IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)

Channel log from 21 January 2009 (all times are UTC)

00:02	<alkisg> sbalneav: any progress on this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/164508
00:15	Nevermind - it was fixed in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltspfs/ltspfs-trunk/revision/78
00:33	<stgraber> !s
00:33	<ltspbot> stgraber: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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03:08	<Appiah> Does anyone here use sama for the homedirs (I'm using my LTSP server against a MS AD). I'm having problems getting the right permissions for the DE (Gnome) , same problem as described here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=989463
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04:17	<Appiah> samba* ofcourse
04:17	It's amazing how I cant find any info on this
04:18	Gnome and pam_mount for homedirs
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04:36	<alkisg> I have a specific TC which doesn't ...respond to the logoff menu. If a user tries to logoff, nothing happens except ldm goes to 100% CPU usage and /var/log/ldm.log gets filled with "sigwaitinfo returned an error" error messages, until it gets 60 Mb in size!
04:40	So I guess "res = waitid (P_ALL, 0, &info, WEXITED \| WSTOPPED)" in ldm_wait returns -1, and so the loop never stops. How can I see the returned error code? Run ldm with ltrace?
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07:12	<Appiah> O_o?
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08:18	<Gadi> morning, all
08:18	nubae: I think you need to kick your log bot
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08:31	<cyberorg> Gadi, we have almost worked out how to get rdesktop integrated in ldm and get usb working
08:33	we need ssh socket tunnel for ltspfs as rdesktop disk export does not work with linux xrdp
08:34	<Gadi> when you integrate it into ldm, you may not want to call it "rdesktop"
08:35	as folks may use that to connect to windows
08:35	<cyberorg> yes
08:35	<Gadi> you may want to call it "xrdp"
08:35	or Nomad
08:35	or something
08:37	actually, to integrate it, you really only need to set LTSP_COMMAND to "true" and create an dlm rc.d script liks: K00-xrdp
08:37	that runs rdesktop locally
08:37	that should work fine
08:37	<cyberorg> Gadi, http://pastebin.com/d334ab34d our working diff
08:37	ignore some unnecessary stuff in there
08:37	this at least now starting rdesktop session and creating ssh socket
08:39	Gadi, see patch to 'rc.d/X99-run-x-session'
08:39	<Appiah> xrdp: An open source remote desktop protocol(rdp) server.
08:39	Based on the work of rdesktop, xrdp uses the remote desktop protocol to present a GUI to the user.
08:39	The goal of this project is to provide a fully functional Linux terminal server, capable of accepting connections from rdesktop and Microsoft's own terminal server / remote desktop clients.
08:39	Unlike Windows NT/2000/2003/2008 server, xrdp will not display a Windows desktop but an X window desktop to the user.
08:39	Xrdp uses Xvnc or X11rdp to manage the X session. To learn about how xrdp currently works, click here and here.
08:39	For questions or comments please mail xrdp-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
08:39	This project is released under the GNU Public License (GPL).
08:39	For search
08:39	Linux rdp server
08:39	Linux terminal server
08:39	Terminal server for Linux
08:39	ops
08:39	Sorry guys!
08:39	page had an tricky frame =(
08:40	<pmatulis> i got an ltsp4 setup (on Ubuntu 7.04) that has no obvious vga trouble (web pages render fine). i looked in the X log file and i see that it's using the VESA driver. i also have an ltsp5 setup (on Ubuntu 8.10) but the occasional web page renders very improperly. the X log file shows it is using the GEODE driver. my adapter is the Geode LX. on 7.04 there is an xorg.conf that contains 'vesa' but on 8.10 there is no ...
08:40	... xorg.conf file at all. comments?
08:40	<Gadi> cyberorg: you export the password to the environment?
08:40	<Appiah> pmatulis: you dont usally need one
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08:40	<cyberorg> Gadi, we will unset it as soon as rdesktop is run
08:40	<Appiah> pmatulis: 8.10 shoul have a good enough autoconfig
08:41	check the log to see what driver it's using Xorg.#.log pmatulis
08:41	<cyberorg> Gadi, there was no other way to get password from ldm
08:41	<pmatulis> Appiah: i stated what drivers are being used
08:42	<ogra_> thats not acceptable
08:42	ogra_ is now known as ogra
08:42	<ogra> you cant put a password in the nevironment at any time
08:43	pmatulis, wiht 8.10 you have to force the creation of a config file if you want one
08:43	pmatulis, CONFIGURE_X=True in lts.conf
08:43	<Appiah> pmatulis: well thats on 7.04 maybe 8.10 selected another one?
08:43	but nevermind
08:43	<cyberorg> ogra, we tried running rdesktop directly from ldm.c, but then ssh socket closed as there was no xsession call
08:43	<ogra> pmatulis, well, 8.10 did the right thing for your HW
08:43	<Appiah> you can force another one like ogra wrote
08:43	<pmatulis> ogra: good to know (xorg.conf creation)
08:43	<Appiah> if you'd like to try
08:43	<ogra> pmatulis, its just a sad fact that the driver is buggy
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08:44	<pmatulis> ogra: worse than vesa?
08:44	<ogra> but with CONFIGURE_X=True and XSERVER=vesa you should get what you had in 7.04
08:44	<pmatulis> ogra: will try that
08:45	<Gadi> pmatulis: try: X_DEVICE_OPTION_01 = "\"AccelMethod\" \"XAA\""
08:45	and: XSERVER=geode
08:45	<ogra> cyberorg, add a proper fork()
08:45	and hand over the pw though that
08:45	<nubae> Gadi: what's wrong with ltsplogbot?
08:45	<pmatulis> Gadi: thanks
08:45	<ogra> you cant export passwords to the environment ... thats a huge security flaw
08:45	<Gadi> nubae: your page has not updated in 24 hours
08:45	<nubae> oh...
08:46	<Gadi> (not to mention the ugly link names)
08:46	:)
08:46	<nubae> yeah u know... I changed to a centos server and ever since the language dir for eggdrop refuses to be read by the bot
08:46	* ogra scatters some beautiful flowers over the link names
08:46	<nubae> its highly annoying, I've spent hours on that
08:46	u wanna try and take a look?
08:47	<Gadi> is it a permissions thing?
08:47	<nubae> I highly doubt it
08:50	<sbalneav> Morning all
08:50	<Gadi> cyberorg: to keep the socket ope, you just need to keep the xrdp child process open
08:50	s/xrdp/rdesktop/
08:51	and have it block the rest of ldm
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08:51	<Gadi> until it returns
08:51	<sbalneav> So, between LaserJock and I, we managed to get Sabayon working last night.
08:51	<Gadi> !s
08:51	<ltspbot> Gadi: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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08:51	<sbalneav> LaserJock had a patch for a null check somewhere, but it's patching a symptom.
08:51	<Gadi> isnt sabayon something u eat?
08:51	:)
08:52	<sbalneav> Well, not usually raw :P
08:52	And if you cook it, it's just scrambled eggs :)
08:52	<Gadi> mmm....
08:52	<nubae> [07:51] LANG: No lang files found for section logs2html.
08:52	this is what I get... I know its centos related... but not sure what... eggdrop runs under /usr/lib instead of /usr/share, but I symlinked all that... I'm at a loss really
08:53	<ogra> sbalneav, so we need to put you and Laser into the package to make it work (if it only works with you and him left and right of it ?)
08:54	<cyberorg> Gadi, ogra we tried something like this first http://pastebin.com/d43c6034d
08:54	<nubae> http://bugs.centos.org/view.php?id=3338
08:55	* ogra points again to fork()
08:55	<cyberorg> it closed ssh socket soon after creating it, even when rdesktop was connected
08:55	<sbalneav> ogra: well, what we're going to do tonight is try to figure out the root cause of the problem, fix that, then yeah, Laser and I will work on getting SRU's, fixes for Jaunty, and upstream pushes.
08:55	<ogra> sweet
08:55	<nubae> awsome!
08:56	<ogra> take over upstream !
08:56	<sbalneav> Yes indeedley do.
08:56	<nubae> s! rocks...
08:56	<sbalneav> Well, I'm thinking that's what's ultimately going to happen.
08:56	<ogra> yeah
08:56	and the sanest thing to do if you can invest the time
08:56	<Gadi> cyberorg: well, you can work around that by running something before it that keeps the ssh tunnel open
08:56	then killing that process when rdesktop ends
08:56	<nubae> Gadi: if u still need logs, from 21, they are up now
08:57	<sbalneav> Sabayon's important, and currently no-one's caring for it upstream.
08:57	<ogra> johnny never was having the balls ... :P
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08:57	<Gadi> cyberorg: for example, make an ssh connection with -N
08:58	<cyberorg> Gadi, i hope you are aware of my programming handicap
08:58	<Gadi> hehe
08:58	I have been playing with a handicap my whole life
08:58	:)
08:58	<cyberorg> Gadi, you mean create ssh socket connection with -N ?
08:58	* Gadi prefers to think of cyberorg as handicapable
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08:59	<Gadi> cyberorg: yeah, spawn an ssh command before your rdesktop command with -N
08:59	that should hold the socket open
08:59	(i think)
08:59	<cyberorg> that is why i prefer of exporting password and use shell script, and unset LDM_NOMADPASSWORD immediately after running rdesktop
08:59	<Gadi> then, kill that pid after rdesktop ends
09:00	right - but that can never be integrated into upstream
09:00	it will fail security
09:01	<cyberorg> then i need suggestion (code examples) i can look and do copy paste :)
09:08	is there something similar elsewhere in ltsp code?
09:11	<nubae> cyberorg: I'd like the same...
09:11	:-) so if u do find it, let me know+
09:12	<cyberorg> nubae, what are you trying to do?
09:13	<nubae> reconnect to an ssh socket to be able to transfer user authentication to fatclient system
09:14	<cyberorg> nubae, password is perishable so you would not be able to reconnect
09:14	<nubae> well then create a new connection I guess
09:14	<cyberorg> that is why we stole ldm.password with g_strdup and stored in ldm.nomadpassword
09:15	<nubae> have to look at that
09:15	<cyberorg> nubae, BUT it is no allowed
09:15	<nubae> ?
09:18	<cyberorg> nubae, to create new password you need password again
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09:26	<nubae> bugger
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09:27	<Gadi> cyberorg: in that last diff you pasted, it seems you already know the kind of code to copy
09:27	:)
09:28	<alkisg> Is there any "normal" way to add a bunch of users from a .csv file? (i.e. a GUI app or a maintained script) - or is does this also fall under the "do it yourself" scenario? ;)
09:28	<Gadi> before running the rdesktop command, make a "sshkeepopenpid" assigned to an ssh command that connects to the open ssh socket with the -N flag
09:28	alkisg: man newusers
09:29	<cyberorg> Gadi, yeah i was thinking the same (great men think alike)
09:29	<alkisg> Gadi, ty, looking...
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09:32	<cyberorg> Gadi, but to run ssh command wouldn't we need stuff that is run in sshutils.c?
09:32	<nubae> @.die
09:33	<Gadi> nope
09:33	u have the soket, the server, and ldm_spawn
09:33	what else do you need?
09:33	:)
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09:34	<cyberorg> ok, will try that out first
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09:41	<pmatulis> ogra: btw, those settings gave the same results :(
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09:41	<pmatulis> ogra: also, xorg.conf did not get created
09:42	Gadi: your settings also did not help :(
09:42	<Gadi> pmatulis: you did: CONFIGURE_X=True?
09:42	<pmatulis> Gadi: yup
09:42	<Gadi> log into the shell of the client and do: cat /etc/lts.conf
09:42	see if lts.conf is the same as what you expect
09:42	<pmatulis> Gadi: one moment
09:43	<Gadi> if it is, pastebot it
09:43	!pastebot
09:43	<ltspbot> Gadi: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
09:43	<pmatulis> Gadi: yeah, lines are there
09:44	<alkisg> Arghh... useradd has /etc/login.defs, adduser has /etc/adduser.conf, users-admin has /etc/gnome-system-tools/users/profiles... I hate pluralism!
09:44	<pmatulis> Gadi: it's just 2 lines
09:44	<Gadi> then, thats the problem
09:44	:)
09:45	<pmatulis> ?
09:45	<Gadi> paste the two lines
09:45	<pmatulis> XSERVER=vesa
09:45	CONFIGURE_X=True
09:45	<Gadi> lts.conf is in .ini format
09:45	<alkisg> pmatulis: You also need a [default] section
09:45	<Gadi> you need:
09:45	[default]
09:45	XSERVER=vesa
09:45	CONFIGURE_X=True
09:45	not the [default] section
09:46	or, if you want to specify for a particular workstation, [<MAC Address>]
09:46	<pmatulis> not = note ?
09:46	<Gadi> right
09:46	sorry
09:46	:)
09:46	<pmatulis> k
09:46	one moment
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09:50	<pmatulis> Gadi: the ldm login screen looks better!
09:50	<nubae> gah, fixed the bot finally!
09:50	<Gadi> pmatulis: great! now, you can try those other params
09:50	:)
09:50	<nubae> dates and days showing correctly now
09:51	<Gadi> nubae: nice!
09:51	what was it?
09:51	<nubae> darn centos... the bot will only work when run from /usr/share/eggdrop, and centos package managers install it to /usr/share/lib
09:51	<pmatulis> Gadi: also, troublesome web page is good
09:51	<nubae> sorry /usr/lib/eggdrop
09:52	running with full path wont work... must be done from within the directory itself
09:52	weird stuff
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09:55	<pmatulis> geode driver is no good. looks like i'm stuck with vesa
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09:55	<jammcq> Good morning #ltsp
09:56	<cliebow> j!
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10:12	<_UsUrPeR_> I'm having problems with virtual screen size in ubuntu. I can't open a second monitor because ubuntu's telling me my virtual screen size is too small
10:12	is there a way to change virtual screen size outside of xorg.conf?
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10:13	<Petaris> Hi all
10:14	Is there a way to get a login screen from the LTSP server from another computer? Without using a client or netbooting?
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10:16	<Appiah> Petaris: on linux you can use a xdmcp client
10:16	gdm got one inbuilt , and you can choose "remote login"
10:16	<Petaris> Appiah: cool, thanks
10:16	<Appiah> on windows you could install xming and connect to it
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10:20	<alkisg> (shell script related): In /etc/gnome-system-tools/users/profiles (.ini format) there are two lines "groups=_something_", the first one under a [Desktop] section, and the second one under [Administrator] section. How can I get the "groups" line from the [Desktop] section?
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10:21	<Appiah> alkisg: grep
10:22	<alkisg> Appiah: there are two similar lines...
10:23	<Appiah> dont grep have a option to grab the first , second or whatever line?
10:23	<Gadi> _UsUrPeR_: X_VIRTUAL in lts.conf
10:23	<_UsUrPeR_> gadi: k :D
10:23	<Gadi> or Virtual in your screen section
10:23	of xorg.conf
10:23	<alkisg> Appiah: maybe, but I can't rely on the order, maybe the [Default] section is after the [Adminstrator] section for some users...
10:24	<Gadi> alkisg: in a script?
10:24	<alkisg> Gadi: yes
10:24	I think python has an .ini reader, but I think it would be simpler with a script...
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10:28	<Gadi> while read line; do case "$line" in [Default]) PAY_ATTENTION=1;; []) PAY_ATTENTION=0;; ; esac ; if [ -n "$PAY_ATTENTION" ]; then case "$line" in groups) echo $line;; ; esac; fi; done < /etc/gnome-system-tools/users/profiles
10:28	something like that
10:28	actuall, "unset PAY_ATTENTION" is better than PAY_ATTENTION=0
10:28	<Appiah> alkisg: ah ok , thought it always was the same order
10:29	<alkisg> Wow... that was difficult, I thought there would be some builtin function or utility for this... :)
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10:30	<alkisg> Gadi: what if I constructed a regex that searches for [Desktop]groups=() ?
10:30	But it should include newlines...
10:31	Nah, nevermind, the PAY_ATTENTION solution is fine. Thank you very much, Gadi
10:32	<Gadi> alkisg: there are some proper ini parsers out there
10:32	in various languages
10:32	(you could prolly use getltscfg
10:32	:)
10:32	<alkisg> Heh... not a bad idea at all!!! :)
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10:49	<ltsppbot> "alkisg" pasted "Get the groups that normal (=desktop) users belong to" (18 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/192
10:49	<alkisg> Heh... got it at last!
10:50	(getltscfg had problems lines like name[es]=Usuario sin privilegios...
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11:15	<quickslip> have some issues with AD integration and LTSP - ne1 available to help ?
11:21	<sbalneav> Doesn't appear that ne1's here.
11:21	But others are.
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11:22	<quickslip> anyone
11:22	<Gadi> !ask
11:22	<ltspbot> Gadi: "ask" is Don't ask to ask a question, simply ask it, and if someone knows the answer, they'll respond. Please hang around for at least 15 minutes after asking a question, as not everybody constantly monitors the channel.
11:23	<Gadi> in other words, quickslip, how can we help you today?
11:26	<sbalneav> Gadi: Guess I was too subtil, huh? :)
11:26	<Gadi> sbalneav: I understand u, but we've been talking a long time now
11:26	:)
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11:27	<sbalneav> subtle, even.
11:27	One day, I'll learn to spell.
11:27	Then I'll retire :)
11:27	<Gadi> your canadian, you can never learn to spell
11:27	:)
11:27	*you're
11:27	hehe
11:27	:)
11:28	<quickslip> Well - I have AD integration setup
11:28	<Gadi> btw, sbalneav: I was playing with ssh-askpass and password expiry last night
11:28	<quickslip> it seems to work for a while
11:28	and then all of a sudden - it stops
11:28	<Gadi> quickslip: are you using likewise?
11:28	<quickslip> no
11:28	<Gadi> ah. how does it stop?
11:29	ie define stop
11:29	and what tools you used to set things up
11:29	<quickslip> well - I have an ad account that I can use to login to the workstation - it allows me to successfully athenticate and then I can get to a desktop
11:29	<sbalneav> Gadi: Get anywhere?
11:29	<Gadi> sbalneav: seems the issue is not ssh really, its "passwd" -> passwd won't run a GUI if there's no tty
11:30	<quickslip> if I try again after about 24 hrs. I can not seem to login using the same account any more
11:30	<Gadi> quickslip: have you checked the logs?
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11:30	<sbalneav> Gadi: Well, it is ssh, because X forwarding isn't enabled until AFTER the pam session. I looked in the ssh code. So even if you link passwd to, say, an X enabled passwd, it still won't work.
11:30	<quickslip> yeah- thats the funny thing - the logs are still showing success on the authentication
11:31	when I try, it flashes for a second and then just goes right back to the login splash screen
11:31	<Gadi> quickslip: check the end of that user's ~/.xsession-errors
11:31	<quickslip> no error or bad passwd messages
11:31	<Gadi> it may give some hints as to why the X session is failing
11:31	<quickslip> is that in /var/log
11:32	<Gadi> no in the user's home directory
11:32	<sbalneav> quickslip: does it work if you log in on the console, but not if you log in via ltsp?
11:32	<quickslip> sbalneav: neither
11:32	let me take a look
11:32	hold on
11:33	<Gadi> sbalneav: that sux (wrt ssh): btw: do you know if one can create additional port forwards to an ssh connection by connecting to the master socket?
11:33	I know it is possible from the ssh command line
11:33	but, it doesn't seem to work when args are passed
11:34	<quickslip> Gadi: I dont see any home dir for my users
11:34	<Gadi> quickslip: ?
11:34	<quickslip> I am SSH in to the server
11:34	looking under /home
11:34	<Gadi> well, perhaps that is your problem
11:34	<quickslip> these are not local accounts
11:34	<Gadi> you never created home directories
11:34	or use pam_mkhomedir
11:35	<quickslip> is it required? they used to work
11:35	with home dir
11:35	<Gadi> they may not be local accounts, but they still need home directories
11:35	where do you expect the users to keep their stuff?
11:35	:)
11:35	<quickslip> yeah - never really thought about it
11:36	that command does not work for me
11:36	<Gadi> users need stuff
11:36	<quickslip> I am running LTSP on Fedora 9
11:36	ssh'd in as root
11:36	<Gadi> what you need is to find urself a good F9 AD howto
11:36	<quickslip> yeah - those seem hard to come by
11:36	<Gadi> that'll make sure you dont miss anything
11:36	<quickslip> have been searching (for a good one)
11:37	there are a lot out there
11:37	all are very generic
11:37	going to check things @ the console - brb
11:40	<Gadi> quickslip: google: mkhomedir active directory
11:40	you may find some good stuff
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12:09	<jach> hi howto run thin client manager from console with edubuntu?
12:09	my server not run gnome enviroment
12:09	<nubae> dont use client manager
12:09	<Lns> jach: TCM is waaay old and outdated
12:09	<nubae> use italc
12:10	and u will need a desktop of some sort, be it xubuntu, kubuntu, or ubuntu
12:10	<jach> my client run gnome
12:10	<nubae> your server then should too
12:11	<jach> my video cart not support in my server
12:12	<ogra> do you have thin client manager installed ?
12:12	try: scp-remote --help
12:13	<johnny> now what were you saying about me ogra?
12:13	* ogra whistles innocently
12:13	<nubae> wow u went and read through all todays conversation ;-)
12:14	<jach> yes i have scp-remote but error of d-bus
12:14	<johnny> nubae, hello!
12:14	<_UsUrPeR_> ubuntu 8.10 while testing units. Just re-built client image (ltsp-build-client) and tried to apply a xorg.conf. Now on boot, the same message flashes on the screen over and over: "xauth: creating new authority file /var/run/ldm-xauth-IJems3791". In the client's ldm.log I am seeing the error "ERROR: get_userid from greeter failed"
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12:14	<ogra> jach, well, its not maintained since a long time
12:15	<_UsUrPeR_> it's not getting to the login screen
12:15	* nubae waves to johnny
12:15	<ogra> if it would work, scp-remote would be the commandline interface
12:15	<johnny> ogra.. i don't have time to fix the entire world :)
12:15	<jach> i will like to created a new users, howto do?
12:16	<ogra> johnny, pffft
12:16	johnny, just sleep less
12:16	<johnny> i can imagine things are going to get better, now there there is one more person to play around with :)
12:17	<jach> ogra help please
12:18	<nubae> jach: use command line
12:18	adduser
12:18	check the web on how to use it
12:19	<_UsUrPeR_> anyone about the issue above?
12:19	<warren> pscheie_: did you push the latest build of k12linux-quick-start-guide into the update system?
12:19	<jach> yes adduser create user in my linux, but in my ltsp?
12:19	<_UsUrPeR_> both the syslog and messages on the client are empty
12:19	<warren> pscheie_: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/
12:20	<pscheie_> warren, no, I haven't yet; been swamped with some other family stuff
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12:20	<nubae> jach: its the same
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12:20	<jach> ok, very thank!!
12:20	<pscheie_> warren, it was just the one sentence, regarding NetworkManager not controlling the new device, that needed changing, right?
12:21	<warren> pscheie_: I already did it
12:22	<pscheie_> warren, then do I need to do anything?
12:22	<warren> pscheie_: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/
12:22	pscheie_: it is built but not pushed into the repo
12:27	<_UsUrPeR_> it's creating the file /var/run/ldm-xauth-IJems3791 over and over again... then deleting it
12:27	<pscheie_> warren, do you mean it's not in the rawhide repo?
12:29	* _UsUrPeR_ goes to open a bug report
12:29	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: it happens only once before X runs
12:29	_UsUrPeR_: if X died then it will do it again in the loop
12:30	<_UsUrPeR_> why isn't there any log pertaining to anything on the client/server?
12:30	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: nothing in /var/log/ldm.log?
12:31	<_UsUrPeR_> except for that: it says "error: get_userid from greeter failed"
12:32	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: when did this begin?
12:32	<_UsUrPeR_> post ltsp-update-client after putting a xorg.conf in /etx/X11/xorg.conf
12:32	err ltsp-update-image
12:33	err etc/X11/xorg.conf
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12:39	<warren> that probagly means X is failing
12:39	X fails, so it starts the loop again
12:41	_UsUrPeR_: it works without an xorg.conf?
12:41	<ogra> wonky xorg.conf ?
12:41	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: did you use X_CONF= to point at the xorg.conf location?
12:41	_UsUrPeR_: why are you using an xorg.conf instead of X_* parameters?
12:44	Gadi: ogra: where does ltsp-genmenu get installed?
12:44	<ogra> no idea
12:44	stgraber's child
12:44	<warren> stgraber: ping
12:46	stgraber: can I have a listing of where the files in ltsp/ldm/ltspfs get installed in debian/ubuntu?
12:48	<Gadi> /usr/bin/ltsp
12:48	-genmenu
12:48	oops
12:48	/usr/bin
12:49	<warren> Gadi: could you please list the paths of everything installed by the various packages?
12:49	Gadi: any URL?
12:49	Gadi: hmm, why does ltspfs have so many changes but not tagged?
12:49	<Gadi> warren: better if stgraber gives you complete lists as he has been packaging stuff
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12:50	<Gadi> ltspfs has not been tagged because we are working out a bug that does not affect normal use
12:50	but only affects when ltspfsmounter is installed in the chroot
12:50	so, it can be tagged
12:50	<warren> oh
12:50	<alkisg> warren: /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/bin/ltsp-genmenu
12:50	<Gadi> but, there is a known bug in a feature we are trying to get working
12:51	so there was some hesitation to tag
12:51	<warren> I need a listing of all files installed by the latest debian/ubuntu packages
12:51	I don't know where the cluster stuff goes
12:51	and I could be missing other pieces
12:51	<Gadi> ogra: btw, the new ltsp-genmenu makes the menuing seamless as in your initial localapps request
12:51	yeah, best to get from stgraber
12:52	<ogra> Gadi, yeah, i took a glance during development
12:52	but havent had time to see it in action
12:52	<Gadi> we also have LOCAL_APPS_MENU_ITEMS lts.conf param
12:52	so you can limit the local apps
12:52	(in the menus, that is)
12:52	<warren> Gadi: what runs ltsp-genmenu?
12:53	<Gadi> ltsp-trunk/localapps/ldm-rc.d/S01-localapps
12:53	it is run as the user
12:53	so it is in /usr/bin
12:54	<warren> oh, that is to be installed on the server?
12:54	BrunoXLambert has quit IRC
12:54	<warren> not client
12:54	wait
12:54	hmm
12:54	<_UsUrPeR_> warren et all: any ideas on this get_userid error?
12:54	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: does the login screen come up? that happens after you attempt to login?
12:54	<_UsUrPeR_> warren: it's prior to login screen
12:55	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: your X is failing to start, you are not listening
12:55	<_UsUrPeR_> no login screen appears
12:55	<Gadi> _UsUrPeR_: you should never put a xorg.conf in /etc/X11/xorg.conf
12:55	make it: /etc/X11/myXorg.conf
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12:55	<Gadi> and use: X_CONF=/etc/X11/myXorg.conf
12:56	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: why are you using an xorg.conf instead of X_* parameters?
12:56	<_UsUrPeR_> ubuntu doesn't seem to like the X_VIRTUAL command
12:56	<Gadi> yeah, ubuntu predates it
12:56	i thought you were on fedora
12:57	<_UsUrPeR_> gadi: oh :/
12:57	<Gadi> ubuntu jaunty will have it
12:58	<_UsUrPeR_> so that's why I'm using xorg.conf. To be clear: there appears to be no better way to put in a virtual desktop resolution outside of the "Section "screen"" section in xorg.conf in ubuntu.
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13:05	<Gadi> _UsUrPeR_: correct
13:06	but u should still not put anything in $chroot/etc/X11/xorg.conf
13:06	u need:
13:06	CONFIGURE_X=True
13:06	X_CONF=/etc/X11/myXorg.conf
13:07	<warren> _UsUrPeR_: was that you that filed the bug?
13:07	<_UsUrPeR_> no, you caught me before that
13:07	warren: ^^
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13:07	<warren> Gadi: the changes in ltspfs, which package does /usr/share/ltsp/xinitrc.d/ get installed into?
13:08	<Gadi> ltspfsd
13:08	because that is always client-side
13:09	<stgraber> Gadi: around ?
13:09	Gadi: I have a geode with an usb key, rdesktop setup and the latest ltspfs
13:09	<Gadi> stgraber: excellent
13:09	working?
13:15	<stgraber> nope
13:15	that's why I was poking you :)
13:16	<Gadi> ah, good
13:16	<stgraber> how is it working, what should happen when I plug the usb key (one partition, vfat) and what should be running on the thin cleint ?
13:16	*client
13:17	for now I only see ltspfsd running and the fstab entries added to /var/run/ltspfs_fstab (or similar)
13:17	<Gadi> you should be able to look on the client and see: /media/root
13:17	(you installed ltspfs in the chroot along with ltspfsd, right?)
13:19	<stgraber> that's actually a good point :)
13:19	<alkisg> stgraber: with your latest ppa on intrepid there's a line in ltsp-client-setup that needs to be changed for the usb sticks to be automatically mounted, is this the problem or is something geode specific?
13:21	<stgraber> alkisg: what line ? it seems to work well here and we're running Intrepid with my ppa (but it got updated a lot of time since the install)
13:21	Gadi: both installed
13:21	<alkisg> stgraber: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/317286
13:21	<stgraber> ii ltspfs 0.5.9~bzr91-0ubuntu1~ppa1 Fuse based remote filesystem for LTSP thin c
13:21	ii ltspfsd 0.5.9~bzr91-0ubuntu1~ppa1 Fuse based remote filesystem daemon for LTSP
13:21	<alkisg> I needed to either comment out configure_localdev(), or move the line that includes the upstream script down, after the local functions
13:22	(I updated the chroot this morning with your ppa in sources.list)
13:22	<johnny> kc8pxy, you about?
13:23	<Gadi> ok
13:23	<stgraber> alkisg: this actually is likely to be an upstream issue rather than Ubuntu, I synced it recently from what we have in the bzr
13:23	alkisg: we only have a few more stuff like nbd, serial mouses, ...
13:23	<Gadi> stgraber: do you see /media/root
13:24	?
13:24	<stgraber> Gadi: nope
13:24	<Gadi> do you see an entry in ltspfs_fstab?
13:24	<alkisg> stgraber: by moving the line ". /usr/share/ltsp/ltsp-init-common" after the functions, usb sticks worked for me - tested this morning.
13:24	<stgraber> root@ltsp223:/media# cat /var/run/ltspfs_fstab
13:24	/dev/sda /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda ext3 defaults 0 0
13:24	/dev/sda /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda-sda ext3 defaults 0 0
13:24	/dev/sda1 /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1 vfat defaults,utf8 0 0
13:25	<Gadi> thats bizarre
13:25	:)
13:25	whats with the /dev/sda?
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13:33	<seven> any one knows of a resource on cost benefit analysis of putting up a school lab based on LTSP
13:34	loather-work has joined #ltsp
13:34	<alkisg> Ermm... Gadi, do I need this? "you installed ltspfs in the chroot along with ltspfsd, right?" - my usb sticks work properly and I only have ltspfsd in the chroot...
13:35	<davidj> seven: The ones I'm familiar with are a bit dated.
13:35	<Gadi> alkisg: no, stgraber and I are working out localdev+rdesktop
13:35	<davidj> Gadi: Hello!
13:35	<Gadi> (for which eventually one would do this)
13:35	<alkisg> Ah, sorry, I'm shutting up now :)
13:35	<Gadi> davidj: !!!
13:36	hows the foot?
13:36	<davidj> How are you?
13:36	The foot is healing well, thanks for asking.
13:36	quickslip has quit IRC
13:36	<Gadi> see - you ask me about my spiritual well-being, and all I ask about is ur dumb foot!
13:36	:)
13:36	<davidj> It's mostly well now, only an occassional twinge when I slip in the snow ;-(
13:36	It's mostly well now, only an occassional twinge when I slip in the snow ;-)
13:36	<seven> davidj:would love to have a look at them - are they accessible over the web
13:37	<davidj> seven: google "cost benefit analysis school lab ltsp"
13:37	seven: The short version is that LTSP is much less expensive.
13:38	seven: Instead of replacing desktops every 3 or 4 years, they last 10 years or more.
13:38	<johnny> depending on the 10 years :) and what software is required..
13:38	<davidj> Gadi: The foot is obvious, not asking would have been odd ;-)
13:38	<johnny> obviously is new required software needs better graphics cards.. upgrades will be necessary..
13:38	if*
13:38	<Gadi> davidj saves me once again
13:38	<seven> davidj:yes, but the SUITS (management) want to see metrics
13:39	<davidj> seven: Gadi might be able to help with that.
13:39	<Gadi> me?
13:39	<johnny> gadi is biased :)
13:39	<Gadi> :)
13:39	there should be a wealth of LTSP case studies/success stories out there
13:39	<davidj> Gadi is not biased, he just has good sense.
13:40	<johnny> seven, in interested of full disclosure, gadi sells his own ltsp solution :)
13:40	<Gadi> on wiki.ltsp.org
13:40	and other places
13:40	<davidj> Well, if we're going for full disclosure, so do I.
13:40	<Gadi> cost-benefit largely depends on the factors that are important to you
13:40	if your school doesnt pay for its own electricity, the power savings may not be a factor
13:41	for, example
13:42	litlebuda has joined #ltsp
13:42	<litlebuda> hi all !
13:42	<seven> Gadi:a generic doc would assist as I am not to sure how to go about this
13:46	<Gadi> seven: I don't have a particular doc handy - I can research it a bit. But, basically, break it into upfront costs for hardware and software, and the costs after, say, 5 years
13:46	assuming a PC refresh every 3 years or so for standard school PCs
13:46	(or sooner, if you know your school's IT plans)
13:47	<ltsppbot> "4Gadi" pasted "ifconfig info" (26 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/193
13:47	<Gadi> also factor in electrical costs, size of IT staff for maintenance, etc
13:48	<seven> Gadi: thanks for the pointers - firing Calc already to create the framework
13:49	<Gadi> seven: best to start with what you know about your own budgets
13:49	then, its easier to compare
13:49	also, people use LTSP in all kinds of ways
13:49	<stgraber> Gadi: sorry, had to fix some other stuff :)
13:49	Gadi: so basically I have /dev/sda1 and /dev/sdb1
13:49	sda1 being the usb stick
13:49	sdb1 is an internal rom disk
13:50	<CAN-o-SPAM> seven: take a look at this: http://www.disklessworkstations.com/web/documentation/uniNorte.pdf
13:50	<Gadi> stgraber: before, you had sda
13:50	by itself
13:50	twice
13:50	warren: ping
13:50	<warren> ?
13:51	<stgraber> Gadi: ah, right
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13:51	<davidj> warren: Hey! Have you recovered from your jet lag yet?
13:51	<Gadi> my good friend davidj is having some issues getting your bridging stuff in fedora ltsp going
13:51	could you lend him an ear?
13:51	<warren> what kind of issues/
13:51	<Gadi> he's got a bridge to sell you!
13:51	har har har
13:52	stgraber: so, what does ltspfs_fstab look like now?
13:52	<davidj> warren: I have a single-nic laptop I'm trying to set up for a demo, and whenever ltspbr0 comes up I loose access to the lan.
13:53	I'm sure the answer's in the docs somewhere, but I haven't found it.
13:53	<warren> davidj: you need to dedicate an interface to the bridge
13:53	<davidj> brctl delif gets me back on the lan.
13:54	<stgraber> root@ltsp223:/media# cat /var/run/ltspfs_fstab
13:54	/dev/sda /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda ext3 defaults 0 0
13:54	/dev/sda1 /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1 vfat defaults,utf8 0 0
13:54	that's with clearing the file and plugging the key again
13:54	<Gadi> stgraber: whats up with sda?
13:54	<warren> davidj: the eth interface itself attached to the bridge has no IP address, it uses whatever is configured on the bridge
13:54	<stgraber> Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
13:54	/dev/sda1 1 1017 1954643 83 Linux
13:54	that's the partition table
13:54	<Gadi> right but how come sda is ext3?
13:55	and sda1 is fat?
13:55	that makes no sense
13:57	<davidj> warren: I've tried aliasing the eth0, also tried bridging ltspbr0 to eth0:1, no luck.
13:58	<warren> doesn't work that way
13:58	<davidj> warren: No, it does not. :-)
13:58	<warren> davidj: the bridge is only convenience for the most common way to use it
13:58	davidj: you're trying to do an uncommon way
13:58	<davidj> I know that.
13:58	<warren> davidj: can you get online with wireless and dedicate the eth to the demo?
13:58	davidj: eth plugged into an isolated network for thin clients right?
13:58	<davidj> I'm just trying to figure out the simplest way to do this.
13:58	<Gadi> davidj: you IMd me a bridge IP of 172.13.100.254, but eth0 of 192.168.254.250
13:59	seems to me, you need the bridge IP to be the same as eth0 (prior to bridging)
13:59	<davidj> wireless isn't always available.
13:59	<warren> davidj: your eth network already has DHCP on it? don't do that!
13:59	davidj: the bridge serves its own dhcp server, you are fucking the network
13:59	<davidj> warren: This is a demo syste.
14:00	isolated network.
14:00	<warren> davidj: remove the configurations from eth0, add it to the ltspbr0 bridge
14:00	then ignore eth0
14:00	configure only ltspbr0
14:01	<davidj> With ltsp4, I would configure everything to run on eth0, and use ifup eth0:1....
14:01	<Lns> Anyone do KDE over LTSP here?
14:01	<warren> eth0:1 was what?
14:02	davidj: you are not forced to use the bridge, you can reconfigure everything manually and use it exactly as you used to in the past. Just as much manual work.
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14:02	<davidj> warren: Sorry, I butterfingered that. eth0:1 would come up on a customer's lan.
14:03	<warren> you have the same eth interface plugged into a network, with dhcp server broadcasting?
14:03	F-GT has joined #ltsp
14:03	<warren> you're still fucking their networkin that case
14:03	<johnny> warren is a dirty dirty man
14:04	<davidj> warren: I'm fairly confident I can reconfigure everything so that the bridging isn't used. I'm just trying to figure out the best solution.
14:04	<warren> davidj: you are trying to do something totally non-standard, i'm sorry I can't help you. just configure it without the bridge.
14:04	davidj: but it sounds like you're broadcasting a second dhcp server on an existing network?
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14:04	<davidj> warren: No, my dhcpd only responds to the MAC addresses of my demo terminals.
14:04	<SDuensin> If I install iTACL in the chroot environment, what runs ica-launcher?
14:05	<warren> davidj: ok, that is even further non-standard, you need to configure every aspect manually.
14:05	<davidj> I know this is non-standard
14:06	warren: OK, thanks. I got the impression earlier that the bridging was intended to simplify this sort of thing.
14:06	<Gadi> davidj: are these PXE clients?
14:06	<davidj> Gadi: Yes
14:06	<Gadi> alkisg taught me the other day about "IPAPPEND 3" in pxelinux.cfg
14:06	<warren> davidj: the bridge simplifies the most common deployment scenario. your kind of scenario is just as difficult as it was before.
14:06	Gadi: what does that do?
14:06	<davidj> warren: :-) thanks.
14:07	Gadi: What's it do?
14:07	<stgraber> Gadi: sda1 is vfat, sda is the partition table
14:07	<Gadi> warren: it appends the PXE IP/MAC as a kernel argument
14:07	so initramfs uses it instead of ipconfig
14:07	(or a second dhcp request)
14:07	<davidj> neat.
14:07	<warren> Gadi: you just add "IPAPPEND 3" where to pxelinux.cfg/
14:07	<Gadi> it can help when dhcp servers conflict
14:07	on its own line
14:08	in default
14:08	google it
14:08	its an interesting read
14:08	:)
14:08	laserdrill has joined #ltsp
14:08	<warren> how can that help when dhcp serversconflict?
14:08	vagrantc has joined #ltsp
14:08	* alkisg reads up...
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14:09	<Gadi> it means that if you can setup the LTSP server such that it is first responder/only responder to broadcast PXE requests
14:09	then, you are done
14:09	it won't boot half way and then get a different IP
14:09	and screw up NFS/NBD
14:09	<alkisg> Yeah, that adheres perfectly to the dhcp protocol! :P :D
14:10	<warren> Gadi: hmm, but then initramfs lacks other parameters given by the dhcp server, like root-ppath
14:10	root-path
14:10	<Gadi> hmm...
14:10	yeah, that may break on nfs
14:10	ur right
14:10	<warren> We use root-path for nfs, nbd and iscsi
14:10	<Gadi> alkisg: did you test this only with ubuntu nbd?
14:10	<laserdrill> Hi All. I have ltsp5 installed on Ubuntu 8.04 (64 bit). It worked fine until I updated the server recently. Now the server stopped and the ltsp-manager throws up a blank screen (I never used it before today) so I cant figure out whats wrong. Any help would be really appreciated, thanks
14:10	<johnny> ltsp-manager ???
14:11	ltsp-manager shouldn't be there anymore
14:11	<davidj> warren: Thanks for the time, I'll talk to you later.
14:11	<johnny> it's dead
14:11	it's for 4x
14:11	or do you mean thin-client-manager or student-control-panel ?
14:11	<alkisg> Gadi: yes, and even there lts.conf had to be moved to /var/lib/tftpboot
14:11	* warren has never seen ltsp-manager, thin-client-manager or any of this
14:11	<laserdrill> johnny: thanks for responding
14:12	<Gadi> alkisg: ah
14:12	nm, then
14:12	its neat in theory
14:12	<johnny> warren, ltsp-manager is a 4x thing.. so no need
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14:12	<laserdrill> johnny: I am trying to find a way to get the server running again so i was looking for anything that might help. ltsp-manager is in the repos
14:12	<johnny> don't use it
14:12	it does not work
14:12	it should not be there
14:13	<laserdrill> ok
14:13	<alkisg> I have a patch for ipconfig to only accept offers from the "ltsp" dhcp server
14:13	If anyone needs it...
14:13	<laserdrill> how can I check to determine why the ltsp server is not responding to clients
14:14	Is there any tool that can be used to handle the lstp server?
14:15	<johnny> the ltsp server is not special.. many standard tools work
14:15	laga, you are going to have to start giving error messages
14:15	uggh complete
14:15	laserdrill,
14:15	<laga> johnny: no problem, let me dig up some
14:15	<johnny> laga, hehe
14:15	sorry
14:15	<laga> johnny: "An IOException at scim_bridge_client_register_imcontext ()" good enough? ;)
14:16	<laserdrill> johnny: Well, to be honest I have seen no messages at all. The server just worked when I installed it, then i update the system and it no longer works. OI am completely lost as this is my first ltsp on ubuntu setup and the first time I have ever seen ltsp do this
14:17	<johnny> laserdrill, try harder
14:17	you're not giving useful information we can help you with
14:18	<laserdrill> Johhny: I understand. what would be the first thing you'd look for. Maybe I can start from there.
14:18	<litlebuda> can anyone please give me some pointers on were to find info on a call center with ltsp and voip phones ? I have googled but cant seem to find any relevant information. thanks
14:19	<johnny> tell us what is not working :)
14:19	and then what happens when you turn on the clients
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14:21	<laserdrill> johnny: I dropped offline for a bit. If you had responded I did not see it
14:22	<johnny> tell us what is exactly not working
14:22	"ltsp server is broken" is not nearly useful enough :)
14:22	!questions
14:22	<ltspbot> johnny: Error: "questions" is not a valid command.
14:22	<johnny> !question
14:22	<ltspbot> johnny: "question" is if you have a question about ltsp, please go ahead and ask it, and people will respond if they can. please also mention the linux distro and release you're using. :)
14:22	<johnny> oh.. that's not it
14:23	http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
14:23	<laserdrill> johnny: ok, when a client tries to connect it does not get a response, so I suspect the dhcp server is either not running or not responding
14:23	<johnny> at which point ? before it does tftp ?
14:24	<laserdrill> ltspbot: I had indicated my distro: Ubuntu 8.04 64 bit
14:24	<SDuensin> laserdrill - if you changed any IPs, you need to run ltsp-update-sshkeys and ltsp-update-image.
14:24	<ltspbot> laserdrill: Error: "I" is not a valid command.
14:24	<johnny> soon i will have to shower :)
14:24	<laserdrill> SDuensin: Thanks for responding. I have not changed anything except for updating the server.
14:25	<johnny> laserdrill, explain exactly what happens when you turn on a client
14:25	* SDuensin is new at this.
14:25	<johnny> including writing out the messages
14:25	<laserdrill> johnny: yes, before it does tftp. Its like there is no dhcp
14:25	<johnny> laserdrill, please don't make us drag everything out of you
14:25	ok
14:26	so on the server, see if dhcp is running
14:26	dhcpd
14:26	<laserdrill> Johnny:sorry, I do feel lost with this
14:26	<stgraber> Gadi: what should happen when I plug an usb key ? should it execute ltspfsmounter or similar thing ?
14:28	<johnny> laserdrill, is dhcp running?
14:29	<laserdrill> johnny: I suspect its not running. I did dhcp3-server restart and got this error: dhcpd self-test failed. Please fix the config file. The error was:
14:30	I guess this is a start though
14:30	<johnny> ps ax \| grep dhcp would tell you
14:30	if it was running
14:30	or via the system monitor gui thing
14:30	<laserdrill> ok
14:30	<johnny> the error was ?
14:31	<laserdrill> johnny: this is the output:
14:31	4513 ? S<s 0:00 dhclient3 -e IF_METRIC=100 -pf /var/run/dhclient.eth0.pid -lf /var/lib/dhcp3/dhclient.eth0.leases eth012930 pts/0 R+ 0:00 grep dhcp
14:31	<johnny> ok.. tha'ts just client
14:31	so no server
14:31	<laserdrill> hmmm. ok
14:31	<johnny> so.. it says Please fix the config file
14:31	the error was: ...
14:31	WHAT?
14:32	<laserdrill> johnny: based on the restart msg the config file is bad. There was nothing after the colon
14:32	<warren> I plan on tagging ltsp-trunk later today
14:32	<Gadi> stgraber: yes
14:32	udev should
14:32	<laserdrill> johnny: The error was:
14:32	thats all
14:32	<Gadi> stgraber: and create /media/root
14:33	stgraber: have a look at ltspfs_entry
14:33	<johnny> oh
14:34	!pasteboot
14:34	<ltspbot> johnny: Error: "pasteboot" is not a valid command.
14:34	<johnny> !pastebot
14:34	<ltspbot> johnny: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
14:34	<johnny> laserdrill, paste your /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf or whatever it is called in there
14:34	wait.. i forget what it is on ubuntu
14:34	Gadi, remind me
14:35	<Gadi> johnny: ur good
14:35	:)
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14:37	<laserdrill> johnny: this is /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
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14:37	<laserdrill> ## Default LTSP dhcpd.conf config file.#authoritative;subnet 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 { range 192.168.0.20 192.168.0.250; option domain-name "example.com"; option domain-name-servers 192.168.0.1; option broadcast-address 192.168.0.255; option routers 192.168.0.1;# next-server 192.168.0.1;# get-lease-hostnames true; option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0; option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386"; if substring( option vendor-class
14:37	filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0"; } else { filename "/ltsp/i386/nbi.img"; }}
14:37	<vagrantc> !pastebot
14:37	<ltspbot> vagrantc: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
14:37	<vagrantc> laserdrill: ^^
14:37	litlebuda has joined #ltsp
14:38	<laserdrill> vagrantc: ok, I am new to this so I am larning
14:38	learning
14:40	<ltsppbot> "laserdrill" pasted "ltsp5 on Ubuntu 8.04 64bit (AMD X2 64 processor)" (22 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/194
14:42	<Gadi> laserdrill: what is the IP address of the interface serving the clients?
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14:44	<laserdrill> johnny, let me check
14:45	<alkisg> laserdrill: what Gadi said, and also "sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server status" to see if the dhcp server is running
14:45	<johnny> i am going to work shortly.. hopefulyl these other gents are working
14:45	alkisg, we already went over that
14:45	it is not running
14:45	<laserdrill> johnny: its presently blank according to ifconfig
14:45	<SDuensin> alkisg! Help! :-)
14:45	<alkisg> johnny: sorry!
14:46	<Gadi> laserdrill: I think you found your problem
14:46	you are not online
14:46	fix your networking
14:46	<SDuensin> alkisg - WTF do I do with the ica-launcher you gave me? I replaced the one in chroot, but have no idea how to properly start it on boot.
14:46	<laserdrill> alkisg: it says the server is not running
14:47	<alkisg> SDuensin: that wasn't for chroot installation, it was for normal italc installation
14:47	* SDuensin sighs
14:47	<SDuensin> I thought that's what we talked about?
14:47	<alkisg> No, first you asked for italc autodetection,
14:48	<laserdrill> Gadi: thanks for pointing that out. How would you go about fixing the ltsp dhcp server (ubuntu 8.04)?
14:48	<SDuensin> Well, you should know that us clueless folks want the world! :-)
14:48	<johnny> laserdrill, the problem is not ltsp related.. it is that you have no ip address on your network interface
14:48	<alkisg> I asked you how did you install it, you told me you did a normal installtion, I gave you the script, and _later_ you asked about the benefits of chroot installation :)
14:48	<johnny> /etc/init.d/networking restart
14:48	<SDuensin> alkisg - This is very true. :-)
14:49	<warren> anybody plan on touching ltsp-trunk?
14:49	I'm in no particular rush
14:49	<laserdrill> johhny: will do that. it will probably knock me offline for a bit. Thanks for your help so far.
14:49	<johnny> pastebin your ifconfig output
14:49	and then /etc/network/interfaces
14:50	* SDuensin will be back in about 30. Gotta pick up his daughter. That will give alkisg time to hide. :-)
14:50	<laserdrill> johnny: ok
14:50	F-GT has quit IRC
14:50	<alkisg> SDuensin: heh... or time to sleep, it's almost midnight in my time zone! :P
14:51	<ltsppbot> "Lns" pasted "Script to automate things" (310 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/195
14:51	"laserdrill" pasted "ltsp5 on Ubuntu 8.04 64bit (AMD X2 64 processor)-ifconfig" (26 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/196
14:51	<Lns> sorry, wrong chan heh
14:51	<Gadi> laserdrill: dhcp server fails because you have it configured for a subnet that does not correspond to any subnet of any interface
14:52	set an interface to the 192.168.0 subnet, and restart the dhcp server
14:52	F-GT has joined #ltsp
14:53	<Gadi> if you ask me how to configure your computer's network interface, I will beat you summarily with a wet noodle
14:53	<ltsppbot> "laserdrill" pasted "ltsp5 on Ubuntu 8.04 64bit (AMD X2 64 processor)-ifconfig" (24 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/197
14:54	<Gadi> seems you have no eth1
14:54	was that ifocnfig -a?
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14:54	<Gadi> *ifconfig -a
14:54	<laserdrill> johnny,gadi: thanks. Will configure the interface. Can't think how it got blanked !
14:54	<ogra> Gadi, coinfig -a ?
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14:55	<Gadi> ah, the germanic spelling
14:55	<ogra> heh
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14:56	* ogra is compiling kernels all day ... that somewhat mashes up your brain
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15:34	* SDuensin is back! Run alkisg!
15:34	<alkisg> Heh!! :)
15:35	<SDuensin> So am I just a horrible Googler, or is this not documented anywhere?
15:36	<alkisg> SDuensin: which one? the italc chroot installation?
15:36	<SDuensin> Yea
15:36	<alkisg> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/iTalc
15:36	<SDuensin> From what I gather, I put the italc-client in the choort, italc-master on the server, and then I need a dead chicken or something to connect them.
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15:37	<alkisg> Erm... :) something like that! See the above wiki page, you need to copy the italc keys
15:37	<SDuensin> Is there's something magic to the Edubuntu package vs. the Ubuntu package?
15:37	<ogra> nah, thats totally wrong
15:38	<SDuensin> The chicken or the wiki, ogra ?
15:38	<ogra> you need two goats facing east at full moon
15:38	else it wont work at all
15:38	<SDuensin> Hmmm. You know, where I live, I can actually do that. :-)
15:38	<ogra> we really got over the chickens over the years
15:38	<Lns> if [ $NumOfGoats = 2 ]; then ...oh whatever =p
15:39	<ogra> the edubuntu package and ubuntu package are the same package
15:39	<Gadi> so, here's a brain teaser
15:39	* ogra puts on the jumpstart clamps
15:39	<Gadi> is there any way to connect to an existing ssh master socket with a secondary connection and have that second connection add port-forwards
15:40	* Gadi connects the battery
15:40	<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTSPClientShutdownReboot ?
15:41	its quite old, but do you mean something like that ?
15:41	<Gadi> not like that
15:41	and thats cheating
15:41	:)
15:41	<ogra> indeed :)
15:41	<Gadi> I mean like this:
15:41	<SDuensin> I still don't get it. I did what that page says. ica does not run on the client.
15:41	<Gadi> ssh -M -S somesocket server
15:41	ssh -S somesocket -L 10000:localhost:10000 server
15:42	that seems to fail in creating a port forward
15:42	<Lns> ogra: do you have a list of these seemingly random LTSP wiki pages ? =) It'd be nice to see what might fit into the ubuntu/ltsp wiki. (I could probably just do a search for LTSP in the titles though)
15:42	<Gadi> seems the forward must be made by the master connection
15:42	<ogra> Lns, nope ... and its mainly weird hacks that really shouldnt be used :)
15:42	<Gadi> but one can add forwards to an existing connection with the ssh> pseudo-shell
15:42	<SDuensin> Does auto-discovery and chroot installation not work together?
15:42	<Lns> ah
15:43	<ogra> Gadi, hmm ...
15:44	even to the sub session ?
15:44	<Gadi> sub session?
15:44	<ogra> well, the second ssh call
15:44	<Gadi> ah
15:44	good question
15:44	<ogra> i.e. you establish it ... and then add the forward later
15:44	<Gadi> actually I think you cannot bring up an ssh> shell in the second connection
15:45	<SDuensin> WAIT! Where the hell is $START_ITALC supposed to be? In lts.conf?
15:45	<Gadi> only in the first
15:45	<alkisg> SDuensin: I've never installed italc to the chroot, so I really don't know what the problem is. Is ica running on the clients? Get a terminal, do some "ps", see the logs...
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15:45	<Gadi> but in the first, you can get into the subshell and add forwards
15:45	<alkisg> SDuensin: I think so
15:45	Without the $
15:45	<SDuensin> Ah HA! That's quite possibly the missing link!
15:45	Right.
15:46	<Gadi> ogra: all ssh connections on a socket share the same forwards
15:46	ogra: thats why we need to do -X in our first ssh call in ltsp
15:46	from LDM
15:46	<ogra> yeah
15:46	<Gadi> all the other places we do -X I think are irrelevant
15:46	:)
15:46	<ogra> so why dont you just use the first connection then ?
15:47	<Gadi> well, I am playing with an idea
15:47	:)
15:47	as usual
15:47	I have a little script that will try to find an open port on the server to use for -R (remote) forwards
15:48	I would like to have my script add remote forwards to the existing connection (once it finds an available one)
15:48	so, I can tunnel things like sound and localdev
15:48	(optionally, of course)
15:48	<ogra> well, ssh -S somesocket server my_nifty_script_that_finds_open_port && ssh > shell add port
15:49	<Gadi> right, but that only works on the master connection
15:49	which is my problem
15:49	<ogra> ugh, you dont want to tunnel sound or localdev through the tunnel
15:49	at least not their traffic
15:50	* Lns thinks Gadi belongs in the 5th dimension ;)
15:50	<Gadi> I want to try
15:50	:)
15:50	<ogra> with gigabit clients ?
15:50	and amd64 CPUs ?
15:50	<Gadi> the works
15:50	:)
15:51	I fear not the overhead
15:51	I embrace it
15:51	<ogra> that will either make your CPU or the network die
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15:51	<Gadi> mere conjecture at this point
15:51	NX tunnels sound
15:51	afaik
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15:51	<ogra> but uses nifty compression
15:52	<Gadi> nothing more than ssh
15:52	<SDuensin> Yea. NX is hella fast.
15:52	<Gadi> ssh does have compression, you know
15:52	<ogra> you surely dont want X and sound in the same tunnel
15:52	<SDuensin> Yes, it does, but not like NX.
15:52	<Gadi> SDuensin: NX's speed is not due to their compression of sound
15:52	<SDuensin> Oh no, not sound. :-)
15:53	<Gadi> it is due primarily to the type of proxy they use and their caching
15:53	not the tunnel
15:54	NX is fast for some things and not others, also
15:54	TurboVNC beats NX hands down when playing a video
15:55	just not when clicking through a menu ;)
15:55	<SDuensin> Never even heard of that flavor of VNC.
15:55	<Gadi> there's a wide world of terminal services protocols out there, boys
15:55	<warren> stgraber: nbd_device=$(cat /proc/mounts\|grep /dev/nbd\|grep nbd\|cut -d " " -f1) 2>/dev/null
15:55	<SDuensin> I know there are. And I want to know it ALL!
15:55	<warren> stgraber: second grep doesn't change anything?
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15:56	<Lns> Gadi: you should revise the wikipedia article for Terminal Services, it's completely Windows-centric
15:56	it could use a reality check from someone like you =)
15:56	<SDuensin> :-)
15:56	<Gadi> hehe - well, they are prolly the only ones that call it "Terminal Services"
15:57	:)
15:57	capital T,S
15:57	<SDuensin> More like capital B,S.
15:57	<Gadi> now now
15:57	<Lns> ooo, burn!
15:57	<SDuensin> Dude, I pretty much quit my job to avoid Windows.
15:58	Now my goal in life is to spread the word to the rest of the IT cattle.
15:58	<Lns> you're in the right place then.
15:58	<SDuensin> :-)
15:58	<Gadi> just be sure to keep your eyes open
15:58	<Lns> well...of course, gadi is in bed with both sides... ;)
15:59	<Gadi> too many evangelists cannot learn from the rest of the world
15:59	<ogra> warren, but its so much safer ... you only find the nbd devices in the list of nbd devices :)
15:59	<SDuensin> No, I know better. Windows has it's place. But not too many data centers run games. :-D
15:59	<warren> ogra: the second grep will always succeed
16:00	<Lns> warren: maybe that's just his way of double-checking. ;)
16:00	<warren> it makes no difference though
16:00	<SDuensin> Would you guys recommend NX between the clients and server if the clients can afford the RAM?
16:01	<ogra> warren, well, it finds the a's in the list of a's :) (indeed its pointless ;) )
16:01	<Lns> SDuensin: no, from what i've heard about NX and server-side saleability
16:01	<SDuensin> Oh yea?
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16:02	<Lns> SDuensin: from what i hear it's pretty expensive
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16:02	<Lns> (cpu wise)
16:02	<Gadi> SDuensin: local apps is much faster than NX
16:02	:)
16:02	<Lns> SDuensin: maybe find some more opinions in #nx
16:03	<Gadi> make high-motion-video apps local and if you need to, enable LDM_DIRECTX
16:04	and you will have the best user experience bar none
16:04	<Lns> Gadi: sure, just leave us ubuntu LTS users out in the cold... ;)
16:05	<Gadi> Lns: by 10.04, you'll be golden ;)
16:05	<SDuensin> Gadi - Well, yea, local is faster. But I don't want local.
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16:05	<SDuensin> And right now, I just want @%^$%&&( iTALC to work!
16:05	<Gadi> SDuensin: you just said you had ram
16:05	<SDuensin> I have some RAM.
16:05	<Gadi> then run only some local apps
16:06	<SDuensin> :-P
16:06	<Lns> Gadi: lol
16:06	<Gadi> lol
16:06	<alkisg> SDuensin: it didn't?! what did you put in lts.conf?
16:07	<SDuensin> echo START_ITALC=True >> /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
16:07	<alkisg> Eewww
16:07	<SDuensin> What?!
16:07	<alkisg> You also need a [Default] on top of that
16:07	<SDuensin> The setting made it to the client.
16:08	That'd be handy. :-P
16:08	<alkisg> Ah, ok >>
16:08	* SDuensin has no [Default]
16:08	<alkisg> (I'm on the third glass of vodka... :P)
16:08	<SDuensin> See? Google failed me again!
16:08	* SDuensin needs to START drinking!
16:08	* Lns forgot his [default] once
16:08	<ogra> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream is better than google ;)
16:09	* ogra alsways carries his [default] with him
16:09	<ogra> in my right pocket
16:09	<SDuensin> hehe
16:09	* SDuensin has even read the LTSP docs. Although you may never know it.
16:10	<Lns> ogra: with the cool netbooks you get to work on, i wouldn't doubt you actually do!
16:10	<ogra> heh
16:10	well, i wouldnt want to use an ARM netbook as ltsp server
16:11	<Lns> you know you do
16:11	<warren> stgraber: ogra: im going ahead and removing the second grep
16:11	<ogra> warren, sounds sane
16:11	<alkisg> I wonder how many of the ubuntu packages will refuse to compile in ARM
16:11	<ogra> warren, save bytes !
16:11	<sbalneav> nubae: there?
16:11	<ogra> alkisg, about 14 in main and about 800 in universe
16:12	<alkisg> Wow, very good
16:12	<ogra> well, i'm not getting paid for nothing ;)
16:12	<alkisg> :D
16:12	<sbalneav> I thought you were getting paid just for your Teutonic good looks!
16:13	And sexy, sexy hair.
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16:13	<sbalneav> You mean Shuttleworth makes you work too?
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16:14	<SDuensin> Shuttleworth should hire me as an evangelist.
16:14	<ogra> sbalneav, nah, he sends me free HW
16:14	<SDuensin> Or just give me his pocket change so I can afford to do it. :-)
16:15	otavio_ has quit IRC
16:15	* ogra had to get up at 8am today ... to recieve a piece of HW that looks like you can remote control the ISS with it
16:15	* Lns wonders if the name LaunchPad comes from Shuttle
16:15	<ogra> it does
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16:15	<Lns> ha! I'm so smart
16:15	ogra: pics?
16:16	<ogra> its bigger than my server in the basement ... but in the end turned out to only be a 600MHz ARM with 100M ram
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16:16	<SDuensin> I'm jealous. Most high-tech thing I have recently is a Wiimote.
16:16	<ogra> Lns, i cant, sorry :(
16:16	<Lns> aww
16:16	<SDuensin> I think I have a PDA that fits that hardware description. :-)
16:17	* ogra is really sad he mostly works with pre-release HW nowadays ...
16:17	<ogra> i got some beautiful stuff i'd love to share
16:17	<SDuensin> That's sad? I work with old broken crap people can't afford to replace.
16:18	<warren> stgraber: why nbd checker in ldm and not ltsp?
16:18	<ogra> well, i work with new broken crap that has to be fixed by deadlines
16:18	<SDuensin> hehehe
16:18	Still no ica on the client. <sigh>
16:19	<alkisg> SDuensin: did you get a terminal on the client and checked with ps?
16:19	<SDuensin> alkisg - yep
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16:19	<alkisg> SDuensin: post lts.conf in pastebot...
16:19	<SDuensin> k
16:20	<ltsppbot> "sduensin" pasted "conf" (4 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/198
16:22	<warren> hmm
16:22	<SDuensin> Not much to it.
16:22	<warren> ldm-trunk Makefile.am is missing a few of the files listed, so they wont get installed. Is this intentional?
16:25	<stgraber> warren: hmm, it requires ldm-dialog which is provided by ldm
16:25	<warren> stgraber: good enough for now
16:25	stgraber: posted to ltsp-devel
16:25	<stgraber> warren: about the second grep, it seems safe to remove it yes
16:26	<alkisg> SDuensin: I'm looking at the init scripts (ubuntu 8.10) for START_ITALC and I can't find it... maybe it's not there anymore
16:26	<stgraber> Gadi: around ?
16:26	<alkisg> stgraber: is START_ITALC needed in lts.conf to start italc in the chroot?
16:26	<stgraber> alkisg: yes
16:27	<SDuensin> alkisg - it's in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ldm/rc.d/
16:27	S06-italc
16:27	<stgraber> Gadi: I'm back home and have ssh access to that test box at the office, so I'm a lot more focused on fixing it than I was some hours before :)
16:27	<ogra> SDuensin, that means it will only start on login
16:27	<SDuensin> Arrrrrgh!
16:27	<stgraber> Gadi: having people poking you with packaging questions all the time doesn't help having an IRC discussion :)
16:28	alkisg: you need italc-client in the chroot, then it'll create a ldm rc.d script in /usr/share/ldm/rc.d/
16:28	<SDuensin> So where SHOULD it go?
16:28	<alkisg> stgraber: ty, that's why I couldn't find it, SDuensin is the one that's trying to install it in the chroot...
16:29	<ogra> SDuensin, its fine where it is, but a user needs to log in
16:29	<SDuensin> Isn't that the point of using it chroot? So it runs before they log in?
16:30	<stgraber> no
16:30	<ogra> ldm will exec its rc.d scripts during the login process
16:30	<stgraber> the point is to have less network traffic and less CPU usage on the server
16:30	* SDuensin sighs
16:30	<stgraber> though I can probably run it as a Ixx script now that we have them
16:30	but that'll be for Jaunty
16:30	<SDuensin> Oh.
16:30	Nuts. :-)
16:30	<ogra> stgraber, how would Ixx change that ?
16:31	you still need a user login, no ?
16:31	<stgraber> ogra: Ixx are started when the ldm greeter is loaded
16:31	ogra: so you'll be able to see the login screen
16:31	<warren> stgraber: also I want to know where to install all the cluster stuff. I haven't been packaging those yet.
16:31	<stgraber> ogra: actually I'll probably do it as a xinitrc.d script so it works with rdesktop as well
16:31	<ogra> stgraber, ah
16:32	<warren> stgraber: could you post to the list URL's of your package layout?
16:32	<ogra> haha, so stgraber fled from the office to answer packaging qustions in #ltsp g
16:32	<stgraber> warren: sure
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16:33	<SDuensin> stgraber - so the Ixx stuff is in the next release?
16:33	<ogra> in 9.04
16:34	<stgraber> SDuensin: as ogra said
16:34	and it's not in at the moment but something I'll do by the release
16:35	(just added that to my todolist)
16:35	<SDuensin> Ok, well, needing to login explains it. ica is running on the client now. No auto discovery though.
16:35	<stgraber> warren: http://pastebin.com/f28ad6a99 that's for ltsp-trunk (ltsp-client-core on the thin client)
16:36	spectra has quit IRC
16:36	<stgraber> warren: and that's for ldm: http://pastebin.com/f6f74a6c5
16:36	<warren> stgraber: localapps-menu is completely gone now right?
16:36	stgraber: what about ltsp-server?
16:36	<stgraber> yeah, I removed it yesterday
16:37	on the ltsp-server we only have a ltsp-build-client plugin that's at the moment in the Ubuntu directory
16:37	we can probably move it to common as it's not ubuntu-specific
16:37	and you may still want to build a fedora chroot with it (even if the other components aren't packaged for fedora)
16:37	laserdrill has quit IRC
16:39	<Gadi> stgraber: sorry (just scrolled up)
16:39	Im here
16:39	* warren not fully understanding what youmean.
16:39	<ogra> warren, there is a cluster plugin
16:39	<warren> oh
16:39	<ogra> that only resides in the ubuntu dir
16:39	and needs to move to common
16:40	<warren> I do want to get cluster working on fedora and to contribute more fixes to it.
16:40	<stgraber> Gadi: ok, so what do you think may be wrong with ltspfs ? (other than my partition table appearing as ext3 :))
16:40	Gadi: shouldn't /media/root be created anyway ?
16:41	<Gadi> stgraber: ok, well a few things:
16:41	1. if you ssh into the terminal to test commands, you should: unset SSH_CONNECTION
16:41	<warren> stgraber: it isn't harmful to non-cluster to move it into common now right?
16:42	<Gadi> (because the local ltspfsmounter commands need to set that to 127.0.0.1
16:42	<stgraber> warren: right, it'll just show an additional option in --extra-help
16:42	<Gadi> 2. take a look at /lib/udev/ltspfs_entry
16:42	<warren> ok
16:43	<Gadi> make sure the local ltspfsmounter stuff is there
16:43	* Gadi gets some coffee...
16:43	<Gadi> one sec
16:44	* vagrantc raises an eyebrow at ldm-trunk 1054
16:45	<stgraber> Gadi: md5sum matches the current upstream one
16:46	<Gadi> we have an md5sum?
16:46	:)
16:46	anyhow just take a look at that file anyway
16:46	* vagrantc hacked up a different file with the same md5sum
16:46	<Gadi> so you can see the lines that are added
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16:47	<SDuensin> On the client, what is /etc/ltsp/directory.conf for?
16:48	<stgraber> Gadi: "Also call local ltspfsmounter if installed", I guess that's the new code right ?
16:48	<SDuensin> Looks related to avahi, but I can't find it.
16:48	<Gadi> stgraber: yeah
16:49	stgraber: do this:
16:49	<stgraber> SDuensin: that's ltsp-cluster specific, it'll just use avahi if it doesn't exist, which is the behavior you want
16:49	<Gadi> export DISPLAY=:7
16:49	unset SSH_CONNECTION
16:49	ltspfsmounter ${MOUNTPOINT} add
16:49	<vagrantc> stgraber: shouldn't your nbd checker be run from xinitrc.d instead?
16:49	<SDuensin> stgraber - Actually, it won't publish unless that file exists. Will making an empty one make anything else mad?
16:49	<Gadi> where MOUNTPOINT is your /var/drives/...
16:50	<stgraber> SDuensin: what's the test it does on it ?
16:50	<SDuensin> Oh crap. I need to learn to read. It says \|\| OR!
16:51	But I have no published service on the client. avahi-publish-service isn't running.
16:52	<vagrantc> stgraber: doesn't seem LDM specific at all...
16:53	<stgraber> vagrantc: right, as long as it's in the ldm package because it uses ldm-dialog
16:53	<ogra> vagrantc, but it needs a running X to display the message
16:53	<SDuensin> I assume avahi-daemon needs to run as well. Not there.
16:53	<vagrantc> stgraber: ah,.
16:53	<mistik1> hey guys
16:53	<stgraber> vagrantc: ^ that too
16:53	<SDuensin> Hi mikkel
16:53	<ogra> it could use xdialog/zenity/kdialog though
16:54	<stgraber> ogra: I sort of like ldm-dialog's progress bar
16:54	<vagrantc> xinitrc.d stuff is run while X is up
16:54	<stgraber> Gadi: hang on a sec, I'm trying to find my thin client, I sort of lost it :)
16:54	<Gadi> no worries, Im getting dizzy myself
16:54	* ogra hasnt seen ldm-dialog to be honest :)
16:54	<ogra> my ltsp time is near to zero atm
16:54	<Gadi> ogra: its the best of zenity without the deps
16:54	:)
16:55	<ogra> well, zenity comes with gtk anyway usually
16:55	a sa dep of ldm
16:55	*as a
16:55	<Gadi> zenity has a huge amount of deps
16:55	above and beyond a normal ltsp chroot install
16:58	sigh evolution wigs out yet again
16:58	* ogra cant find much thats not pulled in by the ldm dependency chain anyway
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16:59	<stgraber> ogra: 27.5MB with the recommends
16:59	ogra: 12.5MB without
16:59	<ogra> right, and without should nearly match ldm deps
16:59	<stgraber> ogra: nope, that's on a thin client :)
17:00	warren has quit IRC
17:00	<stgraber> Gadi: I have a python backtrace for you
17:00	* Gadi wonders if zenity was written by Adobe :p
17:00	* ogra wonders about the diff
17:01	<ltsppbot> "stgraber" pasted "python traceback" (6 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/199
17:01	<Gadi> ah, crap
17:01	<stgraber> docbook-xml libart-2.0-2 libglade2-0 libgnomecanvas2-0 libgnomecanvas2-common libnotify1 librarian0 rarian-compat sgml-base
17:01	sgml-data xml-core zenity
17:01	ogra: ^
17:01	0 upgraded, 12 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
17:01	Need to get 2929kB of archives.
17:01	<Gadi> that was bec of the cleanup I did for vagrantc
17:01	:)
17:01	lemme re-cleanup
17:02	<stgraber> Gadi: ok :)
17:02	<ogra> sgml should be pulled in by ubuntu-minimal already
17:02	the xml stuff as well
17:03	<stgraber> ogra: I ran that apt-get install in a ltsp chroot, so it's not :)
17:03	<ogra> well, its 3M
17:03	<stgraber> 12M when unpackaged
17:03	unpacked
17:04	<ogra> diskspace is cheap :)
17:04	especially squashed diskspace ;)
17:04	<mistik1> ~$100 per TB
17:04	<stgraber> and IIRC ldm-dialog also uses the right gtkrc
17:05	anyway, it doesn't solve the issue that this would be a depend of ldm not ltsp
17:05	chrisinajar is now known as chrisinanothere
17:05	<ogra> yeah, dont think i want to make ldm-dialog go away :)
17:05	<stgraber> so I'd still end up without zenity in a default chroot :)
17:05	<vagrantc> Gadi: what are you blaming on my suggested cleanups? :)
17:05	<stgraber> s/default chroot/chroot without ldm/g
17:05	<vagrantc> ldm-dialog would make a useful package on it's own.
17:06	<Gadi> vagrantc: not at all
17:06	just my poor job at following suggestions
17:06	<stgraber> yeah, we'd have to rename it to ltsp-dialog :) and make it its own package, so ltsp-client can depend on it without depending on ldm
17:06	<Gadi> just fixed and pushed
17:06	Eghie has quit IRC
17:06	* ogra likes ltsp-dialog
17:07	<vagrantc> stgraber: well, it still could be part of the ldm source package, since the build-deps are more similar.
17:07	stgraber: or it's own source package...
17:09	<stgraber> vagrantc: separate binary package would be fine
17:13	<alkisg> (Copy/pasting a question I posted this morning, since all devs come here after midnight... well, at least in my time zone :P)
17:13	I have a specific TC which doesn't ...respond to the logoff menu. If a user tries to logoff, nothing happens except ldm goes to 100% CPU usage and /var/log/ldm.log gets filled with "sigwaitinfo returned an error" error messages, until it gets 60 Mb in size!
17:13	So I guess "res = waitid (P_ALL, 0, &info, WEXITED \| WSTOPPED)" in ldm_wait returns -1, and so the loop never stops. Any ideas? How can I see the returned error code? Run ldm with ltrace?
17:13	<stgraber> root@ltsp223:/usr/sbin# ltspfsmounter /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1/ add
17:13	Wrote 646a7b8284d0859a3a2b703750deeeaa size 32, waiting
17:13	Error: /media/root/ is not mounted
17:13	Gadi: ^
17:14	<Gadi> stgraber: you have a trailing / on your mountpoint
17:14	warren has joined #ltsp
17:14	<stgraber> alkisg: sounds like a question for sbalneav
17:14	Error: can't bindmount under /media/root: already mounted
17:14	suid mount failed: [Errno 16] Device or resource busy: '/tmp/.root-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda1'
17:14	<alkisg> sbalneav, some help please? ^^^
17:14	<stgraber> Gadi: that's without the trailing /
17:14	<SDuensin> stgraber - FYI, it works now. Seems avahi-daemon isn't in the right runlevels in the chroot.
17:14	<Gadi> stgraber: do "remove"
17:14	<stgraber> Gadi: my bad, 2s :)
17:14	<Gadi> then "add" again
17:15	<stgraber> Gadi: seems to work, is ltspfsmounter supposed to exit at some point ?
17:15	<Gadi> it doesnt?
17:16	<stgraber> nope, I got a: Wrote 646a7b8284d0859a3a2b703750deeeaa size 32, waiting
17:16	and it's still waiting :)
17:16	<vagrantc> alkisg: we had a stray thin client at freegeek fill up our server's /var/log/syslog with those messages...
17:16	<Gadi> hit enter
17:16	<stgraber> Gadi: already done that twice
17:16	<Gadi> hmm...
17:17	<vagrantc> Ryan52: any thoughts on the "sigwaitinfo returned an error" errors?
17:17	<stgraber> Gadi: finally exited now :)
17:17	litlebuda has quit IRC
17:17	<vagrantc> stgraber: sounds pretty similar to the problems i was experiencing
17:17	<Gadi> stgraber: wow
17:17	long wait
17:17	litlebuda has joined #ltsp
17:17	* Gadi wonders why
17:17	<stgraber> Gadi: remove fails
17:17	<Gadi> error?
17:18	<stgraber> root@ltsp223:/usr/sbin# ltspfsmounter /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1 remove
17:18	Error: /media/root/usbdisk-sda1 is not mounted
17:18	Error: /media/root/usbdisk-sda1 unmountablefusermount: bad mount point /media/root/usbdisk-sda1: No such file or directory
17:18	root@ltsp223:/usr/sbin# mount \| grep sda1
17:18	/dev/sda1 on /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1 type vfat (rw,fmask=0022,dmask=0022,codepage=cp437,iocharset=iso8859-1,utf8)
17:18	<alkisg> vagrantc: I can see that the loop should end if waitid returns -1, so I think a "break" should be inserted there, but I don't know why it would return -1...
17:18	<Gadi> stgraber: so, the mount you have, just not the ltspfs mount
17:19	<stgraber> yeah, and it's actually unnmounted :)
17:19	<Gadi> what is?
17:19	<stgraber> hmm, hang on a sec I'll just clean that mess and try once again :)
17:21	<ltsppbot> "stgraber" pasted "fustermount" (4 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/200
17:21	<stgraber> Gadi: ^
17:21	that's with everything unmounted and mtab cleared
17:22	<Gadi> can you do just the "add" and look for /media /root
17:22	perhaps lbmount is having issues
17:26	<stgraber> something is really wrong with that usb stick, I guess I'll just unmount everything, create a new partition table, add two partitions (vfat and ext3) and reboot the thin client :)
17:26	so I'll have a clean test environment :)
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17:31	<stgraber> Gadi: ok, I have an usbstick with two partitions, files in both of them and the patched ltspfsmounter, rebooting it now
17:32	it's one of these GX2 thing (white one, might be one of yours ?) so it'll take a while to reboot :)
17:32	<Gadi> yeah, Im familiar with it
17:32	:)
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17:36	<stgraber> Gadi: hmm, weird :)
17:36	root@ltsp185:~# mount \| grep sda
17:36	ltspfs on /tmp/.None-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda1 type fuse.ltspfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,user_id=0,group_id=0)
17:36	/dev/sda2 on /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda2 type vfat (rw,fmask=0022,dmask=0022,codepage=cp437,iocharset=iso8859-1,utf8)
17:36	sda1 is ext3, sda2 is vfat
17:37	<vagrantc> heh
17:37	<stgraber> both appear correctly in /var/run/ltspfs_fstab this time
17:37	<vagrantc> looks like python got None for the username
17:37	<stgraber> and none of them werer mounted in /media at boot time (is that the expected behaviour ?)
17:38	vagrantc: yeah ... :)
17:38	brendan0powers has joined #ltsp
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17:41	<Gadi> None?
17:41	more bad cleanup by Gadi
17:41	<vagrantc> that's kind of like python's idea of NULL
17:41	<Gadi> Gadi reverts to old code
17:42	<stgraber> vagrantc: NULL == null == None == 0 == nil ... probably one of the most language-specific thing :)
17:43	(some languages probably avec nul as well just to make it even more confusing)
17:43	<Gadi> pushed again
17:43	back to what I knew was working
17:43	if not cleanest and shiniest
17:45	gate_keeper_ has joined #ltsp
17:45	* Gadi now knows why he doesnt clean much
17:45	<Gadi> always causes grief
17:45	and I can never find anything
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17:50	<stgraber> Gadi: rebooting again, looks like that stick is randomly buggy :)
17:50	Gadi: this time it appeared twice as /dev/sda and then sda1 and sda2 :)
17:51	warren has joined #ltsp
17:53	<stgraber> Gadi: something is really really wrong :)
17:54	<ltsppbot> "stgraber" pasted "ltspfs_fstab" (7 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/201
17:54	<Gadi> lol
17:54	udev is going crazy
17:55	<stgraber> I wonder if I'll get three more by rebooting again :)
17:55	warren has quit IRC
17:56	<Gadi> weird
17:56	what does /media/root look like?
17:58	<stgraber> non-existent
17:58	<Gadi> stgraber: when you repartitioned, did you blank the first 512 bytes?
17:58	<stgraber> Gadi: I used fstab and did a "o" so I should have a all new partition table
17:58	<Gadi> do a: dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=512 count=1
17:58	and then do fdisk
17:59	some sticks need a good blanking
17:59	otherwise, they are never quite right
18:00	<stgraber> done, rebooting again :)
18:00	though, it's weird that /media/root wasn't even there
18:00	<Gadi> well, one thing at a time
18:01	when it comes back up, also check what is mounted
18:03	<stgraber> Gadi: I get the one I pasted before again (twice every partition)
18:04	<Gadi> I wonder if that is because of the udev rules you got from vagrantc
18:04	well, anyway
18:04	what is mounted?
18:05	<stgraber> ltspfs on /tmp/.root-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda type fuse.ltspfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,user_id=0,group_id=0)
18:05	<Gadi> that good
18:05	<stgraber> nope
18:05	<Gadi> can you ls that dir?
18:05	<stgraber> sda is the block device, not a partition :)
18:05	<Gadi> ah, right
18:05	so you have udev weirdness here
18:05	<stgraber> root@ltsp251:~# cd /tmp/.root-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda
18:05	-bash: cd: /tmp/.root-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda: No such file or directory
18:06	speaking of weirdness :)
18:06	<Gadi> well, that makes sense
18:06	because you shouldnt be able to access the block device
18:07	can you prune down your ltspfs_fstab so it reads correctly?
18:07	and then:
18:08	unset SSH_CONNECTION
18:08	export DISPLAY=:7
18:09	/lib/udev/ltspfs_entry add sda1
18:09	/lib/udev/ltspfs_entry add sda1 auto
18:09	actually
18:10	<stgraber> Wrote e8ec4d72b539d7b5ac8366b6063f6b11 size 32, waiting
18:10	Error: /media/root is not mounted
18:10	Error: /media/root/usbdisk-sda1-sda1 is not mounted
18:10	suid mount failed: [Errno 39] Directory not empty: '/tmp/.root-ltspfs'
18:11	hmm, I should actually just remove my ltspfs_fstab
18:12	ok, removing ltspfs_fstab, unmounting everything and doing rmdir in all the dirs (media, tmp and var)
18:13	then triggering the script for both partition works fine :)
18:13	root@ltsp251:/media/root# /lib/udev/ltspfs_entry add sda2 auto
18:13	Wrote e8ec4d72b539d7b5ac8366b6063f6b11 size 32, waiting
18:13	Error: /media/root is not mounted
18:13	(is the not mounted thing normal ?)
18:13	<Gadi> no
18:13	im looking into that now
18:13	<Ryan52> vagrantc, huh?
18:13	vagrantc, did you get it figured out?
18:14	if not, is it happening everywhere or just on one system?
18:14	warren has joined #ltsp
18:14	<Ryan52> a) we need to be using perror
18:14	b) since we aren't using perror, strace will tell us what the problem was
18:14	<vagrantc> Ryan52: sounds like alksig was encountering the same problem
18:15	<Ryan52> where are you getting it?
18:15	is it happening at FG?
18:16	<stgraber> Gadi: I'll restore the usbstick to its Windows setup (as in, no partitioning) just to make sure it at least works that way :)
18:16	<Gadi> stgraber one sec
18:16	can you run:
18:16	lbmount /dev/sda1
18:16	<stgraber> root@ltsp251:~# lbmount /dev/sda1
18:16	mountpoint name invalid.
18:17	<Gadi> oh, sorry
18:17	it may be:
18:17	lbmount /tmp/.root-ltspfs/usbdisk-sda1
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18:18	<vagrantc> Ryan52: haven't seen it at fg lately ...
18:18	pmatulis has quit IRC
18:18	<vagrantc> Ryan52: but haven't really been looking
18:19	tfl_total_nub has joined #ltsp
18:19	<tfl_total_nub> hello there :)
18:19	<Ryan52> vagrantc, so the only person who is able to reproduce it is alksig?
18:20	<vagrantc> Ryan52: haven't heard about it from anyone else...
18:20	<Gadi> stgraber: actually, it may be: lbmount /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1
18:20	<stgraber> Gadi: seems to be broken again, just doing a quick reboot ...
18:20	<Gadi> this code is annoying to trace
18:20	* Ryan52 wonders how to use perror without printing to stderr
18:20	<tfl_total_nub> hey guys, i just installed LTSP5 from ubuntu 8.04 and got my eee 701 to boot via PXE
18:21	<stgraber> Gadi: btw, why using the prefix thing when there's no name associated to the device ?
18:21	<tfl_total_nub> i rebooted the server and now i get TFTP timeouts
18:21	<Gadi> prefix thing?
18:21	<stgraber> Gadi: doing usbdisk-sda1-sda1 looks really weird as it just can't happen :)
18:21	<Ryan52> ahah. got it.
18:21	<Gadi> stgraber: that was code to get around 2 sticks with the same LABEL
18:21	obviously, your stick calls it twice
18:22	for some broken reason
18:22	<Ryan52> vagrantc, okay, I'll try to improve the error reporting in ldm..
18:23	<tfl_total_nub> would anyone be able to point me in the right direction?
18:23	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: do you have the "next-server" defined properly in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf?
18:24	<stgraber> Gadi: I have a small problem there, doing a ls in /tmp/.root-ltspfs just crashes my ssh :)
18:24	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: actually, i'm not running dhcp on my server, using dnsmasquerade on my router
18:24	<ltsppbot> "stgraber" pasted "even more weird things happening" (10 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/202
18:25	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: check that the interfaces on your server are up and in the right order
18:25	<stgraber> Gadi: that /dev/sda is just breaking everything it seems
18:25	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: i am currently on the server. it is a laptop, and only has one interface eth0.
18:26	<vagrantc> stgraber: if it thinks there's a filesystem on it, it'll try to mount it ... did you blank the first parts of your usb stick?
18:26	<stgraber> Gadi: oh no !!!! that may all be my fault
18:26	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: do you have wireless, too?
18:26	<stgraber> I have a remaining udev hack in /etc/udev/ ...
18:26	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: not using it, completely disabled
18:27	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: and your laptop is the tftp server?
18:27	<tfl_total_nub> yes
18:27	<Gadi> does your syslog tell you that a request is coming in?
18:27	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: also, i ran a tcpdump on eth0 while the client is trying to boot and got "udp port tftp unreachable"
18:27	<vagrantc> Ryan52: i don't know what conditions are needed to reproduce the sigwaitinfo bug ... alksig seemed to have a more clear idea
18:27	<stgraber> vagrantc: yeah, I did, though that udev scripts I had in /etc/udev/ was just running ltspfs_mount on everything it seems
18:27	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: firewall?
18:28	<vagrantc> stgraber: well, the udev script will run it on everything, but ltspfs_entry should determine weather or not to actually do anything.
18:28	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: no, everything worked yesterday and after a reboot. it stopped
18:28	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: did you install something that made you reboot?
18:28	<Ryan52> vagrantc, ok...I'll ask him next time I see him here.
18:28	<tfl_total_nub> Gadi: graphics drivers
18:28	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: dpkg -l\|grep inetd
18:29	<vagrantc> stgraber: ltspfs_entry checks ID_FS_TYPE for a value, and it looks like it was returning ext3
18:29	<stgraber> vagrantc: I was calling ltspfs_mount not ltspfs_entry
18:29	<Ryan52> johnny, what was that one thing that you said that this bot didn't have that you wanted it to? like memoserv, but after the person starts talking, or something like that..I just can't remmeber the name :p
18:29	<tfl_total_nub> Gadi: rc openbsd-inetd and ii update-inetd
18:29	* Ryan52 has a random brain today
18:29	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: looks like openbsd-inetd got uninstalled
18:30	tfl_total_nub: sudo apt-get install openbsd-inetd
18:30	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: just reinstalled it, no joy
18:30	<Gadi> grep tftp /etc/inetd.conf
18:31	<tfl_total_nub> nothing
18:31	<Gadi> thats the problem
18:31	add this line:
18:31	<stgraber> dpkg -l \| grep tftpd
18:31	<Gadi> tftp dgram udp wait root /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /var/lib/tftpboot
18:32	tfl_total_nub: if you are on ubuntu, you will need one for nbdrootd, too
18:32	tho, you may be able to just: sudo dpkg-reconfigure ltsp-server
18:32	I think thats what adds ir
18:32	*it
18:32	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: ok, trying now
18:33	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: also do what stgrabe says
18:33	make sure tftpd is installed
18:33	sounds like some stuff got removed on you
18:33	<tfl_total_nub> that's really odd no?
18:34	<Gadi> depends
18:34	Ive seen some odd things before
18:34	and everythings relativ
18:34	*relative
18:34	sounds more like mildly annoying
18:35	:)
18:35	<stgraber> Gadi: I just checked with udev and it seems to be that the usbkey is having problem when partitioned
18:35	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: the whole package was gone ltsp-server
18:35	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: ah - you'll prolly want that
18:35	<tfl_total_nub> haah
18:36	<Gadi> stgraber: well, thats fun
18:36	do you think it is your key in particular or the udev rules?
18:36	we did change the udev rules since last tag
18:36	<stgraber> Gadi: I did a udevinfo on /dev/sda and it returned ext3 :)
18:37	<Gadi> cough vagrantc cough
18:37	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: should i be seeing output when i run /etc/init.d/tftpd-hpa restart ?
18:37	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: you shouldnt run that
18:37	<stgraber> (after I wiped the boot sector, made a partition table, added two partitions and synced it :))
18:37	<Gadi> tfl_total_nub: tftp should run out of inetd
18:37	tfl_total_nub: so, no
18:37	:)
18:37	<tfl_total_nub> hehe
18:37	<vagrantc> Gadi: yes, and ubuntu's been using those rules for quite some time, just shipping our own copy.
18:38	our meaning Debian and Ubuntu
18:38	<Gadi> cough
18:38	cough
18:38	* Gadi drinks some water
18:38	<vagrantc> the old rules would do no better, as they check weather udev thinks it has a filesystem
18:38	which udev does.
18:38	<Gadi> stgraber: thats quite bizarre
18:39	<tfl_total_nub> gadi: thanks for the help, but i'm still having no luck. i have to go now, my gf is nagging me :)
18:39	<stgraber> Gadi: that's cheap 3 years old usb key so ...
18:39	<Gadi> what happens if you dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda count=1 bs=512
18:39	and then look at it with udev?
18:39	tfl_total_nub: just marry her and come to expect it
18:40	I mean, no worries
18:40	<stgraber> ok, with /dev/sda being ext3, it worked fine :)
18:40	* Gadi presses the 7-second erase button
18:40	<stgraber> will try the dd now
18:41	Gadi: ext3 :)
18:41	ID_FS_USAGE=filesystem
18:41	ID_FS_TYPE=ext3
18:41	<Gadi> wow
18:41	thats weird
18:41	<vagrantc> persistant bugger.
18:41	<Gadi> you've brainwashed your stick
18:42	<vagrantc> bad sectors?
18:42	<stgraber> vagrantc: not impossible
18:42	<Gadi> so, can you make /dev/sda ext3 again?
18:42	:)
18:43	give udev what it wishes
18:43	<stgraber> will try to format it in vfat and see what happens :)
18:43	<Gadi> that'll eally mess with it
18:44	<stgraber> ah, I forgot to do something, udev scans at boot time, I need to reboot :)
18:44	<Gadi> or kill udevd
18:45	<stgraber> warren: about your post to ltsp-dev, I forgot to add them and that's a bug
18:45	<vagrantc> Gadi: if you had to change the root = "/tmp/.root-ltspfs" ... stuff back ... that probably means that os.putenv isn't working with ltspfsmounter and such, ieither.
18:45	<warren> stgraber: more than just that one
18:45	stgraber: how did anyone actually use those scripts then?
18:45	<vagrantc> Gadi: or lbmount
18:46	<Gadi> vagrantc: a rational argument
18:46	perhaps I should export USER=root in all these scripts
18:46	<vagrantc> might be the source of all this headache
18:46	egads.
18:46	<Gadi> what?
18:46	<vagrantc> Gadi: that just sounds evil.
18:46	<Gadi> oh, get over it
18:46	its stupid lbmount's fault
18:47	I prefer to get rid of root entirely
18:47	<vagrantc> paranoid, not stupid. well, maybe both.
18:47	<Gadi> but, no....
18:47	we have to hardcode everything
18:47	to stupid values
18:47	<vagrantc> Gadi: next thing you'll be running GNU/Hurd!
18:47	that'll really get rid of root.
18:47	<Gadi> ok, lemme export USER
18:48	...
18:48	<vagrantc> i don't know.
18:48	<stgraber> warren: the 3 scripts are mine :) and all entered since last tag I'd say
18:49	I always forget to add them to that Makefile.am ... (btw, why do we have to manually specify them ?)
18:51	<warren> stgraber: I dunno, is there a better way?
18:52	<stgraber> I'm not good at autotools but can't we just make it copy the content of the directory on make install ?
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18:53	<kc8pxy> johnny: i am now
18:54	and youjust split
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18:54	<kc8pxy> :-(
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18:55	<stgraber> ok, I fixed the Makefile for ldm, any change about to be uploaded ? If not I'll just tag it now
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18:56	<vagrantc> Gadi: did you catch my pastebot paste?
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18:56	<vagrantc> Gadi: http://pastebot.ltsp.org/203
18:56	<Gadi> stgraber, vagrantc: if you can test at all the latest push with known good hardware, that'd be cool
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18:57	<kc8pxy> johnny: here
18:57	<stgraber> I'll also tag ltsp in a few minutes
18:57	(I sort of need these ltsp-cluster and localapps commit)
18:58	* vagrantc fades away
18:58	<kc8pxy> kc8pxy: you need me to help something?
19:02	<Ryan52> ...
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19:59	<stgraber> tagging ldm and ltsp now
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20:58	<kc8pxy> johnny: still need my help?
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22:49	<johnny> kc8pxy, so did you get success with clearlooks ?
22:49	err.. gtk-engines
22:49	without the ubuntulooks?
22:49	kc8pxy, my box is almost back alive again.. if only i could fix my toolchain
22:49	i screwed up gcc/binutils/glibc
22:49	somehow
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23:37	<alkisg> sbalneav: ping? (about a "sigwaitinfo returned an error" error)
23:43	<Ryan52> alkisg: can you apply this patch http://slexy.org/raw/s2969Z7Ph2 , rebuild, and try again?
23:43	<alkisg> Ryan52: ah... rebuilding will take some time, as I'll have to gather the sources and tools :)
23:43	<Ryan52> I can do it.
23:43	<alkisg> Ryan52: I could try a binary though :)
23:44	Thanks!!!
23:44	<Ryan52> I have chroots. what version of ubuntu are you using?
23:44	<alkisg> Intrepid, with stgraber's PPA (=jaunty ltsp)
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23:49	<Ryan52> hrm. are you in a patient mood? I have to set up a new chroot, tho I have a fairly quick connection.
23:50	<alkisg> Ryan52: sure, and I can only try it in 4-5 hours, when I'll go to school
23:50	Thanks a lot!
23:50	<Ryan52> ok
23:52	<warren> stgraber: hmm, your nbd updater script doesn't seem to be wrking
23:52	stgraber: boot a client, redo the nbd image file, restart ldm, right?
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