IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 30 January 2008 (all times are UTC)
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| 04:05 | <robzhei> morning !
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| 04:07 | * robzhei need help with clean Edubuntu install and ltsp problem (hangs after 5 sec after showing edubuntu-logo) ;) | |
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| 04:59 | <jvanrooyen> Hi there...I chatted about my problem yesterday..."PXE-E32 open timeout". This is the msg I get on my clients when I boot them up
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| 04:59 | Can anyone help with this please
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| 04:59 | I changed switches and it didnt make any difference
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| 05:07 | <robzhei> me 2
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| 05:23 | <mhterres> hi :-)
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| 05:23 | morning
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| 05:24 | zoro has joined #ltsp | |
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| 05:26 | <zoro> I have a current setup of around 70 client machines, all running Windows 2000 (along with Office, FireFox, IE6 and a few other minor apps), and a Windows PDC running on a dual xeon with 2gigs of ram
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| 05:27 | i'm looking into the possibilty of using Edubuntu and LTSP to setup a network that can be expanded alot easier than what is there at the moment
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| 05:27 | <johnny> zoro, it's kinda early atm :)
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| 05:28 | <zoro> as its for a school, the major uses of the systems is basically just MS Office usage and web browsing
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| 05:28 | johnny: i know - i'll idle :p
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| 05:28 | <johnny> migth have to wait for a bit :)
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| 05:28 | <zoro> johnny: besides, it's 11:28am here in Dublin :D
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| 05:28 | <johnny> sure but your question will prolly be lost in the shuffle
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| 05:28 | so you'll have to ask again :)
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| 05:28 | <zoro> yup
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| 05:28 | i'm an idler-veteran :D
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| 05:29 | <PerfDave> Whoo Dublin :)
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| 05:29 | <zoro> still though, i've found that quiet times are good for getting answers too ;)
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| 05:29 | o/ PerfDave
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| 05:29 | <johnny> zoro, many of the folks active in here are in the US
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| 05:30 | some even on the west coast
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| 05:30 | one of the most active ones is for sure
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| 05:30 | * zoro sighs | |
| 05:30 | <zoro> :p
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| 05:30 | <PerfDave> zoro: If you're desperate for MSOffice, you'll want to look into WINE or Crossover Office or something. Or just use OpenOffice.org, koffice or similar.
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| 05:30 | <zoro> PerfDave: yeah i know about that already. i'm an ubuntu user myself so i use openoffice
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| 05:31 | honestly, the hardest part will be convincing the computers teacher in there that an LTSP would be useful for the school
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| 05:31 | so i want to make sure i've done all my homework and bring in a pre-setup server to demo the whole thing with him
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| 05:31 | <PerfDave> zoro: One thing you might want to consider is setting up the LTSP server on a seperate machine to the PDC, then you can switch between your existing setup and LTSP just by choosing to boot off the HDDs or the NICs on the clients.
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| 05:31 | <johnny> zoro, a good demo .. is virtualbox vm with server
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| 05:31 | and a couple clients :)
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| 05:31 | <zoro> if he doesn't like it, fair enough, but i want to mke sure i do it right
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| 05:32 | <johnny> that's how i test my clients atm
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| 05:32 | software wise
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| 05:32 | * zoro nods | |
| 05:32 | <johnny> got ubuntu in a vm.. and another vm that does networkboot
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| 05:32 | works nicely
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| 05:32 | <PerfDave> zoro: You could also have your LTSP server use the Windows Active Directory stuff for auth (and possibly even mounting home directories using Samba), to keep the systems compatiable during any transition period.
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| 05:32 | <johnny> or fire the computer teacher :)
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| 05:33 | and hire a better one
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| 05:33 | <zoro> hehe
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| 05:33 | <ogra> geeez
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| 05:33 | <zoro> he's actually my old teacher :) this is for the school i used to go to :D
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| 05:34 | <ogra> http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iU4Lq7tOR_WVOJLZ3IeRaIH03x6w
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| 05:34 | <zoro> i'm their netadmin - and i want to make it as easy as possible for him to run, maintain and expand if i'm not around
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| 05:34 | * PerfDave likes the idea of having LTSP supplement a Windows setup, work transparently with it, then slowly migrate :) | |
| 05:34 | * ogra needs to teach the gendarmes about ltsp :))) | |
| 05:34 | <johnny> ogra, !
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| 05:34 | welcome!
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| 05:35 | <ogra> hey hey
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| 05:35 | <johnny> still learnin the python
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| 05:35 | still hackin the sabayon :)
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| 05:35 | <ogra> we should look into sabayon thins week ... i'd like to avoid to have to write an UVF exception :)
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| 05:35 | <johnny> UVF ?
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| 05:35 | <ogra> 14th is feature freeze
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| 05:35 | upstream version freeze
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| 05:36 | (the freezes are the same this release due to its LTS nature
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| 05:36 | <johnny> well upstream is already frozen :)
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| 05:36 | <PerfDave> Oh, Sabayon's the Gentoo derivative, right?
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| 05:36 | <johnny> no
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| 05:36 | well yes
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| 05:36 | but not what we're talking about
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| 05:36 | it's a user profile tool for gnome
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| 05:36 | <PerfDave> Oh, right.
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| 05:36 | <zoro> PerfDave: well, i'd rather just do a "Big Switch", and get them out of the hole they're digging themselves into
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| 05:36 | <johnny> unfortunate naming conflict
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| 05:36 | <ogra> johnny, that freeze is from ubuntu, meaning no new upstream versions after that point of the release schedule
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| 05:37 | <PerfDave> zoro: You might, but you might find it easier (politically rather than technically) to add to what's there already and then switch back.
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| 05:37 | <ogra> johnny, well, sabayon was there forst :P
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| 05:37 | *first
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| 05:37 | <johnny> which one? :)
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| 05:37 | <ogra> hehe
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| 05:37 | choose :P
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| 05:37 | <johnny> as a gentoo user.. i decline to answer :)
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| 05:38 | next version will support xephyr..
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| 05:38 | but too late for this gnome release
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| 05:38 | <zoro> PerfDave: Yeah I see your point, and its a valid one ;) In my case I have it pretty easy though - there's only 1 person to convince. The school doesn't care about technology - the teacher does. So if I can sway him in 1 sitting, I can just do it
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| 05:40 | <ogra> oh i really love that article :)
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| 05:40 | "He also added that "the Linux interface is ahead of other operating systems currently on the market for professional use.""+
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| 05:40 | <johnny> ?
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| 05:40 | article?
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| 05:40 | <ogra> johnny, the url i pasted above
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| 05:40 | http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iU4Lq7tOR_WVOJLZ3IeRaIH03x6w
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| 05:40 | <johnny> aha..
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| 05:40 | i didn't know what afp was :)
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| 05:41 | <ogra> the whole french police switches 70000 desktops to ubuntu
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| 05:41 | <zoro> that's a whole lot of money
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| 05:42 | * johnny wonders if the canonical folks can handle this kinda workload :) | |
| 05:42 | * ogra wonders if they pay with desktops where zoro lives | |
| 05:42 | * ogra tries to imagine zoro's wallet | |
| 05:42 | <zoro> :)
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| 05:42 | <ogra> johnny, the article doesnt say that they buy support at canonical :) (yet)
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| 05:42 | ubuntu != canonical :)
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| 05:43 | <johnny> i meant both really
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| 05:43 | as in.. more user bug reports
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| 05:43 | more folks in the irc
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| 05:43 | etc
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| 05:43 | <ogra> ah well, we'll manage another 70000
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| 05:43 | <johnny> more servers for download
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| 05:43 | etc
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| 05:43 | i'd like to work for canonical some day..
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| 05:43 | <ogra> its unlikely that all of them will show up on IRC or file bugs :)
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| 05:43 | <PerfDave> zoro: But if you go for a complete replacement, and something goes wrong, you end up with an unusable IT system and you and he end up looking foolish and maybe getting into trouble.
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| 05:44 | <ogra> johnny, all i can point you to is http://www.ubuntu.com/employment :)
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| 05:44 | <johnny> i don't think i'm ready yet ..
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| 05:44 | <PerfDave> Is it hard to get a job with Canonical?
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| 05:44 | They seem to hire everybody.
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| 05:44 | Or at least, to try to.
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| 05:44 | They're worse than Google ;)
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| 05:44 | zoro: You also need to make it as easy as possible for people to migrate. Letting them use their existing Windows domain accounts and file shares is a good way to do that.
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| 05:45 | <johnny> i've been doing web devel for years, using gentoo, i'm just now playing wit debian/ubuntu since july
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| 05:45 | <ogra> PerfDave, we try to hire th best :)
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| 05:45 | <johnny> so now i'm more deeply learning autotools
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| 05:45 | <PerfDave> ogra: That'll be why they haven't approached me then. Or perhaps that's because I don't use Ubuntu :)
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| 05:45 | <ogra> (at least people with better grammar skills than me :P )
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| 05:46 | PerfDave, well, preferred are people that already worked with ay of the devs and have a recomendation through contributing ...
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| 05:46 | but indeed not all jobs can be filled like that
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| 05:46 | <PerfDave> ogra: Yeah, I have no interest in contributing to Ubuntu :)
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| 05:46 | <zoro> PerfDave: Yeah I understnd. Either way I can't do anything until I have an LTSP server setup for testing in my own environment, so I'll be getting onto that in the next few days. Thanks though :)
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| 07:52 | <Nubae> hi there... I've got a question about using LTSP serving a fat chroot
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| 07:52 | I've got authentication working against an LDAP directory
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| 07:53 | but under Gutsy, the startup sequence hangs at starting system log daemon...
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| 07:53 | I believe this has to do with xorg
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| 07:53 | <PerfDave> Why are you serving a FAT chroot?
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| 07:54 | <Nubae> because I have a bunch of core 2 duo laptops with 2 gigs of ram
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| 07:54 | which are totally wasted otherwise
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| 07:54 | <PerfDave> I'll guess that it has something to do with FAT not supporting Unix-style file permissions, and something hanging because of that.
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| 07:55 | <Nubae> fat = fully installed edubuntu desktop chroot
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| 07:55 | not the file system
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| 07:55 | fat 'thin' client
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| 07:55 | <ogra> Nubae, can you take out quiet and splash from the bootoptions ?
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| 07:55 | <PerfDave> Ah, you should be more specific :)
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| 07:55 | <ogra> it should reveal more info then
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| 07:55 | (in the pxe defaults file)
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| 07:56 | <Nubae> ah, will do
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| 07:56 | <ogra> also note that this setup will required some tweaks ... the ltsp-client scripts are likely interfering with a normal boot sequence here
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| 07:57 | but dropping splascreen and quiet should give you some hints
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| 07:57 | <Nubae> yeah, I know I'm close though, this must have something to do with the xorg starting up part
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| 07:57 | everything else seems to be working allright, but let me give you the output
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| 07:57 | I've exported /home through nfs too, thats correct no?
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| 07:58 | <kysucix> hi
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| 07:58 | <kysucix> I've got nfs timeout problems...
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| 07:58 | I tried with sleep 10 method, changing rsize or wsize but it doesn't work :(
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| 07:59 | <kysucix> the weird thing is that opening /bin/sh to the client and making the same command it works!
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| 07:59 | <Nubae> well, went all the way through to login prompt
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| 07:59 | <kysucix> do you have any suggestion? I'm totally lost
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| 07:59 | <Nubae> but no X startup
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| 07:59 | <zoro> .:13:52:28:. < Nubae> hi there... I've got a question about using LTSP serving a fat chroot
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| 07:59 | .:13:53:47:. < PerfDave> Why are you serving a FAT chroot?
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| 07:59 | .:13:55:23:. < Nubae> fat 'thin' client
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| 07:59 | brilliant
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| 08:00 | excellent misunderstanding :D
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| 08:01 | <Nubae> yeah indeed
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| 08:01 | <PerfDave> Stranger things have happened, I'm sure ;)
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| 08:02 | <Nubae> ogra any ideas? startup goes through to login prompt, I can login there and startx from the command line
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| 08:02 | but no gnome
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| 08:06 | actually, when I login to the terminal, I get a message cannot find name for group ID such and such (2 times) and then a prompt that shows I have no name!@fatclient
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| 08:06 | <kysucix> adding "-o retrans=10" to
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| 08:06 | /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/nfs solves nfs timeout problem
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| 08:07 | <Nubae> I cannot unfortunately do a su root in the chroot, cause authentication fails, and trying to create a password for root in the chroot fails too
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| 08:07 | <gundul-> hello
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| 08:07 | i have problem in ltsp access local device
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| 08:07 | <Nubae> result is I cant see the log files to see where its failing
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| 08:07 | <gundul-> anyone can help ?
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| 08:07 | <ogra> Nubae, how do you try to set that pw ?
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| 08:07 | <Nubae> passwd
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| 08:08 | <ogra> it works fine here
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| 08:08 | <Nubae> on a fat client?
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| 08:08 | <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
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| 08:08 | then sudo ltsp-update-image
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| 08:08 | (which might take quite long with a whole desktop installed there) :)
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| 08:08 | <Nubae> actually, doesnt... its quite fast
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| 08:09 | <zoro> does it only send the differences?
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| 08:09 | <Nubae> passwd: Authentication information cannot be recovered
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| 08:09 | passwd: password unchanged
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| 08:09 | <zoro> or does it resend the entire desktop install?
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| 08:09 | <Nubae> differences (I believe)
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| 08:09 | <zoro> Nubae: have you kept a blog or anything of how you setup your ... well, setup?
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| 08:10 | <Nubae> yeah, I'm writing it up in the ubuntu wiki
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| 08:10 | <zoro> linkage \o/
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| 08:10 | <Nubae> but... first I want to see X before I shout success
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| 08:10 | * zoro nods | |
| 08:10 | <zoro> i'm just looking for reading at the moment anyway
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| 08:10 | looking to setup a rather large network using edubuntu myself
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| 08:11 | <Nubae> zoro, well, I'm working on it at the moment, but wont publish until its fully functional
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| 08:11 | <ogra> Nubae, gdm is installed i suppose
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| 08:11 | <Nubae> should ahve been pulled in through apt-get installed edubuntu-desktop, no?
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| 08:11 | <ogra> yes, usually
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| 08:11 | but re-check please
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| 08:11 | <Nubae> well gdm at the command line does not work
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| 08:11 | <zoro> Nubae: no problem. i'm looking forward to reading it
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| 08:12 | <ogra> another thing is that X is configured by the ltsp-client-core initscript
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| 08:12 | might be that gdm tries to start before there is X configuration
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| 08:12 | (which actually shouldnt matter though with gutsys xorg)
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| 08:12 | <Nubae> hmmm.... well, doing apt-get install gdm is pulling through a lot of crap
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| 08:12 | xfce stuff
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| 08:13 | <ogra> huh ?
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| 08:13 | <gundul-> mm... anyone can help me with access local device ?
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| 08:13 | <ogra> that sounds massively wrong
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| 08:13 | gundul-, not if you dont tell us the symptoms :)
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| 08:14 | <Nubae> sorry :-/ me reading too fast... its under recommended packages that xfce stuff is mentioned
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| 08:14 | <gundul-> i plug usb drive in client, but it didn't seem to be automounted
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| 08:14 | <Nubae> ok, what about the pam.d gdm file, should that have anything special to allow authentication from ldap?
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| 08:15 | <ogra> gundul-, which distro and ltsp release ?
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| 08:15 | <Nubae> ogra, is lts.conf looked at in any way by the fat system?
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| 08:16 | <gundul-> ltsp 4.2 and I use mandriva 2005
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| 08:16 | <ogra> Nubae, ltsp-client-core uses it
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| 08:16 | gundul-, oh, thats ancient and unmaintained ...
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| 08:16 | <Nubae> so yes then
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| 08:16 | <ogra> look at the ltsp.org wiki, there migh be more info
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| 08:16 | i think there is a troubleshooting guide for 4.x localdev somewhere
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| 08:17 | <gundul-> which one is ancient ?
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| 08:17 | ltsp or mandriva ?
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| 08:17 | <Nubae> should I edit the initscript?
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| 08:17 | both :-)
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| 08:17 | <ogra> ltsp 4 wasnt touched for about three years
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| 08:17 | so newer HW wont work and rthere might be security holes
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| 08:17 | <gundul-> so i have to use this LTSP-5.0 ?
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| 08:18 | <ogra> i fear there is no ltsp5 for mandriva ... i dont think anyone has put time into integration
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| 08:18 | ltsp5 requires the distributor to integrate it
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| 08:18 | so 4.x might be your best bet ... but people knowing the fixes and workarounds get rarae nowadays
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| 08:19 | Nubae, well, first you really need gdm installed ...
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| 08:19 | <gundul-> thank you
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| 08:19 | <Nubae> it is
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| 08:19 | <ogra> ok
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| 08:19 | and if you try to start it on a running client whats the error you get ?
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| 08:19 | look in xorg.6.log
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| 08:19 | or in any other log you find
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| 08:20 | <Nubae> so u think the authentication error when trying to create the root pass is related to not having gdm installed?
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| 08:20 | <ogra> no
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| 08:20 | you should be able to set a password nn the chroot
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| 08:20 | <Nubae> ok, this is what I get: passwd: Authentication information cannot be recovered
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| 08:20 | <cliebow_> gundul-: i think localdev troubleshooting is on wiki.ltsp.org in 4.x
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| 08:20 | <ogra> *in
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| 08:21 | <ogra> mccann, hey
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| 08:21 | <Nubae> I need the root pass or I cant see the ologs
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| 08:21 | <ogra> sme movement going on in sshd :)
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| 08:21 | *some
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| 08:21 | <mccann> ogra: yo
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| 08:21 | ogra: cool, like what?
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| 08:21 | <ogra> cjwatson was just discussing his changes in #ubuntu-devel a minute ago :)
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| 08:22 | <Nubae> well, I'll just rebuild the image and see if I can at least start gdm now
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| 08:23 | <Nubae> just so you know, there is an error in the ltsp-update-image script...
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| 08:23 | I have to do this to get my image built: sudo ltsp-update-image -a fati386 -b /opt/ltsp -p 2003
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| 08:24 | really the fati386 should be here: -b /opt/ltsp/fati386 but that sets it up wrong
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| 08:25 | maybe my inability to create a passwd is related to ldap being used for authentication in the chroot?
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| 08:26 | <ogra> mccann, see the bottom :) http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/01/30/%23ubuntu-devel.html (last lines from 13:57 on)
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| 08:26 | <ogra> hmm, thats not having everything yet
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| 08:27 | but it looks like he wants it in sshd directly
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| 08:27 | at least for ubuntu ...
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| 08:27 | <gundul-> how to insert mount command after usb drive detect ?
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| 08:27 | <ogra> no idea how upstream sees that
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| 08:28 | <mccann> ogra: you'd probably want each client to be on its own seat (just like we do for xdmcp)
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| 08:29 | <Nubae> ok, nss_ldap is saying it cant bind to ldap server, invalid credentials... but on startup it did connect, whats going on here? (this is after doing gdm form the console)
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| 08:30 | <ogra> mccann, right
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| 08:32 | <ogra> Nubae, in gutsy you need to use ldap-auth-client or so to set it up ... did you do that ?
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| 08:34 | <Nubae> yes
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| 08:34 | it wouldnt have come this far if it wasnt working
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| 08:34 | <ogra> well, root shouldnt be handled by ldap though
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| 08:34 | <Nubae> right, but now I'm talking about the gdm error above
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| 08:34 | <ogra> at least *i* wouldnt do it like that :)
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| 08:35 | <Nubae> where does gdm look at for authentication via ldap¿
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| 08:35 | ?
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| 08:35 | <ogra> gdm needs the gdm user in place
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| 08:35 | and runs as such
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| 08:35 | <Nubae> yeah ok, so I add the user and group to ldap
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| 08:37 | gdm user exists in ldap already
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| 08:37 | <ogra> check /etc/passwd on the client :)
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| 08:37 | i be the user and group id's are broken then
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| 08:37 | *bet
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| 08:38 | system groups and users shouldnt come from ldap
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| 08:38 | <Nubae> hmm... ok, so should I copy across the users and groups from the server to the chroot?
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| 08:38 | <ogra> simply because usually packages create the system users ... during install there might be no ldap
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| 08:38 | (i.e. if you install in a chroot ;) )
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| 08:39 | <Nubae> gotcha
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| 08:39 | <ogra> i'd make everything below uid 1000 come from /etc/passwd ...
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| 08:39 | <Nubae> indeed no gdm in /etc/passwd
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| 08:39 | <ogra> from iud 100 upwards ubuntu creates normal user accounts
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| 08:39 | *1000
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| 08:40 | so you will still have a working system even if your ldap server ot the net is down
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| 08:40 | *or
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| 08:40 | <Nubae> but the fat client needs to authenticate somehow
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| 08:41 | I'm only using ldap for the fat clients
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| 08:41 | fat 'thin' clients
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| 08:41 | <ogra> yeah, make sure the order in nsswitch.conf is right so it first looks in passwd
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| 08:41 | <PerfDave> ogra: All non-root accounts should come from LDAP!
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| 08:42 | <ogra> then make soure to have no duplicatesd system users/greoups in ldap and passwd/group
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| 08:42 | PerfDave, that means a lot stuff wont work
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| 08:42 | as soon as your ldap is gone
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| 08:42 | <Nubae> I have no gdm in /etc/passwd, should it be there?
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| 08:42 | <ogra> udev needs the udev user to even create devices
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| 08:42 | you dont want that in ldap
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| 08:43 | <PerfDave> Meh, just have a resilient LDAP setup :)
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| 08:43 | <ogra> Nubae, well, the packages postinst should have created that
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| 08:43 | <Nubae> didnt
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| 08:43 | <ogra> bug
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| 08:43 | <Nubae> the group is there, user isnt
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| 08:44 | <ogra> gdm:x:109:119:Gnome Display Manager:/var/lib/gdm:/bin/false
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| 08:44 | you should have something like that
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| 08:45 | (while the group is created dynamically ...)
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| 08:45 | so the numbering will differ
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| 08:45 | err
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| 08:45 | s/group/id/
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| 08:45 | <Nubae> nope... not in /etc/group or /etc/passwd now I've checked properly
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| 08:45 | <PerfDave> getent group | grep gdm
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| 08:46 | <ogra> that doesnt help
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| 08:46 | getent will use ldap
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| 08:46 | <Nubae> gdm:x:118:
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| 08:46 | indeed
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| 08:46 | comes from ldap
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| 08:47 | <ogra> ogra@ceron:~/isos/hardy$ grep adduser /var/lib/dpkg/info/gdm.*
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| 08:47 | /var/lib/dpkg/info/gdm.postinst: adduser --system --ingroup gdm --home /var/lib/gdm gdm
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| 08:47 | /var/lib/gdm is likely owned by the wrong uid in your case
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| 08:48 | <Nubae> gdm.gdm (how do I find the uid?)
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| 08:49 | <johnny> id gdm
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| 08:49 | or look in /etc/passwd
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| 08:49 | <ogra> its 118
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| 08:50 | you should do that chrooted :)
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| 08:50 | not in the running client that definately uses ldap ;)
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| 08:50 | <Nubae> uid=108(gdm) gid=118(gdm) groups=118(gdm)
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| 08:50 | <ogra> right
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| 08:51 | <Nubae> but thats from ldap
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| 08:51 | <ogra> first fix your nsswitch.conf
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| 08:51 | make sure it checks the local file first
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| 08:51 | make sure there are only system users in passwd/group locally
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| 08:52 | <Nubae> ok, I've got ldap then files
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| 08:52 | <ogra> then all your real users should come from ldap while system functionallity is provided by local system accounts
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| 08:52 | right, flip that order
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| 08:52 | files then ldap
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| 08:52 | <Nubae> ok, done
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| 08:53 | so I remove system users from ldap?
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| 08:53 | <ogra> yes
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| 08:54 | <Nubae> every last one?
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| 08:54 | :-)
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| 08:54 | <ogra> but only if you are sure they are in passwd :)
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| 08:54 | <Nubae> they're not... gdm is only in ldap
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| 08:54 | <ogra> ubuntu starts assigning non system users from uid 1000 on
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| 08:54 | look at everything with smaller uid
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| 08:55 | udev and messagebus for example come to ming
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| 08:55 | *mind
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| 08:55 | <Nubae> ok, to be clear then, system users in ldap, but not in /etc/passwd should be copied to /etc/passwd?
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| 08:55 | <ogra> not copied :)
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| 08:55 | you cant rely on the fact that your client has the matching UI free
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| 08:56 | <Nubae> ok, copied and verify the UI is unique?
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| 08:56 | <ogra> grep for the adduser command in /var/lib/dpkg/info/<packagename>.postinst
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| 08:56 | and use that
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| 08:56 | <Nubae> ok do what the postinst would do... but shouldnt that be the same as the user created in ldap?
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| 08:56 | <ogra> and make sure $HOME permissions match
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| 08:57 | well, you had ldap ordered first ...
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| 08:57 | it likely is
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| 08:57 | but double check that
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| 08:57 | <Nubae> I mean, I'd imagine when I installed gdm, the user was created in ldap
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| 08:57 | ok
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| 08:57 | gotcha... btw.. this is far more complex than just apt-get install edubuntu-desktop ;-)
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| 08:57 | <ogra> yeah
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| 08:58 | thast why i didnt add it as option to ltsp-build-client yet ;)
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| 08:58 | <Nubae> heh, ok, well I'm documenting at putting in wiki.ubuntu.com
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| 08:58 | <ogra> if we have a proper ldap setup that works without any manual setup i'll consider it ...
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| 08:58 | <Nubae> ldap is pretty easy now
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| 08:58 | <ogra> currently i think fedorea will be ahead once they have ltsp5 in ... they simply have the auth-server bits we're missing in ubuntu
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| 08:59 | its easy, on the client side
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| 08:59 | <Nubae> server side too
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| 08:59 | <ogra> but not at all on the server side
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| 08:59 | <Nubae> if you dont do ssl or tls
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| 08:59 | I set it up in about 20 minutes
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| 09:00 | <ogra> and my expectation of calling ltsp-build-client --fat is that you dont have to do anything beyond
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| 09:00 | as long as we cant provide that with distro tools in ubuntu i wont add that feature
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| 09:00 | <Nubae> well, the smbldap-installer works too
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| 09:00 | for setting up the server
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| 09:01 | and then just migrate-unix-accounts
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| 09:01 | primeministerp has quit IRC | |
| 09:01 | <Nubae> anyway, let me get this working and then there'll at least be a wiki
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| 09:01 | tiagovaz has joined #ltsp | |
| 09:02 | <ogra> smbldap-installer ? in which distro package did you find that ?
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| 09:02 | :)
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| 09:03 | <Nubae> ok, no package, but there is a source
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| 09:03 | jammcq has joined #ltsp | |
| 09:03 | <jammcq> hey kidz
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| 09:03 | sbalneav: ping
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| 09:04 | <Nubae> (03:56:57 PM) ogra: and make sure $HOME permissions match
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| 09:04 | I exported /home via nfs to the fat client
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| 09:04 | <ogra> Nubae, gdm's home isnt in /home :P
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| 09:04 | <jammcq> !seen sbalneav
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| 09:04 | <ltspbot> jammcq: sbalneav was last seen in #ltsp 23 hours, 6 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <sbalneav> someones sent folder didn't come a cross.
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| 09:04 | <jammcq> pff
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| 09:04 | <ogra> most other sys users will have special homes as well
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| 09:04 | hey jammcq
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| 09:05 | <jammcq> g'morning ogra
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| 09:05 | err, afternoon
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| 09:06 | <cliebow_> ho!!
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| 09:07 | <Blinny> I have a diff comparison of two very long nearly-identical single lines (30k+ each) -- is there an easy way to ignore the 99% common stuff and only print part of the lines that are actually different? I was thinking of sed'ing spaces into newlines if there isn't a native diff method.
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| 09:08 | <ogra> who the heck writes 30k+ long lines ?
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| 09:08 | <PerfDave> ogra: Scripts?
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| 09:09 | <Blinny> Yeah. Output of a javascript
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| 09:09 | <Nubae> I take root out of ldap too?
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| 09:10 | <ogra> evil scripts you have :)
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| 09:11 | <Blinny> Yes.
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| 09:12 | <Nubae> jeez, so I have to wade through the postinst of every package that creates users in the thin client?
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| 09:14 | well, calling it a day I'm gonna tackle this tomorrow on a clear head
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| 09:14 | thanks for the help ogra
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| 09:16 | <ogra> Nubae, well, the right approach would have been to have your install done in the chroot and *then* set up ldap
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| 09:16 | so all system users would have the proper setup
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| 09:17 | i wonder if its not easier to actually re-run ltsp-build_client and install the desktop than to wade through the users
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| 09:18 | <Nubae> i thought it was done, didnt realise gdm wasnt installed alongside edubuntu-desktop
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| 09:18 | you're probably right
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| 09:18 | nicoAMG has joined #ltsp | |
| 09:18 | <ogra> if its really only gdm though
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| 09:19 | <Nubae> yeah its all I installed, but who knows what else it pulled down
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| 10:02 | <bartolomeojsimps> hi
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| 10:03 | i got a amd k6-2 350 mhz as a thin client and i get this error when it starts: acpi: bios age (1997) fails cutoff (2000)
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| 10:03 | what can i do
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| 10:05 | mhterres has quit IRC | |
| 10:07 | mhterres has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:10 | * sutula apologizes to bartolomeojsimps for the stupid suggestion, but can you update the BIOS? | |
| 10:10 | <zoro> :)
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| 10:10 | Daggett has quit IRC | |
| 10:10 | <bartolomeojsimps> i'll do it and i'll tell yoou
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| 10:11 | * sutula doesn't *really* need to know :) | |
| 10:11 | Daggett has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:11 | highvoltage has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:12 | <highvoltage> sbalneav, ogra: seen this yet? some linuxbios nice-ness: http://www.artecgroup.com/thincan/
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| 10:12 | <sutula> bartolomeojsimps: I'd assume the acpi writers had some reason for putting that check in there...in any case, to find out more about that, it's not really an ltsp questions, so you'd probably want to ask on a distro-specific channel for better support, as though you were just running Linux on the box
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| 10:14 | Daggett has quit IRC | |
| 10:16 | <ogra> highvoltage, i have one under my desk :) sbalneav as well ... its Q-Funks's company
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| 10:16 | mhterres has quit IRC | |
| 10:17 | mhterres has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:17 | <highvoltage> ogra: oh, cool!
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| 10:18 | <cliebow_> you have sbalneav under your desk 8~)
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| 10:18 | LET HIM OUT!!
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| 10:20 | <ogra> he is scared because you shouted ...
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| 10:22 | <cliebow_> sorry..couldnt help it..
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| 10:22 | i really miss the scottmeister
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| 10:25 | <ogra> he was here yesterday
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| 10:27 | <cliebow_> heh..i hollered at him once but he didnt hear me..
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| 10:30 | <ogra> he had to go pretty quick for a mail emergency
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| 11:35 | some_dude has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:35 | <some_dude> hi
| |
| 11:36 | I'm having trouble getting my client to boot, I'm getting file not found
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| 11:36 | I think the problem is in my dhcp config, but Im not sure how to fix it
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| 11:37 | the root-path is valid, but the filename /ltsp/pxeliux.0 is not
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| 11:39 | * sutula is not an expert, but suggests that some_dude put his dhcp config file into a pastebot, so others here can take a peek | |
| 11:39 | <sutula> !pastebot
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| 11:39 | <ltspbot> sutula: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
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| 11:40 | <some_dude> it's a Windows 2003 dchp. so there is no file to post
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| 11:40 | * sutula can't help there | |
| 11:41 | <some_dude> well where shold /ltsp/pxelinux.0 be ?
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| 11:43 | should I have a pxelinux.0 on my system ?
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| 11:43 | <PerfDave> Your DHCP server needs to tell the client to load a kernel via TFTP. The pxelinux.0 should be on the LTSP server.
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| 11:44 | <some_dude> I'm not finding it on my system at all
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| 11:44 | <ogra> /ltsp/pxelinux.0 should be under the root of your tftp server
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| 11:44 | what distro ?
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| 11:44 | <some_dude> and that should be in my /opt/ltsp/i386 ?
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| 11:44 | ubuntu
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| 11:44 | <ogra> no
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| 11:44 | what distro ?
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| 11:45 | under 7var7lib/tftpboot then
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| 11:45 | whoops
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| 11:45 | tiagovaz has quit IRC | |
| 11:45 | <ogra> /var/lib/tftpboot
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| 11:45 | <some_dude> ah, it's not there
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| 11:45 | <ogra> and its actually /ltsp/$ARCH/pxelinux.0
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| 11:46 | (ARCH=i386 usually here)
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| 11:46 | <some_dude> i see, the docs leave out that small detial
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| 11:47 | I'm going to test it now
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| 11:47 | <ogra> ??
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| 11:47 | <some_dude> thanks brb
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| 11:47 | <ogra> which docs did you follow to even end up in that state ?
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| 11:48 | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall is the most valid ressource
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| 11:48 | bartolomeojsimps has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:48 | <ogra> you actually need only two commands and surely will have the mentioned dir in the end i the second command finished properly
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| 11:48 | <bartolomeojsimps> hello
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| 11:49 | how can i force acpi in ltsp
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| 11:49 | krishna has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:49 | <ogra> some_dude, you need to run ltsp-update-kernels to create that dir properly
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| 11:50 | bartolomeojsimps, you mean use the kernel commandline option acpi=force ?
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| 11:50 | <bartolomeojsimps> yes
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| 11:50 | <ogra> depends on your distro and ltsp version
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| 11:50 | <bartolomeojsimps> ubuntu 7.04
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| 11:50 | ltsp 5
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| 11:50 | <ogra> add it to /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
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| 11:50 | and reboot your clients
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| 11:51 | behind splash and quiet
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| 11:59 | <bartolomeojsimps> i did what you say, but acpi error still aperas
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| 12:00 | appear
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| 12:03 | <ogra> you didnt talk about any error :)
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| 12:03 | <bartolomeojsimps> acpi: bios age (1997) fails cutoff
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| 12:04 | the las line is
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| 12:04 | IP-Config: eth0 hardware address ----- DHCP RARP
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| 12:04 | <ogra> the acpi message shouldnt prevent you from booting at all
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| 12:05 | it just means the system wont use acpi because the bios is to old
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| 12:05 | the ubuntu kernel should actually fall back to use the apm module for such HW silently
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| 12:06 | what kind of HW is that exactly ?
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| 12:06 | <bartolomeojsimps> amd k6-2 500 mhz
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| 12:06 | pcchips 598lmr
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| 12:06 | <ogra> how much ram
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| 12:06 | <bartolomeojsimps> 256 mb
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| 12:06 | <ogra> hmm, that should all be fine
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| 12:07 | <bartolomeojsimps> in the las t days i activate local_apps in lts.conf
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| 12:07 | but yestreday i quit that line
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| 12:07 | <ogra> there is no localapps support in ltsp5
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| 12:07 | and its unlikely to be there before 8.10
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| 12:09 | it sounds very much to me that your network card cant be configured right ... you should see a MAC address in that IP-Config line
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| 12:09 | <bartolomeojsimps> yes
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| 12:09 | 00:e0:06:ee:be:6d
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| 12:10 | it happens only in my amd k6 2 based pcs
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| 12:10 | <ogra> hmm
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| 12:10 | <bartolomeojsimps> but they werw working fine
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| 12:10 | <ogra> so since when dont they work anymore
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| 12:10 | <bartolomeojsimps> yes
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| 12:10 | <ogra> you must have changed something then
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| 12:11 | find out what that was and change it back :)
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| 12:12 | <bartolomeojsimps> i have touch the lts.conf and i have copy some files from /usr/lib to /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib in order to run local apps
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| 12:12 | could that be the problem?
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| 12:13 | <ogra> yes
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| 12:13 | <bartolomeojsimps> the strange thing is that my other machines works well
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| 12:13 | DonSilver has quit IRC | |
| 12:13 | <ogra> try to change back what you did
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| 12:13 | there is no easy way to run localapps atm ...
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| 12:14 | if you want to fiddle with it: sudo ltsp-build-client --chroot testing
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| 12:14 | <bartolomeojsimps> how i know that the files i copy wereńt ther before?
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| 12:14 | <ogra> then you can play around in the testing chroot without doing harm to your actual setup
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| 12:14 | DonSilver has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:15 | <ogra> bartolomeojsimps, well, didnt you look before you copied stuff over existing files ?
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| 12:15 | i'd alwas do a backup of files before copying something just over them
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| 12:15 | *always
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| 12:16 | <bartolomeojsimps> i did it with sudo, so it didn't ask me confirmation
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| 12:16 | am i right?
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| 12:16 | <ogra> indeed
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| 12:16 | it expects that you know what youre doing if you use sudo and gain administrative rights
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| 12:17 | <bartolomeojsimps> what if i remove those files, after doing a backup
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| 12:17 | <ogra> one thing you can do is: sudo mv /opt/ltsp/i386 /opt/ltsp/i386.old
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| 12:17 | and get a clean client setup with: sudo ltsp-build-client
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| 12:17 | that will recreate everything under /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 12:18 | before making any changes make a tar archive of that dir ... so you can always play it back
| |
| 12:18 | <bartolomeojsimps> what info i lose if i do taht
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| 12:18 | that
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| 12:19 | <ogra> depends what you already changed in your chroot
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| 12:19 | <bartolomeojsimps> i don't understand, pleas explain me
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| 12:19 | <ogra> you lose only stuff you manually changed in /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 12:22 | <bartolomeojsimps> what happens with the clients that are actually online
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| 12:22 | vagrantc has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:22 | <ogra> they need to reboot
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| 12:22 | <bartolomeojsimps> it seems very serious
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| 12:23 | did they stuck if i do it know? their process stops ?
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| 12:23 | <ogra> well, why do you blindly copy files around on a production system ?
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| 12:23 | on 7.04 it will break ... that used nfs ... if the files are gone from /opt/ltsp/i386 they will liekly break
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| 12:24 | DonSilver has quit IRC | |
| 12:26 | <kysucix> is unionfs usable with debian ?
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| 12:26 | <bartolomeojsimps> one last question
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| 12:26 | how can i know the defalut files that were in the /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib directory?
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| 12:26 | <ogra> kysucix, vagrantc can answer that
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| 12:27 | bartolomeojsimps, only idf you build a fresh chroot with ltsp-build-client else you cant compare
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| 12:28 | <bartolomeojsimps> can i do it in a testing dir?
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| 12:28 | <kysucix> vagrantc, is unionfs usable with debian ?
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| 12:28 | <ogra> bartolomeojsimps, thats what i said above
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| 12:28 | see the command i wrote there
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| 12:28 | <bartolomeojsimps> sudo ltsp-build-client --chroot testing
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| 12:29 | <ogra> kysucix, generally it should work (works in ubuntu since 8 months now) but i dont know the status of the kernel module in debian atm
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| 12:29 | DonSilver has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:29 | <ogra> bartolomeojsimps, exactly
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| 12:29 | kysucix, and indeed sid only :)
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| 12:32 | <vagrantc> kysucix: it was working in sid a little while back, but then initramfs-tools dropped "grep" and "tr" from the default... so we either have to re-write the initramfs-tools bits that enable nbd+squashfs+unionfs, or manually add grep and tr to the initramfs
| |
| 12:32 | <kysucix> ok
| |
| 12:32 | <vagrantc> but the unionfs part of it was working as of a couple months ago
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| 12:34 | daya has quit IRC | |
| 12:34 | <ogra> vagrantc, ugh, why did debian do that ?
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| 12:34 | we still have grep and tr ... i'm 100% sure
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| 12:36 | <vagrantc> ogra: you haven't synced initramfs-tools with debian since edgy, i don't think
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| 12:36 | <ogra> no
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| 12:36 | well, we cherrypicked patches afaik
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| 12:36 | <vagrantc> yes
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| 12:36 | <ogra> the nfsroot one is in since gutsy
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| 12:36 | but i dont think there is much interest in most of the debian changes
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| 12:37 | especially since there is a ton of new stuff being done in ubuntu for hardy atm i dont think they plan to break it by mergeing :)
| |
| 12:37 | the new error handling will be such a relief
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| 12:38 | proper messages instead of dumb busybox propmpts without any indicatior
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| 12:38 | <vagrantc> i think maks wanted to get it down to just klibc-utils, and drop anything depending on glibc
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| 12:39 | <kysucix> thx
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| 12:39 | bye
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| 12:39 | kysucix has quit IRC | |
| 12:41 | <ogra> i think that has been heavily discussed back in ubuntu already and we had a reason to keep glibc ...
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| 12:41 | dont ask me which :)
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| 12:41 | jeff bailey would know
| |
| 12:41 | i asked about that at the very beginning of my ltsp work and was told off :)
| |
| 12:48 | * ogra wonders how much truth is in the statement that fedora plans to switch its package management completely to bzr like stated in http://madduck.net/blog/2008.01.29:consolidating-packaging-workflows-across-distros/ ... i wonder if warren knows | |
| 12:49 | <ogra> that'd be extremely cool :)
| |
| 12:49 | anyway, dinner etc ...
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| 12:53 | <warren> ogra, no idea who this guy is
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| 12:53 | ogra, but he has no clue what he's talking about
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| 12:53 | ogra, fedora uses pretty much every vcs tool for different purposes, and bzr is a really tiny minority
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| 12:54 | ogra, and we are nowhere near going to anything for packages yet
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| 14:09 | <Blinny> I'm putting some lines in /var/lib/tftpboot/i386/lts.conf for testing purposes (X_COLOR_DEPTH=8) and they don't seem to be taking. Is there a log file or something I can check to see what the issue is?
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| 14:09 | This is LTSP5 on 7.10
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| 14:40 | <mcfloppy_> hello
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| 14:40 | someone expirence with ltsp5 and sound (pulse audio)
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| 14:40 | ?
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| 14:42 | <tarzeau> sound yes, it works
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| 14:42 | pulse audio.. no idea
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| 14:43 | mcfloppy_: what sound do you listen to?
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| 14:44 | <vagrantc> mcfloppy_: what linux distro?
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| 14:50 | <vagrantc> warren: i have patches to ldm's rc.d support to allow /etc/ldm/rc.d, @libexec@/ldm/rc.d and /usr/share/ldm/rc.d simultaneously
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| 14:50 | <warren> what is ldm's rc.d for?
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| 14:50 | * warren didn't get ldm to actually work on fedora yet | |
| 14:51 | <vagrantc> warren: it's where ltspfs hooks get plugged in ... basically scripts that are run at login and potentially logout
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| 14:53 | <warren> vagrantc, k
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| 14:55 | <vagrantc> warren: i think the patches add a couple more filesystem calls, but overall shouldn't be too harsh of a performance cost, for full backwards compatibility and future compatibility, and gives the sysadmin the ability to override a plugin
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| 14:55 | ogra: any thoughts on that?
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| 14:55 | <reh> so
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| 14:55 | reh is now known as mcfloppy | |
| 14:55 | <mcfloppy> hrhr
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| 14:56 | <vagrantc> mcfloppy: what linux distro?
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| 14:56 | <mcfloppy> i use debian last stable ;)
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| 14:56 | ltsp5
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| 14:56 | and want to run pulseaudio
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| 14:56 | <vagrantc> using the ltsp backports?
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| 14:57 | <mcfloppy> ii ltsp-server 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1 basic LTSP server environment
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| 14:57 | ii ltsp-server-standalone 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1 complete LTSP server environment
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| 14:57 | <vagrantc> ah, those are quite old.
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| 14:57 | i would recommend upgrading and rebuilding your ltsp environment
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| 14:57 | <mcfloppy> should i upgrade?
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| 14:57 | ok
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| 14:58 | <vagrantc> !debian
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| 14:58 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "debian" is is a GNU/Linux based operating system that makes an excellent LTSP server. You can find it at http://www.debian.org. for information about LTSP on debian see http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP
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| 14:58 | <vagrantc> mcfloppy: there should be a howto
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| 14:58 | <mcfloppy> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Ltsp5 this?
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| 14:59 | <vagrantc> mcfloppy: http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto
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| 14:59 | <mcfloppy> yes i see
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| 15:01 | should i use the apt version or the backported?
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| 15:01 | <vagrantc> apt version?
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| 15:01 | <mcfloppy> ah ok.. i must take the backport
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| 15:02 | If you want to use newer LTSP related packages (with ltspfs and pulseaudio sound):.....
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| 15:02 | <vagrantc> to get support for pulseaudio, i would recommend following the instructions for the backport
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| 15:02 | <mcfloppy> ;)
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| 15:16 | damn job :p
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| 16:09 | <mcfloppy_> back
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| 16:09 | so..... i have a new problem :)
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| 16:10 | i dont know how to install the binary nvidia driver on my new backport ltsp5
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| 16:10 | i cant remind how i did it the last time
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| 16:11 | <vagrantc> the same way you would on a system with a harddisk
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| 16:11 | with one difference ...
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| 16:11 | chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 16:11 | and then run all your commands
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| 16:11 | like apt-get install xserver-xorg-video-nvidia-evil-proprietary-driver
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| 16:12 | <mcfloppy_> ok
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| 16:15 | hmmm
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| 16:15 | nvidia has its own installer
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| 16:16 | <PerfDave> mcfloppy_: nvidia's install script tends to crap all over distribution files though. Most distributions have specific ways for installing the proprietary driver, and they're best followed.
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| 16:18 | <mcfloppy_> hmm
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| 16:18 | ok
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| 16:57 | <mcfloppy_> damn
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| 16:57 | nothing works
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| 17:12 | <loather-work> this should be fun. i have to install ubuntu into a VM in order to create my chroot.
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| 17:16 | <mcfloppy_> hehe
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| 17:16 | now i do a very bad hack
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| 17:17 | install the same kernel on the server and reboot.... then i can compile my nvidiakernel in chroot ^^
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| 17:17 | <mcfloppy_> cause the installertool ignores a other kernelsource then the running
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| 19:17 | <jammcq> hey all
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| 19:17 | !seen sbalneav
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| 19:17 | <ltspbot> jammcq: sbalneav was last seen in #ltsp 1 day, 9 hours, 19 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <sbalneav> someones sent folder didn't come a cross.
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