IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 2 January 2014 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:47 | <Trey_> Hello all... I have a need to share 2 windows applications at our church. We have a high speed vpn already and need a terminal solution. I would prefer to have the clients connect via web client.
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| 01:47 | After reading the documentation, I can't find whether we can serve windows applications using ltsp
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| 08:21 | <alkisg> vagrantc: dpkg: warning: version 'generic-pae' has bad syntax: version number does not start with digit
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| 08:21 | Found linux image: /boot/vmlinuz-generic-pae
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| 08:21 | etc, i.e. the symlinks confuse grub and go in grub.cfg
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| 08:21 | We should either only put them in tftp, from ltsp-update-kernels (I think that's best), or in a subdir, e.g. pxelinux.cfg/symlinks.
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| 08:45 | <gdi2k> alkisg, I took your advice and got my super cheap and nasty 1gb switch out, but still had poor iperf scores, especially when some machines were active. turns out my lan cable tester is broken, reporting bad cables as good, and a bunch of cables are in sorry state. new tester on the way. thanks for all your help
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| 08:47 | <alkisg> gdi2k: nice catch! you're welcome
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| 09:47 | <alkisg> gdi2k: keep in mind that even one 100mbps client is enough to cause the server to pause (flow control issues)
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| 09:47 | So while benchmarking with the cheap switch, keep your 100mbps clients turned off
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| 09:48 | <gdi2k> alkisg, yes, and we actually have 4 of them. I will upgrade them to 1 gb once the cabling is all sorted out
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| 09:48 | ok got it
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| 10:13 | <prem__> hi alkisg are you there., am checking the Wireless ltsp option
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| 10:13 | am able to retrieve the required pxelinux.0 and the vmlinuz files over tftp using ipxe boot in my client machine
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| 10:14 | but as soon it shows "Decompressing linux" ., it is trying to setup the "eth0" connection and end up with IP-Config error
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| 10:14 | <prem__> i can see that i have to change the startup service in the initrd image., but what exactly i have to do
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| 10:36 | <alkisg> prem__: didn't we say that it'll be too slow that way, and it's not even worth to try it? :)
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| 10:36 | <prem__> alkisg, well am thinking to go with local usb boot only., but just wanted to try ths once..
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| 10:37 | how can i prepare a usb boot which will talk to the ltsp server and mount the filesystem alkisg
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| 10:37 | <alkisg> OK, go ahead and try it, if you have some hours/days/weeks to spend... (depending on your knowledge of involved technologies etc)
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| 10:38 | <prem__> is it enough to take the given initrd and vmlinuz images under /ltsp/i386 and use them for usb booting?
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| 10:38 | <alkisg> !local-boot
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| 10:38 | <ltsp`> local-boot: If you want LTSP fat clients on a low-speed network, you can put i386.img on e.g. C:\Boot\LTSP\i386.img and use this command line in pxelinux.cfg: APPEND ro initrd=ltsp/i386/initrd.img init=/sbin/init-ltsp root=/dev/sda1 rootflags=ro loop=/Boot/LTSP/i386.img; IPAPPEND 3
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| 10:38 | <alkisg> The main image is /opt/ltsp/images/i386.img, not just the kernel/initrd
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| 10:39 | <prem__> alkisg, will this connect with a wireless network and mount the filesystem?
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| 10:40 | <alkisg> It will mount the filesystem from the usb stick
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| 10:40 | *After* it boots, it'll have all drivers etc so yeah you can tell it to connect wherever you like
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| 10:40 | It'll even support WPA2 connections and whatever else you want
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| 10:41 | <prem__> alkisg, for user authentication and other harddisk space it has to talk to server ., right
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| 10:41 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 10:41 | <prem__> so all these can be done with this img ?
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| 10:41 | <alkisg> But that's after it boots
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| 10:41 | <prem__> okey..
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| 10:43 | so for copying this into a usb drive., is it enough to run "zcat i386.img > /dev/sdb"
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| 10:43 | will this create a bootable usb for client
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| 10:43 | <alkisg> Not zcat, either plain cat or dd
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| 10:43 | No, it won't be bootable
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| 10:44 | <alkisg> You'll have to install grub in it, and add grub.cfg
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| 10:44 | Not many people have done what you want to do, so it's not easy and not automated
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| 10:44 | <prem__> alkisg, its little confusing, can u make it bit more clear
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| 10:45 | i thought it is usb bootable till now
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| 10:45 | <alkisg> *You* need to run grub-install in it to make it bootable
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| 10:45 | LTSP doesn't provide a way to create a bootable usb key
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| 10:45 | So you have to do it with console commands on your own
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| 10:45 | <prem__> extract the i386.img ., chroot into it and install grub on it
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| 10:45 | right
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| 10:46 | <alkisg> If you use grub2, you don't even need to extract it
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| 10:46 | You could just copy it
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| 10:46 | grub supports reading the kernel and initrd from inside squashfs images
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| 10:47 | <prem__> alkisg, is there any document / wiki for this process
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| 10:47 | <alkisg> No
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| 10:49 | <alkisg> prem__: here's a very quick how-to. That's just one way, there are many many others:
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| 10:49 | 1) format your usb stick with ext4
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| 10:49 | 2) rsync -a /opt/ltsp/i386/ /media/usb-stick/
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| 10:50 | 3) grub-install --boot-directory=/media/usb-stick/boot /dev/sdb
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| 10:50 | 4) edit /media/usb-stick/boot/grub/grub.cfg to pass the correct parameters for ltsp
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| 10:50 | 5) edit /media/usb-stick/etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/* to declare your wifi connection
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| 10:51 | 6) drop an appropriate lts.conf in /media/usb-stick/etc/lts.conf
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| 10:51 | I think those should do it...
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| 10:51 | <stgraber> alkisg: ltsp merge uploaded (hopefully it'll build fine, I don't have the bandwidth to test-build here)
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| 10:51 | <prem__> alkisg, so the entries given in grub.cfg only should give the proper authentication with the server
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| 10:52 | <alkisg> stgraber: thanks, I'll check - do you have a link for your packaging handy?
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| 10:52 | <stgraber> alkisg: not really, the UDD branch for LTSP is messed up... so it's unfortunately best to just grab the .debian.tar.gz from Launchpad at this point...
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| 10:52 | <alkisg> prem__: no, grub is just for loading the kernel, the wifi connection in etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/* and lts.conf are the ones that will tell it where to connect
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| 10:53 | OK, ty
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| 10:54 | <prem__> all the given steps will boot and mount the filesystem , and the authentication with server and mounting the server filesystem space will be done through lts.conf
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| 10:55 | <alkisg> prem__: /home/username is mounted via sshfs upon login
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| 10:55 | while / (root) is the usb stick
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| 10:56 | <prem__> and ltsp will take care of mounting the home folder ?
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| 10:57 | <alkisg> Yes, ltsp mounts /home/username via sshfs upon login
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| 11:09 | <gdi2k> alkisg, if I upgrade my 100mbit clients to 1gb with new network cards, will I be able to netboot? Presumably there won't be bios options for that, so I may end up having to boot off USB or something via gpxe?
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| 11:48 | <alkisg> gdi2k: yes you'll need to put ipxe in (floppy/cd/usb/internal disk)
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| 13:52 | <||cw> gdi2k: what 1Gb cards? I've only used intel and broadcom add-ins and both supported PXE. just check your cards feature list
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| 13:53 | <gdi2k> I have D-Link cards locally available here, they're Realtek based I think
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| 13:53 | if they do, how do I make it work?
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| 13:55 | <||cw> I never had to do anything extra
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| 13:55 | maybe check bios for "other add in card" for the boot options?
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| 13:56 | <gdi2k> ok thanks, will check that out!
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| 14:05 | <alkisg> ||cw, gdi2k: intel NICs cost about 25€ (here) and have on-NIC boot ROMs. D-link, realteks etc don't have boot ROMs, so they need iPXE, and cost about 7€.
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| 14:06 | One can buy boot roms for less than 1€, and program them with ipxe, but it's difficult to find someone with an eprom programmer...
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| 14:08 | E.g. http://www.9channel.com/taobao/product-1113331985874-8.169-million-Gigabit-network-connection-started-8,169-network-adapter-PXE-boot-ROM-PXE-PXE-boot-chip-chip-chip.html
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| 14:21 | <gdi2k> I am able to get these for about 18 USD http://www.dlink.com/uk/en/business-solutions/switching/network-and-switch-accessories/nic-cards-and-media-converters/dge-528t-dge-528t-copper-gigabit-pci-card-for-pc
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| 14:21 | in the specs it says it supports remote boot rem - 'Optional remote Boot ROM (p/n DGE-528R)" will that be unique to that model, or can I just pick up a generic boot rom like you linked to?
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| 14:23 | <alkisg> All NICs support "optional boot rom"
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| 14:23 | You need a boot rom specific to that NIC
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| 14:23 | Better buy one with the rom included
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| 14:25 | <gdi2k> ok understood - will do some hunting, but I doubt I'll find that here...
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| 17:11 | <alkisg> vagrantc: Houston, we have a problem
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| 17:11 | <vagrantc> uh--oh
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| 17:11 | <alkisg> (10:21:23 πμ) alkisg: vagrantc: dpkg: warning: version 'generic-pae' has bad syntax: version number does not start with digit
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| 17:11 | (10:21:23 πμ) alkisg: Found linux image: /boot/vmlinuz-generic-pae
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| 17:11 | (10:21:23 πμ) alkisg: etc, i.e. the symlinks confuse grub and go in grub.cfg
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| 17:11 | (10:21:59 πμ) alkisg: We should either only put them in tftp, from ltsp-update-kernels (I think that's best), or in a subdir, e.g. pxelinux.cfg/symlinks.
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| 17:12 | In other words, with ltsp-pnp, after update-kernels + update-grub, the server is unbootable :D
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| 17:12 | <vagrantc> ouch
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| 17:13 | <alkisg> *subdir ==> I mean pxelinux.cfg/vmlinuz-generic, pxelinux.cfg/vmlinuz-generic-pae etc etc
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| 17:14 | But I think it's best to do the symlinks from ltsp-update-kernels
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| 17:15 | Of course we can just remove the kernel_links call for now and postpone it for ltsp6...
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| 17:16 | <vagrantc> well, the symlinks also failed to end up in the pxe menus
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| 17:16 | what's wrong with the symlinks in grub, though?
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| 17:17 | <alkisg> vagrantc: it doesn't understand the version, can't find the respective initrd, and so the first menu entry is just the kernel => unbootable
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| 17:17 | <vagrantc> ah
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| 17:18 | <alkisg> It doesn't matter much about the menus.. anyone who wants static menus will do them manually anyway
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| 17:18 | <vagrantc> moving the symlinks to ltsp-update-kernels would require moving some of those functions to ltsp-common-functions ...
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| 17:18 | <vagrantc> moving the symlinks to a subdir should be pretty easy
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| 17:19 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I think it's doable with a single small function plus the KERNEL_NAMES variable
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| 17:19 | And if the KERNEL_NAMES isn't defined, we can just skip creating the symlinks
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| 17:20 | <vagrantc> sounds reasonable
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| 17:20 | <alkisg> Hmm although the INITRD_NAME isn't defined
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| 17:20 | OK we'll need to define that too
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| 17:20 | Gimme 5' to create the function...
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| 17:20 | <vagrantc> so basically those symlinks are breaking ltsp-pnp
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| 17:21 | <alkisg> Yes, or any chroot that is somehow bootable with grub
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| 17:21 | (e.g. VM)
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| 17:21 | <vagrantc> naming the symlinks such that grub or other bootloaders wouldn't use them would also work
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| 17:21 | i.e. ltsp-vmlinuz-generic
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| 17:22 | but moving them to ltsp-update-kernels seems like a lot of potential for breakage
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| 17:22 | alkisg: is that the only problem you've found so far?
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| 17:23 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 17:23 | But I didn't yet do extensive testing
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| 17:23 | <vagrantc> i guess that kind of blocks extensive testing a bit ... :)
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| 17:23 | * alkisg plans to deploy all the new ltsp, ldm, ltspfs versions to schools | |
| 17:25 | <alkisg> vagrantc: what kind of breakage?
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| 17:26 | We can just omit the kernel_links call, it's not that important to have symlinks before ltsp6...
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| 17:26 | <vagrantc> that would be easy, sure.
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| 17:26 | but it would be just as easy to rename the files or move then to a subdir
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| 17:26 | which would at least give something
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| 17:26 | since the code is basically there
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| 17:28 | <alkisg> About the subdir, I'm worried that the extra paths add complexity to the command line
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| 17:31 | <vagrantc> how about renamed files? i.e. ltsp-vmlinuz-FOO
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| 17:31 | i bet that would work around the problem with grub
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| 17:32 | <alkisg> ltsp-* do work around the problem with grub...
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| 17:32 | In ltsp6, we'll do the symlinks from ltsp-update-kernels, right?
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| 17:32 | Why not just do it now?
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| 17:32 | <vagrantc> if you think it's not too much work
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| 17:33 | <alkisg> Btw where did that "vmlinuz" symlink come from? From the kernel postinst itself?
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| 17:33 | <vagrantc> yeah
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| 17:33 | in /etc/kernel-img.conf something sets do_symlinks=true
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| 17:33 | but i don't think that's default anymore
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| 17:34 | alkisg: another workaround ... vmlinuz-1-generic ...
| |
| 17:34 | i.e. always include a digit in the version
| |
| 17:34 | * alkisg thought of that too, vmlinuz-0-generic | |
| 17:34 | <vagrantc> or vmlinuz-3-generic
| |
| 17:34 | well, no, then when it's vmlinux 4.x it'd break
| |
| 17:34 | <alkisg> It's not default, we put it there ourselves
| |
| 17:35 | <vagrantc> for a single-kernel install, the vmlinuz symlink works for a generic symlink
| |
| 17:35 | <alkisg> (we can stop putting it there if we create vmlinuz from ltsp-update-kernels...)
| |
| 17:35 | <vagrantc> true enough
| |
| 17:36 | although i don't think we should mess with the vmlinuz symlink ...
| |
| 17:36 | old chroots will have it, for example
| |
| 17:37 | <alkisg> I'd like us to mess with it for the following reason: we can do it better :D
| |
| 17:37 | ...i.e.:
| |
| 17:37 | a) I have kernel 3.2
| |
| 17:37 | b) I install 3.5
| |
| 17:37 | c) I remove 3.5
| |
| 17:37 | => I have a broken vmlinuz symlink
| |
| 17:37 | (with the current kernel postinst code)
| |
| 17:38 | <vagrantc> yes, but if we "do it better" and then ltsp-update-kernels keeps copying the old one back into place...
| |
| 17:38 | then we get into exclusion games
| |
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| 17:38 | <vagrantc> that's why i realized the best way to update the pxelinux.cfg/default was to not generate it in the chroot at all
| |
| 17:38 | <alkisg> ltsp-update-kernels will create vmlinuz in the tftp dir, nowhere else
| |
| 17:39 | <vagrantc> right, and an old chroot will have vmlinuz as well, and copy over it
| |
| 17:39 | <alkisg> First copy, then create symlinks
| |
| 17:39 | <vagrantc> and symlinks have... interesting behavior
| |
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| 17:44 | <vagrantc> alkisg: if you think it's worth rewriting it a bit, go for it... we're not too deep into it yet
| |
| 17:44 | alkisg: but that seems more code than i'd want to put into 5.5
| |
| 17:45 | * alkisg rewrites kernel_links to only need KERNEL_NAMES + INITRD_NAME, and we'll judge if it's suitable for ltsp5.5 when it's done... | |
| 17:46 | <vagrantc> sure
| |
| 17:53 | <alkisg> vagrantc: http://pastie.org/8594034
| |
| 17:53 | It has some debugging code, e.g. echo in front of "ln"
| |
| 17:56 | Maybe we prefer initrd_name() to be a function instead of a variable...
| |
| 17:56 | Although that's kind of ugly in a conffile
| |
| 18:02 | * vagrantc seems to recall "local" behaving differently in different shells | |
| 18:02 | <alkisg> vagrantc: no that was only for "local -"
| |
| 18:03 | ..but I forgot to update that line with the variables needed, sorry :)
| |
| 18:03 | local tftp last_flavor
| |
| 18:03 | (the other variables are in a subshell so they don't need to be local)
| |
| 18:06 | <vagrantc> alkisg: maybe find instead of ls, so could could exclude symlinks easily
| |
| 18:06 | alkisg: you'll want to make the symlink a relative one
| |
| 18:07 | ln -sf $(dirname $file)
| |
| 18:07 | or use shell subsitutions
| |
| 18:08 | <alkisg> vagrantc: afaik it's relative...
| |
| 18:08 | <vagrantc> alkisg: so basically, that loops through the flavors, making a symlink for the first (i.e. newest version) found
| |
| 18:08 | <alkisg> $ sh ~/tmp/kernel-symlinks
| |
| 18:08 | flavor=generic-pae, last_flavor=
| |
| 18:08 | ln -sf vmlinuz-3.2.0-51-generic-pae /boot/vmlinuz-generic-pae
| |
| 18:08 | <vagrantc> alkisg: ah, ok.
| |
| 18:08 | <alkisg> Yes, and additionally it creates the vmlinuz symlink for the first kernel found
| |
| 18:09 | It doesn't take the preferred kernels order into account though... I don't know if it should, or if we should deprecate the ordering
| |
| 18:10 | <vagrantc> well, i'd rather not touch the vmlinuz symlink
| |
| 18:11 | <alkisg> ln -s || true then?
| |
| 18:11 | So, if it exists, don't create it?
| |
| 18:11 | (or plain if [ -e vmlinuz ]...
| |
| 18:11 | ! -e
| |
| 18:11 | <ltsp`> Error: "-e" is not a valid command.
| |
| 18:11 | <vagrantc> then it won't get updated if it wasn't in the chroot
| |
| 18:12 | it'll be stuck on the first time it was run
| |
| 18:12 | <alkisg> True, nice catch. We could check if it's dangling, but it gets messy.
| |
| 18:12 | <vagrantc> and it might just be pointing to a present, but very old kernel
| |
| 18:13 | alkisg: i just don't think it's worth messing with
| |
| 18:13 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I think we shouldn't modify the kernel postinst config in ltsp6
| |
| 18:14 | So the vmlinuz symlink won't get generated at all
| |
| 18:14 | <vagrantc> yes.
| |
| 18:14 | and we could even drop it from 5.5
| |
| 18:14 | but i don't think we should mess with the link if it is present
| |
| 18:14 | * vagrantc forgets where that is even created | |
| 18:15 | <alkisg> ./ltsp-trunk/server/share/ltsp/plugins/ltsp-build-client/Debian/020-kernel-img-conf: if [ -f "$ROOT/etc/kernel-img.conf" ]; then
| |
| 18:15 | <vagrantc> it's in ... tat
| |
| 18:16 | i think it'd be fine to just remove that plugin
| |
| 18:17 | wow. that code hasn't been touched since otavio and i wrote it in 2006
| |
| 18:18 | i don't think it's needed on wheezy ... i think it would break squeeze chroots.
| |
| 18:18 | but that's easy enough to apply manually to fix them
| |
| 18:19 | <alkisg> Btw ltsp-pnp doesn't have the appropriate kernel-img.conf file, so I wonder why I'm getting the vmlinuz symlink
| |
| 18:20 | <vagrantc> maybe ubuntu creates it by default?
| |
| 18:20 | <alkisg> Ah no I have a script for that
| |
| 18:20 | ./client/Debian/share/ltsp/cleanup.d/50-vmlinuz
| |
| 18:20 | <vagrantc> ah
| |
| 18:23 | <alkisg> vagrantc: so, which way do you wanna do it for ltsp5.5?
| |
| 18:24 | Omit creating the symlinks? Put 0 as the version? Rename the symlinks? Create them from ltsp-update-kernels?
| |
| 18:24 | I don't like the "0 as the version" solution, it would get ltsp-pnp users a weird entry in their grub.cfg
| |
| 18:25 | <vagrantc> alkisg: the code you pasted looks good (although i'd use find instead of ls and exclude symlinks).
| |
| 18:25 | <alkisg> Np, I can change it to use find
| |
| 18:25 | And just omit the vmlinuz symlink too?
| |
| 18:25 | <vagrantc> alkisg: yeah, i'd rather just omit it
| |
| 18:26 | <alkisg> OK, no problem
| |
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| 18:30 | <alkisg> vagrantc: http://pastie.org/8594097
| |
| 18:32 | <vagrantc> ah, using find instead of ls requires basename
| |
| 18:35 | <alkisg> vagrantc: why? -printf "%f" should do it...
| |
| 18:36 | <vagrantc> because i had a simpler/stupider find :)
| |
| 18:36 | <alkisg> :)
| |
| 18:36 | No need to do the same work twice; you can do the integration instead!
| |
| 18:38 | <vagrantc> alkisg: looks good.
| |
| 18:38 | * alkisg also wants to commit http://pastie.org/8594116 | |
| 18:39 | <vagrantc> how's that?
| |
| 18:41 | <alkisg> That, supposedly, allows nbd-disconnect to work with any nbd root device, not just /dev/nbd0
| |
| 18:41 | <vagrantc> alkisg: technically, i think it should use the last root= argument on the commandline
| |
| 18:41 | alkisg: so removing the break, while slightly slower, i think would be more correct.
| |
| 18:42 | <alkisg> Nice, ok
| |
| 18:42 | <vagrantc> alkisg: and you would want to exclude root= from the swapoff stuff, no?
| |
| 18:42 | <alkisg> vagrantc: it won't show up in /proc/swaps
| |
| 18:44 | <vagrantc> oh, it's just reading from /proc/swaps
| |
| 18:44 | so it won't support root-on-swap, but that doesn't exist as far as i know :)
| |
| 18:44 | <alkisg> The issue left is that "echo >&2" does nothing with upstart, unless "console output" is specified in the upstart job
| |
| 18:46 | I could include the lsb-init functions... but I'd hate having to test it again :D
| |
| 18:46 | The messages are not important anyway
| |
| 18:47 | Shutting down NOW, and then it shuts down after a few msec, so there's no time to see the message anyway
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| 19:02 | <bennabiy> alkisg or vagrantc: Are the 5.5 changes going to affect anything which I need to be watching for on LinuxMint?
| |
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| 19:09 | <alkisg> bennabiy: I don't think so, a small testing should be all that's needed
| |
| 19:09 | <bennabiy> great
| |
| 19:10 | Do you know why trusty would fail to build?
| |
| 19:20 | <alkisg> bennabiy: what failed to build?
| |
| 19:20 | James_Epp has joined IRC (James_Epp!~Thunderbi@001dcf920408.cpe.westmancom.com) | |
| 19:22 | <James_Epp> I feel conflicted between installing the ltsp-server package or the ltsp-server-standalone variant. On this thread (http://askubuntu.com/questions/214058/what-is-the-difference-between-ltsp-server-and-ltsp-server-standalone-packages) user Rinzwind says that ltsp-server-standalone package adds on a lot of features such as remote sound, network swap, and the like. Does the ltsp-server package have these as well? If not, can I install them
| |
| 19:22 | to avoid conflicts.
| |
| 19:23 | <vagrantc> the ltsp-server-standalone just includes additional package dependencies, and a dhcpd.conf file that automatically configures your dhcp server
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| 19:24 | <James_Epp> vagrantc: So there is no harm in end-user functionality if I use the ltsp-server package?
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| 19:24 | <vagrantc> James_Epp: as long as you install all the dependencies for features they want tto use
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| 19:25 | <alkisg> If you don't have a very specific reason not to select ltsp-server-standalone (like e.g. if you have an external dhcp server), prefer it over ltsp-server...
| |
| 19:25 | <vagrantc> ltsp-server package is useful when your LTSP server is not your application server, or if you're just using fatclients.
| |
| 19:25 | * vagrantc agrees with alkisg | |
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| 19:25 | <vagrantc> alkisg: always approaching it from the correct angle :)
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| 19:26 | <alkisg> :)
| |
| 19:26 | <James_Epp> vagrantc: Could I just as well install ltsp-server-standalone and then remove and purge isc-dhcp-server* ?
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| 19:27 | <alkisg> apt-get install --no-install-recommends ltsp-server-standalone
| |
| 19:27 | (to avoid the isc-dhcp-server)
| |
| 19:27 | * vagrantc thought it was a dependency | |
| 19:27 | <James_Epp> alkisg: The recommends for ltsp-server-standalone only includes ltsp-docs
| |
| 19:27 | <alkisg> James_Epp: which version?
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| 19:27 | <James_Epp> isc-dhcp-server is depends under this page http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/ltsp-server-standalone
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| 19:27 | <alkisg> (ubuntu version)
| |
| 19:27 | OK I was looking at precise
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| 19:28 | <alkisg> Meh it's tiresome now... old ubuntu deps, new ubuntu deps, still not in sync with debian...
| |
| 19:28 | <James_Epp> But I should be safe just removing dhcp afterwards, correct? There won't be any future repercussions?
| |
| 19:29 | <vagrantc> isn't dnsmasq installed by default? that should satisfy the dependency
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| 19:29 | James_Epp: that would also remove ltsp-server-standalone
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| 19:31 | <James_Epp> Darn.
| |
| 19:31 | <vagrantc> James_Epp: i'd just disable the dhcp features of whichever DHCP server it pulls in
| |
| 19:31 | weather isc-dhcp or dnsmasq
| |
| 19:31 | <alkisg> ...why quantal?! :)
| |
| 19:31 | <James_Epp> Do you know how to disable isc-dhcp-server? In my experience, I could not find out how. (I also have 0 experience with upstart) so I just added a stop line in /etc/rc.local. Very dirty, me no like.
| |
| 19:31 | <alkisg> dnsmasq isn't installed by default, dnsmasq-base is
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| 19:33 | <James_Epp> Okay. Thanks guys. I'll see what I can do with this.
| |
| 19:34 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i don't think it includes recommends for most features
| |
| 19:34 | <alkisg> vagrantc: http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/ltsp-server
| |
| 19:34 | Green bullets there
| |
| 19:35 | <vagrantc> alkisg: pulseaudio?
| |
| 19:36 | alkisg: it doesn't recommend ldm-server ...
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| 19:36 | <vagrantc> or ltspfs
| |
| 19:39 | does upstart generally make use of /etc/default/SERVICENAME ?
| |
| 19:41 | installing just ltsp-server and manually installing all the dependencies requires knowing which dependencies you want...
| |
| 19:41 | <James_Epp> vagrantc: I know that /etc/default/isc-dhcp-server is generated on its install.
| |
| 19:42 | I think my gameplan as of now is going to be to install standalone, then play with upstart to stop dhcp from starting.
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| 19:43 | <vagrantc> James_Epp: alternately, if you already have a dhcp server on the network, install dnsmasq and set it up to do proxydhcp
| |
| 19:43 | !proxydhcp
| |
| 19:43 | <ltsp> proxydhcp: A proxy DHCP server is defined by the PXE specification as a server which sends auxiliary boot information to clients, like the boot filename, tftp server or rootpath, but leaves the task of IP leasing to the normal DHCP server. More info: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
| |
| 19:44 | <alkisg> dhcp shouldn't even start by default unless you edit the range in the file to match your actual range
| |
| 19:44 | <vagrantc> but the default matches many default home router network ranges
| |
| 19:44 | <alkisg> pulseaudio should be a dependency of *ubuntu-desktop...
| |
| 19:44 | <vagrantc> at least on ubuntu
| |
| 19:44 | <James_Epp> alkisg: You have a point, but LTSP has a default dhcpd.conf from what I know.
| |
| 19:44 | <alkisg> 192.168.0.x
| |
| 19:44 | If you have that, ok, if you don't, it won't start
| |
| 19:45 | <vagrantc> James_Epp: you'll also need to configure your DHCP server to have appropriate network boot settings... unless you use proxydhcp
| |
| 19:45 | <James_Epp> vagrantc: I understand PXE relationships quite well.
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| 19:46 | <alkisg> vagrantc: ls /boot on a gentoo live cd: http://paste.debian.net/73871
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| 19:47 | <vagrantc> alkisg: that looks fun.
| |
| 19:48 | <alkisg> vagrantc: it's ok, it's still sed-able
| |
| 19:48 | 3.3.0-gentoo-r1 == version, -x86=flavor
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| 20:03 | <vagrantc> alkisg: so, are you working on getting the kernel_links moved into ltsp-update-kernels?
| |
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| 20:11 | <alkisg> vagrantc: ah sorry I thought you were going to do the integration... should I?
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| 20:20 | <vagrantc> alkisg: oh, i can work on it
| |
| 20:26 | <alkisg> Wow, `cp -r --no-preserve=mode` didn't work until about a year ago..!
| |
| 20:26 | There's no way to cp a dir _without_ preserving the files modes?!!
| |
| 20:26 | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/coreutils/+bug/379233
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| 20:50 | <vagrantc> could switch to rsync ...
| |
| 20:51 | if the workarounds start becoming more complicated than using a more fitting tool...
| |
| 21:00 | <alkisg> rsync should work way better, yeah
| |
| 21:00 | So if e.g. someone has 20 old kernels, it would only copy the most recent one etc
| |
| 21:01 | And with --delete, it'll work for the "reverting to older chroot" case too
| |
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| 21:03 | <vagrantc> delete will wipe out pxelinux.cfg
| |
| 21:04 | we should probably stick with "cp -a" and workarounds for ltsp 5.5.x
| |
| 21:05 | alkisg: it may be a bit before i get to the kernel_links stuff
| |
| 21:07 | <alkisg> No worries, schools open on Wednesday, it'd just be nice to upload something to the PPA before then
| |
| 21:08 | <vagrantc> ok
| |
| 21:08 | * alkisg prepares a patch to lower udhcpc to recommends:... | |
| 21:10 | <vagrantc> alkisg: so, the kernel_names and and initrd_name need to be in the chroot, yes?
| |
| 21:10 | the configuration for that
| |
| 21:11 | <alkisg> vagrantc: yes, and ltsp-update-kernels needs to source update-kernels.conf
| |
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| 21:11 | <vagrantc> ok.
| |
| 21:11 | <alkisg> unset KERNEL_NAMES INITRD_NAME; . $CHROOT/etgc/update-kernels.conf; if [ -n "$KERNEL_NAMES" ]...
| |
| 21:19 | vagrantc: I only see "pulseaudio" as suggested by ltsp-server, not in Recommends or Depends...
| |
| 21:19 | <vagrantc> right
| |
| 21:20 | and that's, as far as i'm concerned, how it should be.
| |
| 21:20 | <alkisg> Ah, ok, I thought above ^ you said that it should be recommented
| |
| 21:20 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i said it won't get pulled in because it's not recommended
| |
| 21:20 | or at least meant to say that
| |
| 21:21 | <alkisg> I thought you were comparing "ltsp-server-standalone, which would pull pulseaudio" to "ltsp-server, which wouldn't pull pulseaudio"
| |
| 21:21 | But both of them won't pull it...
| |
| 21:22 | Anyways, ok, just wanted to see if something was amiss
| |
| 21:22 | <vagrantc> ah
| |
| 21:23 | * vagrantc wonders if it's in ldm-server, where it belongs anyways | |
| 21:23 | <bennabiy> alkisg: sorry, missed your question. My recipe of ltsp based on your greek schools packaging.
| |
| 21:23 | for my ppa
| |
| 21:23 | <alkisg> bennabiy: link?
| |
| 21:25 | <bennabiy> rerequesting build now. one minute
| |
| 21:26 | https://code.launchpad.net/~bennabiy/+recipe/ltsp-daily
| |
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| 21:29 | <alkisg> bennabiy: I don't see any failed builds there...
| |
| 21:29 | <bennabiy> I deleted the one, that is why I am re-requesting
| |
| 21:29 | <alkisg> dpkg-source: error: can't build with source format '3.0 (native)': native package version may not have a revision
| |
| 21:29 | <bennabiy> if you have an email I can mail you the message I was sent about it
| |
| 21:30 | <alkisg> bennabiy: https://code.launchpad.net/~alkisg/+recipe/ltsp-daily
| |
| 21:30 | See the recipe text there
| |
| 21:30 | Also, you can just copy the packages from my ppa to yours, instead of using recipes...
| |
| 21:31 | <bennabiy> How do I do that? Download and then re-upload them? or is there a way to do that all in launchpad?
| |
| 21:32 | Sometimes I make custom tests based on my branch, testing things for mint
| |
| 21:32 | <alkisg> https://launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/+archive/proposed/+copy-packages
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| 21:32 | That's the greek schools "proposed" ppa, and this is the normal one: https://launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/+archive/ppa/+copy-packages
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| 21:33 | For example, now the proposed ppa does have ltsp 5.5, but we've found out it has an issue, so it won't be copied to the real ppa
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| 21:33 | <bennabiy> right now it is synced with upstream, but I plan on testing some things soon.
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| 21:33 | Ok
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| 21:34 | What issues does 5.5 have right now?
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| 21:34 | <alkisg> For ltsp-pnp, some symlinks created in /boot mess up grub configuration
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| 21:34 | <bennabiy> what about non ltsp-pnp
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| 21:35 | thin-client environment
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| 21:35 | <alkisg> The symlinks there don't matter
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| 21:35 | So it's fine there
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| 21:36 | <bennabiy> Ok.
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| 21:37 | Got scared for a minute :)
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| 21:51 | <bennabiy> Trying now... back later.
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| 22:18 | <alkisg> ltsp-client-core: lower udhcpc to X-Ubuntu-Recommends: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/sch-scripts/ltsp-debian-packaging/revision/1192
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| 22:18 | ...I'm not sure if it's worth the trouble of committing it though... it's a minor thing
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| 22:26 | Here's a better command that double sorts the results, so that -generic is listed before -generic-pae, or -486 before -686, or x86 before x86-64...
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| 22:26 | ls /boot | sed -n "$KERNEL_NAMES" | sort -V -k 4,4 | sort -r -k 3,3
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| 22:27 | <alkisg> ...so that in pxelinux we list the "lesser" kernels first, without the complexity of LIST_KERNELS_*.
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| 22:27 | ifcpu* is still left up to the user...
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| 22:32 | vagrantc: ltsp-localappsd is running by default on fat clients... does that make sense? E.g. for ..remoteapps to be able to launch localapps?!
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| 22:48 | <vagrantc> alkisg: when you get into mimetypes and whatnot? yeah...
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| 22:49 | i.e. program X opens filetye y that's handled by program Z
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| 22:49 | <alkisg> vagrantc: so that's on purpose, not a mistake? ok...
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| 22:49 | <vagrantc> i can see it being needed ... it's kind of messy, yes.
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| 22:50 | <alkisg> Next task, for tomorrow... we need lts.conf directives to run things at INITRD/INIT/RC/DM/PRELOGIN/LOGIN/SESSION/LOGOUT
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| 22:50 | ...and I want to find the proper names for all those
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| 22:50 | e.g. RUN_DM_0, RUN_LOGIN_1, or e.g. LOGIN_COMMAND_2 ?
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| 22:53 | <alkisg> INITRD=commands to run at initramfs, INIT=init-ltsp.d, RC=ltsp-core, DM (or should it be X instead?) = ldm, lightdm... for e.g. XRANDR_MODE_0,
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| 22:53 | PRELOGIN=just before login, to check e.g. the servers CPU for load balancing, LOGIN=right after login, to e.g. clear guest files, SESSION=from /etc/xdg/autostart, and LOGOUT=to cleanup stuff
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| 22:56 | <||cw> hm. why do all the howto's say to "/etc/init.d/isc-dhcp-server restart" but doing so errors and doens't seem to restart the dhcpd process that's running? did I mess something up, or did something change recently?
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| 22:56 | <alkisg> ||cw: distro/version?
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| 22:56 | <||cw> saucy
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| 22:56 | <alkisg> sudo service isc... restart
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| 22:57 | If it errors, then something's wrong
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| 22:57 | Press <tab> in isc for autocompletion
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| 23:05 | <alkisg> vagrantc: btw we have some commands with a single digit, e.g. PRINTER_0_DEVICE, XRANDR_MODE_0, and some with double digit, e.g. RCFILE_01...
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| 23:05 | Should I make them all single-digit in ltsp-docs, and accept both single and double digit in lts.conf?
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| 23:05 | $ env | sed '/^FSTAB_[0-9]*=/!d' | sort -V
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_00=00
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_0=0
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_01=01
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_1=1
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_9=9
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| 23:05 | FSTAB_20=20
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| 23:07 | *accept both single and double digit in lts.conf ==> of course I mean from the client-side code that processes them...
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| 23:07 | <vagrantc> alkisg: long-term yes, short-term ... ?
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| 23:08 | <alkisg> Sure, why not short term?
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| 23:08 | I don't see any breaking of compatibility
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| 23:08 | <vagrantc> sure
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| 23:08 | <alkisg> Well, at least from the side of the code
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| 23:08 | No need to update the docs for ltsp5.5...
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| 23:08 | <vagrantc> there are probably some updates for ltsp 5.5 that are needed
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| 23:09 | <alkisg> OK, but we'll rewrite much of ltsp-docs for ltsp6, and I'd hate to do the same work twice
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| 23:43 | <alkisg> Fun :) http://paste.debian.net/73903/
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| 23:49 | <vagrantc> alkisg: i do recall removing a lot of sed/awk/grep calls and replacing with striaght shell having a notable speed improvement at one point
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| 23:50 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I don't like 01 02 03 ...
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| 23:50 | I prefer VAR_<any number>
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| 23:50 | * vagrantc too | |
| 23:50 | <alkisg> So, sed is necessary to do that
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| 23:50 | Sort is necessary to sort the numbers
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| 23:50 | So... :-/
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| 23:51 | vagrantc: my current diff: >> /etc/rc.local
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| 23:51 | Meh
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| 23:51 | http://pastie.org/8594874
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| 23:51 | Errr ignore udhcpcc
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| 23:51 | <vagrantc> would that also negatively impact say ... X_MOD_0=foo=bar ?
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| 23:52 | ah, it's any number of numbers, till =
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| 23:52 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 23:53 | <vagrantc> but with your code it supports an arbitrary number of arguments
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| 23:53 | <alkisg> Yup, and we don't care how many digits they have, 00 or plain 0
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| 23:54 | What we could do for a bit of speedup, is to cache the output of "env | sort -V"
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| 23:54 | I.e. I could write an "sorted_env" function that caches the result in a variable
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| 23:54 | <vagrantc> alkisg: init-ltsp.d/20-modules looks like a huge improvement
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| 23:55 | <alkisg> Yeah it's more readable that way
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| 23:55 | I just hope there are no regressions anywhere...
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| 23:58 | <alkisg> All those env | sort would delay client booting for about 1/100 sec... not sure if it's worth it to put them in a function
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