IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 14 December 2015 (all times are UTC)
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| 06:28 | work_alkisg is now known as alkisg | |
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| 06:59 | <huafu> hello, anyone here who could help with some DHCP issues and my LTSP clients?
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| 06:59 | I see the DHCP requests and offers from in the syslog of the server but none of my clients seems to see the offers (responses)
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| 07:00 | the issue is not client side, they use to boot correctly on other config
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| 07:01 | but now I wanted my ltsp server to be a VM, so I setup my NIC as manual, in the vbox params I allowed promiscuous mode, setup as bridge of course, used AMD but tried with intel and it is the same
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| 07:01 | <maldridge> having not tried to do such things from a VM, I'd be sure that your VM is forwarding the packets back out
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| 07:02 | <huafu> in the client vm (ie ltsp server) I used a very basic configuration, no extra config
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| 07:02 | <alkisg> Is that your only dhcp server?
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| 07:02 | <huafu> maldridge, alkisg thanks for answering
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| 07:02 | <alkisg> Or do you have another dhcp server (e.g. router) in your network?
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| 07:02 | <huafu> alkisg, on that network yes it is the only dhcp server (the VM, ltsp server)
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| 07:02 | the router is on another NIC
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| 07:03 | <alkisg> Which nic is the host nic that is bridged to the VM? eth1?
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| 07:03 | Run this from your host: sudo /usr/lib/klibc/bin/ipconfig -n eth1
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| 07:04 | This tries to get an ip without actually assigning it. The VM should answer.
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| 07:04 | <huafu> alkisg, FYI I started from scratch and decided to follow the tuto before doing some fancy config, and to allow me to revert quickly I decided to use a very basic ubuntu server as the host os, and the vm would be the ltsp server. on the host, eth0 is the internet, and eth1 is the lan with my ltsp clients. The eth1 on the host is configured as `inet manual`
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| 07:05 | <alkisg> The quickest way to have something up and running is to follow the wiki page without testing e.g. if ubuntu server works :)
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| 07:05 | What's the output of that command that I said above?
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| 07:06 | <huafu> the interfaces are the same name in the guest (eth0 and eth1), I do have access to the internet, I configured my eth1 as fixed in the guest os (as explained in your pnp tuto, only change is a different network and no dnsmasq)
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| 07:06 | <alkisg> dnsmasq is automatically configured for 2 nics
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| 07:06 | <huafu> ok lemme run that command, sorry was expalining everything before reading lol
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| 07:07 | <alkisg> and tftpd-hpa has issues, so dnsmasq is again better there
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| 07:07 | So after a couple of days of troubleshooting, you'll end up discovering the bugs that I found a couple of years ago, before writing the tutorial :)
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| 07:08 | <huafu> dnsmasq is also dhcp server?
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| 07:08 | <alkisg> Yes, it's automatically configured by ltsp-pnp
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| 07:08 | You only need to set eth1=192.168.67.1 from network-manager
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| 07:08 | ...as the wiki page says
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| 07:08 | <huafu> well the other day I was using isc and it was working, and also I am not used to dnsmasq but isc, that is why
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| 07:09 | ah, and I do not want to use network manager ;-)
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| 07:09 | <alkisg> Sure if you want ltsp not to work, you can not follow the page
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| 07:09 | :)
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| 07:09 | <huafu> alkisg, the last setup with isc was working
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| 07:09 | <alkisg> OK, bug solving is always nice, you can take 1 month to solve all the related bugs upstream and in ubuntu, in launchpad etc
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| 07:09 | Yes
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| 07:10 | tftpd-hpa is not working with ubuntu though, it sometimes doesn't start
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| 07:10 | <huafu> ok if dnsmasq provides the same as isc then I'll switch and learn
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| 07:21 | <alkisg> dnsmasq is lower quality than isc but provides more things for netbooting, like e.g. proxydhcp, tftp, dns...
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| 07:21 | ltsp-config dnsmasq gives you a configured file for your ltsp server
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| 07:22 | There's no ltsp-config isc-dhcp-server, noone cared enough to implement it
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| 07:27 | <huafu> yeah saw that ;-)
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| 07:28 | so I disabled the lines about proxying in the config file, and added a line so that it listen only on eth1, plus gave a correct range of IP, is that ok? (in your config you suppose there is already a dhcp server and I do not have so (at least on the NIC for ltsp)
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| 07:29 | <alkisg> huafu: run ltsp-config --overwrite
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| 07:29 | And set eth1=192.168.67.1
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| 07:29 | That's all
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| 07:29 | Don't improvise
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| 07:29 | ltsp-config dnsmasq --overwrite
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| 07:29 | Your use case is documented in the wiki
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| 07:29 | There's no need to implement it yourself
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| 07:31 | <huafu> I guess I am missunderstanding stuff
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| 07:31 | shouldn't I need a dhcp server?
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| 07:32 | <alkisg> ltsp-config dnsmasq --overwrite configures a dhcp server for you
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| 07:32 | In the 192.168.67.1 subnet
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| 07:32 | You only need to set the eth1 ip to that
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| 07:32 | <huafu> oh ok, thanks
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| 07:40 | alkisg, I have the same issue as before :/
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| 07:40 | and the output of the command you gave me is
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| 07:40 | IP-Config: eth1 hardware address 90:f6:52:03:9b:58 mtu 1500 DHCP RARP
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| 07:41 | only that, then it hang for some time and then exit
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> huafu: run a vnc for me to see:
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| 07:41 | !vnc-dide
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| 07:41 | <ltsp`> vnc-dide: To share your screen with me, run this: sudo apt-get --yes install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect srv1-dide.ioa.sch.gr - this is a reverse connection, it doesn't need port forwarding etc.
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| 07:47 | <xdrazen> hi
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| 07:47 | anybody on?
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| 07:47 | <alkisg> Hello
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| 07:48 | huafu: the vnc is stack, is your internet connection extremely slow or it hanged?
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| 07:48 | huafu: try to go to the root terminal so that I see if it changes
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| 07:48 | <xdrazen> well, i am having some issues...
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| 07:48 | service isc-dhcp-server restart
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| 07:48 | it shows "failed"
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> Use dnsmasq :)
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| 07:49 | <xdrazen> had better with that?
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> xdrazen: weren't you going to use the ltsp-pnp page?
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| 07:50 | I thought that the last time you were going to try with ubuntu 12.04 + ltsp -pnp..
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| 07:50 | <xdrazen> i was going to... bur i downloaded "ubuntu 12.04.5" just today
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| 07:50 | <alkisg> We said 12.04.1
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| 07:50 | <alkisg> Because of your s3 virge cards
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| 07:50 | <xdrazen> :facepalm:
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| 07:50 | yes yes! i forgotted that
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| 07:51 | <alkisg> There's irclogs.ltsp.org if you want to remember the conversation
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| 07:51 | <xdrazen> well, i messed that. i will must to download the ubuntu 12.04.1 again
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| 07:51 | <alkisg> You can install with 12.04.5 and then downgrade
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| 07:51 | If your internet is expensive
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| 07:52 | You'll need help to downgrade though, it's a bit harder then upgrades
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| 07:52 | <xdrazen> alkisg
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| 07:52 | i really need your "council" i am not sure about what word is
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| 07:52 | <alkisg> advice, ok
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| 07:52 | <xdrazen> kinda a suggestion
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| 07:52 | <alkisg> You now have wheezy?
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| 07:52 | Or ubuntu?
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| 07:53 | Anyway ok go on, ask what you want...
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| 07:53 | <xdrazen> NOW NOW, i am with wheezy
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| 07:53 | but i wanna ask you
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| 07:54 | what could be the best way for do this. The server is a fx-8350 with its gigabit interface, the switch is a gigabit now
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| 07:54 | huafu has joined IRC (huafu!~huafu@node-jni.pool-1-2.dynamic.totbb.net) | |
| 07:54 | <xdrazen> i have 8 pentium pro clients and 1 pentium 2
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| 07:55 | most of pentium pro has a scsi hdd
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| 07:55 | <alkisg> xdrazen: we talked about it 3 days ago, and I adviced you to install 12.04.1
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| 07:56 | My opinion hasn't changed
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| 07:56 | <xdrazen> thanks a lot. that is what i will do
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| 07:56 | <alkisg> huafu: this is the vnc command:
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| 07:57 | <alkisg> !vnc-dide
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| 07:57 | <ltsp`> vnc-dide: To share your screen with me, run this: sudo apt-get --yes install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect srv1-dide.ioa.sch.gr - this is a reverse connection, it doesn't need port forwarding etc.
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| 07:59 | <xdrazen> what is the difference between ubuntu 12.04.5 and 12.04.1? the linux kernel?
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| 07:59 | <alkisg> linux kernel and xorg version
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| 08:00 | You need the older xorg
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| 08:00 | You can install with 12.04.5 and downgrade
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| 08:00 | <xdrazen> must i downgrade the linux kernel or the xorg?
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| 08:01 | <alkisg> huafu: you don't have 192.168.67.1
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| 08:01 | We have code for automatic NAT on that subnet
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| 08:01 | Is there any reason why you want not to try the default setup?
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| 08:02 | <huafu> I have another network in another room with the same 67, I just don't want to confuse myself
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| 08:03 | is it possible for me to change later back to 42?
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| 08:03 | <alkisg> huafu: and that point, the real client gets an ip and the VM doesn't?
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| 08:04 | <huafu> the real client (does not get an ip, it is stuck on trying to get one on the pxe boot)
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| 08:04 | <alkisg> xdrazen: mainly xorg
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| 08:05 | huafu: what's the output of ipconfig on the server now/
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| 08:05 | ?
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| 08:05 | <huafu> it sounds like the server (vn guest) is giving one, but it looks like the packet or whatever isn't going back to the real client
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| 08:05 | server, ie the host?
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| 08:05 | <alkisg> yes
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| 08:05 | <alkisg> sorry, I should have said host, with 2 servers now it's confusing
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| 08:06 | <huafu> confusing for me too, can I paste here?
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| 08:06 | <alkisg> Sure
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| 08:06 | <huafu> eth0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr d0:50:99:71:3f:3a
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| 08:06 | inet addr:192.168.1.2 Bcast:192.168.1.255 Mask:255.255.255.0
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| 08:06 | inet6 addr: fe80::d250:99ff:fe71:3f3a/64 Scope:Link
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| 08:06 | UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
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| 08:06 | RX packets:1334554 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
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| 08:06 | TX packets:820885 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
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| 08:06 | collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
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| 08:06 | RX bytes:1613797760 (1.6 GB) TX bytes:77066420 (77.0 MB)
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| 08:06 | Interrupt:20 Memory:efe00000-efe20000
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| 08:06 | eth1 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr 90:f6:52:03:9b:58
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| 08:06 | UP BROADCAST MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
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| 08:06 | RX packets:33 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
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| 08:06 | <alkisg> Not that
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| 08:06 | <huafu> TX packets:12230 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
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| 08:07 | collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
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| 08:07 | RX bytes:19470 (19.4 KB) TX bytes:2361242 (2.3 MB)
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| 08:07 | <alkisg> The ipconfig -n eth0 command
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| 08:07 | *eth1
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| 08:07 | <huafu> oops
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| 08:07 | iPconfig?
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| 08:08 | the host is ubuntu server, guest (ltsp server) is ubuntu client
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| 08:08 | <alkisg> (09:03:48 πμ) alkisg: Run this from your host: sudo /usr/lib/klibc/bin/ipconfig -n eth1
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| 08:09 | <xdrazen> btw... i wonder, if i use the edubuntu 14.04.3 and downgrade the xorg. Could it work?
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| 08:09 | <alkisg> xdrazen: no, it can't be installed to 14.04
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| 08:09 | <huafu> alkisg, IP-Config: eth1 hardware address 90:f6:52:03:9b:58 mtu 1500 DHCP RARP
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| 08:09 | and then it hand
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| 08:09 | hangs
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| 08:09 | <alkisg> xdrazen: You can put newer graphics cards to your clients if you have. Or you can work with them as vesa, they'll be slower though
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| 08:10 | huafu: I don't see a request in the logs, but maybe it's because it's the same nic
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| 08:10 | <xdrazen> i got some issues with vesa, the monitors were kinda strange, like a high frequency
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| 08:10 | <alkisg> xdrazen: Do you have a standalone ubuntu client, or live cd, to run that ipconfig command from?
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| 08:10 | xdrazen: then just install 12.04, why do you resist so much?
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| 08:11 | xdrazen: Do you have a standalone ubuntu client, or live cd, to run that ipconfig command from? ==> this was for huafu, sorry
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| 08:11 | <xdrazen> ¨
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| 08:11 | **:)
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| 08:12 | <huafu> alkisg, I have a mac I could do
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| 08:14 | <xdrazen> well, this is pretty hard, it was not that i was "resisting"
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| 08:14 | <huafu> alkisg, actually, I can't find my adapter to plug on the LAN, lemme try to find a machinw which would boot on usb
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| 08:15 | <alkisg> xdrazen: it takes 1 hour to install ltsp-pnp, and you said you'd do it 3 days ago. Since then you installed, removed, installed wheezy, now you're asking the same questions again... it's a bit tiresome :)
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| 08:15 | <xdrazen> i readed the wiki of ubuntu pnp
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| 08:16 | **(not sure, i guess that is "have read")
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| 08:16 | <alkisg> The questions you ask now about the kernel and xorg, we talked about them 3 days ago again
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| 08:16 | You're asking the same questions now again
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| 08:16 | The advice you asked, I gave it to you 3 days ago
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| 08:16 | The specs, I asked for them 3 days ago and we talked about them
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| 08:17 | Anyway, just go on with the installation and ask if you have any issues following the page
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| 08:20 | <xdrazen> thanks for be so patient. Right now, i will read the 3 days ago chat.
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| 08:21 | <alkisg> Instead of reading, I advice that you install by following the page
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| 08:22 | <xdrazen> http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/12.04.1/ubuntu-12.04.1-desktop-i386.iso
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| 08:22 | this one i should download?
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| 08:22 | http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/12.04.1/ubuntu-12.04.1-alternate-i386.iso
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| 08:23 | or better that one'
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| 08:23 | <alkisg> Which 12.05.1 .iso did you download?
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| 08:24 | <xdrazen> none of them. I got the mistake of download the 12.04.5 desktop i386
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| 08:24 | then i will download the other one
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| 08:25 | then, what is better? the desktop or the alternate?
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| 08:25 | <alkisg> Sorry I mistyped, I meant "which 12.04.5 .iso did you download"
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| 08:25 | <huafu> alkisg, ok found one lol, noe the command is running on it
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| 08:25 | <alkisg> Install with the 12.04.5 iso that you already have
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| 08:25 | huafu: I closed the vnc window, can you open it again?
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| 08:25 | <huafu> sure
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| 08:26 | <alkisg> xdrazen: so, start with installing 12.04.5-desktop.iso
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| 08:26 | <xdrazen> ok
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| 08:26 | i am on it
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| 08:29 | well, i will need further instructions. Eventually i could mess the internet (huawei e303 modem) wich was pretty funny to install
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| 08:29 | <alkisg> huafu: maybe the promiscuus mode isn't working good enough for you. Can you temporarily try to change the bridged network to the internal network? I.e. with eth1=internal, and a vm client?
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| 08:30 | <xdrazen> once installled the ubuntu 12.04.5 then should i "downgrade" the xorg?
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| 08:30 | <huafu> alkisg, ok
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| 08:30 | <alkisg> xdrazen: where will you be installing 12.04.5? in the pc what you are in irc now?
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| 08:31 | <xdrazen> 9
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| 08:31 | actua,
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| 08:31 | **actually, yes, for "try"
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| 08:32 | or i had better to have the fx 8350 server instead?=
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| 08:32 | <alkisg> And now there you have wheezy and you have the modem installed?
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| 08:32 | Whatever is easier for you
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| 08:34 | <xdrazen> i have the wheezy and the modem installed in the e1 laptop.
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| 08:34 | <alkisg> Then install ubuntu on the 8350 server
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| 08:37 | <xdrazen> ok. Then. once installed the 12.04.5 the next step will be downgrade the xorg?
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| 08:39 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 08:40 | sudo apt-get install --purge xserver-xorg xorg
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| 08:46 | <huafu> alkisg, so with the int network and another vm as the client I can't copy the output of the command but it seems to work, I see the pxe boot folder etc.., and the command actually does not hang
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| 08:47 | <alkisg> huafu: then it's a problem with the promiscuus mode of vbox, try asking in #vbox
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| 08:47 | <huafu> so I think it is a bug (?) with the promiscuous mode of vbox :/
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| 08:47 | haha
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| 08:47 | ok thanks
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| 08:53 | <xdrazen> then. I am on
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| 08:54 | searching how to downgrade the xorg. When xorg would be downgraded, then
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| 08:54 | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 08:58 | <alkisg> xdrazen: I wrote the command for you above, read it
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| 08:58 | (10:37:51 πμ) xdrazen: ok. Then. once installed the 12.04.5 the next step will be downgrade the xorg?
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| 08:58 | (10:39:38 πμ) alkisg: Yes
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| 08:58 | (10:40:22 πμ) alkisg: sudo apt-get install --purge xserver-xorg xorg
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| 09:00 | <xdrazen> well. I am on it. I will be back here if any issue appears
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| 09:01 | 1 install 12.04.5 2 downgrade xorg 3 https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 09:01 | <huafu> alkisg, waiting for an answer from there (#vbox) I am going to try the virtio-net adapter of vbox
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| 09:13 | <huafu> alkisg, same issue, maybe I can put the dhcp server on the host as well as nat rule (I meant, I will need one then) and use the proxy config of dnsmasq?
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| 09:13 | ...in the guest
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| 09:13 | <alkisg> huafu: you don't need a proxy if you have a real dhcp
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| 09:14 | Just set up dhcp on the host so that it points to the VM
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| 09:14 | <huafu> alkisg, point to the VM?
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| 09:15 | <alkisg> next-server==ip of VM
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| 09:15 | DHCP on the host, TFTP on the VM
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| 09:15 | You don't need proxydhcp at all
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| 09:15 | <huafu> alkisg, ok thanks
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| 09:15 | alkisg, yeah that is what I want to do about dhcp on server and tftp on guest
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| 09:15 | arg, s/server/host
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| 09:16 | alkisg, should I still use dnsmaq instead of isc on the host? or does it then doesn't matter?
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| 09:17 | <alkisg> The host doesn't have anything related to ltsp, right?
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| 09:18 | <xdrazen> well, it is time for sleep 1 hour
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| 09:18 | as i told. I will do the things that i said before
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| 09:18 | <alkisg> xdrazen: good night!
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| 09:18 | <huafu> alkisg, nope, will just have the dhcp server now
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| 09:19 | the host is very very basic, I wanted to keep it free of cpu use and mem use, I'll even disable x from starting at boot later when all good
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| 09:19 | <alkisg> Then sure use whatever you want, ltsp-config won't help you if you don't have it installed there
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| 09:20 | Why do you need a host + vm?
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| 09:20 | Why not just install the ltsp server in the host/
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| 09:20 | ?
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| 09:21 | <huafu> alkisg, I want to have a host clean, where I do not install anything, and on it have one ltsp server, maybe play with another one later which i could put in cluster (and later with a real machine), also another being the same but with windows instead of linux (but yeah, all those for later)
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| 09:21 | alkisg, also the goal is to easily rollback the crap I do, play with different config and backup them, etc..
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| 09:22 | alkisg, "why not install on the host", well I really want to keep the host as light as possible, with minimal services
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| 09:22 | <alkisg> The lightest way is to have 1 host instead of 1 host and 1 vm
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| 09:23 | It saves ram, cpu etc
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| 09:23 | But if you want to do experiments and not production deployment, then sure vbox is fine
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| 09:26 | <huafu> alkisg, yes I know it'll be lighter with one host and no vm system, but yeah I need to experiment and also have some kinda staging setup on VMs which I can later move "easily" on real new machines when I can buy them :D
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| 09:27 | * alkisg is using his real system for experiments and has VMs for templates | |
| 09:28 | <alkisg> To test the VM servers, I'm using internal networking
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| 09:28 | <huafu> alkisg, I have only one server, once I'll open the cyber, it'll not be ok to fuck up that system lol
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| 09:28 | alkisg, so in the guest then I have to set eth1 to dhcp right?
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| 09:29 | <alkisg> No, set up a static ip
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| 09:30 | Also if you want to be able to ship template servers, use network manager, it's easier for the users to see the network settings, the speed, if the cable is disconnected etc from the indicator in the tray
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| 09:32 | <huafu> alkisg, I don't want the user to change anything or see anything lol, also I could change to managed=true in the [ifdown] section of NetworkManager.conf
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| 09:33 | alkisg, can't I setup it to dhcp and assign the vm a static lease thru the host isc config?
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| 09:33 | <alkisg> sure
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| 09:33 | <huafu> alkisg, or it MUST be static for some reason?
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| 09:33 | ok thx
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| 09:33 | <alkisg> no
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| 09:50 | <alkisg> !syslog
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| 09:50 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'syslog', but I do know about these similar topics: 'rsyslog'
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| 09:50 | <alkisg> !rsyslog
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| 09:50 | <ltsp`> rsyslog: To enable remote client logging in Ubuntu (it possibly also works on Debian), see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/697387/comments/9
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| 09:57 | <huafu_> alkisg, sorry my irc client crashes I suppose
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| 09:58 | <alkisg> No worries
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| 10:27 | <huafu_> alkisg, it looks like the promiscuous mode or something makes it fail the same the other way around, can't get an ip from the host on the guest, I see the dhcp request but the guest is not taking any ip
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| 10:27 | <alkisg> huafu_: I thought you now had a real host and a real client?
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| 10:28 | And the vm is the ltsp server?
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| 10:28 | <huafu_> yup
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| 10:28 | <alkisg> So where is the promiscuous mode involved now? No VMs...
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| 10:28 | <huafu_> I think it doesn't like that the dhcp server and client are on the same real NIC
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| 10:28 | alkisg, well I do not know what is wrong, but i can't get an ip with dhcp on the vm. I'll fix it
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| 10:29 | <alkisg> Aaah you mean the dhcp request for the ltsp server, not for the ltsp client
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| 10:29 | Yes it's quite possible that dhcp broadcasts don't show up on the same nic
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| 10:30 | <huafu_> alkisg, I have to set address, netmask and gateway right? no more?
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| 10:31 | <alkisg> For a static ip? yup
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| 10:32 | <huafu_> alkisg, oh man I can't ping anything :/
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| 10:32 | I chose .254 for host, .253 for vm
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| 10:33 | <alkisg> !acceler
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| 10:33 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'acceler', but I do know about these similar topics: 'bypass_acceleration'
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| 10:33 | <alkisg> !bypass_acceleration
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| 10:33 | <ltsp`> bypass_acceleration: to bypass hardware acceleration (LP #1251281): RCFILE_01="ln -sf /bin/true /usr/lib/gnome-session/gnome-session-check-accelerated"
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| 10:34 | <huafu> alkisg, is that for me?
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| 10:34 | <alkisg> No no ignore it
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| 10:37 | <huafu> alkisg, I can't even ping the host from the VM, and I have weird routes
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| 10:37 | <alkisg> huafu: for vbox issues, you should be asking in #vbox
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| 10:37 | When you reach ltsp issues, ask here
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| 10:38 | <huafu> yeah sure, thanks
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| 12:03 | <huafu> work_alkisg, I ended up upgrading to latest vbox 5 instead of 4, but still same issue, then I fucked up my host lol, I am finally back
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| 12:04 | I can ping the host from the guest on the same NIC at least now
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| 12:04 | I am trying to fix internet as I do not have internet in the guest
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| 12:15 | <huafu> work_alkisg, ok I give up, I think I am going to forget about vbox, will try to findout if I can snapshot quickly a whole system
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| 12:15 | laterz!
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| 14:25 | <huafu> work_alkisg, I've got my setup working, and fast ;-)
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| 14:25 | work_alkisg, one issue I am working on is the NAT not working as epxected :/
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| 14:25 | anyway, thanks for all the huge help lately
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| 14:36 | work_alkisg, also having issues on using 2 languages, sounds like you can only see and use the language defined system wide, impossible to change, and also impossible to type the password of a user in a console after login :/
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| 14:51 | work_alkisg, also you talked about caching the kernel on the clients which have some disk, is that "easy", can't find any tuto on the web
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| 15:01 | <alkisg> huafu: see this
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| 15:01 | !local-boot
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| 15:01 | <ltsp`> local-boot: If you want LTSP fat clients on a low-speed network, you can put i386.img on e.g. C:\Boot\LTSP\i386.img and use this command line in pxelinux.cfg: APPEND ro initrd=ltsp/i386/initrd.img init=/sbin/init-ltsp root=/dev/sda1 rootflags=ro loop=/Boot/LTSP/i386.img; IPAPPEND 3
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| 15:01 | <alkisg> That's about it, no tutorials needed
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| 15:02 | About using a different language, yup it's possible, I don't know what issue you have there
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| 15:06 | <huafu> alkisg, thanks - I've fixed the nat already
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| 15:07 | for languages, I need to have thai as first main language, but still have the ability to change the input method and change the language to english
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| 15:08 | I tried many configuration, setting the locale in lts.conf, changing it before loging in, after (this is not even possible), but it all ends up in NOT changing anything, and the language to remain in the main (/etc/default/locale) language
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| 15:08 | <alkisg> Are you using ltsp-pnp or plain chroot?
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| 15:08 | <huafu> I did install all lang packs, installed all `check-language-support`, etc...
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| 15:09 | pnp
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| 15:09 | <alkisg> thin clients or fat?
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| 15:09 | <huafu> I striclty followed pnp this time, except again for the IP range
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| 15:09 | fat clients
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| 15:09 | <alkisg> what's the output of env | grep ^L, on the server (where things work) and on a client?
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| 15:10 | <huafu> I yet did not test in thin, but I do remember last time I had some issues with the language too, and switching to non pnp and including all required packages in the chroot fixewd it, but well, not sure I hadn't other issues with the pnp as it could be the case now
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| 15:10 | <alkisg> LTSP_FATCLIENT=False gives you thin
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| 15:10 | You don't need another chroot
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| 15:11 | <huafu> I am not doing any chroot since I am in pnp mode, but I'll need a chroot because my thin clients are raspberries (another arch)
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| 15:11 | but well, thin/fat isn't the issue here, my issue is with first fat client tested (for now :D)
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| 15:11 | where can I put the output of this command? it's kinda big
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| 15:13 | <alkisg> paste.debian.net
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| 15:13 | or just omit the variables that are not related to lang, lc_all etc
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| 15:14 | <huafu> alkisg, I used pastebin, dunno why I did not think about it earlier
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| 15:14 | http://pastebin.com/57hha1Tk
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| 15:14 | weird it does not fully match /etc/default/locale
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| 15:14 | <alkisg> You have half thai settings and half english
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| 15:15 | Usually setting LANG and LANGUAGE are enough, the rest are not needed
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| 15:15 | If you manually set them, then you should be setting all of them, not half
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| 15:15 | Where are you setting all these from? .profile?
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| 15:15 | Finally... don't login graphically as root :)
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| 15:16 | <huafu> no, I just set in /etc/default/locale - ah, and then to try to fix in VMs I changed in the gnome settings and "apply system wide"
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| 15:16 | the one I gave you is root on the server only
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| 15:17 | <alkisg> The normal way is:
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| 15:17 | 1) install ubuntu with the locale you want
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| 15:17 | 2) set LANG in lts.conf or select a language in LDM
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| 15:17 | (2 == to override the system defaults)
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| 15:18 | 3) Don't use the ubuntu or gnome ways to set the locale, they're broken :D
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| 15:18 | <huafu> ah ok, so how I can reset the 3?
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| 15:18 | <alkisg> xorg was working fine for ages and then gnome and ubuntu decided to break everything in 10 different ways
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| 15:18 | <huafu> haha
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| 15:18 | <alkisg> $ cat /etc/default/locale
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| 15:18 | LANG="el_GR.UTF-8"
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| 15:18 | That's all that should go there
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| 15:19 | $ cat /etc/environment
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| 15:19 | PATH="/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/games:/usr/local/games"
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| 15:19 | <huafu> oh, and what about l10n?
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| 15:19 | <alkisg> And that's environment in case you changed it
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| 15:19 | <huafu> no I did not change env
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| 15:19 | <alkisg> l10n? you've installed language-packs, didn't you?
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| 15:19 | By setting LANG, you get the locale you want
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| 15:20 | <huafu> I meant, I need enmglish langauge, thai setup for currency, and european dates (not *** american dates with the month before the day)
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| 15:20 | <alkisg> Then do set LC_MONETARY and whatever else you want to be static
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| 15:21 | <huafu> because thai dates are... in thai :D and I yet did not finish to learn the whole alphabet consisting of 44 consonents and 33 voewls :D
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| 15:21 | <alkisg> Don't set LC_ALL though if you don't want it to apply for everything
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| 15:21 | <huafu> ok
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| 15:21 | thanks will try that
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| 15:21 | <alkisg> Woah, thai children must start talking after 5 years old with all those letters... :D
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| 15:22 | man locale ==> gives you the variables involved
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| 15:22 | <huafu> alkisg, you meant writing, well actually not, but they learn faster than me
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| 15:22 | <alkisg> No I meant speaking, with so many different letters it must be difficult
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| 15:23 | <huafu> alkisg, sorry, so I can set en_US.UTF-8 in /etc/default/locale, and then change the LANG in lts.conf so that ltsp client would be in thai by default, but able to change it?
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| 15:23 | <alkisg> Greek vowels are very few and easy, I had a hard time learning the english ones with all the subtle variations
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| 15:23 | Yup
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| 15:23 | Set LANG and LC_MONETARY etc there, in default/locale
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| 15:23 | But not LANGUAGE or LC_ALL
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| 15:24 | <huafu> alkisg, speaking is hard, they have 2 syllable lengh and 5 tones! I can speak but I am still beginner to intermediate - I guess when you are a children under 2yo you could learn even assembly if your parents where talking with it lol
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| 15:24 | <alkisg> Haha, that's true :)
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| 15:25 | <huafu> :p ok setting up as you told me now ;-)
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| 15:25 | btw, where does gnome put some crap when I changed the language of my session, so that i can revert that?
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| 15:27 | <alkisg> in 10 different places :(
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| 15:27 | accountsettings, .dmrc, gsettings...
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| 15:27 | <huafu> ok will search on google
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| 15:27 | :/
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| 15:28 | rm -rf .gnome .gnome2 .gconf .gconfd .metacity .cache .dbus .dmrc .mission-control .thumbnails ~/.config/dconf/user ~.compiz*
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| 15:28 | :D
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| 15:29 | <alkisg> Haha, you forgot accountsettings in /var/lib/AccountSettings/user :)
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| 15:29 | and dconf is in .local (or in .config, don't remember)
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| 15:32 | <huafu> alkisg, also my alt+tab does NOT work, but taht since the beginning and I think I can look on google myself :p
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| 15:32 | omg it is everywhere
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| 15:33 | ok logout/login, ttys
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| 15:35 | <huafu> alkisg, back
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| 15:35 | I have a question about the --cleanup, not getting exactly what it is doing (from reading the doc)
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| 15:35 | (ltsp-update-image --cleanup /)
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| 15:35 | <alkisg> The /opt/ltsp/images/i386.img contains a copy of your server disk
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| 15:36 | You don't want your password there exposed to the network via nbd, do you?
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| 15:36 | cleanup removes the passwords, users, ssh keys etc before the compression
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| 15:36 | <huafu> alkisg, sorry, a question about this too, it is a copy of the ENTIRE server disk, or just some part of it?
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| 15:36 | ah cool! thanks
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| 15:36 | <alkisg> cat /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-images.excludes
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| 15:36 | Those are things that are excluded
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| 15:37 | <huafu> ah nice, last time I looked it had like 2 lines in there
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| 15:38 | <alkisg> I don't think I"ve ever shipped that file with 2 lines
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| 15:39 | <huafu> maybe I remember of another file, or maybe I fucked it up before :D
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| 15:39 | hmmm.. still getting some very weird LC, now even with some values I never ever set anywhere :/
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| 15:40 | <alkisg> you can't easily reset accountservice settings by just deleting files
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| 15:40 | try rebooting and logging it with a guest user first, to verify that you've correctly set the system defaults
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| 15:41 | <huafu> ok, I'll go to runlevel 3 and cleanup crap right?
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| 15:41 | ok
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| 15:45 | <huafu_> alkisg: I can't even login into the guest session lol
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| 15:45 | I am now on another computer so that I can keep IRC open
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| 15:45 | but yeah, the guest session shows the background, period
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| 15:45 | <alkisg> Maybe you have a syntax error in one of the config files
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| 15:45 | reformat :)
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| 15:45 | :D :P
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| 15:46 | See, you need the VM in your primary system, to revert the changes :D
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| 15:46 | <huafu_> actually it's exactly what it showed me when I tried to login to my user from the ltsp client
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| 15:47 | ah no man I can't reformat seriousely, last time was because I needed to move from a server amd64 distro to a desktop i386
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| 15:47 | I reformat so many times lately that I feel like using windows
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| 15:47 | well, just 3 times, but each was because of a distro change
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| 15:48 | now I am on the basic ubuntu desktop i386 and I want to fix this
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| 15:48 | I guess I can delete my user account :/
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| 15:48 | ah no rrr
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| 15:48 | it's not about it
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| 15:48 | <alkisg> if guest can't login, you have system-wide issues
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| 15:48 | guest is a clean account each time
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| 15:49 | Check the files you've changed in /etc
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| 15:49 | <huafu_> no no I don't want to have a system wide issue on a system I installed some hours ago lol
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| 15:49 | <alkisg> sh -n file => tells you about syntax errors
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| 15:49 | <huafu_> ah good to know about that last one
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| 15:49 | but I changed only /etc/default/locale
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| 15:50 | anyway, lemme check
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| 15:51 | hahah can't even log in to my session, ok ctrl-alt-f1
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| 16:04 | apt-get install --reinstall --purge --clean --repair --fix-everything --please-fix-it *
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| 16:26 | <m3741> good {morning,afternoon,evening} chan. i'm having trouble with usb hard drives on thin clients. it seems to mount them with some strange permissions and makes them read-only
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| 16:28 | <m3741> i'm sure this is also partially related, but clients also can't eject the drive. it gives the good ol 'not in the fstab (and you are not root)
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| 16:29 | <alkisg> are you using thin clients or fat clients?
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| 16:40 | <m3741> thin clients
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| 16:40 | running lxde
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| 16:41 | <alkisg> thin clients are using ltspfs, they're not mounting usb devices normally
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| 16:41 | you can just unplug the devices after 2 seconds of inactivity
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| 16:41 | if your clients have enough cpu/ram, you can make them ltsp fat clients instead.
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| 16:41 | <m3741> ah, ok
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| 16:43 | how does ltspfs handle permissions?
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| 16:43 | <alkisg> what file system does the usb stick have? fat or ext?
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| 16:45 | <m3741> i have one drive that has two partition on it, one exfat, one ext4. another is ntfs
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| 16:46 | <alkisg> can linux write to exfat?
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| 16:46 | or read it?
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| 16:47 | <m3741> my ubuntu 14.04 x64 desktop seems to do ok.
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| 16:47 | <alkisg> Try with simpler things first, does it read/write to e.g. a fat or ext4 stick that only has 1 partition?
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| 18:10 | <huafu_> alkisg: ok now I have xubuntu, I learnt how to use LVM (well basicly, just to be able to do partitions and snapshots) and so I have a snapshot of my root partition. Now I can start playing and I can revert quickly to a clean install, without a VM :D
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| 18:11 | following your pnp tuto now, again... :D
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| 18:11 | (I saved my etc anyway)
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| 18:58 | <huafu> alkisg, if I change the lts.conf, do I need to ltsp-update-image?
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| 18:58 | I am asking because this file is in tftp root so I think I do not need, but a confirmation would be nice, looking at the time it takes to create an image even not compressed
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| 19:02 | <vagrantc> huafu: if you're using lts.conf in a tftp directory, you don't need to re-run ltsp-update-image.
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| 19:03 | <huafu> vagrantc, thanks, that also if my lts.conf is in tftp root BUT symlinked from another path out of tftp?
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| 19:04 | :/ ok answering myself, yes I am stupid haha
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| 19:18 | <huafu> where should I configure specific graphic drivers and configuration for each client, knowing that I am using a pnp ltsp server?
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| 19:19 | <vagrantc> huafu: it depends on your tftp server and config weather it supports symlinks
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| 19:19 | huafu: it should autodetect the appropriate drivers
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| 19:19 | huafu: and there are lts.conf settings if it doesn't
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| 19:19 | !lts.conf
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| 19:19 | <ltsp`> lts.conf: (#1) http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf, or (#2) lts.conf manpage is available in the ltsp-docs package
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| 19:20 | <huafu> vagrantc, thanks again - for the drivers, I am asking because I have very bad and buggy graphics on one of my fat client (card is 82865G)
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| 19:20 | ok, will look again in lts, thanks
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| 19:20 | <vagrantc> intel?
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| 19:21 | <huafu> yup sorry
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| 19:23 | <vagrantc> if it doesn't autodetect correctly ... it gets complicated fast
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| 19:23 | <huafu> vagrantc, VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82865G Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 02)
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| 19:23 | <vagrantc> sometimes there are simple workarounds...
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| 19:24 | depends on exactly what you need to change
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| 19:24 | <huafu> vagrantc, I do have graphics, but sounds like 16 bit colors or less
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| 19:24 | vagrantc, I do not want to change anything, just do the right thing so that it display things correctly
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| 19:24 | <vagrantc> on a fat client, or thin client?
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| 19:24 | <huafu> fat
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| 19:25 | <vagrantc> you could try forcing X_COLOR_DEPTH=24 for that client
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| 19:25 | <huafu> it's not only the colors, lemme show you
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| 19:26 | <vagrantc> it's probaly got issues with kerenl mode setting ... those are a pain to debug
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| 19:26 | huafu: what distro?
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| 19:27 | and version
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| 19:27 | <huafu> xubuntu 14.04.3
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| 19:27 | i386
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| 19:28 | <vagrantc> i seem to recall they were fixed in debian ... should be fixed in ubuntu 14.04 ... if not, it may be really challenging to get working
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| 19:29 | <huafu> :/
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| 19:29 | where should I look? do you have any link which could help?
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| 19:29 | <vagrantc> it's been so long since i messed with those issues
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| 19:29 | you could try an older version of ubuntu for those clients
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| 19:29 | or debian, etc...
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| 19:29 | <alkisg> post your xorg.7.log to pastebin
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| 19:30 | <vagrantc> or invoke alkisg
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| 19:30 | <alkisg> Haha
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| 19:30 | <huafu> thanks ;)
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| 19:31 | hu, cant get it full
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| 19:31 | <alkisg> (from the client, /var/log/Xorg.7.log)
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| 19:31 | scp
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| 19:31 | or open firefox from the client
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| 19:31 | <huafu> ah yeah, sorry it's 2.30am here, can't even think straight lol
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| 19:31 | <alkisg> or install pastebinit
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| 19:36 | <huafu> alkisg, http://paste.ubuntu.com/14011541/
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| 19:37 | <alkisg> [ 34.590] (==) intel(0): Depth 24, (--) framebuffer bpp 32
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| 19:37 | <huafu> lemme screenshot
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| 19:37 | <alkisg> if you use print screen, do you see the corruption or bad colors that you say?
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| 19:37 | or does it only appear with photos?
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| 19:38 | !sna
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| 19:38 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'sna', but I do know about these similar topics: 'sis', 's'
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| 19:38 | <alkisg> !exa
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| 19:38 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'exa', but I do know about these similar topics: 'lts.conf-example'
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| 19:38 | <Hyperbyte> Can I try?
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| 19:38 | !tqm
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| 19:38 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'tqm', but I do know about these similar topics: 'tag'
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| 19:38 | <Hyperbyte> Damn.
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| 19:38 | !vra
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| 19:38 | <ltsp`> I do not know about 'vra', but I do know about these similar topics: 'ver', 'vga', 'v'
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| 19:39 | <alkisg> !Hyperbyte
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| 19:39 | <ltsp`> Hyperbyte: We all thank our super duper webadmin for his contributions... er, also, reminder: make the irclogs.ltsp.org banner scrollable to save screen estate for mobile phones :D
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| 19:39 | <Hyperbyte> :-/
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| 19:39 | Ok, your turn again to spin.
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| 19:39 | That is soooo old, I made it scrollable years ago.
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| 19:39 | <alkisg> ...we need something better for that factoid :D
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| 19:39 | <Hyperbyte> !alkisg
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| 19:39 | <ltsp`> alkisg: The LTSP oracle. Our beacon of hope in the world of LTSP. With the guidance of this divine emperor, we shall prevail.
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| 19:39 | <Hyperbyte> Still accurate.
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| 19:39 | <alkisg> !accelmethod
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| 19:39 | <ltsp`> Error: "accelmethod" is not a valid command.
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| 19:40 | <alkisg> !noaccel
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| 19:40 | <ltsp`> noaccel: Some graphics cards, e.g. SiS [1039:6325] on 14.04, require this setting in lts.conf: X_OPTION_01="\"NoAccel\""
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| 19:40 | <huafu> ok the graphic card is ok
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| 19:40 | I am too tired
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| 19:40 | <alkisg> It's the monitor?
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| 19:40 | <huafu> but... is it xubuntu having a dirty background with some black in the middle as a joke?
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| 19:41 | <alkisg> Hahaha
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| 19:41 | <huafu> nope, everything is fine except the background, which I did not change and on the server it looks ok
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| 19:41 | <alkisg> It's possible that the first background is painted wrong
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| 19:41 | <huafu> alkisg, it's possible to fix that possibility? :D
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| 19:41 | <Hyperbyte> huafu, possibly.
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| 19:41 | <huafu> :D
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| 19:42 | <alkisg> Haha
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| 19:42 | if you logout/login again, does it work on the second (or third) try?
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| 19:42 | <huafu> I'll try now
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| 19:49 | ok just the second login did work
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| 19:50 | alkisg, btw I have to find a way to limit my users to <=480 youtube videos, as well as using more bandwidth, it is slowing down the clients (fat) because.... they are old machines
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| 19:51 | alkisg, ah, I had one question for you ltsp guru, would I gain in performances (after the client has logged in) if I do cache the kernel on the hdd of the fat clients?
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| 19:51 | <alkisg> Issues like this are not related to ltsp, but do also try chromium-browser and/or google-chrome, those have a much newer flash version which performs better
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| 19:52 | Do you have gigabit now?
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| 19:53 | <huafu> alkisg, no, I do not even had money to pay my internet lol, I am still awaiting for my salary lol
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| 19:53 | <alkisg> About the background issue, I think LDM does something wicked with the background and breaks the DE background on some cases
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| 19:53 | Then it will make it faster, yes
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| 19:53 | E.g. launching libreoffice needs 120 MB of bandwidth
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| 19:54 | That's 12 seconds for 100 mbps for a single client
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| 19:54 | <huafu> but caching the kernel will not include libreoffice
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| 19:54 | <alkisg> Or 120 seconds for 10 clients
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| 19:54 | <huafu> or does it?
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| 19:54 | <alkisg> I thought you meant this:
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| 19:54 | !local-boot
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| 19:54 | <ltsp`> local-boot: If you want LTSP fat clients on a low-speed network, you can put i386.img on e.g. C:\Boot\LTSP\i386.img and use this command line in pxelinux.cfg: APPEND ro initrd=ltsp/i386/initrd.img init=/sbin/init-ltsp root=/dev/sda1 rootflags=ro loop=/Boot/LTSP/i386.img; IPAPPEND 3
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| 19:54 | <alkisg> The one you were asking about before
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| 19:54 | <huafu> oh, I forgot the .img contains the whole disk haha
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| 19:54 | yup I meant that
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| 19:55 | <alkisg> So, 120 MB for a normal disk is usually under 5 secs
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| 19:55 | <huafu> ok so yeah it'll be faster, but once firefox is launched then it doesn't change a thing right?
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| 19:55 | <alkisg> i.e. much better than reading it from the network
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| 19:55 | Well, yes, but...
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| 19:55 | suppose firefox needs to write to home
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| 19:55 | And the other 9 users are just launching firefox or libreoffice
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| 19:56 | <huafu> haha
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| 19:56 | <alkisg> ==> network saturated, firefox can't write to /home fast enough
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| 19:56 | So it helps there too
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| 19:56 | <huafu> and in the case I use local boot, is there a way to automate the update of the local image in case it has changed somehow?
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| 19:57 | <alkisg> You can implement it with a small script, sure
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| 19:57 | Write it as a bounty if you want, maybe someone will sponsor it (I know you can't)
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| 19:57 | !bounties
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| 19:57 | <ltsp`> bounties: You can ask an LTSP developer to implement new features or fix hard bugs by offering a bounty: http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Bounties
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| 19:57 | <alkisg> I think the best way there is to let the user work with the old image, while syncing the new one
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| 19:58 | And it would be nice if we overlayed 2 nbd images, one big one and a small one for .diffs from the previous big one
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| 19:59 | <huafu> yup, syncing while it's running, also improvements can be adding resume and such :D
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| 19:59 | <alkisg> rsync resumes
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| 19:59 | <huafu> wow, that is too much for me to do :) so yeah bounty
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| 20:00 | alkisg, if you come to thailand I offer you a beer, there is no bounty here :D
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| 20:01 | rsync resume ok, but incremental... not something I'll try to do (at least in the near future)
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| 20:01 | anyway, I am first going to do a chroot for my raspberry
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| 20:02 | ah, yeah alkisg I must do a chroot and can't do pnp for RPis right?
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| 20:02 | <alkisg> You can do pnp on an rpi
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| 20:02 | <huafu> oh
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| 20:02 | <alkisg> but ltsp-update-image really sucks on rpis :D
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| 20:02 | Do the chroot method
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| 20:02 | My daughter wanted to come to thailand very much
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| 20:03 | <huafu> well very touritsic area is not very nice, it's not the real thailand, it's the touristic crapy one
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| 20:04 | but you have very nice spots all around big cities or even farer if you like country side
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| 20:04 | <alkisg> Haha OK we'll come there to fix your ltsp setups and you give us a tour of the real thailand :D
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| 20:04 | <huafu> haha sure :p
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| 20:06 | <elias_a> huafu, alkisg: This fake tourist area problem is all over the world.
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| 20:06 | <huafu> elias_a, yeah sure, but here it's really like black and white
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| 20:06 | <elias_a> Also here in Finland very odd things are marketed to tourists.
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| 20:06 | huafu: I know :(
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| 20:07 | <huafu> elias_a, I travelled a lot but yet not go to thailand
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| 20:07 | arg, to finland lol
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| 20:07 | but I know "kipis" tho I am not sure how to write it ;-)
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| 20:08 | <elias_a> huafu: Finland is far away. :) Land's end, really.
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| 20:08 | huafu: Wow. Kippis!
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| 20:08 | <huafu> elias_a, I am from france so it used to be not so far - also I like the cold (yeah wtf am I doing in thailand you can say)
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| 20:09 | I used to know Kippis in greek but can't remember, tho I went to greece lol
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| 20:09 | anyway, ltsp-image-build --arch thailand
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| 20:09 | <elias_a> huafu: Ok. I do understand why ppl move to Thailand. Nice climate is always... nice. ;-)
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| 20:09 | huafu: Take care - stay on the channel!
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| 20:10 | <huafu> elias_a, well, I love the cold, used to have 14 to 16 in my flat in the winter and me topless, here I am burning :D
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| 20:11 | like now it's 3am and it is....28.3C haha
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| 20:12 | <elias_a> huafu: You'd probably better check some of the nordic countries at some point.
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| 20:13 | <huafu> elias_a, well I live with my familly here, moving 3 children still at school and in need of complex visas is not some task I am going to do soon :)
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| 20:14 | elias_a, also I love the people here, the poorer they are, the happiest they are and the more they want to help you
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| 20:29 | alkisg, when you were talking about chrome, I never know what is the one to install, chromion or google-chrome or another one?
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| 20:37 | <alkisg> Chromium-browser is the open source equivalent of google-chrome
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| 20:37 | Try that first if it works OK for you, otherwise google-chrome might have some non-free decoders that will work better
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| 20:37 | flash should be the same though
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| 20:40 | <huafu> I use to have a lot of issues with chromium that is why I am asking
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| 20:41 | <alkisg> I'm using firefox except for a few cases where google-chrome shows videos a bit better
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| 20:46 | <huafu> I am going to do some benchmarks and use the one that runs faster
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| 20:47 | once all is good I will need to do a lot of more work as setting up the template user
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| 20:47 | its menus, etc...
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| 22:20 | <huafu> does anyone knows if a section in lts.conf can have multiple `LIKE=`? and if it can cascade multiple sections, as: [SECTION1] LIKE=SECTION0 ... [SECTION2] LIKE=SECTION1 ...?
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| 22:22 | <vagrantc> experiment to find out :)
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| 22:22 | <huafu> I have very slow machines ;-)
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| 22:23 | <vagrantc> even for a machine that takes 2 minutes to boot, and you have to boot it 5 times, it's probably still fairly quick to test numerous permutations ... especially if you boot multiple machines at the same time
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| 22:26 | <huafu> warren, well I was asking here in case someone had the answer, because it's 5am and it's already hard for me to type, so walk here and there to one and another machine, and also make my stupid brain think about how to implement this test (yes it's easy but not for me right now :p)
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| 22:26 | I guess I'll just test and then copy paste lol
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