IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 31 August 2007 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:08 | <vagrantc> !seen otavio
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| 00:08 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: otavio was last seen in #ltsp 2 weeks, 3 days, 11 hours, 35 minutes, and 0 seconds ago: <otavio> vagrantc: :-)
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| 00:08 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 02:28 | <dan__t> Hi.
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| 02:38 | <ari_stress> LOL: #microsoft
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| 08:16 | <sbalneav> Morning all
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| 08:21 | <Blinny> Morning sbalneav
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| 08:22 | <sbalneav> morning
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| 08:47 | <joebaker> sbalneav I'll stay late after work today to test our LTSP server's DHCP
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| 08:47 | server after suspending it with your patch applied. Thanks for working on
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| 08:47 | a solution. I hope to have results submitted by 6pm CST (Milwaukee /Chicago time)
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| 08:49 | <sbalneav> Post them in the bug, let me know
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| 08:49 | if so, I'll see if I can get ollie to make the change.
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| 10:39 | <pablo-uy-mvd> HI! how do i setup autologin for my terminals?
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| 10:39 | each terminal must use a specific user (im using gnome/gdm)
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| 10:54 | <joebaker> sbalneav: OK
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| 10:55 | <sbalneav> joebaker: S'alright.
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| 10:56 | pablo-uy-mvd: http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-12777.html has some tips
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| 10:56 | pablo-uy-mvd: Google is your friend, as usual.
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| 10:56 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: oh, a little typo fix for ltspfs-upstream: http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltspfs/vagrant-ltspfs/
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| 10:57 | <sbalneav> That the extra && in ltsp-kernels?
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| 10:58 | I bumped into that one last night.
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| 10:58 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: ltspfs
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| 10:58 | <sbalneav> duh
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| 10:58 | maybe I should read the url :)
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| 10:59 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: though taking a second look ... maybe i'm reading it wrong
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| 11:01 | sbalneav: ended up with some situations where delayed mounts got entered twice
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| 11:01 | <sbalneav> Delayed mounters gone.
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| 11:01 | the ltspfs-nodm's the tree I'm working in
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| 11:02 | the login-rc's of the new ldm completely eliminate the need for a delayed mounter :)
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| 11:03 | I wanted the rc scripts for a long time, since the whole reason we had the delayed mounter was because a) we didn't have an rc script mechanism, and b) ogra didn't want me hacking up the old ldm.
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| 11:03 | <vagrantc> when is ltspfs-nodm going to merge into upstream
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| 11:03 | <sbalneav> heh, now I've done both, and he loves it :)
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| 11:04 | Well, I'm figuring after we get a bit of testing in.
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| 11:04 | <vagrantc> ok
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| 11:04 | ubuntu doesn't even have a bunch of the patches you merged from debian ages ago
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| 11:04 | <sbalneav> It's been working great for me, and it's got some of the other fixes you sent me, plus a stuck mutex bug.
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| 11:05 | Yeah, I've told ogra to merge from -nodm, but he hasn't yet.
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| 11:05 | <sbalneav> I just don't want to move that stuff into upstream until everyones on the same page. I don't want to screw anyone up.
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| 11:05 | <vagrantc> fair enough
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| 11:05 | so, there's this patch for upstream ...
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| 11:05 | <sbalneav> lol
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| 11:05 | <vagrantc> :P
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| 11:06 | <sbalneav> WHere you at with the C based ldm? That working in Deb?
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| 11:07 | <vagrantc> i had it working once ... based on 5.0.22 i think
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| 11:07 | <sbalneav> If you've got that working, then I could move it to upstream.
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| 11:07 | That, actually was what was holding me off, because if I move that to upstream, it'll bugger you up for the older python ldm.
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| 11:08 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: also, since we've got all sorts of files in /var/run/ we should use sub-dirs ... i.e. /var/run/ldm/ and/or /var/run/ltspfs/
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| 11:08 | <sbalneav> hmm. OK, good point.
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| 11:08 | Mind if we hold off on that 'till after gutsy's released?
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| 11:08 | then we'll fix it.
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| 11:09 | how 'bout /var/run/ltsp?
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| 11:09 | then we can have /var/run/ltsp/fstab, etc.
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| 11:10 | <vagrantc> i like a little more granularity, since some non-ltsp projects are using ltspfs, and possibly ldm ... but no big deal either way.
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| 11:10 | as long as all the software knows where to look
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| 11:11 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: the only reason i would suggest trying to get it into gutsy is gutsy doesn't have your latest changes yet ... so it would seem a good time to switch to what will hopefully be the final destination :)
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| 11:11 | <sbalneav> hm
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| 11:12 | Well, you make a good argument.
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| 11:12 | I just don't want to get hammered with "YOUR CHANGING THINGS AAARRRGH" :)
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| 11:12 | Non ltsp projects are using ltspfs?
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| 11:12 | Who?
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| 11:13 | I'd love to know.
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| 11:13 | <vagrantc> tcos, for sure.
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| 11:13 | <sbalneav> ah, well, that's "ltsp-like" :)
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| 11:13 | <vagrantc> i've stumbled across a few others here and there
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| 11:13 | <sbalneav> really?
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| 11:13 | Cool.
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| 11:13 | <vagrantc> :)
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| 11:13 | it's very useful
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| 11:16 | <sbalneav> Anyone know where our favorite Teutonic code warrior is today?
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| 11:16 | !seen ogra
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| 11:16 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: ogra was last seen in #ltsp 20 hours, 7 minutes, and 39 seconds ago: <ogra> from a client side view the device looks like any other alsa device
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| 11:34 | <vagrantc> !integration
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| 11:34 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "integration" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/IntegratingLtsp
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| 11:54 | <Blinny> !learn Teutonic as "Not enough Gin."
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| 11:54 | <ltspbot> Blinny: The operation succeeded.
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| 11:55 | <Blinny> (:
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| 11:56 | <sbalneav> He's not here. Maybe that should be "too much gin" :)
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| 11:58 | <sbalneav> OK, out for lunch
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| 12:17 | <MrChicken> Hello =)
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| 12:17 | I wanted to ask you guys... how can I enable a local printer in ltsp?
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| 12:17 | (ltsp5 in ubuntu)
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| 12:19 | <vagrantc> MrChicken: which version of ubuntu ?
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| 12:35 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: looking at the ltspfs-nodm code, it looks like it would be really easy to maintain backwards compatibility with the old socket locations, since you process them in a for loop ...
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| 12:36 | ls
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| 12:42 | <loather-work> heh, fun
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| 12:42 | <loather-work> it appears as though you can't specify a different server for NFS than for booting
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| 12:43 | <vagrantc> TFTP ?
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| 12:43 | <loather-work> correct
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| 12:43 | it used to be that you specified it in the root-path variable
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| 12:43 | <vagrantc> which distro?
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| 12:43 | <loather-work> ltsp-5
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| 12:43 | <vagrantc> which linux distro ?
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| 12:44 | <loather-work> fedora 7
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| 12:44 | <vagrantc> ah.
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| 12:44 | <loather-work> but that shouldn't make any difference, really
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| 12:44 | <vagrantc> well, that should be fixed
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| 12:45 | <vagrantc> though you could pass a different next-server option based on client-id
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| 12:45 | loather-work: so i didn't know there was LTSP5 for fedora yet
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| 12:45 | <loather-work> but then i'd have to host tftp on the same box as NFS
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| 12:45 | since booting looks at next-server as well
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| 12:45 | i'm baking ltsp5 into fedora ;)
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| 12:46 | <vagrantc> did you see my recent post to ltsp-developer ?
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| 12:46 | <loather-work> no, i'm not actually on the list
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| 12:46 | * loather-work looks at archives | |
| 12:46 | <vagrantc> just a couple hours ago a posted the brief work i did getting LTSP5 on fedora
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| 12:46 | integrating it into the existing codebase
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| 12:49 | it wasn't much, really ... just a couple calls to yum mostly
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| 12:49 | <loather-work> hmm, interesting.
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| 12:50 | <vagrantc> i mostly work on debian, but figured since i know the LTSP5 codebase pretty well, i'd give it a whirl on fedora :)
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| 12:51 | <loather-work> well, i know fedora pretty well, so maybe we can work together and get something going.
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| 12:51 | i honestly don't mind if the terminals themselves run something != fedora
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| 12:51 | <vagrantc> well, that defeats 90% of the point of LTSP5
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| 12:51 | <loather-work> their only job is to provide I/O for the user, for the most part
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| 12:52 | <vagrantc> sure
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| 12:52 | but that gets complicated when some of that I/O is implemented in fuse filesystems with different kernels with different patches
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| 12:53 | <loather-work> ah, yeah, for things like local usb keys and whatnot
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| 12:53 | <vagrantc> right
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| 12:53 | at this point, i think it might be less work to properly integrate LTSP5 into fedora than implement workarounds installing some other distro on top of fedora.
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| 12:56 | <loather-work> hm, ok. perhaps i'm misunderstanding the goal of ltsp5 then.
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| 12:56 | <vagrantc> for basic functionality, you can just grab the tarball ... but getting local devices and sound to work may require some magic tricks
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| 12:56 | <loather-work> yea, the sound is crucial. But, the local devices i'm not too worried about
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| 12:56 | <vagrantc> !ltsp5
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| 12:56 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "ltsp5" is ltsp5 is The next version of LTSP, and the future of Thin Client computing on GNU/Linux. http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Ltsp5
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| 12:56 | <vagrantc> !muekow
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| 12:56 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "muekow" is MueKow represents the future of LTSP. Using the packages available in the distribution, an LTSP client is build locally, and supported by the distribution. You can see the future at: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/MueKow
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| 12:57 | <vagrantc> the future is now the past :)
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| 12:59 | well, the main goal of LTSP5 was to reduce the busywork for LTSP developers to do custom kernels, X, libc, and porting-random-software-into-ltsp ... and just rely on an existing distro to handle it
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| 12:59 | since the majority of LTSP is not anything LTSP-specific
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| 12:59 | it's just a small handfull of scripts and binaries
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| 13:00 | <loather-work> right, which makes sense
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| 13:00 | but what about the case where your terminals are a different architecture than the host?
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| 13:00 | e.g. my userland is 64 bit, and my terminals are 32 bit
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| 13:01 | <vagrantc> well, then you'd need to build the environment on a machine of the appropriate architecture, and copy it over to the host
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| 13:01 | <loather-work> they'll vomit when they get fed 64 bit code :p
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| 13:01 | ok, what if my terminals happen to be ppc.
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| 13:01 | <vagrantc> well, you should be able to build i386 chroots on a 64-bit environment
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| 13:02 | <vagrantc> for ppc, you build the environment on a machine of the appropriate architecture (ppc) and copy it over to the server.
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| 13:02 | <vagrantc> that's where tarballs will come in handy ...
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| 13:03 | <loather-work> That, to me at least, seems a little unreasonable. What if I don't have a machine of the same architecture to do the build? (that'd definitely be the case if my terminals were ppc)/
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| 13:03 | <vagrantc> if you don't have a machine of the same architecture, then you don't have any need for supporting that architecture, do you? :P
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| 13:04 | <loather-work> But you just said that the userland for the terminals will basically be running the host's environment
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| 13:04 | <vagrantc> well, sort of.
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| 13:04 | <loather-work> If the terminal architectures differ from the host, then I won't be able to create a userland for the terminal.
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| 13:05 | <vagrantc> you build the LTSP environment on one of your terminals, and copy it to the host ... ?
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| 13:05 | <rcy> could you cross compile an environment?
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| 13:05 | or is that asking for a world of headache
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| 13:05 | <loather-work> Diskless terminals with 128M RAM and a 133 MHz CPU compiling an entire userland?
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| 13:05 | <vagrantc> well, it's not a compiled thing, except maybe with gentoo ... so cross-compilation is not really an option
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| 13:06 | loather-work: there is no compiling
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| 13:06 | <rcy> ok, then... uhh whats the problem exactly
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| 13:06 | <loather-work> not to mention the fact I have to boot the terminal in the first place
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| 13:06 | <vagrantc> loather-work: all LTSP is at that point is a chroot
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| 13:06 | loather-work: so you build a chroot environment and copy it over to the server
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| 13:06 | <loather-work> yes. And what I get from that is the chroot environment will be built on the host
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| 13:07 | <vagrantc> and there is nothing to prevent people from pre-building a chroot for you just like with older versions of LTSP
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| 13:08 | <loather-work> ah, OK. See, that's what I was worried about -- i figured those chroots wouldn't be provided anymore.
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| 13:08 | <vagrantc> well, the maintenance of them hasn't exactly been stellar
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| 13:17 | <MrChicken> vagrantc ... I'm trying to get local printing in ltsp5 running on ubuntu feisty
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| 13:18 | I read i must put in lts.conf PRINTER_0_DEVICE=/dev/lp0
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| 13:18 | but I'm unsure how to add it to CUPS
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| 13:19 | <loather-work> oh, add it as an AppSocket printer
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| 13:19 | <MrChicken> yeah to where?
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| 13:19 | <loather-work> it will be running on the terminal's IP address on port 9100
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| 13:20 | <MrChicken> but the terminal is on dynamic addresses
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| 13:20 | <loather-work> does your dhcpd update DNS?
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| 13:20 | <MrChicken> update dns?
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| 13:20 | <loather-work> i'm guessing not.
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| 13:21 | <MrChicken> I dont have dns active right now
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| 13:21 | :P
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| 13:21 | <loather-work> well, any terminal you have static resources associated with should have a dhcp reservation
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| 13:21 | meaning, it gets the same IP each time no matter what
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| 13:21 | <MrChicken> hrmmmm
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| 13:21 | yes, I understand
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| 13:22 | so I'll get it into reserved space
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| 13:22 | and I add it as appsocket
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| 13:22 | :)
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| 13:22 | thnx
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| 13:22 | <loather-work> welcome
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| 13:27 | <MrChicken> cya
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| 13:36 | <loather-work> ugh. Now to tackle the annoyance that is NFS.
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| 14:04 | <pablo-uy-mvd> HI! how do i setup autologin for my terminals? i need each terminal to autolog itself into gdm after boot using a specific user configured for each terminal (my terminals are kiosks thats why i need autologin))
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| 14:13 | can be gdm instances (one for each terminal) be told via command line/script or daemon to log each terminal with diferent&specific users ?
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| 14:13 | <evilgold> pablo-uy-mvd, i believe you can setup autologin with xdmcp that way
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| 14:14 | AFAIK ltsp does not use GDM it uses ldm
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| 14:14 | i think there is also a patch that allows you to have machines autologin based on their host names
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| 14:15 | <vagrantc> ltsp5 uses LDM
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| 14:17 | older versions still use XDMCP (gdm, kdm, xdm)
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| 14:17 | pablo-uy-mvd: which linux distro/
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| 14:17 | ?
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| 14:17 | <loather-work> what is LDM?
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| 14:17 | <vagrantc> LTSP Display Manager
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| 14:18 | <loather-work> hm, interesting. Does it still use XDMCP or a different backend like NX?
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| 14:18 | <vagrantc> it uses ssh
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| 14:18 | <vagrantc> but it also has support to merely use ssh for login, and regular X traffic for the rest of the session
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| 14:19 | <loather-work> so it's tunneling Xlib via ssh?
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| 14:19 | <vagrantc> you can, of course, configure LTSP to use whatever you want... but LTSP5 uses LDM by default
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| 14:19 | it's basically a wrapper around "ssh -X", yes.
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| 14:20 | <loather-work> hm, OK. How difficult is it to get LTSP5 to work with NX? i'd like to keep the bandwidth down as much as possible.
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| 14:20 | <vagrantc> there are scripts for it out there...
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| 14:20 | <loather-work> ok, i'll do some googling :)
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| 14:20 | <vagrantc> but if you're using a local network, NX won't get you much
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| 14:21 | <loather-work> yea, i'm considering colocating my host
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| 14:25 | ok.
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| 14:25 | anyone have any tricks up their sleeve to get NFS working
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| 14:25 | ?
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| 14:29 | <loather-work> i wish there was something better than NFS that didn't suck.
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| 14:30 | <vagrantc_> well, ubuntu started using NBD + squashfs + unionfs
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| 14:30 | supposed to be a lot faster
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| 14:30 | <loather-work> the linux nfs daemon just flat out doesn't work right
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| 14:30 | hmm, i wonder how difficult that would be to set up
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| 14:31 | <vagrantc_> though, you could put whatever filesystem on the NBD
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| 14:32 | <loather-work> makes it nice and flexible that way
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| 14:33 | anyhow, nfs is stupid. no matter what I do, I can't get any clients to mount off this server.
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| 14:33 | permissions wide open.
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| 14:33 | <vagrantc_> using tcp or udp ?
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| 14:34 | portmap running client-side ?
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| 14:34 | what kind of error messages are you getting ?
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| 14:34 | can you mount it manually ?
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| 14:34 | <loather-work> either transport, nothing works
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| 14:34 | portmap (rpcbind) is running
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| 14:34 | <vagrantc_> can you mount it on the server ?
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| 14:35 | <loather-work> over loopback? haven't tried that
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| 14:35 | <vagrantc_> mount -o ro,nolock 127.0.0.1:/foo/bar /mnt
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| 14:35 | <loather-work> permission denied
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| 14:35 | ol
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| 14:36 | <vagrantc_> loather-work: what's in /etc/exports ?
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| 14:36 | <loather-work> /opt/ltsp *(rw)
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| 14:36 | wide open :p
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| 14:37 | <vagrantc_> first off ...
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| 14:37 | you'll want /opt/ltsp *(ro,no_root_squash)
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| 14:37 | but that wouldn't explain why it won't mount at all
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| 14:37 | <loather-work> yeah, i originally had no root squash in there
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| 14:37 | <vagrantc_> the LTSP clients will need that
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| 14:44 | <loather-work> yeah. nothing i do changes this behaviour
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| 14:46 | <vagrantc_> !nfs
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| 14:46 | <ltspbot> vagrantc_: "nfs" is the protocol that serves the files needed by LTSP. You can find info at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/NFS
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| 14:46 | <vagrantc_> might be some troubleshooting tips there
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| 14:47 | or
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| 14:47 | !troubleshooting
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| 14:47 | <ltspbot> vagrantc_: "troubleshooting" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/TroubleShooting
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| 16:55 | <kiteflyer07> hello all, I have a question about setting up LTSP. I am running 5.0.7 on Feisty server.
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| 16:58 | I can PXE boot a client box, it detects the DHCP server and loads pxelinux. I had to add nfsroot=/opt/ltsp/i386 to /var/lib/tftboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default, in order for it to find it and begin loading the display manager.
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| 16:58 | I get a login that looks similar to GDM (presumably LDM) but after I enter a username and password, the displays goes black, flashes, then comes back with the same login prompt.
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| 16:59 | I get the impression that this is a permissions problem somewhere, but I can't track it down. I've created an account in the chrooted environment and the /etc/passwd and /home/<username> perms are OK.
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| 18:13 | <joebaker> sbalneav Your Fix for DHCP on resuming from Hibernation/Suspend worked!
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| 18:13 | see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/48212
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| 20:00 | <loather-work> well, i figured out my retarded NFS problem
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| 20:00 | (after a day and a half of beating on it)
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| 20:00 | fedora's /etc/init.d/nfs doesn't seem to mount /proc/fs/nfsd when it starts.
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| 21:01 | <jon_> anyone here?
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| 21:05 | <loather-work> yes.
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| 21:09 | <jon_> hello
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| 21:09 | i just installed ltsp and could use qa kickstart
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