IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 15 February 2021 (all times are UTC)
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| 10:38 | <antareS_> Hello!!! just switching to the new LTSP and coming from PiNet (which made everything veeery easy) and looking for some advice on how to install ltsp in a virtual machine. I've been looking around the past tw days but found little about the new LTSP
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| 10:39 | <alkisg> Hello antareS_
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| 10:39 | Everything about the new ltsp is in ltsp.org
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| 10:40 | https://ltsp.org/docs/installation for the usual ltsp server installation, even if it's in a vm,
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| 10:40 | And https://ltsp.org/docs/installation/raspios/ for raspberries
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| 10:41 | pinet just added a gui to run the ltsp commands, while the code that made everything easy was already in ltsp :)
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| 10:41 | <antareS_> Yes, I read that. I want to make a new fresh install and I've made it already. But no success and I guess it is because I am installing LTSP in a VM.
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| 10:41 | <alkisg> What is the "no success" error message?
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| 10:42 | What part is failing and what error does it show?
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| 10:45 | <antareS_> Basically the RPi's couldn't get the OS. But my question here is about: possible keywords, hints, to search for and try before asking for "real help"... I mean things I should have read thorougly (apart from the ltsp docs) If you think, for instance, that running LTSP in a VM is a no-go
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| 10:45 | <alkisg> You only need the 2 URLs I linked to, and a "bridged mode NIC" in your LTSP VM
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| 10:45 | Nothing more to read about it
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| 10:48 | <antareS_> OK. I'll start over again and come back later.
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| 10:48 | <alkisg> OK
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| 10:48 | antareS_: it's a good idea to do the chrootless mode first, and boot a pc client
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| 10:48 | I.e. all the installation page
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| 10:48 | And THEN to go to the raspios page, and boot a raspberry
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| 10:49 | As raspberries are more difficult to troubleshoot, they don't show messages before they receive their bootcode.bin etc
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| 10:49 | <antareS_> OK but... chrootless means I serve "the server itself" doesn't it?
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| 10:49 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 10:49 | You can delete the image afterwards without issues
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| 10:50 | <antareS_> OK. I'll do the simplest first and then move on. By the way... I'd love to keep my pinet image... I tried to copy the chroot and use it with the new LTSP. is it crazy?
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| 10:51 | <alkisg> From "ltsp server" to "chrootless" it's just `ltsp image / && ltsp ipxe`; while to delete it, it's `rm /srv/ltsp/images/x84_64.img && ltsp ipxe`
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| 10:51 | It should be possible to keep your old pinet image, sure. Although you don't need the ltsp-client packages anymore and you can uninstall them
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| 10:51 | Follow the raspios page inside your pinet chroot
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| 10:52 | Note though that pinet was using the debootstrap command, which resulted in a much lower quality image than the new ltsp
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| 10:52 | I.e. it was missing all the raspberry pi os optimizations
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| 10:58 | <antareS_> Well, I have to ponder if it is an option. I had it configured very simple (just openbox) and I am in a sort of a hurry... and keeping the old image will save a lot of time. But I should move on for sure.
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| 10:59 | <alkisg> Sure, you should be able to keep it even without any changes at all
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| 10:59 | The new LTSP sends its code while it boots, so it doesn't even need an ltsp-client package
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| 11:01 | <antareS_> Aah... I see that no desktop servers (headless?) are not recommended. I wanted to install it in a no-desktop ubuntu 20 server. Could it be an issue? Or the recommendation is just for making things easier with GUIs?
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| 11:02 | <alkisg> It's not a problem to use a headless server, the same instructions apply, even for chrootless
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| 11:02 | The booted client will again be headless, of course
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| 11:03 | The recommendation is there in order to be able to use epoptes to control the clients etc
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| 11:07 | <antareS_> Ok, so in my first attempt I should xpect to have a headless thing (the same as the server, being ltsp chrootles) and if i am able to serve the chroot, as it always used to be. Yhanks
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| 11:07 | Thanks
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| 11:38 | Well, i have to say... it's absolutely appealing... chrootless up and running!!! Now time to try the chroot thing.
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| 12:19 | Well, just installed the old chroot and tested with a laptop. Of course it doesn't boot but at least ipxe menu is modified and I see there are attempts to get the thing. I guess I have the problem with the RPi itself. I followed the netboot procedure, but in my case I have a RPi 3 and no way without SD card. With SD card, however, there is some
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| 12:19 | network activity and, in fact, I get something I guess interesting from wireshark
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| 12:19 | but nothing on screen
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| 12:34 | <douglas_br> hello! How are you?
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| 12:34 | <antareS_> OK... i used wireshark to see what's going on... basically there are complaints about not finding relevant files. I made a simple dump here, just in case you can take a look
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| 12:34 | https://gist.github.com/jtornero/d4705ebab678d5dd3248ae92eb711bff
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| 12:37 | <douglas_br> someone have motherboard with aptio setup utility? (american megatrends BIOS). I have mini pc with this bios and cannot find option to change the boot mode for lan / network / ipxe
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| 13:00 | <alkisg> dragon788: upload screenshots for us to see
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| 13:01 | antareS_: not all the files are needed. What's the output of ls -l /srv/tftp | nc termbin.com 9999 ?
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| 13:01 | dragon788: sorry I meant douglas_br
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| 13:01 | douglas_br: upload screenshots for us to see
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| 13:06 | antareS_: note that rpi3 can boot either with sd-card or without it
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| 13:06 | If you ARE using an sd card, make sure it has the latest bootcode.bin and not an old one; it got fixed a year ago or so
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| 13:06 | <antareS_> https://termbin.com/cgl9
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| 13:07 | <alkisg> antareS_: you didn't follow the raspios page steps carefully
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| 13:07 | antareS_: here's mine: https://termbin.com/tty2
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| 13:07 | This is done by the ltsp kernel step, after you've configured the correct rpi_image in ltsp.conf
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| 13:08 | https://ltsp.org/docs/installation/raspios/#server-preparation
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| 13:08 | This is needed because rpi is implements netbooting in a very, very bad way :)
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| 13:09 | I've filed bug reports about it but they didn't really bother fixing their bugs
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| 13:10 | Note that in ltsp5 (=what you think that pinet did, it was done by ltsp5), an sd card was needed with a local kernel etc
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| 13:10 | In the new ltsp, I reimplemented that part better so the sd card isn't needed anymore
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| 13:10 | <antareS_> No. I guess it was for a new raspios setup. I tried copying the chroot. Guessed those instructions were for new installs and for existing chroots the simple approach (ltsp image [chroot]) will be enough.
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| 13:10 | <alkisg> You'll need half of the instructions there
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| 13:11 | The simple approach would be enough for other architectures, but raspberries need these extra commands and steps
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| 13:11 | You need ALL that page, except for the "chroot preparation" paragraph
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| 13:13 | <antareS_> OK, I just followed the ltsp.conf instructions, I mean, the "Server preparation" but no the others. I'm starting over, thanks a lot!!!!!!!!
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| 13:14 | I guess instead "raspios" it can be named whatever I like (I inherited 'armhf' from my old ltsp/pinet installation)
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| 13:14 | <alkisg> antareS_: it's a good idea to rename armhf to raspios, it'll save you time troubleshooting things
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| 13:14 | But sure, you can name it however you want. Avoid spaces.
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| 13:15 | Also note that things got moved from /opt/ltsp to /srv/ltsp
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| 13:18 | <antareS_> OK, thanks
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| 13:18 | <alkisg> antareS_: also do the steps below this line: At this point, Raspberry Pi OS should be in /srv/ltsp/raspios. This chroot isn't ready for netbooting yet, the following commands are needed:
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| 13:18 | They might not be needed with ltsp5, but do them just in case
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| 13:18 | <douglas_br> dragon788 here: https://imgur.com/ZB7Qf2R
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| 13:19 | <alkisg> douglas_br: I typed "dragon788" by mistake; it was me talking to you; dragon788 hasn't said anything :)
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| 13:20 | douglas_br: the other tabs will be needed too; you'll need like 10 screenshots :)
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| 13:20 | Upload these tabs next: advanced, chipset, boot,
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| 13:25 | <douglas_br> sorry! I need to say to person to send me the screenshots because mini pc is in other city. But, we enter all mode: advanced, chipset, boot.
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| 13:26 | <alkisg> douglas_br: no problem, you may also upload them in the github discussion; I'll go afk for a while anyway, back in a couple of hours...
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| 13:28 | <douglas_br> yes alkisg I did start in github. Thank you
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| 16:34 | <eu^1909212715> hi, i'm new to this chat. I have problems with ltsp clients
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| 16:36 | <alkisg> Hi eu^1909212715
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| 16:36 | eu^1909212715: what problems?
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| 16:37 | <eu^1909212715> i am this guy https://github.com/ltsp/ltsp/discussions/400
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| 16:38 | <alkisg> It's best if you use a nickname in IRC. To set one, type this command here in irc: /nick alequint8912
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| 16:38 | Let me re-read that discussion...
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| 16:38 | Ah right where your home isn't mounted
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| 16:38 | eu^1909212715 is now known as alequint8912 | |
| 16:39 | <alkisg> Can I see via vnc? If yes, do this:
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| 16:39 | !vnc-alkisg
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| 16:39 | <ltspbot> vnc-alkisg: To share your screen with me, run this: sudo apt-get --yes install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect alkisg.ltsp.org; this is a reverse connection, it doesn't need port forwarding etc.
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| 16:41 | <alequint8912> ok wait
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| 16:43 | I can not connect
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| 16:44 | <alkisg> What is the error message?
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| 16:44 | <alequint8912> ******************************************************************************
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| 16:44 | Have you tried the x11vnc '-ncache' VNC client-side pixel caching feature yet?
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| 16:44 | The scheme stores pixel data offscreen on the VNC viewer side for faster
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| 16:44 | retrieval. It should work with any VNC viewer. Try it by running:
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| 16:44 | x11vnc -ncache 10 ...
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| 16:44 | One can also add -ncache_cr for smooth 'copyrect' window motion.
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| 16:44 | More info: http://www.karlrunge.com/x11vnc/faq.html#faq-client-caching
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 Making connection to client on host alkisg.ltsp.org port 5500
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| 16:44 | |D-chain|-<>-192.168.70.3:3128-<><>-81.186.20.0:5500-<--denied
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 rfbConnectToTcoAddr: failed to connect
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| 16:44 | : Connection refused
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connection failed: Connection refused
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connect_tcp: trying: alkisg.ltsp.org 5500
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| 16:44 | |D-chain|-<>-192.168.70.3:3128-<><>-81.186.20.0:5500-<--denied
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 rfbConnectToTcoAddr: failed to connect
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| 16:44 | : Connection refused
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connect_tcp: connection failed: Connection refused
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| 16:44 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connect_tcp: re-trying alkisg.ltsp.org 5500
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| 16:44 | <alkisg> !paste
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| 16:44 | <ltspbot> paste: To avoid channel flooding, please upload text longer than 3 lines to http://paste.debian.net. Don't forget to paste the resulting URL here.
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| 16:45 | <alkisg> Do not paste more than 3 lines in IRC, because freenode will kick/ban you...
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| 16:46 | Do you have a firewall that blocks the connection?
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| 16:46 | Try `sudo ufw disable` in case you have ufw
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| 16:46 | <alequint8912> D-chain|-<>-192.168.70.3:3128-<><>-81.186.20.0:5500-<--denied
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| 16:46 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connect_tcp[ipv6]: connect: Connection refused
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| 16:46 | 15/02/2021 11:45:08 connect_tcp[ipv6]: setsockopt IPV6_V6ONLY: Protocol not available
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| 16:47 | <alkisg> Hmm why ipv6?
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| 16:47 | It's an ipv4 address
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| 16:48 | <alequint8912> I don't know, I have an IPv4 address
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| 16:49 | <alkisg> Check your firewall. Maybe that's what's causing all the issues.
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| 16:49 | alequint8912: are you using a proxy to access the internet?
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| 16:50 | Yeah I guess that's the issue, you're going through a proxy and the proxy blocks you
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| 16:51 | Try this: x11vnc -connect alkisg.ltsp.org:80
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| 16:55 | <alkisg> OK
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| 17:11 | <alkisg> alequint8912: so the command you needed was, inside the VM: sudo apt install --install-recommends ltsp epoptes-client
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| 17:11 | That's because stupid Linux Mint disables `--install-recommends`, it's a bad distribution
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| 17:11 | I'll update ltsp.org to note that
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| 17:12 | <alequint8912> s the only distribution that works for me
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| 17:13 | <alequint8912> the client is very poor
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| 17:13 | intel D2500
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| 17:13 | 2GB ram
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| 17:13 | i try with ubuntu but does not load
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| 17:14 | <alkisg> Ubuntu MATE is much lighter
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| 17:14 | Don't try Ubuntu GNOME, try Ubuntu MATE, I also have the link for the .iso in the installation page
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| 17:14 | And with 2 GB RAM, it might be best to use Ubuntu MATE 18.04 32bit as the client VM
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| 17:15 | <alequint8912> can we prove it?
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| 17:15 | <alkisg> Sure, boot any live cd or installation that you like, open a terminal and type `free`
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| 17:15 | I've done that, and Mint needed a whole lot ram than mate
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| 17:16 | It's: GNOME > KDE > XFCE > MATE > LXDE
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| 17:16 | I don't remember cinnamon, I think it's as heavy as GNOME
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| 17:17 | <alequint8912> this version is Linux mint 18 xcfe
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| 17:17 | <alkisg> OK, so it's just a bit more heavy than ubuntu mate. Is it 32 or 64 bit?
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| 17:17 | <alequint8912> 32
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| 17:17 | <alkisg> OK
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| 17:17 | Which Ubuntu version is that?
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| 17:17 | Is it based on 18.04?
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| 17:17 | <alequint8912> the server?
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| 17:18 | 20.04
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| 17:18 | <alkisg> No, the Linux Mint 18 XFCE
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| 17:18 | <alequint8912> i think 16.04
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| 17:18 | <alkisg> cat /etc/os-release, should have it
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| 17:19 | Anyway I'd go for MATE 18.04; but this should also work
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| 17:21 | <alequint8912> it doesnt say
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| 17:21 | ok i wil type de command
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| 17:22 | you are watching my screen?
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| 17:23 | <alkisg> No, let me see..
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| 17:33 | <alequint8912> ok I create the image
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| 17:34 | and run ltsp ipxe
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| 17:34 | ltsp nfs
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| 17:34 | ltsp initrd
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| 17:52 | <alkisg> alequint8912: everything ok now?
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| 18:05 | <alequint8912> no, stay the same
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| 18:06 | Im downloading ubuntu mate 18.04
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| 18:06 | maybe with him it will work
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| 18:08 | I can't add the ltsp ppa repository on linux mint
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| 18:08 | can't install ltsp library
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| 18:12 | <alkisg> alequint8912: it's not needed
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| 18:12 | You ran ltsp image and it didn't work after that?
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| 18:13 | alequint8912: login to theclient, and run sshfs, is it there?
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| 18:14 | <alequint8912> no is not there
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| 18:15 | cant find the package
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| 18:16 | <alkisg> alequint8912: then you didn't run ltsp image properly
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| 18:16 | Maybe you installed sshfs in the copied vm, but not in the correct one
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| 18:17 | <alequint8912> let me see
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| 18:19 | ok in the vm it say missing host
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| 18:19 | but I use that vm when create the image
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| 18:20 | let me do it again
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| 18:20 | I win type thi command ltsp image VM-flat
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| 18:20 | then ltsp ipxe
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| 18:21 | then ltsp nfs
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| 18:21 | and ltsp initrd
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| 18:21 | is correct?
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| 18:34 | ok i bott the client and recognize sshfs
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| 18:34 | and mount home
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| 18:37 | <alkisg> Great
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| 18:39 | <alequint8912> wow it works jajaja
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| 18:39 | save my changes
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| 18:39 | <alkisg> All this because of silly linux mint breaking debian policy with --no-install-recommends :)
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| 18:39 | <alequint8912> thanks you very much
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| 18:39 | <alkisg> You're welcome
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| 18:39 | <alequint8912> so you recomends intall ubuntu mate
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| 18:40 | <alkisg> If you remember to use --install-recommends, then mint isn't an issue, you can keep using it
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| 18:40 | But for new installations, yeah I believe ubuntu mate is superior to mint for a lot of reasons
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| 18:40 | <alequint8912> ok I will try ubuntu
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| 18:40 | <alkisg> With just 2 GB RAM, remember to use a 32bit version, so either up to 18.04, or debian
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| 18:41 | I.e. don't use ubuntu 20.04, it's 64bit only
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| 18:41 | And it wastes a lot of RAM
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| 18:41 | <alequint8912> ok thanks
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| 18:41 | <alkisg> np
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| 18:41 | <alequint8912> so where I give you the stars
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| 18:41 | <alkisg> What stars?
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| 18:42 | For "question solved" in github?
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| 18:42 | <highvoltage> there's an ice-cream tub full of stars, I usually just take one of the gold ones and push it on to alkisg's forehead
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| 18:43 | <alkisg> Ice cream? Where? Where?
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| 18:43 | :D
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| 18:43 | <alequint8912> jaja I dont know the corrent answer, doesnt it work like that
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| 18:43 | ?
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| 18:43 | yes question solved
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| 18:43 | <alkisg> OK let me post a reply
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| 18:44 | alequint8912: last reply there: https://github.com/ltsp/ltsp/discussions/400
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| 18:44 | OK now we're politically correct, we have a star :D
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| 18:47 | <alequint8912> so this chat support only ltsp or other things
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| 18:47 | <alkisg> ltsp and epoptes
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| 18:48 | <alequint8912> ok thanks
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| 19:05 | <highvoltage> alkisg: I scream, you scream, it's 2021, we all scream
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| 19:12 | <antareS_> Well... in PiNet all the user "lived" ad the server and had their own home at the server. How is it done now?
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| 20:08 | <alkisg> antareS_: pinet is ltsp5. I wrote the code to boot raspberries in ltsp5 myself :)
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| 20:09 | The new LTSP works the same way as the old LTSP, the user accounts and home are on the server
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| 20:10 | I.e. it's best to say "in ltsp5..." than to say "in pinet", because pinet had no code for that; it was all done by ltsp
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| 20:45 | <antareS_> alksig: From now on, I'll refer to it as ltsp5... it was just for putting it into context.
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| 20:45 | so fro creating an account, I just create users on the server machine, isn't it?
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| 20:55 | <alkisg> Yes, and you run `ltsp initrd` to have them show up on the clients on the next reboot
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