IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 11 March 2012 (all times are UTC)
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| 07:52 | <knipwim|vacation> /nick knipwim
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| 07:52 | <muppis> Too long in vacation? ;)
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| 07:52 | <knipwim> clearly
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| 07:53 | getting used to the keyboard interface
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| 07:53 | <muppis> Good starting point.
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| 07:58 | <alkisg> Welcome back :)
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| 08:13 | <srdjo> good morning all
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| 08:15 | is there a directory that is visible on ltsp clients and ltsp server at the same time without special mounting ? I would like to put some config files there to use on client without rebuilding the image
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| 08:16 | <alkisg> Since you're not using NFS, no, there isn't
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| 08:17 | Some alternatives are the tftp dir, localapps_extramounts, ssh_followsymlinks and /home, etc
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| 08:17 | Or you can stop using squashfs, so that you don't have to run ltsp-update-image on each change
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| 08:18 | <srdjo> what would be the best place to keep few config files for my cups printers script ?
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| 08:18 | <alkisg> The best place would be to implement a script that does what you want,
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| 08:18 | and then use new lts.conf parameters for each client
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| 08:19 | E.g. CUPS_PAGE_SIZE=xxx, CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True/false etc
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| 08:20 | If you do that, attach it to your bug report so that some developer considers it for upstream inclusion
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| 08:21 | Now if you don't want to do that, then just do what X_CONF does, which is also what Hyperbyte adviced you: put all your cups.xxx.conf scripts in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/somewhere
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| 08:22 | And just implement a CUPS_CONF=xx lts.conf directive
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| 08:22 | <srdjo> what I did is create a two part script - first part is run on client after all printers are set and it copies all the files to the home/user/cups dir - the second part is run on the server and it copies the files back to chroot creates script files and runs ltsp-update-image
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| 08:22 | <alkisg> That's not a good solution though
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| 08:23 | The best method is to have a script run on the client before cups runs at all
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| 08:23 | So that when it starts it already has the configuration you specify with lts.conf
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| 08:23 | <srdjo> and it all works fine but I thought about creating a general script that could get user.cups.conf from server, and if it exists it uses it
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| 08:23 | <alkisg> In other words, a script that can modify cups.conf
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| 08:24 | <srdjo> cupsd.conf is not the problem - the printers.conf is
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| 08:24 | <alkisg> Gettting user.cups.conf wouldn't be a good solution either
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| 08:24 | <srdjo> i meant client.cupsd.conf
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| 08:24 | <alkisg> It doesn't matter which configuration file you want to have modified, the idea is the same for all of them
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| 08:25 | "modify them before the service starts, based on parameters provided in lts.conf"
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| 08:28 | <srdjo> it is not problem for me to do that, but I want to make a script that anyone can use - the idea is that one boots the client, sets the cups settings he want, installs all the printers he wants, runs ltsp-cups-save (all files are saved) and when he reboots everything works again - i just need a proper place to store the files
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| 08:29 | and I would need only one variable - CUPS_CHECK=True
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| 08:31 | <alkisg> Why should he need to chroot, update image etc just to share his printers?
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| 08:31 | Wouldn't it be much easier to put CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True in lts.conf?
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| 08:32 | Please read the lts.conf man page for the X_* related settings
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| 08:32 | What I'm saying is that for most cups settings, we could use the same method as XRANDR_MODE_0 etc, without need to modify the chroot at all
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| 08:32 | <srdjo> but what about printers - samsung printer wont reinstall automatically at reboot
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| 08:32 | <alkisg> And in special cases where indeed cups.*.conf needs to be modified, we would resort to CUPS_CONF=path
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| 08:32 | Like X_CONF
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| 08:32 | Again, see the lts.conf manpage for X_CONF
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| 08:33 | <srdjo> no mater the sharing settings
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| 08:33 | ok - will see it now
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| 08:33 | <alkisg> The place to put X_CONF files are in the chroot /etc, like we've been telling you all along
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| 08:33 | The same would be for CUPS_CONF files too
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| 08:34 | Also I think that a CUPS_PPD=file directive would allow installing many printers that don't get installed automatically
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| 08:35 | <srdjo> then my logic is blown away :) - the idea was to keep it simple - one command - one variable
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| 08:36 | <alkisg> Would it be simple to tell people to create several different xorg.conf files instead of just using XRANDR_MODE_0=1024x768?
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| 08:37 | When someone has an HP printer and wants to share it, why would he go through the trouble of copying cups.conf files and updating chroots when he could just do CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True ?
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| 08:38 | <srdjo> cups is ok, but the printers.conf file is the problem
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| 08:38 | <alkisg> Again, it doesn't matter which configuration file it is, I'm discussing the general idea.
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| 08:38 | <srdjo> when he boots that HP is not there :)
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| 08:38 | <alkisg> Why?
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| 08:38 | <srdjo> it is not auto installed
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| 08:38 | <alkisg> Why?
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| 08:38 | <srdjo> he has to press the add printer button
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| 08:39 | I dont know why, but for samsung printers it is so
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| 08:39 | <alkisg> In many many cases, no
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| 08:39 | In some cases where the exact printer model isn't specified, yes
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| 08:39 | (in the printer configuration files)
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| 08:39 | <srdjo> lexmark printers are auto installed
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| 08:39 | <alkisg> So a single lts.conf line would help there
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| 08:39 | HP too
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| 08:39 | Many HP printers are
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| 08:42 | <srdjo> I solved my problem, and I could just quit, but I want to resolve this for everyone - I have spent 10 days on this and I want to spend few more to do it right
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| 08:42 | <alkisg> I understand, that's why I'm spending time to try to point you to a method that could be accepted upstream
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| 08:43 | The cups problem is very similar to the xorg.conf problem, so it would be solved in a similar way
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| 09:05 | <Hyperbyte> srdjo, why don't you just expand on the earlier solution I gave you?
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| 09:06 | I.e, you had one correct default cupsd.conf, one correct stampac cupsd.conf, why not just create a third, fourth or fifth cupsd.conf for other clients as well?
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| 09:09 | <Llama_be> hey knipwim, had a good vacation? I got my ltsp clients to boot with SCREEN_01
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| 09:10 | SCREEN_01=xterm and start xfreerdp from there. So the dependency on server for xorg is not needed. However, I have not yet managed to boot them completely autonomous into xfreerdp
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| 09:17 | <srdjo> Hyperbyte, I wanted to do it like that but alkisg has a different approach
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| 09:17 | <alkisg> Many cupsd.conf is similar to many X_CONF= files that I was saying
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| 09:17 | But that's not enough
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| 09:18 | <srdjo> now I am trying to build printers.conf file on boot for every client
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| 09:18 | based on the CUPS_FAT_PRINTER variable
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| 09:19 | later I will divide it to have more options like
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| 09:19 | CUPS_FAT_PRINTER_PAPER_SIZE
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| 09:19 | and so on
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| 09:22 | think that is the right way to go - I will also leave 2-3 empty CUSTOM variable for printer specific options as that might be needed for someone
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| 09:28 | <alkisg> srdjo: commit the "FAT" from the variables... CUPS can be used from localapps too
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| 09:28 | *omit, not commit, sorry
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| 09:29 | <srdjo> using localhost as server ?
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| 09:29 | <alkisg> Whatever server
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| 09:30 | E.g. one may want a localapps firefox in a specific thin client to print to a specific cups server to the other room
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| 09:30 | So he'd put [mac:address] CUPS_SERVER=the-other-room-pc-ip
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| 09:31 | <srdjo> yes, and that is why I added the FAT in name to distinguish then - the script wont be run for them
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| 09:31 | as they dont read the printers.conf file
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| 09:31 | it is on specified server
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| 09:31 | <alkisg> They should, localapps should behave the same as fat clients
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| 09:31 | No need to have different cups options for them
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| 09:32 | <srdjo> not if CUPS_SERVER is not localhost
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| 09:32 | they are connecting to other server having its own cupsd.conf and printers.con
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| 09:32 | conf
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| 09:33 | <alkisg> I think that if CUPS_SERVER is not defined, client.conf should be left empty,
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| 09:33 | thus showing all published printers on the local network
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| 09:33 | If it's defined, it should behave the same for localapps and fat clients alike
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| 09:34 | If CUPS_PAPER_SIZE is defined, it should modify the client printers.conf or whatever conf file it needs
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| 09:34 | Again, without caring if localapps or fat clients are used
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| 09:35 | <srdjo> yes, but if you specify CUPS_SERVER=10.0.0.100 then there is nothing to edit - we dont have access printers.conf no mater if its FAT or LocalApps
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| 09:36 | <alkisg> So?
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| 09:36 | Does that change anything?
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| 09:36 | Also, you may use CUPS_PAPER_SIZE on client01, and then put CUPS_SERVER=client01 to the other client02
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| 09:37 | <srdjo> so the CUPS_SERVER variable should be the trigger for my script - if it is not localhost just exit
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| 09:38 | <alkisg> If it's empty, it should still be reading the local configuration
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| 09:39 | <srdjo> Ill try it now just to be sure
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| 09:39 | <alkisg> (I think that currently it uses LDM_SERVER so it's broken)
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| 09:40 | But I don't think that you should care about CUPS_SERVER, if someone defined any of those CUPS_* vars your script should do its job without caring about the server
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| 09:41 | In an extreme case, suppose I'm working on client01 and I want to always print on client02 (color printer there) while the person working on client02 wants to always be printing to my client01 printer
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| 09:41 | In that case, we'd both have CUPS_SERVER=the-other-pc
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| 09:41 | ...we'd still want the paper settings to take effect on our printer though
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| 09:42 | The cups client part shouldn't care about the server part
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| 09:42 | <srdjo> yes, but it would only have effect on client01 as the printer is connected there
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| 09:43 | <alkisg> There are two printers in this example, color printer on client02 and black/white printer on client01
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| 09:43 | <srdjo> whatever changes the client01 makes are auto translated to client02
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| 09:43 | <alkisg> In lts.conf you'd put: [client01] CUPS_SERVER=client02
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| 09:43 | and [client02] CUPS_SERVER=client01
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| 09:43 | <srdjo> no, you would use CUPS_SERVER=localhost on both and enable sharing on both
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| 09:43 | <alkisg> Now if you wanted to specify the paper size on client01, why shouldn't you be able to?
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| 09:44 | I don't want client01 to be able to print in his printer
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| 09:45 | <alkisg> Anyway, /me goes back to coding, bbl
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| 09:49 | <srdjo> Hyperbyte, take a look at a script I made from our talk yesterday http://pastebin.com/qrrU7K9J
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| 09:51 | it has two parts - client runs the first one when he sets up everything and the other part on the server to create /usr/bin script, copy files to chroot and update client
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| 10:09 | <Hyperbyte> srdjo, look at it in a bit
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| 10:09 | Question though - CUPS_PAPER_SIZE... how are you going to set that in the CUPS config?
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| 10:09 | <srdjo> it is not set in cupsd.conf but in printers.conf
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| 10:09 | <Hyperbyte> Ah, the default paper size for print jobs.
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| 10:10 | <Hyperbyte> srdjo, this means you have to run cups configure for every user?
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| 10:11 | <srdjo> only for the users that have local printers
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| 10:11 | <Hyperbyte> srdjo, wouldn't it make more sense to do it based on clients, like we did before?
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| 10:11 | So you configure the local printer for the client, and not for the user?
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| 10:11 | <srdjo> yes - just using home to store file temporarily
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| 10:13 | <Hyperbyte> Where and how is the cupsd.conf and printers.conf generated?
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| 10:13 | <srdjo> in the chroot of the booted client
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| 10:13 | and then copied to home
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| 10:13 | and from server back to image
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| 10:14 | <Hyperbyte> I mean specifically.
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| 10:14 | Where in the chroot of the client, and how?
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| 10:14 | <srdjo> the cupsd.conf is in /etc/cups/
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| 10:15 | and printers.conf is generated only when printer is added
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| 10:15 | <Hyperbyte> Ah - so you're creating the cupsd.conf and printers.conf by hand?
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| 10:15 | <srdjo> (in the script I am working on with alkisg i will use lpadmin to add printer and generate printers.conf)
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| 10:16 | when client boot and add printer
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| 10:16 | <Hyperbyte> I still don't see the purpose of this script.
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| 10:16 | You either take one of two approaches:
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| 10:16 | 1. Create a pre-determined cupsd.conf for each client, and copy it over the cupsd.conf on client boot
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| 10:17 | 2. Set configuration variables for the client, and run lpadmin on boot to pass those to cups
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| 10:17 | This back-and-forth of files between server and client is confusing
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| 10:17 | You seriously need to stop abusing /home/ for this, it makes things confusing.
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| 10:17 | If you want to move files from client to server, or vice-versa, use scp.
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| 10:18 | What I would do, is one of two cases:
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| 10:18 | <srdjo> this script is replacing manual work for your step 1
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| 10:19 | <Hyperbyte> 1. Create two scripts. One called "ltsp-save-cups" and one called "ltsp-restore-cups"
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| 10:19 | "ltsp-save-cups" would scp the cupsd.conf and printers.conf to the server, and place them under <chroot>/etc/cups/<mac address>/
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| 10:20 | And then another script called "ltsp-restore-cups" which runs during boot, and copies /etc/cups/<mac address>/ files over cups config, if they exist.
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| 10:20 | Then you set it per-client, and not per-user.
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| 10:20 | Or two
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| 10:21 | <srdjo> that is the same thing I am doing - just did not know about scp
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| 10:21 | so I used home
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| 10:21 | <Hyperbyte> 2. Create configuration variables CUPS_PAPERSIZE, CUPS_PRINTER, etc, whatever you need... and create an LTSP or LDM startup script, which runs the correct lpadmin commands to configure CUPS accordingly.
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| 10:23 | srdjo, I don't see yours based on mac-address. Also, one script on client and one on server is confusing. Use ssh and scp from the main script to execute remote commands, and copy files - that way you also get rid of the required 'running the script as root'
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| 10:23 | <srdjo> the first way is easier to do - in what /etc/cups directory should I copy the files to ? server or chroot ?
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| 10:24 | <Hyperbyte> If the client needs access to something during boot, it has to be the chroot.
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| 10:24 | The files on the server only come into play once a thin-client user logs in to LDM, or with remote apps from a fat client.
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| 10:24 | <srdjo> so that also means running ltsp-update-client
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| 10:25 | <Hyperbyte> Yes, that means doing that.
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| 10:25 | <srdjo> I will focus on the second way as you and alkisg suggested
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| 10:25 | <Hyperbyte> One of the disadvantages of using NBD vs NFS
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| 10:26 | Second way is definitely the most robust solution.
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| 10:27 | <srdjo> but is also harder to make :) - will make it now and be back with results
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| 10:32 | <Hyperbyte> Well, yeah... but if you get something that works -very- good, it could possibly be included in LTSP by default... :)
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| 10:32 | Think of all the fame! The lobster dinners! ... the chicks! :-D
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| 10:33 | <srdjo> possibly ??? :) when I make it right it must be included :)
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| 10:34 | <Hyperbyte> Well I'm not a developer, so I don't decide about that. :P That's why I said 'possibly'.
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| 10:34 | <srdjo> lets first make it :)
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| 12:15 | <markit> hi ppl :) alkisg, you use x11vnc with -noshm option, "man" says "be careful this can use large amounts of network bandwidth"... is something can be avoided when providing remote assistance (through adsl and not local net)?
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| 12:16 | <alkisg> No
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| 13:26 | <srdjo> alkisg, I dont thing this can be done the xorg way. I tried multiple printers, and only the ones that can be installed by plug and play work, but there are the ones that need download plugins (HP p1005) and new ones that are not yet supported without manufacturer drivers (that should also be in chroot). I am running out of options.
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| 13:27 | thing/think
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| 13:28 | <alkisg> srdjo: so it's not possible to isntall hp p1005 in a e.g. ubuntu desktop pc without internet connection?
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| 13:30 | <srdjo> it asked to download a new firmware from internet or select it from file
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| 13:31 | but once the firmware is upgraded it is auto installed
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| 13:32 | <alkisg> Installing drivers or firmware to the chroot is not ltsp's responsibility
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| 13:32 | If one needs to install the nvidia drivers, he just installs them
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| 13:33 | <alkisg> Don't compare xorg.conf with printer drivers, compare the nvidia drivers with printer drivers
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| 13:35 | <srdjo> yes, but in order for my script to work, printer must be installed, and i thought of using lpamin to install and configure it on boot. but it it wants some response, how to handle that ?
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| 13:35 | lpadmin
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| 13:35 | <alkisg> lpadmin would download the firmware over the internet?
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| 13:35 | I think you're mixing too many parameters in your questions... maybe focus them on one thing at a time?
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| 13:36 | For missing drivers and firmware, I don't think LTSP should do anything
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| 13:36 | If the firmware is there, you say that the printer is automatically installed
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| 13:36 | What happens with e.g. lexmark printers? I thought those needed manually selecting a .ppd file?
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| 13:37 | <srdjo> V120 auto installs
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| 13:37 | e232 also
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| 13:37 | <alkisg> OK, so in which case could ltsp help with installing a new printer?
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| 13:38 | <alkisg> (not talking about the next CUPS_PAGE* or other stuff, just the installation for now)
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| 13:38 | <srdjo> I mean e120 - just need to know how to handle installation problems in script - lets say there is no driver - how to detect that ?
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| 13:38 | how to handle it ?
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| 13:42 | should I just exit or is there a way to report there is an error in installation ?
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| 13:44 | <alkisg> srdjo: I don't understand why your script needs to care about the CUPS_SERVER, if printers are installed etc
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| 13:44 | Can I see it?
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| 13:45 | Isn't it enough to modify the cups configuration files even before cups is started?
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| 13:46 | And I also don't understand what your script has to do with driver installation, installing drivers shouldn't be an ltsp problem
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| 13:54 | <srdjo> If printer is auto installed, there is no problem, but if it is for example Samsung ML-1910 that is supported but not auto installed, I need to find its ID using lpinfo and add it using lpadmin. printers.conf file is then created and i can modify anything once I have a file. Or I could just write out printers.conf file from the script. But if it is not supported, what should I do ? Do I just exit or is there a way to report to user that the driver needs to be
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| 13:54 | installed. From GUI he can see that there is no printer in the list, and this way he doesn't know what to do. Maybe I care to much...
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| 13:55 | <alkisg> "I need to find its ID using lpinfo and add it using lpadmin" ==> I think that's the root of the problem
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| 13:55 | For pci-ids, there's a file that matches pci-ids to certain drivers
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| 13:56 | There should be something similar for printers too
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| 13:56 | So, instead of doing lpinfo, lpadmin etc, you should just add the id to that mapping file, wherever that is
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| 13:56 | And report it to upstream so that it's automatically installed next time
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| 13:57 | For pciids, the file is there: /lib/modules/3.2.0-18-generic-pae/modules.pcimap
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| 13:58 | Don't know where the mappings are for printers, but that's what you should be looking
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| 13:58 | <srdjo> but then we would have to run ltsp-update-image wouldnt we ?
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| 13:58 | <alkisg> Can you give me an example of lpinfo/lpadmin usage?
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| 13:58 | Yes, until they were added upstream so that they'd be automatically detected in any distro, not just ltsp chroots
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| 13:59 | Or you could make an ltsp script to add the known mappings
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| 14:02 | <srdjo> ok - didnt think there would be so many problems - i will write a script now and put it on pastebin when I'm done
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| 14:07 | <alkisg> Last year I wrote a patch that allowed ltsp clients to reboot/shutdown from the gnome menu, instead of having to logoff to ldm first
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| 14:08 | It wasn't accepted, because they thought that the implementation method wasn't good enough
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| 14:08 | (even though it was what we use ltsp, no other option available)
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| 14:08 | But I understand their point, that adding hacks that don't solve the problem in its root cause, is just making the code unmaintainable
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| 14:09 | The solution here would be to find what needs to be done so that the printers are automatically installed, no?
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| 14:09 | Once this is found, then integrating it to ltsp is the second step
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| 14:14 | <srdjo> if you think that my lpinfo/lpadmin way is not good should I go with it or try to "invent" something else ?
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| 14:15 | <alkisg> (04:09:09 μμ) alkisg: The solution here would be to find what needs to be done so that the printers are automatically installed, no?
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| 14:15 | I.e. so that no script is needed to add the printer
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| 14:17 | <srdjo> but I think its cups problem - cant do much about it - is there a need for me to go on with this ?
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| 14:17 | <alkisg> If you can solve the cups problem, of course
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| 14:17 | That would help all linux users, not just ltsp users
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| 14:17 | Even if you just pinpoint the problem it would help too
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| 14:20 | You're trying to solve this problem by "what can I do to create a script to install the printer"?
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| 14:20 | And I'm saying, "better find a way sothat the printer is automatically installed without scripts"
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| 14:21 | <srdjo> ok - for now I will get back to my original script, review it once again and make it public as a workaround until permanent solution is made. It will most certainly help everyone using local printers on fat clients
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| 14:22 | <alkisg> OK, once I find some printer that is not automatically installed I'll try to find out why
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| 14:24 | <srdjo> I will also try to find it out myself - since I have a printer in front of me - I will give you the script for review once I complete it
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| 14:24 | <alkisg> OK, thank you. Time to go, bb :)
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| 17:17 | <uskerine> hi, i have installed LTSP in lubuntu, but dhcp3 seems to fail to start, i am getting "no subnet declaration for eth0". I attach syslog output, dhcpd.conf and ifconfig info, could someone please help? thanks in advance; http://pastebin.com/dmH9itz3
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| 17:18 | <Mava> uskerine: what dhcpd file have you edited ?
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| 17:19 | .. where is it located in ?
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| 17:19 | <uskerine> "/etc/dhcp/dhcpd.conf"
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| 17:19 | <Mava> ach
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| 17:19 | <uskerine> i also see another dhcp directories, such as /etc/dhcp3
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| 17:19 | where should i put my dhcpd.conf?
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| 17:19 | <Mava> try to check if you can find something like
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| 17:19 | /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
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| 17:20 | <uskerine> yes i can
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| 17:20 | <Mava> for my best knowledge that is the dhcpd conf which overrides the default dhcpd file in /etc/dhcp3/
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| 17:20 | so edit that under the ltsp and you'll be just fine =)
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| 17:21 | <uskerine> no error now, i will check
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| 17:24 | <uskerine> mava, it works now
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| 17:24 | however, the thinclient does not boot
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| 17:24 | <Mava> öerh
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| 17:25 | <uskerine> i can see in syslog the DHCPDISCOVER and the DHCPOFFER
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| 17:25 | for the thin client MAC Address
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| 17:25 | but i get PXE-E53: No boot filename received
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| 17:25 | <Mava> ahaa
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| 17:25 | <uskerine> in the thin client screen
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| 17:25 | how could i further troubleshoot?
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| 17:26 | <Mava> your dhcpd file is missing...
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| 17:26 | wait a sec
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| 17:26 | or a min.. got to dig those old dhcpd files up somewhere =)
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| 17:26 | <uskerine> but the system is offering an IP (the one of the dhcpd.conf pool) to the thin client
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| 17:27 | the thin client seems to keep asking for IP
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| 17:27 | <alkisg> You can see an example dhcpd.conf at /usr/share/doc/ltsp-server/examples/dhcpd.conf
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| 17:27 | <Mava> uskerine: check this out
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| 17:27 | http://pastebin.com/fBW840DK
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| 17:28 | there is my old dhcpd.conf what you are missing is the filename and option root-path from the conf
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| 17:28 | at least
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| 17:28 | <uskerine> ok
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| 17:28 | i will check thanks
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| 17:28 | <Mava> then also check that where is your tftp root pointing at at the moment
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| 17:28 | cheers, hopefully these helps =)
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| 17:32 | <uskerine> it is progressing mava, now i get ip but it can't find the file, i am double checking paths and files
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| 17:34 | <Mava> ls /opt/ltsp/
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| 17:34 | <uskerine> http://pastebin.com/MiBvT9Hf
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| 17:35 | i have the "root environment" in /opt/ltsp/i386/
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| 17:36 | <uskerine> i got from the thin client:
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| 17:36 | TFTP.
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| 17:36 | <Mava> aa
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| 17:36 | <uskerine> PXE-T01: FILE NOT FOUND
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| 17:36 | PXE-E3B: TFTP ERROR - FILE NOT FOUND
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| 17:36 | <Mava> got it.. that filename should not point to 386.img but to pxelinux.0
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| 17:37 | <uskerine> i don't have any 386.img
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| 17:37 | sorry
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| 17:37 | <uskerine> i mean pxelinux.0
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| 17:37 | <Mava> you sure ?
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| 17:37 | <uskerine> i am "find"ing it
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| 17:37 | find / -name "pxe*"
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| 17:38 | "/opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0"
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| 17:38 | should be that one Mava?
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| 17:38 | <Mava> yah
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| 17:40 | <uskerine> MAva, i changed /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
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| 17:40 | with "/opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0"
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| 17:40 | in filename, but still same error
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| 17:40 | i restarted the dhcpd3 (isc-dhcpd...) service
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| 17:41 | i also have
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| 17:41 | "/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0"
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| 17:41 | i will try that one
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| 17:42 | <Mava> try that also
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| 17:42 | <uskerine> no way
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| 17:42 | these are all the pxe* files i have
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| 17:42 | <Mava> to be honest can't remember and atm. not running any ltsp environment
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| 17:43 | <uskerine> http://pastebin.com/wtEuj2VZ
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| 17:46 | <Mava> uskerine: /opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0 this seems to be correct one
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| 17:46 | but, you must change it in the dhcpd.conf to point in lets say.. /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0'
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| 17:47 | because the tftp root is different than your servers filesystem root
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| 17:47 | <uskerine> understood
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| 17:51 | <uskerine> Mava, it works, i am logged in :)
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| 17:51 | thank you very much indeed, you saved me lot of time
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| 17:51 | <Mava> really ?
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| 17:52 | <uskerine> the desktop is not seen exactly as in the PC, but i guess it will be a matter of playing a bit with it
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| 17:52 | yes it works well
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| 17:52 | <Mava> yeah, anycase congrats uskerine, that's great =)
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| 17:52 | then it must be a good time to have a coffee break ->
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| 17:52 | <uskerine> indeed
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| 17:53 | i will fine-tune the desktop wallpaper, screen resolution and fonts used later
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| 19:52 | <knipwim> alkisg: why is the fat client autodetection (in ltsp_config.d) based on a .desktop file?
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| 19:53 | <alkisg> knipwim: the idea is that people should be able to have fat client chroots without ltsp-build-client
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| 19:53 | I.e. normal installations with only the ltsp-client package afterwards
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| 19:54 | So since /etc/ltsp_fat_chroot was generated with ltsp-build-client, I couldn't count on that being there
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| 19:54 | <knipwim> i can agree with that, only, the clients are fat by default now (on gentoo)
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| 19:54 | <alkisg> And in Debian/Ubuntu/Fedora all available sessions are there
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| 19:54 | Hmmm
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| 19:54 | Why would you have sessions there?
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| 19:54 | (on thin chroots?)
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| 19:54 | <knipwim> at least, xinit installs a .desktop file
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| 19:55 | <alkisg> Maybe we can blacklist that? What's its name?
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| 19:55 | <knipwim> in /usr/share/xsessions/Xsession.desktop
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| 19:55 | <alkisg> Can you think of a better way to separate between thin chroots and fat chroots on Gentoo?
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| 19:56 | Suppose someone builds a thin chroot
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| 19:56 | And later on installs a whole desktop in the chroot, wanting it to be fat from then on
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| 19:56 | He shouldn't be required to manually touch an /etc/ltsp_fat_chroot file
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| 19:56 | <Llama_be> hi knipwim. Did you see my message in here earlier today?
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| 19:56 | <alkisg> So, maybe blacklisting Xsession.desktop is the way to go?
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| 19:56 | <knipwim> alkisg: thinking
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| 19:57 | Llama_be: no
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| 19:58 | alkisg: kernel commandline option?
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| 19:58 | <Llama_be> knipwim: basically, the setup without X on the server works :p I've had (and have) some issues, but as far as I can tell, they're not the fault of having no xorg on the server
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| 19:59 | <alkisg> knipwim: That part is just for setting the default, of course one can still set LTSP_FATCLIENT=False
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| 19:59 | Either from ltsp_config.d or from lts.conf
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| 20:00 | <knipwim> Llama_be: cool
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| 20:00 | what did you remove from your setup again? xdm, pulseaudio and xorg-serveR?
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| 20:01 | alkisg: blacklisting Xession.desktop sound like the best bet
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| 20:02 | <Llama_be> knipwim: something like that yes. Want me to do a diff on the overlay ?
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| 20:02 | <knipwim> indeed, if a fat client chroot want to switch back, LTSP_FATCLIENT=False would have to be set
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| 20:03 | Llama_be: sure
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| 20:07 | <knipwim> Llama_be: or just the ebuild you used
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| 20:07 | <alkisg> knipwim: can you try if this works? if [ -n "$(find /usr/share/xsessions/ -not -name Xsession.desktop -name '*.desktop' 2>/dev/null)" ]; then
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| 20:07 | <Llama_be> knipwim: http://pastebin.com/J8RjXE1D
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| 20:09 | so basically I removed x11-base/xorg-server, x11-apps/xdm and media-sound/pulseaudio from the net-misc/ltsp-server ebuild
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| 20:15 | I now just run into an issue that while the virtual machine I was testing with boots perfectly, the actual physical box it should run on doesn't. It has a kernel panic because it says my real /dev is missing files required to boot (console and null)
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| 20:23 | <knipwim> Llama_be: thanks
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| 20:24 | can i refer to your real name mentioned in the diff?
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| 20:24 | <Llama_be> sure
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| 20:25 | <knipwim> Llama_be: how did you copy the virtual machine to a physical one?
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| 20:26 | <Llama_be> copy? they should be thin clients, they boot from the network... :)
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| 20:27 | the server is staying the same. It was just easier for testing to have a virtual machine as the thin client
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| 20:28 | <knipwim> so the installed chroot doesn't have a /dev/null ?
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| 20:30 | <Llama_be> it does, the physical machine just complains it can't find it. but the virtual machine still boots without problems
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| 20:32 | <knipwim> alkisg: it works, i used:
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| 20:32 | for xsession in $(find /usr/share/xsessions/ -not -name Xsession.desktop -name '*.desktop' 2>/dev/null); do
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| 20:33 | <alkisg> knipwim: for + break instead of if?
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| 20:34 | Or another loop plus the existing if?
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| 20:34 | Ah, you mean your local test?
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| 20:35 | <knipwim> alkisg: ah check, was working on the 5.3.5 instead of the latest revision
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| 20:35 | the if also works :)
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| 20:35 | <alkisg> Ah, ok, yeah I thought the single liner was more reusable
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| 20:36 | knipwim: Llama_be tried "init=/bin/bash" and he didn't get a bash, so I'm just wondering, why didn't it work on Gentoo?
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| 20:36 | (considering we're trying to switch to init=/sbin/init-ltsp...)
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| 20:42 | <knipwim> alkisg: Llama_be: it's working here
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| 20:42 | <alkisg> OK, ty
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| 20:42 | <Llama_be> I might have made errors :)
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| 20:43 | but I added init=/bin/bash at /var/lib/tftpboot/pxelinux.cfg/default at the end of the APPEND line
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| 20:45 | and I did that again, and I still get my rdesktop that boots up (in my virtual machine netbooting)
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| 20:49 | <knipwim> how does this relate to the missing /dev files?
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| 20:51 | <Llama_be> it doesn't :) it was just something alkisg told me to do yesterday when I was resolving other issues (I have to edit the lts.conf in the chroot, because I can't get it to update over tftp, which I thought was how it should work)
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| 20:52 | <knipwim> Llama_be: about the tftp issue, have you seen http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/LTSP#lts.conf_not_downloading_at_client_boot ?
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| 20:54 | <Llama_be> ah yes, but those files mentioned, they don't seem to exist on my system.
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| 20:55 | <knipwim> not in the chroot?
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| 20:55 | you should have $chroot/etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup
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| 20:55 | aerm
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| 20:55 | sorry, it should be init.d indeed
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| 20:57 | <Llama_be> ah ok, that explains :)
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| 20:58 | and simply replace the tftp command with curl then?
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| 20:59 | <knipwim> ehm, checking now
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| 20:59 | realising that should be in the wiki as well :)
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| 21:01 | replace (echo "get ${TFTPPATH}"|tftp ${SERVER} >/dev/null 2>&1) by (curl "tftp://${SERVER}${TFTPPATH}" -o lts.conf >/dev/null 2>&1)
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| 21:05 | <Llama_be> indeed, that works
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| 21:06 | is it normal I don't have that other file?
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| 21:08 | <knipwim> yes
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| 21:09 | it's only part of ltsp-client-5.3
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| 21:26 | <uskerine> hi
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| 21:26 | how can i configure the screen resolution of my thin clients in ltsp?
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| 21:26 | i am stuck at 1024x768 maximum, but my thin client supports more than that
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| 21:28 | <alkisg> What's the output of `xrandr` on that thin client?
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| 21:29 | <uskerine> how could i run that command?
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| 21:29 | i mean, all the commands are ran on the server right?
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| 21:35 | pastebin.com/CkZUjhNH
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| 21:36 | <alkisg> uskerine: how is the monitor connected? plain vga cable? some converter?
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| 21:36 | <uskerine> VGA
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| 21:36 | DVI to VGA converter
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| 21:37 | <alkisg> I think that's the problem... Hyperbyte do you have any quick fixes for that, or should he resort to X_HORIZSYNC/X_VERTREFRESH?
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| 21:37 | <knipwim> Llama_be: new ltsp-server ebuilds with optional X and pulseaudio USE flags are pushed
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| 21:40 | <alkisg> uskerine: I think that if you don't use a converter, your graphics card will autodetect all the available resolutions, but if you can't do that, then you can use those lts.conf variables I mentioned above, see the lts.conf manpage
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| 21:41 | <uskerine> ok i will do that thanks
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| 21:41 | tje lts.conf is located in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
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| 21:41 | right?
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| 21:42 | <Llama_be> knipwim: is there a git command that cleans my overlay, so that layman -S works again (now it complains I have local changes that it doesn't know what to do with...
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| 21:42 | <alkisg> uskerine: yes
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| 21:47 | <knipwim> Llama_be: i just delete and add it again, layman -d ltsp && layman -a ltsp
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| 21:48 | <Llama_be> just before I saw your answer, I did a git checkout . and layman -S and that seems to have worked :)
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| 21:50 | running emerge world -uDva now, and ltsp-server does not pull in any new dependencies, as expected on my server
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| 21:51 | <knipwim> nice :)
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| 21:54 | <Llama_be> is it normal the quickstart.profile has changed a lot?
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| 21:55 | <knipwim> between ltsp-servers? could be, depends on the upgrade
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| 21:56 | a lot of quickstart profile info has been put into the portage profile in the overlay
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| 21:57 | <uskerine> alkisg
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| 21:57 | i changed lts.conf, selected the right horiz and vert syncs
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| 21:57 | disabled xrandr
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| 21:57 | and forces x_mode_0 to 1280x1024
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| 21:57 | but still i am stuck at 1024x768, is there any log i could look?
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| 21:57 | i realize that cliclinkg alt+ctrl+f1 i get a console
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| 21:57 | whichi password should i use?
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| 21:58 | <alkisg> uskerine: what's your current lts.conf like?
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| 21:58 | <uskerine> let me paste it
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| 21:59 | <alkisg> !pastebin
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| 21:59 | <ltsp> alkisg: pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
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| 22:00 | <uskerine> pastebin.com/nH4jDjia
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| 22:00 | i know lts.conf is being read because the keyboard layout was switched from US to ES
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| 22:01 | <alkisg> uskerine: remove XRANDR_DISABLE, change X_MODE_0 to XRANDR_MODE_0, and replace 76 to 100
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| 22:02 | <uskerine> 76 is the right frequency for the monitor i am using
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| 22:02 | but i will try it
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| 22:02 | <alkisg> 87 is for 1024x768
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| 22:02 | There's something different in how xorg calculates timings vs how cvt or the monitor manuals do
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| 22:03 | <uskerine> wow
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| 22:03 | did not know that
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| 22:03 | that would explain many hours configuring xorg.conf
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| 22:03 | <alkisg> I haven't found documentation to explain it, but that's what my tests had shown
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| 22:05 | <uskerine> still 1024x768 :(
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| 22:06 | <alkisg> Meh. What graphics card?
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| 22:06 | !localxterm
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| 22:06 | <ltsp> alkisg: localxterm: Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually run on the server. However, if in a client you run 'ltsp-localapps xterm', a local xterm will open, and any commands that you enter there will be executed locally on the client.
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| 22:06 | <alkisg> ...and in that, lspci -nn -k | grep -A 2 VGA
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| 22:07 | <uskerine> pastebin.com/fBPPscnr
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| 22:07 | it is a quite decent thin client
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| 22:08 | <alkisg> And xrandr still lists 1024x768 as the maximum resolution?
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| 22:08 | <uskerine> yes
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| 22:09 | i ran it in the "local" xterm
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| 22:09 | <alkisg> And the output of `getltscfg -a` on that localxterm?
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| 22:09 | <uskerine> but it says
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| 22:09 | Screen 0: minimum 320x200, maximum 4096x4096
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| 22:09 | i see what we configured in lts.conf
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| 22:10 | <alkisg> What resolution do you want? Can you use cvt, xrandr --newmode, xrandr --addmode and xrandr --mode to set it?
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| 22:10 | <uskerine> pastebin.com/QGwEtajn
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| 22:10 | i will investigate how to use that, xrandr is new for me
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| 22:10 | i would like 1280x1024
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| 22:11 | which is what is supported by my monitor
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| 22:11 | <alkisg> xrandr --newmode "1280x1024_60.00" 109.00 1280 1368 1496 1712 1024 1027 1034 1063 -hsync +vsync
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| 22:12 | xrandr --addmode VGA1 "1280x1024_60.00"
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| 22:12 | xrandr --output VGA1 --mode "1280x1024_60.00"
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| 22:12 | <uskerine> ok let me try, thanks
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| 22:12 | <alkisg> 109.00? I wonder if you should increase X_HORZSYNC to 110...
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| 22:13 | <uskerine> i will try that firts
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| 22:18 | alkisg
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| 22:18 | increasing horiz sync to 110 did not work
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| 22:18 | however, adding the new mode as you described
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| 22:18 | worked perfectly
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| 22:18 | how could i "fix this configuration"?
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| 22:18 | <alkisg> Hmmm we really need new XRANDR_CMD_[0-9] lts.conf options
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| 22:19 | Until that's fixed upstream, the only ways I can think of are using a custom xorg.conf or a custom ldm rc.d script
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| 22:19 | <uskerine> ok, where should i put my "custom" xorg.conf?
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| 22:20 | <alkisg> If you remind me tomorrow, I can commit the change upstream so that you download that fixed script
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| 22:20 | <uskerine> i will do, i am glad to help to improve ltsp, so far i am quite impresed about it (last time i "used" ltsp it was just a linux howto) :)
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| 22:21 | <alkisg> :)
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| 22:21 | <uskerine> where should i "put" the xorg.conf?
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| 22:21 | <alkisg> In the chroot, see the docs for X_CONF
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| 22:21 | !lts.conf
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| 22:21 | <ltsp> alkisg: lts.conf: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
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| 22:22 | <alkisg> Or just wait until tomorrow
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| 22:22 | You won't need a xorg.conf then
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| 22:22 | <uskerine> "/opt/ltsp/i386/etc..."?
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| 22:22 | ok
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| 22:22 | thanks a lot
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| 22:22 | <alkisg> yup
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| 22:28 | 'night all
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