IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 12 September 2009 (all times are UTC)
| 00:04 | <johnny> dvorak_, they have
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| 00:05 | <dvorak_> any web posts?
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| 00:05 | <johnny> i don't know.. try to find it :)
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| 00:08 | vagrantc has joined #ltsp | |
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| 00:11 | <dvorak_> i have been trying to dig it up ... with little success
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| 00:11 | https://wiki.phys.ethz.ch/readme/notes_on_ltsp_clients
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| 00:11 | http://livecd.phys.ethz.ch/
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| 00:12 | <johnny> dvorak_, come back when more people are around
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| 00:12 | <alkisg> ...that sounds useful :)
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| 00:12 | <dvorak_> sure
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| 00:15 | <alkisg> vagrantc: "do the udhcp scripts pass VCI ?" ==> yes
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| 00:15 | <vagrantc> alkisg: nice.
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| 00:15 | <alkisg> But I didn't found any standard kernel parameter for that, so I had to create a new one... :-/
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| 00:16 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i was thinking it might be nice to just have them override the configure_networking function, rather than re-implementing everything
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| 00:16 | <alkisg> override == replace?
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| 00:16 | <vagrantc> well, you could leave the existing configure_networking function, but re-define configure_networking at a later stage ...
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| 00:17 | thus overriding it, and effectively replacing it
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| 00:17 | <alkisg> Ah. I didn't think of that, it sounds doable...
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| 00:17 | <vagrantc> alkisg: it seems to behave ok if udhcpc isn't installed, but there was at least one warning message in that case
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| 00:18 | <alkisg> vagrantc, if you see any bugs, ping me, and I'll look into them (I do have a sidux installation around, I guess it's "debian-enough"..)
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| 00:18 | But I had left some comments in the code which were to be read and then deleted, and now they're upstream... :(
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| 00:19 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 00:19 | well, the comments still had meaning...
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| 00:19 | should be documented somewhere
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| 00:19 | <alkisg> I'd better rewrite them then to be cleaner
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| 00:20 | <vagrantc> it seemed to work like a charm, though.
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| 00:20 | at least for the default use case.
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| 00:20 | * alkisg is happy for that :) | |
| 00:20 | <alkisg> I tried it even with 2 NICs and it worked fine
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| 00:20 | <vagrantc> and you use enough bizzare use cases that surely all insane paths are tested
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| 00:20 | <alkisg> But it's not tested in any "production" environments...
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| 00:20 | So I bet there are some bugs left there
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| 00:21 | <vagrantc> i'll make it the default in my next upload (by recommending udhcpc)
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| 00:21 | <alkisg> ...what worries me most is how we use sleep() to wait until the devices are ready..
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| 00:21 | I think there should be a better way for that :-/
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| 00:22 | <vagrantc> ah yes ... "sleep 0.1" wasn't valid or something like that was the error i was getting
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| 00:22 | maybe the sleep implementation in the initramfs only took integers
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| 00:23 | <alkisg> Ouch. Maybe ubuntu has a different version
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| 00:23 | I think it works here
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| 00:23 | <vagrantc> though i swear sleep 0.N is used elsewhere in initramfs-tools
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| 00:23 | <johnny> well.. perhaps it is one of those options that must be enabled in busybox
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| 00:23 | <alkisg> Yes I think I grep'ed for sleep 0.N before using it
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| 00:23 | <vagrantc> i know the initramfs-tools maintainer in debian is trying to ditch busybox entirely
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| 00:24 | <alkisg> To replace it with what?
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| 00:24 | * alkisg didn't have any complains about busybox so far.... | |
| 00:24 | <vagrantc> i think just klibc stuff
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| 00:24 | <alkisg> Ah, nice :)
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| 00:24 | Killing klibc is worth any hussle :)
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| 00:24 | <vagrantc> of course, we can always add extra utilities if needed.
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| 00:25 | <alkisg> Ooops misunderstood
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| 00:25 | OK, got it
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| 00:25 | <vagrantc> heh.
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| 00:25 | yeah, the plan is to ditch busybox in favor of klibc, from what i gather.
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| 00:26 | <alkisg> Ugh... who's the maintainer? maks?
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| 00:28 | <johnny> hmm..
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| 00:29 | klibc isjust a lib
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| 00:29 | <vagrantc> alkisg: yeah, maks
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| 00:30 | <alkisg> OK I'm sure he knows what he's doing, then. :)
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| 00:30 | <vagrantc> johnny: well, it's a lib and a suite of utilities written to use that lib
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| 00:30 | <johnny> maybe i'm thinking about uclibc ...
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| 00:31 | i know some people were compiling busybox with uclibc
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| 00:31 | <vagrantc> yeah, that's different
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| 00:31 | <johnny> hmm.. but why drop busybox..
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| 00:32 | i guess it's worth it if you want something small, and don't want to compile busybox with uclibc
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| 00:32 | <vagrantc> klibc is smaller than what busybox is built with
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| 00:32 | right
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| 00:32 | <johnny> busybox is build with glibc by default..
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| 00:32 | iirc
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| 00:32 | doing it with uclibc wouuld require "cross compiling"
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| 00:32 | <vagrantc> and the size of the initramfs is apparently one of the biggest factors with getting crazy fast boot times
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| 00:32 | <johnny> altho not really..
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| 00:32 | but it does require a seperate toolchain
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| 00:33 | it'd be nice if debian used dracut too tho.. found some way to cooperate
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| 00:34 | <vagrantc> dracut looked klunky to me
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| 00:34 | <johnny> you think?
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| 00:34 | i don't know
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| 00:34 | i compared it to initramfs-tools and found that klunky
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| 00:34 | <vagrantc> i've been following it in git
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| 00:34 | <johnny> i thought what was in git looked good
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| 00:35 | was nice to see nbd support right iin there
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| 00:35 | <vagrantc> i think it hit some of my pet peeves...like ending shell scripts with .sh
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| 00:35 | <johnny> lol
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| 00:35 | python files are always named .py except the executables
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| 00:36 | same with most interpreted langs really.. php , ruby, etc..
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| 00:36 | executable not having the extension.. but all files used having them
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| 00:36 | <vagrantc> hm. dracut repository i was pulling from isn't letting me check for updates.
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| 00:36 | <johnny> yeah.. i think i had that issue too..
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| 00:37 | it says the remote end hung up
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| 00:37 | * vagrantc too | |
| 00:38 | <johnny> i think it is something wrong with sf
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| 00:38 | perhaps i should re clone
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| 01:05 | <Ryan52> vagrantc: sure (re uploaders)
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| 01:06 | I *really* don't care what packages I'm listed in...there are some packages that I don't even know what they do that I'm in Uploaders for :P
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| 01:06 | (because I did RC bug fixes and such)
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| 01:07 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 01:08 | <elias_a> Good morning!
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| 01:08 | Where are the functions of NICs defined in LTSP5 + Jaunty?
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| 01:09 | Everything else is set but restart dhcpd3 gives me: Not configured to listen on any interfaces!
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| 01:10 | <Ryan52> "Skolelinux archive Installer"..too impatient?
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| 01:10 | Debian's NEW queue is really blazing fast the last few weeks, thanks to the new ftpteam members.
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| 01:10 | <elias_a> Found it already...
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| 01:11 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: figure at the very least, i'll get some review from the skolelinux ftpmasters
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| 01:11 | Ryan52: but need a sponsor to get it into debian's NEW queue
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| 01:11 | <elias_a> Should be in /etc/default/dhcp3-server
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| 01:11 | <Ryan52> oh right.
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| 01:11 | <vagrantc> Ryan52: skolelinux has a history of being an early adopter for LTSP stuff anyways
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| 01:12 | <elias_a> vagrantc: Do you have a straight connection to skolelinux-people?
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| 01:12 | <vagrantc> elias_a: i'm one of the debian-edu developers, sure.
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| 01:13 | <elias_a> vagrantc: Good! I am trying to get an overall impression of where different FLOSS@schools projects are going.
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| 01:13 | vagrantc: Would it be OK for me to call you some time?
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| 01:14 | I am travelling for a week now but maybe after that....
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| 01:14 | <vagrantc> elias_a: why not just post questions to the public mailing lists?
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| 01:15 | <elias_a> vagrantc: That's a good option. I just happen to know that not all projects I know about are on those lists.
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| 01:15 | But it is a good start :)
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| 01:15 | <vagrantc> elias_a: debian-edu@lists.debian.org
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| 01:16 | elias_a: there's also irc.debian.org #debian-edu
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| 01:20 | night all
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| 01:24 | <alkisg> (09:09:54 πμ) elias_a: Everything else is set but restart dhcpd3 gives me: Not configured to listen on any interfaces! ==> You should edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to match your subnet.
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| 01:26 | <elias_a> alkisg: I think I found the problem: http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1094344.html
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| 01:27 | I am setting up a demo server into a laptop which of course is running Network Manager :)
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| 01:29 | <alkisg> elias_a: nope, that doesn't solve your problem, it creates more problems
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| 01:29 | # Find this line / ... INTERFACES="" / # Replace with the following line / INTERFACES="eth0" ===> don't do this, it's the wrong way.
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| 01:30 | This way instead of solving the problem, you disable dhcp3-server's autodetect features.
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| 01:30 | <elias_a> alkisg: Ok. What do I have to do?
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| 01:30 | <alkisg> You should edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to match your subnet.
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| 01:31 | *but*
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| 01:31 | If it's a laptop, then I assume there's already a dhcp server where you're going to do the demo?
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| 01:31 | <elias_a> I do no know that yet.
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| 01:32 | Where's the problem, then?
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| 01:32 | <alkisg> If there's a dhcp server already there, then you'd have 2 dhcp servers in the same subnet, so there will be problems, e..g clients not booting
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| 01:32 | In that case, you'd better use a proxy dhcp; not a normal dhcp server.
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| 01:33 | <elias_a> I don't think so as I am going to build a new subnet: a switch for the clients.
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| 01:33 | <alkisg> In this case a dhcp server won't be there, so no problem, ok
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| 01:33 | <elias_a> Does DHCP echo through the LTSP server, then?
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| 01:34 | Yes, and a 2 NIC setup of course to isolate the 2 networks.
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| 01:34 | <alkisg> But if you just plugged your laptop to the existing switch, and an existing dhcp server was there, you'd better use a proxy dhcp
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| 01:34 | (That's what *I* do when I want to show ltsp demos with my laptop)
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| 01:35 | <elias_a> alkisg: Yes, of course.
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| 01:35 | <alkisg> OK first things first. Edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to match your subnet, and restart dhcp3-server
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| 01:36 | <elias_a> alkisg: I do not want to go to the other side of the world and plug a LTSP-server into a network in production and mess it .)
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| 01:36 | ;-)
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| 01:36 | <alkisg> It doesn't cause any mess, that's the beauty of it
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| 01:36 | It's plug 'n' play, thanks to the dnsmasq developer
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| 01:37 | <elias_a> Wow - where can I read more about it?
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| 01:37 | <alkisg> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
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| 01:38 | It *assumes* that there's an existing dhcp server running on the network.
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| 01:38 | Otherwise, you'd have to change a single line in the dnsmasq configuration file.
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| 01:38 | <elias_a> OK. Sounds like fun :)
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| 01:46 | I am still getting Not configured to listen on any interfaces! when trying to start dhcpd3.
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| 01:48 | Is there another place where the configuration could be than dhcpd.conf?
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| 01:59 | http://pastebin.com/m43b5b4f8 <- /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
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| 02:01 | <alkisg> What's your ip? Do an ipconfig -a
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| 02:02 | Your eth0 should have an ip in the 192.168.0.x range for that dhcpd.conf to function correctly.
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| 02:02 | <elias_a> is the output of ifconfig enough?
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| 02:03 | IP is in any case 192.168.1.34 for the NIC connected to Internet
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| 02:05 | <alkisg> As you're telling me, you're using your laptop as a 2-nic ltsp server
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| 02:05 | <elias_a> Yes.
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| 02:05 | <alkisg> So, you should connect to the internet through wlan = 192.168.1.34 and have a static ip in eth0=192.168.0.1
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| 02:05 | Anything other than that is not a standard 2-nic ltsp setup, and needs more explaining..
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| 02:06 | <elias_a> alkisg: Yes, exept that I do have 2 LAN NICS.
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| 02:07 | <alkisg> Ah :)
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| 02:07 | In your laptop???? Nice!
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| 02:07 | (what's the other one, pcmcia?)
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| 02:07 | <elias_a> alkisg: But I think I get now what I have not seen: the NIC that serves the clients: How is DHCP disabled on that one?
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| 02:08 | <alkisg> DHCP only listens on the interface that matches dhcpd.conf
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| 02:08 | So only in the 192.168.0.x interface.
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| 02:08 | <elias_a> alkisg: Nice? To have old crap like RTL chipset NICs? :)
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| 02:08 | <alkisg> You have 2 RTL nics in your laptop???!!!
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| 02:08 | <elias_a> So it should basically work with the configuration I have?
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| 02:09 | alkisg: No - only one (luckily).
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| 02:09 | I plugged an old NIC into a thinkpad T42 to take care of traffic to Internet.
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| 02:10 | <elias_a> Yes - it is PCMCIA
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| 02:10 | <alkisg> elias_a: I don't get your network setup. You have 2 laptops there?
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| 02:11 | <elias_a> alkisg: Depends on what you mean... I'll try to explain....
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| 02:12 | I have a T42 laptop with 2 NICs. The built in is meant to serve the clients. The PCMCIA card works. I am writing this through it.
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| 02:13 | The other laptop is used as a client.
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| 02:13 | <alkisg> Ah right
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| 02:13 | OK, then the PCICIA=192.168.1.34 and the build-in=192.168.0.1
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| 02:13 | <elias_a> Nothing strange... I have set up LTSP before but now here's something I just cannot figure out.
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| 02:14 | alkisg: Yes, exactly.
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| 02:15 | <alkisg> elias_a: what I'm saying is that if you have those IPs, then dhcp3-server should start ok
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| 02:16 | <elias_a> alkisg: Ummm... now I noticed something strange. When I start the client machine, the server tries to get a DHCP lease from the client....
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| 02:16 | Maybe I should get rid of Network Manager altogether?
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| 02:16 | <alkisg> You have the client connected with a crossover cable? Or a switch?
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| 02:17 | Did you set up a *static* ip=192.168.0.1 for your built-in NIC?
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| 02:17 | <elias_a> alkisg: With a straight cable. I was told yesterday it should work.
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| 02:18 | <alkisg> Heh. :)
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| 02:18 | <elias_a> alkisg: No - I guess the static IP is what is missing here.
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| 02:18 | alkisg: And it does not work, does it? :D
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| 02:18 | <alkisg> Using a straight cable would work if one of your laptops (or both) have autosensing (mdx)
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| 02:19 | ...and a static IP is necessary - how did you make the built-in nic to use 192.168.0.1 if not by using a static ip?
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| 02:19 | <elias_a> alkisg: and the rest of it goes: ...and my crappy old thinkpads do not necessarily have it :)
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| 02:20 | <alkisg> You can use either networkmanager or /etc/network/interfaces to set up a static IP for your built-in nic
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| 02:21 | <elias_a> alkisg: Yes - will do that. What is used as gateway in the settings of the LTSP client side card if the external card gets an address with DHCP?
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| 02:22 | <alkisg> No gateway needed if you don't use localapps
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| 02:22 | Also, you seem to use your ltsp server as the dns server - did you actually install bind in your laptop?
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| 02:25 | <elias_a> No - there's the fault!
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| 02:26 | <alkisg> Not really. DNS server doesn't have anything to do with dhcp3-server not starting :)
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| 02:26 | <elias_a> Oh, crap... :/
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| 02:26 | <alkisg> The problem is that you don't have a static ip for the built-in nic
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| 02:26 | So set one already :)
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| 02:28 | <elias_a> But is it possible to forward the DNS information to the LTSP NIC configuration if getting address with DHCP to the external card?
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| 02:29 | <alkisg> LTSP clients, in their default configuration, have little use for dns
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| 02:30 | But other than that, yes, you could put the "external" dns server there, and put the laptop as the gateway for the clients. That wouldn't be useful if localapps aren't used, though
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| 02:31 | <elias_a> I am dreaming of demoing localapps...
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| 02:31 | But first I have to get this running.
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| 02:33 | <alkisg> If you're dreaming about localapps, then you should probably forget about the second nic and just use the proxydhcp method I told you before
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| 02:33 | So there's no point in fixing dhcp3-server when you'll be replacing it with dnsmasq...
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| 02:34 | <elias_a> Hold on....
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| 02:35 | There's one more thing... the place I am going to go probably does not have Internet access at all so I should be able to demo the server standalone.
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| 02:35 | but that is another story...
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| 02:35 | <alkisg> The primary reason for using 2 nics is to prevent the clients to be accessed from the internet, for security reasons
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| 02:36 | If localapps are used, then obviously the clients have direct access to the internet (usually - firefox, flash etc as localapps)
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| 02:36 | <elias_a> I wonder what the term "auto" refers to in Network Manager setup?
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| 02:36 | <alkisg> Auto = dhcp client
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| 02:36 | You need a static ip, not auto.
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| 02:36 | <elias_a> So do I just delete it and create a new?
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| 02:37 | Ok.
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| 02:53 | | |
| 02:53 | Oops.
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| 02:53 | For some reason giving the NIC settings manually to the LTSP side card does not seem to work.
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| 02:54 | Ifconfig does not show an address to the card.
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| 02:54 | I will have a break and enter RTFM mode.
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| 03:19 | <alkisg> elias_a: there's a bug in network manager that prevents setting up *system* connections for dual nic systems
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| 03:20 | elias_a: so just use /etc/network/interfaces - or don't click the "apply to all users" button (I don't remember its exact caption)
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| 03:42 | <elias_a> alkisg: Thank you! Seems like if there is a bug, I will find it :)
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| 03:42 | <alkisg> So does it work now?
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| 03:50 | <elias_a> I'll have to do some other things first.
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| 03:50 | I'll tell you about it.
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| 09:34 | <BugsBunnyBR> hey, someone knows if there is any problem in kubuntu 8.04 to get the configurations from /var/lib/tftpboot/i386/lts.conf?
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| 09:35 | My thin clients seens doesnot get this configurations..
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| 09:41 | <BugsBunnyBR> someone knows why the config is not got in the thin clients?
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