IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 23 April 2012 (all times are UTC)
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| 05:23 | <alkisg> vagrantc: I'm using a recipe which builds on your https://code.launchpad.net/~vagrantc/ltsp/ldm-debian-packaging - is it easy for to remove "chmod +x debian/ldm/usr/share/ldm/ssh-hostchecker" from debian/rules so that I request a new build and see if it works?
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| 05:24 | <vagrantc> i don't know anything about launchpad recipes
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| 05:24 | <alkisg> *for you
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| 05:24 | vagrantc: you don't need to; I just need you to update your branch to reflect the ssh-hostchecker removal, if you don't mind
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| 05:25 | <vagrantc> ssh-hostchecker is going away? good...
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| 05:25 | <alkisg> I removed it from trunk, but I'd prefer to build on launchpad instead of locally, and if you updated the packaging tree it would make it easy for me to build without uploading a branch of my own
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| 05:26 | https://code.launchpad.net/~alkisg/+recipe/ldm : lp:~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ldm-trunk
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| 05:26 | nest ldm-debian-packaging lp:~vagrantc/ltsp/ldm-debian-packaging debian
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| 05:26 | It means "merge trunk with the packaging and build the result"
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| 05:29 | <vagrantc> alkisg: it might make sense to add -o CheckHostIP=no
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| 05:30 | <alkisg> True, we could put that in ldm options
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| 05:30 | I also experimented with putting "*" in front of the ssh keys, and nothing was checked, hostname nor ip
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| 05:30 | <vagrantc> evil.
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| 05:31 | <alkisg> But checking at least the hostname is wiser :D
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| 05:31 | <vagrantc> yeah, ssh-hostchecker allowed for MITM attacks with multiple servers.
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| 05:32 | alkisg: i can push it now, although it may be some time before launchpad mirrors the branch
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| 05:33 | <alkisg> Aah I thought it was the other way around
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| 05:33 | vagrantc: please do though and I'll test later on when it's available
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| 05:34 | <vagrantc> for the debian-specific parts, i host on debian servers as the primary location
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| 05:34 | launchpad just has a few mirrors
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| 05:34 | <alkisg> So now it's a matter of policy, if one uses hostnames both in ltsp-update-sshkeys <hosts> and in LDM_SERVER, then he doesn't need to run ltsp-update-sshkeys when he updates their IP
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| 05:34 | But if he puts IPs there, he does
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| 05:35 | <vagrantc> and the default case uses the ltsp default of "server" which automatically gets added to /etc/hosts
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| 05:35 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 05:36 | <vagrantc> i swear i suggested we do that at the BTS, but instead we got ssh-hostchecker :(
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| 05:36 | <alkisg> Haha, better late than never
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| 05:37 | <vagrantc> and especially before debian freeze
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| 05:37 | <alkisg> Next I'll commit a client-side utility, "ltsp-cleanup-image" or something
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| 05:38 | Which removes users etc, will be called from the server when ltsp-update-image --export-root is executed
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| 05:39 | (thanks btw!)
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| 05:42 | <vagrantc> launchpad should say how long till next mirror
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| 05:42 | er, pushed ldm-debian-packaging ...
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| 05:43 | <alkisg> Last mirrored: 3 hours ago Next mirror: in 2 hours
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| 05:43 | Nice!
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| 12:41 | <elias_a> muppis: Do you happen to know Janne Karjanlahti in Pomarkku? He is taking care of the LTSP of Nakkila high school.
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| 12:42 | <muppis> elias_a, nope.
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| 12:45 | <elias_a> muppis: Have I told you about Educoss-list? Do you know it?
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| 12:45 | <muppis> elias_a, yes you have told. Sorry, but haven't you joined to it.
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| 12:46 | <elias_a> muppis: I run the list. I just wanted to makes sure you know about it.
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| 12:47 | All Finns check out this years workshop:
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| 12:47 | http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Ty%C3%B6paja_2012
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| 12:48 | It is already 2.5.2012 so you have to hurry if you plan to travel to Töysä in Ostrobothnia...
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| 12:49 | <muppis> Traveling is not the problem, schedule is. Already planned that week. :(
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| 12:50 | <elias_a> Ok.
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| 13:27 | <mealstrom> hi, how to correct configure printer to all users, that is shared via smb?
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| 13:47 | <dobber> anyone have problems with skype eating too much memory ?
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| 13:51 | <mealstrom> i've got shared printer (smb) on host machine. how to share it to ltsp-clients ?
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| 14:16 | <brunolambert> dobber: Skype is an alcoholic when it comes to memory, even on a normal workstation.
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| 14:17 | <dobber> memory spikes to 4gb and skype crashes
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| 14:18 | <brunolambert> I've seen Skype eating almost 8GB
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| 14:19 | <dead_inside> then why use it?
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| 14:21 | <brunolambert> because it works and when not opened 24/7 for days, it does not take too much memory.
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| 14:29 | <mealstrom> brunolambert: make a script to restart skype at midnight
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| 14:30 | how to fix cupsd with apparmor at name="/rofs/usr/lib/libcupsmime.so.1" . (operation OPEN denied)
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| 14:30 | &
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| 16:24 | <talntid> I have a currently-deployed 30-agent LTSP setup... It's in production right now, and load averages are 30-70
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| 16:25 | things are laggy. Can I get some suggestions as to what I should do? It seems firefox/flash may be eating up the resources.
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| 16:25 | server has 8gb memory. 6core 2.65ghz
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| 16:27 | also willing to pay for some consulting time, if someone wants to go that route, and knows their stuff :)
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| 16:27 | http://pastebin.com/0bqkJmXA
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| 16:31 | <dead_inside> if each of the 30+ agents has firefox/flash open and you are using thin client setup you need a hell of alot more ram
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| 16:31 | like 6 times as much ram
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| 16:31 | <talntid> I can move it to a server with 64gb ram
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| 16:31 | or, I can offload it to localapps with some help, maybe? :)
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| 16:31 | each thin client is a 2.6ghz, 1gb ram
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| 16:32 | <dead_inside> you might get away with running firefox and flash locally
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| 16:33 | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTSPLocalAppSetup
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| 16:40 | <||cw> or even switch to fat a client setup, a client with those specs would do well enough
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| 16:41 | <dead_inside> if you go the fat client route make sure to use network swap, end users can fill up 1G of ram quickly on their own
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| 16:42 | <talntid> what is suggested more, fat client, or localapps?
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| 16:42 | try localapps first, and if not, move to fatclient?
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| 16:42 | <dead_inside> either options has their advantages, its really up to you
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| 16:45 | <talntid> when i set localapps=firefox..
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| 16:45 | so I also need to set localapps=plugin-container?
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| 16:46 | <dead_inside> no you just need to be sure flash is installed in the client image
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| 16:47 | only firefox needs to be in localapps=
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| 16:47 | <talntid> k
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| 16:47 | <dead_inside> you also have the option for using the 64G ram server and staying with thin cleints
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| 16:50 | <talntid> yeah, but I am using that for other VM's... I -could- move it there, but.. I didn't buy that for this
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| 16:55 | <dead_inside> oh i see
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| 16:57 | <talntid> just did firefox as localapp and installed flash. will reboot the clients and see what happens
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| 16:59 | <dead_inside> sweet
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| 17:00 | <talntid> man this sucks trying to run commands on this thing.. lol
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| 17:00 | on the update-image... takes forever since loads are high
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| 17:11 | <GodFather> knipwim, ping
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| 17:15 | <talntid> can I uninstall firefox on the main server, to... ensure they can only access the localapp?
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| 17:15 | i have all my users dropping off right now... then I'll have one login, check to see localapp works, then have them all log back i
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| 17:17 | <dead_inside> i would not recommend uninstalling firefox on the main until you are sure the localapp is the route you want to go
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| 17:18 | <talntid> how do i know if it's running local?
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| 17:18 | <dead_inside> on the client
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| 17:19 | open a terminal
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| 17:19 | <dead_inside> ltsp-localapps xterm
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| 17:19 | this will open an xterm window
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| 17:19 | run top
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| 17:19 | and see if firefox is running
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| 17:25 | <talntid> localapp works
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| 17:26 | <dead_inside> then i would have everyone log in and try it and see how it affects the real load
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| 17:26 | if your server load dropped and your users are happy then you have found your solution
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| 17:26 | <talntid> well, if everyone logs in, they'll open it using the firefox link on their desktops
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| 17:26 | <dead_inside> that should work
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| 17:26 | <talntid> they won't know to open "ltsp-localapps"
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| 17:26 | on the desktop, it opened it on server
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| 17:27 | then ltsp-localapps got it working on the client
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| 17:27 | <dead_inside> if they are using gnome and you have localapps menu set in your lts.conf their link should work
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| 17:27 | LOCAL_APPS_MENU = 'True'
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| 17:27 | <talntid> lemme check that
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| 17:28 | <dead_inside> gnome will rewrite their menu for firefox to make it run locally
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| 17:29 | <talntid> there was a local apps menu in the config. asking my monkey to see if it shows up in the system
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| 17:30 | <dead_inside> if it was in the config he should be able to open firefox like normally and it will run it as local on it's own
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| 17:30 | <talntid> firefox on the server is... firefox-2 I think
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| 17:35 | loads looking good so far
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| 17:36 | <dead_inside> whats the load at, usually you want the number to be less then the total number of cpu cores on the server
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| 17:37 | <talntid> 10:36:56 up 11:30, 27 users, load average: 3.74, 4.56, 17.17
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| 17:37 | and it's got 7 cores assigned
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| 17:37 | this is during the "flood" of everyone logging in, too.
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| 17:45 | settling down to... .load: 5.37, 5.10, 12.29
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| 17:51 | <dead_inside> thats much better then it was, how is the performance of the clients
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| 17:54 | <talntid> checking
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| 17:54 | i uninstalled firefox on the server :)
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| 17:54 | top - 10:54:51 up 11:47, 27 users, load average: 4.84, 5.52, 9.33
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| 17:55 | getting even better
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| 17:56 | they are a little slow when opening firefox, I don't know if that's normal
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| 17:56 | but when firefox is open, everything seems pretty snappy
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| 17:58 | <dead_inside> yes it will be slow opening firefox, it has to suck the firefox program from the server on to the client, but if the lag goes away once it is open you should have your solution
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| 17:58 | and it did not cost you anything
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| 17:58 | <talntid> yeah :)
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| 17:58 | I used to have 800mhz, 256mb ram wyse clients
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| 17:58 | upgraded to the lenobo s50, 2.6, 1gb ram
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| 17:59 | looks like it was the right choice for localapps
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| 17:59 | <dead_inside> indeed
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| 17:59 | <highvoltage> that's nothing. I used to have a 48k ZX Spectrum!
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| 17:59 | <dead_inside> ouch
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| 17:59 | <talntid> top - 10:59:19 up 11:52, 28 users, load average: 3.59, 4.93, 8.16
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| 17:59 | <dead_inside> did you use links instead of firefox highvoltage?
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| 18:01 | <talntid> before localapps: http://pastebin.com/0bqkJmXA after localapps: http://pastebin.com/cYJ6St4d
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| 18:01 | <alkisg> I think at that time people downloaded the internet in cassettes and used a text editor to surf
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| 18:01 | <talntid> haha
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| 18:04 | wow. load: 2.89, 4.05, 6.97
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| 18:05 | looks like that helped a LOT
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| 18:05 | thanks guys. :)
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| 18:17 | <talntid> I'v got a bunch of "ica" stuff running - not sure what that is...
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| 18:26 | <slackish> talntid: citrix?
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| 18:27 | <talntid> I don't use citrix..
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| 18:27 | but my processes show ica...
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| 18:30 | <slackish> italc-client: /usr/bin/ica
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| 18:34 | <H0ax> Hello all. I have ltsp on debian linux. I boot fluxbox and than xfreerdp to the windows terminal server. Someday the client starts to "beep" if you press any key. You can to type but with annoying beep sound. Restart of the client solves the problem for some time.
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| 18:36 | <talntid> ah, yeah, I did have italc
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| 18:36 | I'll delete that
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| 19:01 | <alkisg> H0ax: they beep in xfreerdp only, in fluxbox too, or in real console too?
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| 19:06 | <||cw> H0ax: is the thin client only using rdp, or do they do local stuff with fluxbox too?
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| 19:07 | most of mine that rdp don't use a window manager/desktop at all, just rdesktop full screen
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| 19:34 | <[GuS]> Hi Guys, is there a way to install User VNC server (http://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/X11VNC) in LTSP?
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| 19:35 | <talntid> http://wiki.centos.org/HowTos/VNC-Server
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| 19:35 | https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2007-July/001317.html
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| 19:35 | https://wiki.edubuntu.org/InstallX11VncOnLtspClients
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| 19:36 | if you still have questions, let us know :-)
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| 19:42 | <alkisg> [GuS]: x2go is usually much better than vnc
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| 19:43 | * talntid notes that | |
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| 19:44 | <[GuS]> talntid: seems that you didnt got what i need :P
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| 19:44 | <talntid> hmm?
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| 19:44 | <[GuS]> I need, like i do with x11vnc, to use the current user sesión, not a new vnc server...
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| 19:45 | alkisg: ok, i will check that...
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| 19:45 | <alkisg> So why don't you use x11vnc?
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| 19:46 | <[GuS]> alkisg: but how in the thin client?
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| 19:46 | <alkisg> How do you use it in a normal machine?
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| 19:46 | There's no difference...
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| 19:47 | Are you basically looking for a way to assist your users? Or is it something else?
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| 19:47 | <[GuS]> alkisg: it is, since it will open the connection of the server, instead of the user in the client
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| 19:47 | <alkisg> If x11vnc is ran from the user session, it will show the user desktop
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| 19:48 | <[GuS]> alkisg: i think i am not explaning myself well..
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| 19:48 | <alkisg> Please mention the whole scenario
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| 19:48 | <[GuS]> alkisg: I use x11vnc with a normal desktop, runing the current user session, and not a new one. So the user can show what is doing in his desktop.
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| 19:49 | So, i want to do the same, but in thhis new case, is about a ltsp thin client
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| 19:49 | <alkisg> There's no difference in those 2 cases
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| 19:49 | A normal desktop user runs x11vnc. It publishes his desktop in port 5900.
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| 19:50 | <alkisg> A thin client user runs x11vnc. It publishes his desktop in port 5900 of the server.
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| 19:50 | If another port is needed, you can specify it...
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| 19:50 | ...
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| 19:51 | * [GuS] back... | |
| 19:52 | <[GuS]> alkisg: if i do that, vnc connects to the current user in the server, and not on the thin client
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| 19:52 | <talntid> alkisg, you are not explaining what the END GOAL is very well.
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| 19:52 | er, [GuS]
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| 19:52 | <[GuS]> ?
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| 19:53 | <alkisg> [GuS]: you probably have another vnc server running on the server, and don't notice that x11vnc on the client runs in 5901
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| 19:53 | [GuS]: run x11vnc on a client and post the last few lines
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| 19:53 | <[GuS]> alkisg: i dont have any other vnc running
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| 19:54 | Never mind guys, i keep searching...
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| 19:55 | <talntid> [GuS], you know you have to install the x11server in the chroot of the thin client image, right?
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| 19:55 | /opt/ltsp/....
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| 19:56 | <alkisg> No he doesn't
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| 19:56 | <[GuS]> talntid: i dont need to do that...
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| 19:56 | <alkisg> Only if he tries to run it as a localapp, which isn't necessary
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| 19:56 | <[GuS]> exactly....
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| 19:56 | <talntid> right
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| 19:56 | <alkisg> [GuS]: x11vnc -noshm also helps sometimes
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| 19:56 | <[GuS]> As an example, in a normal desktop, i do x11vnc -display :0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth -rfbauth /home/user/.vnc/passwd to start the VNC on the current user sesion
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| 19:57 | <alkisg> But you shouldn't ever be able to run x11vnc from a thin client and see the server screen
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| 19:57 | That would be a major security issue
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| 19:57 | So you're clearly doing something wrong, but if you don't provide the x11vnc output we can't help
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| 19:58 | <[GuS]> If i issue that same command on the client, will start vnc of course, but in the current user sesion of the server where LTSP lies...
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| 19:58 | <alkisg> The clients don't use gdm to login
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| 19:58 | That command makes no sense in LTSP
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| 19:58 | And also you shouldn't need to specify the display or xauthority
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| 19:58 | <[GuS]> I know, is why i am asking alkisg howto...
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| 19:59 | <alkisg> Just run x11vnc from the client
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| 19:59 | Without specifying anything
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| 19:59 | <[GuS]> alkisg, that will run on current sesion? are you sure?
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| 19:59 | <alkisg> Yes
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| 19:59 | <talntid> that's how I do it.. I don't specify anything..
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| 20:00 | <alkisg> You may only need -noshm, if you try to access that display from another thin client
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| 20:00 | or from the server itself
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| 20:00 | *if you try to access that VNC display...
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| 20:01 | (10:56:57 μμ) [GuS]: As an example, in a normal desktop, i do x11vnc -display :0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth -rfbauth /home/user/.vnc/passwd to start the VNC on the current user sesion ==> also there you don't have to do that
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| 20:01 | You only need to run x11vnc
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| 20:01 | Maybe you are trying to run that command from somewhere else? From ssh maybe?
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| 20:01 | That would explain why running x11vnc is not enough in that case...
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| 20:02 | <[GuS]> Yes, from console..
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| 20:03 | <[GuS]> Have to go now... thanks.
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| 20:03 | <alkisg> OK, don't run it from console
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| 20:03 | <ogra_> to late :)
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| 20:03 | <alkisg> two late :P
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| 20:04 | <talntid> three late!
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| 20:04 | <dead_inside> am i late?
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| 20:04 | <alkisg> Nah you're right on time, here, take my sit...
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| 20:05 | <talntid> seat.
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| 20:09 | <dead_inside> i am sure he did not mean seat, no one could fill alkisg's seat
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| 20:09 | he is the ltsp god
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| 20:14 | <talntid> haha
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| 22:03 | <wcchandler> anybody hear of the raspberry pi? I'm trying to set one up as a thin client...
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| 22:04 | I can get it to nfs boot, but I don't think that should be necessary. It *has* to have an sd card to boot... so I might as well keep a lightweight image on there, right?
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| 22:05 | there's a nice debian image that I'm going off of but I can't seem to get the ltsp-client stuff to install... :/ and I'm not sure it's really necessary.
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| 22:06 | <wcchandler> do you guys have any ideas on how to approach this? I feel like I might be going backwards or the wrong way or something :/
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| 22:09 | <slackish> wcchandler: Are you keeping a list of problems and their solutions that you encounter? As soon as I get my pi, I'll be attempting the same thing.
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| 22:09 | <wcchandler> slackish
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| 22:09 | yeah, for the most part
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| 22:10 | I have a txt doc that I throw stuff on occassionally
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| 22:11 | <wcchandler> I've built an arm environment on debian squeeze but that was before I realized I might as well just keep the image on the SD card...
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| 22:11 | but even then, when I'd boot I got about ~5 different issues that kept it from getting to an LDM
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| 22:12 | <wcchandler> I hunted down some small things but for the most part I thought I was reinventing the wheel, especially considering somebody already fixed ~80% of these quirks on the released debian image
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| 22:14 | right now I'm thinking of installing ltsp-server onto the pi, then mounting the rootfs to /opt/ltsp/armel over nfs and running ltsp-chroot on it or ltsp-build-client or something... then just copy pasting the rootfs onto the SD card
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| 22:15 | in theory that should work, right?
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