IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)

Request log from specific day:

Channel log from 30 January 2013 (all times are UTC)

00:00	<Enslaver> bash-4.1# cat /lib/lsb/init-functions \|grep log_action
00:00	bash-4.1#
00:00	guess we don't get it
00:01	log_success_msg () failure and warning
00:05	oh well, echo works fine
00:07	and with that change, LTSP 5.4.4 now successfully ported to EL6, server and client, night guys..
00:09	* vagrantc cheers
00:10	<jammcq> surely RH has a way of display messages during boot
00:11	<Enslaver> yes they do, but in more of a 2 part way so they can check wether it returned an error code
00:11	<jammcq> well... seems like a good thing to do, eh?
00:11	<Enslaver> already done
00:12	using lsb's way not redhat's
00:12	<vagrantc> heh. those functions are from ubuntu
00:13	<jammcq> ah, k
00:13	<vagrantc> they were included in an include file in debian's /lib/lsb/init-functions
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00:13	<Enslaver> rpm -qf /lib/lsb/init-functions
00:13	redhat-lsb-4.0-3.el6.i686
00:15	<vagrantc> apparently added in 2005...
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00:29	<Enslaver> Sneak preview http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/4/screenshot20130129at626.jpg/
00:30	my email is enslaver at enslaver dot com if anyone needs to reach me, i'll have it packaged and ready here soon
00:30	ttyl
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12:37	<markit> hi alkisg :) the problem with your repo keys were due to... squid! All repo keys add was blocked by it
12:38	I'm wondering if really squid worths the trouble as simple web cache...
12:38	<Hyperbyte> markit, depends on for how many people it's caching. :-)
12:39	And how fast your internet connection is. ;-)
12:40	<alkisg> markit: that's the reason we haven't yet included it in sch-scripts, even though many many teachers are asking for it :)
12:40	It needs careful examination, evaluation, documentation of common pitfalls...
12:41	...before one deploys it at a site with a sysadmin... so, for sites with just teachers it even more difficult
12:58	<markit> Hyperbyte: internet is very slow... nominal 7Mb/s, currently works in a mean of 2Mb/s, for 24 PC
12:59	but I've seen that more and more pages have "non cachable" content, that is also the heaviest part
12:59	<alkisg> markit: btw did you try the -threads option in epoptes to see if it makes broadcasting muuuuch faster for you?
12:59	<markit> btw, time ago there was the firefox "flash block" package, now is no more provided, I've to find our how install globally and, more important, how to update
13:00	alkisg: I've updated epoptes, isn't set by default? I tested and was not much faster as far as I remember
13:00	<alkisg> The -threads fix is not released yet
13:00	Committed, but not released
13:01	http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~epoptes/epoptes/trunk/revision/352
13:03	<markit> so... should I apply manually the patch and do some test?
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13:15	<alkisg> markit: sure, or you could wait a few weeks until Phantomas releases the new version
13:17	<markit> ok I'll patch ;P
13:18	alkisg: btw, I've found very handy the autologin feature for doing boot and login tests
13:18	I've found a problem with thin clients... if you logout it logins again
13:18	instead of stopping at ldm letting the user to turn the pc off
13:19	<alkisg> It's not a problem, it's by design
13:19	But yeah an "LDM_AUTOLOGIN_ONCE" directive should also be implemented..
13:20	The bug there is that it doesn't allow the user to turn off the PC from inside the session
13:20	LXDE supports that, but not the other DEs
13:20	And of course fat clients also support it
13:21	(in all DEs)
13:21	bbl
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13:30	<Hyperbyte> markit, by the by - at work I use squid too, but only for the clients.
13:30	I have my firewall configured so that all clients -cannot- access internet without going via squid, yet servers have completely access to internet.
13:30	This solves any problems you might have with specific sysadmin programs not working properly with proxy servers.
13:33	<markit> Hyperbyte: of course if you use FAT clients only, right?
13:34	did you set in transparent mode so without authentication?
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13:39	<JuJuBee> Using a fat client. A user locked screen ctrl-alt-L but is unable to unlock it?
13:39	he entered same password he used to log in, but that doesn't work
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14:48	<Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, screen locking is not supported with LTSP
14:48	If you absolutely need it, you'll have to use NIS or LDAP
14:49	alkisg, question... I have a client that doesn't load LDM... X seems to crash
14:49	I put XSERVER=vesa in lts.conf and now the client logs in, however, with the wrong resolution.
14:49	How can I properly overcome this?
14:50	<alkisg> Hyperbyte: lspci -nn -k \| grep -A 2 VGA, pastebin local /var/log/Xorg.0.log when the client crashes etc
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14:52	<Hyperbyte> alkisg, http://pastebin.com/5WwXnrKk
14:52	<jammcq> good morning friends
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14:52	<Hyperbyte> Hi jammcq!
14:53	alkisg, working on the Xorg log now
14:54	<alkisg> Hi Jim! Hyperbyte: sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/* dpkg -l xserver-xorgs3
14:54	Ah although no that's not s3 virge, it's s3 unichrome... try nomodeset
14:54	!nomodeset
14:54	<ltsp> nomodeset: Unfortunately, Kernel Mode Setting (KMS) doesn't work well with some cards. To disable it, open /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default and replace "quiet splash" with "nomodeset".
14:55	<Hyperbyte> alkisg, still interested in the Xorg.0.log?
14:56	<alkisg> Hyperbyte: try the nomodeset bit first, it's quicker... also, thin or fat?
14:56	<Hyperbyte> alkisg, http://pastebin.com/8LeQaQzJ
14:56	Thin.
14:56	<alkisg> Next try after nomodeset, X_SMART_COLOR_DEPTH=False
14:58	<Hyperbyte> alkisg, when I do the nomodeset bit, the client sits there while trying to start X
14:59	Screen flickers every ~15 seconds, I presume it tries to start X and fails
14:59	<alkisg> Hyperbyte: also I see in your logs that the client is using 24bpp, how so? Anything related in lts.conf? Thins are supposed to use 16 bpp by default..
14:59	<Hyperbyte> Trying X_SMART_COLOR_DEPTH=false now
14:59	alkisg, no
14:59	<alkisg> Hyperbyte: the logs with nomodeset could be useful too
14:59	<Hyperbyte> I'm using 12.10 though, with the standard LTSP version
15:00	Not your ltsp-pnp
15:00	Or ppa
15:00	<alkisg> It should be the same
15:00	12.10 is recent enough...
15:00	<Hyperbyte> I'll get one with nomodeset
15:01	<alkisg> If nothing works, modinfo viafb has a whole lot of parameters to try
15:01	SCREEN_02=shell and then X -configure would help in faster testing those
15:01	Finally, #ubuntu-x is your friend
15:02	Hyperbyte: http://www.x.org/wiki/FAQErrorMessages#I_keep_getting_the_message:_.22AddScreen.2BAC8-ScreenInit_failed_for_driver_0.22
15:02	This kind of problem typically occurs when you're using a big monitor with an old graphics card. You can solve it by deleting some of the highest resolutions of the deepest colour mode in the Screen section of your xorg.conf, or even the whole last Display subsection.
15:03	I.e. also try with a smaller monitor, to see if this is the problem
15:03	<Hyperbyte> http://pastebin.com/mvqXm88D
15:03	That's the log with nomodeset enabled.
15:05	Seems like best solution would be to just get a new client with a more recent graphics card
15:05	<alkisg> Btw when removing quiet splash, also remove "plymouth:force-splash vt.handoff=7"
15:05	In my experience, graphic card problems come and go between linux/xorg versions
15:06	So I'm just looking for workarounds, I'm not able to change graphics cards on each release...
15:06	<Hyperbyte> Want a new Xorg.log with the force-splash (etc) bits removed?
15:06	<alkisg> Nah
15:07	Try forcing a lower mode
15:07	<Hyperbyte> I'll just XSERVER=vesa for now and just get a new client
15:07	<alkisg> Either with XRANDR_DISABLE and X_MODE_0, or with a smaller monitor
15:07	<Hyperbyte> I'm pretty sure this video card just isn't.... although
15:07	No, wait
15:07	On 12.04 I also used this one without problems with the higher resolution
15:07	But I didn't run LDM, just the rdesktop screen script
15:08	<alkisg> (05:05:45 μμ) alkisg: In my experience, graphic card problems come and go between linux/xorg versions :)
15:08	I've seen that tooooo many times, unfortunately
15:08	<Hyperbyte> I think easiest is to just use XSERVER=vesa for now, for testing, and just aim for a new client.
15:08	<alkisg> ...the new client might work in 12.10, break in 13.04, work again in 13.10... :D
15:17	<Hyperbyte> This client is horribly old though
15:18	800mhz VIA processor, 100 megabyte memory....
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15:22	<alkisg> OK, those are good reasons to replace it
15:25	* markit has a raspberry, boosted at 900mhz, 512MB, 35 euros ;P
15:27	<markit> btw, anyone here using a raspberry as thin client with the custo distro for that? It does not boot from SD in my only experiment
15:27	<alkisg> It's too slow, the dual core chinese clients are much faster :D
15:27	<markit> alkisg: yes, I know, really would pay 50 euros for a 4 core instead ;P
15:28	this is faster and just a little more expensive, but don't know how much faster cubieboard.org
15:28	<alkisg> I think they cost about 80-90 euros, dual core, 1 gb ram, ethernet, usb etc
15:28	<JuJuBee> Hyperbyte: thanks for that.
15:28	<alkisg> I think a8 is single core, isn't it?
15:29	cortex a9 would be faster afaik
15:31	Something like that, I guess... http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Google-TV-Box-Android-4-0-ARM-Cortex-A9-WiFi-HD-1080P-HDMI-Internet-TV-Box/505428849.html
15:32	<markit> alkisg: ok, but rising the price makes Intel solution more desiderable
15:32	<alkisg> 10 pieces for $71 each, converted to euros, would be cheap enough
15:32	markit: pi ==> thin, those ==> fat
15:32	Veeery big benefit there
15:32	<JuJuBee> I have a SCREEN_02=shell in my lts.conf file. It seems that this gives root access on ctrl+alt+f2 ?
15:33	<alkisg> JuJuBee: yup, that's the idea
15:33	<markit> can you have a mixed intel/arm chroots? one day you should teach me how to set it up
15:33	<JuJuBee> That gives the students the ablilty to do anything? this is bad...
15:33	<alkisg> markit: I think it's documented in the wiki somewhere... it's not difficult
15:33	JuJuBee: well, don't put it in lts.conf then
15:33	It's for troubleshooting purposes
15:34	<JuJuBee> Ah, ok. I thought it would be like a local os install where they would get a prompt to log in.
15:35	<alkisg> There are no local users in an LTSP client so that wouldn't work
15:35	<JuJuBee> alkisg: does this https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/DisableScreenLock accurately describe how to disable screen lock?
15:35	<alkisg> There's an `ssh` screen script which allows the users to login on the server, if you want that...
15:35	JuJuBee: that's for gnome 2, are you using gnome 3?
15:36	<JuJuBee> alkisg: Well, I have gnome and kde
15:36	<alkisg> You'd need to google for gnome 3 and kde 4 then
15:36	<JuJuBee> installed gnome-session-fallback and kubuntu-desktop along with ubuntu 12.10
15:37	<alkisg> $ cat /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/10_sch-scripts.gschema.override
15:37	[org.gnome.desktop.screensaver]
15:37	lock-enabled = false
15:37	[org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.print-notifications]
15:37	active = false
15:37	Those are some settings to look into ;)
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15:40	<JuJuBee> alkisg: don't have 10_sch-scripts.gschema.override
15:40	<alkisg> Yes, sch-scripts is a local greek solution
15:40	I'm just displaying its contents for you to see the appropriate gsettings keys
15:41	<JuJuBee> OK
15:41	<markit> JuJuBee: oh, I use kde also
15:41	but I've special settings for it... do you use fat or thin clients?
15:42	<JuJuBee> fat
15:43	<markit> JuJuBee: and you have decent boot times? I've found kde transfer of about 400-500MB
15:43	you have to set nfs with async at least
15:43	and take care of /var/tmp dir not only home
15:44	(btw, I've put something about it in the ubuntu ltsp wiki)
15:44	<JuJuBee> yes have decent boot times.
15:45	<Hyperbyte> JuJuBee, I think you can just remove the gnome-screensaver package from the chroot and be done with the screen locking
15:45	As for kde, shrug
15:45	<JuJuBee> currently using defaults for nfs...
15:45	<markit> JuJuBee: can you please measure with iftop -ni ethwhatever?
15:45	JuJuBee: because if you have 2 clients everything seems ok, when you have 15 you are doomed
15:46	<JuJuBee> I have 8 students now and boot was fine.
15:46	They have the option of selecting session (gnome-classic, ubuntu or plasma)
15:47	<markit> JuJuBee: can you test it for one client? just curious, since I spent so much time to make it work
15:47	<JuJuBee> I haven't tried having everyone use plasma yet. I might do that today.
15:47	<markit> what is your export like?
15:47	<JuJuBee> markit: pm?
15:47	<markit> JuJuBee: ok
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16:30	<JuJuBee> markit: on ltsp-server with 6 clients TX=1.08GB RX=14MB ON nfs-server TX=234MB RX=351MB Logins did seem slower but not super crazy slow.
16:30	All used plasma
16:33	<markit> JuJuBee: thanks
16:33	<JuJuBee> np
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