IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 28 May 2015 (all times are UTC)
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| 03:05 | <raimundo> hello
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| 03:07 | work_alkisg is now known as alkisg | |
| 03:07 | <alkisg> Hi
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| 08:18 | <bojan_> Alkisg:Can you please tell me what was the problem you faced when you were trying to change my LTSP thin to FAT Server??
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| 08:19 | alkisg:I want to make my server as FAT..Can you please help me??
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| 08:19 | <alkisg> bojan_: I don't remember :)
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| 08:19 | bojan_: sorry, for a few weeks I won't have much time for free support, jobs come first... :-/
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| 08:20 | !ltsp-pnp
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| 08:20 | <ltsp`> ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 08:20 | <alkisg> You can try this ^ though
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| 08:20 | <alkisg> You're welcome
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| 08:20 | :)
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| 08:37 | <fiesh> does someone have an idea why, when entering a wrong login, it always takes forever, then the login manager closes and restarts, often extremely slow (like 20 seconds)
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| 08:38 | successful logins work fast
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| 08:38 | but wrong username and/or password results in a very slow login manager restart
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| 08:39 | <alkisg> fiesh: which ltsp version? what's the output of `sudo ltsp-info`?
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| 08:39 | <fiesh> server 5.4.4, client 5.4.3, and:
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| 08:39 | server information:
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| 08:39 | LSB Version: n/a
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| 08:39 | Distributor ID: Gentoo
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| 08:39 | Description: NAME=Gentoo
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| 08:40 | Release: n/a
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| 08:40 | Codename: n/a
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| 08:40 | server packages:
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| 08:40 | ltsp-client-5.4.3
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| 08:40 | ltsp-server-5.4.4
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| 08:40 | ldminfod-20120430
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| 08:40 | ltspfs-1.1
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| 08:40 | packages in chroot: /opt/ltsp/amd64
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| 08:40 | ltsp-client-5.4.3
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| 08:40 | ldm-2.2.11
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| 08:40 | ltspfs-1.1
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| 08:40 | found: /opt/ltsp/amd64/etc/lts.conf
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| 08:40 | found: /tftpboot/ltsp/amd64/lts.conf
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| 08:40 | <fiesh> (it's always been like this, but now it sometimes really does become a nuisance)
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| 08:41 | but it's ok if there's no "oh yeah, do this and that, common problem" solution, it's not really worth going through a lot of debugging either, just forces people to type their password correctly ;)
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| 08:49 | <alkisg> Gentoo? Nice... :)
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| 08:49 | I was thinking it could be related to a recent change in ltsp, but you're using an older version
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| 08:50 | So it's just plain ssh time outs etc, as ldm is using ssh
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| 08:50 | You can search+change those from /etc/ssh/ssh_config and/or LDM_SSH_OPTIONS
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| 08:56 | <fiesh> oh, so the server has a long timeout on an incorrect ssh login, resulting in this long timeout? hmm, even though running sshguard, I'm a little hesitant to raise these values too far, since the server is publicly accessible via ssh
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| 08:58 | I don't think there's a way to handle this from the client side, since it's the server who is (on purpose) delaying the wrong login information message, correct?
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| 08:59 | but thank you for explaining, makes total sense, should have thought about it myself
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| 09:01 | <alkisg> The ssh client side does have its own timeouts, but they're not as big as you describe
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| 09:02 | It might be possible that sshguard makes things worse...
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| 09:08 | <fiesh> sshguard is whitelisted on the internal network
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| 09:32 | <alkisg> Not as a firewall, as a delay
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| 09:32 | (I don't know sshguard though)
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| 11:38 | <gp> vagrantc: About using centrifydc auth on the clients - that would probably simplify things. I am not sure if the joining the windows domain could be automated very well though. I will have to look into it
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| 11:45 | <gp> Is it possible to use variables in the lts.conf? I was thinking about a more concise way to configure some clients to default to LDM and some to default to xfreerdp. It would be nice if I could define the xfreerdp command as a variable and do something like SCREEN_07=$PRIMARYXFREERDPCMD or SCREEN_06=$PRIMARYXFREERDPCMD to prevent typos
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| 12:27 | <awei_> hi, I'm getting permission denied errors when the client boots and tries to write to /etc/hosts. any ideas?
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| 14:20 | work_alkisg is now known as alkisg | |
| 14:25 | <miup> alkisg: ok... but with our squeeze images, some clients work "smoother" as with wheezy :/ Anyhow, Scrolling in Firefox i.e is mostly really smooth. But scrolling in a terminal is really annoying if you scroll trough text. You can see how the lines slide ;)
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| 14:26 | <alkisg> miup: is that xterm or gnome-terminal?
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| 14:26 | <miup> urxvt
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| 14:26 | <alkisg> Does it use double-buffering?
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| 14:27 | <miup> huh, dunno... wait a minute (with xterm there are the same symptoms)
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| 14:28 | <alkisg> About squeeze vs wheezy, at that point the XAA acceleration method was dropped, that's why some drivers started being very slow or unstable or completely non-functional
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| 14:28 | It's a xorg issue
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| 14:28 | xterm doesn't use double-buffering AFAIK, while firefox and gnome-terminal do
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| 14:29 | Anyway, whatever xorg issues are there in ltsp-localapps, surely LTSP isn't to blame, xorg is
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| 14:30 | <miup> it's clear that it is an xorg issue, but maybe anyone around here has similar experiance ;)
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| 14:31 | <alkisg> Sure, we all had that experience :)
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| 14:31 | <miup> oh, and disabling/enabling buffering in urvxt makes no difference
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| 14:31 | <alkisg> What buffering are you referring to?
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| 14:31 | Scroll buffer?
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| 14:31 | That's a completely different topic
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| 14:31 | It's not related to drawing to the screen at all
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| 14:31 | <miup> buffered: boolean
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| 14:31 | Compile xft: Turn on/off double-buffering for xft (default enabled). On some card/driver combination enabling it slightly decreases performance, on most it greatly helps it. The slowdown is small, so it should normally be enabled.
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| 14:31 | ;)
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| 14:33 | <alkisg> It's unrelated
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| 14:33 | It's about font buffering, not about screen buffering
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| 14:33 | Try with gnome-terminal
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| 14:34 | <miup> mee, I'm trying the installed terminals...
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| 14:35 | hm... with xfce4-terminal it is better, one sec, I will test a thing
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| 14:37 | (we don't have gnome-terminal installed, we using lxde or i3, so mostly no gnome related packages ;))
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| 14:38 | <alkisg> Sure I was just trying to say that if you install live on the client you'll get a proof that it's app-related, not driver-related
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| 14:38 | <fiesh> hmm, xterm works really well for me
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| 14:38 | is it supposed not to? ;)
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| 14:39 | <alkisg> The xterm flickering is too fast to be annoying in quick PCs... :)
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| 14:39 | <fiesh> oh ok, hehe
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| 14:40 | dosbox also works like a charm, and so does mplayer, I was surprised
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| 14:40 | <miup> it's a shame urxvt is not working charm :/
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| 14:40 | <fiesh> only certain qt applications suck, most notably qtcreator....
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| 14:41 | <miup> fiesh: we are mostly working with PIII @ 1GHz with a "better" GPU
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| 14:42 | <fiesh> yeah I guess that's a whole different story then, we have the newest NUCs and 4k monitors... which surprisingly also work great with thin clients
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| 14:44 | <fiesh> miup: is that even superior so say just using a raspberry pi?
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| 14:44 | <awei_> hi, i broke my ltsp image somehow. i'm now getting "Permission denied" from client when trying to write to /etc/hosts on startup. any ideas?
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| 14:44 | <fiesh> to
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| 14:45 | <alkisg> miup: btw what's the output of `lspci -nn -k | grep -A 2 VGA` on these clients?
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| 14:46 | awei_: distro/version?
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| 14:46 | <awei_> alkisg: thx for reply. running ubuntu 14.04 with ltsp-client 5.5.4
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| 14:47 | <alkisg> awei_: are you using the greek schools ppa?
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| 14:47 | <awei_> alkisg: here's backstory: i thought i was being clever by mounting the NFS image read/write so that i could do some desktop-based configuration/installation then change back to read-only when finished. now it won't boot.
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| 14:47 | alkisg: i'm using greek schools ppa, yes.
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| 14:47 | <alkisg> awei_: nfs? ubuntu uses nbd by default...
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| 14:48 | <awei_> alkisg: i configured to use NFS mounted image and /home
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| 14:48 | <alkisg> OK about /home, but why NFS mounted image?
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| 14:48 | <awei_> well, again, i thought i was being clever so that i could install from the GUI rather than command line
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| 14:48 | and then i would switch back to read-only after i was satisfied
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| 14:49 | but, now that i've switched back, i'm getting write permission issues. I could rebuild from scratch and do all install from command line in chroot, but was hoping someone might see something obvious
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| 14:50 | <alkisg> The ltsp boot process destroyed your chroot since you had it rw and overlayfs doesn't work upon nfs
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| 14:50 | <awei_> ok, so, bottom line is don't do what i did.
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| 14:50 | <miup> fiesh: I was using my private raspberry as LTSP client with berryboot, it was ok but I like to use a dualhead setup
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> awei_: Right. You could check the date of all the files and try to revert them, or you could build a new chroot.
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| 14:51 | <miup> alkisg: 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] RV350 [Radeon 9550] [1002:4153]
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| 14:51 | Subsystem: ASUSTeK Computer Inc. Device [1043:008e]
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| 14:51 | Kernel driver in use: radeon
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> awei_: for gui management of chroots, see ltsp-pnp
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| 14:51 | !ltsp-pnp
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| 14:51 | <ltsp`> ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 14:51 | <awei_> ltsp`: i tried that tutorial with little success, unfortunately.
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| 14:52 | ok, no worries. thanks for the explanation. i'll rebuild using command line and read-only.
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| 14:53 | <miup> alkisg: but mostly all clients are differnt, we using old hardware, because we collect them (und better hardware ~core 2 duo) and repair and sell them
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| 14:53 | <alkisg> miup, for old hardware check this: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTA0NDg
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| 14:54 | We have a lot of old cards here too (supporting hundreds of schools), we usually just throw away XAA-based cards
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| 14:54 | <miup> hm... I will take a look
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| 14:55 | <alkisg> The biggest problem is SiS (onboard), they're too common, and barely work with EXA, but give a lot of segfaults
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| 14:55 | Anyway, some xorg-related channel would be more suited for your questions...
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| 14:55 | They have more xorg knowledge than #ltsp
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| 14:56 | <miup> I will take a look
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| 14:56 | but thanks for your time and help (:
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| 14:56 | <alkisg> np
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| 14:58 | <miup> anyhow, I'm currently testing setups, to determine which are the hw requirements to work properly and smooth
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| 14:59 | <alkisg> It really depends on the kernel + xorg version
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| 14:59 | <miup> and as I can see, mostly the cpu's are the bottleneck
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| 15:00 | <alkisg> It's very hit-and-miss, we've kept schools at 12.04 because they have many kernel/xorg versions there, and it's easier to find a combination that works
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| 15:00 | But we even had schools that needed 2 chroots because no single combination worked in all clients :(
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| 15:01 | <miup> hm... but proberly with newer software packages?
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| 15:01 | <alkisg> No, we've seen all combinations of old/new working/not-working
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| 15:01 | There are many regressions even for new hardware
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| 15:02 | <miup> mee, on my old private gaming rig, I had also a xorg problem and was long using squeeze because of this
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| 15:02 | <alkisg> So e.g. we've had schools with dual core PCs that needed the older kernel, yet their 15-years-old P3's were working fine with all kernels...
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| 15:02 | <miup> xD
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| 15:02 | thats interesting
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| 15:03 | <alkisg> A complete mess, our advice now is "keep whatever's working"
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| 15:03 | <miup> :D
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| 15:04 | as I said, we have also two chroots because of some weird incompatiblity
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| 15:10 | <s0lid> Hey any idea why xorg is throwing me fatal error, "invalid argument for -config"?
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| 15:11 | this usually happens when I got machine with intel's integrated gpu or the machine is a laptop, although one laptop with intels gpu work
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| 15:13 | something must happen with generating the xorg.config
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| 15:16 | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/816139 oh :)
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| 15:21 | <gp> Anyone familiar with setting up a web browser screen like a kiosk for anonymous use? I'd like to have a terminal set up for anyone to access web mail
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| 15:21 | Maybe like the xfreerdp screen script but with a browser
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| 15:23 | I guess it would be important to automatically wipe saved passwords and history after inactivity
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| 15:28 | <alkisg> gp, there's a kiosk plugin for ltsp, see the bug above ^
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| 15:28 | google for kiosk ltsp
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| 15:28 | SCREEN_07=kiosk etc
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| 15:29 | <gp> alkisg: Okay cool. Thanks. I had looked for it but all the information I found indicated it was outdated. I didn't want to try it without asking.
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| 15:30 | <alkisg> It's not very well maintained, but it was rewritten a couple of years ago... it should mostly work, with a couple of bugs...
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| 15:30 | <gp> Well that should get me going
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| 20:38 | <gp_alt_> So I've removed shutdown options available on the desktop. Malicious users could override my efforts but I am okay with that for now. But, I am having a difficult time finding a way to remove the shutdown option from the LDM greeter. Anyone know how to do that?
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| 20:39 | I would prefer to actually remove the button. Not just make it non-functional via user permissions of some sort
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| 21:06 | <awei_> hi, using ltsp-server 5.5.4 and ltsp-client 5.5.4 on ubuntu 14.04. clean ltsp client image with gnome installed as DE. I'm getting "cannot create /etc/hosts permission denied" and DE does not load
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