadays, unless you have multiple images
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| 09:38 | i wonder if we could ssh-tunnel nbd somehow
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| 09:41 | <tsurc> my rule is: iptables -t nat -A OUTPUT -p tcp --match owner --gid-owner pupils -j REDIRECT --to-ports 8080
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| 09:41 | <stgraber> hmm, you would need to have ssh in the initrd and a way to login on the server without login/pass, so tunneling is possible but far from easy :)
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| 09:42 | <tsurc> but I guess that will stop all tcp traffic to and from the terminal
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| 09:42 | <ogra> stgraber, well, my main concern with the ssh client side stuff is that you can just read the keys
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| 09:43 | <stgraber> yes, if you block port 2000 you'll block all disk access which will basically make your clients to crash, if you just want to block login from running clients blocking ssh (tcp 22) should do it
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| 09:50 | <tsurc> well accepting all traffic to and from port 2000 didn't work. The client gets a login screen and can authenticate but the screen goes black with a mouse cursor after they have logged in, I guess its stopping the desktop session from starting up properly
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| 09:53 | Ah... that rule will redirect all traffic on "lo" as well as actual "outbound onto the internet" (eth0) traffic. Am I right?
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| 09:58 | thanks all, I'll have a think tonight and update the edubuntuProxy wiki page accordingly
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| 09:59 | tsurc has left #ltsp | |
| 10:02 | <ogra> hmm
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| 10:03 | i wonder if he used LDM_DIRECTX :)
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| 10:03 | he would have to let X traffic through then
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| 10:16 | <rafaelcardoso> via unichrome vga hava any configuration to make more faster o
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| 10:42 | <warren> *sweet*
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| 10:42 | <warren> really close to making LTSP install and update work with selinux enabled
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| 10:43 | <ogra> heh
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| 10:43 | <warren> ogra, if we get all aspects of the distro working by default with selinux enabled, then people aren't tempted to turn it off.
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| 10:43 | <ogra> we dont have any users in a choot and root is locked :)
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| 10:43 | <warren> ogra, selinux denials are bugs.
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| 10:44 | ogra, well I'm trying to make this in a general way, so the same chroot can be used for netbooted managed workstations.
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| 10:44 | <ogra> in the nfs implementation there are only a handfull of files writeable additionally
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| 10:44 | <warren> ogra, the nearer term issue however was selinux was denying the install/update itself
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| 10:44 | <ogra> ah
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| 10:44 | yeah, we have an ongoing request for fat clients
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| 10:45 | <warren> Fedora 8's selinux is really getting good, the default policies are very fine grained, and we keep adding more every day.
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| 10:45 | <ogra> the thing is that you need a network auth mechanism (at least the client side) which makes you depend on stuff like ldap etc ... something we liked to avoid unpstream yet
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| 10:45 | <warren> More developers and users know how to submit new rules for default inclusion.
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| 10:46 | <warren> ogra, right, I wont have all aspects of net managed workstations for quite a while.
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| 10:46 | <ogra> right
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| 10:46 | <warren> ogra, but I am getting the chroot install part correct now, so it isn't a problem later.
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| 10:46 | <ogra> i'm pondering suchg a setup since a while ... with one "golden workstation" that has full rw access to the chroot
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| 10:46 | so you can maintain the whole lot from that machine
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| 10:47 | <warren> Our workstation idea would be readonly filesystem, completely centrally managed, with data dirs mounted over the network. On top of that centrally managed selinux for another layer of security.
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| 10:47 | It is completely doable today to have your "golden workstation"
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| 10:47 | that is easy even if it is full rw
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| 10:48 | <ogra> right
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| 10:48 | but i havent come around to find the time to work out a proper default setup that works out of the box
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| 10:48 | we dont have a redhat directory server in ubuntu :) (yet)
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| 10:49 | so i'D have to tackle that part as well, i dont want to provide half solutions
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| 10:49 | <warren> Somebody added debootstrap to Fedora yesterday
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| 10:49 | <ogra> cool !
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| 10:50 | <warren> It would be cool if the equivalent were in Ubuntu.
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| 10:50 | <ogra> botstrapping fedora chroots ?
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| 10:50 | <warren> ogra, no, it is to install debian chroots on top of fedora.
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| 10:50 | <ogra> ah
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| 10:50 | what is the equivalent to debootstrap in fedora ?
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| 10:51 | <warren> ogra, we have too many options, unfortunately.
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| 10:51 | <ogra> ah
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| 10:51 | <warren> ogra, all of our tools assume you already have a fedora system in /. It might be simpler to write a tool that downloads the base RPMS and create a new chroot, then use yum from that chroot to install the rest.
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| 10:52 | <ogra> it would be cool to hackup debootstrap to build fedora chroots though ...
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| 10:52 | <warren> not sure how debootstrap works
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| 10:52 | i'll look into it
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| 10:53 | <ogra> it makes a lot use of dpkg ... not sure rpm can offer all features here ... beyond that it uses apt-get to install additional stuff after the base system is in place, i assume that part can easily be done by yum
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| 11:01 | <ogra> and they refuse to look at our tools ... not written here ... pfft
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| 11:03 | <johnny> :(
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| 11:03 | kill RPM
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| 11:03 | all over the place
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| 11:03 | spectra has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:03 | <ogra> whoops, that was from a different conversation ...
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| 11:03 | <johnny> hehe
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| 11:05 | <ogra> rpm has its advantages and drawbacks, as dpkg has ...
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| 11:05 | <johnny> hmm it would be nice to see an up to date comparison these days
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| 11:05 | i have't seen any of the good stuff in RPM since like redhat 5 :)
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| 11:06 | before the yum era
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| 11:06 | <ogra> well, its rather the thing on top that counts ...
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| 11:06 | apt, yum, yast ...
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| 11:06 | <johnny> yast ... haven't used suse since 8 or something..
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| 11:06 | i had it on multi disk dvd back in the day
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| 11:07 | or hmm.. really it musta been before 8..
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| 11:08 | ogra, is anybody familiar with ldm2 other than scott?
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| 11:08 | trying to figure out what my next step to help resolve this bug could be
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| 11:08 | i've looked in the code even, but nothin is jumping it, maybe cuz i rarely code in C
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| 11:09 | <ogra> johnny, me a bit ... but i havent had any time yet to look at anything ...
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| 11:09 | <johnny> he suggested i try ssh -X ltspuser@ltspserver
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| 11:09 | <ogra> i'm pretty busy with job stuff atm
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| 11:09 | <johnny> and that worked just fine
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| 11:42 | <ogra> sbalneav, https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/ltsp/ltsp-build-client-gtk
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| 11:42 | feel free to play with it :)
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| 11:43 | <sbalneav> Awesome
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| 11:52 | <stgraber> ogra: Looks really good, too bad I don't have a LTSP server around (I get an ugly error as I don't have /opt/ltsp :)). I played a bit with the glade file and think it looks better if you set the mirror URLs, chroot name and base dir as filling horizontal space
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| 11:53 | as their initial width was really really too small here (1680x1050 display so they had plenty of free space around them)
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| 11:53 | <ogra> feel free to patch it :)
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| 11:53 | i'll happily merge
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| 11:54 | <stgraber> ok, will send you the patch
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| 12:06 | <stgraber> ogra: http://www.stgraber.org/download/ltsp-build-client.diff, updated .glade + check if /opt/ltsp exists, if not show an error message (otherwise it's gtk who whines :))
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| 12:06 | <vagrantc> !serversize
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| 12:06 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "serversize" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/ServerSizing
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| 12:13 | <cliebow_> sbalneav: know anyone that misplaced by-the-sea 2005 sweatshirt?
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| 12:40 | <vagrantc> wahoo. finally figured out how to get qemu bridged networking at least sort of working
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| 12:42 | ironically, it was docs on getting bridged networking for virtualbox that helped me figure it out :)
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| 12:42 | <ogra1> heh
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| 12:42 | why dont you use vitrualbox ?
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| 12:42 | i find it way more comfortable
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| 12:42 | <vagrantc> just installed the etch backport today :)
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| 12:43 | but i'm not eagre to use something that requires kernel modules ...
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| 12:43 | ogra1: or are the kernel modules optional?
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| 12:43 | <ogra1> i dont think so
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| 12:44 | <vagrantc> and there's both host and guest modules?
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| 12:44 | <ogra1> but virtualbox on my lappie is faster than the ebox 1000 :)
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| 12:44 | you make it what you want it
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| 12:44 | <vagrantc> ?
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| 12:44 | <ogra1> its just a vm ...
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| 12:45 | i have one wiht a full edubuntu install and one that netboots from the other one and actes as client
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| 12:45 | <vagrantc> well, if the vm requires installing kernel modules inside the vm ...
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| 12:46 | <ogra1> i never found that necessary
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| 12:46 | indeed you can
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| 12:46 | <vagrantc> ok, that's what i was trying to find out :)
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| 12:47 | <ogra1> btw, in case you missed it: https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/ltsp/ltsp-build-client-gtk
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| 12:48 | will need some tweaks for debian i guess
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| 12:48 | <ogra1> (i.e. a switch to skip the image creation at the end etc)
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| 12:48 | <vagrantc> i gotta start testing the NBD root stuff again ...
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| 12:49 | ogra1: why doesn't it just use the normal plugins?
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| 12:49 | <ogra1> it calls ltsp-build-client
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| 12:49 | <vagrantc> which doesn't create an image on debian
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| 12:49 | <ogra1> but with --skipimage ... and then runs ltsp-update-image separately
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| 12:49 | <vagrantc> at least, not yet
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| 12:49 | ah.
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| 12:50 | <ogra1> it currently emulates the ubuntu default setu but split into parts to get proper progressbar output
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| 12:51 | <vagrantc> right
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| 12:52 | <dan__t> hi
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| 12:52 | * ogra1 currently pokes around on ltsp-image-shell, a tool that builds a unionfs from image and tmpfs and chroots into it ... on exit irt rebuilds the image | |
| 12:52 | <dan__t> sorry, didn't have a lot of time to dive into that last night, vagrantc.
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| 12:52 | Had to replace the power steering pump in my truck heh
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| 12:52 | <vagrantc> no problem
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| 12:53 | ogra1: a utility like that could really alliviate one of my biggest annoyances with the whole NBD image stuff
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| 12:53 | <ogra1> i also want to have a small status panel icon for ltsp sanity checks ;)
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| 12:54 | <vagrantc> i'd also like to see what the performance of a plain ext2 image or whatever ... how much is squashfs and how much is NBD
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| 12:54 | <ogra1> nbd is surely more involved here
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| 12:54 | but squashfs reduces the bandwith to 1/3 of a unsquashed fs
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| 12:55 | <vagrantc> that big of an improvement, eh?
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| 12:55 | <ogra1> well, unsquashing happens on the client
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| 12:55 | <vagrantc> right
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| 12:55 | <ogra1> so you trade bandwith against cpu power
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| 12:55 | <vagrantc> right ... slower clients might boot slower
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| 12:55 | <ogra1> exactly
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| 12:56 | still faster than nfs mounted ones though
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| 12:57 | shriek
| |
| 12:57 | * ogra1 was brave today and thougt he'd upgrade to hardy .... | |
| 12:58 | <vagrantc> ogra1: y'all pulled in debian's ltsp
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| 12:58 | <ogra1> Get:534 http://archive.ubuntu.com hardy/main ltsp-server-standalone 5.0.39debian1 [37,9kB]
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| 12:58 | * ogra1 cries | |
| 12:58 | <vagrantc> ogra1: i've been telling you that for weeks
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| 12:58 | it's probably the first time debian had a newer version
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| 12:58 | <ogra1> yeah, i didnt bother since i ran gutsy and scott didnt merge my branch yet to have something to package
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| 12:59 | no, there was a time around edgy ...
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| 12:59 | but we didnt sync back then
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| 12:59 | <vagrantc> the whole source split before merging debian changes makes for conflict hell.
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| 12:59 | 20-50 conflicts on any given merge.
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| 13:00 | <ogra1> well, ugly but solveable
| |
| 13:00 | cant you try to make the same split first ?
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| 13:00 | that should reduce it significantly
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| 13:00 | <vagrantc> i've solved them once, and then will have to solve them again... due to the "dists" shuffling
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| 13:01 | basically, i'm waiting to see a "stable" upstream before i try to merge again
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| 13:01 | <ogra1> well, i'D like to see released whats there now
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| 13:01 | we can fix the issues on the go
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| 13:01 | <vagrantc> i would *really* prefer to get debian merged before a release
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| 13:02 | <ogra1> thats what i mean with on the go ...
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| 13:02 | either push your merge now or wait for a release
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| 13:02 | <vagrantc> where do i push it?
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| 13:02 | <ogra1> i dont mind either
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| 13:03 | i just want code to package
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| 13:03 | <vagrantc> i've published my changes and asked for them to be merged
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| 13:03 | <ogra1> ah
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| 13:03 | <vagrantc> ogra1: your getting rid of the "dists" dir hasn't been merged yet either
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| 13:04 | <ogra1> sbalneav, ??
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| 13:04 | * ogra1 only has until dec 13th to get a stable source in | |
| 13:04 | <vagrantc> or wait ... maybe i'm wrong here
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| 13:05 | nope. still not merged
| |
| 13:05 | * ogra1 missed the LP codebrowse functions | |
| 13:05 | <ogra1> *misses
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| 13:05 | <vagrantc> i'm hesitant to work on LTSP until i see where LTSP is going ...
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| 13:06 | <ogra1> well, i thought we were pretty much done with the changes to the source so far
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| 13:06 | <vagrantc> because resolving 20-50 conflicts every merge is not my idea of fun.
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| 13:06 | <ogra1> right
| |
| 13:07 | <vagrantc> i think there were two changes you won't want for ubuntu ... dhcpd.conf and ... something else
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| 13:07 | ah yes, i only include the ltsp and Debian themes for ldm
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| 13:08 | <ogra1> well, thats easily changed :)
| |
| 13:08 | * vagrantc pushes again for a separate source package for additional themes | |
| 13:09 | * ogra1 isnt opposed ... but would like to see a proper ltsp theme first | |
| 13:09 | <vagrantc> LDM was something like 2MB with all the themes, and about 150k with just the "ltsp" and "Debian" themes
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| 13:09 | <ogra1> 68 lurkers in this channel
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| 13:09 | <vagrantc> ogra1: have you seen my ltsp theme?
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| 13:09 | <ogra1> IS THERE NO ARTWORKER ?? !!
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| 13:10 | vagrantc, got a screenshot
| |
| 13:10 | ?
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| 13:10 | <vagrantc> it's nothing amazing, but i think it'll ddo
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| 13:10 | <Guaraldo> jammcq: pastebot id down on ltsp-br... :-/ Can you help us?
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| 13:10 | <vagrantc> ogra1: no screenshot ... but it's just the LTSP.org logo from the website on a blue background
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| 13:11 | <ogra1> uuh
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| 13:11 | <vagrantc> ogra1: it's really small, and i would say passable
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| 13:11 | * ogra1 is no friend of the blue :) | |
| 13:12 | <vagrantc> ogra1: well, for the "ltsp" theme, i tried to emulate the ltsp website :P
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| 13:12 | <ogra1> right
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| 13:12 | <vagrantc> i suspect most distros will probably make their theme default anyways
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| 13:12 | <ogra1> yep
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| 13:12 | <vagrantc> it's kind of just an example
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| 13:13 | and for that, i think a small example theme is perfect
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| 13:13 | <ogra1> indeed
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| 13:14 | actually i'd just like to have LTSP overall a more modern look
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| 13:15 | <vagrantc> ogra1: well, if it's any consolation, the background image isn't just straight blue ... it fades at a diagonal :)
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| 13:15 | <ogra1> there are so many good artworkers out there
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| 13:16 | oooh, sexy :)
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| 13:19 | * vagrantc is happy to have qemu doing etherboot/pxe boot | |
| 13:19 | <vagrantc> might be good to update the qemu-ltsp script
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| 13:20 | although maybe i should just document it
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| 13:20 | since the user-mode networking requires no special privledges... even if it doesn't fully test the entire setup
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| 13:21 | <warren> user mode networking can't test PXE
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| 13:22 | or any of the netboot
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| 13:23 | <vagrantc> right, that's the downside
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| 13:24 | hence, "doesn't fully test the entire setup"
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| 13:25 | hrm. last night i was getting X with ltsp in qemu ... today ... just a black screen
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| 13:38 | <vagrantc> user registration with virtualbox? no thanks.
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| 13:47 | <stgraber> vagrantc: are you running the OSE or standard version ? IIRC only standard (the one with some proprietary modules) ask for registration
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| 13:53 | <vagrantc> stgraber: i'm running the ose version from backports.org (based on packages from debian.org)
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| 13:55 | <stgraber> hmm, so it should be OSE ...
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| 15:05 | <cliebow_> jammcq know anyone that misplaced by-the-sea 2005 sweatshirt?
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| 15:07 | <jammcq> cliebow_: did you end up with the extra?
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| 15:08 | err, misplaced one?
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| 15:08 | moquist_ is now known as moquist | |
| 15:08 | * jammcq was thinking it might belong to moquist | |
| 15:08 | <moquist> sbalneav: hey-a. didja get sshfsplus? any comments?
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| 15:08 | jammcq: I found mine at home.
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| 15:08 | bobby_C has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:08 | <jammcq> hmm, maybe dtrask?
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| 15:09 | <moquist> better chance of that.
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| 15:09 | <cliebow_> it was an extra large
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| 15:09 | ill ask dtrask
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| 15:09 | <jammcq> well, we know it's not mine
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| 15:09 | <cliebow_> 8~)
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| 15:09 | <moquist> heh
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| 15:11 | <cliebow_> i thought i was going crackerdog..id hang mine up..next thing i know..durn thing was downstairs again..
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| 15:13 | edgarin has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:13 | <cliebow_> til finally they both appeared at once..reminded me of esiotrot..first it was huge..next thing i know it was little again..
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| 15:14 | * moquist laughs out loud | |
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| 15:59 | <sonjag> Hello! Anyone out there ready/able to help me troubleshoot an issue? I think it's related to fuse.
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| 16:00 | <vagrantc> sonjag: best to just ask your questions and people will respond if they can
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| 16:00 | ltspbot: factoids search --values
| |
| 16:00 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: 'ltsp', 'sbalneav', 'icewm', 'frappr', 'wiki', 'debian', 'edubuntu', 'dhcpd', 'greyscreen', 'ltsp42', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'checklist', 'muekow', 'bestltspdistro', 'serversize', 'wireless', 'sound', 'topics', 'integration', 'lts.conf', 'pastebot', 'bootfloppy', 'ltsp5', 'tarball', 'download', 'monkeys', 'ogra', 'nfs', 'nfsnotresp', 'js', 's', 'troubleshooting', (1 more message)
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| 16:01 | <vagrantc> !question
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| 16:01 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "question" is if you have a question about ltsp, please go ahead and ask it, and people will respond if they can.
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| 16:01 | <sonjag> vagrantc, okay, here goes :)
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| 16:02 | I've been having occasional severe slow downs on my ltsp servers. If I restart, the issue goes away. I am not currently having the issue, but when I do, I can't really troubleshoot because I just need to get them running again.
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| 16:02 | So I looked around and saw this...
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| 16:02 | lsof | wc -l gave me this response
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| 16:02 | lsof: WARNING: can't stat() fuse file system /media/13tcair/usbdisk-sda1
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| 16:02 | Output information may be incomplete.
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| 16:03 | There are 5 similar responses, then lsof hangs. I have to ctl-c to get back to a prompt.
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| 16:03 | dmesg gives me this at the end
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| 16:03 | [98838.897576] end_request: I/O error, dev fd0, sector 0
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| 16:03 | <ogra> fuse is owned by the user and not even readable by anyone else (not even root)
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| 16:04 | s/fuse/a fuse mount/
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| 16:04 | <sonjag> I don't know if they're related, and I also don't know if they indicate that my server will start to slow to a crawl, but I'm just trying to understand and prevent the issue.
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| 16:04 | ogra, is that a command you are recommending?
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| 16:05 | <ogra> there is no command
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| 16:05 | its a security feature of ltspfs ...
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| 16:05 | sadly it breaks some tools like lsof
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| 16:05 | <sonjag> one last thing... when I run mount, I get quite a few of things similar to this
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| 16:05 | /tmp/.13tcair-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda1 on /media/13tcair/usbdisk-sda1 type none (rw,bind)
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| 16:06 | ogra, so are you saying that the fact that lsof hangs is not indicating problems? I don't understand what you meant by s/fuse/a fuse mount/
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| 16:06 | <ogra> tmp/.13tcair-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda1 is actually mounted to the thin clients device
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| 16:06 | i replaced the first with the latter in my former sencence ;)
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| 16:07 | <sonjag> ogra, it was. That is a removed usb drive. It is not still in the client machine.
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| 16:07 | <ogra> sorry, i'm to geeky sometimes
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| 16:07 | hmm, then the mount should have gone away
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| 16:07 | <sonjag> ogra, lol... it took me so long to get that.
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| 16:08 | <ogra> can you find out how the users logged out for which the stale mounts are there ?
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| 16:08 | <sonjag> ogra, what do you mean, how they logged out?
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| 16:08 | <ogra> ldm has a command that forcefully cleans up fuse mounts after logout
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| 16:09 | if you dont properly log i.e. just hold down the power button until the client shuts down that cleanup wont hppen
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| 16:10 | <sonjag> they rarely do that, but no guarantees (they're middle school students... everything is game :) I also have some of these lines
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| 16:10 | /tmp/.wdowning-ltspfs/floppy0 on /media/wdowning/floppy0 type none (rw,bind)
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| 16:10 | There are no floppy drives on the clients
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| 16:11 | <ogra> hmm
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| 16:11 | thats weird
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| 16:12 | <sonjag> Wait, that could be a lie. I have a laptop that the user listed there uses. It might have one. I would have to go look at it.
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| 16:13 | When my server ran slow on Monday morning, there were about 40 of these /tmp listings from mount. There was also swap space allocated that wasn't there on Friday when I left. No one uses these over the weekend, so I was surprised that the swap space got used.
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| 16:18 | <moquist> sonjag: do you have trouble with printing? e.g., whole TC session locking up when somebody tries to print?
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| 16:19 | <sonjag> I just went to look a the laptop.... it does not have a floppy drive. It is unusual tho that the only user for whom the floppy error comes up uses a laptop not a thin client.
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| 16:19 | <sonjag> moquist, hi! No, not usually. When the server starts to slow then yes, almost everything seems to lock the client.
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| 16:20 | moquist, I was having an error like that due to some fonts that either weren't compatible with cups or my printer drivers.
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| 16:20 | I told the students to be boring and use Times :)
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| 16:21 | <moquist> heh
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| 16:21 | sonjag: K. I'll keep that in mind when we try to figure out what's going on with ours (in one school).
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| 16:21 | I thought the problems had cleared up b/c I stopped hearing about them, but today I found out they haven't been using the TCs because of the above problem. 8-p
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| 16:23 | <sonjag> moquist, to clear it, I had to restart the printer which clears its queue so I assume it's an issue with the printer driver. However, it did stall the terminals so I thought it might have to do with cups.
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| 16:25 | <moquist> sonjag: Nah, in our case they click File->Print in OO and the whole TC freezes instantly.
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| 16:25 | I haven't been able to reproduce it.
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| 16:25 | * moquist hates not being able to reproduce this stuff | |
| 16:26 | <moquist> I'm scheduling a time when I can go to a classroom and watch it happen.
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| 16:26 | <sonjag> ogra, others... does it seem like the fuse and /tmp results on dmesg and mount, and the mysterious swap allocation would cause a general slow down of server response?
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| 16:27 | moquist, definitely try using the fonts that start with ae. They seem to be the most problematic.
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| 16:27 | <vagrantc> sonjag: what's your load average?
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| 16:28 | <sonjag> Is that in iostat? I'm trying not to sound numb ;)
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| 16:28 | <vagrantc> sonjag: cat /proc/loadavg
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| 16:28 | sonjag: or you can get it from top
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| 16:29 | <ogra> sonjag, well, the swap files should just vanish after some time and the stale mounts will only have an effect if the user tries to mount the same device again neither should have any infulence on the system speed
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| 16:29 | <sonjag> vagrantc, 2.03 2.24 2.30 3/447 813
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| 16:29 | <vagrantc> not crazy bad ...
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| 16:29 | <sonjag> vagrantc, the system is not loaded now... is this an average over time or right now?
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| 16:30 | vagrantc, by not loaded, I mean students are gone... no users but me.
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| 16:30 | <vagrantc> sonjag: the three numbers are averaged over time, but i think only in a matter of minutes
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| 16:30 | sonjag: so you've got a load of 2 with no users?
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| 16:30 | that's not good
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| 16:30 | <ogra> no, thats pretty bad actually
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| 16:30 | <vagrantc> sonjag: look for runaway processes
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| 16:30 | <sonjag> vagrantc, yikes... newbie time... how?
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| 16:31 | <ogra> if you run top ... whats the top CPU consuming process ?
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| 16:31 | (top of the list)
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| 16:31 | <sonjag> vagrantc, gnome-panel, and apparently I have a few users who didn't log out before they left so there are a few logged in but they're not doing anything
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| 16:32 | vagrantc, 24632 15jlamb 25 0 33132 12m 9548 R 100 0.2 216:19.21 gnome-panel
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| 16:32 | vagrantc, unless it's meaningful to have them there, I can kill their logins
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| 16:33 | <vagrantc> i would suspect those processes can be killed
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| 16:34 | <sonjag> vagrantc, I ran the loadavg on another identical server with no users and got this
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| 16:34 | 24632 15jlamb 25 0 33132 12m 9548 R 100 0.2 216:19.21 gnome-panel
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| 16:34 | or actually this...
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| 16:34 | 0.07 0.02 0.00 1/448 18200
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| 16:34 | <moquist> sonjag: I would totally kill that gnome-panel
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| 16:34 | <ogra> thats rather normal
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| 16:35 | <sonjag> ogra, what's normal?
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| 16:35 | <ogra> the last values you pasted
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| 16:35 | * moquist set the LTSP servers at one school to reboot at midnight every night... | |
| 16:35 | <moquist> I don't want it to be a long-term "solution", but hopefully it'll be a helpful troubleshooting step.
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| 16:36 | sonjag: The rebooting is, in part, to deal with such leftover processes as the ones you mention.
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| 16:36 | <sonjag> moquist, I do that manually when I see swap used... it always dies when swap gets used. But I don't want to run it so that I never see the problem b/c then I can't troubleshoot.
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| 16:36 | <moquist> I regularly have to kill more CPU-sucking processes than we have CPU cores, which means the entire server is busy running runaway processes until I log in and kill -9 them.
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| 16:37 | sonjag: Yes. You are right.
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| 16:37 | sonjag: I wasn't recommending anything here; I was confessing my inadequacy. :p
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| 16:38 | <sonjag> Confessions of a Serial Rebooter by moquist.
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| 16:39 | <moquist> oh, no.
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| 16:39 | I was going to publish under a sudo-nym. :(
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| 16:40 | Now sonjag gave it all away.
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| 16:41 | <warren> ogra, sbalneav: did sbalneav pull in ogra's repo?
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| 16:42 | <ogra> warren, i pung him several times ... according to vagrantc it wasnt merged two hours ago though
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| 16:45 | <sonjag> Is it normal to have processes running after the xsession has ended? I have users that have gnome-panel, evolution-data, and bonobo-activati showing up in top that have no xsession running.
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| 16:48 | <vagrantc_> http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/ltsp/ is missing the patches from http://www.ltsp.org/~ogra/ltsp/
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| 16:49 | <ogra> yeah
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| 16:50 | <sonjag> moquist, could this be hanging processes that cause problems with my servers? Didn't you once say that xterminator could be configured to kill processes on logout? Does it sound reasonable that changing to that might solve my issue?
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| 16:50 | <vagrantc_> and everybody's missing the patches from debian :P
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| 16:50 | <ogra> right
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| 16:51 | <jammcq_> =/quit
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| 16:51 | oops :)
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| 16:51 | jammcq_ has quit IRC | |
| 16:54 | <vagrantc_> mostly just a few bugfixes and lots of translation updates
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| 16:56 | * ogra tires a reboot ... | |
| 16:56 | <ogra> *tries too :)
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| 16:56 | <henriquev> I've about 200+ users to add to LTSP, what can I use to automatize it?
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| 17:02 | <henriquev> oh, as they're back from the split... => I've about 200+ users to add to LTSP, what can I use to automatize it?
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| 18:05 | <moquist_> sbalneav: ping
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| 19:07 | <sbalneav> Evening all
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| 19:07 | * vagrantc_ waves | |
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| 19:17 | <sbalneav> hey vagrantc
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| 20:57 | <boog> Is there a command for the lts.conf that will automatically log a user in at a given client?
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| 21:08 | <Artemka> iocharset CP1251 on local device, how can i made this?
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| 21:43 | <vagrantc_> boog: there's some autologin stuff, but it may be broken
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| 21:47 | <boog> vagrantc: can you point me in a direction?
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| 21:48 | I want to set up some kiosks at my community college campus. the kiosk admin tool seems to work well at locking them down, now i just need to figure out auto login
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| 21:50 | <rcy> i have been trying to get autologin working in ltsp 5. all i get is a black screen with an X cursor
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| 21:51 | using ldm
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| 21:51 | <vagrantc_> boog: supposedly LDM_USER and LDM_PASSWORD, but i think it's broken
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| 21:53 | <boog> is it broken in ltsp 5?
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| 21:54 | <vagrantc_> i think it's broken in ubuntu/gutsy, doesn't exist for ubuntu/feisty (although there are patches), and is broken in debian sid and lenny, and doesn't exist for etch, but there are patches for it.
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| 21:55 | boog: search for LDM_USERNAME and LDM_PASSWORD
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| 21:55 | <boog> will do. i plan to use it on opensuse 10.3 under kdm
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| 21:56 | <vagrantc_> ah, *no* idea how the suse support is
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| 21:56 | <boog> i'll report back here after we try it next week
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| 21:56 | <vagrantc_> actually, you might have better luck with gdm
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| 21:56 | i know there's support to use it with gdm
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| 21:57 | <boog> can i force the login session to kde with gdm?
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| 21:57 | <vagrantc_> probably
| |
| 21:57 | <boog> the kiosk admin policies do not seem to apply to gnome sessions, but they do work if the user logs in via kde
| |
| 22:00 | originally tried kiosk-mode under edubuntu, but could not get printing to work
| |
| 22:02 | <Artemka> anybody already made OO as local application7
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| 22:03 | <rjune__> boog: are you using kdm or gdm for login manager?
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| 22:03 | IIRC sabyon is the GNOME tool to do Kiosk type stuff
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| 22:06 | <boog> was using gdm
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| 22:08 | i hadn't heard of sabyon. does it do the same thing?
| |
| 22:13 | <rjune__> kdm works better for autologin
| |
| 22:13 | at least it used to
| |
| 22:13 | and yah, if I remember correctly, sabyon is the gnome equiv to kiosktool
| |
| 22:16 | <boog> i think i'll stick with kiosktool and try to accomplish the autologin with kdm. I am rebuilding this server with kde only.
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| 22:22 | thanks for your help and suggestions.
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| 23:14 | <warren> *SWEET*
| |
| 23:14 | ./mkdist --release can export Changelog directly from bzr log
| |
| 23:14 | so you don't have to maintain it in two separate places
| |
| 23:14 | unfortunately, Changelog originating from upstream's old old old bzr repos will contain lots of garbage
| |
| 23:14 | so this is only really usable on a fresh repo
| |
| 23:18 | <cyberorg> .
| |
| 23:19 | <warren> (for example, ltspfs will contain bzr log entries from everything else from the beginning of time instead of just talking about ltspfs. It is too confusing to use, unfortunately.)
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| 23:19 | <cyberorg> warren, where is the new upstream repo now?
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| 23:20 | <warren> cyberorg, sbalneav didn't import it yet
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| 23:20 | cyberorg, ogra has it in the new desired structure
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| 23:20 | I'll be applying fixes on top of ogra's structure
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| 23:20 | <cyberorg> cool, looking forward to it :)
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| 23:20 | <warren> this is the third version of new structure
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| 23:21 | Hmm...
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