IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 29 April 2015 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:10 | <modalsurrealist_> Hello folks,
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| 01:11 | A friend suggested this channel for asking a question i am having a really hard time with
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| 01:12 | ..about ASCII Control Codes, how to use them, and particularly how to read the preset key map for a telnet client i am using.
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| 01:13 | The Chrome OS version of the client is found here, http://www.mochasoft.dk/chrome_tn5250.htm
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| 01:14 | If you go into the settings, then 'Key Data', you will see there are a bunch of Esc codes preset on the f keys. How do i find out what these mean?
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| 01:21 | I have been able to map these keys to strings of text mixed with /015 (Carriage Return) and /014 (Space) to create some very useful macros, but i want to know what else i can do with them. Specifically, i'm hoping there is a way i can embed the content of my clipboard into the sequences.
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| 05:24 | <work_alisg> modalsurrealist: that's not really ltsp related...
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| 10:48 | <Uzzi> nfs over tcp not available ltsp why this?
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| 10:57 | <alkisg> Uzzi, why do you say that?
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| 10:58 | I believe it's fine... which distro/version?
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| 10:59 | <Uzzi> debian ewwzy
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| 11:00 | <alkisg> nfsmount should support tcp nfs fine
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| 11:00 | It's part of klibc
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| 11:01 | Maybe you haven't set up nfs correctly
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| 11:02 | <Uzzi> /srv/tftp 172.16.1.0/24(sync,ro,no_root_squash,nohide) /opt/ltsp 172.16.1.0/24(sync,ro,no_root_squash,nohide)
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| 11:02 | <alkisg> Can you mount /opt/ltsp/i386 from another pc?
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| 11:03 | You don't need to serve /srv/tftp with nfs, by the way...
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| 11:04 | <Uzzi> mount: special device 172.16.6.75/opt/ltsp does not exist
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| 11:04 | mmmm
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| 11:06 | now I've mount 172.16.6.75:/opt/ltsp on a pc
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| 11:49 | <alkisg> Uzzi: and your ltsp clients still can't boot?
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| 12:26 | <Uzzi> o yes
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| 14:30 | <here_and_there> can comeone give me a clue why my usb pen is not recognized, please
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| 14:30 | when I open a localapps term and make a dmesg, I can see that it is detected
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| 14:30 | but the automatic mount is not done
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| 14:30 | in my lts.conf I have LOCALDEV=True
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| 15:34 | <danau11> my 2 cents....https://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto worked out better for PNP than any ubuntu reference i have touched.
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| 15:41 | work_alkisg is now known as alkisg | |
| 15:41 | <alkisg> danau11: that's mostly copied from my ltsp-pnppage :)
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| 15:41 | !ltsp-pnp
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| 15:41 | <ltsp`> ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 15:42 | <alkisg> here_and_there: distro/version?
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| 15:42 | Uzzi: do you get a busybox (initramfs) shell? does nfsmount work from there?
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| 15:43 | <danau11> thanks alkisg my troubles with the ubuntu reference all stem from network manager using dnsmasq and the SYSLINUX/PXELINUX troubles with the file locations not matching the kernal-update scripts
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| 15:43 | <alkisg> danau11: I've updated the ppa 2 years ago, so it should now be able to handle newer pxelinu
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| 15:44 | About network-manager, I complained a lot at the ubuntu devs but ... :-/
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| 15:44 | The workaround in the page should work fine though
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| 15:44 | I.e. to tell network-manager not to spawn its own resolver
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| 15:44 | <danau11> ya i got around that one
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| 15:45 | <alkisg> I'm not aware of any issues not covered in that page
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| 15:45 | If you find one, ping me
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| 15:45 | <danau11> but the newer ubuntu builds seem to shuffle the file locations for pxeconfig.0 etc
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| 15:45 | let me crank up my test machine and i will check file locations
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| 15:45 | <alkisg> You mean non-lts versions?
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| 15:45 | <danau11> let me check for accuracy
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| 15:46 | <alkisg> Sorry I don't upload ltsp for non-lts ubuntu versions in the greek schools ppa...
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| 15:46 | With 9 months of support, I think they're only good for devs, not users
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| 15:47 | Btw, if debian works fine for you, keep it, there's no need to switch to ubuntu for ltsp, it's not that it's better supported there...
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| 15:47 | <danau11> let me get them side by side and share what i can not based on my memory
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| 15:48 | <Uzzi> alkisg: netbooting dskless
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| 15:49 | <alkisg> Uzzi: I don't understand what you're saying... maybe you could write bigger sentences
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| 15:49 | <Uzzi> :D
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| 15:53 | <danau11> askisg, its Ubuntu 14.10 so you are correct its not LTS
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| 15:53 | so we can call this my problem for not paying attention
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| 15:53 | <alkisg> OK, I'm writing to the top of that page that only 12.04 and 14.04 are supported :)
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| 15:53 | If you really want to, you can use the ltsp daily ppa temporarily
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| 15:53 | I think I've posted ltsp builds there for 14.10 too...
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| 15:54 | But... better don't :)
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| 15:54 | <danau11> no noted it and highlighted it and i missed it so my fault
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| 15:54 | <alkisg> Use 14.04
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| 15:54 | <danau11> thanks for the guide
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| 15:54 | <alkisg> np
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| 15:54 | <vagrantc> danau11: the pxelinux file locations changing has been reported in launchpad for quite some time with no action
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| 15:54 | danau11: ltsp apparently needs a maintainer in ubuntu
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| 15:55 | <danau11> thanks vagrantc
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| 15:55 | <alkisg> stgraber: ^^^ please drop the ubuntu diff and let it sync with debian... :)
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| 15:55 | It doesn't even boot anymore
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| 15:57 | <vagrantc> i think the main difference at this point was the debian-installer .udeb
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| 15:57 | i could probably write up some conditional logic based on install environment
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| 15:57 | * vagrantc has also been meaning to add support for the ltsp-pnp image generation to the .udeb | |
| 15:58 | <vagrantc> should be trivial...
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| 15:58 | * alkisg wonders if we have to rename ltsp to something else in order to drop all obsolete code there... :) | |
| 16:03 | <stgraber> IIRC we still had a bit of Edubuntu delta so can't just sync but we can certainly drop most of the delta on the floor
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| 16:04 | unfortunately we don't have an open development release now so not much I can do about it until we do
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| 16:06 | <alkisg> stgraber: me and I think vagrantc are willing to make it work in ubuntu 15.10 if you're willing to accept that it will be the same as in debian
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| 16:06 | I.e. no ltsp-cluster bits, no nbd-proxy, defaults to 192.168.67.x and whatever else debian has
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| 16:07 | I can test with vagrantc's ltsp-debian-packaging plus ltsp-trunk/ldm-trunk etc, with a launchpad recipe for 15.10
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| 16:09 | But I'm not willing to do it if ubuntu has its own tree for packaging
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| 16:09 | (with the X-Ubuntu-XXX directives in debian/control, we shouldn't need a different tree..)
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| 16:12 | <Uzzi> ERROR: ltsp chroot not found: /opt/ltsp/i686 but ls /opt/ltsp/--->i386
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| 16:41 | <stgraber> alkisg: I don't care about most of those things, but I do care about not breaking Edubuntu and IIRC we have a chunk of code in the ltsp postinst for that which we'd need to relocate
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| 16:42 | <alkisg> stgraber: which part are you talking about?
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| 16:42 | AFAIK edubuntu is broken currently...
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| 16:42 | (well, if one installs 14.10 + edubuntu desktop)
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| 16:43 | stgraber: in any case, that's good news, I think they mean that we can start working on this
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| 16:44 | vagrantc: this script disables flow control (i.e. 10 times faster networking when applicable) and does NAT for 192.168.67.1, do you think it can go to ltsp/debian/ltsp-server.if-up?
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| 16:44 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/trunk/view/head:/debian/sch-scripts.if-up
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| 16:45 | I finally got it to work with mii-tool too today, instead of just ethtool
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| 16:45 | So realteks and non-manageable switches are no longer a problem
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| 16:45 | (we had to buy hundreds of intel NICs + managed switches previously just for this problem...)
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| 16:49 | * vagrantc looks | |
| 16:51 | <alkisg> Intel, broadcom, marvel, nvidia nics work with ethtool, while realtek, atheros etc with mii-tool, so far I had 100% success in the tests I did at some schools
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| 16:51 | <vagrantc> alkisg: mucking with firewalling rules by default doesn't seem safe to me
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| 16:51 | <alkisg> vagrantc: we can put an option for the NAT, but if someone has ip=192.168.67.1, I believe that he does want NAT for his clients
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| 16:52 | E.g. NAT=True in /etc/default/ltsp
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| 16:52 | Or in /etc/ltsp/ltsp-server.conf
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| 16:52 | <vagrantc> there is no magic to 192.168.67.1 == LTSP
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| 16:52 | <alkisg> Or even NAT=192.168.67.1
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| 16:52 | Why not? debian-edu even gives specific IPs to specific roles
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| 16:53 | No problem though, you're the debian maintainer, I'm just throwing the idea
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| 16:53 | we can move from sch-scripts to ltsp whatever you like, I'll keep the rest inside sch-scripts
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| 16:54 | The flow control part is more significant than the NAT part though
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| 16:55 | <vagrantc> regarding the mii-tool/ethtool stuff ... it depends on the vendor which needs to be called? ideally we'd want something a little less shotgun approach
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| 16:55 | <alkisg> I haven't found a solution online the last 3 years I've been looking into it
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| 16:55 | <vagrantc> i.e. run the appropriate tool for the appropriate vendor, etc.
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| 16:55 | <alkisg> We don't know which vendor supports which tools
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| 16:55 | We have to do feature detection instead of vendor/version detection
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| 16:56 | Some even claim they support a tool, but they don't
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| 16:56 | <vagrantc> fair enough
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| 16:56 | <alkisg> It's a very common issue on the web, but I've seen it applies on linux a lot too
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| 16:56 | <vagrantc> does: output=$(/bin/false) actually return true ?
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| 16:57 | <alkisg> Example, the same vendor and NIC need autoneg on / rx off in ubuntu 10.04, and then autoneg off / rx off in ubuntu 12.04
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| 16:57 | <vagrantc> nope.
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| 16:57 | what a mess.
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| 16:57 | <alkisg> An assignment doesn't change $?
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| 16:58 | <vagrantc> alkisg: your code is fine with that.
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| 16:58 | * vagrantc guessed badly before testing | |
| 16:58 | <alkisg> OK, feel free to copy whatever you think is worth it to go to debian/ltsp-server.if-up... just ping me to remove it from sch-scripts then
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| 16:59 | Ah we can arrange for some time to work together on the packaging if you like
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| 16:59 | To take care the ubuntu .diff drop as well
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| 16:59 | <vagrantc> alkisg: so your code doesn't run mii-tool if ethtool works?
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| 16:59 | <alkisg> Right
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| 17:00 | And if ethtool reports that it's already disabled, it doesn't run anything
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| 17:01 | The combinations to make it work were very tricky, I think it's ok now though, as clean as it can be...
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| 17:01 | The correct way would be for all network modules to expose a parameter for flow-control in modprobe.conf
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| 17:01 | <vagrantc> that you need to call it with seemingly exact arguments on different cards seems bizarre. not that i'm contesting that's the reality of it... but eesh.
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| 17:01 | <alkisg> But only a couple of them provide that
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| 17:01 | <vagrantc> exactly opposite
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| 17:02 | <alkisg> A couple of years ago I even asked in the kernel's networking list, but got no answer for any good way to disable flow control
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| 17:03 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i'd say go ahead and commit it minus the iptables stuff
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| 17:04 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I don't have commit access to debian/
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| 17:05 | Should I commit it to /usr/share/ltsp-server/disable-flow-control, and then packagers can call it from their if-up scripts?
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| 17:07 | .../usr/share/ltsp/disable-flow-control, sorry, I forgot we put everything there
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| 17:16 | <vagrantc> alkisg: that sounds like a reasonable approach.
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| 17:17 | * vagrantc forgot we don't have directories to dump everything into | |
| 17:17 | <vagrantc> the client/share could be extended to client/etc, server/etc, etc.
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| 17:17 | with client/Debian/etc ...
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| 20:48 | <Dsys> good day. Where can I send a donation for ltsp?
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| 20:48 | i should ask first, do you accept paypal donation?
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| 20:52 | <vagrantc> i'm not sure we've set up a donation infrastructure
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| 20:53 | i've toyed with the idea of proposing some crowdfunding ideas for specific features and dvelopment
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