IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 16 March 2012 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:55 | <AliNarcis1> hello
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| 00:55 | i have a question
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| 00:56 | a beginner type question
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| 00:56 | wen i sign in with a client in ltsp
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| 00:56 | my client has the same ip as my server has
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| 00:56 | anybody knows y ?
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| 01:08 | <Llama_be> AliNarcis: when you sign in into an LTSP client, you actually connect to the server and perform all actions on the server
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| 01:08 | so if you would check your ip address, you're actually checking the server ip address
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| 01:16 | <AliNarcis> auuuuuuu
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| 01:17 | got it dude
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| 01:17 | thx
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| 04:25 | <AliNarcis> dudes, is there any irc channel for ltsp cluster 2 ?
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| 05:06 | <alkisg> There's no separate channel for ltsp cluster, this is it
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| 06:21 | <AliNarcis> dudes i am so new in using linux
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| 06:21 | and i want to migrate to linux from windows
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| 06:21 | but there are some win apps that i wanna use in linux
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| 06:22 | some apps that were not totally ok in wine
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| 06:22 | is there anybody who could help me ?
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| 06:25 | <alkisg> AliNarcis: ask your specific question, and wait for an answer, don't ask if someone's available...
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| 06:44 | <Alternativend> Hello
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| 06:44 | anyone there?
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| 06:45 | I have a few simple questions and i hope that someone could help me :)
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| 06:47 | Does anyone know if it is possible to use the FatClient system with Debian?
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| 07:12 | <Alternativend> hmh
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| 07:22 | <Alternativend> no one here who could help me out?
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| 07:23 | <elias_a> People are still asleep in Europe at this time :)
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| 07:23 | <alkisg> Alternativend: yes it is possible, and it's easier on wheezy
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| 07:23 | <Alternativend> ok what do i have to do?
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| 07:23 | <elias_a> Alternativend: Should be but most who I know use Ubuntu.
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| 07:24 | <Alternativend> and yes Im using wheezy allready, because of ltsp 5
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| 07:24 | <elias_a> alkisg: Sorry to assume you were still sleeping :)
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| 07:24 | <alkisg> elias_a: haha no worries I'm not the only person responding anyway :)
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| 07:24 | <Alternativend> ;)
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| 07:25 | So how do I prepare the chroot envireoment?
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| 07:25 | <alkisg> Alternativend: let me see how recent is ltsp in wheezy...
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| 07:26 | 5.3.4-1?
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| 07:27 | <Alternativend> right
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| 07:27 | <alkisg> Good enough. How would you prefer to install it? With ltsp-build-client or by a normal installation in a real client or in a vbox?
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| 07:27 | <elias_a> alkisg: I never asked this but how much do the local education administrative bodies know about FLOSS in Greece?
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| 07:28 | <Alternativend> greece?
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| 07:28 | <alkisg> elias_a: there are some that actually promote it. And there are some that don't even know that software is :)
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| 07:28 | *what
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| 07:28 | <Alternativend> However whats the best option to do it?
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| 07:28 | <elias_a> alkisg: Well - that is all the same all around the world.
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| 07:29 | <alkisg> Alternativend: go with the standard method, run ltsp-build-client and install some desktop environment in your chroot
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| 07:29 | <elias_a> alkisg: If you know people who are interested in joining the FSFE Education list, please let me know.
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| 07:30 | <Alternativend> Nothing special about the FAT-Client option to do?
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| 07:30 | <alkisg> Alternativend: in the past a fat plugin was required to disable network manager etc etc
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| 07:30 | But in recent ltsp versions all that is done automatically
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| 07:30 | <Alternativend> So it will be enough to do the following?
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| 07:30 | chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get install htop openarena stellarium vlc
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> No, that doesn't give you a desktop environment
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| 07:31 | <Alternativend> ok ok
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| 07:31 | chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get install htop openarena stellarium vlc xfce4
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| 07:31 | ;)
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> Right
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| 07:31 | <Alternativend> What to do with the lts.conf?
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> From ltsp 5.3.6 your chroot will automatically detect that it's a fat cone
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| 07:31 | *one
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| 07:31 | <Alternativend> cool
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> For now, you'll need LTSP_FATCLIENT=True in lts.conf
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| 07:32 | <Alternativend> so Im adding this line
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| 07:32 | <alkisg> [Default] on top too
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| 07:32 | <Alternativend> right
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| 07:32 | <alkisg> That should be all... if it isn't, ask again :)
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| 07:33 | <Alternativend> And that´s all? After that my "ThinClients" are FatClients? Would be really amazing.
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| 07:33 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 07:33 | <Alternativend> I cant wait to see what the performance will be like.
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| 07:33 | <alkisg> And if you remote the lts.conf line, they're thin again
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| 07:33 | Like local installations, like if they were booting from an external usb disk (not flash stick, a real fast one)
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| 07:34 | <Alternativend> So youtube for instance would work?
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| 07:34 | <alkisg> Of course
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| 07:34 | <Alternativend> I have to manage a few schools and well videos are quite popular
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| 07:34 | <alkisg> Exactly like local installations, even the memory requirements are the same
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| 07:35 | Me too, 250 schools, that's why I spent so much coding the fat clients code ;)
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| 07:35 | <Alternativend> For us this could be a great way to deploy Linux as a second option, without having trouble managing everything
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| 07:35 | Do you use LDAP?
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| 07:37 | Is it possible to use LTSP so that the pupils are able to logon with there "normal" Windows users?
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| 07:37 | <elias_a> alkisg: Are you managing 250 schools? :O
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| 07:37 | <alkisg> elias_a: yup, writing manuals, providing repositories with software etc... some 100+ of them are listed here: http://goo.gl/maps/nOoQ
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| 07:38 | Alternativend: no I'm not using LDAP
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| 07:38 | To login with the normal windows accounts, I think likewise open can be used
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| 07:38 | Or just plain samba, haven't done it
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| 07:38 | I'd prefer the opposite ;)
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| 07:38 | To manage all the accounts on linux and have windows workstations authenticate against samba
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| 07:38 | <Alternativend> Yes but Linux would be only the second option here :(
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| 07:39 | <elias_a> alkisg: You are FLOSS-hero :)
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| 07:39 | <Alternativend> RIGHT!
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| 07:40 | I do have an ActiveDirectory here and a Windows Domain
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> Alternativend: in the future I'll write an ltsp screen script to launch windows VMs on top of ltsp fat clients
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| 07:40 | <Alternativend> What would you say.. how to give them a chance to logon with their "normal" users?
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> The result will be that you'll be able to server e.g. windows 7 professional in all your school from a single VM, without needing a domain
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| 07:41 | <elias_a> alkisg: What you do is so interesting and large scale that somebody should interview you and write an article about what you do.
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> And authentication and user homes will be in linux, but the users will only see windows
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| 07:41 | <Alternativend> Would be GREAT!
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| 07:41 | But for now on??
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> Since that's so much easier to maintain than windows server + a lot of different windows client installations, I hope it will help migrating more schools to linux
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| 07:42 | <elias_a> alkisg: Have you thought what that means licencewise?
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| 07:42 | <alkisg> It requires a corporate win 7 license
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| 07:42 | (I think)
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| 07:42 | <elias_a> What about CALs?
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| 07:43 | Client Access Licence, that is.
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| 07:43 | <alkisg> There's no server
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| 07:43 | So I don't think any CALs are necessary
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| 07:43 | You just maintain the client disks in a single VM on the linux server
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| 07:43 | <Alternativend> hmh
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| 07:43 | So thats too fast for me...
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| 07:44 | <alkisg> Alternativend: for now you can either offer local booting, or rdesktop from ltsp, or you can manually create VMs in ltsp too
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| 07:44 | <Alternativend> I dont understand how do you do it right now?
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| 07:44 | <alkisg> Whatever matches your situation
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| 07:44 | <Alternativend> Yes but I think you dont udnerstand my problem :)
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| 07:45 | Guess I have a Linux server with fat clients
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| 07:45 | and I have a Windows 2003 R2 server with a fully working Active Directory, Usernames and so on...
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| 07:45 | How do I link this?
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| 07:46 | <elias_a> alkisg: Oh - you plan having as many VM:s and licenced Windowses enough for all users?
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| 07:46 | <Alternativend> For the beginning I do need a method to give everybody the chance to logon with their normal user
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| 07:46 | <alkisg> Logon to linux or to windows?
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| 07:46 | <Alternativend> Booting LTSP
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| 07:47 | Login with Windows credentials
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| 07:47 | <alkisg> elias_a: no, a single VM that can be reused by any number of ltsp clients/windows users
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| 07:47 | Alternativend: and your session would be linux or windows?
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| 07:47 | <Alternativend> Linux
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| 07:47 | <alkisg> OK, yeah, that's what I understood, see my first answer
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| 07:48 | <Alternativend> It´sjust about the username, password and files
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| 07:48 | <alkisg> (09:38:21 πμ) alkisg: To login with the normal windows accounts, I think likewise open can be used
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| 07:48 | (09:38:27 πμ) alkisg: Or just plain samba, haven't done it
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| 07:48 | <elias_a> Alternativend: One alternative would be to boot the clients first to Linux. Then there would be an icon on the desktop that would start a winblows-session.
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| 07:48 | <alkisg> He wants a linux session, not a windows one
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| 07:49 | <Alternativend> Yes
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> Just to be able to authenticate using the windows credentials
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| 07:49 | <Alternativend> right
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> That's what likewise and samba/winbind etc are for
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| 07:49 | But as I said, I haven't done it
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| 07:49 | <elias_a> Ok, just using the existing AD as LDAP?
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| 07:49 | <alkisg> I don't want to invest on windows servers
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| 07:49 | Yes, something like that
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| 07:49 | <Alternativend> exactly
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| 07:50 | <elias_a> I know it is doable as it is quite common in Finland. The sad thing is I do not know how it is done.
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| 07:50 | * alkisg reboots to check something in gnome-language-selector... | |
| 07:50 | <Alternativend> hmh
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| 07:50 | alkisg has left IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg, Remote host closed the connection) | |
| 07:51 | <Alternativend> that´s a challenge I gues
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| 07:54 | So my first step now is to test the FAT-Client option. The second one is finding a way to give them a chance to logon with Windows username and password.
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| 07:55 | What is about aptitude upgrade?
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| 07:56 | I would have to rebuild with ltsp-build-client when xfce or iceweasel do have an update, right?
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| 07:57 | <elias_a> Alternativend: Are you aware of the LTSP LinkedIn-group? http://www.linkedin.com/groups/Linux-Terminal-Server-Project-LTSP-1412517
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| 07:57 | That could be a good place to ask, too.
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| 07:58 | <Alternativend> So what ist linkedin?
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| 07:59 | <elias_a> LinkedIn is a social media service for "professionals".
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| 07:59 | <Alternativend> Or you dont want to have me here anymore?
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| 07:59 | <elias_a> Alternativend: No - please stay here.
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| 07:59 | <Alternativend> ;)
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| 08:00 | <elias_a> I am just saying that there are people out there doing beatiful things but don't use IRC.
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| 08:00 | <Alternativend> This is my first real chance to offer Linux for schools here
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| 08:00 | <elias_a> Alternativend: Where are you?
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| 08:00 | <Alternativend> Germany
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| 08:00 | you?
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| 08:00 | <elias_a> Wo in Deutschland?
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| 08:00 | Ich bin hier in Finnland.
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| 08:00 | <Alternativend> Nähe von Bielefeld
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| 08:01 | <elias_a> Ok :)
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| 08:01 | <Alternativend> Deutscher?
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| 08:01 | oder deutsch gelernt?
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| 08:01 | <elias_a> Nein, doch nicht.
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| 08:01 | Ja in Schule.
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| 08:02 | <Alternativend> Ich wusste nicht das man in Finnland deutsch in der Schule lernt
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| 08:02 | great!
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| 08:02 | <elias_a> Well it was even more popular 20 years back.
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| 08:02 | <Alternativend> anyway ;)
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| 08:03 | back to topic
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| 08:03 | <elias_a> Alternativend: Have you found any other activists near you?
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| 08:04 | I know some people who would possibly be of help.
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| 08:04 | Alternativend: And just to check - do you know the Skolelinux project the Norwegians run?
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| 08:05 | http://www.slx.no/
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| 08:05 | <Alternativend> Yes I do know it
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| 08:06 | and no I haven´t heard of similar things here..
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| 08:06 | <elias_a> Ok.
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| 08:06 | <Alternativend> Well Skolelinux is quite nice, but it dont fits for us.
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| 08:06 | <elias_a> Have you heard of the Munich case?
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| 08:06 | <Alternativend> Yes of course!
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| 08:07 | I really hope that this guys will have success
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| 08:07 | <elias_a> What you could do is to have a chat with them. They did some mistakes that led to resistance.
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| 08:08 | I know one of the guys as a name on a mailing list.
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| 08:08 | I can introduce you two if you want to.
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| 08:09 | alkisg: You see - even I am not that good in tech things, I can do these things... :)
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| 08:09 | <alkisg> elias_a: sometimes these are even more valuable ;)
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| 08:09 | <elias_a> I am a FLOSS pimp ;-)
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| 08:10 | <Alternativend> :)
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| 08:10 | Lobbyist
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| 08:10 | <elias_a> alkisg: I force nerds to talk to each other, too. :9
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| 08:10 | Alternativend: You got that right. I actually get paid for that and that is why I try to help you, too.
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| 08:11 | <Alternativend> Thank you very much
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| 08:11 | thats really kind
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| 08:12 | Unfortunately I don´t have anymore time today.
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| 08:12 | So lets do the following
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| 08:13 | <elias_a> Alternativend: This is the man: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf-Dieter_Zimmermann
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| 08:13 | <Alternativend> On Monday I will test the FAT-Client installtion of xfce, iceweassel, vlc and so on..
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| 08:14 | If the performance is good enoguh I will go on and test the winbind things
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| 08:15 | <elias_a> I don't know if he is a good contact. You can tell him that I told you to contact him.
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| 08:15 | He is retired but seems to be quite active.
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| 08:15 | <Alternativend> cool
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| 08:16 | <elias_a> My real name is Elias Aarnio if you wish to say hello ;)
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| 08:17 | <Alternativend> If the winbind things work I will go on and show my work to the responsible people in one school.
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| 08:18 | But no matter what the result will be I will inform you about that
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| 08:20 | <Alternativend> At the moment my ltsp runs on a virtualbox, and I guess the performance on a real server would be better.
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| 08:26 | For now I would like to sy a big THANK YOU for putting me into the right direction! I will look closer into it on Monday and Im quite sure that I will have further questions.
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| 08:27 | <alkisg> Good luck!
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| 08:27 | <Alternativend> Thank you!
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| 08:28 | I hope thats ok to ask further questions here :)
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| 08:30 | Have a great Weekend! We will see us on Monday, goodbye!
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| 08:35 | <elias_a> alkisg: I would like to write a few lines about your activities to my blog. I link to the map but is there also some URL I could point to?
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| 08:35 | <alkisg> The entry page is http://ts.sch.gr/ellak
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| 08:35 | (in greek)
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| 08:37 | <Alternativend> Whats the address of your blog?
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| 08:38 | Would love to read it.
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| 08:40 | <elias_a> Alternativend: It is only in Finnish :(
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| 08:40 | So far.
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| 08:41 | <Alternativend> hmh
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| 08:41 | ok
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| 08:41 | well I have to leave now, bye
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| 12:22 | <srdjo> is it safe to upgrade to 12.04 now ? Is anyone using it in production ?
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| 12:25 | <alkisg> Have you ever used a beta version in production?
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| 12:25 | (a beta os version)
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| 12:27 | * [GuS] Morning | |
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| 12:34 | <srdjo> no :)
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| 12:34 | but I just cant wait to see whats new :)
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| 12:34 | <Llama_be> then put it in a test virtual machine
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| 12:37 | ofcourse, it depends on what you mean by "in production"
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| 12:38 | if that means it is for you alone, and you don't mind having to figure out why certain problems arise, then it's something different than if 20 people are depending on the infrastructure
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| 13:16 | <srdjo> i mean are there some major bugs I should worry about - there is no point running LTSP server and client in VM - I will try it in the office with 5 clients - I hope all will work right - are there any major changes in 12.04 ?
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| 13:27 | <Llama_be> srdjo: but if you would just like to see what's new in Ubuntu, you wouldn't need to run it on LTSP, would you?
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| 13:43 | <srdjo> Llama_be, I am interested in LTSP changes not the Ubuntu ones. I dont use unity, so there is not much for me to see. Since I have Firefox and Chrome memory problems (disappearing browsers :) in Fat clients) on 11.10 I thought there might be some stability upgrades in 12.04.
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| 16:01 | <xsl> guys is it ok to have 20 users on a 8GB server (if they are thin clients)? (giving libreoffice and chromium on the server )
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| 16:01 | 8GB RAM
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| 16:01 | or is there a website with some performance/requisites charts i can check
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| 16:16 | <Llama_be> knipwim: I found the issue why I was getting a grub install: I was stupidly using quickstart installer with kicktoo profile. Changed that, and it has built me a client now
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| 16:21 | <knipwim> Llama_be: hehe nice one
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| 16:39 | <muppis> !win32-loader
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| 16:39 | <ltsp> muppis: win32-loader: win32-loader.exe can be used to add a "PXE - Network boot" option to the Windows boot manager. It's developed for Debian and it uses gPXE/iPXE for the network booting. You can download a binary from http://ts.sch.gr/docs/kanonismoi-diadikasies/doc_download/327-ltsp-loader - (if someone can write a wiki page about it it'd be nice :))
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| 19:13 | <andygraybeal_> aftenroon
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| 19:16 | <knipwim> hey andy
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| 19:19 | <andygraybeal_> hi knipwim
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| 19:55 | <jg> What's the recommended URL with the recipe to get LTSP running on Lubuntu 11.10?
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| 19:59 | <srdjo> Dont know about Lubuntu, but see if you can use something from this Ubuntu guide http://mojotechblog.wordpress.com/2011/12/01/ubuntu-11-10-ltsp/
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| 20:08 | <knipwim> what, seriously, nbd boot says "Exported device is too big for me. Get a 64-bit machine"
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| 20:08 | <dead_inside> lol
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| 20:08 | <knipwim> but all my clients are 32 bit
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| 20:08 | <||cw> how big?
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| 20:08 | <dead_inside> is your nbd image over 4G?
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| 20:09 | <||cw> knipwim: my server is x64 and clients x32, it's not a problem
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| 20:09 | <dead_inside> whats the size of the image....
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| 20:09 | <knipwim> hmm, the image is 350M but the nbd negotation says 4229768MB
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| 20:09 | <||cw> it's a little obnoxious when 3rd party installers in the chroot see the x64 kernel and install the wrong libs, but otherwise it's been fine
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| 20:11 | <alkisg> knipwim: ehhh I've seen that, it was a wrong configuration, let me see if I can remember what it was...
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| 20:13 | ...maybe it was trying to connect via named-based export, when the server was only listening for port-based exports, or vice-versa...
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| 20:16 | <knipwim> i do try to connect a namebased export
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| 20:17 | but i don't refer to a port, by default it's listening on 10809
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| 20:17 | <alkisg> What's your nbd-server configuration like?
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| 20:17 | `grep -rv ^# /etc/nbd-server` or something...
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| 20:19 | <knipwim> http://dpaste.com/717556/
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| 20:20 | that's in /etc/nbd-server/config
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| 20:25 | <alkisg> Damn I can't remember well... it might also have been the sequence of the parameters of nbd-client
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| 20:25 | <alkisg> I.e. if the -N name was in the wrong place, it did that... maybe
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| 20:26 | knipwim: what's your nbd-client command line like?
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| 20:28 | <knipwim> nbd-client 192.168.0.1 -N ltsp /dev/nbd0
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| 20:30 | <alkisg> All look fine... sorry I can't remember what it was
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| 20:30 | <knipwim> no worries
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| 21:23 | <jg> srdjo, Thx.
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| 21:31 | <talntid> anyone here ran thin clients over the web?
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| 21:31 | remote thin clients, that is
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| 21:32 | <||cw> probably would work OK for rdp or vnc, I woudln't want to try X
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| 21:32 | neatx/nxclient might be OK though
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| 21:32 | <talntid> hmm
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| 22:20 | <vagrantc_> !seen alkisg
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| 22:20 | <ltsp> vagrantc_: alkisg was last seen in #ltsp 1 hour, 49 minutes, and 58 seconds ago: <alkisg> All look fine... sorry I can't remember what it was
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| 23:17 | <vagrantc_> i guess no new epoptes today... :)
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| 23:28 | <jg> Any suggestions for which LTSP config file has the default client (LXDE) wallpaper? I'd like to change the initial new user client machine default wallpaper.
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