IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)


Channel log from 26 June 2012   (all times are UTC)

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05:14
<mealstrom>
goo morning, i suppose
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06:20
<teacher>
exit
06:20
quit
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13:09
<Hyperbyte>
What's the best way to run a command on the server, during user logout in a thin client environment?
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13:10
<Hyperbyte>
There's some process that doesn't quit properly, I want to kill it manually
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13:11
<alkisg>
pam_exec?
13:11
xexit?
13:11
ldm?
13:11
<Hyperbyte>
I want to run the command on the server, preferably on Gnome exit...
13:12
I'm basically looking for /etc/xdg/autostart, but then on logout. ;-)
13:12
<alkisg>
All of those can do that, each one with its shortcomings
13:13
<Hyperbyte>
Which one is the best for my situation? :)
13:13
<alkisg>
Worst case... user pulls the network plug. xexit will understand that quickly, pam_exec some time later on, ldm never
13:13
xexit polls X, so if you don't mind the minor overhead, it's a good candidate
13:13
...and if you don't mind the lack of documentation ;D
13:13
!xexit
13:13
<ltsp>
alkisg: xexit: Instead of gnome-watchdog one can use xexit, which is a similar (but better!) tool written by an LTSP developer: http://www.opinsys.fi/en/killing-user-processes-with-xexit-on-ltsp-servers
13:14
<Hyperbyte>
Does xexit detect logout, or only client shutdown?
13:14
<alkisg>
Logout without X killed? How?
13:14
It detects the inability to connect to the client X
13:14
<Hyperbyte>
I mean, what if I log out of Gnome, and then log back in
13:15
<alkisg>
X is killled on logout
13:15
<bieb1>
alkisg: what is the site for the LTSP tool you just built? (not sure of the name) I had the link before but lost it
13:15
<alkisg>
!ltsp-pnp
13:15
<ltsp>
alkisg: ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
13:16
<alkisg>
bieb1: actually there's no "ltsp-pnp" tool, I just kept the name in order to have a name for that specific method. It's using the upstream LTSP sources, so it's just `ltsp-update-image -c /`
13:16
<bieb1>
cool
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13:17
<bieb1>
alkisg: I am thinking about rebuilding my ltsp server with Mint.. just trying to evaluate all my options
13:18
<alkisg>
Sure... /me settled with gnome-fallback
13:19
<bieb1>
was that for me? or Hyper?
13:21
<alkisg>
For you
13:21
I mean, that I didn't like Unity, but instead of going with Mint or the other options, I settled with the gnome-fallback-session
13:21
Looks like the old 10.04
13:22
<bieb1>
I did the fallback, which was fine.. but just odd things that don't seem to want to work with 12.04
13:22
<alkisg>
Like what?
13:22
(and why would they work with Mint then? older packages?)
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13:23
<Hyperbyte>
!forget xexit
13:23
<ltsp>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
13:23
<Hyperbyte>
!learn xexit as Instead of gnome-watchdog one can use xexit, which is a similar (but better!) tool written by an LTSP developer: http://www.opinsys.fi/en/killing-user-processes-with-xexit-on-ltsp-servers (not available for Ubuntu 12.04)
13:23
<ltsp>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
13:23
<bieb1>
I followed your advice and have been searching google for Multi-user settings.. I follow them step by step.. nothing works.. ie.. Desktop background..
13:23
<Hyperbyte>
Next. :)
13:24
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: it's very easy to compile it for 12.04
13:24
Just a click on a PPA
13:24
Want me to put it in my PPA until sbalneav puts it in his?
13:25
<Hyperbyte>
Meh, nah...
13:25
I'll just run a nightly cronjob that kills all errant processes for now
13:26
<alkisg>
bieb1: desktop background doesn't work?
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13:28
<bieb1>
alkisg: also trying to turn off the screensaver/lock settings.. followed the steps I found online.. nope.. that didnt work either.. but 2 things that have driven me nuts.. I have run 3 of the regular updates when I have received the "updates" available message, and had to reboot after each (don't want to have a windows like server that needs to be rebooted every update) and AD connection.. Likewise which worked great under 10.04 was purchased by beyond trust..
13:29
I know not all this is an LTSP issue.. I am just trying to get the system back to stable reliable 10.04 setup that I had.. I am going to look at Kiwi also
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13:30
<alkisg>
bieb1: switching to Mint won't change anything about those problems though. When e.g. you have a kernel update, you need to reboot for it to take effect, nothing else you can do about it.
13:30
Also, whatever distro you use, if it uses gnome, locking will be exactly the same
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13:30
<alkisg>
Locking is only different between desktop environments (gnome, kde, lxde etc), not between distros
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13:32
<bieb1>
alkisg: it's just very frustrating to me with 12.04.. since my 10.04 system worked so well.. ya know?
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13:33
<alkisg>
bieb1: yeah, I know, in Greek we had broken keyboard layout for gdm. We filed bug reported, they fixed it, then it broke again for the next version of gdm, then they fixed it, now it's broken for lightdm
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13:33
<bieb1>
that is a pain
13:34
<alkisg>
Unfortunately that's how the gnu/linux development works, we just have to be patient and wait for the major problems to be solved before upgrading to newer versions
13:34
...and some of the problems will always be there... e.g. I checked which laptop to buy and got one where everything worked. Now with the newer linux kernel, brightness doesn't work, and battery level either
13:34
<bieb1>
I understand that.. and that is part of my frustration.. I should have waited before the move to 12.04
13:35
<alkisg>
...but I really don't want to spend a week in trying to get them fixed by kernel bisecting
13:36
<bieb1>
alkisg: what would be your recomendation to someone that was going to build LTSP from scratch? with diskless workstation thin clients.
13:37* Hyperbyte <3 12.04
13:37
<alkisg>
Right, that's what I tell teachers here: 12.04 is out in April, update (or better yet do a clean install to avoid problems) in September :D
13:37
bieb1: I can't say in general, without knowing the specific needs
13:38
<bieb1>
Active Directory authentication..
13:38
<alkisg>
For teachers here I advice using ltsp-pnp from our PPA, along with our sch-scripts tool that fixes some of the recent ubuntu regressions (like dnsmasq not working)
13:38
<bieb1>
codeweavers to run MS Office
13:38
<alkisg>
bieb1: I'm not sure why you're running linux then :D
13:39
<bieb1>
lol
13:39
thanks
13:39
<alkisg>
Why not windows on top of LTSP, without Linux even showing up on the clients?
13:39
A Windows VM for fat clients, or Server for thin clients, is all you need...
13:40
<bieb1>
explain please? I didnt know that was possible without win terminal services
13:40
<alkisg>
Have you ever run virtualbox in windows inside linux?
13:40
<bieb1>
yep
13:40
<alkisg>
Err a windows guest in a linux host?
13:40
Well, you could do the same with LTSP
13:40
Send the same VM to all your clients
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13:41
<bieb1>
is there a howto that you can point me at? I have never thought of providing a VM to the thin clients
13:41
<alkisg>
I haven't seen a how-to, it would need some digging into it to make it work
13:42
<bieb1>
hmmm thought provoking..
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13:42
<alkisg>
So basically the clients run windows, linux is there just for the remote boot + to avoid having to install different drivers for each client
13:43
<bieb1>
do you know how that affects your windows license? **yes I know that's not an ltsp issue** :) :)
13:44
<||cw>
can vbox do "linked clones"?
13:45
<Hyperbyte>
bieb1, Google for that one. 'windows virtual machine license'
13:45
<bieb1>
that was one of the contributing factors to puttin linux in the lab.. reduce license cost, and maintenance time
13:45
<||cw>
if so, you'd have a linked clone for each station, the master image would be syspreped, and the clones would hold the licensing
13:45
<alkisg>
Nope. I guess you need a volume license for that. If you only have e.g. windows home, then you'd have to create a few snapshots of the master VM and change their serial number
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13:45
<||cw>
works best with one of hte volume agreements
13:46
<Hyperbyte>
I believe if you get a Windows Datacenter edition, you can run as many virtual instances as you want.
13:46
<alkisg>
vbox can do linked clones, yeah
13:46
<||cw>
bieb1: it's basically the same concept as VDI
13:46
Hyperbyte: on the one host
13:47
<bieb1>
||cw: I am not familiar with VDI.. I will have to look that one up
13:47
<Hyperbyte>
||cw, mmm
13:47
<||cw>
if you have fat clients, vbox would let you spread that out
13:48
<alkisg>
A vbox screen script over thin clients would be enough
13:48
SCREEN_07="vbox params etc"
13:48
<||cw>
it's a cool concept, would like to see an implementation detailed, or maybe do one some day
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14:01
<mnevans>
Hello LTSP world. I am having trouble getting ltsp started on a fresh debian/wheezy (6.0.5) install. Two Intel NICs. I am following instructions on http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto
14:01
1. installed ltsp-server-standalone
14:01
2. built the client for the architecture (amd64 in both server and client)
14:02
3. configured /etc/dhcp/dhcpd.conf to include the pointer to /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
14:03
4. Configured /etc/exports
14:03
5. 5. restart ndb daemon (no errors to stdout).
14:04
6. invoke-rc.d openbsd-inetd restart
14:08
7. check configureation of NICs using ifconfig: OK.
14:08
<alkisg>
And the client error is...?
14:09
<mnevans>
Th eproblem seems to be starting isc-dhcp-server: it fails with the error "no subnet declaration" for eth0, which is the server's internet connection, and says: "not configured to listen on any interfaces!"
14:09
I am using the stock /etc/dhcpd.conf with the only changes that I am using for the client LAN the server address 192.168.1.1.
14:09
<bieb1>
||cw: is this what you are talking about?? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desktop_virtualization#VDI
14:10
<alkisg>
mnevans: then a good start would be to paste your dhcpd.conf (both the main and the ltsp one) for anyone that uses/knows about isc-dhcp to help you...
14:12
<||cw>
bieb1: yes.
14:13
<mnevans>
Alkisg, thank you, these are at: http://pastebin.com/fjaLyumh . I pasted the single line I added to /etc/dhcp/dhcpd.conf (include...) and then the whole of /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf.
14:14
... I suspect this is very simple and will reflect my ignorance...
14:15
<alkisg>
I don't have isc-dhcp so I can't see its stock contents
14:16* alkisg is using dnsmasq...
14:17
<alkisg>
Also, if you run dpkg-reconfigure isc-dhcp-server and told it to listen on a specific interface... you should undo it
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14:19
<mnevans>
@alkisg, I don't think I told isc-dhcp-server to listen on a specific interface; just installed ltsp-server-standalone, didn't make any notes about configuration during install on that.
14:19
<||cw>
you probably need to tell it to NOT listen on eth0, specifically
14:19
dnsmask is so much easier though
14:19
<mnevans>
@||cw, thank you, how do I do that (in /etc/dhcpd.conf?)
14:19
<||cw>
I don't
14:20
<mnevans>
@||cw, I would try dnsmasq, should I follow th einstructions on the ltsp/lenny howto?
14:20
<||cw>
I guess, last time all I needed was to read the comments in the default conf file
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14:26
<alkisg>
mnevans: (05:15:46 μμ) alkisg: I don't have isc-dhcp so I can't see its stock contents
14:26
I meant, you should put those in pastebin too
14:27
isc-dhcp decides which interface to listen in based on its subnet
14:27
So there's no need to declare it anywhere by name
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14:36
<mnevans>
@alkisg: what exactly would you like in pastebin from isc-dhcp?
14:36
<alkisg>
Its stock configuration file
14:36
Then, the output of your `ip addr show`
14:38
<mnevans>
OK, /etc/dhcp/dhcpd.conf is here: http://pastebin.com/QfUDVgaR
14:40
and output of ip addr show is here: http://pastebin.com/T65dFNSP
14:40
<alkisg>
mnevans: so, you have an IP of 192.168.0.x but you're declaring a subnet of 192.168.1.x
14:40
That's why isc-dhcp doesn't start
14:41
Maybe you're missing a static IP on the internal interface?
14:41
<mnevans>
Alkisg, I'm confused. I have two NICs, one is the connection to the internet (eth0). The second (eth1) is supposed to be for the ltsp LAN, 192.168.1.1. Isn't that correct (guess not?)
14:42
<alkisg>
mnevans: and did you set that IP for eth1?
14:42
<mnevans>
... so the subnet declaration in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf is supposed to be for the IP, 192.168.0.x, for the internet lan?
14:43
<alkisg>
mnevans: that's for dhcp. To set an IP, you either use network manager, or /etc/network/interfaces
14:43
Google for "set static ip debian"
14:44
<mnevans>
Alkisg, I did this using network manager. Static IP address settings, IPv4, never use IPv6.
14:44
I do see that the eth1 is not active, and doesn't seem to be activate-able.
14:44
<alkisg>
mnevans: it doesn't show up in `ip addr show`, so you did something wrong there. Maybe you didn't activate it yet?
14:45
sudo cat /etc/network/interfaces
14:45
(err ok as root, I mean)
14:45
<mnevans>
Hm, maybe. How to activate it? It doesn't have an 'activate' choice in the menu in network manager. Maybe by restarting the service?
14:45
<alkisg>
and: cat /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/*
14:46
<mnevans>
Alkisg, there is nothing in that directory, although the directory exists.
14:46
<alkisg>
Then you didn't create a system connection with network manager
14:47
Anyway the "setting up a static IP" part isn't LTSP specific, so you could also ask in #network-manager, in #debian etc. bbiab.
14:47
<mnevans>
Sorry! I was looking at a window into an ubuntu system by mistake ! Hang on...
14:48
I see in the directory system-connections, a file "Auto Eth1" and this is for 192.168.1.1, and the correct MAC address for the NIC.
14:49
No entry for eth0 (192.168.0.x) there (it is called "Auto eth0" in the Network