IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 23 December 2013 (all times are UTC)
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| 03:57 | <alkisg> highvoltage: do you have upstream commit access to gnome-panel?
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| 03:58 | There are 4-5 issues in Trusty to be taken care of... patches included for some of them ;)
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| 04:08 | * vagrantc waves to alkisg | |
| 04:08 | * alkisg waves to vagrantc and waits for the ltsp6 branch :D | |
| 04:08 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 04:09 | hoping to put in some ltsp work this week
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| 04:10 | <alkisg> Except for ~10 significant bugs, Trusty is in a good shape, so I wouldn't mind doing some work for an ldm-less ltsp branch...
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| 04:11 | So if you think you have time for it, I'd say let's do it :)
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| 04:16 | <vagrantc> ok, virtual en-of-year hackfest commences now!
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| 04:17 | * alkisg sends a dozen virtual beers to vagrant!!! | |
| 04:26 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 04:27 | * vagrantc virtually drinks up | |
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| 04:56 | <vagrantc> alkisg: well, got my testing environment updated.. so i should be able to start on things tomorrow
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| 04:57 | probably first going to up load cdpingerless ltspfs
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| 04:57 | <alkisg> Shouldn't that go to the stable branch first?
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| 04:57 | ...before the "split"?
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| 04:57 | <vagrantc> stable?
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| 04:57 | <alkisg> We'll split ltsp-trunk to [ltsp5, ltsp-trunk], right?
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| 04:58 | <vagrantc> ah, forking each current repository
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| 04:58 | i was going to just try it as a patch to debian, first off
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| 04:59 | but maybe i should first commit upstream...
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| 04:59 | <alkisg> Or maybe [ltsp-trunk, ltsp6], so that we can even ship an ltsp6 package that could be usable but not much tested in production?
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| 04:59 | <vagrantc> i'd be inclined to branch off ltsp-5
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| 05:00 | and push most fixes to ltsp-trunk, and backport/cherry-pick individual commits to ltsp-5
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| 05:01 | <alkisg> OK, but what about packaging? It's either hit-or-miss for 14.04/jessie?
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| 05:02 | <vagrantc> packaging branches should be similarly split if needed
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| 05:02 | just really depends how long it's going to remain broken
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| 05:03 | <alkisg> We'll move some of the ldm scripts to ltsp-trunk, right?
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| 05:03 | So they'll conflict with ldm...
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| 05:04 | And since ltsp-client Depends: ldm...
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| 05:04 | ...I think we'll need some packaging changes
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| 05:04 | <vagrantc> sure
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| 05:04 | but ltspfs, for example, may not change too much
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| 05:05 | <alkisg> Yeah that can probably remain common for both ltsp 5 and 6
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| 05:06 | <vagrantc> might consider uploading ltsp6 in parallel... or maybe i just use debian experimental
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| 05:07 | * alkisg just wants to have an ltsp package in a ppa that doesn't depend on ldm, so that he doesn't have to worry about overlapping scripts | |
| 05:08 | <vagrantc> i'm kind of wondering if a separate source package for the *dm/libpam-sshauth hooks makes sense
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| 05:08 | and then ltsp* packages can depend on the appropriate packages
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| 05:09 | <alkisg> Hmm on second thought, it looks like having ldm installed won't affect anything, it doesn't put anything under /usr/share/ltsp
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| 05:09 | <vagrantc> right
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| 05:09 | all my testing was done with ldm already installed
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| 05:09 | <alkisg> It's just that ltsp6 won't work correctly if one chooses SCREEN_07=ldm because of the duplicate scripts
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| 05:09 | <vagrantc> they can coexist peacefully
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| 05:10 | depends how we write it...
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| 05:10 | <alkisg> Are you going to integrate pam-ltsp into ltsp-trunk?
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| 05:10 | Or that would be the separate *dm package you were talking about?
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| 05:11 | <vagrantc> yeah, a separate package
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| 05:11 | could even shoehorn it into libpam-sshauth, but that's kind of messy
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| 05:12 | * alkisg would prefer it if libpam-sshauth didn't do anything by default, for ltsp-pnp... | |
| 05:12 | * vagrantc nods | |
| 05:12 | <alkisg> But it could have scripts that we could call on init-ltsp.d
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| 05:13 | Like, pam-sshauth-config login/lightdm/whatever
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| 05:13 | <vagrantc> so, your libpam-sshauth bugs in trusty were related to overlayfs?
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| 05:13 | <alkisg> Yeah, those are easily solved by moving to a tmpfs dir
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| 05:13 | I just symlinked /tmp to /run/tmp
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| 05:13 | And I got login and lightdm working with those
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| 05:14 | <vagrantc> did login create the tunnels and everything?
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| 05:14 | <alkisg> I think so, but I'm not sure
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| 05:15 | Btw, there's a problem with extrausers, we can't manage multiple logins with our current logic
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| 05:15 | We add users on each login, but we don't have a clean way to restore them on each logout
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| 05:15 | <vagrantc> we havne't supported multiple logins for ages
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| 05:16 | <alkisg> OK... what about the system groups not exposed by extrausers?
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| 05:16 | <vagrantc> but yeah, cleanup would be a god thing
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| 05:16 | good
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| 05:16 | <alkisg> Are those blockers?
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| 05:17 | <vagrantc> i'm not realthrilled about the system groups being ignored
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| 05:17 | basically we need to manually re-add them or something?
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| 05:17 | which is what we were trying to avoid
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| 05:17 | * alkisg doesn't mind much, ltsp-pnp semi-guarantees that the groups are available | |
| 05:17 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 05:18 | keeps the id numbers in sync, too
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| 05:18 | <alkisg> But if extrausers doesn't quite cut it, we can just use our current code for changing /etc/passwd
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| 05:19 | <vagrantc> yeah, that's worst-case scenario
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| 05:19 | although better with the current code, it seems
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| 05:20 | <alkisg> Ah, one way to manage multiple logins: each login would add the users to passwd.login123, and we'd have a merge script that merges all those files to the one that extrausers reads
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| 05:20 | <vagrantc> at that point, ldap or samba start to become attractive
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| 05:20 | mltiple servers might get ugly
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| 05:21 | <alkisg> True, if I was the one to decide, I'd avoid having to develop our own pam/managing users solution
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| 05:21 | I'd just go with samba to be able to support windows clients too, and call it a day. Or 6-months to be more precise :D
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| 05:22 | <vagrantc> it'd be nice to just support whtever pam/nss backend...
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| 05:22 | <alkisg1> Sorry I'm near the fireplace, signal not good enough
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| 05:22 | <vagrantc> arbitrary backends seems like the way to go, as long as we can provide a sane default
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| 05:23 | <alkisg1> Sure, we can default to libpam-sshauth and just have a variable to disable it
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| 05:23 | <vagrantc> although getting the ssh tunnel up without it... ?
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| 05:24 | <alkisg1> There's kerberos, or with samba, Phantomas succeeded in copying the ssh keys to the mounted home folder for a password-less connection of the tunnel
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| 05:24 | * vagrantc is a little tired to dive in tonight, but tomorrow is another day | |
| 05:24 | <alkisg1> We do rely on the ssh channel
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| 05:26 | <alkisg> Time to get the kids to school, bbiab...
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| 06:42 | <vagrantc> well, i think i've got a workable configuration to have different udev rules on debian vs. ubuntu
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| 07:25 | * alkisg is eager to test a cdpinger-less ltsp on ubuntu... :) | |
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| 07:34 | <vagrantc> `eh
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| 07:34 | er, heh
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| 07:34 | eh?
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| 07:35 | well, i've got rules that seem to work for me, and alkisg claims the change udev rules are already triggered on ubuntu
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| 07:35 | <alkisg> hehe
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| 07:35 | Yup, at least since I reported the bug... let me check which version that was...
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| 07:36 | <vagrantc> my one qurstion is if the rules are also available in debian, but not installed by default...
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| 07:36 | so we might hit problems with other packages
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| 07:39 | but it seems to work, and is only enabled on boot...
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| 07:39 | i just worry that fatclients might have issues or something
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| 07:39 | <alkisg> So you only need to install udisks in debian to make it work?
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| 07:39 | <vagrantc> no udisks, just three udev rules
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| 07:40 | <alkisg> Ah, pastebin?
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| 07:40 | If e.g. udisks also install those 3 rules, then fat clients could end up mounting the same disk twice...
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| 07:41 | So maybe we should try a debian fat installation first, with udisks etc installed, to see if the rules aren't needed there?
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| 07:41 | If so maybe we could install these 3 rules conditionally, only if udisks (or grep for the main rule) isn't there...
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| 07:42 | <vagrantc> http://paste.debian.net/72280
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| 07:42 | right
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| 07:42 | <alkisg> Wait, those are for mounting, not to trigger the events... those are needed for ubuntu too, right/
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| 07:43 | <vagrantc> the mounting happens once the change events are triggered
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| 07:43 | last you tested it you reported those caused double-mount attempts
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| 07:44 | <alkisg> Hmm let me take this from the start, in order to remember it better
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| 07:45 | I think in Ubuntu I managed to have add and remove events, while debian had only change events, right?
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| 07:45 | <vagrantc> yeah, basically
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| 07:45 | <alkisg> *not I managed, it was that way by default
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| 07:45 | OK, so, for debian, are you trying to produce add/remove events, or to hook into change events?
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| 07:46 | <vagrantc> the change events call the mounting scripts
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| 07:46 | i think
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| 07:46 | <alkisg> OK, scenario where I fear this might go wrong:
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| 07:46 | A user installs udisks in his thin chroot
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| 07:46 | That somehow fixes the events and now you have add/remove events on debian too
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| 07:47 | ==> then that user will have the same problems that I had on Ubuntu
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| 07:47 | I.e. the change and add events being both processed, ending up mounting the same disk twice
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| 07:47 | <vagrantc> it also needed the polling
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| 07:47 | <alkisg> I think we need to see what happens with a debian chroot that has udisks installed...
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| 07:47 | * vagrantc forgets if udisks triggers that | |
| 07:48 | <vagrantc> i don't think simply installing it caus the problem
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| 07:48 | <alkisg> I think it may make debian produce add/remove events
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| 07:48 | <vagrantc> udisks was installed all along
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| 07:49 | only if something runs udisks
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| 07:49 | * vagrantc purges it and tries again | |
| 07:49 | <alkisg> Then we could probably use the same rules for both distros, i.e. to handle only change events and ignore add events completely?
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| 07:51 | <vagrantc> change events only happen for cd media, i think
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| 07:54 | <vagrantc> given all this, i'm tempted to only upload this change to experimental as a patch
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| 07:56 | but it works without udisks installed
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| 07:57 | works with it installed...
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| 07:57 | testing fatclient with lxde
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| 07:57 | no idea if thar has udisks
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| 07:58 | doesn't look like it
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| 08:04 | <alkisg> Yes I meant the change events only for cdroms, the other events are fine... ok if we already process add events for cdroms, we'd need to ignore them
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| 08:09 | <vagrantc> i think the add events only work if there's a media event
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| 08:09 | er change event
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| 08:09 | for cdrom
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| 08:10 | it doesn't seem to do anything if there's no media in the cd drive, and there's no change event if there is media in the drive- it's part of the add event
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| 08:11 | long time since i instaled gnome... boy this takes forever to install
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| 08:11 | <alkisg> Hehe
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| 08:12 | * alkisg needs to go for a couple of hours... happy hacking, bbl! | |
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| 21:12 | DJUnreal has joined IRC (DJUnreal!~qscript@host31-54-239-155.range31-54.btcentralplus.com) | |
| 21:12 | * DJUnreal waves | |
| 21:13 | <DJUnreal> how are we all?
| |
| 21:13 | ... aside from sleepin' that is
| |
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| 21:40 | <manolo> aaa
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| 21:40 | <DJUnreal> bbb
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| 21:57 | * vagrantc plans to tag ltspfs 1.2 soonish | |
| 21:57 | <vagrantc> goodbye, cdpinger.
| |
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| 22:11 | * DJUnreal stretches | |
| 22:11 | <DJUnreal> ooh, someone's alive
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