IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 30 March 2010 (all times are UTC)
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| 10:26 | <CAN-o-SPAM> hello #ltsp
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| 12:19 | <Lns> stgraber: ping?
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| 12:22 | <Lns> hrm, upon updating my ubu lucid chroot this morning I'm getting the following error when updating dbus : http://pastebin.com/7L3AQDbx
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| 12:59 | <plasticdoc> Do you know how to check, from a shell script, if a system is getting its IP data from DHCP?
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| 13:05 | <Lns> plasticdoc: you mean whether or not an interface is getting an ip address from a dhcp server?
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| 13:10 | <plasticdoc> Lns: It is more if the address it got was obtained via DHCP, or some static address from /etc/network/interfaces
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| 13:11 | <Lns> you need to do this from a script?
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| 13:11 | <vbundi> plasticdoc: you want to know if a machine is obtaining an ip address from the DHCP server vs setting it's own?
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| 13:14 | <alkisg> plasticdoc: run a ps -ef and see if a dhcp client daemon is running
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| 13:15 | <Lns> alkisg: even if dhcpcd/whatever is running, wouldn't it honor /etc/network/interfaces or equiv over it?
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| 13:15 | <alkisg> Lns, if it got an ip lease, it should have a client daemon running to renew the lease when it expires
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| 13:15 | If it didn't, there's no reason to run a daemon
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| 13:16 | So theoretically no matter if it's using networkmanager or /etc/network/interfaces, the client daemon should be there.
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| 13:16 | <Lns> alkisg: right..but dhcp client daemon usually is installed by default (at least in ubu) either way
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| 13:16 | <plasticdoc> I am changing the djbdns .deb package. The debian/dnscache-run.postinst has a buggy way to check if someone gets its ip from dhcp, in which case the # prepend line must be uncommented from /etc/dhcp3/dhclient.conf; or if someone is getting its ip from a static setting, in which case one must make sure that 'nameserver 127.0.0.1' is the first line in /etc/resolv.conf
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| 13:18 | <alkisg> plasticdoc: so you only care about dhclient? If so, just check if it's running
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| 13:18 | That won't work with other clients / conffiles, though
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| 13:18 | network manager exposes a dbus interface for connections
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| 13:18 | But not all people use nm...
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| 13:19 | <Lns> that's an understatement for this chan alkisg ;)
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| 13:26 | <plasticdoc> I am changing this HowTo <http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=956864> . But, instead of compiling, I will use the recently revamped djbdns .deb packages. In changing the .deb packages I must remove the user intervention at "5. Configure & start dnscache -> If your computer uses DHCP"
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| 13:28 | I think that I will do both: always insert the local server at the first line of /etc/resolv.conf and, if finding a /etc/dhcp3/dhclient.conf file just enable the "prepend ..." line.
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| 13:28 | Thank you.
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| 14:15 | <Lns> Does this look sane? I just wrote it up, needs some proofreading: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UseStgraberPPA
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| 14:20 | <vbundi> Lns: I like it
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| 14:22 | <Lns> vbundi: thanks
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| 14:22 | I know it comes up for me quite often so its good to have it written down =)
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| 14:23 | I just need to know whether it's ok with stgraber to have it up there - I'm not sure how stable each and every update he puts up there is..but iirc he says they're ok to use for most cases
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| 14:23 | <CAN-o-SPAM_away> Lns: good idea, just scanned it quickly
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| 14:24 | <Lns> CAN-o-SPAM: cool. thx =)
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| 14:24 | next up is cleaning up gnome panel applets/non-ltsp stuff for 10.04
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| 14:25 | that reboot/shutdown/ubuntu one/unified messaging spam is bugging the $*&@ outta me
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| 14:25 | I wish they'd keep that out of the default config
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| 14:25 | at least the last 2
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| 14:26 | <vbundi> well
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| 14:26 | while I don't really like them either.. a 'built-in' messenger might be nice for some LTSP setups
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| 14:27 | <Lns> i'm a minimalist at heart, especially when it comes to larger ltsp setups...the less on users' screens, the less can go wrong
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| 14:27 | <stgraber> Lns: I'm fine with that, just see my note in #edubuntu. Usually I have relatively stable backports for older releases and very fresh bzr snapshots for the current dev release.
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| 14:28 | Lns: if you want something that's recent and stable (as in, in production), Revolution Linux's ppa has that
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| 14:28 | (that's what we use for all our customers on pretty much all supported releases of Ubuntu)
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| 14:28 | <Lns> stgraber: great. Hmm, maybe i'll add the revlinux ppa to the wiki page then for that
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| 14:29 | what's the ppa url?
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| 14:30 | <stgraber> http://ppa.launchpad.net/revolution-linux/ppa/
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| 14:30 | so that's https://launchpad.net/~revolution-linux/+archive/ppa/
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| 14:31 | <vbundi> here's a question... I have IBM Thinkcentre's with built in speakers as clients and by default, the audio device is configured wrong... is there a way to set this permenantly for every user?
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| 14:31 | <Lns> stgraber: thx
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| 14:36 | <vbundi> I mean.. set it correctly for every user... it just requires going into the preferences under the gnome-panel app and selecting the proper output device
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| 14:38 | <Lns> vbundi: if the panel app uses gconf, you can change it globally through the gconf key..
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| 14:40 | stgraber: so i see no ltsp packages for lucid in revlinux's ppa.. is that just because you're not using it yet in production?
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| 14:45 | Cool, just updated the page to reflect either PPA. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UseStgraberPPA
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| 14:46 | <stgraber> Lns: that's because the most stable recent is in lucid
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| 14:48 | <Lns> stgraber: =p gotcha
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| 14:49 | <Lns> hrm, upon updating my ubu lucid chroot this morning I'm getting the following error when updating dbus : http://pastebin.com/7L3AQDbx - anyone have any clues?
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| 14:50 | <stgraber> export LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS=false
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| 14:50 | then try upgrading again
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| 14:52 | <Lns> strgaber: did that, same thing
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| 14:54 | <stgraber> weird
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| 15:00 | <johnny> Lns, wait for them to fix it?
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| 15:01 | <Lns> johnny: heh, yeah not sure what else could be the issue. of course seems to be an ltsp chroot specific thing since no system bus is running when you're upgrading it via chroot
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| 15:02 | <Lns> there's gotta be a way to upgrade dbus without it doing whatever it does over the system bus though..i'd think.. probably just to reset itself or something.
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| 15:05 | <johnny> Lns, if nobody else can replicate it.. that must not be the problem
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| 15:06 | <Lns> well this is new as of this morning for me, just during normal updates
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| 15:06 | <johnny> well.. i'd say just wait then
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| 15:06 | <Lns> yea
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| 15:14 | <vbundi> Lns: ahh yeah Gconf, ok thanks
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| 15:25 | <vagrantc> stgraber: have you tested multiple screen scripts on lucid? failed on debian. committed a fix to ltsp-trunk
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| 17:39 | <john> I am trying to figure out if upgrading my 7K sata disk to a 15 SAS will help bottle necks apparently caused by high CPU wait time
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| 17:39 | does anyone have any ideas in this regard?
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| 17:39 | e.g. Do fast disks matter for LTSP?
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| 17:46 | <john> There used to be info on the ltsp wiki about this but it is gone
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| 17:46 | Is anyone using Serial Attached SCSI for LTSP?
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| 17:50 | <john> sigh
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| 17:53 | <Lns> john: how many terminals and what kind of work are you talking about?
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| 17:53 | server disks are usually not the highest priority as far as bottlenecks in ltsp unless you're really hammering down on them
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| 17:57 | <john> Lns: I am really a hammering them
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| 17:58 | At least I believe that I am. I have high CPU wait times corresponding to 7Ks writes on the disk
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| 17:58 | <Lns> wow
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| 17:59 | well i'm not the expert in that :) sorry
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| 17:59 | <john> I am not either :-)
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| 18:00 | It doesn't seem like that should be a problem, but it mirrors my very high wait times so I am assuming that lots of little writes by different users is causing issues
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| 18:00 | <windmill> Hi I've finally managed to get my client to boot!! how do I log in?
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| 18:01 | Should the accounts on the server work or do I need to add accounts to the i386 directory?
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| 18:01 | <windmill> do I need to chroot or something?
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| 18:02 | <alkisg> windmill: you login with your server accounts
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| 18:02 | <windmill> alkisg, ok, that doesn't seen to work
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| 18:02 | seem*
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| 18:05 | <alkisg> windmill: tail /var/log/auth.log
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| 18:05 | Do you see a failed attempt?
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| 18:06 | <alkisg> Lns, "ltsp-master, ltsp-client, ltsp-send(-cmd)" => do they sound OK? Or it's too similar to the ltsp-server/ltsp-client?
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| 18:06 | <windmill> alkisg, no don't see any attempts
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| 18:06 | <alkisg> *ltsp-slave, I mean
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| 18:06 | windmill: distro/version?
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| 18:06 | <windmill> ubuntu karimic
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| 18:06 | karmic
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| 18:06 | <alkisg> windmill: sudo gedit /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
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| 18:07 | Put the following there:
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| 18:07 | [Default]
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| 18:07 | <Lns> alkisg: those sound too much like core components to me
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| 18:07 | <alkisg> SCREEN_02=shell
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| 18:07 | SCREEN_07=ldm
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| 18:07 | Then, reboot the client and press alt+ctrl+f2 to get to a shell prompt
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| 18:07 | Lns, those are core components
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| 18:07 | They just take care of the communications - nothing with GUI etc
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| 18:07 | <Lns> alkisg: no i mean to ltsp itself
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| 18:08 | <Lns> ltsp-client...people might confuse that with an actual ltsp terminal/client
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| 18:08 | <alkisg> ltsp-slave, I meant
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| 18:08 | <Lns> well...
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| 18:08 | <alkisg> ok, I thought so too :)
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| 18:08 | <Lns> just mho but i'd prepend something else
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| 18:08 | maybe ltsp-manager-client
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| 18:08 | if it's not too long
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| 18:10 | i dunno about master/slave myself, iiwy i'd call them something a bit more unix-y.. like ltsp-managerd or something similar
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| 18:10 | <alkisg> The problem is that both are daemons
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| 18:10 | <Lns> well like with dhcp, you've got dhcpd, then dhcpcd
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| 18:10 | <alkisg> Ah, right :)
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| 18:10 | Didn't think of that
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| 18:10 | <Lns> though i always thought dhcpcd was misleading ;)
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| 18:11 | <windmill> alkisg, am rebooting the client
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| 18:11 | <Lns> how about ltspmd, ltspmcd
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| 18:11 | <alkisg> Hmmm it doesn't sound too bad
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| 18:11 | <johnny> alkisg, so.. have you spoken to sbalnaev about this idea of yours?
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| 18:12 | hasn't he had any input?
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| 18:12 | <windmill> alkisg, I've got a terminal on the client now
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| 18:12 | <alkisg> johnny: no, the last I told him is to give me a hand on sch-scripts, but I haven't spoken to him since I started with the communications backend
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| 18:12 | windmill: try: ssh user@server
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| 18:12 | <johnny> you really should talk to him.
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| 18:12 | <alkisg> change user to an existing username
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| 18:12 | <Lns> johnny: i think he's gone for the week
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| 18:12 | <alkisg> but *don't change server*
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| 18:13 | windmill: if you see any prompts, e.g. "the ip has changed" or "do you trust this server", then you need to update your ssh keys
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| 18:13 | johnny: I'm basically done with the core implementation, in the next few days I'll shift to the GUI part
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| 18:14 | <windmill> alkisg, I got the host auth key prompt
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| 18:14 | <alkisg> I hope it can get integrated to the LTSP code tree, but as 2 separate packages, e.g. ltspmd / ltspcd
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| 18:14 | windmill: on the server, do: sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys && sudo ltsp-update-image
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| 18:15 | <windmill> alkisg, will do
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| 18:15 | <Lns> ok, i've chased and filed my bugs for the day, i'm outaheeere
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| 18:15 | Cheers to the chan
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| 19:49 | <twb> I hear that gdm dropped XDMCP support. Anybody know if xorg and/or xdm plan to do the same?
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| 19:50 | (I ask you guys because I figure you're one of the biggest use cases for XDMCP.)
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| 19:55 | <johnny> twb, it doesn't affect us
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| 19:55 | xorg isn't going to drop it
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| 19:55 | we don't use xdmcp by default anyways
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| 19:55 | <twb> OK, my main worry was that Xorg were gonna follow gnome's lunacy.
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| 19:56 | johnny: because you run the WM and such from the client, and use ssh -X for just the apps?
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| 19:56 | <johnny> yes
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| 19:56 | no.. we run wm from the server
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| 19:56 | but ssh -X to start it up
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| 19:56 | i wouldn't call it lunacy
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| 19:56 | <twb> Why, what's wrong with XDMCP?
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| 19:56 | <johnny> the main use case of gdm is much more specific to the machine
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| 19:56 | nothing is wrong with xdmcp
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| 19:56 | it's just that gdm is more specific to the machine now
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| 19:57 | <twb> OK, so gdm is just narrowing its focus to a particular use case
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| 19:57 | <johnny> yes
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| 19:57 | <twb> I can live with that :-)
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| 19:57 | <johnny> exactly
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| 19:57 | <twb> Thanks for explaining it to me.
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| 19:57 | <johnny> i don't personally know anybody that actually uses xdmcp tho..
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| 19:58 | they all use ssh -X
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| 19:58 | it'd just be nicer of ssh shipped with the null cipher
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| 19:58 | if it did.. we'd drop xdmcp (what we call LDM_DIRECTX in lts.conf) altogether
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| 20:01 | <twb> I guess most networks aren't ultimately trusted
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| 20:02 | <johnny> that's why we tunnel in ssh by default
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| 21:37 | <jammcq> howdie
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| 21:51 | <dberkholz> johnny: anything besides dracut that would be good to put an undergrad student on for the summer?
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| 21:51 | i've got someone interested in easy-to-configure clusters, ltsp setups, etc
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| 21:52 | hiya jammcq
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| 21:52 | <jammcq> hey dberkholz
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| 21:52 | how's it goin?
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| 21:52 | <dberkholz> jammcq: finally finding a bit of time for linux stuff again. starting a new job is always tough
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| 21:52 | <jammcq> cool. you all done with school?
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| 21:53 | <dberkholz> jammcq: sorta. i'm doing a postdoc now
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| 21:53 | <johnny> jammcq, and he has a kid ..
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| 21:53 | <jammcq> ah. you still in oregon?
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| 21:53 | johnny: yeah, I heard about the "kid" :)
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| 21:53 | <dberkholz> jammcq: nah, headed back to minnesota where our families are from
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| 21:53 | <johnny> dberkholz, plymouth?
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| 21:53 | <jammcq> cool
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| 21:53 | <dberkholz> johnny: that is where i'm from, but i'm now working at the mayo clinic in rochester
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| 21:54 | <johnny> dberkholz, how about uhmm.. anything to get portage 2.2 stable :)
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| 21:54 | lol
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| 21:54 | <jammcq> cool. what are you doing for the clinic?
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| 21:54 | <dberkholz> what do we need there? sets?
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| 21:54 | <johnny> i have no idea
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| 21:54 | i don't know why it's not stable
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| 21:54 | <dberkholz> johnny: i'm asking what features we need in 2.2 that are holding back ltsp?
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| 21:55 | jammcq: i'm working mainly on a drug-design project for a disease called friedreich ataxia
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| 21:55 | <johnny> the thing that knows how to resolve deps cleanly?
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| 21:55 | or was that backported
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| 21:55 | <jammcq> ooooh, sounds interesting
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| 21:55 | <dberkholz> johnny: i think most things besides sets have made it back to 2.1
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| 21:55 | <johnny> err resolve blockers*
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| 21:55 | ah.. so nothing
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| 21:56 | /me still doesn't know why openrc isn't stable either :(
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| 21:57 | <dberkholz> oh yeah, that was a problem.
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| 21:58 | <johnny> dberkholz, personally.even if openrc is faster than upstart.. i'd like to see it able to be perfectly integrated as well
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| 21:58 | just because it's used in fedora and ubuntu now.. and perhaps someday.. debian
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| 21:58 | <dberkholz> http://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010_ideas#Upstart_on_Gentoo
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| 21:59 | <johnny> sweet :)
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| 21:59 | and ubuntu is gonna use plymouth too
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| 21:59 | so. i would ask to have ltsp use plymouth + upstart + dracut
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| 21:59 | <johnny> then ubuntu/gentoo/fedora can share much code
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| 22:00 | on the client side boot part at least..
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| 22:01 | <dberkholz> johnny: thx for the suggestions
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| 22:01 | it seems he's a quite capable student so i'll suggest that he consider doing all of that
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| 23:02 | <vicd> Hi, All
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| 23:03 | why i can't see content of /var/run/drives/usbdisk-sda1 localy?
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| 23:03 | i need to use usb stick in rdesktop session
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| 23:04 | (sorry for my english :)
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| 23:07 | help
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| 23:07 | please
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| 23:08 | <johnny> try back in 12 hours
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| 23:08 | this is not a good time for support in this channel
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| 23:08 | i myself am going to bed
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| 23:08 | and everybody else already has..
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| 23:08 | <vicd> thanks
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| 23:46 | i have installed ltspfs on chtoot with ltspfsmounter, it helped
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| 23:47 | ltspfsmounter mounts usbsticks on /media/root
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| 23:48 | but only if i insert usb stick after boot
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