IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 3 March 2014 (all times are UTC)
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| 04:59 | <fkeith> question i have a client who needs a setup for 200 thinclient workstations
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| 05:00 | planing to use n computing devices
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| 05:00 | does ubuntu support 200 clients
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| 05:00 | <vagrantc> might be best to explore ltsp fatclients
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| 05:01 | you'd need quite a few servers to load-balance that many users
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| 05:01 | wit han ltsp thinclient
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| 05:02 | <fkeith> what if i install a server with more ram
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| 05:04 | if not how fo i go about setting up load balancing
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| 05:25 | * alkisg wonders how much such a solution costs, with 200 n-computing devices... and, which ones? | |
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| 06:12 | <vagrantc> fkeith: well, each client login maybe requires 256-1GB of server ram...
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| 06:13 | fkeith: and you'll probably want a processor core for each 5 users, at least...
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| 06:13 | so we're talking 50-200GB of ram
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| 06:14 | <gdi2k> I'm noticing some low-cost chromeboxes becoming available like this: http://www.extremetech.com/computing/176123-asus-chromebox-for-just-180-you-can-have-a-fanless-fairly-useless-chrome-os-desktop-pc - it's $180, small, fanless and scores 1500ish on cpubenchmark.net. What are the chances of being being able to bypass the chrome stuff and (ab)use it as an ltsp fat client?
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| 06:15 | <alkisg1> It should just work... :)
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| 06:17 | * alkisg1 wonders if he could get those for 200€ here... | |
| 06:18 | <vagrantc> fairly useless... what marketing sense...
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| 06:18 | fkeith: and about 40 cores...
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| 06:18 | fkeith: so really, look into fatclients
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| 06:18 | fkeith: or at least some way of dividing the users/thin-clients across multiple servers.
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| 06:20 | * vagrantc wonders how many clients a single gigabit ethernet can realistically serve | |
| 06:21 | <gdi2k> what stops you from adding multiple NICs to a single server - that to me seems to be the bottleneck, and using the dnsmasq method, it would seem you can have fat clients boot from specific server interfaces
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| 06:21 | <vagrantc> well, sure, you can do bonded interfaces or split across multiple interfaces...
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| 06:22 | but how many clients realistically can go to each?
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| 06:22 | <alkisg1> If we support dmcache or something in ltsp, we could run hundreds of clients on a single nic... :)
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| 06:23 | The only bottleneck then would be /home
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| 06:23 | <alkisg1> ceph could help there, if the users usually used the same pc each time...
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| 06:26 | <gdi2k> by the way, those chromebooks have 16gb of internal storage (presumably ssd based) - that may help?
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| 06:26 | <alkisg1> Sure, for both root and home
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| 06:27 | If we used local storage, then the network bandwidth would be extremely lower
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| 06:27 | (bandwidth needs)
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| 06:27 | ...for swap too
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| 06:27 | For now, we support local swap and local squashfs image
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| 06:27 | !local-boot
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| 06:27 | <ltsp`> local-boot: If you want LTSP fat clients on a low-speed network, you can put i386.img on e.g. C:\Boot\LTSP\i386.img and use this command line in pxelinux.cfg: APPEND ro initrd=ltsp/i386/initrd.img init=/sbin/init-ltsp root=/dev/sda1 rootflags=ro loop=/Boot/LTSP/i386.img; IPAPPEND 3
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| 06:28 | <alkisg1> But it's a pain to have to copy the image after each ltsp-update-image, even if one can do it with a single click from epoptes
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| 06:28 | <gdi2k> possible with epoptes?
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| 06:29 | <alkisg1> So with dmcache/bcache/* for root, and ceph for /home, one could serve many many clients with low-speed networking...
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| 06:29 | Yes you can execute commands to the clients from epoptes, e.g. sudo dd /dev/nbd0 /mnt/Boot/LTSP/i386.img
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| 06:29 | <gdi2k> ah ok, yes, got it
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| 06:30 | * alkisg1 waves | |
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| 09:08 | <RL600> Is it possible to game through a "terminal server" or is it a waste of time
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| 09:11 | <elias_a> RL600: Depends on what you mean by gaming.
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| 09:22 | <RL600> Lets say battlefield 4 on medium settings is that possible (what would it cost)
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| 09:42 | <alkisg> With ltsp fat clients, it's the same as if it were running locally
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| 09:42 | So sure, gaming and everything is possible
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| 09:42 | !fatclients
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| 09:42 | <ltsp`> fatclients: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
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| 14:02 | <elmeri> .
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| 14:03 | <alkisg> !
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| 14:04 | <elmeri> hi
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| 14:04 | <alkisg> Hello
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| 14:04 | <elmeri> i woud need some help with ltsp-pnp....
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| 14:04 | <alkisg> !ask
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| 14:04 | <ltsp`> ask: Don't ask to ask a question, simply ask it, and if someone knows the answer, they'll respond. Please hang around for at least a full hour after asking a question, as not everybody constantly monitors the channel.
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| 14:05 | <elmeri> i did update server this morning and run ltsp-update-image --cleanup / after that some clients gets busybox
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| 14:06 | <alkisg> Some of them still work fine?
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| 14:07 | <elmeri> yes.... but just few of them the server is 12.04 ubuntu
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| 14:07 | <alkisg> dpkg-query -W ltsp-client
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| 14:07 | What's the output of that?
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| 14:08 | <elmeri> very long list
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| 14:08 | <alkisg> ltsp-client 5.5.1~r2555+p1204+201402271256~ubuntu14.04.1
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| 14:08 | That?
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| 14:09 | <elmeri> no... just xxxxxxxx12.04.1
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| 14:10 | <alkisg> Is it 5.5.1?
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| 14:10 | <elmeri> yes
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| 14:11 | <alkisg> On the client busybox, run this: ip addr show
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| 14:11 | Does it mention an IP address?
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| 14:14 | <elmeri> no there is no ip.... it says link/ether "mac brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
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| 14:15 | <alkisg> Can I have a look at your server via vnc? sudo apt-get install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect alkisg.dyndns.org
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| 14:15 | I did some changes in udhcp to fix the problem you're seeing, so it's weird that you still have it
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| 14:16 | <elmeri> ok
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| 14:18 | what do u need to get there ?
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| 14:18 | <alkisg> (04:15:00 μμ) alkisg: Can I have a look at your server via vnc? sudo apt-get install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect alkisg.dyndns.org
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| 14:22 | <alkisg> elmeri: if the clients that did have the problem, now boot ok, then udhcp still has unresolved issues... :-/
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| 14:22 | Do they boot now?
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| 14:23 | <elmeri> no still busybox
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| 14:23 | <alkisg> OK that's a good thing :)
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| 14:24 | <elias_a> elmeri: I am sorry you have problems but it is nice to see new Finns on this channel ;-)
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| 14:25 | <alkisg> Still busybox?
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| 14:25 | <elmeri> yes still busybox
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| 14:26 | <alkisg> elmeri: and `ip addr show` still shows no IP?
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| 14:27 | <elmeri> no ip just ff:ff.....
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| 14:27 | <alkisg> run this: ipconfig eth0
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| 14:27 | Did it mention an ip now?
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| 14:28 | <elmeri> yes now there is right ip address
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| 14:29 | <alkisg> elmeri: reboot client...
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| 14:30 | Meh
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| 14:30 | I can't find a reliable way to get the interfaces up :(
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| 14:30 | <elmeri> yes :) it has gui to login!
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| 14:31 | <alkisg> Yes because I put "sleep" there
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| 14:31 | But I shouldn't have to use sleep :-/
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| 14:31 | <alkisg> elmeri: do you have 10-15 minutes to find some good code to fix this?
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| 14:32 | I.e. to help me test, because that problem doesn't happen here with my clients...
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| 14:32 | <elmeri> yes i do have 15min....
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| 14:32 | <alkisg> I just need you to report when it's working and when it's not
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| 14:32 | Nice...
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| 14:32 | elmeri: do you have a mobile phone with which you could take photos and upload them to e.g. imagebin.org?
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| 14:33 | from the client screen...
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| 14:33 | <elmeri> yes i do have
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| 14:33 | <alkisg> Nice
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| 14:35 | elmeri: reboot client
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| 14:35 | (no need for a photo yet...)
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| 14:35 | <elmeri> ok.. bootinh
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| 14:36 | busybox again
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| 14:38 | <alkisg> elmeri: reboot client, and wait for the message that says "take a picture now"
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| 14:38 | <elmeri> ok
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| 14:38 | <alkisg> You have 40 seconds then to take a picture :)
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| 14:38 | <elias_a> Wow - this is interesting!
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| 14:39 | <alkisg> (also check if the client booted or not :))
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| 14:40 | <elmeri> i didnt see the text.... it went to busybox in 10 seconds
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| 14:41 | <alkisg> Did you see a message about "no network interfaces are up" etc?
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| 14:41 | Or, no network interfaces found?
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| 14:42 | <elmeri> yes that message is on screen right now
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| 14:42 | <alkisg> Which one of those 2 messages?
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| 14:42 | No found?
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| 14:42 | Or no interfaces are up?
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| 14:42 | <elmeri> no network interfaces are up
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| 14:43 | <alkisg> type "exit" on busybox
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| 14:43 | And check if you now got the "take a picture" message
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| 14:44 | <elmeri> yes now i have pictre from screen....
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| 14:45 | <alkisg> elmeri: reboot the client again
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| 14:45 | <elmeri> ok
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| 14:46 | <alkisg> Meh
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| 14:46 | I had 4 seconds maximum wait from the time of `ip link up` to the time that the link is actually up
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| 14:46 | <elmeri> and i have login screen
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| 14:46 | <alkisg> ...and in your system, it's too little!!!
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| 14:46 | OK I'll increase that to 10 seconds
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| 14:46 | <elmeri> ok
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| 14:46 | old machines....
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| 14:46 | <alkisg> elmeri: can you run this on the client?
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| 14:46 | 1) login
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| 14:46 | 2) ltsp-localapps xterm
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| 14:47 | 3) on the xterm that got opened:
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| 14:47 | lspci -nn -k | grep -A 2 Ethernet
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| 14:47 | ...and paste the result here or in pastebin.com
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| 14:47 | <elmeri> i try
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| 14:47 | <alkisg> Also please mention your cpu, you can see it with `cat /proc/cpuinfo`
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| 14:48 | <elmeri> ok
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| 14:48 | <alkisg> (on the xterm again on the client)
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| 14:48 | <elmeri> ok...
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| 14:50 | <alkisg> Here's the fix, in case you were wondering: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/revision/2558/client/Debian/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/init-premount/udhcp
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| 14:51 | I just committed it to the ltsp code... thanks
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| 14:57 | <elmeri> pastebin.com/9VLGigBJ
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| 14:57 | and thanks!!!
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| 15:00 | <alkisg> You're welcome :)
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| 15:00 | Ethernet controller [0200]: Broadcom Corporation NetXtreme BCM5751 Gigabit Ethernet PCI Express [14e4:1677] (rev 01)
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| 15:00 | Subsystem: Hewlett-Packard Company DC7100 SFF(DX878AV) [103c:3006]
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| 15:00 | Kernel driver in use: tg3
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| 15:00 | model name : Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.00GHz
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| 15:01 | (just to keep them here in the irclogs in case they're ever needed)
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| 15:11 | <elias_a> alkisg: That was nice to follow :)
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| 15:11 | <alkisg> :)
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| 15:12 | <elias_a> My grandmom comes from the town elmeri works in :)
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| 15:12 | So a double on behalf of the Finns ;-)
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| 15:12 | <alkisg> Fortunately, people are not too afraid to give vnc access to their servers
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| 15:12 | It would take ages without it...
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| 15:14 | <elias_a> :D
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| 17:42 | <alkisg> !ipconfig
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| 17:42 | <ltsp`> ipconfig: to fake a DHCP request from your LTSP server, e.g. to check if another DHCP server is present: sudo /usr/lib/klibc/bin/ipconfig -n eth0
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| 17:42 | <alkisg> !learn ipconfig-readme as http://git.kernel.org/cgit/libs/klibc/klibc.git/tree/usr/kinit/ipconfig/README.ipconfig
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| 17:42 | <ltsp`> The operation succeeded.
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