IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 9 December 2016 (all times are UTC)
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| 03:45 | <nek> hi
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| 03:46 | <sbalneav> Hello
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| 03:46 | <Guest45623> Hi sbalneav
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| 03:47 | Can I ask about my trouble here?
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| 03:47 | <sbalneav> Yes
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| 03:48 | <Guest45623> Now I try to construct LTSP Server on Ubuntu 16.04
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| 03:48 | And I could install ltsp-server.
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| 03:49 | But I had the error when "ltsp-build-client" for fat client was done.
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| 03:49 | <sbalneav> What was the error
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| 03:50 | <Guest45623> The hash sum of some packages mismatch and stopped...
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| 03:50 | I can find these packages on http://archive.ubuntu.com/.....
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| 03:50 | <sbalneav> Try rebuilding it. Sounds like some packages may have updated on the server while you were building.
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| 03:51 | <Guest45623> Ok. I would!
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| 03:52 | Now I run. Until now, I tried to rebuild over 5 times on Ubuntu Desktop 16.04 and over 3 times on Ubuntu Server 16.04....
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| 03:55 | Usually, can people build fat client on ubuntu 16.04 without errors ?]
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| 03:56 | <sbalneav> I use debian personally, but I'd assume so
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| 03:59 | <Guest45623> I don't have any knowledge about the relation between server and client. If use debian, what version of client will be ?
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| 04:01 | <sbalneav> debian
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| 04:01 | Jessie. That's what I use
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| 04:02 | <Guest45623> Oh, ...ltsp-build-client stopped... Perhaps, around ldm-ubuntu-theme. For setting ldm-ubuntu-theme(2:2.0.47), ltsp-build-client tried to read package list, and read information about dependency and failed to find packeges...
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| 04:03 | Is server debian Jessi? So what is client? Ubuntu? Ubuntu mate?
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| 04:03 | <sbalneav> Jessie
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| 04:03 | Both the server and client are debian jessie
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| 04:03 | <Guest45623> Oh, both
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| 04:04 | Ok, I understood... Is there way to use ubuntu 16.04 as client...?
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| 04:05 | <sbalneav> Not that I'm aware of.
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| 04:05 | Wait around for alkisg to show. He's more knowledgable of ubuntu
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| 04:06 | <Guest45623> Yes, thank for your kind! I will wait and keep searching :)
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| 14:05 | <sbalneav> vagrantc: Hey hey
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| 14:06 | You still with alkisg? Or heading home?
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| 14:15 | <jammcq> Scotty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 14:17 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: roughly 24 more hours in alkisg's good care.
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| 14:18 | jammcq: heya!
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| 14:18 | we actually set up an LTSP lab in a small mountain village this morning, so didn't have much time to test
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| 14:18 | sbalneav: test ltsp-pam improvements
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| 14:18 | really nice to see LTSP in real-world use!
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| 14:19 | <jammcq> vagrantc: HEY !
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| 14:19 | what city are you guys in?
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| 14:19 | <vagrantc> ionnina now
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| 14:19 | oops, misspelled
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| 14:20 | <jammcq> ok... what country ? :)
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| 14:20 | * vagrantc pulls the proper spelling from debian/changelog | |
| 14:20 | <vagrantc> Ιωάννινα
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| 14:20 | as the saying goes, looks greek to me.
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| 14:20 | <jammcq> in greece ?
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| 14:21 | <vagrantc> i guess that's only one of the proper spellings
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| 14:21 | jammcq: nai!
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| 14:21 | (a.k.a. yes)
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| 14:21 | <jammcq> found it on google maps
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| 14:21 | looks cool
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| 14:22 | <vagrantc> it has been a wonderful visit, and we've made some good progress on the ltsp PAM integration
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| 14:22 | mostly sbalneav writing stuff, and alkisg and I testing
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| 14:23 | sbalneav: what's your august looking like? maybe we could do a hackfest in montreal piggy-backing on debconf :)
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| 14:32 | * vagrantc tests the latest and greatest ltsp-pam | |
| 14:33 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: ooh, ooh! i was able to log into mate twice in a row!
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| 14:34 | no luck on the console login though ...
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| 15:04 | * alkisg tries debuild'ing ltsp-pam... | |
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| 15:12 | <alkisg> vagrantc: if [ "$PAM_TYPE" = "close_session" ]; then
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| 15:12 | sleep 10
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| 15:12 | Does that sleep 10 at that point, give you a 10 sec console?
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| 15:12 | I was able to login and work fine, and then after 10 sec it exited
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| 15:13 | sbalneav: I'm having the same issue as vagrantc, i.e. my console logins immediately exit
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| 15:13 | And additionally the user is not removed from extrausers on logout
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| 15:15 | Hmmm actually that "sleep" there, increases the lightdm login time, not the logout time
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| 15:15 | Sounds like "close_session" is called at the wrong time?!
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| 15:19 | <sbalneav> Hmm, dunno, I'll dig into it today, see if I can get terminal logins working.
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| 15:19 | back, was out for a bit.
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| 15:20 | The cleanup code on close_session should now be shutting down any stray procs
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| 15:25 | <alkisg> Ah, maybe it's called for the lightdm user... let me check
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| 15:27 | sbalneav: I see pam-session being called for the lightdm user ==> close_session,
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| 15:27 | and then for the "administrator" user ==> open session
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| 15:27 | Maybe we want to ignore all lightdm events?
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| 15:28 | <sbalneav> This is in the console?
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| 15:28 | <alkisg> No I was trying from lightdm currently, now I'll try from the console
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| 15:29 | So, logging in from the console immediately calls pam-session open_session and pam-session close_session
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| 15:29 | <sbalneav> The session stuff's contingent on the socket existing. For the lightdm user, there'll be no socket
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| 15:30 | Right, why, I don't know.
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| 15:30 | <alkisg> If I put a "sleep 10" in close_session, then I can work in the console just fine for 10 seconds
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| 15:30 | <sbalneav> For a console login, do we want the ssh tunnel to start, and the sshfs homedir to mount?
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| 15:30 | <alkisg> Does the pam-session script need to return 0?
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| 15:31 | <sbalneav> Or do we just want to have the user logged into an empty directory?
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| 15:31 | <alkisg> I think I would do it like this: if the user account exists, don't fetch it from the server (e.g. ldap)
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| 15:31 | if the home dir exists, don't use sshfs
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| 15:31 | else => do those
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| 15:31 | That should allow multiple console logins etc too
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| 15:32 | <sbalneav> Well, we always remove the homedir on exist
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| 15:32 | *exit
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| 15:32 | <alkisg> Currently we pkill everything
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| 15:32 | <sbalneav> correct.
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| 15:32 | <alkisg> If we see that killing systemd only kills the cgroup processes,
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| 15:33 | then we can check after killing systemd if there are other processes of that same user
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| 15:33 | <sbalneav> I've added in further cleanup code.
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| 15:33 | It's already there now.
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| 15:33 | <alkisg> (or ask logind directly if there's another session for that user),
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| 15:33 | so, if he's logged in another time, we don't want to unmount it
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| 15:33 | <sbalneav> Not sure how to ask logind such things :
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| 15:34 | <alkisg> loginctl --help will tell us
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| 15:34 | There's also loginctl kill-session, if we prefer it to pkill
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| 15:36 | <vagrantc> that sounds more robust, if implementation specific
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| 15:36 | <alkisg> Ideally we don't want to kill anything; we only want pam or systemd to notify us when a session has closed
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| 15:39 | <sbalneav> ok
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| 15:39 | <alkisg> sbalneav: could you give us a small description of which parts run at which point? Like, user authenticates in lightdm => ssh.py gets called as root with that param ==> session starts etc etc?
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| 15:39 | And which of them run as root, and which as the user?
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| 15:40 | <sbalneav> User enters username
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| 15:40 | pam_open is called
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| 15:40 | <alkisg> Ah, that's before he enters the password?!
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| 15:40 | <sbalneav> pam prompts for "Password"
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| 15:40 | Correct
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| 15:40 | PAM asks for the password
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| 15:40 | If you look in the ssh.py code, you'll see under "password" authentication where it asks for it.
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| 15:41 | pam recieves password
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| 15:41 | <alkisg> That runs as root or as lightdm?
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| 15:41 | <sbalneav> We're root right now, yes
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| 15:41 | <alkisg> ok
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| 15:41 | <sbalneav> pam does whatever necessary to check password is ok
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| 15:41 | password's fine, we're finished with auth
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| 15:41 | now we call pam_acct_mgmt
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| 15:42 | whatever acct mgmt stuff needs to happen goes on (usually nothing)
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| 15:42 | That closes
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| 15:42 | open_session is called.
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| 15:42 | Whatever stuff's in the open session happens (we're still root)
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| 15:42 | open_session finishes.
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| 15:43 | lightdm DROPS PRIVS. we're now the user
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| 15:43 | whatever lightdm xsession is going on runs.
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| 15:43 | <sbalneav> lightdm xsession terminates (user selects SYstem->Logout>
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| 15:43 | pam close_session is now called AS THE USER
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| 15:44 | that finishes
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| 15:44 | pam_close is called
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| 15:44 | go back to the top
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| 15:44 | <alkisg> pam_close runs as root?
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| 15:44 | <sbalneav> The problem that's always present is:
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| 15:44 | No, pam_close runs as user.
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| 15:44 | auth, and open_session run as root
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| 15:44 | <alkisg> So at what point do we have the rights to remove the home dir?
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| 15:44 | <sbalneav> close_session runs as user
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| 15:45 | You can do it in close session, but you have to do it AS THE USER
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| 15:45 | You never get root back
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| 15:45 | <alkisg> But the user cannot remove his own home dir...
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| 15:45 | Hmm...
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| 15:45 | <sbalneav> That's the problem.
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| 15:45 | That's why we have to make sure the user owns his or her home dir, since they cannot remove it if it's root owned
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| 15:46 | that's also why we can't clean up nss-extrausers
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| 15:46 | <alkisg> If that fails, we could have some root process listening for logout signals, and doing the "right" thing for them...
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| 15:46 | <sbalneav> once you drop the privs, they're gone and you never get them back
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| 15:47 | The *easy* solution would be to just have some setuid program that does LTSP specific cleanup. But distros are VERY hinky about letting setuid binaries into the filesystem
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| 15:47 | <alkisg> We can keep some script running as root, listening for signals from its childs...
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| 15:48 | <sbalneav> That complicates things. And for the moment, I don't think we'll need it.
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| 15:48 | <alkisg> It shouldn't require more than 10-20 lines of code to implement that wrapper... without counting the cleanup code
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| 15:48 | That could also clean up extrausers
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| 15:48 | <sbalneav> What I need to do is write the code necessary to MERGE new data into extrausers, and not just overwrite
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| 15:49 | <alkisg> I think I've already done that in the past in x01-localapps
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| 15:49 | <sbalneav> then we wouldn't need to clean up; extrausers would just cleanly grow during the course of multiple people logging in and out.
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| 15:49 | <alkisg> But is that a wise thing to do?
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| 15:49 | A user that is removed from the server, will never get removed from the client's lightdm list
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| 15:49 | <sbalneav> I can't see why it wouldn't be: take my scenario...
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| 15:50 | Yes, but if it's removed from the server, it can't AUTHENTICATE anymore
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| 15:50 | Since the authentication doesn't happen with the local extrausers stuff, only from the remote ssh
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| 15:50 | <alkisg> True, it wouldn't be a security risk, just an annoying GUI thing
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| 15:51 | <sbalneav> It shouldn't even be annoying gui wise.
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| 15:51 | Lets say user bob, uid 1000 logs in to a thin client, and then logs out
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| 15:51 | <alkisg> OK, at that point lightdm keeps him as the preselected user
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| 15:51 | <sbalneav> now on the server, we delete bob, and add bill, uid 1000
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| 15:51 | ah, well, that's a function of the GREETER.
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| 15:51 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 15:52 | Sorry, should have said lightdm-greeter instead of just lightdm
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| 15:52 | <sbalneav> remember, I want us to eventually switch to using lightdm-webkit-greeter
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| 15:52 | <alkisg> Ideally, don't we want to support any greeter?
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| 15:52 | <sbalneav> We do, but gtk-greeter doesn't support password aging.
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| 15:53 | <alkisg> sry, phone, brb...
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| 15:53 | <sbalneav> np
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| 15:54 | in your scenario, true, gtk-greeter would keep "bob" as the default user, but but that would be the case if bob and bill both did exist anyway, so... it's not really a big issue, as far as I can see.
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| 15:54 | and as soon as bill logs in, if we're properly merging the extrausers files, bob will simply get replaced at that point.
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| 15:54 | since they both have uid 1000
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| 15:55 | since there's no local password stored, I don't see that it's a security problem.
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| 15:57 | btw, if I remove the "ltsp" parameter from the common-auth ssh.py line, I can log in to the console. So it's something with the code that launches the tunnel that's causing the console hang.
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| 15:57 | That narrows it down... :D
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| 15:57 | <vagrantc> huh
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| 15:58 | why would launching the tunnel work for lightdm but not for getty login?
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| 15:58 | <sbalneav> *shrug*, I guess I'll figure it out :D
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| 15:59 | there's a lot of forking and execing in there. chances are I've got something ever-so-slightly wrong.
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| 16:00 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: removing "ltsp" from the auth line didn't work for m
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| 16:00 | me
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| 16:01 | <sbalneav> hmm
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| 16:01 | odd
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| 16:01 | worked for me
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| 16:01 | * vagrantc moves on to using the sshauth with sshd :) | |
| 16:01 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: did you have the user logged in via lightdm at the same time?
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| 16:01 | <sbalneav> No
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| 16:02 | a dual login like that's gonna fail for sure
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| 16:02 | <vagrantc> well, it has it's issues
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| 16:02 | but actually works
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| 16:02 | until one of them logs out
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| 16:02 | <sbalneav> right
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| 16:02 | since we just kill everyone's processes with our userid
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| 16:03 | wonder if loginctl can give us a list of what a particular sessions' pids are.
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| 16:03 | <vagrantc> thre's got to be a way to only kill a particular tree of processes
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| 16:03 | <sbalneav> Oh, I'm sure.
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| 16:04 | <alkisg> back, reading...
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| 16:07 | <sbalneav> brb, coffee
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| 16:10 | <alkisg> sbalneav: maybe it has something to do about closing stdio descriptors?
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| 16:16 | <sbalneav> alkisg: That's.... a possibility
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| 16:17 | Anyway, I know both your time there is fleeting, but I think we've made some really good progress
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| 16:18 | We've kind of gone from "a bunch of ideas and dreams" to "a mostly working implementation"
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| 16:19 | So, I'm planning on setting up a server here to be my new testbed
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| 16:20 | My question is: what's the *preferred* way now, if we're getting rid of ltsp-build-client (or trying to) to do ltsp? I've never done the ltsp-pnp stuff. How do you get started with that?
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| 16:20 | <alkisg> !ltsp-pnp
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| 16:20 | <ltsp> ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 16:20 | <alkisg> I think I kept this up to date even for 16.04
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| 16:21 | Ah, sorry, some ubuntu specific bits there
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| 16:21 | vagrantc has one for debian as well, I dunno if it's up to date...
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| 16:21 | If you have a working ltsp setup, you rm -rf /opt/ltsp, and run ltsp-update-image -c /
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| 16:21 | That should mostly do it...
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| 16:22 | The rest of the parts are for setting up proxydhcp instead of normal dhcp etc, you don't really need to switch to those
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| 16:29 | <sbalneav> ok
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| 16:29 | I'll try setting something up
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| 16:35 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: https://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto has a description using the LTSP-PNP method
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| 16:36 | mgith be slightly out of date ...
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| 16:36 | some of the steps are no longer necessary with Debian stretch or jessie-backports
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| 16:37 | and some of them you can omit (e.g. DHCP if you have that on your own)
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| 16:38 | the main part is "ltsp-update-image --cleanup /"
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| 16:47 | <alkisg> if not os.path.exists(pamh.env[SOCKET]):
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| 16:47 | debug('Control socket did not start')
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| 16:47 | # return pamh.PAM_AUTH_ERR
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| 16:47 | I commented out that line
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| 16:47 | Then I tried putting a "return" right above the forking code
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| 16:47 | And console logins work
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| 16:48 | Then I moved the "return" right below the forking code
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| 16:48 | And console logins fail
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| 16:48 | I'm guessing that something's going wrong at the forks...
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| 16:55 | A single fork works, a double fork causes issues
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| 19:56 | <Statler> alkisg, do you have upgraded nbd-client?
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| 20:14 | <Statler> alkisg, I have found it!
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| 20:14 | strace on the nbd-server shows the problem
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| 20:15 | Kernerl 4.8 or the nbd-client strips the first / from the path of the nbd-export-name
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| 20:22 | <alkisg_web> Statler, yup, known issue and bug report filed for that
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| 20:24 | Statler, https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=846998
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