IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 14 February 2007 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:00 | <krinns> ogra u there
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| 01:00 | cliebow
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| 01:01 | any one there
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| 01:01 | i have ubuntu with ltsp.2 all good
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| 01:01 | but when any thin client user logs off it sees an option of hibernate
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| 01:01 | with hibernate the server
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| 01:01 | and all goes off sundenly
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| 01:02 | in /etc/X11/gdm.conf
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| 01:02 | i disable SystemMenu = false but this wont fix it will not shot shutdown option but hibernate is still there
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| 01:03 | any idea how i disbale this hiberbnate option
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| 03:06 | <CapRiCoRN^80> hi
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| 03:14 | <CapRiCoRN^80> ogra: u there ?
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| 05:13 | <envite> Hello all from Spain
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| 05:13 | Hola a todos desde España
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| 05:33 | <sumpfdotterblume> hello
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| 05:34 | I've Clients with a Radeon Rage 128, and when i start the clients Xorg doesn't start
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| 05:35 | I've use ati, r128 and auto but nothing work
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| 05:38 | <sumpfdotterblume> Now it works
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| 05:38 | I've deled the Modules and now it works
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| 05:40 | :-)
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| 05:50 | <cliebow> krinns:i dont think i caan help
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| 06:03 | <andrea_> hello anybody around ?
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| 06:04 | i m tryin to help a friend he is using vnc to exports students desktops into teacher dektops ...
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| 06:04 | but he has problemes visualizing mplayer windows into those exported desktops ...
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| 06:05 | so he was asking me if there is any project dealing with this sort of probelem ...
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| 06:05 | btw i m bip ...
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| 06:05 | i chas as andrea_ just because i m using somebody else machine right now ;-)
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| 06:48 | <andrea_> i m tryin to help a friend he is using vnc to exports students desktops into teacher dektops ...
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| 06:48 | but he has problemes visualizing mplayer windows into those exported desktops ...
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| 09:05 | <jammcq> GodFather: HEY !!!
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| 09:09 | <GodFather> i'm tring to fix this thing
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| 09:10 | <jammcq> something wrong with your "thing" ?
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| 09:15 | <cliebow> my thing is broken too.
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| 09:15 | Godfather:ever thought of reselling the eway clients?
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| 09:15 | or nohrtek?
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| 09:16 | <GodFather> cliebow, no haven't do you have a url?
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| 09:17 | <jammcq> etyack has looked at them. we can discuss later today
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| 09:19 | <bricode> What are people's pricepoints for clients?
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| 09:24 | <cliebow> ewayco.com
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| 09:25 | their clients are like 99 but in quantity 85..it is wirng te money that costs so
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| 09:26 | http://www.norhtec.com/products/index.html
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| 09:26 | i tried to get one frokm nohrtec..couldnt clear my visa card..ewy.com ended up with 30 bucks for wiring money near 150
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| 09:27 | justr seems the price might be more to peoples liking
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| 09:27 | some people are using them
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| 09:46 | <bricode> cliebow: are they decent for horsepower?
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| 09:46 | <bricode> cliebow: are you using it in the pure thin client setup?
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| 10:04 | <cliebow_> brocode..never got one...
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| 10:59 | <michel> hello: i am in africa and i am installing ltsp, now i have seen that the version 1.5 is out, i have experiences with 1.4.2, what can you recommend 1.5 or 1.4.2?
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| 11:23 | <Trolle> Hi has anyone gotten X-lite or simlar working on your ltsp clients
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| 12:18 | <nofxx> hi everyone !
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| 12:31 | <nofxx> ogra: hi... xvidtune works on the client... but only for the session... i dont know how to get the correct values... it shows the same... when you close it
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| 12:32 | maybe if I play with the rates on lts.conf? HORZSYNC ? say... take 5 from it?
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| 12:32 | HSync 30-81 = offset to the right....... HSync = 25-76?
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| 12:35 | what is funny is that the splash screens are perfect..hahaha....
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| 12:37 | <cliebow_> what the diff between using T and S in inittab as the first character n a line?
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| 12:51 | <nofxx> so.. if I specify Hsync, I got a offset... without .. i got 800x600... cant be another config ? X_VIDEORAM ?
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| 12:51 | gigabytes has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:52 | <nofxx> the onboard gpu not passing the total amount of ram so ltsp gives 800x600 to it ...
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| 12:57 | ...gonna cry
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| 13:21 | <Maxou> hi
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| 13:21 | how can i configure an account for many people ?
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| 13:21 | such a kiosq account
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| 13:22 | <pscheie> you don't, you setup an account for each kiosk
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| 13:22 | <Maxou> humm i have ever done one day
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| 13:35 | mtnbkr has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:37 | <mtnbkr> can anyone help me with screen scripts? I want to have the thin clients boot to a console login prompt rather than the X login. I have looked a the telnet, startx, shell, rdesktp files in the etc/screen.d directory but am stumped as to how to switch to console logins. is it even possible?
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| 13:39 | <nofxx> there is some kind of time manager... a cronometer on the thin destkop.. and the server get the month hours that user used
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| 13:49 | sbalneav has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:50 | <sbalneav> Afternoon all
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| 13:50 | <mistik1> greets
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| 13:51 | <Maxou> no idea ?
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| 13:52 | i have done a guest account one day
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| 13:52 | oh207 has quit IRC | |
| 13:52 | <Maxou> but i don't remember how ...
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| 13:52 | that's for a conference
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| 13:55 | <cliebow_> Itttttttts Scottie
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| 13:57 | <joebaker> ogra Regarding the printing issue we were working on yesterday... /dev/lp0 is showing up after booting, and modules lp and parport_pc are loading but lp_server doesn't show up. Also when I run /usr/lib/ltsp/lp_server -n 9100 -d /dev/lp0 the daemon stays running, but print jobs do not get to the printer. If I add -w (write only) to the daemon line, I can print to the printer. Yeah! I hope this helps in your development
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| 13:59 | ogra the other command line parameter I saw for lp_server was -r I added "-r 192.168.0.0/24" to the parameters in addition to -w.
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| 14:03 | <jammcq> sbalneav: Scotty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 14:03 | <sbalneav> hey hey
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| 14:07 | <nofxx> Ive got a image offset, to the right, setting HSync samsungs rates on lts.conf...on default settings it only gets 800x600...... any help?? using nv driver on a geforce 6150
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| 14:07 | <mistik1> I cant believe that after all this time you guys still do that ;-)
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| 14:07 | You must be friends or something ;P
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| 14:07 | <jammcq> heh
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| 14:07 | sbalneav: check yer private msgs
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| 14:08 | <pscheie> jammcq: any idea why messages I send to the ltsp mailing list don't show up?
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| 14:08 | <mtnbkr> so am I chasing my tail trying to have console logins on the thin clients rather than X gui logins?
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| 14:08 | <jammcq> pscheie: umm, nope. what is your email addr that you are signed up with?
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| 14:08 | mtnbkr: you want char-based logins ?
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| 14:08 | <pscheie> it's...uh, hold on, I think I might know what the problem is
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| 14:09 | <mtnbkr> yes. from there the the users will run freedos in dosemu (which I have gotten to work in an X session so far. now I am tring to get off of the gui log in at all.
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| 14:10 | <jammcq> mtnbkr: do you want to log into a server? or do you just want to run a session on the thin client?
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| 14:11 | <mtnbkr> I want to authenticate to the LTSP server so the user gets his/her home directory etc. the basic a SCREEN_01 = shell will not work. I need to auth to the LTSP server without GUI
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| 14:11 | <jammcq> yeah, that's not really supported by ltsp
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| 14:12 | in LTSP, the thin client doesn't have any concept of users
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| 14:12 | it's just a conduit, to get you logged into a server
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| 14:12 | <mtnbkr> what about a /bin/login -h ltsp.servername.com as a screen script?
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| 14:15 | <jammcq> I dunno what -h does
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| 14:15 | the manpage simply states it's the name of the remote host
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| 14:15 | prolly for updating of utmp, so that the 'w' command shows where you came from
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| 14:18 | <pscheie> jammcq: ok, now I've really ballocksed things up with the mailing list
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| 14:18 | email addy has been petre@scheie.homedns.org
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| 14:19 | but I changed my identity in Tbird a few weeks ago to peter@...
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| 14:19 | <jammcq> well, mailman isn't gonna like that
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| 14:19 | <pscheie> but since that's not the address I signed up under, mailman was tossing them
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| 14:19 | <jammcq> so, create a new account in mailman
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| 14:20 | <pscheie> tried that, says that address has been banned
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| 14:20 | can you unban it?
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| 14:22 | <jammcq> there's no 'peter@....'
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| 14:22 | <pscheie> no peter@scheie.homedns.org?
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| 14:22 | Megant is now known as Megant_ | |
| 14:22 | <jammcq> Nope
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| 14:23 | there's only 3 'peter' accounts
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| 14:23 | and you aint one of them
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| 14:23 | <pscheie> hokay, I'll try it again
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| 14:24 | <jammcq> on top of that, your test message--ignore made it to the list
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| 14:24 | <pscheie> yeah, it did 'cause I changed my ID in TB back to petre
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| 14:25 | but if I change it to peter again, the messages will get blocked
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| 14:25 | I suspect that's why my address is banned, too many unauthorized messages
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| 14:26 | 'cause I was sending them without having signed up the peter address
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| 14:26 | I tried changing the address within mailman, but when I try to login under the new address, it fails
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| 14:27 | <pscheie> and when I try to register peter, it says 'banned, contact the list admin'
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| 14:27 | <jammcq> hmm, dunno why it would be banned. Unless Mike set it up that way
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| 14:28 | Mike collins takes care of managing the mailing list
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| 14:28 | chupacabra: hey, you around?
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| 14:29 | <jammcq> i'm not sure where mailman stores banned users, looking now
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| 14:36 | <jammcq> pscheie: you sure you aren't: peter@panhandle.rr.com ?
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| 14:36 | <pscheie> nope
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| 14:36 | rr.com = road runner cable
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| 14:36 | I don't like cable cos
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| 14:37 | their speed is good, policies are bad
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| 14:37 | <jammcq> i found the ban list, and that is the only peter on the list
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| 14:37 | <pscheie> not that any of that matters to you in this case ;-)
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| 14:38 | <jammcq> ah, FOUND IT :)
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| 14:38 | <pscheie> hmm, so why does it keep saying peter@scheie.homedns.org is banned when I try to sign up?
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| 14:38 | oh good
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| 14:38 | find it in the 'banned because his messages aren't really worth reading' category?
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| 14:39 | <jammcq> damit. the user interface for this sucks. There's about 200 addresses listed in a scrolling field on a webpage. the fiel only displays about 8 lines at a time. I found your entry, and I removed it. when I clicked 'submit', I got an error
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| 14:44 | <pscheie> I just tried it again, for laughs--same result: banned
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| 14:46 | <jammcq> ok, try it now
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| 14:47 | <pscheie> nope, still says it's banned
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| 14:47 | <jammcq> I need to search through the list again. when I got the error, im' not sure if it removed you or not. I found a few obviously wrong addresses, and removed them. that got me over the error
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| 14:49 | ok, got it
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| 14:49 | try it now
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| 14:51 | <mistik1> jammcq: If I can get access to that webserver of yours I would setup pastebot there for you
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| 14:51 | <pscheie> nope, same thing
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| 14:51 | <jammcq> pscheie: no way
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| 14:51 | maybe it needs to get replicated or something
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| 14:51 | <pscheie> btw, I've just been hitting my back button and then rehitting the submit page
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| 14:51 | <jammcq> mistik1: isn't just a perl cgi script?
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| 14:51 | <pscheie> let me kill my browser and try it
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| 14:51 | <jammcq> k
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| 14:52 | <mistik1> well the latest one if setup has annotations et al and it was lisp based
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| 14:52 | and the other is a stand alone server
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| 14:52 | <jammcq> "lisp" based???? people are still writing in lisp ?
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| 14:52 | <mistik1> you could proxy it with apache though
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| 14:52 | yessir ;)
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| 14:53 | <pscheie> aargh! still says i'm banned
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| 14:53 | <mistik1> darnit
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| 14:53 | lbe keeps bombing on me
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| 14:54 | <jammcq> pscheie: oh, wait, there's ANOTHER list of banned users
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| 14:54 | nofxx has joined #ltsp | |
| 14:54 | <pscheie> isn't mailman fun!
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| 14:58 | <jammcq> pscheie: what makes it really hard, is the list of 200-300 banned addresses isn't sorted in any order, so I have to stare at this tiny window of 8 lines, as I hit the scrollbar
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| 14:59 | <mistik1> can firefox not search it out
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| 14:59 | <jammcq> can you search in a scrolling text box ?
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| 14:59 | <mistik1> donno
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| 15:00 | try it out
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| 15:00 | <jammcq> the answer seems to be no
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| 15:00 | <mistik1> :(
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| 15:01 | <mistik1> jammcq: btw I just ran into the same error Eric did with lbe failing on perl
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| 15:01 | <jammcq> ah, good ole Mozex to the rescue
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| 15:01 | <pscheie> can you highlight the names in the scrollbox while pressing the down arrow key?
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| 15:01 | <jammcq> i've got a firefox plugin that lets me edit a text box using vi
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| 15:02 | <mistik1> slick
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| 15:02 | <jammcq> pscheie: ok, try that
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| 15:02 | sbalneav turned me on to that beauty
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| 15:02 | <jammcq> while I had the list in vi, I sorted it, so that helps for next time
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| 15:02 | <pscheie> Bingo!!!
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| 15:02 | * mistik1 goes hunting that plugin | |
| 15:02 | * pscheie goes hunting that plugin, too | |
| 15:03 | <jammcq> it's called Mozex
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| 15:03 | it's for 'External command integration'
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| 15:03 | so I set it up to call "xterm -e vim %t" when the Ctrl-Alt-e key is pressed
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| 15:04 | <mistik1> just installed it ;)
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| 15:06 | <pscheie> hmm, can't install it on this machine, only have FF 1.0 on this RH8 box
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| 15:06 | can't seem to get newer versions of FF to run
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| 15:07 | :-(
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| 15:10 | PMantis has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:11 | <PMantis> jammcq, ping
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| 15:12 | <jammcq> pong
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| 15:17 | ogra: ping
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| 15:17 | <ogra> jammcq, pong ?
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| 15:18 | <jammcq> hey, you know that new thin client I gave you?
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| 15:19 | <nofxx> ogra .. hello..... I still with that prob.... I can tune it with xvidtune.. but it shows the same values..... what can I do???
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| 15:19 | so I dunno what values to use on lts.conf.... Hsync
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| 15:21 | <ogra> jammcq, yes
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| 15:21 | <jammcq> ogra: have you had a chance to test that with feisty yet, and is it using the vesa driver or the via driver?
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| 15:21 | * ogra is in a meeting in another channel so please be patient expecting answers :) | |
| 15:21 | <ogra> last time i checked it used vesa
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| 15:21 | but in an incredibly fast way
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| 15:22 | (its the best vesa responiveness i've ever seen i thinbk, even FF scrolls smooth in big pages)
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| 15:23 | jammcq, there is a very slight chance for xorg 7.2 in feisty
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| 15:23 | <jammcq> hmm
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| 15:23 | does it automatically choose the vesa driver on bootup ?
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| 15:24 | <ogra> yes, and last time i tested the unichrome driver it didnt work
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| 15:24 | but thats a while ago
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| 15:24 | <jammcq> hmm
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| 15:24 | <ogra> i can run another test after herd4 released
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| 15:24 | <jammcq> also, which kernel is shipping in feisty?
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| 15:24 | <ogra> 2.6.20 currently
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| 15:25 | and i guess that will be the final one
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| 15:25 | with some more iterations of bugfixes
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| 15:25 | <nofxx> hmm... maybe pulseaudio?
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| 15:27 | <jammcq> ogra: thatnks for the info
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| 15:28 | <mistik1> jammcq: do you remember the post about needing libtermcap to compile lbe?
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| 15:28 | I know I know I will do MueKow after this little project is done ;)
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| 15:28 | <ogra> jammcq, btw, i'm pondering an optional tarball installation method for ltsp-build-client
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| 15:29 | we have the tarballs, and ltsp-build-client already has the bits for the server side ... that wouols make cross arch a lot easier
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| 15:29 | *would
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| 15:43 | <nofxx> can someone help me gettin apt-get to work on chroot ?? it says no packet found....but I copied my source .list
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| 15:44 | and apt-get update .. it just try to connect to the serve... as it dont have connection
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| 15:45 | <mistik1> make sure you have a good /etc/resolv.conf in the chroot
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| 15:46 | <nofxx> mistik1: yea... no nameserver.... should be it.. tnx
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| 15:47 | gonna try to install nvidia-glx ... nv really dont like me
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| 15:48 | yee!! updating.... very cool xD
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| 16:11 | <Maxou> can we make a kiosq account ?
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| 16:33 | <nofxx> yeehooo !!! all 100% working... .nvidia drivers..... only rockn roll ! tnx everybody ! ! ogra ! ! tnx !! ! !!
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| 16:33 | linux terminal super cool ! !
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| 16:35 | <GodFather> mistik1, hi
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| 16:36 | <mistik1> hey man, how goes it
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| 16:36 | <GodFather> mistik1, been good, need your help for a second, but what are you doing now-a-days?
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| 16:52 | <jammcq> mistik1: hey, you still using irssi ?
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| 17:23 | <mistik1> eek!
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| 17:30 | <cliebow> amouse
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| 17:45 | ryness has joined #ltsp | |
| 17:45 | <ryness> howdy!
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| 17:45 | i want to convert a lab of old dell dimension desktops into a thin client lab
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| 17:45 | <jammcq> ok
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| 17:45 | <ryness> i have about $6000 to spend and have some Q's about hardware
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| 17:46 | firstly i'm wondering if i should upgrade all their NICs to gigabit... and am wondering if there's a recommended NIC?
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| 17:46 | <jammcq> no
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| 17:47 | you do NOT need gigabit on the clients
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| 17:47 | <ryness> would it help?
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| 17:47 | <jammcq> not really
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| 17:47 | <ryness> cool
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| 17:47 | <jammcq> don't the dimensions have built in nic ?
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| 17:48 | <ryness> some do, some don't
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| 17:48 | as i understand it, so long as the NIC supports PXE we should be "ok" ?
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| 17:50 | <jammcq> yep
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| 17:50 | worst case, you boot with an etherboot floppy
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| 17:50 | but prety much anything built with built-in nic in the past 6 years or so has pxe
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| 17:53 | <ryness> yea... some of the clients i have to work with don't have built-in nics.
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| 17:53 | ok how about video cards, should i upgrade those?
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| 17:54 | <jammcq> depends on what you have
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| 17:54 | first thing I'd do is try with what you have
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| 17:54 | if you aren't happy with the performance, then figure out what component you'd like to replace
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| 17:54 | <ryness> ah
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| 17:55 | problem is there's a change i can use right now for this but may not be there later.
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| 17:56 | er, there's a *chunk of change* i can use right now
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| 17:57 | <cliebow_> ryness: intelkl chipset right?
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| 17:57 | <ryness> yea all the dell mobos are intel... P3 ~800mhz
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| 17:58 | <jammcq> ryness: put the money into a decent server and switch
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| 17:58 | <cliebow_> with the i810 driver should be fine in 4.2..not sure if autoconfigure will work in ltsp5/ubuntu
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| 17:59 | <jammcq> cliebow_: I'd expect it to work beautifully
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| 17:59 | <cliebow_> i think the last two dell dimension i used "just worked' in ltsp5 with pxe
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| 18:01 | <mistik1> jammcq: btw: yes I still use irssi
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| 18:01 | <cliebow_> ryness: disklessworkstations has prommed niics ready to rock.
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| 18:01 | <jammcq> mistik1: I was trying to figure out how to get the bell to ring on certain events. but, google came to the rescue
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| 18:01 | <ryness> oh?
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| 18:01 | <mistik1> hehe
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| 18:02 | * cliebow_ shameless plug | |
| 18:07 | <ryness> you guys know steve hargadon?
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| 18:07 | <jammcq> yeah
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| 18:07 | I know him well
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| 18:07 | <ryness> just got off the phone w/ him
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| 18:08 | <jammcq> ah, cool
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| 18:08 | <ryness> he said whatever i do, DO NOT ask for advice in #ltsp
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| 18:08 | <jammcq> heh
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| 18:08 | <ryness> har har j/k ;)
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| 18:08 | anyway
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| 18:08 | jodell has joined #ltsp | |
| 18:08 | * jammcq moves hargadon into the naughty list | |
| 18:09 | <cliebow> hargadon will Sufferr for that!
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| 18:09 | we'll shortsheet him next chance we get
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| 18:10 | <ryness> so my next question... does the mobo play any role in all this (assuming i've got an off-board pxe nic)?
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| 18:10 | <jammcq> cliebow: hey, you get a new keyboard or something?
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| 18:10 | <ryness> eg: will the mobo get in the way of the pxe or anything like that?
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| 18:10 | <cliebow> no...shovelling seems to help
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| 18:10 | <jammcq> ryness: well, the mobo is certainly an important component
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| 18:11 | <ryness> yes important.... but i wonder if there's anythign i need to watch out for in designing this proposal.
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| 18:11 | <cliebow> ryness: you "might hasve to disable on-board nic and use a promed card..or floppy
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| 18:11 | <ryness> eg: am i being unrealistic when i imagine turning a bunch of random old computers of varying hardware into thin clients.
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| 18:11 | <jammcq> before you propose anything, i suggest trying one of the clients, make sure it works
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| 18:12 | <jodell> ryness: mobo on client or server?
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| 18:12 | <cliebow> ryness: that is what i do..turn wreckage into thin clients
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| 18:12 | <ryness> jodell: client
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| 18:12 | jammcq: problem is the clients aren't all the same
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| 18:12 | <jodell> ryness: problem that I have had is making sure the initramfs or kernel includes needed drivers.
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| 18:13 | <jodell> ryness: if you have multiple unique clients you "could" get a little bloat
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| 18:13 | <ryness> "bloat" ?
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| 18:14 | <cliebow> ryness: what type dell dinension..model? 466 something?..those to tend to bemy high end clients..i cant try
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| 18:14 | <jodell> bigger kernel image or ramfs image.
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| 18:14 | <cliebow> i Can try one for yotomorrow maybeu
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| 18:14 | <jodell> not a problem typically
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| 18:15 | <ryness> cliebow: most of them are dimension 4100s or thereabouts
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| 18:15 | p3/800mhz on average
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| 18:15 | <jodell> Since we are on that topic: is anyone else finding that the need to add moduled to the initramfs
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| 18:16 | <cliebow> Dell recommends Windows Vista™ Home Premium.
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| 18:16 | <jodell> cliebow: are you looking for a fight?
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| 18:16 | its been one of those days...
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| 18:17 | ;-)
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| 18:17 | <cliebow> Integrated Intel 10/100 Ethernet Controller Driver (Intel 82562ET chip set) for built in nic
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| 18:18 | <jodell> the 3 dells I have all support PXE. the oldest is a precision 420.
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| 18:19 | <ryness> i'm having a hard time telling if a nic supports pxe or not
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| 18:19 | i disabled all the boot options in the mobo bios, but never get a nic/pxe bios.
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| 18:19 | <cliebow> you/ll just have to look in the bios
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| 18:19 | <jammcq> ryness: did you enable 'Boot from network' ?
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| 18:19 | <cliebow> network boot?
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| 18:20 | heh..
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| 18:20 | <jammcq> and do you have a network cable plugged in?
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| 18:20 | <jodell> or "enable onborad boot prom" on teh older dells (should have a PXE loader on it already)
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| 18:22 | <ryness> ah, found it
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| 18:22 | MBA UNDI
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| 18:22 | whatever that is ;)
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| 18:22 | <jammcq> NBA? it sounds like it has a 3com nic
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| 18:23 | I think UNDI should work
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| 18:24 | <cliebow> http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/opgx110/en/ug/setupopt.htm
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| 18:24 | <ryness> yea when i enabled MBA UNDI the pxe boot bios appeared
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| 18:25 | <cliebow> you're not out of the woods yet...my two dells booted ok..pxe on some asdd in cards never did
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| 18:26 | Managed PC Boot Agent (MBA)
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| 18:26 | <jammcq> it's possible to use MBA
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| 18:26 | it requires running a utility called imggen against the kernel
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| 18:27 | <cliebow> Universal Network Device Interface (UNDI).
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| 18:28 | <ryness> cool
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| 18:29 | thanks
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| 18:29 | changing gears... what OS do you guys run on your thin clients... *any*?
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| 18:30 | <jodell> debian
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| 18:31 | <ryness> any windows?
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| 18:32 | <jodell> I am toying with vm/xen or wine
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| 18:32 | <jammcq> LTSP is running on the thin clients
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| 18:32 | the interesting question is what OS is running on the server
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| 18:32 | <ryness> yea thats what i meant
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| 18:33 | <jammcq> I've got Redhat, Debian and Ubuntu out in the field
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| 18:33 | <jodell> jammcq: ltsp 5 (debian etch) effectivly put the os on teh client
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| 18:33 | <jammcq> sure, now with LTSP-5
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| 18:33 | <ryness> am i correct in my understanding that you could just as well point the clients to boot off a windows terminal server?
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| 18:34 | <jammcq> ryness:
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| 18:34 | ryness: no
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| 18:34 | windows doesn't serve up a copy of windows to load into the clients
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| 18:35 | <ryness> hmm
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| 18:36 | guess i have more reading to do :)
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| 18:36 | <jodell> jammcq: so ktsp 5 is not widly used?
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| 18:36 | <jammcq> it's getting there
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| 18:36 | the upcoming of Ubuntu feisty is looking really good
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| 18:37 | <jodell> ryness: a thread was started on the ltsp list about usind a vm to run windows and rdesktoping into it
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| 18:37 | <ryness> yes rdesktop'ing
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| 18:37 | <jodell> jammcq: i am debian etch which i believe is using the fiesty packages
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| 18:38 | <jammcq> it's pretty close
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| 18:38 | vagrantc and ogra are working very closely on it
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| 18:38 | <jodell> my experiance with ltsp5 is that it is almost idiot proof (heck I did it)
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| 18:38 | <cliebow> me too..
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| 18:38 | with a little help
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| 18:39 | <jodell> thinkg I like is that I am esentially using a terminal with a disk in it for a server.
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| 18:39 | only problem I am having is that I find syslog requires a restart ro actually log remote
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| 18:41 | <jammcq> that's weird
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| 18:41 | <jodell> I even went so far as to put the correct config in <ltst_root>/etc/syslog.conf
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| 18:42 | <jammcq> and simply restarting it fixes it?
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| 18:42 | <jodell> yep.
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| 18:43 | in the /etc/init.d/ltsp-client script I added a call to
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| 18:43 | restart /etc/init.d/sysklogd restart
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| 18:43 | just before the end of the syslog config section
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| 18:44 | <jammcq> have you filed a bug report?
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| 18:44 | <jodell> now I get everythign after the restart bot nothing before
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| 18:44 | not yet. I was tripple checking to amke sure I haven;t built anything wrong.
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| 18:44 | on my 5th install and I think I am pretty sure it isn't me
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| 18:45 | man my typeing is awful. (hence the 5 installs before I reported a bug)
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| 18:50 | since we touched the "W" word I need a little advice
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| 18:50 | my clients are by no means thin
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| 18:50 | AMD AthelonM 3200+ with 512MB ram and 32MB video cards
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| 18:51 | <cliebow_> holy!
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| 18:51 | <jodell> I need to be able to able to run dos mode educational games and some win 95 games
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| 18:51 | <cliebow_> ETHERBOOT OR PXE?
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| 18:52 | <jodell> cliebow: you know I am a fat guy from our last conversation (they were cheaper to build than to buy thin)
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| 18:52 | PXE with the on board nic
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| 18:52 | each client less than $400 with 17" lcd
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| 18:52 | drop 2 sata disk (raid 0 using md) and one becomes your server.
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| 18:53 | I jsut didn't see the advantage to a rute thin setup.
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| 18:53 | Anywhoo
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| 18:53 | <jammcq> raid 0 ?
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| 18:53 | <jodell> I am thinking wine for das/win emulation
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| 18:54 | jammcq for the server os and ltsp boot slices. I don't lie hd failures
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| 18:54 | and since disks are "cheap" why not.
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| 18:54 | <jammcq> raid 0 is striping, NOT mirrorin g
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| 18:54 | raid 1 is what you want, isn't it?
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| 18:55 | <jodell> too much shoveling (in upstate NY)
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| 18:55 | <jammcq> heh
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| 18:55 | <jodell> raid 1 is what I configed
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| 18:55 | <jammcq> good
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| 18:55 | <jodell> the town "down the road" has 11ft of snow in the last week or so. we got 18" last night
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| 18:56 | <jammcq> wow
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| 18:56 | what city is that?
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| 18:56 | <jodell> Oswego NY.
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| 18:56 | <jammcq> where abouts is that?
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| 18:56 | <jodell> about 60 miles (120 KM)
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| 18:56 | <jammcq> from?
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| 18:56 | <cliebow_> lake effect 8~)
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| 18:56 | <jodell> East end of Lake Ontario
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| 18:56 | <jammcq> ah
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| 18:56 | <jodell> big time lake effect.
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| 18:56 | <jammcq> sure
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| 18:57 | 11ft !!!!!
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| 18:57 | <jodell> You have to see it to believe it, but it is ture
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| 18:57 | happens to htme every couple of years.
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| 18:58 | so back to the dos/win95 emu thing...
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| 18:58 | I am thinking that vm on the client is out as it will need a rw file for each "client" virutal instance
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| 18:59 | Vm on the server is out as each client needs its one instance to run apps
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| 19:00 | that wouls seem to leave wine.
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| 19:00 | (i wonder if I would be able to type if I started drinking? I clearly can't type sober.)
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| 19:01 | BadMagic has quit IRC | |
| 19:01 | <jodell> any other options I am missing?
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| 19:01 | BadMagic has joined #ltsp | |
| 19:01 | <jammcq> jodell: you could have a win2003 server and use rdesktop to attach to it
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| 19:01 | <jodell> I like the windows TS in a vm idea but I abhor the idea of giving microsnot any money
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| 19:02 | jammcq wouldn't that required 1 server for each unique desktop? Not big on M$ operations. more of a sun/linux guy by choice
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| 19:02 | <jammcq> no
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| 19:02 | w2k3 can support multiple users with TS
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| 19:03 | but, I'm also not a fan of sending money to MS
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| 19:03 | <jodell> and I "could" toss that into a vm on the server.....
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| 19:04 | what arguements are there againts wine on my "obese" thin clients?
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| 19:05 | <jammcq> wine wouldn't be running on the client, it would be running on the server
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| 19:05 | <jodell> (the list against 2003 is pretty long but we all know that list by heart)
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| 19:06 | In my fat world it all run on the client. unless I am missing something
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| 19:06 | <jammcq> well, you'd have alot of work to do, to get it executing on the thin client
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| 19:07 | <jodell> how so? remember ltsp5 on deb Etch, big processor and loads of ram.
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| 19:07 | <jammcq> ah, maybe not so bad then
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| 19:07 | <jodell> i would think just
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| 19:07 | apt-get install wine
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| 19:07 | <jammcq> you'd still need the users homedir mounted rw
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| 19:08 | <jodell> homes are nfs using auto fs but the auto user is "copy_dir" to allow auto logins
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| 19:08 | that is cryptic. do I need to retype that?
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| 19:08 | <jammcq> no, that's fine
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| 19:09 | <cliebow> sounds lke you need to just double boot the clients...ltsp..or .the other
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| 19:10 | <jodell> "other" ??? and in teh "evil" os?
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| 19:10 | <cliebow> jammcq: can you escape pxe to boot locally somehow?
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| 19:10 | <jammcq> umm
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| 19:11 | <cliebow> jodell: with etherboot you can choose local..or network...hitting the l forces boot to local hd
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| 19:11 | <jodell> what about a "chooser" in the initramfs?
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| 19:11 | <cliebow> too late then..id think
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| 19:11 | <jodell> I like what you are thinking, but was really hoping to avoid a local disk.
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| 19:12 | <cliebow> ?
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| 19:12 | ?/
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| 19:12 | your clients are 500 meg..but no hard drive hih
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| 19:12 | ?
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| 19:13 | <jodell> 512MB RAM. no hd. the idea was to make them "kid proof"
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| 19:13 | I tossed one across the room and it booted right up. try that with a disk
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| 19:13 | <cliebow> i see..
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| 19:13 | <jodell> this is a day care type environment
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| 19:14 | lots of indoor football using anythign that isnt' screwed down
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| 19:15 | <cliebow> i have seen like kiosks where you d/l me..windows os every ti
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| 19:15 | Balls
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| 19:15 | i have seen like kiosks where you d/l .windows os every time
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| 19:16 | <ryness> i have to run winxp
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| 19:16 | <jodell> ryness: on the thins?
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| 19:17 | <ryness> yea
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| 19:17 | <cliebow> so you are also in a double b oot type situation?
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| 19:17 | <ryness> my hopes are dashed
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| 19:17 | <jodell> ryness: I think you are looking at the 2003 TS solution. Build a 2 cpu box (dual core if at all possible)
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| 19:18 | <ryness> no single boot, pxe.
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| 19:18 | <jodell> run 2003 in vmware and use rdesktop.
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| 19:18 | <ryness> yahp
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| 19:18 | <cliebow> and buy the licenses
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| 19:18 | <ryness> bleh
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| 19:18 | <jodell> sorry amn, but that is all you have.
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| 19:18 | <ryness> the server is no prob... dual woodcrest with 8GB ram
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| 19:18 | <jodell> if you need help with the Vm stuff let me know.
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| 19:19 | I use vm for sim city 4 ( I hang my head in shame)
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| 19:19 | <ryness> i can just run a separate box or a vm for the ltsp stuff
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| 19:19 | <jodell> do it the other way around. run 2003 in a VM on the ltsp server.
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| 19:20 | limint the VM to 1 or 2 cores
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| 19:20 | <ryness> problem is with windows it isn't cut & dry like ubuntu (my sysadmin turned a bunch of imacs into edubuntu thin clients)...
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| 19:20 | since we need it to be XP, just rdesktoping to a 2k3 server won't do the trick.
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| 19:20 | <jodell> these are the p3@800?
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| 19:21 | <ryness> yes p3@800... some @500
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| 19:21 | 128MB ram
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| 19:21 | <jodell> any budget?
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| 19:21 | ouch!
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| 19:21 | <ryness> yea i got about $6k
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| 19:22 | problem is just figuring out what pieces of the puzzle we need.... citrix, etc it's not as straight forward as ltsp w/ linux.
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| 19:22 | <jodell> look into vm-desktop or parallels. both will suport multiple xp instances with network sound
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| 19:22 | VM can run on the server.
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| 19:22 | both support linux
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| 19:23 | the apple guy will know about parallels.
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| 19:24 | <jodell> oh and you can have a single "base image" that is used for the VM boot and overlayed with instance specific "stuff" with the advanced products.
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| 19:24 | my "real" job does this to support a couple hundred servers
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| 19:25 | what do you ahve in M$ land that will run in XP but NOT in 2003?
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| 19:26 | <ryness> yea i use parallels and vm a lot
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| 19:26 | it's not that we have software that needs xp and won't work in 2k3... it's that we have curriculum called "learning windows XP"
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| 19:26 | <jodell> we are esx these days
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| 19:26 | <ryness> :)
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| 19:26 | <jodell> well that kind of blows....
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| 19:27 | <ryness> so students go to start and expect it to look like the book
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| 19:27 | <jodell> silly students.
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| 19:27 | what will happen in 3 months when the ciriculum is learning vista?
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| 19:28 | <ryness> i know
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| 19:28 | <jodell> save your $6K and beg for another $500K.
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| 19:28 | you will need it to migrate to vista
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| 19:28 | <ryness> i told 'em they're better off learning about the various different OS than just one... but it's grant money.
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| 19:29 | <jodell> your the 3rd person to tell me about grant money issues like this this week.
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| 19:29 | I am begining to think grants aren't worth it.
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| 19:31 | <jodell> so it seems to me that we are starting to see a trend inteh need for a mcuh better way to use M$ in a VM in LTSP installs.
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| 19:31 | <ryness> well it's $6k for windows xp thin clients or $6k worth of new Dells
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| 19:31 | <jodell> how many do you need?
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| 19:32 | <ryness> the lab has 24 in it right now, but i'd like to use the server for the entire adult ed center, bout 45 computers in total.
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| 19:32 | <jodell> all "independent" form teh user prespective?
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| 19:33 | make that "from the"
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| 19:33 | <ryness> how do you mean?
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| 19:33 | <jodell> no "shared" os, everyone thinks they have their own computer.
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| 19:33 | <ryness> yea... they won't even notice they're using thin clients
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| 19:34 | so long as i can do it with XP
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| 19:34 | <jodell> I hate this, but you are the perfect canidate for the vm os (we call it esx in house)
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| 19:35 | the idea woudl be this:
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| 19:35 | install esx on the server, create a VM for ltsp
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| 19:35 | then create multiple VM for XP
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| 19:36 | <dan__t> and quadruple-up on RAM and CPU
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| 19:36 | ;)
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| 19:36 | <ryness> a separate vm for each thin client?
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| 19:36 | that's whack yo ;)
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| 19:36 | <dan__t> Indeed, sir.
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| 19:36 | <jodell> thin boot the client with LTSP running the vm console to see the vm
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| 19:36 | not sure that actually save anything
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| 19:37 | <ryness> i would need 16GB of ram
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| 19:37 | <dan__t> What's the issue at hand? Sorry, I just sat down
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| 19:38 | <jodell> 128M * n + 258M (tlsp) + 512 (esx)
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| 19:38 | <cliebow_> seems like you should be looking at local installs and "deep freeze" or something..
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| 19:38 | <ryness> dan: i have $6k and need to turn 40 random old Dells into thin clients running winXP.
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| 19:38 | <dan__t> oh, running XP eh
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| 19:38 | <ryness> yeh
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| 19:38 | <dan__t> that's a tall order.
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| 19:38 | <jodell> got to agree with cliebow on this one.
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| 19:38 | <dan__t> but in that case, I see where jodell is coming from.
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| 19:39 | Well, let's look at it this way? What requires XP?
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| 19:39 | Just throwing out options, not starting a political debate.
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| 19:39 | <jodell> Nope, you should look at the vm solution.
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| 19:39 | <ryness> the curriculum they're teaching requires XP.
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| 19:39 | <dan__t> Ahh.
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| 19:39 | <jodell> tell him the name ;-)
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| 19:39 | <dan__t> It can't be wine'd or anything?
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| 19:39 | heh
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| 19:39 | "Windows XP"
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| 19:40 | <ryness> yea pretty much... actually part one of the course is learning XP, part two is learning office 2k3.
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| 19:40 | <jodell> for $6K you could build 2 servers.
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| 19:41 | <dan__t> er, does vmware not make their player able to boot off of media in the traditional sense?
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| 19:41 | <jodell> VM "might" give you the esx package at a deep discount
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| 19:41 | <ryness> the rdesktop option *may* work, if i can get w2k3 to look close enough to xp.
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| 19:41 | i'm not interested in managing 40 or so VMs :)
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| 19:41 | <dan__t> No, they'd be images.
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| 19:42 | <jodell> you don't you manage 1 vm image and 40 instaces.
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| 19:42 | <dan__t> I don't know, I may just be talking shit, I haven't played with the other VMware products enough to be any help in this conversation ;)
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| 19:42 | Just trying to help you consider options.
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| 19:42 | <ryness> dan: i appreciate it! :)
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| 19:43 | jodell: with vmware each image is a separate vm, with it's own unique name and what-not.
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| 19:43 | <jodell> ryness: you use the vm-server package right?
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| 19:43 | <dan__t> I do.
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| 19:43 | If that matters any heh
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| 19:44 | <ryness> eg: 40 VMs getting windows updates, 40 vms to push software out to, 40 vms with separate user profiles on them, etc.
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| 19:44 | yea we use vmware server on both dapper and w2k3 servers.
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| 19:44 | <jodell> vm server is limited in function.
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| 19:44 | it does NOT support the esx overlay
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| 19:44 | <ryness> ahhh
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| 19:44 | <jodell> I have 1 image for 200 vm
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| 19:44 | I only update the 1 image.
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| 19:45 | <ryness> ok now i'm interested
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| 19:45 | <jodell> I cycle the VM and everyone gets the updates
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| 19:45 | <ryness> esx = spendy?
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| 19:45 | <jodell> it is like a ltsp on a single box with the ability to move vm over to other machines in realtime
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| 19:46 | normally.
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| 19:46 | <dan__t> but you're an edu or something, right?
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| 19:46 | <jodell> It is worth asking.
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| 19:46 | <ryness> yes edu
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| 19:46 | <dan__t> Don't they have gov't or edu discounts etc etc.
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| 19:46 | They seem reasonable in that manner.
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| 19:46 | <jodell> Heck I get a discount
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| 19:46 | <ryness> vmware esx == VI3 ?
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| 19:47 | <jodell> hang on...
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| 19:48 | <ryness> looks like $1000 for the "starter" edition
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| 19:48 | only up to 8GB of ram
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| 19:48 | the standard edition is $3750
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| 19:49 | cliebow has quit IRC | |
| 19:49 | <dan__t> what about the "edu" edition heheh
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| 19:49 | <ryness> have to contact them about that i guess
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| 19:49 | <jodell> You could consider 2 startes on 2 mid scale servers
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| 19:49 | PITA, but it woudl help.
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| 19:49 | <ryness> garrr my $6k suddenly doesn't seem like that much money for this project :)
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| 19:50 | i could just give them kde with a very windowsy theme ;)
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| 19:50 | <jodell> ryness: let me think about it for a little bit. there has to be a way to do this.
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| 19:50 | <ryness> jodell i appreciate that! :)
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| 19:51 | <dan__t> Good luck dood.
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| 19:51 | <ryness> hehe thanks
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| 19:51 | <jodell> So ltsp folks, is ryness the exception for us?
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| 19:51 | <cliebow_> in whAT way?
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| 19:52 | <jodell> I don't have his level of need, but i do need some win compatability
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| 19:52 | needing to run M$ crap
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| 19:52 | <ryness> if i can get this recipe worked out, i'll have number of other clients interested
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| 19:52 | <dan__t> Might be interesting.
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| 19:52 | <cliebow_> we are a ture mixed environment..ibooks up the wazoo..win desktops..thin clients
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| 19:52 | <ryness> so if anyone is interested in flying out to bush alaska to turn ancient crap into modern goodness, let me know ;)
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| 19:53 | <jodell> sold. where is my bunk
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| 19:53 | <dan__t> haha.
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| 19:53 | only if you take me fishing.
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| 19:53 | i love to fish.
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| 19:53 | <ryness> lots of fish
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| 19:53 | <jodell> Hell I am already neck deep in snow ;-)
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| 19:53 | <dan__t> mmm, salmon
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| 19:53 | I just went fishing in the snow this past wknd
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| 19:53 | I love that.
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| 19:54 | <cliebow_> seen more than my share of winter fishing..
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| 19:54 | <dan__t> all we have down here is trout and carfish :/
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| 19:54 | <cliebow_> keeping a boat in the winter sucks
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| 19:54 | <jodell> ryness are all the sytems 8100's?
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| 19:55 | <ryness> jodell... most of them are 4100s
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| 19:55 | <jodell> sorry that was past the end of the scroll buffer....
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| 19:56 | <dan__t> brb, smoke break...
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| 19:58 | <jodell> inspiron?
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| 19:58 | <ryness> dimension
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| 20:01 | <jodell> pc133 sdram... 2 slots. x 40 sytems
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| 20:01 | so if you didn't notice I am a "fat client" guy.
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| 20:02 | I am going to see if I cant get VM-server running on one of my fats.
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| 20:02 | <ryness> yea i read you said your clients were phat
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| 20:02 | <jodell> and I wanted them fatter.
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| 20:02 | I jsut don't like disks.
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| 20:03 | <ryness> well i gotta go buy the wifey some flowers... thanks for all the attention everyone!.... i'll be lurking in his chan much more often now :)
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| 20:03 | <jodell> the problem that I see is that Vm will want the files to be rw, not ro.
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| 20:03 | <ryness> er, *this chan
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| 20:04 | *** Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )
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| 20:04 | irc has come a long way ;)
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| 20:04 | /msg jodell my email is ryness@gmail.com if you have any epiphanies :)
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| 20:05 | <jodell> will do.
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| 20:05 | <cbpage> my desktop at work's a 4100. would like 1ghz ram, firefox hesitates at times... other than that damn good especially for a 6yr old box
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| 20:05 | *1GB
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| 20:06 | having a radeon 9550 and a dell 2007wfp helps.
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| 20:07 | <jodell> ram fixes everything
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| 20:09 | <cbpage> yeah - it's fine with 512 and debian
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| 20:09 | <dan__t> I'm running Gnome on 256M
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| 20:09 | quite nicely
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| 20:10 | <cbpage> i'm also spoiled
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| 20:10 | <dan__t> 'cept i have machines in no particular order or style just completely lock up.
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| 20:10 | lock up hard.
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| 20:10 | I don't understand it.
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| 20:10 | <cbpage> ouch
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| 20:10 | what kinda machines?
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| 20:10 | <dan__t> They were running XP and Linux with full installs prior to moving to LTSP, without incident
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| 20:10 | Shitcan P3 550's w/256M RAM
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| 20:10 | <cbpage> weird - network issues?
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| 20:10 | <dan__t> I suspect.
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| 20:10 | Going to swap out with some eepro100's tomorrow AM
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| 20:11 | <jodell> ltsp5?
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| 20:12 | <dan__t> er, 4
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| 20:13 | I don't know why I started with 4, honestly. I think that was all that was available when i started?
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| 20:13 | idunno
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| 20:13 | <jodell> i've seen oddities on ltsp5 using debian etch. not that drastic, but somethign wierd in nfs land. the occasional "nfs server not responding"
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| 20:14 | recovers in a few seconds.
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| 20:14 | <dan__t> Yeah, I got that a LOT with a few machines.
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| 20:15 | I think I ended up throwing option option-129 "MOPTS=nolock,ro,wsize=2048,rsize=2048"; at it
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| 20:15 | and most all of that went away, except for the occasional client not obeying
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| 20:16 | But I can pretty well correlate that to the ecxact same time someone is playing a Flash game, or doing really image intensive stuff etc etc.
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| 20:16 | i.e. saturation of bandwidth in the switch
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| 20:16 | <cbpage> *nod*
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| 20:16 | <jodell> 100MB?
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| 20:16 | <dan__t> *reluctant sigh* yes
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| 20:16 | <cbpage> and not a hub i hope.
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| 20:17 | <jodell> so they are on teh same server?
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| 20:17 | <dan__t> with 2x bonded 100mbit cards in the server.
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| 20:17 | <jodell> I am SOOOOO spoiled
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| 20:17 | <dan__t> The bonding in itself sometimes has issues, too.
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| 20:17 | haha I bet.
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| 20:17 | I'd be happy with a 100mbit switch with 2x gbit uplinks
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| 20:17 | But, alas....
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| 20:18 | <jodell> the netgear 1GB 24 port is $230 on newegg.
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| 20:18 | <dan__t> I need 48, at least. But even with 2x, that's not all that bad
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| 20:18 | I was looking at 48ports for around $700
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| 20:18 | <jodell> netgear 1GB card $30
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| 20:18 | <dan__t> Overall its a complete success.
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| 20:18 | I just don't like those machines locking up like that.
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| 20:19 | Neither does the boss... heh
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| 20:19 | <cbpage> yeah
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| 20:19 | <jodell> I always tell them "shoot the guy playing flash"
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| 20:19 | it is typically the boss
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| 20:19 | <dan__t> Yeah, tht's what i do haha
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| 20:19 | <cbpage> perhaps instead of channel bonding you could have two seperate networks
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| 20:19 | this assumes you have two 24-port switches or somesuch though
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| 20:19 | <jodell> that is a great idea.
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| 20:19 | <dan__t> Hm, that's not bad.
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| 20:20 | <jodell> 2x24 port + 2xnic and you are only at $520
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| 20:20 | leave the 100 for the connection to the net.
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| 20:20 | <cbpage> i was thinking 100-based stuff... dual gigabit is overkill *unless* you have 64-bit pci or pci-e
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| 20:21 | the computer can barely stuff one
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| 20:21 | <dan__t> i have 2x PCIE on this mobo
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| 20:21 | Decent little mobo
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| 20:22 | Core 2 Duo chip, E6600 I think.
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| 20:22 | 2x 80G SATA RAID1
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| 20:22 | It works quite well.
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| 20:22 | <cbpage> nice
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| 20:22 | <dan__t> I am supporting 20 clients, with a bit of room to spare
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| 20:22 | <cbpage> ok, two giga it is
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| 20:24 | 1x PCI-E is just enough to handle a 2-port gigabit card. dunno if anyone's made a chip like that though
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| 20:24 | <dan__t> Alright, well
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| 20:24 | I need to take off here
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| 20:24 | <cbpage> cya dan
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| 20:24 | good luck
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| 20:25 | <dan__t> Thanks for the help.
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| 20:25 | <cbpage> i'd go with two gigabit ports and 2 24-port 10/100 + 2 gigabit switches
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| 20:25 | yw :)
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| 20:26 | (can get the latter for ~$140 at 'egg)
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| 20:40 | <jammcq> PMantis: hey
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| 20:44 | <PMantis> sup jammcq
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| 20:46 | <mistik1> bah
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| 20:46 | I'm too rusty to add all of what I need to lbe
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| 20:46 | <mistik1> I'll just try to add what I need from ltsp to MueKow
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| 20:46 | This should be even more interesting
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| 20:50 | Time to start on writing ebuilds for the ltsp specific programs
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| 20:50 | <jammcq> talk to dberkholtz, he's done some of the work
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| 20:50 | <mistik1> I talked to him
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| 20:51 | I cant remember where his site is now but I took a look at what he had there
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| 20:51 | I dont know that I would use that method at all, I see no reason for that build system when we are talking about gentoo
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| 20:52 | I could just use portage
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| 20:52 | <jammcq> what was he using?
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| 20:52 | <mistik1> emerge, or for further customizations catalyst or even GNAP
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| 20:53 | He's using the common ltsp build system that I believe debian is using
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| 20:53 | <jammcq> ah, the pluggable thing?
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| 20:53 | <mistik1> yea
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| 20:53 | <jammcq> you'll want that
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| 20:53 | <mistik1> All i bloody need in gentoo and some ebuilds for the ltsp specific apps
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| 20:54 | why would I need it?
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| 20:54 | Curious
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| 20:54 | <jammcq> oook, but I think you'll want it
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| 20:54 | talk to vagrantc about it, it's some pretty good stuff
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| 20:54 | and we're enouraging ALL integraters of ltsp to use it
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| 20:55 | <mistik1> nm mind me, i'll a little grumpy right now
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| 20:55 | <jammcq> me too :)
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| 20:55 | <mistik1> where does this thing live again
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| 20:55 | <jammcq> dunno
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| 20:55 | <mistik1> oh yea, launchpad
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| 21:09 | * PMantis not sure he wants to talk to a grumpy jammcq | |
| 21:10 | <jodell> for anyone who was paying attention to the vm on teh thin client idea for winXP....
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| 21:11 | don't do it with out a disk ont eh client.
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| 21:11 | I got the expected results. bad perf and congessted network.
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