IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 29 January 2013 (all times are UTC)
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| 07:03 | <ltspuser_83> Hello
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| 07:03 | Hai
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| 07:05 | <work_alkisg> Hola
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| 07:49 | <muppis> It's nice when reboot the server and notice over 300G data is missing due overwritten lvm metadata.
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| 07:50 | So good morning for all. :)
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| 08:55 | <ltspuser_07> hi
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| 08:55 | <Hyperbyte> Hi!
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| 08:55 | muppis, overwritten lvm metadata?
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| 08:55 | <ltspuser_07> in my client side we have evalution mail
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| 08:56 | in that send and recieve icon missing
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| 09:16 | <muppis> Hyperbyte, yes. Some partition software (probably fdisk) didn't understand about the lvm's pv and overwrote it.
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| 10:13 | <Hyperbyte> :o
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| 12:00 | <JuJuBee> I want to use rsync to copy the contents of an install (all of /) to a server. I am using LTSP and want to make a template of an existing install. I booted client with usb stick and sudo su then "rsync -azvv --numeric-ids /mnt/HD/* username@server.ip.address:/path/to/destination" but the files all are owned by username. On server root is uid 0 and on client (booted from usb) all of / is owned by root which is uid 0. What am I missing? This
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| 12:00 | been driving me crazy...
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| 12:12 | think I figured it out... needed to set password for root on live usb and rsync as root from destination. That seems to have fixed it.
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| 12:16 | <Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, hi.
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| 12:16 | I believe vagrantc or jammcq told you exactly this yesterday
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| 12:16 | Not to be mean or anything, just saying... :)
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| 12:17 | 21:28
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| 12:17 | <jammcq>
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| 12:17 | JuJuBee: I think you have to run rsync as root if you want to preserve uid/gid
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| 12:18 | <JuJuBee> Hyperbyte: I was running rsync as root, but from the client. It needed to be run from the server
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| 12:18 | <Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, rsync runs on both client and server.
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| 12:18 | It's two processes, one receiver, one sender.
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| 12:18 | <JuJuBee> I initiated it from the client end
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| 12:18 | ltsp client
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| 12:18 | <Hyperbyte> On the client, it doesn't necessarily need to be root, I believe, but it -might- not be able to read all files otherwise.
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| 12:19 | On the server, yes, of course it needs to be root, else it can never set file permissions to other users. :)
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| 12:19 | <JuJuBee> Since I cannot log into the server as root, I logged in as the user I created on install which has sudo privs. So all files were set uid/gid to that user.
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| 12:24 | I am updating the image now, cross your fingers for me...
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| 12:28 | * Hyperbyte crosses fingers | |
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| 12:35 | <JuJuBee> :(
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| 12:35 | "could not find kernel image: vmlinuz-3.5.0-21-generic" then boot: _
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| 12:36 | I did update-image and update-kernels after I rsync'd the files from a workstation to /opt/ltsp/amd64/
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| 12:40 | <alkisg> ls /opt/ltsp/amd64/boot/vmlinuz* /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/amd64/vmlinuz*
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| 12:42 | <JuJuBee> alkisg: http://pastebin.com/j395dth7
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| 12:43 | <alkisg> As you can see you don't have -21 in the chroot
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| 12:43 | How so?
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| 12:43 | <JuJuBee> Not sure...
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| 12:44 | <alkisg> Did you update kernel and then reverted to the old one?
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| 12:44 | <JuJuBee> I did fresh install on client and copied those files up. Wonder if I didn't upgrade system first
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| 12:44 | <alkisg> Go to the client and troubleshoot there
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| 12:45 | So as it's not related to ltsp at all
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| 12:48 | <JuJuBee> alkisg: seesm I neglected to upgrade client first. It is running -17 not -21
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| 12:49 | An upgrades looks like it is going to install -22 though, should I just upgrade the server also?
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| 12:50 | <alkisg> The server is not involved anywhere
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| 12:50 | <JuJuBee> So how do I correct this? Do I need to edit a config ?
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| 12:53 | pxelinux.cfg/default says not to edit, look at /etc/ltsp/update-kernels.conf but that file does not exist.
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| 13:06 | <alkisg> Since -21 is on the client, it looks like you installed it and then removed it
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| 13:07 | Anyway just upgrade the client, reboot, remove -17, and then rsync to the server
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| 13:07 | You can also install ltsp-server on the client so that you run ltsp-update-image there, and only transfer the nbd image
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| 13:08 | <JuJuBee> Once I have this template working, I don't need to do this again. This was to get PacketTracer working.
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| 13:08 | I will upgrade client and reboot and remove 17 and rsync
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| 13:46 | <JuJuBee> After rsync'ing the files to the server, do I need to update-kernles and image? or just image? Does the order matter?
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| 14:07 | <alkisg> Yes, you need them
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| 14:09 | <JuJuBee> Now I get the login screen on the client. When I enter username and password of a user on the server, I get no response from server and it restarts. Is this due to sshkeys? I didn't update them, doing that now
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| 14:47 | <JuJuBee> So I am almost there. In old image chroot, I had /opt/ltsp/amd64/etc/lts.conf but it is not in the new chroot. Can I just copy it over? I was using FSTAB_0=... to mount home dirs from another server
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| 14:52 | <||cw> I thought lts.conf n the chroot was not used, only in the tftp, did that change again?
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| 14:53 | <JuJuBee> I don't have one in /var/lib/tftpboot/... either
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| 14:54 | I can copy it if that will work... My understanding is that if it is in tftpboot... then I won't need to update-image
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| 14:56 | <||cw> yeah, that was the reason for moving it to tftp
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| 15:27 | <Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, any luck yet?
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| 15:38 | * vagrantc waves to alkisg | |
| 15:38 | <alkisg> Hi vagrantc, hi all :)
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| 15:38 | <vagrantc> so LP#1093144 is looking more and more troublesome?
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| 15:39 | <alkisg> Yup, I've seen that the problem persisted 2 weeks ago and I thought I'd comment on the bug after fixing it, but I didn't have time to do so because of some ltsp workshops
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| 15:40 | I hope I'll push the `killall -u $USER` workaround in a few days...
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| 15:40 | * vagrantc hopes the changes will be small enough to consider for wheezy... | |
| 15:41 | <knipwim> alkisg: are you going to make that optional?
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| 15:41 | * vagrantc watches the translations rolling in | |
| 15:41 | <knipwim> with lts.conf var
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| 15:41 | <alkisg> I think that a small version of that could be backported to wheezy, yeah, even though not the actual bzr commit as it's getting a bit chaotic now
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| 15:41 | knipwim: no
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| 15:41 | <vagrantc> alkisg: what about screen/tmux sessions?
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| 15:41 | <alkisg> If SSHFS is used, all processes will be killed unconditionally
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| 15:41 | <knipwim> hmm, so, if i log of on my client, my screens also die?
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| 15:42 | <alkisg> There's no point in not killing the connection if the sshfs mount is unmounted
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| 15:42 | <knipwim> ah, the user processes on the client
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| 15:42 | <alkisg> ssh dies, sshfs dies, so having the processes try to write to $HOME without $HOME being there doesn't help
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| 15:42 | Yup
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| 15:42 | <knipwim> ok, cool
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| 15:43 | <vagrantc> ok
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| 15:43 | <alkisg> That has a bad side effect on people that want to leave user processes after logoff, like daemons, but that should be rare
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| 15:43 | <vagrantc> and potentially a security problem anyways...
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| 15:43 | <alkisg> (on the client)
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| 15:43 | <alkisg> And it would cause problems with passwd being restored by localapps to the one that doesn't have the user account
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| 15:43 | So yeah it shouldn't be too bad...
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| 15:44 | * vagrantc wonders if we can stop launchpad from making pointless translation commits... | |
| 15:45 | <alkisg> vagrantc, knipwim: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ldm-trunk/changes ==> every days there are translation pushes, while they're not there in ltsp-trunk... do you think we have some wrong setting there? Should we report it?
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| 15:45 | Hehe writing the same as vagrantc :D
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| 15:45 | <vagrantc> what good is:
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| 15:45 | -"X-Launchpad-Export-Date: 2013-01-14 04:30+0000\n"
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| 15:45 | -"X-Generator: Launchpad (build 16420)\n"
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| 15:45 | +"X-Launchpad-Export-Date: 2013-01-26 04:30+0000\n"
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| 15:45 | +"X-Generator: Launchpad (build 16451)\n"
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| 15:45 | <knipwim> is something changed then in the po's? on ltsp-trunk it only occurs when something was translated
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| 15:45 | <vagrantc> in *all* the translation files ... it seems like it should only bother with translations that actually... had some meaningful change
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| 15:46 | it touches *all* the files whenever a change is made to any of them?
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| 15:46 | <alkisg> No, not always
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| 15:47 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/revision/2443 ==> just fr.po
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| 15:47 | <vagrantc> r2441 contains *only* the above two changes in all .po files.
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| 15:48 | * vagrantc grumbles about ALTLinux | |
| 15:48 | <knipwim> i can't find any changes in the last change on ldm-trunk
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| 15:48 | just the timestamp changes
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| 15:49 | <vagrantc> if it's going to pull that sort of stuff, we should split it into a separate branch and merge manually.
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| 15:49 | although ideally it wouldn't generate so much noise.
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| 15:50 | <alkisg> It doesn't do that in epoptes
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| 15:50 | <vagrantc> that's good news...
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| 15:50 | <alkisg> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~epoptes/epoptes/trunk/changes/372?start_revid=372
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| 15:51 | <knipwim> but somehow, launchpad changes timestamps and exports because the file changed
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| 15:59 | <JuJuBee> Hyperbyte: I think so. I have the new image booting and PacketTracer loads :D I am happy.
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| 15:59 | I assume that I can just remove /opt/ltsp/amd64.old now and update-image again?
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| 16:00 | <alkisg> https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/220460
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| 16:02 | <knipwim> nice, and subscribed :)
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| 16:14 | <Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, I wouldn't. Unless you're pushed for disk space.
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| 16:16 | <JuJuBee> OK, not pressed for space. Just takes longer to update-image with 2 dirs...
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| 17:40 | <Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, you could move the dir somewhere else entirely
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| 17:40 | That, or delete it.
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| 18:22 | <JuJuBee> I am having a problem. I am using nfs to mount user homes from a different server. I created all of my users accounts on the new ltsp server making sure to make the UID's the same. However, I neglected to make sure the groups were all the same and now my users have a different group id than their own. Suggestions? Should I delete all the users from the ltsp server and recreate making sure the uids and gids match?
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| 18:24 | OR should I bag mounting via nfs the homes from remote server and let the new ltsp server do everything and have them rsyncc files from old server to new?
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| 18:24 | <vagrantc> you should make them match somehow...
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| 18:24 | <JuJuBee> vagrantc: can I just change them in /etc/group?
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| 18:25 | <vagrantc> you might have to change both /etc/group and /etc/passwd ... but be careful!
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| 18:26 | <JuJuBee> Since they really have no files in their home dirs on new server, might be easier to remove them and recreate.
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| 18:31 | * alkisg thought that UID mapping is idmap's job, done automatically for nfs... | |
| 18:32 | <vagrantc> automatically by what?
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| 18:33 | you have two servers that don't know each other's UID/GIDs ...
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| 18:35 | <JuJuBee> vagrantc: not sure I understand what you are asking... I have a new LTSP server and my old file server. my fat clients mount /home from old server using nfs. Since auth is handled by new server, the users need accounts on both, don't they? and it would seem their UID and GID needs to match on both servers?
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| 18:36 | <vagrantc> JuJuBee: yes, that sounds correct.
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| 18:37 | * vagrantc was responding to alkisg's question | |
| 18:37 | <JuJuBee> oh sorry
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| 18:38 | So on the file server when I "ls -al" a users home dir, I see that some of the files "gtk-bookmarks" for example has the wrong group.... -rw-r--r-- 1 bogauschc murrayj 157 2013-01-29 13:33 .gtk-bookmarks
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| 18:39 | <vagrantc> JuJuBee: try ls -aln
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| 18:39 | that should give you the numeric ID...
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| 18:40 | <JuJuBee> I did use -aln and the GID is not what it should be. I tried to chgrp bogauschc -R /home/bogauschc and it seems to revert back
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| 18:41 | when he logs in
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| 18:48 | <alkisg> vagrantc: automatically by idmapd
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| 18:48 | I.e. the ltsp server has a user "xxx" with uid=1234
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| 18:48 | And the nfs server has a user "xxx" with uid=1235
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| 18:48 | Won't idmapd map the same names to the same uid?
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| 18:49 | <vagrantc> i've honestly never set that up, and it certainly didn't work automagically.
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| 19:07 | <JuJuBee> Well, I changed the gid's on new server to match (just for the users I created with same groupname as username) and then set the primary group for each user to correct value and that seems to have done the trick.
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| 19:08 | <vagrantc> yup
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| 19:22 | <JuJuBee> How does a user change his/her password if logged into a fat client? Do they have to ssh to the server and use passwd there?
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| 19:23 | <vagrantc> pretty much.
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| 19:24 | <JuJuBee> bummer, I was hoping it was going to be easier than it was using nis.
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| 19:43 | <kev_j> Hey all, I am having an issue with my 32-bit chroot... when I use 'ltsp-chroot --arch=i386 apt-get install oracle-java7-installer' to install java (webupd8 workaround) it installs the x64 version
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| 19:44 | am I missing a step on this or doing something stupid?
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| 19:44 | <jammcq> what was the arch when you built the chroot?
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| 19:44 | <kev_j> i386
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| 19:44 | <jammcq> hmm
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| 19:45 | <kev_j> used ltsp-build-client --arch=i386
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| 19:45 | <jammcq> is your server 64-bit ?
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| 19:45 | <kev_j> yeah
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| 19:45 | <jammcq> what if you just do: ltsp-chroot
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| 19:45 | and then run the apt-get install inside there?
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| 19:45 | <kev_j> then it just goes to my amd64 chroot
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| 19:46 | <jammcq> ah, so you have multiple chroots?
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| 19:46 | <kev_j> yeah
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| 19:46 | and if I do ltsp-chroot --arch=i386
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| 19:46 | then go in and do apt-get install blah blah
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| 19:46 | it still gets amd64
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| 19:46 | <jammcq> does it install successfully?
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| 19:46 | <kev_j> I'm guessing because the uname still reads as x64
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| 19:47 | <vagrantc> what distro?
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| 19:47 | <kev_j> yeah, but firefox won't recognize it
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| 19:47 | debian wheezy
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| 19:47 | <jammcq> seems like it would fail to install, due to missing dependencies
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| 19:49 | maybe it's installing the 32-bit installer, but then when you run the oracle installer, it's using uname to figure out the arch
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| 19:49 | which is gonna be wrong
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| 19:49 | <kev_j> I was thinking it might be something like that
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| 19:49 | <jammcq> hmmm
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| 19:49 | <kev_j> but I dunno how to fix it
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| 19:49 | <jammcq> is the installer a script? or a binary?
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| 19:50 | <kev_j> script I think..
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| 19:50 | <knipwim> or very ghetto, fake the uname by temporarily replacing it with a shell script which echo's the correct arch
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| 19:50 | <jammcq> maybe hack the script to force the arch
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| 19:50 | or yeah, fake uname
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| 19:50 | <knipwim> if that is the problem
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| 19:52 | <kev_j> I don't really know how to go about replacing uname... I think I understand how you would go about doing that, but not sure
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| 19:52 | <knipwim> kev_j: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=82334
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| 19:54 | <kev_j> knipwim: ah, thanks... that's actually along the lines of what I was thinking, but definitely glad I don't have to figure it out myself
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| 19:56 | <knipwim> i was wondering why no one has made a package for it
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| 19:56 | search google "fakeuname"
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| 19:56 | first hit
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| 19:57 | from the comments: "That's actually useful when compiling some software from chroot."
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| 20:13 | <alkisg> Or mount the chroot via NFS to an i386 machine
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| 20:38 | <kev_j> hrm... fakeuname isn't working in the chroot... it does outside of it, and it does appear to be uname causing the issue, but I keep getting '/tmp/uname.nmQhurVI//uname: 9: /tmp/uname.nmQhurVI//uname: Bad substitution'
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| 20:56 | <kev_j> would running 'linux32 /opt/ltsp/i386 /bin/bash' be a fix? or do I have to use ltsp-chroot to chroot the directory properly?
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| 21:00 | whelp... about to find out
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| 21:02 | <kev_j> yay, it seems to have worked fine
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| 21:03 | <jammcq> seems like: ltsp-chroot --arch=386 setarch i686 apt-get install blah blah blah
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| 21:04 | would do it
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| 21:04 | cuz I think ltsp-chroot does some other magic for you too
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| 21:05 | <kev_j> i actually tried that for the most part and since it downloads a script that works off of uname it didn't work
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| 21:06 | I had to figure out how to change the uname -m command to give i686
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| 21:06 | <jammcq> I think that's exactly what setarch is supposed to do
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| 21:06 | <kev_j> is that an apt-get command or ltsp-chroot command?
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| 21:06 | <jammcq> neither, it's just a linux command
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| 21:07 | man setarch
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| 21:08 | <kev_j> hm, mebbe, I will try that next time... linux32 worked this time, not to say it is the best way to do it... I will try that out tmorrow or something
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| 21:08 | i do like that way better
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| 21:09 | anywho, thanks for the help, time to get back to other work crap
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| 21:12 | <Enslaver> quick question, where does ltsp-bindmounts belong and what calls that script?
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| 21:13 | <jammcq> I think it runs that from the initramfs before turning control over to /sbin/init
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| 21:13 | on my debian server, it's in /opt/ltsp/amd64/usr/share/ltsp/ltsp-bindmounts
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| 21:14 | <Enslaver> is that in the same place as your ltsp-core program?
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| 21:14 | <jammcq> I don't have a ltsp-core
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| 21:15 | <Enslaver> ok, i've been going through the latest ltsp-trunk and seeing what i missed, that is in the client/initscripts directory, not sure where those 2 belong
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| 21:16 | <jammcq> ummm
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| 21:16 | not sure
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| 21:16 | I've only recently gotten back into ltsp and i'm still figuring out where things go and how they work
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| 21:16 | <Enslaver> see if you have a ltsp-core in your amd64/etc/init.d directory
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| 21:16 | <jammcq> I don't have it anywhere on my server
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| 21:16 | locate ltsp-core
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| 21:17 | returned nothing
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| 21:21 | <Enslaver> I am having a lot of trouble and its probably just something really basic I'm missing, i am getting errors like http://imgur.com/wRErgKp
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| 21:21 | <alkisg> That gets renamed in debian-based systems
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| 21:22 | ltsp-trunk/client/initscripts/ltsp-core ==> /etc/init.d/ltsp-client-core
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| 21:22 | And ubuntu has an upstart job instead of that
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| 21:23 | <Enslaver> alkisg: what about bind mounts?
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| 21:23 | <alkisg> bind-mounts are no longer used in debian-based distros afaik
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| 21:23 | It's better to use tmpfs+aufs over e.g. nfs
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| 21:24 | (or overlayfs, or nbd)
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| 21:24 | knipwim had problems with that though so gentoo still uses bind-mounts
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| 21:24 | For fedora, I'd advice to try to avoid it
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| 21:25 | <Enslaver> I'd love to except i need to use hfs for testing
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| 21:25 | nfs*
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| 21:26 | building an nbd image each little change i make is too exhausting
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| 21:26 | esp on a virtual machine on my macbook
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| 21:26 | <alkisg> Debian uses tmpfs+aufs over nfs
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| 21:26 | (afaik)
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| 21:27 | So it doesn't use bind-mounts either
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| 21:27 | You don't need NBD to use aufs or overlayfs, it works with NFS fine
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| 21:27 | <jammcq> debian will do either nfs or nbd
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| 21:27 | i've been playing with both
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| 21:27 | <alkisg> Yeah we've been designing that with Vagrant for weeks :)
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| 21:28 | <jammcq> well... you've been doing well, cuz it's working :)
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| 21:28 | <alkisg> So, bind-mounts ==> to be avoided, and then one can select (NFS or NBD), (aufs or overlayfs), and tmpfs
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| 21:28 | <Enslaver> I've never used aufs, is it a replacement for tmpfs?
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| 21:29 | <alkisg> No, it's a method to have a copy-on-write system over a read-only medium
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| 21:29 | So...
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| 21:29 | NBD and NFS are both read-only for the client
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| 21:29 | A tmpfs is used to make them appear writeable, and the changes get written to the client RAM,
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| 21:30 | and an aufs or overlayfs is used to merge the (NFS or NBD) with the tmpfs so that they both appear as a single root (/) filesystem
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| 21:30 | <Enslaver> provided the client has enough memory for the image :) There an rpm out for it?
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| 21:30 | <alkisg> The client only stores the changes, which are only a few MB
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| 21:30 | Like, 1 MB for thin clients, a couple more for fats
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| 21:31 | <Enslaver> # yum search aufs
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| 21:31 | Warning: No matches found for: aufs
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| 21:31 | <alkisg> And if someone wants, he can use a server-based tmpfs system
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| 21:31 | locate aufs ?
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| 21:31 | Maybe its compiled as a kernel module in fedora...
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| 21:31 | Also search for overlayfs
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| 21:31 | <Enslaver> no aufs
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| 21:32 | no overlayfs either
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| 21:32 | I'm not using fedora
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| 21:32 | el6
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| 21:32 | <alkisg> http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=276094
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| 21:33 | That says that funionfs might be an option
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| 21:34 | <Enslaver> same thing as union's?
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| 21:34 | unionfs*
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| 21:34 | we have that
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| 21:35 | <alkisg> That could work... you basically need to fake a writeable system over an nfs or nbd read only system
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| 21:38 | http://manpages.ubuntu.com/unionfs-fuse.8.html
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| 21:38 | ...we could add support for that as well...
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| 21:39 | ...so that one can choose between overlayfs, aufs, unionfs-fuse, or resort to bind-mounts
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| 21:39 | knipwim: do you have unionfs-fuse in gentoo?
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| 21:39 | <knipwim> yep
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| 21:39 | also funionfs
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| 21:39 | <alkisg> knipwim: if that works, would you prefer to dump bind-mounts?
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| 21:39 | <knipwim> sure
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| 21:40 | <alkisg> Cool, we could put it to our TODO list, I can help there
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| 21:41 | <Enslaver> I'll try and get it going on RH based distro's
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| 21:41 | <alkisg> OK so goal: support overlayfs, aufs, unionfs-fuse, funionfs, and dump bind-mounts
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| 21:41 | <knipwim> is there anything for bindmounts in the common code?
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| 21:42 | <alkisg> I think there is one file
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| 21:42 | <knipwim> i think all the gentoo bindmount stuff is located in the gentoo dirs
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| 21:42 | <alkisg> ./client/initscripts/ltsp-bindmounts
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| 21:43 | <knipwim> gentoo uses client/Gentoo/share/ltsp/init-ltsp.d/00-bindmounts
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| 21:43 | so we can move the other one to obsolete
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| 21:45 | <Enslaver> any common directory for the metadata we should use?
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| 21:45 | /var/cache/ltsp ?
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| 21:50 | So this will serve as "/" ?
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| 23:19 | <Hyperbyte> mhmmmm
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| 23:32 | <Enslaver> I swear, it would have been 100x easier to port this to el6 if warren had just used LSB, I am going to go ahead and include it with el6's ltsp5, it increases the image by about 146M total. I think that'll be ok
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| 23:33 | <vagrantc> wow. the whole debian image is maybe 600-700MB ...
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| 23:33 | <Enslaver> Yeah but who wants to use a fisher price OS?
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| 23:34 | <vagrantc> pfft :P
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| 23:34 | <jammcq> excuse me? fisher price OS ?
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| 23:34 | <Enslaver> yeah, its like intro to linux flavor, I think the man pages come with popups
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| 23:35 | <jammcq> dude, you are gonna need alot of help. now is not the time to piss off the guys that are trying to help you
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| 23:36 | <Enslaver> I meant no personal disrespect, i've used debian plenty and have my reservations
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| 23:37 | * vagrantc really doesn't understand what on earth the reference to manpage popups was about | |
| 23:37 | <Enslaver> like popup books?
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| 23:37 | popup manpages :)
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| 23:37 | * jammcq doesn't get it either | |
| 23:37 | <Enslaver> sorry i just can't stand debian
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| 23:38 | * vagrantc just can't stand intolerance | |
| 23:39 | <Hyperbyte> Wait, when did this turn into a fight?
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| 23:39 | I thought you guys were joking at first.
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| 23:39 | * vagrantc too | |
| 23:39 | <Enslaver> apparently they took the debian joke personally
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| 23:39 | <Hyperbyte> Well it wasn't too kindly now, let's be honest. :P
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| 23:39 | <vagrantc> distro flames are kind of boring, honestly.
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| 23:39 | <jammcq> indeed
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| 23:39 | <Hyperbyte> They are.
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| 23:40 | <Enslaver> yes, but nothing personal, i think vagrant is quite a brilliant guy
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| 23:41 | do you forgive me vagrant? wanna hug?
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| 23:41 | <Hyperbyte> Awwe
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| 23:41 | * Hyperbyte feels left out | |
| 23:41 | <Hyperbyte> Can we make it a group hug? :-D
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| 23:43 | <vagrantc> Enslaver: ah, sure. :)
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| 23:44 | <Enslaver> thanks man, you're alright, i don't care what Hyperbyte said about you
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| 23:44 | :)
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| 23:44 | <Hyperbyte> Hah
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| 23:44 | Now you're trying to put me in the middle of the fight you created? :P
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| 23:44 | * Enslaver nods. | |
| 23:44 | <Hyperbyte> I'm staying out of it! ;-)
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| 23:45 | <Enslaver> I gotta leave soon though and need a torch holder
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| 23:45 | <Hyperbyte> Debian smells and stuff
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| 23:45 | see there
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| 23:45 | <Hyperbyte> I will say this.... I've really only ever used RedHat OS's... started with RedHat Linux 7.x, then Fedora Core, then Fedora....
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| 23:46 | And I've always been a huge advocate of Fedora, without trying other distros (how ironic is that)
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| 23:46 | When I wanted LTSP, it was pretty clear Fedora was not the way to go, so I switched one server to Ubuntu...
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| 23:46 | <Enslaver> I actually never really liked Red Hat
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| 23:46 | <Hyperbyte> And since then I've found out one thing:
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| 23:46 | <Enslaver> I got forced into it because slackware started to really suck
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| 23:47 | <vagrantc> well, computers are the real problems, OSes are just a thin veneer to hide that.
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| 23:47 | <Enslaver> Now its grown on me
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| 23:47 | <Hyperbyte> This whole distro-warring and "my distro is better than yours!" is bullshit. There is no perfect distro. You'll end up tweaking, debugging, fixing, modding, etc, whatever distro you pick. Why? Because that's the way Linux is! And we all love it for it.
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| 23:48 | <Enslaver> There is a perfect distro :) Wanna know what it is?
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| 23:48 | <Hyperbyte> No!
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| 23:48 | <Enslaver> http://www.diy-linux.org/
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| 23:48 | <Hyperbyte> It's subjective. ;-)
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| 23:48 | <Enslaver> DIY linux is actually the perfect distro
| |
| 23:49 | <Hyperbyte> Hah
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| 23:49 | Well
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| 23:49 | Maybe I'll try that when I retire. :P
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| 23:49 | For now, I'm gonna turn in. :-)
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| 23:49 | G'night!
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| 23:50 | <vagrantc> i spent 2-3 years checking on distros around the turn of the millenia, and Debian's done me well the past 12 years, and now i mold it to my own ends.
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| 23:52 | whatever issues Debian may have, the Debian community really won me over
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| 23:52 | LTSP is a similar story- it's had a really healthy community.
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| 23:52 | <jammcq> the community is the best part
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| 23:56 | <Enslaver> log_action_begin_msg i take it is a ubuntu thing?
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| 23:57 | <vagrantc> lsb, i think.
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| 23:58 | it seems to be a function from debian's lsb-base package, anyways.
| |