IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 25 October 2007 (all times are UTC)
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| 00:01 | <Nurionn> hi
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| 00:02 | i've a problem using ltsp-5 on debian etch
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| 00:02 | I can connect whit any client on the server, but only once.
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| 00:03 | afterwards it shows the error-message 'PXE-E61: Media check failure, check cable'
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| 00:04 | anyone an idee what I can do? (sorry if my English isn't correct, I'm from Switzerland)
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| 00:10 | <lns> Nurionn, that is a physical cabling issue
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| 00:10 | make sure your network cable and switch/hub are ok
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| 00:11 | <Nurionn> they are ok, but only until the first restart
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| 00:11 | on every client I testet
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| 00:16 | I'll just test another (non-managable) switch, even I'm almost sure the other one works...
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| 00:23 | <Nurionn> is it possible that a client receives an IP adress (and I can ping it) even it shows 'PXE-E61: Media check failure, check cable' ?
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| 01:52 | <osl> hi all , i wanna ask wut's about the right type of clustering that should be used with LTSP ??
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| 01:53 | ogra, are u there ?
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| 02:34 | <sep> osl,i tested it with LDM_SERVERS=server1,server2,server3 but dont use it in production
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| 02:57 | <Nurionn> I've found something out: If i take off the power cable, they work anew.
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| 02:57 | <Nurionn> is it possible, that they dont properly shut down and stock some information local?
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| 02:58 | <Nurionn> (I mean the thinclients)
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| 03:48 | <gypsymauro> hi
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| 03:49 | <gypsymauro> I've installed ltsp 5 on gutsy but I dunno how to set the default language and the use of local devices, reading lts.conf it says that isn't used anymore and there is a file in the tftp root but it's using nfs not tftp.. (?)
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| 04:02 | <EXP2> i have 71.0 and ltsp 5 combination. i have installed nvidia-glx and dependencies to chroot. but when i use XSERVER= nvidia, i get a blank screen. when i don't use that it works, but when logging out mouse cursor becomes invisible
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| 04:02 | 7.10
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| 04:03 | it worked with 7.04 nad ltsp5
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| 04:03 | and
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| 04:56 | <osl> gypsymauro, if u want to use the /opt/ltsp/(Arch)/etc/lts.conf then u have to compress the image everytime u modify it .. if u don't want to do that then u have to copy lts.conf to /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/(Arch)
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| 06:00 | <EXP2> i have a serious problems with 7.10/ltsp5 and nvidia graphics
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| 06:00 | it won't work
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| 06:00 | i get a blinking line in top corner
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| 06:04 | <EXP2> i have installed nvidia-glx into /opt/ltsp/i386/, and ltsp-update-kernels
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| 06:04 | ogra are you here?
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| 06:29 | <EXP2> how you can change screen resolution in 7.10/ltsp5
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| 06:32 | ping ogra
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| 06:51 | <EXP2> anyone have 7.10 and ltsp5 working?
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| 06:54 | <Nurionn> no sorry, can't help you
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| 07:07 | <EXP2> finally i got it working but but resolution is on ly 800x600
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| 07:08 | how i can make it bigger?
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| 07:17 | <ogra_cmpc> EXP2: set X_MODE_0="1024x786" in lts.conf
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| 08:00 | <sbalneav> Morning all
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| 08:00 | <Blinny> Good morning!
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| 08:15 | <cdealeer> [sbalneav]:: good morning. You think that you will be able to see the password expiration issue until the next month? Its something very important to me =D
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| 08:33 | <Guaraldo> !s
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| 08:33 | <ltspbot> Guaraldo: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 08:33 | <sbalneav> cdealeer: Well, it worked here for me, can you look on the thin client, in /var/log/ldm.log, and email me it's contents for a password change?
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| 09:18 | <sbalneav> !localdev
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| 09:18 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: "localdev" is (#1) Information regarding using pluggable devices and cdroms with LTSP can be found at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev, or (#2) for ubuntu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EnableLTSP5LocalDevices, or (#3) for debian-edu: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/HowTo/LocalDeviceLtspfs, or (#4) http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
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| 09:58 | <daresbalat> hey, ive got a thin client working fine, btu the graphics are pretty sluggish - is there anything i can do to speed this up?
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| 09:59 | hey, ive got a thin client working fine, btu the graphics are pretty sluggish - is there anything i can do to speed this up?
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| 10:00 | whoops
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| 10:00 | <sbalneav> daresbalat: Care to give us a little more info? Which server, version of ltsp?
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| 10:00 | What kind of thin client
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| 10:00 | what's your network speed
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| 10:00 | <daresbalat> kubuntu feisty server with a neoware thin client
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| 10:00 | <sbalneav> how fasts your server
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| 10:00 | etc.
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| 10:00 | <daresbalat> umm normal network is that 10mbs?
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| 10:01 | server is a p4 with 1.5 gb ram
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| 10:01 | wondered if there was some useful lts.conf one liner :)
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| 10:01 | <sbalneav> Well, I don't know, what do you have? Is it a 10 mbps network?
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| 10:01 | <daresbalat> yeah
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| 10:01 | <sbalneav> That would be your biggest problem.
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| 10:01 | <Blinny> sbalneav: You sure?
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| 10:01 | sbalneav: You could add SPEEDUP_MY_SERVER = Y to lts.conf
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| 10:02 | <daresbalat> yeah i mean ive run stuff like this before and its not been so sluggish...
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| 10:02 | <sbalneav> MAKE_EVERYTHING_FASTER = Y
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| 10:02 | <Blinny> I did it to my car and now it's superfast.
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| 10:02 | <daresbalat> s there anyway i can allocare ram to the thi client graphics?
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| 10:02 | <ogra> your car uses an lts.conf ?
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| 10:02 | <daresbalat> (sorry im not used to this keyboard)
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| 10:02 | <Blinny> ogra: Of course. It needs to connect to my bigcar at home in order to start.
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| 10:03 | <ogra> whee
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| 10:03 | <sbalneav> You might also want to look at updating the ldm to accept the LDM_DIRECTX parameter
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| 10:03 | !ldm
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| 10:03 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: "ldm" is You can find the updated ldm that supports the LDM_DIRECTX parameter for bypassing ssh encryption at http://alburg.net/ldm
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| 10:03 | <ogra> remote booting car :)
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| 10:03 | <Blinny> *vroom*
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| 10:03 | <sbalneav> An upgrade to gutsy would help that too.
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| 10:03 | <ogra> sbalneav, you should update that text
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| 10:03 | <sbalneav> yeah
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| 10:03 | <ogra> its not really "the updated ldm" anymore :)
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| 10:03 | <sbalneav> ltspbot: forget ldm
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| 10:03 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: The operation succeeded.
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| 10:03 | * ogra relocates | |
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| 10:04 | <daresbalat> so you think i should upgrade to gutsy? im a bit lost now :p
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| 10:04 | all this car talk
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| 10:04 | <sbalneav> ltspbot: learn ldm as: For feisty users, a newer LDM will allow you to use the LDM_DIRECTX parameter. Either update to gutsy, or get a backported feisty LDM at http://alburg.net/ldm
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| 10:04 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: (learn [<channel>] <key> as <value>) -- Associates <key> with <value>. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent on the channel itself. The word 'as' is necessary to separate the key from the value. It can be changed to another word via the learnSeparator registry value.
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| 10:05 | <sbalneav> ltspbot: learn ldm as For feisty users, a newer LDM will allow you to use the LDM_DIRECTX parameter. Either update to gutsy, or get a backported feisty LDM at http://alburg.net/ldm
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| 10:05 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: The operation succeeded.
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| 10:05 | <sbalneav> !ldm
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| 10:05 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: "ldm" is For feisty users, a newer LDM will allow you to use the LDM_DIRECTX parameter. Either update to gutsy, or get a backported feisty LDM at http://alburg.net/ldm
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| 10:05 | <daresbalat> loooooool
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| 10:05 | okok i get it :p
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| 10:05 | <sbalneav> not directed at you
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| 10:05 | I'm just updating the info and making sure it works.
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| 10:06 | <daresbalat> haha ahhh i thought the bot was flipping out :)
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| 10:08 | so... is there anythign i can do to improve my thin client graphics performance? or will i just need a betetr graphics card?
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| 10:09 | <sbalneav> uhhh
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| 10:09 | Didn't you see what we just did with the ldm?
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| 10:09 | you could try that.
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| 10:09 | <daresbalat> what is the ldm? ltsp display manager?
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| 10:10 | <sbalneav> yup
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| 10:10 | <daresbalat> hmm so what would i do with that file?
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| 10:11 | <sbalneav> Replace the ldm that's in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/sbin with that one
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| 10:11 | make sure it's executable
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| 10:12 | <daresbalat> ahha gottit
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| 10:12 | thanksss
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| 10:12 | <ogra_cmpc> and set LDM_DIRCTX=True
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| 10:12 | <sbalneav> add LDM_DIRECTX=True to your lts.conf file
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| 10:12 | <daresbalat> so whats that line doing?
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| 10:12 | * ogra_cmpc pokes his E | |
| 10:13 | <sbalneav> Bypassing the ssh encryption
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| 10:13 | <daresbalat> ahhhhhh nice
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| 10:14 | saves a lot of unneeded encryption?
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| 10:14 | * ogra_cmpc wouldnt say unneeded | |
| 10:14 | <daresbalat> hehehe
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| 10:15 | <ogra_cmpc> i.e. i wouldnt do online banking with LDM_DIRCTX=True in a public thin client setup
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| 10:15 | <cdealer> [sbalneav]:: hwo do i log in the thinclient tty ?
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| 10:15 | <daresbalat> ah no this isnt public
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| 10:16 | <ogra_cmpc> daresbalat: well, its not your home network, there are users, arent the4re ?
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| 10:16 | <daresbalat> cdealer: you need to chmod into your thi client fodler and use passwd
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| 10:16 | ogra_cmpc: its a home office network :)
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| 10:16 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: or set SCREEN_02=shell
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| 10:16 | <Blinny> Gutsy already has that LDM right? So if s/he were on Gutsy s/he would only have to set the LDM_DIRECTX parameter?
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| 10:17 | <ogra_cmpc> Blinny: exactly
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| 10:17 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: at /opt/ltsp/i386/lts.conf, right?
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| 10:17 | <Blinny> Thank you.
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| 10:17 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc, sbalneav thanks for your help, gonaa do a reset and see how it goes
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| 10:17 | ttfn
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| 10:17 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: in gutsy rather use /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
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| 10:19 | <Blinny> Is it more trouble than it's worth to run the x86_64 ver of Gutsy? Mind, I have 8GB RAM and I'd rather not stray from default kernels.
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| 10:20 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: ok, rebooting now =)
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| 10:21 | <ogra_cmpc> Blinny: i'm not sure how the status of flash is atm
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| 10:21 | thats the only thing that would hold me back for using amd64 in case my users want folash
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| 10:21 | s/for/from
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| 10:21 | <Blinny> Right now I run FF64 through npviewer
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| 10:21 | or, the plugins for FF64 through npviewer
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| 10:21 | Except Java crashes randomly.
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| 10:22 | <ogra_cmpc> native java on amd64 should be fine
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| 10:22 | <cdealer> [Blinny]:: npviewer? How do you see npviewer reports on linux? O.o
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| 10:22 | <ogra_cmpc> (gutsy has icedtea already)
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| 10:23 | <Blinny> cdealer: npviewer is a component of nspluginwrapper, a 32-bit plugin loader for 64-bit FF
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| 10:23 | <Blinny> Nice.
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| 10:24 | I tried blackdown's but it didn't fare so well.
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| 10:24 | <daresbalat> hmm. doesnt seem to have made much difference :(
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| 10:24 | <Blinny> ogra_cmpc: but there aren't any physical limitations on RAM/CPUs/Cores/etc in the server edition of Gutsy?
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| 10:24 | <sbalneav> daresbalat: It probably wont if your network is 10mbs
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| 10:25 | <cdealer> [Blinny]:: here npviewer is being used to see some kind of reports that looks like pdf files... but dont
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| 10:25 | <ogra_cmpc> Blinny: the several kernel packages fulfull different purposes ... the -server kernel is what you want for 8gig
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| 10:25 | <daresbalat> sbalneav: is it really that netowrk intensive? hmmm
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| 10:26 | <sbalneav> Well, seeing as how EVERYTHING comes across the network, graphics, root dir, etc.
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| 10:26 | <ogra_cmpc> Blinny: or if you have around 64CPUs you could use teh -bigiron flavor ;)
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| 10:26 | <Blinny> heh
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| 10:26 | <daresbalat> sbalneav: ahh. would putting mroe ram in the thin help? or irrlevant?
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| 10:26 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: any further configuration for my shell work? Placed a lts.conf file with SCREEN_02=shell on the path you said and didnt work, made the same on /opt/ltsp/i386 doesnt work too ... I have a login prompt on tty1 but cant login, tried already with all the box users
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| 10:26 | <Blinny> ogra_cmpc: Thanks.
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| 10:27 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: dont forget you need a [default] section
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| 10:27 | <sbalneav> daresbalat: how much ram is in it?
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| 10:27 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: that is it =D
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| 10:27 | <daresbalat> sbalneav: not sure. hmm. and dont know how id check without taking it apart
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| 10:27 | <Blinny> The BIOS post screen will tell you yes?
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| 10:28 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: also if you still want the graphical login on tty7 add SCREEN_07=ldm
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| 10:28 | <daresbalat> ahh yeh good thinking
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| 10:28 | i thnk it is maybe 128meg ram
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| 10:28 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: ok, will try to login with a expired password user and get the log to sbalneav see whats happening
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| 10:29 | <daresbalat> theres a sticker on the side syaing it... but it could lie
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| 10:29 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: great :)
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| 10:29 | daresbalat: do you know which graphics chipset is in there ?
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| 10:30 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: i put in an old ati pci card
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| 10:31 | <ogra_cmpc> well, might be that its not well supported and teh vesa driver gets used automatically
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| 10:31 | <daresbalat> hmm i had to put a specific line in to make it work, XSERVER=ati
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| 10:31 | <ogra_cmpc> that would make your screen a bit sluggish
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| 10:32 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: i think its some kind of 3d rage
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| 10:33 | <ogra_cmpc> there is probably another driver you can use ... try radeon
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| 10:33 | <cdealer> [sbalneav]:: want me to send to your email or pastebin ?
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| 10:33 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: ok, cool :)
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| 10:33 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: you think it shouldnt be this sluggish?
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| 10:34 | <ogra_cmpc> depends, i dont know your setup ...
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| 10:34 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: thats cool. i mean its only 1 thin client, its kinda weird. ive never done thins with kde before though
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| 10:34 | <ogra_cmpc> but graphics card driver would be my first look after making sure the network is fine and fast enough in thats case
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| 10:35 | <daresbalat> cool. im test driving these eons for some social centre setup i need to do soon, would be godo fi they could work well coz theyre super cheap and very nice and quiet
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| 10:35 | ill try it just gonan reset, brb
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| 10:38 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: why every file i save on the client i cant see on the server? Im trying to save the log so I can just send it but it doenst appears here
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| 10:41 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: well it seems almost exactly the same if not worse. maybe you're right and tis defualting to vesa
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| 10:41 | is there any way to tell for sure?
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| 10:42 | <ogra_cmpc> thats feisty ?
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| 10:42 | <daresbalat> yeah
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| 10:42 | would upgrading to gutsy be an idea?
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| 10:42 | <ogra_cmpc> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
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| 10:42 | copy and paste that
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| 10:43 | that sets a rootpw in the client
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| 10:43 | use: sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd -l
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| 10:43 | to lock it again later
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| 10:43 | if thaqts set, you can log in on the client at the console as root with the pw you just set
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| 10:44 | <daresbalat> ahh ok
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| 10:44 | <ogra_cmpc> read /etc/X11/xorg.conf on teh running client
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| 10:44 | and see if its vesa, ati or whatever
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| 10:44 | <daresbalat> so do i need to quit the gui to get to the terminal login?
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| 10:45 | <ogra_cmpc> hit ctrl-alt-f1
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| 10:45 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: but im loged already on the thinclient ... the problem isnt to login is to see the ldm.log file I just copied... (cp /var/log/ldm.log /home)
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| 10:45 | <sutula> Should client USB disks work? If so, where should they show up?
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| 10:45 | <ogra_cmpc> to get back to gui hit ctrl-alt-f7
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| 10:45 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: of course, thanks.
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| 10:46 | ogra_cmpc: it says ati, even tho i just cahnged it to radeon?
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| 10:47 | <ogra_cmpc> then the radeon driver didnt work and it fell back to ati
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| 10:47 | try vesa for teh fun of it :)
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| 10:47 | <daresbalat> lol, ok
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| 10:48 | alright, brb again :)
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| 10:48 | daresbalat has left #ltsp | |
| 10:54 | <ogra_cmpc> cdealer: /home?
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| 10:54 | why?
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| 10:54 | Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:54 | <ogra_cmpc> /home on the client is the clients ram ,,, wont gain you much
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| 10:54 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: just want to copy somewhere so I could see it from here... on the server box
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| 10:54 | <ogra_cmpc> scp it
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| 10:55 | <cdealer> [ogra_cmpc]:: I tried... its says that the public key was not found bla bla bla =/
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| 10:55 | <ogra_cmpc> scp <filename> <a_valid_user_on_the_server>@server:/tmp/
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| 10:55 | hmm
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| 10:58 | <sbalneav> use the ip address of the server, maybe
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| 10:58 | daresbalat has joined #ltsp | |
| 10:58 | <daresbalat> ogra_cmpc: what are the chances, vesa deosnt work :)
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| 10:58 | think its because its an LCD monitor and whatever defualt res it was throing up it didt like
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| 10:58 | <cdealer> Permission Denied, please try again; Permission Denied, please try again; Permission denied (publickey, password).; lost connection (every frase in a new line
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| 10:59 | [sbalneav]:: ogra, ^
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| 11:12 | <cdealer> O.o
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| 11:17 | <cdealer> [sbalneav]:: Warning: no xauth data; using fake authentication data for X11 forwarding. Is this normal on ldm.log?
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| 11:18 | gypsymauro has quit IRC | |
| 11:21 | <daresbalat> im gonan take a break. thanks for everyones help
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| 11:23 | <sutula> Can anyone help debug client USB storage woes? This on the Debian/Ubuntu packaging.
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| 11:24 | I've seen the wiki section on Local Drive Access, but the USB device doesn't get automounted
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| 11:25 | I don't know where syslog logs to, so can't see if there's any error output when I plug it in
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| 11:25 | It does show up in /proc/bus/usb/devices
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| 11:25 | <sbalneav> !localdeb
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| 11:25 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: Error: "localdeb" is not a valid command.
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| 11:25 | <sbalneav> !localdev
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| 11:25 | <ltspbot> sbalneav: "localdev" is (#1) Information regarding using pluggable devices and cdroms with LTSP can be found at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev, or (#2) for ubuntu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EnableLTSP5LocalDevices, or (#3) for debian-edu: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/HowTo/LocalDeviceLtspfs, or (#4) http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
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| 11:25 | <sbalneav> Link #4 there should help you
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| 11:26 | <sutula> sbalneav: Thanks...I'll start there
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| 11:35 | <ogra_cmpc> sbalneav: server defaults to teh server IP, its added to /etc/hosts at boot
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| 11:35 | <sbalneav> yeah
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| 12:03 | <aep> hi
| |
| 12:04 | so where do you folks get your thin clients from. the ones i can find for X11 are so expensive, i could just buy a full machione
| |
| 12:04 | <vagrantc> but do you *want* a full machine?
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| 12:04 | <aep> well no
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| 12:05 | <lns> aep, you can check out www.disklessworkstations.com - that helps the development of LTSP
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| 12:05 | <aep> i want a stupid terminal that can run an X server
| |
| 12:05 | * aep does | |
| 12:05 | * aep gasps | |
| 12:05 | <lns> or, I just found http://www.thesymbiont.com as well, they seem to have decent prices
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| 12:05 | <aep> 120€
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| 12:05 | <vagrantc> getting a good thin-client will reduce your electricity costs considerably.
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| 12:06 | <aep> where is the point of terminals when they cost more then a fat client :(
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| 12:06 | <vagrantc> they on't have moving parts (i.e. rarely break down) and use way less electricity.
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| 12:06 | <lns> that's kinda what I don't get..you get much less computer, but for more money? ...Thin clients are still a commodity I think, that's why..when they become more mainstream, they'll have more competition
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| 12:07 | HP recently bought Neoware
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| 12:07 | <ogra_cmpc> aep: about 60% power cost savings
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| 12:08 | centralized maintenance (all you have to care for is the server)
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| 12:08 | easy replacement if something breaks with no dataloss (userdata is on teh server, replacing a client doesnt take more than changing a lightbulb)
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| 12:09 | <vagrantc> or, just find used computers that consume more power but cost nothing
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| 12:09 | * ogra_cmpc would take thin clients even if they would cost more than teh standard PCs | |
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| 12:09 | <aep> yes the centralized maintainance is what i want. but hard to convine the bosses when a thin client costs more then a fat client
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| 12:10 | <lns> aep, they don't really cost more, just almost the same, at least as far as i've seen
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| 12:10 | <aep> it's allready a pain telling them outlook won't work pfft
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| 12:10 | <lns> thesymbiont.com has good prices, check out their SYM1110
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| 12:11 | it's small and sexy, too - that is a major thing for the "microsofties"
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| 12:11 | <vagrantc> aep: so, do some math.
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| 12:11 | <aep> lns: for me too :p
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| 12:12 | <vagrantc> aep: your bosses will like it if it can demonstrate a significant cost savings. and if you can't demonstrate that, then maybe you shouldn't switch.
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| 12:12 | <lns> aep, yes...as much as techies don't want to admit it, the physical look of things is REALLY a major factor regarding if you enjoy using it or not
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| 12:12 | just look at apple
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| 12:12 | * ogra_cmpc has no browser available but maddog gave a talk in portlad at ubuntulive with nice numbers in teh slides | |
| 12:13 | <ogra_cmpc> you should probably google for maddog thin client savings and might get a nice presentation for your boss
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| 12:13 | <aep> lns: you happen to know the prices for thesymbiont?
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| 12:13 | <ogra_cmpc> (he computed in gigawatts though, not in dollars)
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| 12:14 | <lns> aep, I just got a quote yesterday for a batch of 20 SYM1110 - they were $229 each
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| 12:14 | US
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| 12:15 | <aep> ew. still a lot.
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| 12:15 | <lns> aep, well... you might want to look at buying used computers then =p you can't get much lower than that, and if you can, i'd love to hear where
| |
| 12:15 | * lns is afk | |
| 12:16 | <aep> yeah sad
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| 12:16 | <vagrantc> there's a few thin-clients for around US $120 ... but they tend to suck.
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| 12:17 | * ogra_cmpc wouldnt expect something good below $200 (new indeed) | |
| 12:18 | <aep> that's a standard desktop machine, vista included :(
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| 12:18 | oh dollars.
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| 12:18 | <vagrantc> aep: you're not going to win any arguments on initial costs. you're going to win on maintenance: medium to long-term costs.
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| 12:19 | <ogra_cmpc> buy them used :) you can get 10 clients for $1000 of the same quaity from ebay
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| 12:19 | <aep> well... we got 8 computers here
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| 12:20 | actually i just want an ltsp to stop running around the building fixing them
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| 12:20 | <ogra_cmpc> how much time do you spend each week for running around?
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| 12:20 | <aep> i guess ltsp just dooesn't make sense at that scale
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| 12:20 | like 3 hours a day
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| 12:20 | * vagrantc finds it makes sense on a scale of 3+ computers | |
| 12:21 | <ogra_cmpc> ltsp makes alwazs sense :)
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| 12:21 | <aep> :D
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| 12:21 | not with that terminal prices :(
| |
| 12:21 | * vagrantc will stop beating a deaf horse | |
| 12:21 | <ogra_cmpc> well, lets assume you cost $40/h for your boss ...
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| 12:22 | thats $120 he savews per day
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| 12:22 | <aep> indeed. that's a good point :D
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| 12:22 | <vagrantc> hell, we could assume $ 0.25 the way aep is talking
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| 12:22 | <ogra_cmpc> since you can work on more important stuff during that time now
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| 12:22 | <vagrantc> hardware is almost always cheaper than human labour
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| 12:22 | <ogra_cmpc> yeah
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| 12:23 | cdealer has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:23 | <aep> hmm
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| 12:23 | <vagrantc> like i said earlier, do some math.
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| 12:23 | <aep> i think for now i will just go for floppy boot on the desktop machines we have
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| 12:23 | <ogra_cmpc> you really save in all areas ... apart from HW costs
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| 12:23 | <vagrantc> using existing resources is an excellent idea.
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| 12:23 | <aep> yeah
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| 12:23 | <ogra_cmpc> yeah
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| 12:24 | <vagrantc> aep: how old are these machines? many machines 2002+ have network boot built-in
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| 12:24 | <aep> very different. i think two of them have+
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| 12:25 | <vagrantc> you can also set up network boot from hard drive, instead of floppies
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| 12:25 | <aep> i would like to reduce the noice in the office as a nice side effect ;)
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| 12:25 | that makes the graphics dudes happy
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| 12:25 | <vagrantc> well, you can set the hard-disks to spin down when not in use
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| 12:25 | <aep> nice idea!
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| 12:25 | <vagrantc> sure beats having to support floppy disks.
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| 12:25 | <aep> boot-> xdmcp -> spin down
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| 12:26 | <ogra_cmpc> ltsp is beyond xdmcp ... we dont use it since two years anymore ;)
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| 12:27 | <aep> :o
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| 12:27 | <aep> what's the modern standard?
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| 12:27 | <ogra_cmpc> ssh
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| 12:27 | either with encrypted Xtransport or only with encrypted password exchange
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| 12:28 | <aep> interesting
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| 12:28 | <ogra_cmpc> the latter is pretty much teh same as xdmcp, but less insecure
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| 12:28 | * aep wonders how NX would perform on wlan | |
| 12:28 | <vagrantc> slightly more secure than xdmcp ...
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| 12:28 | <ogra_cmpc> well, the critical parts at leats
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| 12:29 | *least
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| 12:29 | <moa-> Quick question: has anyone successfully got sound to work on a server with no sound card?
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| 12:29 | * vagrantc never puts sound cards in the server | |
| 12:29 | <moa-> make dummy sound cards?
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| 12:29 | I can't get esd to start up
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| 12:30 | <aep> you start it on the client
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| 12:30 | <ogra_cmpc> pulse doesnt care about soundcards
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| 12:30 | err, esd ?
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| 12:30 | <aep> starting it on the server doesn't make sense, does it?
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| 12:30 | <ogra_cmpc> right, esd will surely need hacking, thats why we dont use it anymore since some time
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| 12:30 | <moa-> What do you suggest ?
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| 12:31 | <ogra_cmpc> no idea, i dropped esd to not have tio think about that :P
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| 12:31 | * vagrantc thinks it would be a good time to find out what distro and ltsp version moa- is using | |
| 12:31 | <aep> starting esd on the client :p
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| 12:31 | <moa-> lol, gentoo and 4.2
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| 12:31 | <ogra_cmpc> yeah, what distro/ltsp version is that
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| 12:31 | ah, well
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| 12:34 | <moa-> any suggestions on sound daemon?
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| 12:35 | <vagrantc> !sound
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| 12:35 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: "sound" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Sound
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| 13:18 | <outofrang1> Is there separate docs for LTSP-5 or just the distribution specific docs? http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Documentation doesn't seem to have docs for LTSP-5, just links to Ubuntu wiki, so I'm a bit confused about that.
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| 13:23 | muh2000 has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:25 | <vagrantc> outofrang1: the documentation is a little more distro-specific now
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| 13:25 | outofrang1: so if you're using ubuntu, i'd recommend using the LTSP documentation from ubuntu
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| 13:31 | <outofrang1> vagrantc: thanks. Do the LTSP-4 docs still apply mostly? Is that a good place to get a primer on LSTP, or is there so much different now that it would be misleading?
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| 13:31 | <vagrantc> outofrang1: there is enough different that it's misleading
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| 13:32 | rcy` has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:32 | <vagrantc> if you know what the differences are, you ight be able to figure out what still applies and what not... the very basic premise is the same, but almost everything under the hood has changed.
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| 13:33 | <outofrang1> Ok, I read everything on the Ubuntu site -- so maybe just need to dive in and see what happens. ;)
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| 13:33 | <vagrantc> yes, i'm a big fan of diving in
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| 13:34 | <rcy`> any ideas on how to debug problems with autologin in edubuntu ltsp 5?
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| 13:34 | ogra_cmpc has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:34 | <rcy`> i just get an X cursor on my thin clients after i setup LDM_USERNAME/PASSWORD in lts.conf
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| 13:39 | <outofrang1> One thing I'm not clear on is how to install mixed platform -- we have some old iMacs that I'd like to use, but IIRC I need to boot one powerpc client via CD to install the powerpc environment. Is that true?
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| 13:44 | <Blinny> outofrang1: Edubuntu's docs have a good bit of info on them that applies.
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| 13:44 | <Guaraldo> outofrang1: On ltsp5 you can install a chroot to powerpc in the same ltsp server. The way to netboot iMacs I realy don't know!
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| 13:47 | <vagrantc> outofrang1: yes, basically you have to boot a machine of the appropriate architecture, build the LTSP5 environment, and move that to the server.
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| 13:49 | <Guaraldo> vagrantc: ltsp-build-client has an option of the arquiteture...
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| 13:49 | <ogra_cmpc> Guaraldo: it chroots during build ...
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| 13:49 | <Guaraldo> vagrantc: does'nt?
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| 13:49 | <ogra_cmpc> that doesnt work without the right CPU
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| 13:49 | <vagrantc> Guaraldo: it does, but it needs to be compatible with the running architecture
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| 13:49 | <Guaraldo> ogra_cmpc: Oh!...
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| 13:49 | <vagrantc> i.e. on an amd64 server, you can do --arch i386
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| 13:50 | <ogra_cmpc> you can build i386 on amd64
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| 13:50 | but not ppc
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| 13:50 | not sure how the ppc qemu thing is nowadays
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| 13:50 | <Guaraldo> ogra_cmpc: What a bad news...
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| 13:50 | <ogra_cmpc> (or if that runs on x86)
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| 13:51 | <vagrantc> haven't tried qemu with ppc in a couple months, but i've never really had it working
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| 13:51 | <ogra_cmpc> Guaraldo: well, you would need to emulate the CPU somehow
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| 13:51 | Guaraldo: but in gutsy we use images, highvoltage expressed interest to build just packages that install teh images
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| 13:51 | <vagrantc> at some point, we could build tarballs for the most popular architectures and you could try that.
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| 13:52 | ah yes, or squashfs images
| |
| 13:52 | <ogra_cmpc> its only about 140M
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| 13:52 | ppc might be 200 though ... i havent tested it
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| 13:52 | <vagrantc> ogra_cmpc: regarding unionfs in debian ... are you sure it is 2.0 ? all the packages i can find say 1.4*
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| 13:53 | <ogra_cmpc> what version the module in the kernel ?
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| 13:53 | thats all that counts
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| 13:54 | <vagrantc> ogra_cmpc: how do i tell?
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| 13:54 | <ogra_cmpc> (or do you have to handcompile it)
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| 13:54 | modinfo unionfs
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| 13:55 | it also tells the version in dmesg if you load it
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| 13:56 | <vagrantc> ogra_cmpc: seems like there aren;t modules in sid anymore ...
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| 13:56 | <ogra_cmpc> switched to aufs ?
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| 13:56 | <vagrantc> there's aufs-modules-*
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| 13:56 | <ogra_cmpc> yeah
| |
| 13:56 | but its very young still
| |
| 13:56 | <scrapbunny> can anyone help be get sound on thin clients from a server with no sound card?
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| 13:56 | <vagrantc> and debian-live claims that unionfs doesn't work with sid
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| 13:57 | <ogra_cmpc> 2.0 surely now
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| 13:57 | Blinny has quit IRC | |
| 13:57 | <ogra_cmpc> not
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| 13:57 | <vagrantc> nudging people to use aufs
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| 13:57 | <ogra_cmpc> we tried it for some weeks in ubuntu
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| 13:57 | and it broke in many intresting ways
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| 13:57 | <vagrantc> oh well
| |
| 13:58 | * vagrantc is more-or-less happy with nfs and tmpfs mounts | |
| 13:58 | <lns> Hey, do you guys know anything about the Koolu thin-client certification w/Gutsy?
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| 13:58 | <ogra_cmpc> Koolu thin-client certification ???
| |
| 13:58 | <lns> http://www.koolu.com/
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| 14:00 | * ogra_cmpc wasnt contacted by anyone | |
| 14:01 | <ogra_cmpc> i guess thats done by the montreal office, but everyone is travelling atm, cant ask anybody
| |
| 14:01 | (we have our summit next week)
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| 14:02 | <lns> gotcha. =) Those things look pretty nice!
| |
| 14:02 | and a fair price
| |
| 14:03 | <outofrang1> So for powerpc do I need to boot the first client with powerpc? Why I'm confused is I don't see where to download a live cd for powerpc for 7.10. Edubuntu is AMD and i386 only, as the "Get Ubuntu" page also doesn't show a powerpc download.
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| 14:04 | <scrapbunny> they look cool :) I am trying to set up a LTSP lab with dell gx110's but i can't get the log in screen to come up
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| 14:04 | and my server has no sound card so I am not sure I can have sound
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| 14:04 | <lns> scrapbunny, you don't need a sound card in the server to have sound on the clients
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| 14:05 | <scrapbunny> Ins- can you point me to how to set up the sound? the only stuff I can find is for ubuntu 6
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| 14:06 | <sbalneav> scrapbunny: What linux distro are you using, with what version of ltsp?
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| 14:06 | <scrapbunny> edubuntu 7.10 with the latest ltsp,
| |
| 14:08 | at this point I have a fresh install on the server and I can PXE boot and log in on a GX240 but have no sound. on the gx110 I get the edubuntu boot screen but then the screen goes blank
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| 14:09 | <vagrantc> probably the sound card on your thin clients isn't auto-detected
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| 14:09 | <ogra_cmpc> outofrang1: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/ports/releases/gutsy/release/
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| 14:09 | <outofrang1> ogra_cmpc: Thanks!
| |
| 14:10 | <scrapbunny> vagrantc- where can I go to check? sorry I am still new to thin clients and ubuntu
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| 14:11 | <ogra_cmpc> scrapbunny: in gutsy everything is set up automatic, if pulseaudio is installed in teh client environment (which is the case by default), sound will be started for the ltsp parts of things
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| 14:14 | <scrapbunny> I must not have completed the install then because pulseaudio is not installed
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| 14:14 | <ogra_cmpc> scrapbunny: create a file /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
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| 14:15 | put in this content: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/42147/
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| 14:15 | if you boot a client you will then have a shell on the second console for debugging
| |
| 14:16 | <scrapbunny> thank you sooo much. I will try to make sure everything is installed and create that file. hopefully I can come back with good news :)
| |
| 14:16 | <cliebow_> ogra_cmpc:anyone netbooted an intel mac yet?
| |
| 14:17 | <ogra_cmpc> cliebow_: give me one and i'll try :)
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| 14:17 | <cliebow_> id love to...i captured dhcp response today..
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| 14:17 | it tries to PXE boot
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| 14:18 | <ogra_cmpc> well, then iot should be possible
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| 14:18 | <cliebow_> tftp fails for me..starts then fails..i have it coming up..
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| 14:18 | The laptop that is
| |
| 14:20 | the ppc macs are fighting me tooth and nail as well nfs-wise
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| 14:23 | <cliebow_> Ragnar!!!!!!!!!!
| |
| 14:23 | <laprag_> hey chuck
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| 14:23 | <cliebow_> you in the States?
| |
| 14:23 | <laprag_> no, i'm coming next weekend :)
| |
| 14:24 | <cliebow_> bts???
| |
| 14:24 | <laprag_> fot BTS
| |
| 14:24 | yes
| |
| 14:24 | <cliebow_> ahghahh!
| |
| 14:24 | <laprag_> don't want to miss that :)
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| 14:26 | <Guaraldo> scrapbunny: LTSP4.2 or 5?
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| 14:26 | scrapbunny: :-D
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| 14:27 | Sory, I started answering thing answered... :-D
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| 14:27 | <cliebow_> ogra_cmpc, i see read request for /ltsp/pxelinux.0 then an option acknowledgement packet with blocksize 512 and tsize 13552..then an error packet..option negotiation failed
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| 14:28 | <Guaraldo> /ltsp/pxelinux.0??? wouldn't it be /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 ???
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| 14:32 | Gadi has joined #ltsp | |
| 14:34 | Topslakr is now known as Top|Work | |
| 14:36 | Gadi has left #ltsp | |
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| 14:38 | ogra_cmpc has quit IRC | |
| 14:41 | ogra_cmpc_ is now known as ogra_cmpc | |
| 14:43 | * highvoltage catches up | |
| 14:43 | <highvoltage> ogra_cmpc: I've been thinking about those images, do you think the appropriate place to store them would be on ltsp.org?
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| 14:44 | <ogra_cmpc> would make sense
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| 15:01 | Guaraldo has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:04 | <cliebow_> Guaraldo, yeah probably..
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| 15:05 | <Guaraldo> :-D
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| 15:06 | <jammcq> q
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| 15:06 | q
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| 15:06 | exit
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| 15:06 | <sbalneav> That's odd.
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| 15:07 | <cliebow_> who??? me??
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| 15:07 | <sbalneav> cliebow_: jammcq seems to be having trouble, can you type /quit?
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| 15:07 | <jammcq> because some moron is tring to close Jam's session
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| 15:07 | <cliebow_> heh
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| 15:07 | <sbalneav> Waht, that won't work?
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| 15:07 | cliebow_ has quit IRC | |
| 15:07 | <sbalneav> :)
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| 15:07 | BWAHAHAHAA
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| 15:07 | <jammcq> would not be jam
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| 15:07 | jammcq has quit IRC | |
| 15:08 | cliebow__ has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:08 | <sbalneav> LOL
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| 15:08 | <cliebow__> works here...
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| 15:08 | <sbalneav> I didn't think you'd actually do it :)
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| 15:08 | <cliebow__> of course..i always foller directiobns
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| 15:09 | <sbalneav> Oh, man. THAT'll get you into trouble.
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| 15:09 | <cliebow__> i see you got jammcq too
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| 15:09 | or maybe he MEANT to
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| 15:09 | <sbalneav> Just ask them fellas at Nuremburg
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| 15:09 | <cliebow__> yep
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| 15:09 | or Hiroshima
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| 15:09 | My dad was there just sfter the bomb
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| 15:10 | <sbalneav> No kiddin.
| |
| 15:10 | My dad was in the reserve in the 50's. Staff seargent in the Nuclear Decontamination Squad.
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| 15:11 | <cliebow__> oh yeah..i have pictures of a bridge where some poor bastard was standing when the thing went off..his shadow is on the pavement
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| 15:11 | <sbalneav> Freaky. And sad.
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| 15:11 | brb
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| 15:12 | <cliebow__> does "option negotiation failed" ring any bells for you? could block size be a problem in tftp for intel mac?
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| 15:13 | heck..gotta book it...
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| 15:19 | moa- has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:22 | moa- is now known as moa_ | |
| 15:23 | <slidesinger> I've read a bit about chroot jailing for apache/bind/etc. Is this a good idea for a generic lamp server? (never read about it for a lamp box)
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| 15:29 | (embarrased) That's the problem with so many open windows, every so often you grab the wrong one.
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| 15:30 | Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp | |
| 15:37 | <aep> hm does that igel smartcard work with ltsp?
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| 15:37 | sepski has quit IRC | |
| 15:38 | <aep> i can't image what it actually technicaly does.
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| 16:01 | Guaraldo has joined #ltsp | |
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| 16:13 | <lns> Can anyone point me to some information on how to control printer access (through Gnome) to certain users/groups?
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| 16:13 | ahh shit nevermind =p
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| 16:13 | i <3 the new printer cp =)
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| 16:15 | how about groups, though? I have a teacher who really wants to give 'occasional' printer access to the color laser in their room, but give permenant access to the teachers
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| 16:15 | it'd be hard to assign by user every time
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| 16:22 | <sbalneav> Don't know if there's a ui for it
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| 16:22 | but I think AuthClass Group in cupsd.conf might work, GIYF
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| 16:23 | http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/serverguide/C/ch04s09.html
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| 16:23 | <lns> oh nice, ok thx sbalneav
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| 16:23 | <sbalneav> Seems to indicate that might work
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| 16:23 | <lns> GIYF = ?
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| 16:24 | <sbalneav> Google Is Your Friend
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| 16:24 | <lns> lol
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| 16:24 | thanks man
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| 16:24 | <sbalneav> np
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| 16:30 | K_O-Gnom has quit IRC | |
| 16:33 | <vagrantc> otavio: available for an LTSP upload tomorrow?
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| 16:33 | <otavio> vagrantc: sure
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| 16:33 | vagrantc: np
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| 16:33 | <vagrantc> otavio: just waiting for a couple more translations, otherwise everything seems ready
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| 16:34 | DonSilver has joined #ltsp | |
| 16:35 | * moa_ is going bald trying to figure out sound on thin clients | |
| 16:36 | <scrapbunny> moa- i am too! this is a lot harder than i thought it would be
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| 16:36 | <vagrantc> almost always "just works" for me
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| 16:37 | <moa_> That's what every thing I read says
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| 16:37 | <sutula> vagrantc: I'm out of sync...I just (finally) got your last etch-backport working, and now you have a newer version :)
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| 16:37 | <vagrantc> if you have older cards that aren't autodetected, then you have to manually specify the modules
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| 16:37 | sutula: :)
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| 16:37 | sutula: only minor changes in the newer version
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| 16:37 | <moa_> if I don't specify a module, it should auto detect right?
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| 16:38 | <vagrantc> moa_: yes
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| 16:38 | <moa_> I've been using the one that came with the thin client documentation, but I'll try the auto detect. I'm honestly out of options.
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| 16:38 | <sutula> vagrantc: X seemed to no longer autodetect my monitors correctly...had to override the display size, but the other stuff is working
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| 16:38 | <vagrantc> sutula: haven't been able to figure out why the background on LDM doesn't display on etch
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| 16:39 | sutula: yeah, X related stuff is harder to backport- the newer versions rely on X.org 7.2 which handles it's own configuration much better.
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| 16:39 | <scrapbunny> where do I go to manually config the sound?
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| 16:39 | <moa_> lts.conf
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| 16:40 | <sutula> vagrantc: I expected it would be something like that so didn't bother with bug reports
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| 16:41 | mikkel has quit IRC | |
| 16:44 | <vagrantc> sutula: so can i close those two bugs? :)
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| 16:44 | scrapbunny has left #ltsp | |
| 16:45 | <sutula> vagrantc: Sure, go ahead. With the chroot I built this AM I'm still seeing TZ not set right, but if you're not seeing it on other systems, it's probably something borked on my Etch server.
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| 16:46 | vagrantc: The TZ doesn't matter that much to the client's OS anyway
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| 16:46 | <vagrantc> sutula: i haven't really verified the time zone stuff
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| 16:46 | sutula: worth fixing all the same
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| 16:47 | <sutula> vagrantc: Well, if you do a new Etch install, then ltsp-server, check to see if the TZ value is right in the chroot (or login to a client)
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| 16:48 | <vagrantc> i've been experiencing a similar issue with xen installs, actually ...
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| 16:50 | <sutula> vagrantc: I thought it just wasn't propagated to the chroot, but it's more subtle than that...my client's OS's do seem to have the right setting...hmmm
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| 16:51 | <vagrantc> sutula: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 dpkg-reconfigure tzdata
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| 16:51 | sutula: see if that fixes it
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| 16:51 | <sutula> vagrantc: What symptoms do you see in xen?
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| 16:51 | <vagrantc> timezone is always set to UTC, even if /etc/timezone is set to something else
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| 16:51 | reconfiguring tzdata seems to fix it
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| 16:52 | <sutula> vagrantc: That's what I saw when I first reported the bug
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| 16:54 | <sutula> vagrantc: So I'm seeing exactly that behavior right now...I wonder whether it has to do with doing something out of order, like when the chroot is built, it needed the TZ value earlier in the process.
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| 16:56 | * vagrantc checks when it runs | |
| 16:57 | <vagrantc> sutula: ah, it happens during the finalization phase, but debootstrap is installed much earlier
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| 16:57 | er, debootstrap installs tzdata much earlier
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| 16:58 | * sutula wonders what else might have similar problems | |
| 16:59 | Guaraldo has left #ltsp | |
| 17:00 | <vagrantc> i know locales works
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| 17:04 | <moa_> The auto detect, detects the correct card. But no sound works. It makes no sense.
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| 17:05 | <vagrantc> moa_: echo $ESPEAKER ; echo $PULSE_SERVER
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| 17:06 | moa_: logged in from the thin client
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| 17:06 | <moa_> i checked the env and neither one was set
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| 17:08 | <vagrantc> well, that'll cause your problem
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| 17:08 | well, at least make it impossible to use
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| 17:08 | <moa_> Those should get set automatically, correct?
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| 17:11 | <moa_> Got any ideas of places to check to see where it's failing at?
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| 17:11 | <sutula> moa_: Which Linux distribution is the server running?
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| 17:12 | <moa_> gentoo
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| 17:12 | <sutula> moa_: Also, what version of ltsp?
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| 17:12 | <moa_> 4.2
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| 17:13 | <sutula> moa_: Others know better than I, but sound support was different then...I have it working under 5.x
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| 17:13 | * sutula can't help moa_ with 4.x sound | |
| 17:14 | * moa_ bangs head against wall | |
| 17:14 | <moa_> I've been debating upgrading
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| 17:14 | <sutula> moa_: From a support standpoint, it'd certainly be easier...either that or buy a helmet :)
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| 17:15 | DonSilver has joined #ltsp | |
| 17:15 | <moa_> Well, since it's a production server, and my techs work 24/7. Any ideas on seamless upgrade?
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| 17:15 | side by side installation possible?
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| 17:16 | <vagrantc> sutula: well, copying the file earlier just causes /etc/timezone to get overwritten
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| 17:18 | <sutula> vagrantc: I think you need to preseed the value, but I'm ignorant about exactly how it would be done
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| 17:18 | <vagrantc> hard to preseed before any packages are installed
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| 17:19 | <sutula> vagrantc: Yeah...how to folks do it that do unattended installs? Must be the same issue.
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| 17:19 | <vagrantc> the set it up in debian-installer
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| 17:20 | the simple workaround, i think, is to dpkg-reconfigure tzdata
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| 17:20 | <sutula> vagrantc: Maybe someone on OFTC/#debian-devel could help
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| 17:20 | vagrantc: Your last suggestion sounds OK, except...
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| 17:20 | <vagrantc> ?
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| 17:21 | <sutula> ...one of the symptoms I see is that packages complain that certain file times are set in the future
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| 17:21 | I'm guessing that happens because the install is done with a bogus TZ value
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| 17:22 | I think that cures itself in (UTC - TZ) hours, so it's more an annoyance
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| 17:22 | For half the world (positive TZ values), it never shows up at all :)
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| 17:23 | moa_: Again, others are more expert, but I've managed to do quick switchovers on a live system by saving /opt/ltsp as /opt/ltsp-old, and then going back to it if I have trouble. But I wouldn't expect that to work between ltsp 4 and 5.
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| 17:24 | Certainly not seamless, though...I'd think you'd need a second server for that
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| 17:25 | <moa_> I figured as much. I've got the backup I could use.
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| 17:25 | <sutula> moa_: Can you bring ltsp 5 up on a different machine, then do a copy to the real server when it's working right?
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| 17:26 | <moa_> I'm going to go run all this by the boss.
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| 17:26 | be back in a few.
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| 17:26 | Thanks for all your help
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| 17:31 | <vagrantc> sutula: ok, so adding dpkg-reconfigure tzdata after copying /etc/timezone into the chroot seems to work fine.
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| 17:33 | <sutula> vagrantc: OK
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| 17:33 | vagrantc: I'll ask locally...I know an install expert, to see if he knows of a different approach
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| 17:34 | ...but it sounds like you have at least a 90% solution
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| 17:34 | <vagrantc> feels more like a workaround, but sure.
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| 17:34 | <sutula> my "expert" is sick...out of the office until early next week, but I'll make a not to ask
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| 17:34 | s/not/note/
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| 17:36 | <vagrantc> sutula: the other issue was one of the keyboard setting things, but i think that is fixed also
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| 17:37 | sutula: did you end up using the xdebconfigurator stuff for the backport ?
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| 17:37 | sutula: or did you use the new X configuration?
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| 17:41 | <sutula> vagrantc: I used whatever happens "stock out of the box"...I removed my old lts.conf file
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| 17:42 | 5.0.31debian2~0.etch.1
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| 17:42 | DonSilver has joined #ltsp | |
| 17:42 | * sutula isn't sure he's answering vagrantc's question | |
| 17:44 | <vagrantc> sutula: on some machines, i had to switch back to the same sort of X configuration used in 5.0.8debian3 and earlier
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| 17:47 | <sutula> vagrantc: I guess I'm using the newer stuff then
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| 17:47 | <vagrantc> cool
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| 17:51 | <sutula> vagrantc: Back to the TZ, had some discussion with some others (non-experts). Pointed me to http://www.debian.org/releases/etch/example-preseed.txt
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| 17:51 | That doesn't help, does it?
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| 17:51 | * sutula hasn't studied d-i | |
| 17:53 | <sutula> One of the peanut gallery wondered whether it was as simple as exporting $TZ set to a reasonable value in the env the installer runs in, but /me doubts it's that easy
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| 17:54 | <vagrantc> sutula: we're not using d-i at all, no.
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| 17:55 | might be worth trying $TZ
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| 17:56 | <moa_> Well, I appreciate the help. You guys have gotten me out of plenty of predicaments, next step to fix sound: upgrade :)
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| 17:56 | <sutula> vagrantc: If that doesn't work, what do you use, in a nutshell?
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| 17:57 | * sutula could look at the code in ltsp-build-client but is too busy with other stuff right now | |
| 17:58 | sbalneav has quit IRC | |
| 18:00 | <vagrantc> anybody ever messed with micros eclipse POS systems?
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| 18:00 | moa_ has left #ltsp | |
| 18:00 | <vagrantc> i've got a bunch here at freegeek
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| 18:01 | LTSP boots, but not touchscreen
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| 18:05 | cliebow___ has joined #ltsp | |
| 18:07 | * sutula looks on ebay to find out what that is...pricey! | |
| 18:15 | * vagrantc suspects overpriced | |
| 18:15 | janet has joined #ltsp | |
| 18:15 | <janet> is there a way to set up a usb printer locally on a client?
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| 18:17 | anyone on?
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| 18:20 | <vagrantc> yes, there is a way, i don't know off the top of my head, and need to go shortly
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| 18:20 | <janet> sad
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| 18:20 | ok thanks vagrantc i'm still googling
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| 18:21 | <vagrantc> if using ubuntu or debian, search for "jetpipe"
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| 19:15 | mwright1 has joined #ltsp | |
| 19:15 | <mwright1> Hi just wandering if anyone can help me with muekow LTSP for ubuntu?
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| 19:15 | specifically whether the xen kernel in ubuntu supports all the LTSP stuff
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| 19:23 | Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC | |
| 19:37 | <mwright1> ping
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| 20:01 | Lumiere is now known as Lumiere|DCUnited | |
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| 20:47 | <mwright1> ping anyone here
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| 20:47 | jammcq?
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| 21:03 | <mwright1> anyone know how to install ubuntu inside a xen instance and get sound
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| 21:36 | John_Titor has joined #ltsp | |
| 21:36 | <John_Titor> you know where can i find some history info bout ltsp
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| 21:50 | <mwright1> umm what sort of history
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| 21:50 | I'd like to know the future rather than the history
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| 21:50 | I can probably help you with the history though
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| 21:50 | a little bit
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| 22:01 | <John_Titor> i mean the starts
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| 22:02 | the reason to develop it
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| 22:02 | things like thta
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| 22:03 | <mwright1> it was jammcq.. I think he may have wanted to sell thinstations or he may have thought of that after the fact
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| 22:04 | the motivation is to have low cost computing for schools and things I think
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| 22:04 | and to save computer hardware from land fill
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| 22:04 | for instance we have a top notch HP server, but all our workstations are pentium 200 266s
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| 22:04 | they would otherwise be thrown in the bin
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| 22:05 | <John_Titor> thx!
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| 22:19 | sbalneav has joined #ltsp | |
| 22:20 | <sbalneav> Evening all
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| 22:38 | <mwright1> sbalneav: good evening
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| 22:38 | I have a question for you regarding Xen and Ubuntu gutsy
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| 22:38 | can I boot LTSP server inside a xen instance, and then connect my terminals to its IP address and will I get all the muekow sound etc?
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| 22:39 | <sbalneav> I know absolutely nothing about any virtualization technology
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| 22:39 | <mwright1> the xen Dom0 (underlying hardware OS is running centos 5 (xen 3.x) and the ubuntu will be running a -xen kernel (xen3.0_
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| 22:39 | well the OS just boots as normal, obviously there is a small performance and resources hit
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| 22:39 | <sbalneav> I always run my linuxes on the bare metal.
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| 22:39 | <mwright1> the main part of the question is in regards to the kernel extensions that enable LTSP sound on v5
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| 22:40 | there is some huge advantage of virtualising to do with upgrades, redundancy, backups testing, we have a 16gb ram HP Dl385 and it runs very nicely
| |
| 22:40 | in any case we are currently running LTSP 4.2 inside a Fedora Xen instance on top of Centos 5 however we have no sound
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| 22:41 | So I must deliver sound to my clients, and am wandering whether creating another xen instance running ubuntu gutsy, will work for the sound modules (I know it will work for everything else)
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| 22:41 | just depends how the ubuntu sound stuff works
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| 22:41 | MagicStorm has quit IRC | |
| 22:41 | <mwright1> The clients are bare metal
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| 22:41 | it's the server I'm talking about
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| 22:41 | <sbalneav> I know absolutely nothing about any virtualization technology
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| 22:42 | So I don't know.
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| 22:42 | <mwright1> currently the /opt/ltsp terminal stuff is directly on the bare metal (running centos5) but the OS is on the fedora instance
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| 22:42 | yes but you know lots about LTSP, I know nothing about LTSP 5 sound
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| 22:42 | the people who integrated LTSP into ubuntu would know
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| 22:43 | does LTSP 5 on ubuntu gutsy support x86_64?
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| 22:43 | <sbalneav> Which, 64 bit clients?
| |
| 22:43 | Yes.
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| 22:43 | <mwright1> no the clients are 32bit, but 64bit server?
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| 22:43 | <sbalneav> That works as well.
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| 22:43 | <mwright1> I'm just wandering what hapens if the clients are 32bit and the server is 64bit ubuntu
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| 22:44 | <sbalneav> It works just fine.
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| 22:44 | <mwright1> the clients are p200 server is dual core amd opteron 64
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| 22:44 | <sbalneav> Lots of people run it like that.
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| 22:44 | <mwright1> ok great. so where do you think I can ask about the ltsp sound implementation, and hhow that involves the kernel?
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| 22:44 | so to see whether the support is including in the packaged official ubuntu xen kernels
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| 22:44 | <sbalneav> I know how the sound works.
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| 22:45 | I just have no idea if it works under Xen or not.
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| 22:45 | <mwright1> ok so is it a kernel module that works with all kernels
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| 22:45 | <sbalneav> I know lots of people can't seem to install LTSP under xen.
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| 22:45 | It's an alsa driver
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| 22:45 | <mwright1> that might be cause they don't know what htey're doing
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| 22:45 | you have to seperate the boot stuff and put it on the bare metal
| |
| 22:46 | <sbalneav> Or, maybe it doesn't work.
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| 22:46 | <mwright1> that's the main issue with xen, cause of the way dhcp works
| |
| 22:46 | we need to get it working, I will get my guys onto it, but it sounds like it's untested?
| |
| 22:46 | or are there people who claim to have it working?
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| 22:46 | <sbalneav> Utterly untested.
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| 22:47 | <mwright1> no reports as yet as to anyone getting it working.
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| 22:47 | <sbalneav> I don't know. Usually, whenever someone starts talking about Virtualization, I tune out, as it's not something I'm interested in.
| |
| 22:47 | <mwright1> I don't understand why you are not interested
| |
| 22:47 | for instance it is a solution to climate change, better utilisation of resources
| |
| 22:48 | it's just like LTSP.. it saves the environment
| |
| 22:48 | <sbalneav> No it's not.
| |
| 22:48 | How?
| |
| 22:48 | <mwright1> and cost, which is greater accessibility
| |
| 22:48 | cause you can allocate multiple machines on 1 host instead of buying more hosts and use lesss real time power and less embodied energy
| |
| 22:48 | total lifecycle cost
| |
| 22:48 | Amaranth has quit IRC | |
| 22:48 | <mwright1> ie we have a mta with mailing lists in xen, ltsp in xen, database server in xen
| |
| 22:49 | it's also just like chrooting only better. IO is better between boxes
| |
| 22:49 | <sbalneav> Why would you buy multiple hosts, if you've got enough power to run it all on 1 box?
| |
| 22:49 | <mwright1> anyway have to disappear.. I will get to the bttom of htis
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| 22:49 | because you don't want to run everything inside the same OS cause you might have conflicts, or have restraints on rebootin, or some solutions may be better suited to other flavours of linux
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| 22:50 | <sbalneav> Last time I checked, a database server, mail server, mailing list server can all run under one box without xen, so why would I need to partition it up into a lot of virtual hosts to get the same thing?
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| 22:50 | <mwright1> so this is all installed on one physical box booting multiple xen instances
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| 22:50 | * sbalneav shrugs | |
| 22:50 | <mwright1> cause for desktop you want to upgrade every 6 months
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| 22:50 | <sbalneav> I don't need it.
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| 22:50 | <mwright1> but for database server you don't want to go through the hassle of postgresql upgrades, same for web server etc
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| 22:50 | we have a big environment and we don't want to upgrade everything all at once, so Xen solves our problem, this is in production
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| 22:51 | <sbalneav> I run production too.
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| 22:51 | <mwright1> we can leave our old LTSP running and set our new one up and migrate everyone 1 at a time between the two, all on the same physical hardware
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| 22:51 | <sbalneav> 3 databases, 165 users across a 1000 kilometer area.
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| 22:51 | <mwright1> you would be a lot more competent at managing this than our team, however we may be more representativbe of the regular population
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| 22:51 | <sbalneav> If it works for you, great.
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| 22:51 | <mwright1> I'm just mentioning to you because you are a developer
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| 22:51 | <sbalneav> I don't need it.
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| 22:52 | <mwright1> anwyay have to run to a customer cheers and thanks :)
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| 22:52 | <sbalneav> np
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| 22:52 | <mwright1> I wasn't trying to force it on you either.
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