IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 16 October 2013 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:49 | <gdi2k> greetings. I would like to experiment with multi-seat on an LTSP thin client. For this, I obviously need a custom Xorg.conf file, which I have specified with X_CONF = /etc/X11/multiseat01.conf for the specific client in lts.conf, but when the client boots, it doesn't use a specific xorg.conf - what might be going wrong?
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| 01:46 | <bennabiy_again> You want multiple ldm sessions on your client? or just the ability for multiple people to log into the same machine from different locations?
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| 03:27 | <alkisg> !learn nbd-server-bug as nbd-server hanging bug: https://github.com/yoe/nbd/commit/741495cb08503fd32a9d22648e63b64390c601f4, solved in version 3.4-1
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| 03:27 | <ltsp`> The operation succeeded.
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| 06:27 | <elias_a> alkisg: Good morning!
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| 06:27 | alkisg: Your question was good.
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| 06:28 | The difference between centrally maintained computer systems and Epoptes is IMHO clear.
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| 06:30 | As computer systems are meant for processing data, also personal data, there is legislation that shields the user from unauthorized use of personal information or data.
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| 06:30 | <alkisg> elias_a: I meant that anyone with a root account can see anything that the users does. Log keystrokes, watch his screen, steal his passwords etc, there's no need to install epoptes to do those things
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| 06:31 | <elias_a> alkisg: I understood that.
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| 06:31 | <alkisg> It's not just about data, it's about seeing what he types and watches exactly when he does that
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| 06:31 | So there's absolutely no difference from epoptes, afaik...
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| 06:31 | <elias_a> The difference is that there is legislation that can be used for hammering a sysadmin if he/she does that.
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| 06:32 | A classroom situation where a teacher sees private messages for example while using Epoptes is a bit different.
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| 06:34 | If the student has not been informed about the possibility that he/she gets monitored, the case is clear: monitoring is unlawful.
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| 06:36 | Even if informed we still have a problem: what if the use of computers for personal communications is allowed and the teacher just happens to grab the students screen when he/she is writing a personal message?
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| 06:37 | <alkisg> So the legislation covers the sysadmin watching over students, but not the teacher watching over students? /me doesn't really get that part...
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| 06:39 | <alkisg> Also, the teacher is allowed to watch over the student's shoulder, but not do the same thing over lan?
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| 06:41 | Finally, if epoptes had a mode where everything was working except for vnc, then it would be legal in finland?
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| 06:41 | E.g. open files on behalf of students, navigate them to URLs, log them out etc etc...
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| 07:02 | <elias_a> alkisg: Sorry - I was on telephone.
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| 07:04 | <alkisg> np - /me goes to a school...
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| 07:07 | <elias_a> work_alkisg: Actually if use of personal email is not prohibited in school and a teacher looks over student's shoulder and does not go away even if the student tells that he/she should stop looking, the teacher commits a crime.
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| 07:08 | I understand that my attitude is a bit harsh but the students have rights, too. I am defending their rights.
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| 07:09 | Oh, one more thing. When it comes to data protection, Greek laws are the same as in Finland due to EU.
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| 07:09 | All EU countries have same legislation.
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| 08:51 | <asmok> elias_a, in which situation/way you can allow to use Epoptes in classroom with kids? We do use Epoptes in Mexico. Is there any in our mind?
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| 08:53 | <elias_a> asmok: You have to make the rules straight.
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| 08:54 | I am a nitty picker and I would get a signed consent from parents that their kids are monitored in this manner.
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| 08:56 | But as we learned yesterday that there are people with different backrounds and attitudes.
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| 08:57 | I cannot say anything about laws of Mexico.
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| 08:57 | <asmok> how about that teacher have to be in same classroom and use Epoptes as a tool for helping - not using Epoptes as remote tool, as spyware in taht sense
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| 08:57 | <elias_a> Depends on legislation.
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| 08:58 | <asmok> i mean that pupil have to ask to help, teacher can't interrupt pupils session
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| 08:58 | <elias_a> My advise is: tell the pupils and their parents that they ar monitored.
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| 08:59 | <asmok> yes i understand that part
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| 09:02 | and we use opendns service as a filter in classrooms, i think that is again different kind of story (http://www.opendns.com/)
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| 09:04 | <elias_a> asmok: I think this problem is solved by telling how Epoptes or any other tool works.
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| 09:04 | <asmok> and in western world all pupils use their own devices (BYOD) because schools has only one computer classroom and it is full of useless and old computers...
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| 09:06 | <elias_a> All this does still not have anything to do with the question whether a teacher should be allowed to monitor the student without a consent...
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| 09:06 | <asmok> yes
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| 09:06 | <elias_a> I have lived in a world like that as you know.
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| 09:06 | <asmok> i keep that in mind in my project
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| 09:07 | <elias_a> It is called kekkoslovakia.
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| 09:07 | <asmok> ;-)
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| 09:07 | <elias_a> Named after president Kekkonen.
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| 09:07 | <asmok> thanks elias_a have to go
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| 09:07 | <elias_a> Ok.
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| 13:14 | <Rizzo1987> hi all....
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| 13:14 | <Rizzo1987> need some help, We have a TS/RDS server and I want to use LTSP for thin clients so that they can connect to the server via RDP, anyone have the knowledge on how to best go about this?
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| 13:15 | <alkisg> !lts.conf
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| 13:15 | <ltsp`> lts.conf: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
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| 13:15 | <alkisg> See the rdp entries there
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| 13:15 | It should be trivial, doable from the default installation
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| 13:18 | <Rizzo1987> problem is i was hoping it would be possible to customize it and lock down any other apps but RDP
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| 13:18 | is that possible?
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| 13:19 | <alkisg> Yup, that's what the rdp entries do
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| 13:19 | SCREEN_07=xfreerdp etc etc
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| 13:20 | <Rizzo1987> pah, I'm rather new to linux, can you expand a little for me please?
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| 13:21 | <alkisg> did you read the docs?
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| 13:21 | !docs
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| 13:21 | <ltsp`> docs: For the latest community documentation, see the LTSP wiki at http://wiki.ltsp.org/ For a PDF with official documentation, see https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
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| 13:22 | <alkisg> elias_a: greek laws don't allow students to bring their own devices to classrooms, and teachers don't allow them to do private work in school
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| 13:23 | I haven't heard of the EU legislation you're referring to, but it obviously doesn't apply here...
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| 13:23 | <elias_a> alkisg: In that case you are breaking EU legislation in this case, too.
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| 13:24 | <alkisg> Do you have a link handy, so that I can search if it applies to greece or not?
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| 13:24 | Because laws here clearly prohibit students from even bringing a closed cell phone in school...
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| 13:24 | <elias_a> Just a moment....
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| 13:24 | <alkisg> *turned off, i mean...
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| 13:24 | <elias_a> alkisg: Really?
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| 13:25 | <profe01> hola
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| 13:25 | <alkisg> Yup, students get expelled if they do
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| 13:25 | <profe01> algu de valencia?
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| 13:25 | <elias_a> alkisg: I really have to begin to bash your politicians.
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| 13:25 | <elias_a> profe01: No. English, por favos
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| 13:26 | favor
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| 13:31 | alkisg: That is really something which is totally against all legal norms in EU.
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| 13:32 | alkisg: To a certain degree I understand differences but this is way too heavy.
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| 13:32 | <alkisg> elias_a: I don't think students should be able to disrupt the classroom with their cell phones
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| 13:33 | Maybe you're talking about some other education level, not e.g. K12?
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| 13:33 | <elias_a> alkisg: No. Having a cell phone with you is a safety thing.
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| 13:33 | <alkisg> That's what the school phone is there for
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| 13:34 | Although, I'd agree with a turned off phone inside the student's bag
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| 13:34 | <elias_a> alkisg: What apps can you run on the school phone?
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| 13:34 | <alkisg> Your students might have different needs, sure, ours don't need apps to get home
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| 13:35 | <elias_a> alkisg: If that is not defined I find it as restricting freedom of speech.
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| 13:35 | <alkisg> elias_a: you're not a teacher, are you? :)
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| 13:35 | * alkisg guesses elias_a was never annoyed by students with cell phones inside his classroom... | |
| 13:36 | <elias_a> alkisg: I give you more detailed info later. Meanwhile I say that I am ready to slice your politicians to 1mm slices and to compost the whole shebang.
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| 13:37 | alkisg: I am a trained teacher. I have done the job.
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| 13:37 | <alkisg> k, let's talk later, /me has to go to a seminar anyways... nice talking to you!
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| 13:38 | <elias_a> alkisg: My message was: "If you ever disrupt my class with a ringing phone I will not teach you anymore. Sign here, please!"
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| 15:13 | <tfdl> Good morning LTSP gentlemen, We are benefit from LTSP project, and especially the free support help to overcome the critical issues from this forum. We really enjoy ltsp in production here. To say thank you we just sent an email to Jim McQuillan at jam@Ltsp.org from http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/ByTheSea_2013 and ask him how we can donate/sponsor a small portion. We would like to let you know so. Thanks again everyone!
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| 15:15 | We will also write to "Success Stories" we had a good story to tell :).
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| 15:41 | <other_other_joe> 0$hizzl3
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| 15:42 | damn it
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| 15:42 | guess I'll be changing that
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| 15:43 | <slackish> you know, that would make more sense with a 4 instead of a 0.. you could just change it to that :)
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| 15:44 | <other_other_joe> haha
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| 15:44 | it's not supposed to make total sense :P
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| 16:08 | <bcdonadio> I'm unable to start a session at the thinclient, since it says "checking login information" for a while and then restart the session (timeout). The following is printed at ldm.log: "[ssh] INFO: calling rc.d pressh scripts \n [ssh] CRITICAL: no response, restarting". The SERVER and LDM_SERVER variables are with the right values (checked at runtime). Also the client does start an SSH connection with the server (checked with tcpdump), but dies shortl
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| 16:08 | y after. Am I missing something?
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| 16:09 | I'm using ltsp-cluster, btw
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| 18:19 | <bcdonadio> What is the mgmtservice in lbsconfig.xml? What service should access it?
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| 18:22 | * alkisg thinks it's time to drop the ltsp-cluster code from upstream ltsp... if it ever gets some love again, it should be in a separate package... | |
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| 18:32 | <bcdonadio> noooooo, I'm finally getting it to work :)
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| 18:34 | Indeed, I will have soon some patches to submit against ltsp-cluster...
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| 23:52 | <brandon> Quetions about LTSP, can anyone answer maybe?
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| 23:53 | <slackish> !ask
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| 23:53 | <ltsp`> ask: Don't ask to ask a question, simply ask it, and if someone knows the answer, they'll respond. Please hang around for at least a full hour after asking a question, as not everybody constantly monitors the channel.
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| 23:53 | <brandon> I'm seeing its a PXE boot-into enviorment? We're aiming for the ability to RDP into the Linux terminal server-is this possible?
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| 23:54 | <slackish> I haven't had much luck running RDP into a Linux server. There are other things you could do though, like vnc or x over ssh
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| 23:55 | <vagrantc> brandon: do you really need RDP specifically?
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| 23:56 | brandon: basically, thin clients remotely log into the server... that's how LTSP works in the default configuration.
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| 23:56 | <brandon> No not RDP specifically, just the ability to still be running the Windows client OS and not rebooting to PXE
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| 23:56 | <vagrantc> ah.
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| 23:56 | xrdp on the server might work.
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| 23:56 | not really LTSP, though
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| 23:57 | <brandon> Ok, I'll look into xrdp
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| 23:57 | <vagrantc> LTSP is really about network booting a thin client OS
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| 23:57 | <brandon> Thats what I gatherd from the website.
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| 23:58 | We have a legacy app that requires a version of Java older than dirt and IE 8
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| 23:59 | I'm thinking I can maybe get away with the linux rpm of Java and Firefox
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| 23:59 | And of course, 200 WinServer terminal server seats is costly.
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