IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 21 February 2012 (all times are UTC)
| 00:01 | <vagrantc> alkisg: right, figured that out eventually
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| 00:02 | we really should split ltsp-localapps stuff into a separate package...
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| 00:06 | maybe i should've pushed that last commit to common ...
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| 00:06 | since several of our things depend on that working
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| 00:09 | maybe, just maybe i'll upload ltsp to debian today ... i feel like there's always one more thing.
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| 00:11 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I think I'd prefer the symlinks the other way around, from Ubuntu to Debian...
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| 00:12 | * vagrantc really wishes we could just dynamically merge common | |
| 00:12 | <alkisg> Who was against it?
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| 00:12 | <vagrantc> i hate having to track every single change that way
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| 00:13 | gadi was worried about performance issues
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| 00:13 | <alkisg> First of all, why can't we do that at the packaging stage?
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| 00:13 | <vagrantc> alkisg: that's not a bad idea, really.
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| 00:13 | <alkisg> I.e. not ship any common or Distro/ dirs, just a single init-ltsp.d dir
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| 00:14 | <vagrantc> alkisg: thought not something i want to mess with today :)
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| 00:14 | <alkisg> Hehe, yeah
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| 00:15 | <vagrantc> but yes, that would be the right way to do it.
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| 00:15 | in fact, i think we talked about that back in october.
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| 00:16 | a little trickier to implement in packaging ... it's not just a simple directory copy
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| 00:16 | but totally worth the sanity.
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| 00:17 | so far, i've been doing fine just using Ubuntu's, as far as i can tell, with my one workaround
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| 00:18 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I'd also prefer it if we only had a Debian/ dir and we had "ifs" in the code whenever we need to diverge...
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| 00:19 | <vagrantc> alkisg: not sure how much i'd like that
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| 00:19 | <alkisg> It would allow for a common package, like ldm
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| 00:19 | No need for 0ubuntux stuff
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| 00:20 | <vagrantc> i do like that it would encourage less divergence :)
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| 00:20 | but it also makes it easier for release teams to review code and ignore changes in dirs that essenntially won't affect us
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| 00:20 | like importing a new upstream version during a freeze
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| 00:21 | to have separate dirs, that is...
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| 00:21 | well, actually because of all the symlinks it would drive them crazy.
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| 00:21 | hm.
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| 00:21 | there are a number of plugins that are totally irrelevent for each distro, or wildly different ideas about what they should look like.
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| 00:22 | <alkisg> I don't think that currently we have wildly different ideas
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| 00:22 | <alkisg> Examples of irrelevent plugins?
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| 00:23 | <vagrantc> defaulting to using NBD squashfs images, for one...
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| 00:23 | no-recommendss
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| 00:24 | locales
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| 00:24 | <vagrantc> anything having to do with mirror handling
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| 00:24 | <alkisg> I would classify those to "requiring an if "$VENDOR" = "Debian", else...", not as irrelevant plugins
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| 00:25 | <vagrantc> sure, they're where we diverge, but some of which would be really ugly as iff statements.
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| 00:25 | artwork
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| 00:25 | <alkisg> I think it'd be easier to pinpoint where there's diversion
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| 00:26 | artwork could be handled by packaging
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| 00:26 | rules.d or something
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| 00:26 | <vagrantc> in debian i generally add packages to LATE_PACKAGES or EARLY_PACKAGES, whereas the ubuntu plugins generally install the packages directly.
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| 00:26 | <alkisg> Like in ldm now
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| 00:26 | There's no reason to not do it the same way there
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| 00:26 | <vagrantc> the artwork in ldm is done totally differently...
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| 00:27 | <alkisg> Same for "no-recommends", I think it's a bad idea for Ubuntu not to include them
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| 00:27 | <vagrantc> in ltsp-build-client, it's package selection.
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| 00:27 | in ldm, it's update-alternatives magic
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| 00:27 | maybe it's worth a go.
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| 00:28 | <vagrantc> basically, all the artwork hooks wouldn't do anything because of the package names, i think, so it would essentially be a no-op.
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| 00:29 | alkisg: it would also make it possible to install an Ubuntu chroot on Debian and vice versa.
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| 00:30 | or at least, easier.
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| 00:30 | <alkisg> :)
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| 00:30 | vagrantc: did you get to think about ltsp-client-core stop phase?
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| 00:30 | I think that's where `nbd-client -d` belongs, until it goes to the nbd package...
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| 00:30 | <vagrantc> alkisg: no, i've just been plugging away at ltsp on debian
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| 00:31 | alkisg: so you wanted to call it from upstart, but not during the sysv stop phase?
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| 00:31 | <alkisg> No I wanted to call it from sysv but we already had upstart jobs handy and we were on a time pressure :D
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| 00:31 | And I think that upstart doesn't handle them well, it kills them on timeouts etc
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| 00:32 | So I think I'll move them to sysv scripts instead
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| 00:32 | But I do think that the ltsp-client-core stop phase is the correct place for them
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| 00:34 | Doesn't "service ltsp-client-core stop" mean "shut down the ltsp client"?
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| 00:35 | <vagrantc> suppose it could...
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| 00:36 | ok, so now all my menu entries went away :(
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| 00:36 | it remembered the login from what i booted as a thin client
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| 00:36 | er, fat client
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| 00:36 | <alkisg> Is that lxde? Or gnome-shell?
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| 00:36 | <vagrantc> lxde
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| 00:38 | <alkisg> Tomorrow morning I want to finish the reboot/shutdown problem...
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| 00:38 | The best way would be to let the nbd-client script handle it
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| 00:39 | I could write a patch for it, and maybe Wouter could accept it, but there's no time to include it in Precise,...
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| 00:39 | <vagrantc> by the time nbd-client runs, it's a bit late, isn't it?
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| 00:39 | <alkisg> ...so, how weird would it be to override the nbd-client initscript with one of ours in init-ltsp.d ? :D
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| 00:39 | No, it isn't late
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| 00:39 | <vagrantc> or rather, a bit eaarly.
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| 00:39 | too early to stop most services...
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| 00:39 | <alkisg> The way I tried was:
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| 00:40 | disconnect swap etc, and leave only the root file system,
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| 00:40 | then spawn a shell task
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| 00:40 | That task will just wait for the "terminate processes" init phase
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| 00:40 | with a shell trap
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| 00:40 | At that phase, it'll do nbd-client -d, and echo o > sysrq
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| 00:41 | <alkisg> That worked well from sysv, but not so well from upstart, not sure why
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| 00:44 | * vagrantc dreads writing this lengthy changelog. | |
| 00:44 | <vagrantc> i'll mostly steal stgraber's, but still...
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| 00:45 | alkisg is now known as pumpkin | |
| 00:45 | * pumpkin goes to bed... | |
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| 00:46 | <stgraber> ;)
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| 00:50 | * vagrantc wonders if the menu-cached proess has something to do with the menus being messed up | |
| 01:34 | <highvoltage> vagrantc: new bg.png pushed :)
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| 01:37 | * vagrantc cheers! | |
| 01:38 | <vagrantc> with alkisg's new .dmrc processing, i should try and cram out a new ldm tonight too... but not until i get ltsp 5.3.1 solid for debian
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| 03:15 | <vagrantc> still don't know how i want to deal with ltsp-update-image on debian ... simply running it converts your system over to NBD+squashfs, and that's not really desireable just yet.
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| 04:14 | <vagrantc> ah, i'mm subjecting everybody to my /proc workaround....
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| 04:15 | needed to run it before the init-ltsp.d stuff is run, and our scripts pretty much assume it's mounted...
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| 05:07 | <vagrantc> still sometimes get the /var/cache/apt thing ... don't get it.
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| 05:07 | just don't get it.
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| 05:08 | it's the inconsistancy i don't get...
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| 05:34 | <vagrantc> well, i'm not totally happy with the way i resolved the discrepancies with ltsp-update-image ... but it's better than where it was and shouldn't break anything for anyone else.
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| 05:36 | it breaks ltsp-update-image for debian users switching backk and forth regularly, but only a little broken, rather than breaking it for users just by running a command that seems like it does something vauguely related to what they want.
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| 05:38 | now to write the changelog ...
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| 06:24 | <vagrantc> ok, i'm tagging ltsp 5.3.1
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| 06:55 | <vagrantc> alkisg: hah! just in time.
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| 06:55 | <alkisg> 'morning folks
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| 06:55 | <vagrantc> alkisg: uploaded ltsp 5.3.1-1 to debian seconds ago.
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| 06:56 | <alkisg> Coooool!!!
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| 06:56 | * alkisg checks the trunks... | |
| 06:57 | <vagrantc> there's still an intermitant bug with /var/cache/apt/ eating 30MB of space *sometimes* but not always.
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| 06:57 | i'm not totally happy with how i've handled ltsp-update-image, but it's better than what we've had in debian before ...
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| 06:57 | <alkisg> vagrantc: about r2089, I think the idea was to just copy the template provided by nbd
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| 06:58 | <vagrantc> and configure_localdev should be patched out or removed or not run on debian... it causes two cdpingers to show up, one on cdrom on one on sr0
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| 06:58 | <alkisg> vagrantc: do you have a repository I can use to test in Debian? Or, how long until it's available in unstable?
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| 06:59 | We should make that packaging change in ltspfs...
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| 06:59 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i could upload them somewhere... but they should be avilable in the next 1-6 hours at a mirror near you
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| 06:59 | <alkisg> That's soon enough, no need to upload them anywhere then
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| 07:00 | And shutdown gives you no problems?
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| 07:00 | Or just a stale nbd-server process?
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| 07:00 | <vagrantc> or if you get antsy, you could download from incoming.debian.org even sooner and make a local mirror yourself.
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| 07:00 | alkisg: with NBD shutdown gives me stale nbd processes
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| 07:01 | but i mostly don't use NBD, so... :)
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| 07:01 | <alkisg> OK... so the most pressing things now is a new ltspfsd package that doesn't contain the udev rules (but they are linked from init-ltsp.d), and the shutdown/reboot services
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| 07:01 | <vagrantc> (and dropping configure_localdev from init-ltsp.d, or significantly changing what it does)
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| 07:02 | * alkisg hasn't looked at that... | |
| 07:02 | <vagrantc> i also noticed you remove the nbd-client service? i just blindly copied it...
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| 07:03 | <alkisg> Btw I don't know how obvious it was, but I started copying code from ltsp-init-common to init-ltsp.d
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| 07:03 | <vagrantc> but it seemed to leave fewer stale nbd-server processes when i fixed it.
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| 07:03 | <alkisg> It shouldn't, we leave KILLALL=False
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| 07:03 | That tells nbd to not kill anything that it doesn't know in its config file
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| 07:03 | <vagrantc> hm.
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| 07:03 | <alkisg> And we don't write anything in its config file
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| 07:04 | <vagrantc> alkisg: what sort of code from ltsp-init-common?
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| 07:04 | <alkisg> ...so about ltsp-init-common, I thought that only the code that needs to run from ltsp-client-core could stay there
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| 07:04 | E.g. configure_home
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| 07:05 | Gadi had put . init-ltsp-common at the start of init-ltsp.d, and then called its functions
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| 07:05 | <vagrantc> well, the idea of ltsp-init-common was that it woudl be a repository of useful functions that could be shared...
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| 07:05 | <alkisg> Yes, but we moved from functions to files
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| 07:05 | <vagrantc> i.e. maybe one distro calls them from one place, but another migght find them better suited elsewhere.
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| 07:05 | otherwise we get lots of code duplication
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| 07:06 | <alkisg> If one distro wants to call configure_home at a later stage, it can just create a Distro/xx-home with a bigger number
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| 07:06 | It's not like making it a function provides additional flexibility
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| 07:06 | <vagrantc> what if they want to call it after /init ?
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| 07:06 | <alkisg> init-ltsp.d should only have stuff that runs on init
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| 07:07 | The rest should stay in ltsp-init-common, which should probably be renamed to ltsp-client-core-functions :D
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| 07:07 | <vagrantc> and so we're presuming what all the other distros want to just dump code in there... maybe we're right... maybe that's always the sanest place to do those things.
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| 07:07 | <alkisg> We do need some code to run after init-ltsp
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| 07:07 | <vagrantc> it's only called ltsp-client-core on debian/ubuntu (we actually rename the upstream version)
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| 07:08 | <alkisg> Yeah, ltsp-core, isn't it?
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| 07:08 | And we should remove ltsp-setup as soon as noone else uses it
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| 07:08 | <vagrantc> alkisg: but you're presuming all distros will use the same code from init-ltsp.d rather than at a later phase.
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| 07:08 | <alkisg> Right, we do need a common plan
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| 07:09 | <vagrantc> yes.
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| 07:09 | <alkisg> I don't think that changing the code as we did, and leaving it to ltsp-init-common would help any distro
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| 07:09 | <vagrantc> unfortunately, other than knipwim, i've seen precious little interaction with other distros.
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| 07:09 | <alkisg> It'd just break the current ltsp-init-common for them, forcing them to switch to init-ltsp right now
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| 07:09 | I think it's a good time to clean up things then :)
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| 07:10 | ...and when they're clean, and they want to sync again with upstream, they can follow suit...
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| 07:10 | <vagrantc> fair enough!
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| 07:10 | <alkisg> vagrantc: didn't gadi remove "configure_localdev" completely?
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| 07:10 | As it's called from udev now?
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| 07:10 | <vagrantc> he did, and then snuck it back into initramfs-scripts.d for some reason...
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| 07:11 | maybe it was a transient issue that's since been fixed?
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| 07:11 | <alkisg> No, the plan was to remove it completely and make it a response to udev rules
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| 07:11 | <vagrantc> it mumbles about it in the init-ltsp.d hook.
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| 07:12 | something about coldplug?
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| 07:12 | <alkisg> Udev gets restarted on the real fs, so there's no FIXME there
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| 07:12 | We should just remove client/init-ltsp.d/common/50-localdev
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| 07:13 | * vagrantc wonders if it's hopeless to backport to squeeze now. | |
| 07:13 | <vagrantc> alkisg: yes, i was planning on at least removing it from debian before upload, but i'm not going to bother just yet.
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| 07:13 | wait till a few more bugs show themselves
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| 07:13 | <alkisg> Yeah
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| 07:14 | vagrantc: will you eventually do the ltspfs packaging change?
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| 07:14 | I.e. move the rules somewhere that don't apply by default?
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| 07:14 | Then we should change client/init-ltsp.d/common/50-localdev to link those rules
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| 07:14 | Not remove it completely
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| 07:14 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i'm not goind to be available next weekend, really.
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| 07:15 | alkisg: and won't have much time this week...
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| 07:15 | <alkisg> OK, but if stgraber does the change in Ubuntu, should I change the common/50-localdev, or have a local Ubuntu/ copy changed?
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| 07:15 | <vagrantc> alkisg: probably 50-localdev can symlink in /etc/udev/rules.d ...
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| 07:15 | because /lib/udev/ may or may not be the location of the week.
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| 07:16 | <alkisg> As long as the rule is in /usr/share/ltspfsd, I don't mind for either dir, /etc/ or /lib/udev :)
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| 07:16 | <vagrantc> ubuntu also has a different numbering scheme from debian, i think.
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| 07:16 | <alkisg> That even makes debian/rules simpler
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| 07:17 | <vagrantc> alkisg: well, i think the /etc one will be respected as a local admin change...
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| 07:17 | <alkisg> ....and puts the "if" in common/, or if you want we can have different Distro/50-localdev versions
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| 07:17 | vagrantc: but it isn't, it's a packaging change
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| 07:17 | :D
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| 07:17 | <vagrantc> yeah, install to /usr/share/ltspfsd, and symlink into /etc/udev/rules.d, i think...
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| 07:17 | <alkisg> (more or less)
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| 07:18 | We essentially only "install" the ltspfsd package if init=/sbin/init-ltsp
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| 07:18 | <vagrantc> alkisg: it's not *really* a packaging change.
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| 07:18 | if we do that, i think we could kill off ltspfsd-core, too.
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| 07:18 | <alkisg> Yes, that's why I was asking yesterday
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| 07:19 | <vagrantc> i need to look at it more to be sure.
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| 07:19 | <alkisg> OK
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| 07:22 | Hmmm yes I prefer /etc to /usr. Maybe if we're careful in the future we'll only need a writeable /run and /etc
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| 07:22 | <vagrantc> alkisg: no, we should ship it in /usr/share/ltspfs, but at runtime symlink it into /etc/
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| 07:23 | <alkisg> Yes, that's what I meant too
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| 07:23 | But symlinking into /usr assumes that /usr is writeable
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| 07:23 | And maybe, just maybe, in the future we'll only put cows over /usr and /etc
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| 07:24 | * alkisg is thinking of cases where initramfs's aren't supported | |
| 07:24 | <vagrantc> alkisg: symlink from /etc to /usr, /usr doesn't need writeability.
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| 07:25 | NBD cow will save us.
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| 07:25 | <alkisg> Sorry meant from /lib/ to /usr/
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| 07:25 | <vagrantc> i think making things writeable everywhere speeded up boot for NFS.
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| 07:25 | <alkisg> I.e. that I prefer the symlink to go to /etc instead of to /lib
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| 07:26 | <vagrantc> because i didn't have to copy up whole directory trees into ram...
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| 07:30 | alkisg: by the way, i tested with btrfs, although didn't do any custom options or anything
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| 07:30 | <alkisg> -o compress
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| 07:31 | <vagrantc> alkisg: at filesystem creation time?
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> At every mount time
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| 07:31 | <vagrantc> alkisg: NBD mount as well?
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| 07:31 | <alkisg> No need, it's for writing only
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| 07:32 | moment, phone
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| 07:32 | <vagrantc> cool.
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| 07:32 | <alkisg> My btrfs-chroot script: http://paste.ubuntu.com/851017/
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| 07:32 | Just a simple wrapper to easily work with multiple btrfs nbd images
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| 07:38 | The most crucial time to have -o compress is at ltsp-build-client, or at rsync
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| 07:38 | I.e. when all the chroot files are created
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| 07:39 | <vagrantc> using ext3 created an i386.img about 1.3G, using btrfs it was more like 1.8G ... trying with compression now.
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| 07:41 | alkisg: if you're really curious, ltsp 5.3.1-1 is already at http://incoming.debian.org
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| 07:41 | alkisg: but you'd have to download all the debs and dump them into a repository manually.
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| 07:41 | <alkisg> vagrantc: an 743Mb chroot becomes 281Mb as squashfs and 403MB as btrfs
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| 07:42 | I'm very tempted to ditch squashfs completely
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| 07:42 | <vagrantc> having writeability is pretty slick.
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| 07:42 | as well as all the other crazy features of btrfs
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| 07:42 | <alkisg> Opensuse has some patches for squahfs writeability... I hope those could go upstream
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| 07:43 | Yeah, snapshoting a btrfs loop-based chroot before upgrading..
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| 07:43 | ...and while in use :D
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| 07:43 | <vagrantc> right.
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| 07:44 | <alkisg> Another thing I want to experiment with is having multiple proprietary drivers in the chroot, and enabling them or not from init-ltsp.d
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| 07:44 | <vagrantc> so it created an image that was 802MB on disk, df -h reports 387MB used, du -smc reports 731MB
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| 07:45 | crazy!
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| 07:45 | i think a few apt-get upgrades will make one go insane, though.
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| 07:46 | unless it has a feature to reconsile identical files and re-merge them again.
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| 07:46 | reconcile
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| 07:47 | eesh, i've been at this for about 14 hours straight... glad i finally uploaded.
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| 07:47 | <alkisg> Good work though :)
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| 07:47 | Heck, it took me hours to do a simple thing as that .dmrc...
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| 07:49 | <vagrantc> the aufs/overlayfs thing really feels good to finally move to ... it was such a bear to maintain the list of what's expected to be writeable.
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| 07:49 | (and apparently, lintian grumbles about "writeable" not being a word, it's spelled "writable")
| |
| 07:49 | <alkisg> Hehe
| |
| 07:50 | Some people in ltsp-developers expressed concerns about ram usage with the init-ltsp writings
| |
| 07:50 | <vagrantc> if i hadn't tagged and pushed already, i would've fixed that.
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| 07:50 | alkisg: on the mailing list?
| |
| 07:50 | <alkisg> Yes
| |
| 07:50 | * vagrantc has been too busy releasing to read ltsp-devel | |
| 07:51 | <alkisg> Even thought booting needs less than 1 Mb of cow, I think it's a good idea to allow for mounting an nbd temporary image instead of creating a tmpfs
| |
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| 07:52 | <vagrantc> alkisg: sure, that's reasonable.
| |
| 07:52 | (unless you get the 30MB on whatever the heck triggers that on Debian)
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| 07:52 | <alkisg> vagrantc: debian doesn't use plymouth, does it? What does it use?
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| 07:53 | <vagrantc> alkisg: some debian installs use plymouth, i'm sure.
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| 07:53 | <alkisg> Ah. But by default? usplash?
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| 07:53 | <vagrantc> alkisg: default LTSP doesn't use any splash, though.
| |
| 07:53 | * alkisg hates the fact that plymouth adds 6 Mb to initramfs | |
| 07:53 | <vagrantc> none of my machines use splash of any kind... not sure what a default debian install looks like these days.
| |
| 07:54 | <alkisg> It breaks booting 64mb clients
| |
| 07:54 | Just for a fancy splash screen :(
| |
| 07:54 | <vagrantc> just because the initramfs is too big
| |
| 07:54 | ?
| |
| 07:54 | <alkisg> Yeah
| |
| 07:54 | It doesn't fit to be uncompressed
| |
| 07:54 | (in RAM)
| |
| 07:55 | <vagrantc> this sure was the biggest change in Debian's LTSP in ages...
| |
| 07:55 | eesh, i should have probably written a NEWS.Debian about some of the behavior changes...
| |
| 07:56 | * alkisg will be happier when we ditch ldm and reimplement the configuration system :) | |
| 07:56 | <vagrantc> oh, my computer turns into a pumpkin in a few minutes....
| |
| 07:56 | <alkisg> Hehe
| |
| 07:56 | 'night vagrantc
| |
| 07:57 | * vagrantc actually set up a cron job to shutdown computers regardless of weather i'm using them | |
| 07:57 | <vagrantc> till another time, have fun reading diffs :)
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| 14:14 | <cyberorg> alkisg, hi, can you migrate everything out of ltsp-init-common, i'd then know if anything we need is missing from init-ltsp.d/common/
| |
| 14:15 | what i've discovered so far is configure_network does not seem to know what to do if hostname is 'none' and sound setup seems to be missing
| |
| 14:15 | <alkisg> knipwim: are you ok with that? ^
| |
| 14:16 | <cyberorg> apart from those two suse just needs init-ltsp.d/common/ nothing else
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| 14:16 | <alkisg> cyberorg: we've moved configure_network to an init-ltsp.d script too
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| 14:16 | Err sorry, let me check...
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| 14:17 | <cyberorg> alkisg, it is, but as i said if hostname is 'none' it does not do anything
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| 14:17 | <alkisg> common/09-hostname
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| 14:17 | cyberorg: what do you mean "hostname is none"?
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| 14:18 | Hostname is none at the kernel if it's not set
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| 14:18 | <cyberorg> if [ "(none)" = "$hostname" ] || [ "linux" = "$hostname" ] || [ "none" = "$hostname" ]; then
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| 14:18 | <alkisg> We're not looking at the kernel value
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| 14:18 | <cyberorg> we do something like that ^^
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| 14:18 | <alkisg> cyberorg: that's because you're looking at the kernel hostname value
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| 14:18 | We don't look at it anymore, there's no point
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| 14:18 | We either set the value provided by dhcp, or by lts.conf, or the auto-generated one
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| 14:19 | <cyberorg> http://paste.opensuse.org/41082002
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| 14:19 | <alkisg> There's no need, ever, to look at the kernel value at /proc/wherever/hostname
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| 14:19 | cyberorg: yes, we had that code in the past too, I'm saying that it's a broken code
| |
| 14:19 | That's why I replaced it
| |
| 14:19 | Why would we ever want to check what the kernel hostname is?
| |
| 14:19 | We always assign a hostname...
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| 14:20 | <cyberorg> but then the new code does not seem to assign one automatically
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| 14:20 | <alkisg> cyberorg: are you using 09-hostname?
| |
| 14:20 | Or are you still calling configure_networking?
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| 14:21 | <cyberorg> alkisg, using 09-hostname it does not assign hostname automatically, it still remains 'none', using configure_networking autogenerated ws$IP is assigned
| |
| 14:22 | <alkisg> cyberorg: let's have a look together at 09-hostname
| |
| 14:22 | It unconditionally, without an if, calls hostname "$HOSTNAME"
| |
| 14:22 | Why is that not working for you?
| |
| 14:22 | <cyberorg> let me boot up client
| |
| 14:22 | <alkisg> hostname "$HOSTNAME"
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| 14:22 | echo "$HOSTNAME" > /etc/hostname
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| 14:23 | Maybe you set HOSTNAME=(none) before reaching that point?
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| 14:23 | To check, put break=09-hostname, and `echo $HOSTNAME`.
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| 14:23 | <cyberorg> alkisg, exactly, something in initrd sets it to 'none'
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| 14:23 | <alkisg> (as a kernel parameter)
| |
| 14:23 | Then you need to fix your initrd
| |
| 14:23 | Remove stuff, probably
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| 14:24 | <cyberorg> instead of 'if [ -z "$HOSTNAME" ]; then" the above will work for us
| |
| 14:25 | <alkisg> cyberorg: ok, but why not fix the initrd instead? Isn't it ltsp code that sets HOSTNAME=(none)?
| |
| 14:25 | No need to keep old and currently broken code around...
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| 14:25 | <cyberorg> no, kiwi initrd creator does it
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| 14:26 | <alkisg> Wait. Are you using init=/sbin/init-ltsp ?
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| 14:26 | Or are you calling init-ltsp from initramfs?
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| 14:26 | <cyberorg> if i put if [ "(none)" = "$hostname" ] || [ "linux" = "$hostname" ] || [ "none" = "$hostname" ]; then instead of 'if [ -z "$HOSTNAME" ]; then in 09-hostname it will work fine
| |
| 14:26 | using init=/sbin/init-ltsp
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| 14:26 | <alkisg> OK, please do this:
| |
| 14:26 | Boot a client with init=/bin/bash
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| 14:27 | And type: echo $HOSTNAME
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| 14:27 | It isn't logical to get (none) as the output
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| 14:30 | <cyberorg> something in this image didn't like init=/bin/bash, stuck after stopping udevd
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| 14:31 | <alkisg> What I'm saying is this
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| 14:31 | init starts with an almost clean environment
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| 14:31 | No hostname, nothing
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| 14:31 | Then we source some env vars that we saved at init-bottom/ltsp
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| 14:32 | LTSP saved those, not some other initramfs script
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| 14:32 | That's were HOSTNAME=(none) came up in the past
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| 14:32 | But it didn't make sense to save a variable with value=(none)
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| 14:32 | That's why we removed it from the initramfs script and from 09-hostname too
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| 14:32 | I think you need to remove some ltsp code from the initramfs
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| 14:33 | <alkisg> If you really have to do that if above, sure, go ahead and do it, it doesn't hurt, it just doesn't make sense
| |
| 14:34 | <cyberorg> initrd sets hostname to 'none' as it gets nothing from dhcp
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| 14:34 | <alkisg> Yes, that's what ltsp in ubuntu/debian did in the past too
| |
| 14:35 | Not the other initramfs scripts, but the ltsp code in the initramfs
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| 14:35 | And it's broken behavior
| |
| 14:35 | Why set it to (none) and not leave it empty? It doesn't make sense
| |
| 14:35 | What ltsp scripts do you have in the initramfs? Do you have a branch I could look at?
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| 14:36 | <cyberorg> none, we use kiwi for creating initrd
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| 14:36 | <alkisg> OK, if the kiwi code sets HOSTNAME=(none) while at init, then kiwi is broken
| |
| 14:37 | But if you need that, sure, go ahead and commit it, along with a comment to remove it when kiwi is fixed
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| 14:37 | <cyberorg> i can't find anything in kiwi's code that sets it https://github.com/openSUSE/kiwi
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| 14:38 | mostly it should be just this file: https://github.com/openSUSE/kiwi/blob/master/modules/KIWILinuxRC.sh
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| 14:38 | <alkisg> That's why I'm insisting, I think you're overlooking some script that needs to be removed
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| 14:38 | <cyberorg> setupNetwork in there
| |
| 14:39 | nothing there handles hostname so not sure where none comes from, could be default distro behaviour
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| 14:41 | <alkisg> Wow that's a very big script. Yeah I don't see HOSTNAME there.
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| 14:41 | cyberorg: you can try with any opensuse machine, boot it with init=/bin/bash
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| 14:41 | <||cw> could be in dhclient?
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| 14:41 | <cyberorg> so apart from that and sound just the stuff in init-ltsp.d/common is sufficient for suse
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| 14:41 | <alkisg> Sound should come from the udev rules
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| 14:42 | <cyberorg> pulseaudio stuff?
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| 14:43 | see start_sound in ltsp-init-common, we use that
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| 14:43 | <alkisg> Ah, ok
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| 14:44 | In Ubuntu we call that from ltsp-core
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| 14:44 | initscripts/ltsp-core
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| 14:45 | <cyberorg> can that be moved in init-ltsp.d/common as well?
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| 14:45 | <alkisg> Let me check...
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| 14:46 | <cyberorg> may be do away with ltsp-core and just use init-ltsp.d/common?
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| 14:46 | <alkisg> Hmm not sure. Some services need other services to get launched
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| 14:46 | So I think that we'll always need to run some code after most services are loaded
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| 14:46 | E.g. pulseaudio may need some alsa service
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| 14:47 | So maybe we can't launch it before init has even started
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| 14:47 | I think init-ltsp.d should only modify files, and ltsp-core should start services
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| 14:47 | <cyberorg> ok got it
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| 14:48 | in that case is everything that could be moved to init-ltsp.d/common is done? i can then start working on packaging it
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| 14:49 | <alkisg> No, it's not done, Gadi left the code at ltsp-init-common for compatibility reasons and I only moved the code that I needed to touch for other reasons
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| 14:49 | But if opensuse and gentoo are ready, we can move the other code too
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| 14:49 | I.e. not source ltsp-init-common from common/ at all
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| 14:51 | <cyberorg> opensuse is ready, with some stuff duplicated in those two places it is slightly confusing as i don't know what exactly to remove from our ltsp-client.init script
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> knipwim: ?
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| 14:51 | cyberorg: feel free to move the code into common/ though
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| 14:52 | <cyberorg> alkisg, this is our current init script http://kiwi-ltsp.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/kiwi-ltsp/trunk/kiwi-ltsp/ltsp/suse-12.1/root/etc/init.d/ltsp-client.init?revision=561&view=markup
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| 14:53 | not qualified to "move the code into common/" as not sure what other distros use
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| 14:54 | <alkisg> cyberorg: e.g. we moved configure_swap to 50-swap
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| 14:55 | Half of the functions there can be moved to init-ltsp.d scripts
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| 14:55 | I.e. the ones that don't depend on other services running
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| 14:55 | <alkisg> The reason is that e.g. having the swap available before the initscript get loaded allows thin clients with less ram to boot
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| 14:55 | Or that we can disable services before init loads them
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| 14:56 | <cyberorg> i know, removed most of it in current testing
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| 14:56 | <alkisg> Nice
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| 14:57 | Wow, the kiwi git is more than 300mb?!
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| 14:57 | I was hoping to grep for HOSTNAME there...
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| 14:58 | <cyberorg> nice work btw, everything works as before on suse using just common/
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| 14:58 | <alkisg> cyberorg: but do have a quick look at Ubuntu/, you may see some additional functionality there
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| 14:58 | I think that vagrantc mostly symlinked Debian/ to Ubuntu/
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| 14:59 | <mnevans> Hello LTSP world. mnevans again, same problem: no localdev (flashdrive) support on AMD E-350 thin client. LTSP5, ubuntu 10.10. It seemed to break after a recent kernel and security upgrade. I repeated steps 6(a)(2)-(6) in the wiki help page we made at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/AMDE-350. No luck. Any ideas?
| |
| 14:59 | <knipwim> alkisg: working now, but i'm here in about an hour
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| 14:59 | <alkisg> knipwim: nice
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| 14:59 | cyberorg: I'll be here in about an hour too, if you want we can try to eliminate stuff we don't need then
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| 15:00 | <cyberorg> 60-screen-sessions 50-set-time 50-saned can be put in common?
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| 15:02 | <alkisg> cyberorg: I didn't put the scripts into common/ only for speed reasons, because I didn't have the time to check if they would work on other distros
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| 15:02 | <cyberorg> may be not, as locale etc comes from different place on suse
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| 15:02 | <alkisg> Whatever you want, move it to common/ please
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| 15:04 | <cyberorg> paths used in those are ubuntu specific can't use them
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| 15:05 | got to go now, see you tomorrow, 'night
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| 15:06 | <alkisg> Ah, you can't be here when knipwim will be available... ok, bb
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| 15:12 | <Hyperbyte> When I SSH to my server without X11 forwarding (ssh -x), after entering password, I login practically immediately... when I do it with SSH forwarding (ssh -X) there's a 2 second delay during logon...
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| 15:12 | Is this normal?
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| 15:13 | <alkisg> Hyperbyte: I think the ssh delay was some ubuntu specific bug... I don't see what you're saying in Precise.
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| 15:25 | <Hyperbyte> You're giving me more and more reasons to upgrade. :P
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| 15:33 | <alkisg> I've been using it since alpha 1... fortunately LTS'es are indeed more stable than non-LTS releases
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| 15:43 | <mnevans> I have to go; will try again later.
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| 16:03 | <knipwim> alkisg: is this about moving some ltsp-init-common code?
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| 16:09 | all gentoo specific things for setting up the client are in a gentoo initscript
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| 16:10 | i will have to move this to init-ltsp.d
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| 16:10 | the generic stuff is already available there in common rigt?
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| 16:13 | gentoo will use ltsp-client-5.2.12 for some time, so removing the ltsp-init-common won't break it
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| 16:14 | <alkisg> knipwim: yes, about moving stuff out of ltsp-init-common
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| 16:14 | <alkisg> Basically whatever can be ran by /sbin/init-ltsp, without services running, should go to init-ltsp.d/
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| 16:15 | The rest will be left in ltsp-init-common
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| 16:15 | So OK since Ubuntu/Debian/OpenSUSE don't need that code, and you don't mind, we can remove it
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| 16:15 | <knipwim> fine by me
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| 16:15 | when migrating gentoo to 5.3, i will put gentoo specifics there as well
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| 16:15 | <alkisg> Nice
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| 16:16 | <knipwim> in init-ltsp.d/Gentoo that is :)
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| 16:16 | <alkisg> Yup, I hope we can have lots of common stuff in common/ too :)
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| 16:17 | <knipwim> it's interesting, you can see the differences in distro's
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| 16:18 | mostly packaging, but also other quirks
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| 16:20 | <alkisg> bbiab
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| 17:05 | <xsl> is it possible to burn CDs on ltsp ? must the CD-RW be installed on the server - or people can use the Clients CD-RW
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| 17:13 | <mnevans> Hello LTSP World. I lost the usb localdev support for flashdrives that we added a few weeks ago (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/AMDE-350). I tried repeating steps 6(a)(1-6); no luck. Any ideas? Thanks.
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| 17:21 | <mnevans> To continue: I can see that ltspfs is installed on the server; but ltspfsd-core and ltspfsd are not (both 0.7-0ubuntu1). Seems strange. Should they be?
| |
| 17:26 | Going through the DebugLocalDev (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev), ltspfs is installed on the server and ltspfsd is not.
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| 17:27 | lsmod | grep fuse gives no response - maybe fuse isn't loading, or else it's no longer an insertable module. But libfuse2 and fuse-utils are installed.
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| 17:27 | /dev/fuse exists as a device.
| |
| 17:27 | Users are members of fuse group.
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| 17:30 | client recognizes the plug event: http://pastebin.com/c243bUPk
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| 17:31 | /etc/fstab on client and server both READ: #UNCONFIGURED FSTAB FOR BASE SYSTEM.
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| 17:37 | <mnevans> When I try step 4, manually issuing a mount command, I get: "Error /tmp/,mnevans-ltspfs/tmp is not mounted."
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| 17:38 | Anyone...? Bueller...? Anyone? :)
| |
| 17:38 | Now I have to go but if anyone has any ideas - I will leave this window open and come back to it later.
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| 17:51 | <||cw> mnevans: so it was working, then it stopped? what changed? I've also noticed from ltspfs chatter recently, but I wasn't paying enough attention to know if it affects you. it does seem lots of things are changing for 12.04. I don't kno how much is in the repo yet though
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| 20:35 | <mnevans> @ ||cw and others: Thanks - I am now back. What changed was a routine set of upgrades to ubuntu 10.10. I looked at /var/log/apt/history.log, and there were kernel upgrades, to 2.6.35-31.40, 2.6.35-32.41, 2.6.35-32.42, 2.6.35-32.64, 2.6.35-32.65.
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| 23:45 | <torbjorn> I just followed a guide to set up K12linux ltsp on a centos 6 machine (?) if I understand correctly. Would this be the place to ask questions about that?
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