IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 21 May 2012 (all times are UTC)
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| 07:17 | <Fuzai> I'm trying to use ssh -X from a thin client session to export a running app back to the session. What is the trick to do this?
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| 07:17 | i'm trying to run gkrellm from my router and have it come up on my thinclient session
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| 07:20 | <alkisg> Can you explain with a bit more detail what you're trying to do?
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| 07:21 | <Fuzai> I use ltsp 5 thin clients in a small office setting and the one on my desk i'm trying to make gkrellm appear thats running on my router through a X11 tunnel
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| 07:23 | <alkisg> Your router is a PC running X-windows?
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| 07:23 | <Fuzai> kinda
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| 07:23 | <alkisg> So, is there anything ltsp-related in your question?
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| 07:23 | <Fuzai> it is a debian linux machine that has gkrellm installed and working
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| 07:23 | <alkisg> (except that you're using a thin client, but does that matter anywhere?)
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| 07:23 | <Fuzai> well yes, ltsp is denying ssh socket that is normally setup with -X
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| 07:24 | normally this works without a hitch, i use it all over the place
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| 07:25 | <alkisg> Which command are you trying? LTSP doesn't have any particular code to deny any connections, it just sets xauthority locally to the thin client
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| 07:25 | So whatever you run from inside the session should just work with X
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| 07:26 | <Fuzai> gkrellm is all
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| 07:26 | <alkisg> So you run: ssh -X router gkrellm ?
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| 07:26 | <Fuzai> basically
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| 07:26 | <alkisg> And what's the error message?
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| 07:26 | <Fuzai> cant open display
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| 07:26 | X11 forwarding request failed on channel 0
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| 07:27 | <alkisg> And you run this from a normal thin client session?
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| 07:27 | <Fuzai> yep
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| 07:27 | <alkisg> What's the output of `echo $DISPLAY` before running the ssh command?
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| 07:27 | <Fuzai> i'll play with it some more
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| 07:27 | <alkisg> LTSP doesn't have any code related to denying connections such as these
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| 07:28 | <Fuzai> well it looks like
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| 07:28 | display is showing the thin clients ip
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| 07:28 | 172.20.0.25:7.0
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| 07:28 | <alkisg> Nice, and after ssh -X router; echo $DISPLAY ?
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| 07:28 | <Fuzai> which isn't anywhere near my server which is statically set on 202
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| 07:28 | that was after ssh -X router echo $DISPLAY
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| 07:28 | <alkisg> And before that?
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| 07:28 | <Fuzai> same thing
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| 07:29 | <alkisg> Wait, don't combine the 2 commands
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| 07:29 | Otherwise shell evaluates it before the ssh command
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| 07:29 | Run ssh -X router
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| 07:29 | <Fuzai> so my question is how do i tell the xhost on the thin client to allow the connection from someone different the terminal server?
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| 07:29 | <alkisg> And _then_ run echo $DISPLAY
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| 07:29 | ssh -X should have taken care of that
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| 07:29 | <Fuzai> nothing
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| 07:29 | on the router $DISPLAY is blank
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| 07:30 | <alkisg> So, `ssh -X router` doesn't set $DISPLAY
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| 07:30 | Any warnings in ~/.xsession-errors?
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| 07:30 | <Fuzai> -X in ssh's man page says it's supposed to enable 11 forwarding
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| 07:30 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 07:31 | <Fuzai> so how do i set the xhost on the thin client to allow
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| 07:31 | because I can manually set the $DISPLAY line, but it still isn't allowing it
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| 07:39 | <alkisg> Fuzai: my point is that you shouldn't have to, something else is wrong in your setup
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| 07:39 | From a thin client I can ssh -X to another machine without having to do anything at all manually
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| 07:39 | <Fuzai> hrm
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> You're not trying to use localapps, right?
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| 07:40 | <Fuzai> no
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| 07:40 | i know where i'm logged in
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> What did you set LDM_DIRECTX to?
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| 07:40 | <Fuzai> i know where i installed it, from which repo
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> True or the default false?
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| 07:41 | <Fuzai> that's the encrypted tunnel to the server right?
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 07:41 | <Fuzai> it's false right now
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> Are you sure? Your DISPLAY then should be localhost:11 or something
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| 07:41 | <Fuzai> it's not encrypted right now
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> So it's true
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| 07:42 | Not false
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| 07:42 | <Fuzai> which ever setting that would be
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| 07:42 | <alkisg> Try without LDM_DIRECTX=True
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| 07:42 | I.e. remove it from your lts.conf and reboot your client
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| 07:45 | <awilliams> hey guys, how is ltsp-land today?
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| 07:46 | <alkisg> Hello
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| 07:46 | <Fuzai> xauth
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| 07:46 | xauth was missing on the router
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| 07:48 | there we go good to go
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> Nice
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| 08:09 | <Fuzai> has anyone done a large scale deployment with ssh tunneled clients yet? Does anyone have any tricks to making flash video faster?
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| 08:14 | <VectorX> in contrast to distributed computing, what would you call LTSP ?
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| 08:14 | since now there is only one computer trying to solve all the problems
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| 08:14 | <Fuzai> cool
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| 08:15 | <muppis> VectorX, centralized.
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| 08:20 | <alkisg> !flash
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| 08:20 | <ltsp`> alkisg: flash: Yes, flash sucks. Make sure you have LDM_DIRECTX=True in your lts.conf file, or if it's just youtube you're after, try some flash replacing plugin like https://addons.mozilla.org/el/firefox/addon/161869/ (per user installation, gecko-mediaplayer is also needed).
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| 08:21 | <alkisg> Fuzai: ^ ...and also localapps or fat clients
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| 08:23 | <muppis> alkisg, about Youtube, there is possibility also to use HTML5 video in present Firefox, but I haven't tested how it works over lan.
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| 08:23 | http://www.youtube.com/html5
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| 08:23 | <alkisg> muppis: in firefox it still eats the same cpu as flash
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| 08:24 | <Fuzai> gb ethernet i can watch justin.tv in standard def not a problem
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| 08:24 | <alkisg> In google-chrome they have a better codec so it uses less cpu
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| 08:24 | <Fuzai> 100mbit doesn't normally hold up i just installed that gecko bit, i'm going to try again
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| 08:24 | <alkisg> And since it doesn't use XVideo, it's also the same problem with the bandwidth
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| 08:24 | <muppis> Ok.
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| 08:24 | <Fuzai> i find that google-chrome my scroll wheel doesn't work right
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| 08:24 | <alkisg> muppis: while with the *mplayer plugins, it uses XV and it needs _much_ less cpu and bandwidth
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| 08:24 | <Fuzai> firefox and everything else it does
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| 08:25 | woow
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| 08:26 | <muppis> alkisg, does those work with everywhere where flash video is used?
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| 08:26 | <alkisg> muppis: nope, and sometimes they have other problems too
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| 08:26 | <Fuzai> I have to make sure it works for my clients
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| 08:26 | sometimes they have to see multimedia sites
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| 08:26 | <alkisg> (e.g. updates in youtube breaking it until it's updated, or having to download the whole video instead of streaming it live etc)
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| 08:27 | Fuzai: did you also check the localapps/fat clients idea?
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| 08:27 | <Fuzai> yes
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| 08:27 | <alkisg> That's usually much better if you have good enough clients
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| 08:27 | <Fuzai> i started with wanting to use raspberry pi's as the thinclient
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| 08:27 | but they don't have enough power
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| 08:27 | <alkisg> cubox is much better I think
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| 08:27 | <Fuzai> so i moved to a dualcore atom 2gb client
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| 08:28 | <alkisg> With so much power, then go for localapps or fats
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| 08:28 | <Fuzai> Why when there is so much more server side resources available
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| 08:29 | <alkisg> Because 1 hd video requires more than 1 gbps of bandwidth
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| 08:29 | Multiply that with your number of clients
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| 08:29 | <Fuzai> even standard def?
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| 08:29 | <alkisg> width * height * color depth * number of frames per second, do the math for the video you care about
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| 08:30 | <Fuzai> Ok so it really is like that
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| 08:30 | <alkisg> Where width and height are the view screen dimensions, not the video dimensions
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| 08:30 | So for 1920x1080 clients, watching small videos in youtube _fullscreen_ is a no-go for thin clients
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| 08:30 | <Fuzai> What about thin clients with that resolution in general
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| 08:31 | are they going to use more bandwidth to render the screen?
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| 08:31 | <alkisg> Of course
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| 08:31 | <Fuzai> So fat clients really are the only way to go if you want to scale
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| 08:31 | <alkisg> Unless you have multiple servers and arrange them in cluster etc
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| 08:32 | E.g with ltsp-cluster there were deployments with many thousand clients
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| 08:32 | <Fuzai> i was planning on using dual xeon 5600's with quad gbe
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| 08:32 | how many clients do you think i can get away with side by side just browsing the internet?
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| 08:32 | 64 gb ram
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| 08:32 | <alkisg> Without any local apps, and with encryption?
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| 08:33 | <Fuzai> yea no encryption and using thinclients with a central server
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| 08:33 | to me localapps sounds like fat clients
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| 08:33 | <alkisg> You do know that localapps and fat clients are still diskless and served by the same server, right?
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| 08:33 | It's just a different LTSP mode, nothing related to local installations
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| 08:34 | <Fuzai> is there a difference between local apps and fat clients or do you mean local apps just because everything about a fat client is locally executed?
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| 08:34 | <alkisg> There are 3 different modes that ltsp supports
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| 08:34 | thin clients, thin clients with localapps, and fat clients
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| 08:34 | Please read the docs for details
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| 08:34 | <Fuzai> i know the first and the third
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| 08:34 | <alkisg> All of them diskless
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| 08:34 | <Fuzai> can you elaborate on the 2nd
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| 08:35 | <alkisg> It's like thin clients except that you install e.g. firefox and flash in the chroot to solve the problems we're talking about
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| 08:35 | <Fuzai> Hehe, ok unless you have a link i'm going to go read
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| 08:35 | thank you
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| 08:35 | <alkisg> It's in the IRC topic
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| 08:36 | <Fuzai> http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LocalApps
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| 08:36 | the first link about local apps doesn't get very far
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| 08:37 | <alkisg> Type "/topic" in your irc client to see the channel topic
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| 08:37 | <Fuzai> I just did
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| 08:37 | <alkisg> There's a pdf there that you should read
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| 08:37 | <Fuzai> and took the last link
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| 08:38 | <alkisg> http://sourceforge.net/projects/ltsp/files/Docs-Admin-Guide/LTSPManual.pdf/download
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| 08:38 | <Fuzai> thank you
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| 08:40 | <alkisg> !fatclients
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| 08:40 | <ltsp`> alkisg: fatclients: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
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| 08:40 | <alkisg> Fuzai: and that's ^ a bit of documentation about LTSP fat clients
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| 08:40 | <Fuzai> thank you
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| 08:40 | <alkisg> It's relatively new so it's not in the .pdf
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| 08:40 | <Fuzai> i've been looking for something just like your first link for a while
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| 08:42 | <Hyperbyte> Good morning campers! :)
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| 08:43 | <alkisg> Hi Hyperbyte, any new troubles with 12.04 today? :P :D
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| 08:45 | <Hyperbyte> Yessir. :)
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| 08:45 | But that's not really with 12.04, I think.
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| 08:45 | My Samba with LDAP authentication stopped working
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| 08:48 | <Fuzai> if I run firefox as a local apps does this mean I get DRI access too? what about vdpau offloading with flash?
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| 08:49 | <alkisg> Yes you can arrange all that
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| 08:49 | <Fuzai> Oh sweet, you just gave me a tool to blow everyones mind
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| 08:50 | so if I install quake 3 as a local app it should fire correctly if the os is configured right on the thin client?
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| 08:50 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 08:50 | <Fuzai> Oh my, what have you guys done
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| 08:50 | :)
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| 08:51 | <Hyperbyte> alkisg, oh, I have also noticed that screen resolution detection goes a bit less okay in 12.04
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| 08:51 | <alkisg> Hyperbyte: that would be xorg, nothing related to ltsp, correct?
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| 08:51 | <Hyperbyte> alkisg, probably, yeah. :) Just throwing it out here, fyi.
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| 08:51 | <alkisg> For which graphics card?
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| 08:52 | <Fuzai> be right back
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| 08:52 | <Hyperbyte> alkisg, Intel GMA
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| 08:53 | <alkisg> Hyperbyte: are you talking about the reverse screens etc problem, where in ldm everything is ok and the problem is after login?
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| 08:56 | <Hyperbyte> alkisg, well that happens too.. but also when I attach one 4:3 screen, and one 16:10 screen, they're both put in 4:3 resolutions
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| 08:58 | <alkisg> I had that for ages with intel gma, it doesn't sound new...
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| 08:59 | <Hyperbyte> Oh, no, I had some issues on 11.04 as well
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| 09:02 | Still, say what you want about Gnome3, but dconf > gconf.
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| 17:23 | <bieb> I am installing Ubuntu 12.04 from alternate CD, ltsp install.. It says Installation step failed" you can try to run the failing item again from the menu, or skip it and choose something else. The failing step is: Select and install software. Any ideas? should I do the next step? which in the menu is Build LTSP chroot
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| 17:35 | <bieb> anyone awake??
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| 17:35 | <vagrantc> awake, but don't really know ubuntu's installer support
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| 17:36 | <bieb> vagrantc: ok.. didnt know if it was something you had seen or heard before
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| 17:37 | <vagrantc> i think it's basically like debian-installer ... if so you could try alt-f2 to get a shell and poke around
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| 17:37 | logs in /var/log/syslog
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| 17:37 | a very limited shell, though
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| 17:37 | also log displayed on alt-f4
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| 17:37 | (installer itself on alt-f1
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| 17:37 | )
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| 17:38 | <bieb> vagrantc: ok.. seemed odd.. it installed a bunch of packages.. then failed.. I have restarted the software install 3 times
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| 17:38 | <vagrantc> is it installingg from the network? otherwise i'd expect the CD to be self-contained
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| 17:39 | if it's getting segfaults or kernel oopses, i'd run memtest on it for a while
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| 17:39 | <bieb> during one of the software restarts.. I went back on the menu and configured the package manager.. I allowed it to use the network mirrors
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| 17:40 | <vagrantc> the occasional network hiccup might mess it up a bit ... might try installing without network mirrors and then updating later.
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| 17:41 | i mean, it should generally be robust... but who knows
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| 17:41 | <bieb> ok
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| 17:43 | <vagrantc> presuming ubuntu has enough on the CD to do so...
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| 17:50 | <bieb> vagrantc: when you are looking at the package manager.. it tells you the cd will give you limited install
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| 17:50 | <vagrantc> that is plausible.
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| 17:51 | or just retry the network install
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| 17:51 | without seeing what's in the install log, i'mjust guessing in the dark here.
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| 17:55 | <bieb> vagrantc: how do I view the last x number of lines of the syslog?
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| 17:56 | <vagrantc> tail -n #
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| 17:56 | <bieb> something in sptitude failed
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| 17:59 | vagrantc: what info you want me to give you? since I can't cut and paste to pastebin
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| 18:00 | <vagrantc> what in aptitude failed?
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| 18:03 | <bieb> I got Err http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ precise-updates/main linux-headers-3.2.0-24 all 3.2.0-24.38
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| 18:03 | Something wicked happened resolving 'us.aarchive.ubuntu.com:http' (-5 -no address associated with hostname)
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| 18:04 | vagrantc: then after that it runs a bunch of similar errors for archive and security.ubuntu..
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| 18:06 | later before it fails.. one of the lines says Unable to fetch some archives, maybe run apt-get update or try with --fix-missing?
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| 18:06 | <vagrantc> looks like network dropped out
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| 18:06 | you couldn't resolve hostnames ... either your networking went down locally, or you couldn't contact your DNS server for some reason
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| 18:07 | <bieb> ok
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| 18:07 | <vagrantc> might be worth retrying from scratch
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| 18:07 | <bieb> well at this point I can't ifconfig to see if I have ip
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| 18:09 | <vagrantc> ip addr show
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| 18:09 | ??
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| 18:10 | <bieb> cool.. didnt know that one.. was trying ifconfig
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| 18:10 | yeah it has an IP address
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| 18:10 | <vagrantc> can you ping something?
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| 18:13 | * vagrantc waves to alkisg | |
| 18:13 | <bieb> nothing outside.. but can inside
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| 18:13 | <alkisg> Hi vagrantc, hi all
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| 18:13 | <bieb> vagrantc: looks like network issue
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| 18:13 | * vagrantc guessed right | |
| 18:13 | <bieb> I will restart and see if it works
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| 18:14 | <vagrantc> worst case, see just how limited the install from CD is ...
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| 18:14 | <bieb> ok
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| 21:05 | <vlt> Hello. Any idea how to remove the “Shut down …” and “Software up to date” lines in Ubuntu 12.04’s logout menu for LTSP users?
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