IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 16 September 2007 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:22 | <sbalneav> Night all
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| 08:19 | <BlackDark> hi guys
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| 08:20 | is there an howto somewhere for the setup of local apps with ltsp 5.0 ?
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| 08:21 | ltsp.org has the documentation for LTSP 4.2, wondering if the local app thing is much different with 5.0
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| 08:22 | <sbalneav> BlackDark: We haven't got localapps working yet in 5.0 If you wanted to set it up manually, should be pretty much the same.
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| 08:23 | It was a fairly manual process in 4.2 anyway.
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| 08:23 | <BlackDark> okok
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| 08:23 | actually I'd like to make skype work
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| 08:24 | <BlackDark> problem is the sound
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| 08:25 | pulse can't capture sound yet, so I was thinking of running skype as a local application
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| 08:28 | <BlackDark> is it something planned for 7.10 ?
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| 08:28 | I meant ubuntu 7.10
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| 08:29 | <sbalneav> Well, we've planned it for the last 2 releases, but getting the server team to get ldap in a working state seems to be the holdup
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| 08:29 | so I have know idea if we'll get it done.
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| 08:30 | <ogra> sbalneav, hey, fond the reason for compiz not working
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| 08:30 | *found
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| 08:30 | <BlackDark> sbalneav: thks,
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| 08:31 | <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get install libgl1-mesa-dri && sudo ltsp-update-image
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| 08:31 | :P
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| 08:31 | <BlackDark> actually it's only to know if I put the time on my actuall installation to make it work by myself or I wait for 7.10
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| 08:31 | <ogra> sill ymissing package
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| 08:33 | <sbalneav> Morning ogra!
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| 08:33 | <ogra> sbalneav, and you were totally right, 915resolution isnt needed at all (XSERVER=intel is needed for the classmate though, defaulting to i810 breaks the resolution)
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| 08:33 | hey
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| 08:33 | <sbalneav> Hey, guess what!
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| 08:33 | I got the new cdpinger going
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| 08:33 | from udev
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| 08:33 | <ogra> yeah saw that in the backlog
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| 08:34 | <BlackDark> brb
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| 08:34 | <sbalneav> plus, now, cdroms read the volname, so when you put in the cd, you'll get "Ubuntu_6.10" instead of "cdrom0"
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| 08:34 | <ogra> so we have a little problem now ... compiz works great as in feisty with that package installed ...
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| 08:34 | but libgl1-mesa-dri is 16M big
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| 08:35 | that wont really help downsizig the edubuntu CD
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| 08:35 | <jammcq> jeez, you guys get to work early, eh?
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| 08:35 | <sbalneav> Look who's talking :)
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| 08:35 | <ogra> 3:30pm here
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| 08:35 | :)
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| 08:36 | <sbalneav> ogra: So, here's the question: do you want me to integrate the new cdpinger into the ltspfs package?
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| 08:36 | <ogra> for hardy, yes
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| 08:36 | <sbalneav> ok, for gutsy then, we'll stand pat?
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| 08:36 | <ogra> well
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| 08:37 | beta freeze is in 4 days ...
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| 08:37 | changing a whole app now is pretty risky i think
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| 08:37 | and we still have a good bunch of bugs to find i bet
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| 08:38 | (in the existing code)
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| 08:38 | <sbalneav> I can go either way. Hairy's the real prize we're after, and things are already improved so much. Yes, I agree. Lets leave things the way they are for now, and we'll get it in early for Hairy.
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| 08:38 | <ogra> also i'm seeing some weird unionfs things over here with the recent kernel ....
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| 08:39 | did you notice something like that in your logs ?
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| 08:39 | <sbalneav> I've seen some unionfs messages, it doesn't appear to affect anything that I can see.
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| 08:39 | <ogra> well, it looks like oppses ... that would be pretty bad
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| 08:40 | hmm, what do i do with libgl1-mesa-dri
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| 08:41 | <sbalneav> Document it.
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| 08:41 | <ogra> i386 iso is at 736M already :/
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| 08:42 | and i dont know hw much oo.o will give us back if its finally fixed
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| 08:42 | <jammcq> you could always throw out evolution :)
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| 08:42 | <ogra> might be 30 or only 3M
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| 08:42 | <sbalneav> right. Leave it off, and I can add a section in the handboook on it.
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| 08:42 | is it in main, or in uni?
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| 08:42 | <ogra> well, then compiz wont work in *any* edubuntu install
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| 08:42 | its a requirement
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| 08:43 | <sbalneav> Oh, we don't have it in the base cd.
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| 08:43 | ah
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| 08:43 | <ogra> yeah, thats the prob and was the initial reason for me to not have it in the ltsp-client deps
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| 08:43 | (back in the beginning of gutsy)
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| 08:44 | no GL will work without it
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| 08:44 | so we kind of need it
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| 08:47 | <sbalneav> I oo.o what made the huge cd oversizes?
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| 08:52 | Heading upstairs to make breakfast.
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| 11:26 | <joebob777as7> ok sbalneav can you give me a quick hand on making wine replicatable for all future users?
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| 11:30 | <sbalneav> You'll just have to create a drive for wine with a link in the drives folder, and install the app there. Make sure the dir's a shared dir. However, if the app sets a lot of whacky registry stuff, it may or may not work.
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| 11:31 | <joebob777as7> ok i created a drive so i go into my .wine folder and find drive_d and share it?
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| 11:32 | <Q-FUNK> creating a symbolic link to the wine tap sounds quite tipsy alright. :D
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| 11:32 | <sbalneav> OT for this channel anyway.
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| 11:33 | Better to ask in #wine, I'm not an expert by any means.
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| 11:33 | <joebob777as7> ok i'll look there first.
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| 11:38 | sbalneav, do you think it would work if I just logged in as each user on the server and installed the app individually for them?
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| 11:38 | <sbalneav> That would work for sure.
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| 11:38 | <joebob777as7> just a huge waste of space....
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| 11:39 | <sbalneav> assuming the app works under wine.
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| 11:39 | <joebob777as7> could i install it and then remove it's dir and make a link to the shared dir and bypass the registry stuff?
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| 11:39 | it does i just tested it
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| 11:40 | or do you think that would create use errors if more than one person was using it at the same time/
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| 11:40 | ?
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| 11:40 | <sbalneav> Here's an idea for you...
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| 11:40 | why don't you TRY it?
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| 11:42 | <joebob777as7> ok sorry
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| 11:42 | <sbalneav> It'll depend completely on the app, and seeing as how you haven't even told me what the app IS, I have no idea if it will work.
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| 11:43 | <joebob777as7> ies4linux (internet explorer) and office 2000
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| 11:45 | <sbalneav> Only apps I've ever run under wine have been Childview, Warcraft III (for the kids) and Fallout.
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| 11:45 | I've never run IE, and I've never used word, so I'm unqualified to say.
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| 11:45 | <joebob777as7> ok skip the wine questions i did notice on my tablet when i used the same xorg.conf on my x60-tablet my tablet portion didn't work? any idea on this? i know i'm out of what ltsp was meant to do i'm just wondering...
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| 11:46 | <sbalneav> Probably something in the xorg.conf, or the driver for the tablet isn't installed in the chroot.
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| 11:46 | <joebob777as7> ok
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| 11:48 | <sbalneav> Well, heading out for the day with the family. AFK for a bit
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| 11:48 | <joebob777as7> ok have fun sbalneav !
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| 16:55 | <george719> i'm really stuck with a pxe-e32: tftp open timeout
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| 16:55 | new install of ltsp4.1
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| 16:55 | on mepis 6.0.2
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| 16:56 | dhcpd gets ip ok
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| 17:15 | <StylusEater> hello. I just installed ltsp using the etch4.0 quick howto, configured my dhcp server, rebooted my pxe enabled client and it doesn't boot. The client finds the proper tftp root /ltsp/i386/ but it cycles through every pxelinux.cfg option without choosing one. At the end it states cannot find configuration file.
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| 17:16 | <vagrantc> StylusEater: is /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default present ?
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| 17:16 | <StylusEater> yes
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| 17:17 | <vagrantc> StylusEater: dpkg -l '*tftpd*'
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| 17:17 | StylusEater: dpkg -l '*tftpd*' | egrep ^ii
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| 17:17 | <StylusEater> I even copied the default to 01-'insert mac addr here' in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/
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| 17:17 | where you would like the output?
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| 17:18 | <vagrantc> if you do the second, it should only be one line, no ?
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| 17:18 | <StylusEater> ii tftpd-hpa 0.43-1.1 HPA's tftp server
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| 17:18 | <vagrantc> ok
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| 17:18 | grep ^tftp /etc/inetd.conf
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| 17:20 | <dniel> StylusEater: I have Debian Lenny and for install LTSP-5 I followed this instruction
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| 17:20 | StylusEater: http://linuxagora.com/vbforum/showthread.php?p=4156
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| 17:20 | vagrantc: hi!
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| 17:20 | <StylusEater> tftp dgram udp wait root /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /var/lib/tftpboot
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| 17:21 | dniel: thx
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| 17:22 | <vagrantc> StylusEater: ps aux | egrep inetd
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| 17:22 | <StylusEater> root 2660 0.0 0.1 1748 568 ? Ss 17:53 0:00 /usr/sbin/inetd
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| 17:22 | if that weren't up I wouldn't be here I think... :-)
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| 17:22 | <dniel> vagrantc: did you write this tutorial? --> http://linuxagora.com/vbforum/showthread.php?p=4156
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| 17:23 | <vagrantc> dniel: no
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| 17:23 | dniel: reading it now
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| 17:23 | <StylusEater> that tutorial is almost the same as the one listed on the ltsp site...
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| 17:23 | but the ltsp site doesn't mention a boot disk b/c it's pxe loading and using tftp
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| 17:23 | I'll check that out though...
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| 17:24 | vagrantc: I'm not sure what's wrong b/c I've checked the config for tftp, inetd.conf and my config
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| 17:24 | tcpdump isn't showing much activity either
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| 17:24 | <vagrantc> StylusEater: have a firewall ?
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| 17:25 | <StylusEater> that's my next question, but I'm not typically a debian user
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| 17:25 | /etc/init.d/ <--- no firewall script or anything there...
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| 17:25 | I would assume iptables?
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| 17:26 | <dniel> vagrantc: I thought it was you because the surnames are similars
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| 17:26 | <StylusEater> meh... iptables -L shows all accept
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| 17:26 | I'm gonna get some foo then come back and look some more. thx for the ideas vagrantc and dniel.
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| 17:28 | <dniel> StylusEater: ok byes!
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| 17:28 | vagrantc: when are you comming to argentina?
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| 17:28 | vagrantc: have you got any plans?
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| 17:30 | <vagrantc> dniel: next year, for the debian conference
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| 17:31 | dniel: in august
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| 17:33 | <dniel> vagrantc: that's great! And if you want you can come and visit Cordoba.
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| 17:36 | <vagrantc_> dniel: i hope to spend several months there, if i can :)
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| 17:59 | <StylusEater> GOT IT!!!
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| 17:59 | I needed next-server 'my dhcp server IP'; in my dhcpd.conf file
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| 18:02 | <vagrantc_> oh, yeah.
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| 18:03 | sorry that didn't make it into etch
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| 18:03 | it's fixed in lenny
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| 18:04 | next-server used to be optional, but upstream dhcp developers decided it wasn't proper behavior to assume next-server...
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| 18:28 | <StylusEater> vagrantc: it's ok. I've just started using debian (moving over from fedora).
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| 20:01 | <ari_stress> morning
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| 21:20 | <joebob777as7> which processor is going to give me the best server speed and quality to clients? Am I looking for an amd opteron or xeon? also how much memory is too much for 10 clients?
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| 21:21 | <ari_stress> hi guys, i'm told that everything in unix/linux has a symbol in filesystem, such as /dev/lp0 for printer, what i cannot find is the symbol for keyboard and mouse. what is it?
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| 21:22 | <joebob777as7> ari_stress, /dev/input?
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| 21:24 | <ari_stress> joebob777as7:
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| 21:24 | [root@server1 ~]# ls -l /dev/input/
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| 21:24 | event0 event1 mice mouse0
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| 21:25 | <betolley> Does rdesktop work with vista over a wireless connection for anyone here? It works greate over a wireless for me with 1.5.0 but wireless runs and freezes every few seconds.
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| 21:26 | great over a wired...sorry
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| 21:27 | <ari_stress> betolley: you can try to reduce the quality of the rdesktop
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| 21:27 | <betolley> runs fine at 256 colors...crap at 16 bit or higher.
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| 21:27 | but I can connect to xp system no problem.
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| 21:46 | <george719> how can i veryfy that tftpd is running corrctly? i get a ip but timeout on pxe tftp, logs show no activity after ip is accepted
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| 21:48 | <joebob777as7> george719 add SERVER=<serverip> in the lts.conf file under [default]
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| 21:48 | tell me if that fixes it..
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| 21:48 | <sbalneav> george719: If you type: netstat -an | grep :69 what do yoou get?
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| 21:48 | joebob777as7: That won't help tftp
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| 21:49 | <joebob777as7> isn't that the same thing that happened to me?
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| 21:49 | <sbalneav> no
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| 21:50 | <joebob777as7> oh ok
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| 21:50 | which processor do you think would be best an opteron or xeon?
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| 21:50 | is amd support better?
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| 21:51 | also what amount of ram is too much for 10 clients?
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| 21:52 | <sbalneav> !sizing
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| 21:52 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: Error: "sizing" is not a valid command.
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| 21:52 | <sbalneav> !serversizing
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| 21:52 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: Error: "serversizing" is not a valid command.
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| 21:52 | <sbalneav> !topics
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| 21:52 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: "topics" is To get a list of topics, type ltspbot: factoids search --values
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| 21:52 | <sbalneav> ltspbot: factoids search --values
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| 21:52 | ltspbot`: factoids search --values
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| 21:52 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: 'ltsp', 'sbalneav', 'icewm', 'frappr', 'wiki', 'debian', 'edubuntu', 'dhcpd', 'greyscreen', 'ltsp42', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'checklist', 'muekow', 'bestltspdistro', 'serversize', 'wireless', 'sound', 'topics', 'integration', 'lts.conf', 'pastebot', 'bootfloppy', 'ltsp5', 'tarball', 'download', 'monkeys', 'ogra', 'nfs', 'nfsnotresp', 'js', 's', (1 more message)
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| 21:53 | <sbalneav> ah
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| 21:53 | !serversize
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| 21:53 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: "serversize" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/ServerSizing
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| 21:53 | <sbalneav> Or, the edubuntu handbook has a section on it as well.
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| 21:54 | <vagrantc> you can never have too much ram.
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| 21:55 | i'd be much more worried about too little
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| 21:56 | <sbalneav> More = better
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| 21:56 | <joebob777as7> vagrantc, if i put 4 gigs of ram in an opteron bases system isn't processor going to dictate how fast apps will open? where do you think it will get to a point that i won't notice the difference with 10 clients?
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| 21:57 | <vagrantc> joebob777as7: a lot of the time, your limitation is disk speed ... and having way too much ram helps that out a lot because linux will just use extra ram as disk cache
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| 21:58 | <joebob777as7> is there a way to make it all run in memory once it's loaded?
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| 21:58 | <vagrantc> joebob777as7: and it HIGHLY depends on what you're doing where the point of noticing is
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| 21:59 | joebob777as7: yes, but that's a waste of ram. linux can pretty intelligently figure out what should stay cached vs. what you only access once in a blue moon
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| 21:59 | <joebob777as7> well not much actually just web browsing maybe a little picture manipulation and inkscape maybe watch a movie at the same time
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| 22:00 | movie will be xvid
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| 22:00 | <vagrantc> joebob777as7: the only real answer is: try it out and figure it out for yourself.
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| 22:01 | <joebob777as7> yeah i'm only going to buy a processor once though that's my real question... is an AMD Dual-Core Opteron 275 Italy 2.2GHz going to be good? or should i go bigger?
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| 22:01 | <vagrantc> joebob777as7: the guidelines mentioned on the ServerSizing page are ... guidelines. in practice, you just have to experiment and try it out.
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| 22:02 | <joebob777as7> ok
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| 22:04 | <dniel> vagrantc: one question! Cual es la pagina esa en la cual participas? www.freegeek.org?
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| 22:04 | <vagrantc> dniel: si
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| 22:04 | <dniel> vagrantc: thanks!
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| 22:05 | vagrantc: i will watch that!
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| 22:10 | vagrantc: which is the configuration in a thin client to use a serial mouse?
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| 22:11 | vagrantc: it must be configured in lts.conf?
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| 22:48 | <vagrantc> dniel: which version of ltsp ?
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| 22:48 | dniel: X_MOUSE_DEVICE=/dev/ttyS0
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| 22:49 | dniel: X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=ms
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| 22:49 | oh wait
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| 22:49 | dniel: X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=microsoft
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| 22:49 | think ms was XFree86 3.x
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| 22:51 | <dniel> vagrantc: which version of ltsp ? -> LTSP-5
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| 22:51 | <vagrantc> dniel: well, those should work with any version of LTSP
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| 22:51 | <dniel> vagrantc: okey thaks!
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| 22:51 | <vagrantc> dniel: with ltsp5 on debian etch, you might also want to install the joystick package
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| 22:51 | dniel: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get install joystick
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| 22:52 | <dniel> vagrantc: ohh! it's good!
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| 22:52 | <vagrantc> dniel: are most serial mice, or only some ?
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| 22:53 | mouse protocol is different if you install joystick though ...
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| 22:53 | <dniel> vagrantc: the most serial mice
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| 22:53 | vagrantc: the most is serial mice
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| 22:54 | vagrantc: X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=ms or X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=microsoft?
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| 22:54 | I use xorg
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| 22:55 | <vagrantc> dniel: 2 or 3 button ?
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| 22:55 | <chris_punches> IMPS/2
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| 22:55 | jesus.
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| 22:55 | <vagrantc> for a serial mouse ?
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| 22:55 | <dniel> vagrantc: 3 button
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| 22:55 | * jammcq wonders why people don't just TRY IT to see what works | |
| 22:55 | <chris_punches> oh shoot, im so sorry, i was distracted
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| 22:55 | <vagrantc> dniel: if you use joystick, use X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=ms
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| 22:56 | <jammcq> surely it's easier to try both of them, than it is to interrupt a developer who is busy trying to add features or fix bugs
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| 22:56 | <dniel> vagrantc: and if I don't use jostick?
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| 22:56 | <vagrantc> it's exceptionally confusing
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| 22:56 | because if you use joystick, it's a different protocol
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| 22:58 | <dniel> vagrantc: and if I don't use joystick, I use X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=microsoft?
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| 22:58 | <vagrantc> i *think* so
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| 22:58 | but it's better to use joystick
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| 22:59 | oh dear
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| 22:59 | but if you use joystick, then X_MOUSE_DEVICE=/dev/input/mice
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| 23:03 | <dniel> vagrantc: Conclusion: If I use Joystick and serial mice, then I use X_MOUSE_DEVICE=/dev/input/mice and X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=ms and if I don't use Joystick but I use serial mice then I use X_MOUSE_DEVICE=/dev/ttyS0 and X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL=microsoft
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| 23:03 | vagrantc: that is correct?
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| 23:03 | <vagrantc> think so
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| 23:04 | try it and find out
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| 23:05 | <dniel> vagrantc: okey! I will prove it
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| 23:05 | vagrantc: thanks again!
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| 23:14 | <dniel> vagrantc: okey I will go to sleep! ZzzZzZ It's to late! Byes
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