IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)


Channel log from 8 February 2012   (all times are UTC)

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01:12
<vagrantc>
!compiz
01:12
<ltsp>
vagrantc: compiz: the default window manager in gnome is gnome-wm, which automatically chooses compiz if it thinks that the card supports it. Compiz is causing login problems to some clients (LP #673072). To disable it, see !disable_compiz. To restore it, see !restore_compiz
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06:37
<muppis>
alkisg, ah. Good morning. :)
06:37
<alkisg>
Good morning :)
06:39
<muppis>
Got printing issue with local usb printer, but I can't connect to client via ssh at all (ssh server is installed).
06:39* alkisg was considering proposing KDE for Greek schools when Canonical announced that it was dropping support for Ubuntu...
06:39* alkisg is puzzled now, maybe he'll stick with gnome-classic
06:40
<alkisg>
*for Kubuntu, sorry
06:40
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTA1NDA
06:43
<muppis>
I've heard only one person who has used KDE in Ubuntu. And actually KDE in Ubuntu, not Kubuntu. I asked why that way, he said he wanted Ubuntu with KDE, not Kubuntu.
06:43
<alkisg>
...? what's the difference?!
06:44
<muppis>
I do not know..
06:44
<alkisg>
Doesn't kubuntu package all kde stuff for ubuntu?
06:44
<muppis>
Yes.
06:44
<alkisg>
So kubuntu-desktop would only be a metapackage... sounds like that person didn't know what he was asking for
06:45
What I hate most about KDE is that if I want to install kolourpaint in my gnome desktop, I have to get phonon too :-/
06:45
<muppis>
I mentioned that and he claimed he knows that.
06:45
<alkisg>
A lot of dependencies, I'd like it more if its many of its apps were able to run with plain Qt
06:48
<muppis>
My customer wnat LibreOffice to 10.04. Easy task?
06:49
Wants.. Not yet caffained for today.
06:56
<alkisg>
Yeah sure you just use a ppa for that
06:56
<muppis>
Founded that.
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07:43* alkisg does some 12.04 LTSP testing, as requested by stgraber...
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08:50
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, how does the Gnome environment in 12.04 work without compositing capable hardware?
08:50
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: that's what I want to see now, especially via the network (thin clients)...
08:51
Ubuntu 2D, Gnome-session and classic-gnome should work, but I don't know how well
08:51
*gnome-shell, sorry
09:01
<bobapple>
hi
09:01
can somebody tell me how to update the kernel of the chroot? (server kernel already updated)
09:02
<alkisg>
bobapple: distro/version?
09:08
<bobapple>
fedora 14
09:09
<alkisg>
No idea
09:16
Hyperbyte: unity (3d) and compiz really such on vbox VMs though, the screen isn't redrawn properly
09:16* alkisg tries unity-2d...
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09:25
<bobapple>
any idea how to solve tftp timeout problem? (iptables and selinux are down)
09:36
<alkisg>
s/such/sucks
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09:43
<alkisg>
!ubuntu-2d
09:43
<ltsp`>
alkisg: I do not know about 'ubuntu-2d', but I do know about these similar topics: 'ubuntu-bug', 'ubuntu'
09:43
<alkisg>
!learn ubuntu-2d as To select ubuntu-2d as your default session, put this line in your lts.conf: LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=ubuntu-2d"
09:43
<ltsp`>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
09:56
<alkisg>
!learn gnome-shell as To select gnome-shell as your default session, put this line in your lts.conf: LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=gnome"
09:56
<ltsp`>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
09:58
<alkisg>
!learn gnome-fallback as To select gnome-fallback as your default session, put this line in your lts.conf: LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=gnome-fallback"
09:58
<ltsp`>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
09:59
<muppis>
alkisg, are those 12.04 only?
09:59
<alkisg>
muppis: I think from 11.04 and on, but I'm only using lts releases so not sure
10:00
<muppis>
alkisg, ok. I need to test those.
10:00
I want gnome-shell, but so far no joy.
10:00
<alkisg>
There was a bug about LDM_SESSION handling too, before
10:00
(in ltsp)
10:00
I don't remember if that was fixed in 11.10 or in 12.04
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11:35
<andygraybeal>
good morning!
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12:50
<knipwim>
[GuS]: i won't be able to look at your bug this week
12:51
having some major computer problems here
12:51
which need the fixed first
12:51
<[GuS]>
knipwim: no problems, thanks a lot anyway :)
12:51
knipwim: meanwhile i will wait to a new stage3 snapshot to appear
12:51
<knipwim>
have you tried kicktoo as installer?
12:52
<[GuS]>
knipwim: I have that in mind too
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13:53
<andygraybeal>
my heart flops everytime i go to update my image and it tells me 'Error: chroot /opt/ltsp/amd64 doesn't exist' ... everytime it gets me :) and then a second later.. i'm like.. oh yea.. --arch i386
13:55
<muppis>
andygraybeal, put arch=i386 in /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf
13:55
<andygraybeal>
muppis, haha awesome.
13:58
okay, done.
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14:10
<andygraybeal>
alkisg, alright - i have an issue - when i'm logged into a fatclient on vt 12, then i login to vt 11 - the script runs just fine. when i say 'OK' to kill my previous session on vt12... the session on vt12 doesn't get killed and vt11 opens just fine -- so for example right now, i have VT11 and VT12 running at the same time with my account even though i asked it to kill the session on VT12
14:12
i wonder if it deals with my $USER variable that i somehow messed up.
14:12
i wouldn't know how to fix tha in the first place.
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16:02
<muppis>
!gnome-shell
16:02
<ltsp`>
muppis: gnome-shell: To select gnome-shell as your default session, put this line in your lts.conf: LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=gnome"
16:10
<xsl>
is it possible to users to burn CDS ?
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16:21
<xsl>
!cd-burn
16:21
<ltsp`>
xsl: Error: "cd-burn" is not a valid command.
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16:31
<alkisg>
andygraybeal: yup that's the point we were talking about in the first place, when I told you that it's better if the users go there and logout themselves, instead of killing their processes, in order to save unsaved work
16:31
So the 2 dialog options actually mean:
16:32
Cancel login == "ah I forgot I was logged on there, I'll go work there, thanks"
16:32
Kill old session and login == "the other session actually died, I don't have an interface, I can't logout, so kill the stale ssh process"
16:33
The third option that you're mentioning, "kill the other session which has no problem whatsoever and let me login here" is what we agreed that isn't a good idea
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16:38
<alkisg>
stgraber: I wrote some things about my precise/ltsp testing in the pad, I'll test some more in 5-6 hours, but if you could do some of the packaging changes (nbd compression, boot=ltsp_nbd, remove shutdown upstart scripts etc) the testing would make more sense...
16:39
<stgraber>
alkisg: ok, I'll have a look. I'm still not sure about the upstart scripts but will at least look at the exact conditions again
16:40
<alkisg>
stgraber: I can arrange to work on ltsp for the next few days if the changes are going to be included in precise
16:40
(otherwise I was going to after my phd... )
16:40
<stgraber>
alkisg: I definitely plan on uploading a new LTSP before FeatureFreeze (16th of February, so next week)
16:41
<alkisg>
Cool, will do so then, but if you have some time later on to chat about some of the packaging changes, it'd be nice
16:41
<stgraber>
unfortunately that's one of the 20 things I need to get done by the 16th, so I only spend a few minutes on it every day :)
16:41
<alkisg>
bb in 3-4 hours...
16:41
stgraber: I can send a debdiff for the packaging too, along with comments about the testing done after those changes
16:42
Just send me a url for your last branch
16:43
<stgraber>
alkisg: currently I only have a local branch (that's a big mix of LTSP snapshot and packaging), if you want to send me debdiffs, just do a debdiff from what's currently in the ppa
16:43
<alkisg>
OK
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16:58
<andygraybeal>
alkisg, okay thank you for explaining the three separate scenarios - i was confused in the first place... so thank you for explicitly saying the three things.
17:13
alkisg, i guess i'm a little confused - why is it that if I'm logged in on VT12, then I go to login to VT11, i click on "Okay" kill my session at VT12... why i'm still alive on VT12?
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17:15
<muppis>
In 11.10 gnome-shell just doesn't work.
17:19
It is possible that I got something broke in my system as it is upgraded from somewhere ancient.
17:19
<andygraybeal>
muppis, what about the failback?
17:21
<muppis>
andygraybeal, not even that.
17:22
<xsl>
what does not work?
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21:01
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: howdy!
21:17* vagrantc waves
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21:28
<highvoltage>
19:39 < vagrantc> highvoltage: regarding ltsp-cluster packages ... do you have a vcs for it? would you like to include pkg-ltsp as the maintainer (people are likely to associate the two anyways)?
21:30
stgraber: ^^^ is there a reason why we shouldn't put it along with the other ltsp packages in the alioth ltsp-pks repository?
21:33
<stgraber>
highvoltage: pkg-ltsp sounds good
21:33
vagrantc: btw, I believe I asked to join that team on alioth ;)
21:33
<vagrantc>
upstream, of course, should go where upstream wants
21:34
but the debian packaging dirs for Debian i generally like to have hosted on debian infrastructure ...
21:34
<stgraber>
yeah, upstream code is on LP and using mkdst (one is part of ltsp-cluster, the other part of weblive)
21:34
<vagrantc>
although if it makes things easier to host alongside upstream, i'm not fundamentally opposed.
21:34
<stgraber>
vagrantc: nevermind, I see I'm part of ltsp on alioth now, thought I'd get a notification or something ...
21:35
<vagrantc>
stgraber: dunno what happened there
21:42
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: could you give me some pointers? I find alioth kind of confusing. Where are the repositories, and what are they? Git?
21:45
<SmallR2002>
completely off topic
21:47
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: it's messy.
21:47
<SmallR2002>
does anyone have experience with a DMS?
21:47
i've played with Alfresco but can't get it not to crash whatever system/vm i run it on
21:47
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: if upstream uses bzr, probably best to stick with that. if you wanted to do git, we could go that route, too. or any other vcs, probably.
21:48
i haven't yet figured out my preferred workflow with debian packaging, vcs and upstream, and how they interrelate...
21:49
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: ok
21:49
vagrantc: so does alioth actually host the repositories? or does that go into collab-maint?
21:50
<vagrantc>
the main question is weather to keep the debian dir in it's own repository, or to merge it into upstream.
21:50
<highvoltage>
(which actually also seems part of alioth somehow)
21:50
it sounds reasonable to keep it in a seperate repository
21:50
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: collab-maint is just one big project. pkg-ltsp is another project. and you can have repositories of nearly any vcs you've ever heard of hosted in there.
21:51
highvoltage: what i don't like about keeping it in a separate repository is it becomes less clear exactly which upstream version the debian revision relates to...
21:51
<highvoltage>
I know enough of bzr and git to get by. stgraber is upstream and I think he prefers bzr so it sways me that way for this
21:52* highvoltage looks for an option to register a branch
21:53
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: one big question is how likely are debian and ubuntu to diverge on packaging
21:54
highvoltage: http://anonscm.debian.org/loggerhead/pkg-ltsp/
21:55
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: I think it's unlikely. the current plan is to sync these packages from debian to ubuntu and keep it updated in debian.
21:55
<vagrantc>
i've been leaning towards debian dir merged on top of upstream for a while
21:55
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: these packages aren't currently in ubuntu
21:55
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: oh, i didn't know that
21:56
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: that's also why I have some pressure from stgraber to get them into debian. ubuntu feature freeze is next week.
21:57
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: i might be able to try it out friday
21:57
highvoltage: or monday
21:58
<stgraber>
highvoltage: did you add a sysvinit script for ltsp-cluster-agent? I "think" it only had an upstart job
21:58
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: ok, thanks. I'll attempt to get the debian directories on debian's vcs infrastructure tomorrow
21:59
stgraber: nope, I guess I'll have to do that
22:00
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: feel free to set pkg-ltsp-devel as maintainer, and add yourself to uploaders.
22:00
alternately, you might just be able to depend on upstart.,
22:01
<stgraber>
well, more like recommend really, the daemon still works great without, it just won't start automatically (which I actually rarely do in production)
22:01
<vagrantc>
it's a daemon you start manually?
22:02
<highvoltage>
I was thinking more like "suggests"
22:06
<stgraber>
vagrantc: it's a regular daemon so boot time is fine, though for most of my uses cases I want to start it manually to have it load a non-packaged plugin (it also looks in cwd for plugins)
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22:11
<vagrantc>
well, whatever's "normal" behavior should at least be recommends.
22:11
although if "normal" involves manual configuration, then suggests is reasonable.
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22:36
<stgraber>
vagrantc: I guess most people will expect it to start anyway, if only to disable it later. Ideally we should have a sysvinit script, should be a trivial start-stop-daemon call. If not, then recommending upstart sounds good
22:38
<vagrantc>
fair enough
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23:21
<stgraber>
vagrantc: I'm going through the list of issues alkisg reported with the current trunk
23:21
vagrantc: one of them is ldm not listing sessions on fat clients
23:22
vagrantc: that's not a new bug but it can easily be fixed by a packaging change in ldm
23:22
vagrantc: we'd need the ldm binary package to also contain ldminfod and put it in /usr/sbin/ldminfod
23:23
we could depend on ldm-server but then we'd end up with openbsd-inetd and a bunch of other things we don't want on the client, so I guess the easiest is to ship the same file in both packages (with the proper conflict obviously)
23:50
<vagrantc>
i'm a little lost
23:50
oh, you want ldminfod in both ldm-server and ldm itself?
23:51
you could also ship it as a different filename so you wouldn't have to conflict.
23:52
probably wouldn't need to install both on the same machine, but it wouldn't be hard to leave the option open.
23:57
<stgraber>
right, we could have it in /usr/bin/ldminfod in ldm and /usr/sbin/ldminfod in ldm-server
23:57
<vagrantc>
hah
23:57
<stgraber>
would just need a change to the screen.d script to look at /usr/bin/ldminfod though
23:57
<vagrantc>
that wouldn't be confusing.
23:58
stgraber: i almost wonder if /usr/share/ldm/ldminfod for the ldm copy
23:58
<stgraber>
well, I proposed a conflict between ldm and ldm-server ;) you're the one saying we may want both installed :)
23:58
<vagrantc>
sure, just no reason to keep it in the path.
23:58
<stgraber>
vagrantc: yeah, /usr/share/ldm/ldminfod would work, it's an hardcoded path in screen.d/ldm anyway
23:59
<vagrantc>
unless there is... ?
23:59
and it's shipped in ldm itself, so tthat should work.
23:59
i.e. if it changes, it'll be easy to change in ldm