IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 21 January 2017 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:36 | <markit> well, almost all the important stuff has been removed , I have to reinstall from scratch :(
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| 00:36 | maybe tomorrow
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| 00:36 | bye
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| 11:49 | <markit> alkisg: hi, update did not go well. Is it enough if I backup /home, then /etc/passwd,groups to restore later? I will install with the same user that will take the same UID
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| 12:47 | <quinox> markit: you could also setup a separate tiny server just for thhe printer running 16.04
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| 12:48 | although I guess you already tried upgrading so that won't help
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| 13:14 | <alkisg> markit: why did you use aptitude and autoremoved packages?
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| 13:15 | If some new package was missing, you should have just installed that...
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| 13:15 | In general, if you are trying something with apt, and you see that it wants to remove 1234 packages, DONT press yes :D
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| 13:15 | You can backup etc/passwd,group,shadow and gshadow, yes,
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| 13:15 | but I don't know of any tools that will merge them with the new ones except for sch-scripts
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| 13:16 | You can't overwrite the new ones with the old ones, merging is needed.
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| 13:41 | <markit> alkisg: I did not used aptitude autoremove, I aptitude full-upgrade and then, to check dependencies problems, aptitude -f install
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| 13:42 | aptitude said that a lot of packages should have been removed, I was unable to figure out why (since everything was present at the right vesion) and at a certain point it just started removing (due probably to my mistake with a confirmation)
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| 13:44 | btw, I need a clarification about the ppa needed for epoptes... add-apt-repository ppa:ts.sch.gr or just add-apt-repository ppa:epoptes/ppa ? Is the former better since there are others fixes as well?
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| 13:55 | <markit> mmm rsync -avHS /home root@192.168.1.30:/srv/copy works but du -csh is 9GB in the source, 6.6 in the destination... scaring
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| 13:59 | <alkisg> markit, the ts.sch.gr ppa also provides newer ltsp versions, while the epoptes ppa only newer epoptes versions
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| 14:00 | markit, I think it'll be best to avoid aptitude completely in the future...
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| 14:01 | <markit> alkisg: the update process failed leaving the system in a bad state
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| 14:01 | <alkisg> markit, what was the error message?
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| 14:01 | <markit> also you don't know what to do since the console stops and if you press "enter" it tells you "r" to resume the window or "don'tremember" to abort
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| 14:02 | <alkisg> Yes if it stops it's a pain afterwards
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| 14:02 | <markit> a simple one, I don't remember, but like "====the upgrade process failed with error code 1 ========"
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| 14:02 | <alkisg> One common failure issue is bad packages from weird repositories, before you upgrade
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| 14:02 | (the ts.sch.gr/epoptes repositories are fine)
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| 14:03 | <markit> in the meanwhile I sow some scaring messages during the upgrade about packages missing or versions not good about basic packages that should have had no problems at all
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| 14:03 | <alkisg> ...and those packages then have unmet dependencies in newer ubuntu versions
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| 14:03 | <markit> alkisg: probably the kde backports I always use
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| 14:04 | sometime I don't understand aptitude, like yesterday, it told that package X needed package Y at version i.e. >= 5, but package Y WAS at 5.something
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| 14:04 | so aptitude -f install should have been ok
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| 14:04 | and I had no idea about how to fix somethign looked not broken
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| 14:05 | <alkisg> markit, you could still fix it if you wanted
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| 14:05 | i.e. just install the missing packages, kubuntu-desktop or something should pull them in
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| 14:06 | <markit> I did, aptitude reinstall plasma-desktop
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| 14:06 | <alkisg> ...stop using aptitude? :D
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| 14:06 | I don't think plasma-desktop is all of it
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| 14:06 | <markit> why? should be apt on steroids
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| 14:06 | <alkisg> That should be just the desktop environment
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| 14:06 | Isn't there a kubuntu-desktop?
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| 14:06 | <markit> no more
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| 14:07 | or, yes, there is but is not installed by default
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| 14:07 | if you install kubuntu from ISO, that package is not installed
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| 14:07 | <alkisg> You can compare the package list from a live cd and your installation
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| 14:07 | <markit> (time ago it was the "kubuntu way of kde default packages, you are right)
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| 14:08 | alkisg: I don't have the records of the problems, but really was a weird situation with complains about things that were there and at right version
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| 14:08 | <alkisg> plasma-desktop's description is "tools and widgets for the desktop",
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| 14:08 | that doesn't sound like a complete de to me
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| 14:09 | What's the output of `apt install kubuntu-desktop`?
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| 14:09 | <markit> I've a "fresh" install of kubuntu 16.04 and kubuntu-desktop is not installed at all
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| 14:09 | <alkisg> without pressing "yes" after that
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| 14:09 | It will mention a list of packages that will be installed
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| 14:09 | Put them to pastebin, maybe we'll some something important missing from your setup
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| 14:10 | *we'll see
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| 14:10 | <markit> it would install a lot of packages related i.e. to PIM, kmail etc and will produce some inconsistencies
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| 14:10 | <alkisg> Can you try it and put it to pastebin without pressing yes?
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| 14:10 | <markit> in any case, my ltsp server is broken now since a huge amount of packages were removed, or do you think we could try to "save" it?
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| 14:11 | <alkisg> Sure, it's just packages
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| 14:11 | You can get the list from a live cd, and just replicate it to your setup
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| 14:11 | <markit> ok, but I don't want the stuff kubuntu-desktop is going to install
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| 14:14 | <markit> alkisg: http://pastebin.com/vuR7vbke
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| 14:16 | this was removed yesterday http://pastebin.com/99FiGph0
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| 14:16 | <alkisg> markit, you still have a ppa that breaks things...
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| 14:16 | <markit> how can you tell?
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| 14:17 | <alkisg> kde-baseapps-bin : Depends: kde-baseapps-data (= 4:15.12.3-0ubuntu1) but 4:16.04.3-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04~ppa63 is installed.
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| 14:17 | Ubuntu doesn't ship apps with ~ppa in their version...
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| 14:17 | And as you can see, things like apparmor and network-manager are not installed
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| 14:17 | No wonder it doesn't work...
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| 14:17 | <markit> "~ppa63" part you mean?
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| 14:17 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 14:18 | That comes from a ppa
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| 14:18 | <markit> but what about "plasma-desktop : Breaks: plasma-widgets-addons (< 4:5.6.0~) but 4:5.5.5-0ubuntu1 is to be installed."
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| 14:18 | <alkisg> That's aptitude
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| 14:18 | There was a reason it's not default anywhere
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| 14:18 | <markit> says that it needs < 4:5.6.0~ but will be installed 4:5.5.5-0ubuntu1 so should be ok no?
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| 14:18 | <alkisg> And people prefer apt
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| 14:18 | Try with apt instead, like I said above
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| 14:19 | aptitude is not apt on steroids
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| 14:19 | It's adifferent, less maintained, implementation
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| 14:19 | <markit> so sad, I don't know apt as well as aptitude
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| 14:20 | <markit> I will have to change my installation script too
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| 14:20 | <alkisg> Also, I don't see any kmail getting installed there
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| 14:20 | I would say, install kubuntu-desktop, and if it works, you can then see if you want to remove a couple of apps
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| 14:20 | but first, remove the ppa
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| 14:21 | <markit> the ppa has put me on latest kde, so if I remove it will have the repo to point to the older version and a lot of newer version installed instead
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| 14:22 | <alkisg> Right, first remove all the ppa and the new version stuff
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| 14:22 | That's what breaks things
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| 14:22 | <markit> btw, in the desktop installation if I use apt instead of aptitude it does not complain about broken stuff
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| 14:22 | <alkisg> Once you have a smoothly running system, then do a backup, and then add the crazy ppas :)
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| 14:22 | <markit> alkisg: seems easier and safer reinstall from scratch
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| 14:23 | <alkisg> You will still not have the ppa there
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| 14:23 | Whatever works for you
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| 14:23 | <markit> btw I've to run to pick up my son, be back later
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| 14:23 | alkisg: thanks a lot, will experiment later
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| 14:23 | but I fear at the end having some important stuff missing, teachers are too unskilled to help fix even trivial thing
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| 14:24 | <alkisg> You can easily compare packages from a live cd and from the installation
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| 14:24 | If you have the same packages, then it's the same system
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| 14:25 | It's not windows... :)
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| 14:49 | <markit> ocram
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| 14:49 | :)
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| 15:06 | mmm seems that with apt you can have the list of installed packages but not the one explicitly installed, so in the other system you will install all those including dependencies
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| 15:10 | correction, apt-mark showmanual should do the trick
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| 15:20 | <markit> mmm seems also that some ppa have been set with a # so disabled, what a mess :(
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| 15:20 | that could explain the difficult of making the system consistent
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| 15:22 | <markit> dns also seems broken :(
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| 15:43 | <markit> seems that dnsmasq does not work well with resolvconf or something broken
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| 15:59 | <markit> ok, there si a bug in dnsmasq with a strange race condition, if I restart it, it works
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| 16:04 | <markit> wondering how this stuff contributed to a broken upgrade (new ppa commented out, dns resolution broken, etc)
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| 16:24 | <quinox> for me dist-upgrade disables all PPAs before doing it's magic, I need to reenable them afterwards
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| 17:49 | <markit> quinox: that has been done, dist-upgraded disabled the 14.04 one, I recreated so were named ...ppa-xenial.list, the content had only deb-src and also with a remark in front
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| 18:10 | <quinox> is your DNS still broken?
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| 18:13 | I've performed many weird ubuntu upgrades
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| 18:14 | one of my machines didn't have nearly enough diskspace to perform the upgrade, I used to force the upgrade, get it broken midway, clean up diskspace, resume upgrade etc.
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| 18:14 | <markit> quinox: is an issue with dnsmasq + resolverconf, I've solved forcing in dnsmasq.conf the upstream dns server
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| 18:14 | <quinox> I managed to succesfully do that at least 3 times
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| 18:14 | <markit> is probably a bug
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| 18:14 | <alkisg> markit, did you do the ltsp-pnp page instructions?
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| 18:14 | <quinox> ok
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| 18:14 | <alkisg> About fixing dnsmasq dns issues?
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| 18:14 | <markit> alkisg: not pnp here
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| 18:15 | <alkisg> So?
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| 18:15 | If you're using dnsmasq, you need the workaround
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| 18:15 | <markit> ah, sorry, let me have a look
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| 18:15 | <alkisg> !ltsp-pnp
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| 18:15 | <ltsp`> ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
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| 18:15 | <alkisg> The "no pnp" part is just about one command, ltsp-update-image, the rest of the page still applies
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| 18:17 | <markit> I don't use networkmanager but static /etc/network/interfaces settings
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| 18:17 | so no /etc/NetworkManager/NetworkManager.conf
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| 18:18 | but in any case I've solved, now I'm in a hurry tring to decide what to to and fix my install script to work properly with 16.04
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| 18:18 | also ethX naming scheme is gone with 16.04, and I HATE THIS
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| 18:18 | mii-tools does not like that also, lol
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| 18:19 | <quinox> that's a kernel decision IIRC
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| 18:19 | <markit> I know
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| 18:42 | <alkisg> markit, it's just a grub parameter, you can revert it back
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| 18:42 | What problem does mii-tool have? I haven't seen any...
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| 20:12 | <markit> alkisg: mii-tools without parameter does not recognizes interfaces: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/net-tools/+bug/962616
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| 20:28 | <alkisg> Ah, I never use it without an interface name
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