IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 27 September 2011 (all times are UTC)
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| 10:38 | <txor> Hi! How is controlled the bandwith consumed between server and client? LDM_DIRECTX option is the way?
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| 12:58 | <mgariepy> good morning everyone
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| 13:11 | <dgroos> Good Morn mgariepy
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| 13:11 | <mgariepy> so did it work now ?
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| 13:11 | <dgroos> and good morning to all
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| 13:11 | Getting close!
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| 13:12 | Strangle enough it partly worked.
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| 13:12 | <mgariepy> let me guess, it didn't work for the games menu ?
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| 13:12 | <dgroos> Those things in the Education and graphics sub menus that I unchecked didn't show but...
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| 13:13 | The games menu was unaffected :)
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| 13:13 | how did you guess?
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| 13:14 | <mgariepy> it's a bug, because then game menu is kinda weird, when, for example there is like 5 or 6 card games, the game menu will have a card submenu
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| 13:16 | <mgariepy> dgroos, do you want to remove all games or only some of them ?
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| 13:16 | <dgroos> I'd be fine removing them all...
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| 13:20 | but am wary of just sudo -rm stuff in the chroot--I feel like I'll be leaving things around that will cause problems. Is there a clean way to remove an app from the chroot?
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| 13:27 | <mgariepy> apt-get purge <application?
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| 13:36 | <dgroos1> mgariepy: while in the chroot?
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| 13:38 | <mgariepy> yeah
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| 13:38 | <mgariepy> or you can do : apt-get remove <package> instead of purge.
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| 13:43 | <dgroos1> OK, so I'm now in virtual-virtual-virtual client to find out what applications are in the games menu. I'll write down their names, and is there a short cut to find out what their package name is? Usually it won't be the same as the name of application, right?
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| 13:47 | <Hyperbyte> Which Ubuntu version?
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| 13:47 | <dgroos1> Lucid
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| 13:48 | <Hyperbyte> http://aendruk.wordpress.com/2010/04/23/how-to-remove-all-games-in-ubuntu-10-04/
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| 13:48 | Google is my friend. :)
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| 13:48 | <dgroos1> How come I sometimes forget that friend of mine, too? :)
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| 13:48 | <mgariepy> haha nice one Hyperbyte :)
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| 13:52 | <txor> Hi! Can we control or configure the bandwith consumed between server and cilents?
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| 13:53 | <Hyperbyte> txor, sure! Why do you want that?
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| 13:53 | <txor> Hyperbyte: for slow networks topologies
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| 13:54 | for example if I have a slow switch with much clients
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| 13:55 | <Hyperbyte> txor, but limiting the bandwith consumed between server and clients will make them slow. If you don't give LTSP the bandwith it needs, it'll be slow. You can't just make it use less bandwith.
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| 13:55 | Well not in the way you're trying to do it, anyways. :)
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| 13:55 | <ichat> if you have a low bandwidth network,
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| 13:56 | why not just run thin clients with locally installed ' viewer software
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| 13:57 | not requiring the boot being send over pxe, and using better videocompression (at the cost of higher load on your server) can give you some reduction in required network speeds
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| 13:57 | <txor> I make some tests and I see that LDM_DIRECTX and X_COLOR_DEPTH options are affecting to consumed bandwith
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| 13:58 | yes I use some local apps, but I searching for all options
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| 13:58 | nx is one of them?
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| 13:58 | <ichat> nx is indead one yes
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| 13:59 | <txor> where is th video compression controlled?
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| 13:59 | is the ssh compression?
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| 13:59 | <ichat> you would than run most apps on your server like office mail and other. consuming more ram on the server. but less strain on the network
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| 14:00 | <Hyperbyte> txor, but your clients are slow, all the time?
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| 14:00 | <dgroos1> Cool. "sudo apt-get remove gnome-games-common gbrainy" removes ALL games in 1 little command. Now rebuilding client image...
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| 14:00 | <Hyperbyte> Or they become slow once some people start watching videos?
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| 14:00 | <ichat> video copression is done by the xsession .. or for example in your vnc or freenx server settings
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| 14:00 | <txor> what about firefox reproducing some streameing video?
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| 14:00 | <alkisg> How many clients, what network speed (e.g. 100 mbps switch for all of them?) etc?
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| 14:01 | <txor> Well we are implanting LTSP 5 in many schools, sometims, if they have a slow switch and many of the cliens are watching videos, the bandwith gets up!
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| 14:02 | <alkisg> Define slow switch
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| 14:02 | 10 mbps?
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| 14:02 | If it's a 10 mbps hub, ltsp is not for you
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| 14:02 | <txor> I don't have the numbers now but, 100 mbps with 10 thin clients watching the same video
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| 14:02 | <Hyperbyte> txor, you could run the application playing the video as a localapp. Then it won't have to transmit over network. Your clients will have to be powerful enough to handle localapps though.
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| 14:02 | <ichat> txor - if one application causes the network performance to get unacceptably low, consider blocking the aplication
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| 14:03 | <alkisg> txor: and what are the clients specs? CPU/RAM?
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| 14:03 | <txor> yes, we know that
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| 14:03 | I think all are about Pentium 3 and 512 MB
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| 14:04 | They can handle Firefox as localapps and the network bandwith get reduced
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| 14:04 | <alkisg> Some localapps would help there, yes
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| 14:04 | <txor> yes yes
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| 14:04 | <Hyperbyte> txor, then that's the solution, isn't it?
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| 14:04 | <alkisg> But they're not powerful enough for fat clients
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| 14:04 | But, the best solution is to buy a switch with 1 gigabit port with 50€
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| 14:04 | That will get you 10 times better bandwidth
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| 14:04 | And solve most of your problems
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| 14:04 | <txor> Yes! I only want to know how many ways to reduce bandwith consume there are.
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| 14:05 | Yes 10 times about, I see it in my tests
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| 14:05 | <Hyperbyte> txor, localapps, buying better network hardware. Those two. :)
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| 14:05 | <txor> But each scenario have to get it's own solution as we dealing with many schools....
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| 14:06 | Hehe! I can't say 'buy better stuff' despit that its true ;)
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| 14:06 | <Hyperbyte> Sure you can.
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| 14:06 | You're implementing a system for them that'll save thousands of dollars.
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| 14:06 | <txor> And what about copmress traffic with ssh? Where it's done?
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| 14:06 | <Hyperbyte> You can ask them to invest $40 in a switch.
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| 14:07 | <txor> Yes I can but is not my job...
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| 14:07 | Yes yes you are right
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| 14:07 | <ichat> txor - what do you mean by compressing ssh
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| 14:07 | <Hyperbyte> txor, I was looking at that actually. I think it isn't feasible though. It was a configuration option, but it's been removed from the code as far as I can tell.
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| 14:07 | ichat, man ssh.
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| 14:07 | <txor> I read that ssh tunnel can do lzma compression
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| 14:07 | <ichat> ssh is a tunnel that safegards trafic on an unsecure network. if any it will increase network loads
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| 14:07 | <txor> But where it's configured onto openSUSE LTSP infrastructure?
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| 14:08 | <Hyperbyte> ichat, see -c option for SSH.
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| 14:08 | <txor> Yes
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| 14:08 | <Hyperbyte> Sorry, -C (capital)
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| 14:09 | <ichat> highvoltage - wouldn't using a gz enabled proxy benefit you more?
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| 14:11 | <txor> Thanks for all folks, was a nice conversation! I'll tell him 'buy a new switch and stop annoying me!' ;) See you, thanks.
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| 14:11 | <Hyperbyte> txor, good on you!
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| 14:18 | <TheProf> Hello. I hope everyone is well. Question: on an LTSP server, should dhcpd be taking 28% of total ram (as reported by top)? Server has 12 GB RAM.
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| 14:18 | I noticed there was some swap activity and didn't understand why so checked what was going on.
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| 14:18 | <Hyperbyte> TheProf, that'd be a no I think. :)
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| 14:19 | <TheProf> Hyperbyte, That's what I thought! I wasn't sure why dhcpd would need such massive amounts of ram.
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| 14:19 | <Hyperbyte> Still, how much swap activity is there?
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| 14:19 | <TheProf> Not much - 18 MB
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| 14:20 | <Hyperbyte> Because Linux uses memory a lot different than Windows. In the sense that, Linux doesn't clean up memory unless necessary.
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| 14:20 | It's normal for a Linux machine to "use" all available ram.
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| 14:20 | <TheProf> that is true and something I had to learn early on with Linux. I was just confused why it was hitting the swap when it seemed like there was nothing happening (2 people logged into LTSP).
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| 14:21 | So probably just a temporary glitch.
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| 14:21 | <Hyperbyte> Currently I have 15461 GB memory used on a server with only four people logged in. And there's 14 MB swapped as well, probably left over as well from some earlier swap action.
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| 14:21 | Unless you notice your harddisk is spinning and there is a feasible amount of swap activity, I wouldn't worry about it.
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| 14:22 | <TheProf> Hyperbyte, thanks very much for the clarification.
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| 14:22 | <Hyperbyte> If you're curious, you can always run 'swapoff -a' and 'swapon -a' after, to re-initialize your swap.
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| 14:22 | If things go wrong, it was really using the swap. ;-)
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| 14:24 | 15461 GB memory above, should be 15461 MB of course, by the way. But that was probably clear already.
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| 14:31 | <TheProf> I'll try the swapoff and swapon command once they log out at the end of the day :)
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| 14:36 | <jammcq> cliebow: !!!!!!!!!
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| 14:37 | <cliebow> jammcq!!!!!!!!!
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| 14:37 | <jammcq> hey, where ya been?
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| 14:37 | we're coming to see you soon
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| 14:38 | <cliebow> my firewall is wonky i may lose you!.
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| 14:38 | ohh cool!! when are you thinking?
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| 14:38 | <jammcq> oct 27-30
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| 14:38 | at the usual place
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| 14:39 | <cliebow> awesome...i wondered if you were going to get together..
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| 14:39 | <jammcq> heh, of course
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| 14:39 | scotty and i have agreed that we'll continue coming even if we're the last two there
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| 14:39 | btw, we have ragnar joining us this year
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| 14:39 | and I think ogra will be there
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| 14:40 | along with most of the other regulars
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| 14:42 | <cliebow> excellent...
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| 14:42 | <bakytn> Hello! I am trying to force my LTSP client to use lower screen resolution. I am setting X_MODE_0 and 1 and 2 to lower resolutions. No luck! BTW, I am using RDP
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| 14:43 | In this page: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/natty/man5/lts.conf.5.html I am unable to find RDP related configruations any more...where can i find actual lts.conf manual?
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| 14:44 | <Hyperbyte> !lts.conf
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| 14:44 | <ltsp> Hyperbyte: lts.conf: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
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| 14:44 | <Hyperbyte> I think you'll want XRANDR_* options rather than X_* options
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| 14:45 | <bakytn> Hyperbyte, hi! in the man page you provided there are no RDP realted options anymore
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| 14:45 | I have rdesktop in SCREEN_07 it means that I can try XRANDR_MODE_7 =800x600 right?
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| 14:48 | <alkisg> No, still XRANDR_MODE_0
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| 14:48 | Don't forget [Default]
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| 14:53 | <bakytn> thank you! XRANDR_MODE_0 worked!
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| 14:53 | Please! canyou tell...which LTS conf option is for setting options for rdesktop?
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| 14:55 | <bakytn> for example I want to pass some parameters to rdesktop like -r etc
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| 14:58 | <Hyperbyte> Just put it after rdesktop I think
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| 14:58 | SCREEN_07=rdesktop -r
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| 14:58 | Correct me if I'm wrong.
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| 14:59 | * Hyperbyte pokes alkisg | |
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| 15:01 | <bakytn> Hyperbyte, oh
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| 15:12 | <bakytn> Hyperbyte, yes worked! I can just past pass options in the SCREEN_XX
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| 15:17 | <dgroos1> Using the command: sudo apt-get remove gnome-games-common gbrainy removed many games, but upon updating the image and rebooting the client, I saw there were still 2 games left, Potato Guy and Ri-Li.
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| 15:17 | So I then went to try to get rid of them.
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| 15:18 | <dgroos1> I typed sudo apt-get remove ktuberling (the name of the package for Potato Guy) BUT
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| 15:19 | it said that it was going to remove ktuberling AND ubuntu-edu-secondary and I'm wary of removing that package.
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| 15:20 | <dgroos1> I've been googling to find out how to remove just the ktuberling but haven't had luck. Anyone know how to remove just the one package?
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| 15:47 | <dgroos1> Can I just rm these directories and thereby disabling it (though not removing everything related, of course): /usr/share/kde4/apps/ktuberling, /usr/share/applications/kde4/ktuberling.desktop, /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/ktuberling
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| 15:51 | <bakytn> hello! do you have any idea why if I use "rdesktop" command from my Linux notebook it works quite fast and I can actually watch movies by RDP. However I can't do it from Thin Client. The rdesktop versions are the same. THe rdesktop options are the same
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| 16:25 | <alkisg> dgroos1: you can run: chmod -x $(which ktuberling)
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| 16:25 | This will make it not-executable, without uninstalling or deleting anything
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| 16:26 | <alkisg> Another approach is this:
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| 16:26 | $ apt-cache show ubuntu-edu-secondary | egrep '^Depends|^Recommends'
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| 16:26 | Depends: dia-gnome, inkscape, kalgebra, kalzium, kbruch, kig, kmplot, kstars, ktouch, ktuberling, kturtle, kwordquiz, marble, parley, qcad, ri-li, step, vym
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| 16:26 | I.e. to remove ubuntu-edu-secondary, but manually install its dependencies
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| 16:28 | <dgroos> alkisg: cool. I'll try the first but the latter approach looks handy--have to write it in my notes.
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| 16:29 | <alkisg> dgroos: e.g. if you do: apt-get install dia-gnome inkscape kalgebra kalzium kbruch kig kmplot kstars ktouch ktuberling kturtle kwordquiz marble parley qcad ri-li step vym
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| 16:29 | <alkisg> then you'll mark them as "manually installed"
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| 16:29 | So removing ubuntu-edu-secondary won't uninstall them
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| 16:30 | <dgroos1> Now that is very cool. I'll try that instead :)
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| 16:32 | <bakytn> if I pass -r sound:local in the rdesktop options. is it known to be working?
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| 16:32 | can't get sound working from Thin clients
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| 16:33 | in the chroot's usr/share/ltsp/rdesktop.sh I see there is an option: case "${RDP_SOUND}"
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| 16:33 | it means that I have to set RDP_SOUND=pulse-oss in the lts.conf right?
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| 16:33 | or nopulse
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| 16:40 | <cliebow> jammcq:you gonna put up a webpage?
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| 17:23 | <highvoltage> ichat: hmm?
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| 17:48 | <jammcq> cliebow: already did
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| 19:42 | <mgariepy> hey Gadi have you seen a thin client not being able to open a session on a wnidows 2003 server ?
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| 19:47 | <Gadi> sure
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| 19:47 | :)
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| 19:47 | <mgariepy> what was the problem ?
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| 19:47 | <Gadi> could be a number of things - did you check licensing?
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| 19:47 | <khildin> lack of mem and/or cpu poer
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| 19:47 | power*
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| 19:48 | <Gadi> nah - not much memory/cpu required for rdesktop's initial connection
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| 19:49 | I would suspect licensing or plumbing first
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| 19:52 | <mgariepy> the session opens
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| 19:53 | when i start an applications it crahes, freeze
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| 19:53 | <Gadi> rdesktop or freerdp?
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| 19:53 | <mgariepy> rdesktop
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| 19:53 | rdesktop
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| 19:54 | oops.
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| 19:54 | <Gadi> any flags?
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| 19:54 | arguments?
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| 19:54 | <mgariepy> -f -u -r disk:disk /media/root/ -x b -k fr-ca -a 16 -P <IP>
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| 19:56 | <Gadi> try removing the -P
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| 20:02 | <mgariepy> it's really weird.
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| 20:03 | i succesfully log in but when i open computer it freezes
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| 20:07 | <mgariepy> removing -P ins't helping
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| 20:42 | <mgariepy> Gadi, XSERVER=vesa fix the issue .
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