IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 8 September 2009 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:11 | <alkisg> Good morning
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| 01:17 | <PMantis> Hi guys. I just upgraded a Ubuntu 8.04 server to 8.10 then to 9.04. I found a vmlinuz symlink to a non-existant file in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386. Reinstalling ltsp-server didn't help. I re-ran ltsp-build client, ltsp-update-sshkeys, ltsp-update-image, ltsp-update-kernels, but no vmlinuz file. dpkg doesn't show any package as providing this file. When is it supposed to be created?
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| 01:22 | <alkisg> PMantis: What do you have in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386 ? Could you put ls -lha in pastebot.ltsp.org?
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| 01:23 | <PMantis> alkisg: I have pxelinux.0 and lts.conf
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| 01:23 | I rm'd all the broken symlinks
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| 01:23 | <alkisg> Urm... do you have a kernel installed in the chroot?
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| 01:24 | <PMantis> in /opt/ltsp/i386 ? I've rm'd that and re-ran ltsp-build-client.
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| 01:24 | I can chroot if you want....
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| 01:25 | <alkisg> Yup, (distro/version?) e.g. something like that for ubuntu: sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 dpkg -l linux* | grep ^ii
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| 01:26 | <PMantis> Ubuntu 9.04, as of tonight.
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| 01:26 | <alkisg> Right sorry /me is multitasking :)
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| 01:26 | <PMantis> np
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| 01:27 | Hmmm, no kernels.
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| 01:27 | only linux-sound-base
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| 01:27 | <alkisg> Yeah another one had that, I wonder why...
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| 01:27 | OK, just install a kernel there
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| 01:27 | sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 01:27 | mount -t proc proc /proc
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| 01:28 | apt-get update
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| 01:28 | apt-get install linux-image-generic
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| 01:28 | umount /proc
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| 01:28 | exit
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| 01:28 | <PMantis> Was already in the chroot... but. cool
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| 01:28 | <alkisg> sudo ltsp-update-image
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| 01:28 | sudo ltsp-update-kernels
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| 01:29 | <PMantis> No sudo needed, already su'd to root, but I gotcha.
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| 01:29 | <alkisg> OK
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| 01:29 | <PMantis> Which script is actually responsible for writing the vmlinuz file to the tftboot dir?
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| 01:30 | <alkisg> ltsp-update-kernels
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| 01:30 | <PMantis> ok, creating image
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| 01:31 | ok, do you know if it reads the chroot dir, or the img file?
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| 01:31 | <alkisg> the chroot
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| 01:31 | <PMantis> Neat, did it fully populate now.
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| 01:32 | err s/did/dir/
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| 01:32 | <alkisg> I wonder why the missing kernel problem, though... any ideas?
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| 01:32 | <PMantis> I did see some messages scrolling by in the image creation that didn't look right, but scroll by so fast...
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| 01:33 | <alkisg> Did you put any parameters to ltsp-build-client ?
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| 01:33 | <PMantis> No, running i386 on server, so no need to change params
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| 01:34 | It exited with an edubuntu-artwork-usplash package not found, however.
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| 01:34 | If I remember the package name correctly.
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| 01:34 | This was an Ubuntu 8.04, with some edubuntu packages added on.
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| 01:35 | <alkisg> Hmmm maybe the edubuntu hooks had a problem. Well... :-/
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| 01:35 | <PMantis> Heh, never know.. used to be a separate distro, but not just seen as add-on packages.
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| 01:35 | <alkisg> I hope the kernel is the only thing missing :D
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| 01:36 | <PMantis> I just don't know where it gets the idea to look for an edubuntu package for the chroot...
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| 01:36 | hah, yeah.
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| 01:36 | If it's a big issue, I can generate a chroot on a customer server, and scp is over. :)
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| 01:37 | <alkisg> I don't know... well, you could do that, or you could try and see if it works, and leave it at that ;)
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| 01:37 | <PMantis> However, I like to understand WHY things fail, not just work around them to get it working... 'cause sooner or later, a problem worked around will show itself again.
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| 01:38 | <alkisg> Maybe it had something to do with the changed in edubuntu packaging. You could file a bug if you want to.
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| 01:38 | <PMantis> heh, and get shot down? :-/
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| 01:38 | <alkisg> Nah... who does that? :D
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| 01:40 | <PMantis> Nobody I know. :)
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| 01:40 | Trying: ltsp-build-client --base /opt/ltsp-test/i386
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| 01:40 | <alkisg> No, I think base=/opt/ltsp-test
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| 01:40 | <PMantis> Hmm
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| 01:40 | <alkisg> The /i386 is added at the base *I think*
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| 01:40 | <PMantis> Well, not expecting to actually USE it...
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| 01:41 | <alkisg> OK, but you'll get it at /opt/ltsp-test/i386/i386
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| 01:41 | <PMantis> Just have to remove it from inetd.conf
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| 01:41 | <alkisg> k
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| 01:41 | <PMantis> Before I forget.... THANKS!
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| 01:42 | <alkisg> np. /me goes back to some python hacking...
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| 01:42 | <PMantis> I don't have a full thin client here to test, so after this completes, I'll reboot my laptop to try PXE.
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| 01:42 | I should have some info for you in a couple
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| 01:43 | Set my terminal scrollback to 10k lines for the ssh session.
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| 01:44 | <alkisg> Yeah keep that in case it's needed for a bug report
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| 01:45 | <PMantis> apt had a failed to (get) message there, but GONE. Have to scroll back l8r
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| 01:47 | Lots of these errors:
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| 01:47 | debconf: (Failed to open fd 3: Bad file descriptor at (eval 22) line 3)
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| 01:47 | but it looks like it's finishing!
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| 01:48 | <alkisg> So fast? Woah, you got a fast internet connection there... :)
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| 01:48 | Check if a kernel was installed.
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| 01:50 | <PMantis> ltsp-build-client actually created an image, too this time.
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| 01:50 | Looking for kernel...
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| 01:50 | 10Mbps cable connection here, so NB
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| 01:51 | Yup, kernel there.
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| 01:52 | <alkisg> Go figure :-/
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| 01:52 | <PMantis> But WHY, does it fail in the normal dir if I rm-rf /opt/tsp/i386 first???
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| 01:52 | <alkisg> Does it? Wow!
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| 01:52 | Do move the new chroot to the old location, though, it seems more stable :)
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| 01:53 | <PMantis> heh
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| 01:54 | Just looked at 'history', and yup... cd /opt/ltsp, rm -rf i386, then ltsp-build-client
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| 01:54 | Hmmm, I wanna try that again.
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| 01:59 | <PMantis> Ughhhh, sleep pressure... but... must... finish... server...
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| 02:03 | alkisg: Uhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm... It's *WORKING* this time.
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| 02:04 | These scrips must be sensitive to what's in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp ...
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| 02:04 | Yup, finished succesfully
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| 02:05 | * alkisg shrugs | |
| 02:06 | <PMantis> Well, was failing... built one in separate dir success, then rebuild in orig dir (no params on ltsp-build-client) and it works.
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| 02:06 | If that's the solution, then it sounds like a bug on at least some level.
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| 02:06 | alkisg: Either way, thank you... you led me to a working solution!
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| 02:06 | Now I'll reboot the laptop to try PXE.
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| 02:07 | <alkisg> You're welcome :)
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| 02:07 | <PMantis> ttyl
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| 02:36 | <zeltron> Hi
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| 02:36 | <alkisg> hi
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| 02:37 | <zeltron> I'm looking for some help to setup localapps on a lenny LTSP server
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| 02:38 | I found docs on the net about ltsp-localapps scripts that seem to make it work easily
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| 02:39 | but no trace of those scripts on my server, and no trace on the net for a place to download them.
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| 02:40 | Do I need to upgrade my LTSP server, or does those scripts only exist in Ubuntu version?
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| 02:40 | <alkisg> Those scripts are in ltsp-upstream, so they're in debian as well
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| 02:41 | <zeltron> ltsp-upstream?
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| 02:41 | <alkisg> I don't know which ltsp version debian has, though. Most debian-knowing people are here in ...12 hours or so (afternoon for me, don't know what that is for you)
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| 02:42 | I guess ltsp-localapps should be there in lenny.
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| 02:42 | Do you have a /usr/bin/ltsp-localapps file?
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| 02:42 | <zeltron> It's morning for me (I'm French)
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| 02:43 | I don't have ltsp-localapps neither in /usr/bin, nor everywhere else
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| 02:43 | <alkisg> So I guess you'd have to use the testing packages to get them...
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| 02:43 | <zeltron> Using locate (update db is ok, of course), but found nothing
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| 02:44 | Ok Thanks, I'll try to install a testing version, and see if I can get them this way.
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| 02:45 | <alkisg> vagrantc is the debian maintainer for ltsp, and hangs around here in the afternoon (me=Greek, we're in similar timezones). If you don't know how to enable the testing repos, you could ask him for a how-to...
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| 02:45 | <zeltron> ... and I'll come back in 12 hours to see if vagrantc can help me if needed
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| 02:45 | <alkisg> k
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| 02:45 | <zeltron> Thanks
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| 02:51 | <NeonLicht> alkisg, I've just fixed the problem I had with the second LTSP server. The tftpd-hpa daemon wasn't running, and that's why the client couldn't download neither nbi.img nor pxelinux.0.
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| 02:51 | <alkisg> NeonLicht: nice. Why wasn't it running, since it was there in inetd.conf ?
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| 02:53 | <NeonLicht> No idea, alkisg, really, I've restarted inetd several times and it wasn't working, than I've though about taking it out from inetd.conf and running it as a daemon, but before I've done it, it has starting working... no idea why, really :(
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| 02:53 | <alkisg> NeonLicht: but really, multiple dhcp servers with no proper planning would get you into a lot of headaches in the future.
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| 02:54 | (personal opinion)
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| 08:53 | <sbalneav> Morning all
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| 08:53 | <ogra> !s
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| 08:53 | <ltspbot> ogra: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 09:05 | <stgraber> !s
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| 09:05 | <ltspbot> stgraber: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 09:06 | <alkisg> !o
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| 09:06 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "o" is o is for ogra!!!!!!!!!
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| 09:06 | <alkisg> Hmmm and what's the letter for stgraber ? :)
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| 09:06 | <stgraber> alkisg: I don't think I'm famous enough yet to have one ;)
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| 09:07 | <alkisg> Heh :D
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| 09:07 | <ogra> stgraber, sbalneav, i'm all booked for BTS btw :)
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| 09:11 | * sbalneav capers about the room wildly | |
| 09:11 | <sbalneav> \o/
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| 09:11 | * sbalneav hugs ogra | |
| 09:11 | * rjune_ imagines sbalneav capering.. | |
| 09:11 | <ogra> :)
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| 09:11 | <sbalneav> I'm rather large for capering
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| 09:12 | Perhaps lumbering joyfully
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| 09:12 | "Wiggling and jiggling like a bowlful of jelly"
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| 09:13 | <rjune_> heh
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| 09:18 | <stgraber> ogra: yeah, saw that, will be great having your around
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| 09:19 | <ogra> costs me a fortune ...
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| 09:19 | but its worth it :)
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| 09:19 | and indeed i have to be available to ma colleaguers for armel issues at any time :P
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| 09:27 | <garymc> anyone know why my sound stops working in my thin client after a short while of using it?
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| 09:27 | im using Ubuntu 9.04 LTSP server
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| 09:28 | <stgraber> ogra: any chance we get a new ldm gtk greeter ? ;)
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| 09:28 | <garymc> it works fine to start with, so dont know if its when the screen saver comes on or just a short while and it stops playing sound
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| 09:28 | <ogra> stgraber, i might look into my old code :)
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| 09:28 | no promoses
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| 09:29 | (and prom*i*ses either :P )
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| 09:33 | <sbalneav> ogra: I can work on that with you
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| 10:22 | <Q-FUNK> re
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| 10:22 | victims^Wvolunters with Geode GX2 hardware for a test? ;)
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| 10:27 | <zamba> the size of the chroot image.. what implication can that have? booting time?
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| 10:28 | just that or anything else?
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| 10:29 | and if you enable local apps in lts.conf, will the client ONLY use local apps or will it look on the server for applications that's not on the server?
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| 10:29 | eh
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| 10:29 | .. for applications that's not in the image
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| 10:31 | <_UsUrPeR_> zamba: in answer to your localapps question, entering LOCAL_APPS = Y and LOCAL_APPS_MENU = TRUE in your lts.conf will cause your TC to search for resident programs before going to the server
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| 10:32 | <zamba> _UsUrPeR_: ok, cool.. so the application in the image will override the ones on the server
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| 10:33 | <_UsUrPeR_> you can also specify which menu items to search for on the client by entering "LOCAL_APPS_MENU_ITEMS = firefox, tuxtype,etc..."
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| 10:33 | zamba: for myself, I enter all three lines
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| 10:33 | but yes. with those entries, it will override the server's resident programs
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| 10:33 | <zamba> but you still have to manually select the local apps from a separate menu?
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| 10:34 | <_UsUrPeR_> about your questions pertaining to image size, I know it affects the amount of time require to build an image... :)
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| 10:34 | adding localapps will also take up a certain amount of RAM on the ramdrive on the client as well.
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| 10:35 | <zamba> yeah, so it's basically just for the clients with a little bit of extra juice
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| 10:35 | <_UsUrPeR_> define juice :)
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| 10:41 | <zamba> power :)
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| 10:42 | but again.. the users will have to explicitly choose the application from the local apps menu?
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| 10:44 | <zeltron> Hi, I need help for localapps. First, my ltsp server is on Debian lenny and I can'f find the localapps scripts. Is that normal ?
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| 11:00 | <zeltron> Have I asked the wrong question ? the right question, but the wrong way? or nobody knows?...
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| 11:00 | ;-)
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| 11:01 | sorry... Bye !
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| 11:09 | jammcq has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:09 | <jammcq> hello friends
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| 11:20 | <Q-FUNK> !j
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| 11:20 | <ltspbot> Q-FUNK: "j" is jammcq!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 11:29 | <bieb> hey is there a way for me to see who is logged into a particular terminal at a given time?
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| 11:30 | <Q-FUNK> 'w'
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| 11:34 | <bieb> Q-FUNK: thanks
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| 11:35 | Q-FUNK: is there a way for me to log and say that student x was logged into client z prior to student y?
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| 11:35 | <garymc> would the sound on the Thin client normally stop working after it goes off idle? When i get back to my desk after 10 mins etc the sound doesnt work anymore
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| 11:36 | no it works after going idle just done a test
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| 11:36 | why is my sound stopping to work after a certain amount of time or times sound played?
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| 11:38 | I goto sound preferances: error message: gconfaudiosink profile=music: Failed to connect: Connection refused
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| 11:41 | <Gadi> bieb: use "last"
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| 11:42 | <bieb> thanks Gadi
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| 11:44 | last
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| 11:44 | lol.. wrong window
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| 11:44 | <ogra> las longer !
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| 11:44 | bah
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| 11:44 | *last
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| 11:45 | jammcq, all booked ... :D
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| 12:01 | <cnc> hey guys, my pxe clients started acting up, all the sounds and videos they watch go super fast, like they're in fast forward
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| 12:01 | Gadi: any suggestions?
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| 12:02 | <cliebow> ogra:you cvoming??
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| 12:02 | <ogra> cliebow, yep, likely even a day early
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| 12:02 | <cliebow> very cool!
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| 12:02 | <ogra> not sure yet if i take a hotel break or driver through directly ...
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| 12:03 | *drive
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| 12:03 | <cliebow> right
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| 12:03 | * ogra lands at 6:30 pm in portland ... and has a rental car ... i need to see how my jetlag behaves :) | |
| 12:04 | <cliebow> sure...
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| 12:04 | <Gadi> cnc: consistently in every application?
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| 12:10 | <jammcq> ogra: all booked????
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| 12:10 | AWESOME !!!!!!!
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| 12:10 | <ogra> yep :)
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| 12:11 | <jammcq> that's fantastic
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| 12:11 | <ogra> it is, but i need to be available to my co workers as much as possible
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| 12:11 | <jammcq> ogra: the good news is the internet is better than it was last time you were there
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| 12:11 | <ogra> it's release week and i'm the only guy knowing about some stuff of some specialized images
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| 12:12 | <jammcq> we have a direct connection right in the building, instead of using wireless across the parking lot
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| 12:12 | * ogra will fall dead after release ... returning from BTS and four doubleshifts ahead | |
| 12:12 | <ogra> but hey, i get to see my friends !
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| 12:14 | * Gadi sends ogra some tape - a few pieces to hold the eyes open and a few to keep the beer bottle in hand | |
| 12:15 | <ogra> hey, i'm on wine if at home :)
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| 12:15 | <Gadi> I never thought I'd hear you using windows apps ;)
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| 12:15 | * Gadi goes to blog... | |
| 12:15 | <ogra> its not an emulator ! :)
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| 12:16 | anyway, had a long day, susie waits downstairs ...
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| 12:16 | * ogra shores^Wwaves ... and calls it a day | |
| 12:18 | * vagrantc waves | |
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| 12:41 | <cnc> Gadi: yes, primarily using internet explorer
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| 12:42 | <johnny> ok hi... back sorta
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| 12:42 | test
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| 12:44 | <Gadi> internet explorer?
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| 12:44 | through wine?
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| 12:44 | <johnny> gadi: just reply test
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| 12:45 | <Gadi> test
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| 12:45 | test
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| 12:45 | test
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| 12:45 | test
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| 12:45 | buffer overflow
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| 12:45 | <johnny> thanks.. i can't see my own posted messages with new transport.. still working out bugs
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| 12:46 | <cnc> Gadi: no, using rdesktop to access TS
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| 12:47 | <Gadi> so, is it only the windows apps via rdesktop that are fast?
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| 12:47 | <cnc> Gadi: yes, dont have any setups that aren't running rdesktop but I can try that
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| 12:48 | <Gadi> and, are you using an rdesktop screen script or are you going from Linux server to WTS?
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| 12:48 | <cnc> Gadi: also for good measure, I deleted my chroot and completely rebuilt the client
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| 12:48 | Gadi: screen script
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| 12:49 | <Gadi> are you running the sound through pulseaudio in the screen script or going straight to alsa?
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| 12:49 | ie, is pulseaudio running on the client
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| 12:49 | <cnc> Gadi: I'm not sure
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| 12:50 | Gadi: i know I put in options to redirect sound to alsa in lts.conf
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| 12:50 | <Gadi> did you need to edit the chroot at all?
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| 12:50 | <cnc> Gadi: no, only did the normal upgrades and rebuilds
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| 12:50 | <Gadi> do you have SOUND=False in lts.conf?
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| 12:51 | <cnc> I believe so
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| 12:51 | double checking now
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| 12:51 | <Gadi> ok
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| 12:51 | <cnc> Gadi: no
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| 12:51 | <_UsUrPeR_> zamba: pertaining to your last question about ltsp localapps: no. The programs assigned to localapps are those defined by the administrator via lts.conf. The user has no choice as to where they are running their applications from.
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| 12:52 | <Gadi> interesting... cnc - what distro/version?
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| 12:52 | <cnc> Gadi: ubuntu 9.04
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| 12:53 | <Gadi> try adding SOUND=False to lts.conf and see if it has an effect
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| 12:53 | <cnc> Gadi: k trying now
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| 12:53 | <Gadi> whats weird is, someone on the listserv was not getting dound at all in rdesktop by default in 9.04
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| 12:53 | *sound
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| 12:54 | can you pastebot your lts.conf?
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| 12:54 | Im curious
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| 12:55 | <cnc> !pastebot
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| 12:55 | <ltspbot> cnc: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
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| 12:56 | <ltsppbot> "cnc" pasted "lts.conf" (7 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/502
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| 12:56 | <cnc> Gadi: there it is
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| 12:57 | <Gadi> did setting Sound=False have an effect?
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| 12:58 | <cnc> i'm updating the image right now
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| 12:58 | <Gadi> no need to update the image for that
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| 12:58 | <cnc> Gadi: I know it's not required after changing lts.conf but I always do it anywayz
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| 12:58 | <Gadi> lol
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| 12:59 | you must enjoy watching pots boil and paint dry
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| 12:59 | <cnc> call me strange lol
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| 12:59 | honestly it's nice to take a break from other problems
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| 12:59 | I stay busy lol
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| 13:09 | <cnc> Gadi: that fixed it
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| 13:09 | <Gadi> cool
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| 13:09 | <cnc> Gadi: I do have one more question
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| 13:10 | Gadi: the username on rdesktop now says " where it should be blank
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| 13:10 | <Gadi> one per customer
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| 13:10 | :P
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| 13:10 | ah, yeah
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| 13:10 | <cnc> Gadi: lol I fixed it before but my laptp crashed and I lost my notes
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| 13:10 | <Gadi> I believe you need an "eval" rather than an "exec"
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| 13:10 | one sec...
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| 13:10 | <cnc> Gadi: thats it
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| 13:11 | Gadi: no wait, if it says exec
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| 13:11 | Gadi: needs to say exec eval
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| 13:11 | <Gadi> eval exec $COMMAND
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| 13:11 | thats it
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| 13:11 | <cnc> Gadi: whhich file?
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| 13:12 | <Gadi> in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/xinitrc
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| 13:12 | last line
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| 13:13 | <cnc> Gadi: you are the man ty
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| 13:14 | sigh, ltsp fixed.....now to fix cisco issue
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| 13:14 | I know this is the wrong one
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| 13:15 | *room
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| 13:15 | but
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| 13:15 | every light on every switch i have in the network blinks as fast as it possibly can
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| 13:15 | and cisco guys aren't as nice as you gys
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| 13:15 | *guys
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| 13:21 | <Gadi> cnc: activity lights aren't necessarily bad
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| 13:52 | <cor3> hey all
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| 13:52 | winnipeg harvest ltsp has been in production for months now with no issues.
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| 13:53 | that's 2 conversions under my belt now
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| 14:26 | <sbalneav> Congrats
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| 15:07 | <jammcq> sbalneav: ping
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| 15:07 | <sbalneav> jammcq: pong
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| 15:08 | <jammcq> sbalneav: hey, did you see Ogra's confirmed for BTS-2009 :)
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| 15:08 | <sbalneav> Yes I did!
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| 15:08 | <jammcq> pretty cool, eh?
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| 15:08 | <sbalneav> I capered about the room joyously
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| 15:09 | I guess ragnar's still a nogo tho', huh?
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| 15:09 | <jammcq> i did the happy packet dance
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| 15:09 | yeah, Ragnar can't make it this year. something about a 30-year college reunion
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| 15:09 | <sbalneav> Between the two of us dancing, I'm sure seismic detectors were kept busy today :)
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| 15:10 | <jammcq> yeah, usgeo is looking closely at their equipment wondering what happened
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| 15:10 | <sbalneav> :)
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| 16:32 | <johnny> Ahmuck, so you read about stuff i posted?
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| 16:42 | <_dvorak> hi, after going thru the ltsp wiki page and some googling, i am still not very clear about ltsp client which boots from local HDD or CD
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| 16:43 | I have a wireless card, and want the HDD/CD to contain a linux kernel and initrd and boot up to the point where wireless setup is done, and then establish a ssh/NFS session
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| 16:43 | can someone point to documentation?
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| 17:34 | <Ahmuck> johnny: prolly not. when did you post it?
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| 17:34 | <johnny> huh?
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| 17:34 | <Ahmuck> _dvorak: still there?
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| 17:34 | <johnny> i posted it the other day.. about the bookfair, the freeschool, etc
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| 17:34 | <Ahmuck> oh, yes, i read briefly
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| 17:37 | <johnny> how the heck can i import contacts from this old phone :(
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| 17:39 | * Lns falls off of the chandelier and into #ltsp | |
| 17:43 | <Lns> Anyone care to comment on http://kernelnewbies.org/Linux_2_6_31#head-799157cd8729eba8ee5bc1ff0290d7414f366ef2 ? Is this a win for ltsp setups?
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| 18:43 | <johnny> Lns, not sure
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| 18:43 | i think it would be more of an obvious win for regular pcs
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| 18:44 | i'm not sure how it would go on a multiuser env .. or where the network might interfere anyways
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| 19:00 | <sbalneav> _dvorak: No one's really done much in the way of experimenting with that, and it's not a "standard" part of ltsp
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| 19:00 | Lns: Not really, no, unless you're running localapps on a low memory machine.
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| 19:03 | <Lns> sbalneav, gotcha. Still, cool though =)
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| 19:04 | <sbalneav> Oh, sure.
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| 19:05 | I mean, at the end of the day, all performace improvements in the kernel will offer some improvements.
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| 19:07 | <Lns> sbalneav, it be assumed that it will still improve memory usage on the server end?
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| 19:15 | <sbalneav> Possibly in edge cases. But if you're running an LTSP server and you're facing "memory pressure" (i.e. you're running out of ram and clobbering swap) improving that marginally with a kernel hack may be nice. However, hard drives are still a couple of orders of magnatude slower than ram. Throw some more ram in your server.
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| 19:16 | I.e. You're hitting swap. Now, your desktops only come to a grinding halt, instead of a screeching halt
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| 19:16 | \o/ Hooray!
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| 19:17 | Your users will still want you to throw a couple more gigs of ram in the server :)
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| 19:18 | <Lns> true =) When I read this I was trying to figure out specifically what 'memory pressure' meant..makes total sense
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| 19:18 | <sbalneav> The rule of thumb I operate under is: if my LTSP server swaps *at all* under the course of normal situations, it hasn't got enough ram.
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| 19:18 | I mean, if someone has a runaway firefox that's using up several gigs of core, fine, kill it and problem solved.
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| 19:19 | But if people are doing *normal* things, and everything's behaving as it should, and you're hitting swap, you need more ram.
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| 19:43 | <erieslabnx> I have a minor issue that is about to be a major problem... I have been using LTSP with Ubuntu for about 3 months almost pain free... I have 10 TC's at our initial location and about 20 users of these clients. The building itself is at capacity....
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| 19:43 | We got another building and another 20 thin clients....
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| 19:43 | how do I make sure the data is all sync'ed?
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| 19:44 | I would like the two locations to more or less be mirrors of each other, is this possible?
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| 19:45 | in the end I wanna only have one interface to edit to make changes across all locations and all users
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| 19:45 | <sbalneav> Not really an LTSP problem. You'll want shared home directories via NFS, or the like, and LDAP authentication.
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| 19:46 | <erieslabnx> with LDAP can users login to either server (physical location irrelevant) simply through the web?
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| 19:47 | <sbalneav> Not through the web, no.
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| 19:47 | <erieslabnx> The reason I ask is it sounds as though this is starting to get laggy
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| 19:48 | <sbalneav> What's the size of the pipe between the two locations?
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| 19:48 | <erieslabnx> the web.
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| 19:48 | lol
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| 19:48 | 75 miles between cities
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| 19:48 | and a third location on it's way
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| 19:49 | <sbalneav> You'll need to set up a VPN of some kind between the sites.
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| 19:49 | <erieslabnx> I am soooo in over my head now :(
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| 19:49 | <sbalneav> But that's out of scope for this channel. It's not an LTSP problem, it's just a standard "how do I have shared home and auth between sites" problem.
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| 19:50 | <erieslabnx> thank you for the quick answer
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| 19:50 | <sbalneav> At a bare minimum, you'll need vpn
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| 19:50 | <erieslabnx> either way it is cut it's starting point is easiest with a VPN setup
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| 19:50 | <sbalneav> Unless you're going to have 10mbit fibre access at each location, shared home dirs is probably not going to be an option.
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| 19:50 | <erieslabnx> LOL
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| 19:51 | <sbalneav> But ldap auth certainly is.
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| 19:51 | <erieslabnx> well it was fun while it lasted :) lol
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| 19:52 | ok what if I take the auth out of the equation....
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| 19:53 | <sbalneav> I run 5 remote sites
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| 19:53 | <erieslabnx> is there any simple way to mirror the data I have to a standalone server so as not to lose all the work put in?
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| 19:53 | kinda just starting the new location with the setup I have exactly?
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| 19:53 | <sbalneav> The farthest away is 850 k
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| 19:53 | <erieslabnx> WOW!
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| 19:53 | via vpn?
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| 19:53 | <sbalneav> Why do you need shared home dirs?
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| 19:54 | Do the people 75 miles away regularily log into the other site?
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| 19:54 | <erieslabnx> I don't.... half my clients are moving to the new location. I just don't wanna rebuild everything
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| 19:54 | <sbalneav> Ok, but once they MOVE, then they're there permanently?
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| 19:54 | <erieslabnx> correct, I am just lazy
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| 19:55 | looking for shortcuts
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| 19:55 | <sbalneav> Phht, no sympathy from me, then.
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| 19:55 | Build another server for the remote site.
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| 19:55 | move over the home dirs to the new server
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| 19:55 | install at remote location
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| 19:56 | <erieslabnx> I wanna learn something... I just don't want to sit at another server putting in the same 15 hours I put in already
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| 19:56 | <sbalneav> use nightly rotating rsync's to back up the remote location.
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| 19:56 | <erieslabnx> so there is no users.* file to copy and paste?
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| 19:56 | THERE WE GO!
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| 19:56 | Now I have some keywords to search!
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| 19:56 | Thank you :)
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| 19:56 | <sbalneav> yeah, but the rsync's just for backup
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| 19:56 | their live home dir's still on their local server.
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| 19:57 | <erieslabnx> that is all i need... no critical LIVE data needed
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| 19:57 | <sbalneav> Well, that's not what you asked for originally.
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| 19:57 | but whatever.
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| 19:57 | <erieslabnx> My biggest problem in this channel is the fact that I never know WHAT I am asking for till I see it :)
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| 19:58 | you have been very helpful again sbalneav
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| 19:58 | and Sayabon is still the best ;)
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| 19:59 | <sbalneav> You've tried the new builds?
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| 19:59 | <erieslabnx> constantly
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| 20:00 | I tried one of the wannabe competitors, terrible tool
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| 20:00 | it was a new one released a few weeks ago, it sucked
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| 20:01 | <sbalneav> I haven't had a look at it yet, but I'm sure it's not that bad.
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| 20:01 | <erieslabnx> I am proud of myself, I even learned how to connect to my server from my house and edit user accounts :)
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| 20:02 | Well when I first tried Sayabon it was jacking my system, then tried a nightly build and it fixed it all.... The other one, was locking my whole machine everytime I tried to edit any little thing.
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| 20:02 | I never got to the point to even TRY it live, not stable enough
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| 20:03 | <erieslabnx> this was on a clean install of two different Ubuntu builds!
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| 20:03 | You do very good work and shouldn't be so modest
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| 20:03 | one problem with it though if you have ears....?
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| 20:09 | <sbalneav> Sure
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| 20:09 | <erieslabnx> you do not have a donate financially option on the official page! I am a business user and would love to help you out, if nothing else for some of the time you have put into it.
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| 20:11 | if not on the website at least a paypal email address would be cool
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| 20:13 | <sbalneav> Well, I think most of the LTSP developers don't do it for money, I know I don't.
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| 20:13 | Just scratching my itches.
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| 20:14 | <erieslabnx> but money will keep quality motivations high ;)
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| 20:14 | <erieslabnx> we all want the quality to continue
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| 20:14 | <sbalneav> No, it won't. That's the paradox.
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| 20:14 | <erieslabnx> haha
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| 20:14 | <sbalneav> I do this because I *want* to.
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| 20:14 | If I got *paid* to, it'd just be a job.
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| 20:14 | <erieslabnx> I want you to as well
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| 20:15 | not paid.... reimbursed for the efforts
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| 20:15 | <sbalneav> Besides, I already have a job that pays me fine.
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| 20:15 | I speak only for myself. But thanks for the thought.
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| 20:15 | <erieslabnx> :)
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| 20:16 | have a great night and again thank you for the keywords and ideas
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| 20:20 | <Lns> erieslabnx, if you wanna help sbalneav out then send him a pizza/pints ;)
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| 20:21 | <erieslabnx> :)
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| 20:22 | <Lns> seriously though, in the (limited) experience I have with open source projects, money almost actually just gets in the way unless you're supporting a fulltime coder
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| 20:23 | I find it nice to give 'presents', or maybe send a piece of hardware their way if they're in need =) always nice to get packages in the mail, hehe
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| 20:24 | <sbalneav> Beer, unfortunately, doesn't mail well.
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| 20:24 | Gets the envelopes wet.
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| 20:24 | <Lns> =p
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| 20:29 | <johnny> Lns, paying for a specific feature isn't a terrible idea imo
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| 20:30 | especially if it is something only you need
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| 20:30 | and you would like it done sooner
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| 20:30 | <Lns> johnny, sure, but you'd really have to have the right kind of coder i'd think
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| 20:30 | <johnny> i'm the right kind..
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| 20:30 | hmm /me is broke
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| 20:31 | also the /me command is broken
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| 20:31 | which is what i meant
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| 20:31 | <Lns> =p
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| 20:31 | johnny, do you do any misc. gnome/gtk coding?
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| 20:32 | i have a laundry list of stuff i'd love to see fixed..
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| 20:34 | <johnny> depends
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| 20:35 | most of the time .. i'd be just providing the grease to get something fixed rather than fix it myself.. but that depends on the bug
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| 20:35 | or feature
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| 20:36 | i prefer web stuff, but i do have gnome commit access
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| 20:38 | <Lns> johnny, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-panel/+bug/108951 for example...
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| 20:38 | <johnny> people use the drawer for real?
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| 20:38 | i tried using it once.. but i didn't think it added much to the experience
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| 20:39 | <Lns> helps w/panel real estate
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| 20:39 | i've been using it for ages
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| 20:41 | multiple drawers even..one for remote ssh connections, one for frequently used apps
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| 20:41 | <johnny> i guess i haven't had any panel real esate problems
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| 20:41 | ah.. remote ssh connections i just use hot ssh
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| 20:41 | i only have 5 frequently used apps
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| 20:42 | <Lns> johnny, you would if you had 800x480 on your netbook ;)
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| 20:42 | <johnny> evo, gajim, firefox, rhtymbox, hotssh
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| 20:42 | truly
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| 20:43 | <Lns> johnny, so you up for it? =) i hear you're a programmer for hire...
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| 20:43 | <sbalneav> What's the bug for the drawer?
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| 20:44 | <Lns> sbalneav, very slow after first activation of a gnome session
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| 20:44 | <sbalneav> I've got one here, followed the example, and the drawer opens up for me
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| 20:44 | <Lns> has been since...jeez, edgy?
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| 20:44 | sbalneav, it opens, just very slow (0.5-1.5 sec delay) after first opening and launchers inside
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| 20:45 | <johnny> it doesn't seem that big of a deal for me
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| 20:45 | i put one icon in there
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| 20:45 | <Lns> johnny, ok well i guess i won't pay for you to fix it then ;)
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| 20:45 | <johnny> and it seems like it rolls slow over the one icon
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| 20:45 | and then goes fast
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| 20:45 | <Lns> johnny, correct
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| 20:45 | <johnny> definitely not 1 whole sec tho
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| 20:46 | Lns, try fedora 12/ubunt karmic livecd
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| 20:46 | <Lns> johnny, that's why i said 0.5-1sec... it's VERY annoying when you use the drawer frequently.
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| 20:46 | johnny, i tried F11 i think, same deal
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| 20:46 | <johnny> sure.. but panels themselves are slow
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| 20:46 | <Lns> i'm sure it's an upstream issue
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| 20:46 | <johnny> f12 .. not f11
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| 20:46 | read what i said :)
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| 20:46 | that's gnome 2.28
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| 20:46 | <Lns> blah..panels are fine
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| 20:47 | <sbalneav> Oh, I see, that, 1/2 second delay?
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| 20:47 | <Lns> yea
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| 20:47 | annoying as *&$@
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| 20:47 | <johnny> Lns, it's hard for me to notice that.. as i'm running fedora 12 alpha with debug kernel
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| 20:47 | <sbalneav> Does it do it for all apps, or just text file?
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| 20:47 | <johnny> so.. things are worse thatn they should be
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| 20:48 | when the timer applet finishes and blinks.. cpu spikes to 50%
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| 20:48 | so..me noticing something on gnome 2.28 might be not true
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| 20:48 | <Lns> sbalneav, it happens to me even with no launchers after first click
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| 20:49 | (running gnome 2.26.1 here)
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| 20:49 | panels v2.26.0
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| 20:50 | i gotta run, wife's bday dinner =) ttyl guys
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| 20:50 | <moldy> cu Lns :)
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| 20:51 | <Lns> by moldy haha
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