IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 20 May 2009 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:35 | <asmok> Everybody: is it good idea if I and a hungarian ltsp admin have a tutor session here tomorrow 21.5 GMT 9 - 12 about my howto: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/OpenLDAP_NFS_SSL?
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| 00:38 | <asmok> Everybody: We both have basic setup with two server machines and try to take every step on that howto. My real question is this: Will we produce too much noise/spam - should we go somewhere else (example: #ltsp-howto)?
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| 00:41 | Everybody: Why here? Here is pastebot, Nubae records everything and YOU are here ;-) Let me know - thumbs up or down ;-)
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| 00:43 | <cyberorg> asmok, it is always a good idea to do something that keeps the channel buzzing ;)
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| 07:11 | <_UsUrPeR_> :D morning all
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| 07:23 | <X-TaZ> 'morning :)
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| 09:09 | <treyh> !lastseen Gadi
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| 09:09 | <ltspbot> treyh: Error: "lastseen" is not a valid command.
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| 09:09 | <nubae> !seen Gadi
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| 09:09 | <ltspbot> nubae: Gadi was last seen in #ltsp 19 hours, 47 minutes, and 53 seconds ago: * Gadi runs away
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| 09:09 | <sbalneav> !seen gadi
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| 09:09 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: gadi was last seen in #ltsp 19 hours, 47 minutes, and 53 seconds ago: * Gadi runs away
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| 09:10 | <treyh> ty lol
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| 09:42 | <treyh> !women
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| 09:42 | <ltspbot> treyh: Error: "women" is not a valid command.
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| 09:42 | <treyh> thats a valid option in #ubuntu lol
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| 10:58 | <treyh> test
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| 10:59 | <sbalneav> treyh: yup, we saw it.
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| 11:01 | <syn> just curious, but is thin client manager still actively developed?
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| 11:02 | hello
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| 11:02 | <nubae> syn: no
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| 11:02 | use italc instead
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| 11:02 | it does what manager used to do and much more
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| 11:03 | if u want an easy way to manage your config scripts, take a look at easy ltsp
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| 11:04 | <syn> actually I was going to start modifying the tcm code to do more stuff
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| 11:04 | because italc seems pretty unstable on ubuntu
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| 11:06 | so you use italc and easy ltsp together?
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| 11:07 | <DarKnesS_WolF> nubae: hello
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| 11:08 | <nubae> hi DarKnesS_WolF
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| 11:08 | <DarKnesS_WolF> nubae: how is everything with ltsp :)?
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| 11:08 | the lab i did setup like few months ago works perfectly now also i am using LDAP / NFS home / LTSP over NFS and each are running seprated
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| 11:09 | but sometime i face slow in the perforamce
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| 11:09 | also i am using fatclient, but in this case i am still using the memory from the big / main machine that hosts the LTSP
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| 11:11 | <nubae> thats gerat, unfortunately I've not had time to play with fatclient on jaunty so there are bound to be problems. Still, if u look at my website, people have posted fixes for whatever was not working (may eveb have been you)
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| 11:25 | <DarKnesS_WolF> nubae: i am not upgraded to jaunty yet
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| 11:26 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: whats your problem and what are you running
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| 11:27 | <DarKnesS_WolF> treyh: no problem appers yet but sometimes things are very slow in 8.10 for some unknowen reason,
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| 11:27 | also i find that the fat client not useing there memory they are using the HOST LTSP machine memory which might be why things getting slow.
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| 11:28 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: what are you server and client specs
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| 11:28 | <nubae> hmmm it should only be using some of the ltsp server memory
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| 11:28 | most of it should be locally used
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| 11:28 | u could try turning on local swap
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| 11:28 | ie, make it do swapping to the local harddrive if there is one
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| 11:29 | <treyh> nubae: I wouldn't enable swappning, install local apps
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| 11:29 | <nubae> across the network, I'd turn it and logging off, as it does more damage than good
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| 11:29 | <treyh> that will take the load off the server
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| 11:29 | <nubae> hes running fatclient
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| 11:29 | <treyh> if the system is slow, the server probably isn't up to par
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| 11:29 | <nubae> the load is alreay off the server
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| 11:29 | <DarKnesS_WolF> treyh: clients are xeon 8 corse 8 GIG memory
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| 11:29 | my server is a virtual image running 2 cores and 4 GB memory :)
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| 11:29 | <nubae> the clients???
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| 11:30 | <DarKnesS_WolF> nubae: when i do top / htop i find the memory are 4 not hte 8
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| 11:30 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: I know nubae said you have fat clients, are the clients pxe booting?
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| 11:30 | <DarKnesS_WolF> yep
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| 11:30 | over NFS
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| 11:30 | no img
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| 11:30 | <treyh> ok so it's doing nfs instead of nbd
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| 11:30 | is it slow using the applications or booting or both/
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| 11:30 | ?
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| 11:32 | <DarKnesS_WolF> using __some applications__
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| 11:33 | takes some time like 2 mints to get the desktop after login
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| 11:35 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: what distro you using, ubuntu or debian?
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| 11:36 | <epsas> Darkness_Wolf - I am getting that problem with debian ltsp
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| 11:36 | i suspect it is the xlib error that is causing the problem
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| 11:37 | the "taking two minutes for desktop to load after login"
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| 11:37 | <Gadi> is there a delay in getting a prompt when you ssh into the server?
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| 11:38 | <epsas> no
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| 11:38 | <Gadi> is the desktop gnome?
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| 11:38 | <epsas> yes
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| 11:38 | maybe it is time to 'frontport' the xlib library
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| 11:41 | <treyh> what xlib error does it give you
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| 11:43 | <DarKnesS_WolF> treyh: ubuntu
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| 11:43 | Gadi: nop
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| 11:43 | for me no errors
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| 11:43 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: why are you using nfs with Ubuntu?
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| 11:43 | <treyh> DarKnesS_WolF: wait, are you using vbox?
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| 11:44 | <nubae> he's using fatclients
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| 11:44 | fatclients mount /home via nfs
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| 11:44 | <treyh> nubae: let him answer
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| 11:44 | DarKnesS_WolF: on the server, is it virtualized or not, thats the point i'm getting to
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| 11:44 | <nubae> I'm just letting u know how fatclient works since I wrote it...
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| 11:45 | <treyh> nubae: I understand you are just trying to help, so m ai
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| 11:45 | *so am I
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| 11:46 | * Lns doesn't think he's ever seen an argument regarding who gets to help someone on irc..heh | |
| 11:47 | <treyh> lol
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| 11:48 | I think someone is over eager to help, which is cool, but at some point you have to let others help
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| 11:50 | <cyberorg> treyh, you just asked the guy who wrote fatclient to shut up :)
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| 11:51 | <treyh> cyberorg: I never said shutup, but he kept answering my questions towards Dark
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| 11:51 | <syn> whois nubae
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| 11:52 | sorry
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| 11:52 | <treyh> syn: apparently he wrote the fatclient nfs stuff
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| 11:52 | which I appreciate
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| 11:52 | nubae: no hard feelings
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| 11:52 | <Lns> what's up syn
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| 11:52 | <treyh> but at some point, have to let someone else answer their own questions
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| 11:52 | <syn> Lns: hey
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| 11:53 | <Lns> well i guess it's a lot better than nobody responding to people asking questions =p
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| 11:56 | <treyh> I am glad ppl like to help, I like to help, maybe you shouldn't answer for someone else over and over, he thought I was questioning nfs but really I'm looking at virtualization issues
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| 11:57 | I guess i won't spend hours in here each day helping people if i an
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| 11:57 | *can
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| 11:57 | assholes
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| 11:58 | <Lns> ...woah
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| 11:58 | sounds like someone has a case of the moooondays
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| 12:00 | <alkisg> (07:51:34 μμ) treyh: nubae: no hard feelings / (07:56:47 μμ) treyh: assholes !!! ???
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| 12:21 | <DarKnesS_WolF> tryes it is but sometime it works perfect and some not.
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| 12:22 | <nubae> lol
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| 12:23 | <nubae> funny... ANYWAY.... DarKnesS_WolF, I am going to try and get some time in the next couple days to see whats with fatclient for jaunty so people can upgrade it
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| 12:23 | In any case on the forums on my site I believe there are people who have already done the fixes to be able to make it work
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| 12:34 | <DarKnesS_WolF> nubae: perfect :)
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| 12:35 | * Gadi wonders if this is the right time for a "yo mama's thin client's so fat" joke | |
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| 12:37 | <kbum> someone could tell me for which reason I am having the error: "Kernel panic - syncing kill"
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| 12:37 | <nubae> heh its always a good time for those kind of jokes
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| 12:37 | <Lns> Gadi: yo mama's thin client is so fat its using vista
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| 13:13 | <richard_parker_v> We just upgraded our ltsp server from ubuntu 8.10 to 9.04. Solved several problems (good) but we no longer have sound at the clients (bad). Is this just us or a problem others are having and does anyone have any ideas on fixing? We haven't really dug into the problem yet because I first wanted to see if it was a typical problem which might be easily solved.
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| 13:16 | <alkisg> richard_parker_v: are the users in the audio group?
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| 13:17 | That's the only problem I had with sound with 9.04, I had to remove the users from the audio group.
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| 13:18 | * Gadi wonders what ever happened to the ancient art of mime? | |
| 13:18 | <Gadi> where is the mime's place in the computing world of tomorrow?
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| 13:19 | must be in email
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| 13:19 | :P
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| 13:19 | tough crowd today
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| 13:20 | yo mama's thin client's so fat when she runs vista she blocks the view
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| 13:20 | <richard_parker_v> alkisg: I hadn't checked the audio group before--the answer, unfortunately, is that they are inconsistently in the audio group. The audio group includes pulse and some, but not all of the users. We're having the same problem seemingly regardless of the user.
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| 13:21 | Gadi: There are points of the situation which are nicer; it is quieter around here.
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| 13:21 | <Gadi> :)
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| 13:21 | so, richard_parker_v, did you rebuild the chroot after the upgrade?
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| 13:23 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: yes. Does the intrepid client even work if the server is jaunty? We didn't bother to find out. Just rebuilt everything.
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| 13:23 | <Gadi> hehe
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| 13:23 | so, are you near a thin client we can debug?
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| 13:24 | or are you just scoping for the easy fix
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| 13:24 | :)
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| 13:24 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: both
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| 13:24 | <Gadi> hehe
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| 13:24 | ur high maintenance ;)
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| 13:24 | well, let's debug and see if there is an easy fix
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| 13:25 | <rjune> !g
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| 13:25 | <ltspbot> rjune: "g" is Gadi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 13:25 | * Gadi waves to rjune | |
| 13:25 | <Gadi> rjune: we're gonna make sound work again
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| 13:25 | wanna play along?
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| 13:25 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: please...
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| 13:25 | <rjune> Oooo, it's been a while.
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| 13:26 | <Gadi> richard_parker_v: can you get a shell on the client?
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| 13:26 | any which way you prefer
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| 13:26 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: ltsp-localapps xterm
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| 13:26 | <Gadi> that'll do
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| 13:27 | in the xterm, type: alsamixer
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| 13:27 | or, better: alsamixer -c0
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| 13:27 | tho, on ubuntu, I imagine both work the same
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| 13:28 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: among other things, Pulseaudio states that is it unable to connect (connection refused)
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| 13:28 | <Gadi> are you sure that is a localapps xterm?
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| 13:29 | oh, try: alsamixer -c0
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| 13:29 | gotta make sure it uses the soundcard
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| 13:30 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: doesn't like "-c0" -- I get "wrong -c argument" Though it looks like it is supposed to be the card #. I tried "-c 0" and that didn't work either. Hmm.
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| 13:30 | <Gadi> how about: amixer -c0
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| 13:31 | if that doesn't work, my guess is the jaunty kernel and your soundcard do not like each other
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| 13:31 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: i get 'invalid card number'
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| 13:31 | <Gadi> yup
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| 13:31 | thats the problem
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| 13:31 | all clients are same?
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| 13:32 | same hardware, that is?
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| 13:32 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: lspci shows Creative labs CA0106 Soundblaster. It worked under 8.10. Is this because the 9.04 drivers are not quite up to speed yet?
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| 13:33 | Gadi: No, not all the clients are the same, but I haven't tried all users on all clients and alkisg's solution might work on some.
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| 13:33 | <Gadi> well, one solution at a time
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| 13:33 | :)
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| 13:34 | in the xterm, do: lsmod|grep snd
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| 13:34 | so you can see the various sound modules that loaded
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| 13:35 | <richard_parker_v> it does look like "snd_ca0106" is loaded
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| 13:37 | <Gadi> and do yousee a card0 if you do: ls /proc/asound
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| 13:39 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: /proc/asound includes card0 and a symlink from CA0106 to card0
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| 13:39 | <Gadi> ah, so the module is good
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| 13:39 | I wonder why amixer -c0 failed
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| 13:40 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: /proc/asound/cards indicates cad 0 is the CA0106; gives irq and memory address which looks okay. I don't know why amixer and alsamixer aren't working as expected, but it may be related to the core problem.
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| 13:41 | <Gadi> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1123165.html
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| 13:41 | seems some have had issues with pulseaudio and that card
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| 13:41 | is pulseaudio running?
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| 13:41 | ps -efw|grep pulse
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| 13:41 | in that xterm
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| 13:42 | <richard_parker_v> no
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| 13:42 | forgot to check simple things...
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| 13:43 | <Gadi> it seems pulseaudio is dying with that card
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| 13:43 | <Gadi> is that user in the audio group?
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| 13:43 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: no
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| 13:44 | <Gadi> perhaps you can try running pulseaudio in the xterm
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| 13:44 | hmm
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| 13:44 | then you may get permissions errors if you try running pulseaudio by hand
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| 13:44 | pulseaudio -vvv
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| 13:44 | that is
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| 13:45 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: yes. complaint that i'm not in the pulse-rt group.
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| 13:45 | <Gadi> hmm
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| 13:45 | well, we know the issue
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| 13:46 | we just need a fix
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| 13:46 | :)
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| 13:46 | what if you type just: amixer
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| 13:46 | without the -c0
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| 13:46 | does that work?
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| 13:47 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: no, unable to connect (connection refused)
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| 13:47 | <Gadi> that may be permissions
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| 13:47 | do this:
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| 13:48 | add that user to the audio group
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| 13:48 | log out of ldm
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| 13:48 | log back in
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| 13:48 | and get the xterm back
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| 13:48 | that way, we can at least verify that alsa is okey dokey
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| 13:48 | and that the issue is only with pulse
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| 13:50 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: By the way, when I ran pulseaudio -vvv it couldn't find two modules under /usr/lib/pulse-0.9/modules: module-gconf.so and module-hal-detect.so Don't the ltsp clients use hal for the hardware layer?
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| 13:50 | <Gadi> indeed they do, but not sure if pulse needs them or not
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| 13:51 | lets see what package those are from
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| 13:51 | <Gadi> pulseaudio-module-gconf, pulseaudio-module-hal,
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| 13:52 | I suppose for completeness, you can install those in your chroot
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| 13:55 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: on another client with a different sound care (NEC PowerVR); I'm getting similar results: pulse is not running. But it's a bit worse: no /proc/asound directory. This is an older card, so I guess I'm not surprised...
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| 13:56 | <Gadi> sounds like the new kernel is not doing you any favors
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| 13:56 | :)
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| 13:56 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: I'll get those modules installed in the chroot and see where we go. And I'll take the users in and out of the audio group and see if that makes any difference.
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| 13:56 | <Gadi> I would say keep them in the audio group
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| 13:57 | <Gadi> dunno why taking them out would do anything
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| 13:57 | <alkisg> Gadi, if the users are in the audio group, any change they do in the mixer affects the server
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| 13:57 | I.e. a student changes the volume of the server speakers
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| 13:57 | <Gadi> thats bizarre
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| 13:58 | <alkisg> The mixer shows the server sound card if the user is in the audio group
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| 13:58 | <richard_parker_v> Gadi: new kernel: perhaps, but it solves other problems, so we'll just figure out the sound problem. I'll look at the forums reference as well.
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| 13:58 | <alkisg> Gadi: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/360355
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| 14:02 | <Gadi> alkisg: you should prolly cross-reference that bug with gnome-volume-control
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| 14:03 | if stgraber's assertion is correct
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| 14:03 | <Mip5> Hey Gang - I've got jaunty ltsp server, and it's working well. However I can't "unlock" the panel for adding users.
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| 14:03 | <alkisg> Gadi, I'll have more time to debug it in the summer, and the audio group hack works around it, so I left it for now...
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| 14:04 | * Gadi nods | |
| 14:04 | <alkisg> Mip5: "panel for adding users" => you mean users-admin?
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| 14:04 | <richard_parker_v> alkisg and Gadi: Thank you for your help. I'm going to bounce out now and reboot this client to see if I can make progress. Thanks.
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| 14:04 | <Gadi> cheers
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| 14:05 | dont play any sounds I wouldnt!
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| 14:05 | <Mip5> alkisg - yes, sorry about - users-admin
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| 14:06 | <alkisg> You mean that the unlock button is disabled?
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| 14:06 | <Mip5> alkisg - yes, it's grayed, and I can't unlock it by clicking it
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| 14:07 | <alkisg> How did you run it?
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| 14:07 | <Mip5> from System->administration, but I've also tried launching it from the terminal
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| 14:09 | <alkisg> Can you run `id` from the users that you run it with, and upload the result?
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| 14:09 | <Mip5> alkisg - alright, I was logging in from a thin client, and I *thought* that that had worked before. I just tried logging in via vnc, and didn't have the problem.
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| 14:10 | <alkisg> Ah, ok :)
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| 14:10 | <Mip5> I was logging in as my admin account on the client. And, as I said, 8.04 used to allow admin.
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| 14:10 | Anyway - thanks.
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| 14:12 | Do you have a good link to show how to bind an ltsp server to an apple Xserve (running 10.4 - ldap v3)? It might be nice to have the students be able to get to their work from any of the machines inthe building.
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| 14:39 | <_UsUrPeR_> mip5: did you get that nvidia issue sorted out?
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| 14:46 | <Mip5> _UsUrPeR_ - no I didn't. It was taking forever, so I ordered a thin client from Disklessworkstations. It came yesterday, and it's great. I'm hoping we can go with it.
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| 14:47 | <_UsUrPeR_> mip5: oh. Grats :)
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| 14:47 | If you need any help, let me know
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| 14:47 | <Mip5> It's about the same price as the workstations we were planning to get, is greener, and just works.
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| 14:48 | Thanks - I'm sure I will.
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| 14:48 | The next issue I'm grappling with is whether/how to integrate the thin clients with our OS X server infrastructure.
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| 14:49 | In particular, I'd like to have the tc's bind to the same ldap directory so that account info for 300 students can be managed in one place
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| 14:52 | <_UsUrPeR_> mip5: I am presently working on an LDAP config. Once I get my ducks in a row, I can give you some pointers. Not with OS X, but the server config.
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| 14:54 | <Gadi> Mip5: http://lists.nluug.nl/pipermail/macosx-sig/2003-March/000165.html
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| 14:54 | an oldie but may still be a goodie
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| 14:55 | <Mip5> _UsUrPeR_ thanks - I'd love the assist.
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| 14:56 | Gadi - the files changed from simple text to xml (iirc) from Gutsy to Hardy, so I'm not sure whether that ref will still be relevant. I'll take a look though.
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| 14:56 | <Gadi> xml on the client side?
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| 14:56 | hmm
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| 14:57 | <Mip5> Right - the linux client files changed format (is what I recall hearing from one of our techs when he was working on it last spring)
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| 14:59 | <Gadi> well, either way, seems to be straight ldap
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| 14:59 | can prolly follow all the same ldap howtos as if it were Linux
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| 15:01 | <Mip5> Right - I've got some links (somewhere...) on it. Any ideas on how well it'll work to have the ltsp server server up the thin clients, but have the tc's write to their directory on the Xserver.
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| 15:02 | Both of the servers will be on gig ports on a decent cisco chassis (4506)
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| 15:02 | <Gadi> should be fine
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| 15:03 | much like an nfs mounted homedir
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| 15:03 | <Mip5> Oh good. Well, I'll begin testing that out.
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| 15:03 | One thing I heard is that if you botch the client, you lose the ability to login to it to fix it!
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| 15:03 | * Gadi plans to play a bit with a CIFS mounted homedir soon - that one Im more worried about | |
| 15:03 | <Gadi> :)
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| 15:04 | Mip5: always keep a back door
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| 15:04 | :)
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| 15:05 | <Mip5> Right - I heard I should keep a terminal open with root logged in , just in case...
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| 15:05 | <Gadi> or a livecd handy ;)
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| 15:06 | <Mip5> Oh yeah, I suppose that would work, though I'm not exactly sure how I'd restore root access: passwd root?
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| 15:06 | <Gadi> well, you usually screw things up by screwing up pam
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| 15:06 | so any pam file you touch, make a backup
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| 15:06 | <Mip5> right
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| 15:06 | <Gadi> or any operation you run that touches pam, know the inverse operation
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| 15:07 | <Gadi> :)
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| 15:07 | <Mip5> Okay - so then you'd just chroot, and restore the files
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| 15:07 | <Gadi> right
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| 15:07 | or simply, backup all of pam.d first
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| 15:08 | <Mip5> makes sense. I like to know (roughly) how to deal with adversity before I step into it, though I often get more than I bargain for ....;-)
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| 15:08 | <Gadi> it makes you stronger
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| 15:08 | :)
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| 15:09 | <Mip5> yeah... as long as it doesn't kill you, right?
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| 15:10 | It's true though - I do learn more when I have to dig myself out of something
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| 15:10 | Sometimes (often?) things work, and you don't really know why they work
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| 15:12 | <Gadi> thats why we break things here in #ltsp
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| 15:12 | its so our users will thank us for giving them an opportunity to leaarn
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| 15:12 | *learn
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| 15:12 | <Gadi> its a thankless job
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| 15:13 | <cbx33> ping syn
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| 15:13 | <Gadi> but, we know deep down, they appreciate it
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| 15:13 | ack
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| 15:13 | heh - couldnt resist
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| 15:13 | <cbx33> Gadi: heheh
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| 15:13 | hehehe I often peek poke people
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| 15:13 | ;)
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| 15:14 | <Gadi> cbx33: what you do on your own time is your own business
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| 15:14 | :)
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| 15:14 | * Gadi goes to mingle on the other side of the chat room | |
| 15:17 | * syn looks around | |
| 15:17 | <syn> pong cbx33
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| 15:25 | <cbx33> hey syn
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| 15:25 | so what did you wanna speak about
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| 15:42 | <Mip5> Gadi - good one - I had to grab a phone. Anyway - thanks for your help. I'll let y'all know how it goes.
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| 16:13 | <highvoltage> hmm, now why isn't my client configured to auto-join here.
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| 19:10 | <mgariepy> hi everyone.
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| 19:17 | i'm integrating localapps on a ltsp env but not all the thin client are able to run localapps, is there a standard way to launch ex. firefox from the profile "firefox.desktop" to launch the browser in local for thin client that support it or on the appserver for the other ?
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| 19:18 | or do i need to write my own profile parser to start firefox with the command i want ?
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| 20:59 | <MikeMc> Is anyone available to help me with batch entry of new users into an LTSP setup?
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| 21:24 | <treyh> x
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| 23:35 | <johnny> identify jr23462
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| 23:35 | johnny is now known as Guest81459 | |
| 23:36 | <cyberorg> moin Guest81459 :)
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| 23:36 | <Guest81459> badme
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| 23:37 | <cyberorg> you can't hide behind Guest81459 ;)
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| 23:37 | Guest81459 is now known as johnny | |
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| 23:38 | <johnny> cyberorg, it's a freenode setting
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| 23:38 | if i don't identify in time, it kicks me off the nick
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| 23:38 | to stop people from taking my nick
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| 23:38 | <cyberorg> ah, good idea, how do i get that done?
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| 23:39 | <johnny> now.. if only i could fix ejabberd mod_irc to allow nickserv password storage and auto identify, i wouldn't have to worry about it everytime
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| 23:39 | it's a nickserv option
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| 23:39 | /msg nickserv help set
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| 23:39 | look for enforce
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| 23:40 | <cyberorg> got it
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