IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 2 October 2008 (all times are UTC)
| 00:00 | <johnny> Quiliro, if you look through the plugins for ltsp-build-client in ltsp-trunk
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| 00:01 | you will see ubuntu's, then you can modify the references to match
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| 00:01 | and perhaps even get that included in ltsp
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| 00:09 | <Quiliro> i'll try that...thks guys
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| 00:12 | but do I have to go to trunk? i have the scripts in the installed package
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| 00:14 | <Ryan52> that should be fine. though new versions of the package will just overwrite your changes...
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| 00:14 | so you should tell dpkg to "hold" it.
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| 00:15 | so, like this: echo ltsp-package-name-here hold | dpkg --set-selections
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| 00:15 | though I don't really know the name of the ltsp packages off the top of my head. but you need to run that for each one.
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| 00:18 | <Quiliro> it is to try before sending changes
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| 00:18 | thks ryan52
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| 00:19 | <Quiliro> how do i quickly know what is specific for each distro?
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| 00:19 | for example.....change hoary for gusty
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| 00:20 | sorry
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| 00:20 | i meant hoary for deltah
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| 00:20 | change http://ec.archives.ubuntu.com with http://ec.archives.gnewsense.org
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| 00:20 | etc
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| 00:23 | <johnny> just create a copy of ubuntu's plugin files
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| 00:23 | called gnewsense
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| 00:24 | and then examine each one..
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| 00:24 | many are short
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| 00:24 | so it's not gonna take that long
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| 00:24 | if it is an exact match for ubuntu
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| 00:24 | you could just hard link it
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| 00:24 | instead of copying it
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| 00:27 | <Quiliro> https://code.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk
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| 00:27 | is this it?
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| 00:27 | <Ryan52> yup
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| 00:30 | <Quiliro> cant find ltsp-build-client
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| 00:31 | <johnny> it's in there
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| 00:31 | under server/
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| 00:33 | <Quiliro> think i found it
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| 00:33 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/files/876?file_id=ltspbuildclient-20060901054639-5b3bfa5f52ef8569
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| 00:34 | <johnny> yes
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| 00:50 | <Quiliro> great......i will go back whe i get it locally working
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| 00:50 | thks johnny
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| 07:24 | <Hyperbyte> Hello...
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| 07:24 | * Hyperbyte agrees with the topic | |
| 07:24 | <Hyperbyte> Fedora 9 user here... LTSP is very nicely integrated... I'm wondering if someone can point me in the right direction of getting sound working though.
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| 07:25 | I haven't managed that yet... tried some howto's (even though they seem outdated mostly).. alas, no luck.
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| 07:35 | <tuukka> hello.. is it normal to that clients crash on openGL?
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| 07:38 | seems to be..
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| 07:45 | <Hyperbyte> tuukka, you haven't gotten sound working with ltsp have you? =)
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| 07:51 | <tuukka> Sound works just fine it depends
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| 07:51 | dam I haven't IRCed while
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| 07:51 | Hyperbyte: it depences about your soundcard
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| 07:51 | Hyperbyte: and are you using pulseaudio
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| 07:52 | <tuukka> Hyperbyte: example VIA/some Intel soundcards doesn't have Master (in alsa) that pulseaudio seeks..
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| 07:53 | Hyperbyte: so sound works but it's mute and there is nothing you can do about it.. also you have to check from pulseaudio control if your Mixer is ok
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| 07:54 | Hyperbyte: So I have sound now a days :D
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| 07:56 | <tuukka> dam.. I'm talking with myself.. so it means go home..
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| 08:22 | <cliebow> mistik1:could you translate this?,..java.lang.NullPointerException
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| 08:23 | <ltsppbot> "cliebow" pasted "ava.lang.NullPointerException" (11 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/12
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| 08:42 | <Q-FUNK> !g
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| 08:42 | <ltspbot`> Q-FUNK: "g" is Gadi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 08:43 | <Gadi> hey, there!
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| 08:43 | <Q-FUNK> :)
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| 08:45 | <cliebow> Gadi:Hey There!!
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| 08:45 | <Gadi> g'morning
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| 08:45 | <cliebow> ;-]
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| 08:45 | <Gadi> sorry - I'm gonna be afk a lot today - coming back from the holidays and the world kept going on without me :)
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| 09:37 | <jammcq> G'morning friends
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| 09:38 | <Hyperbyte> Hi.
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| 09:46 | <fgiraldeau> jammcq: hope that you're fine
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| 09:54 | <sbalneav> Morning all!
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| 09:54 | <fgiraldeau> sbalneav: hi there
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| 09:54 | <sbalneav> Hey Francis!
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| 09:54 | <fgiraldeau> long time
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| 09:54 | <sbalneav> Oooooh, Beer and lobster time's coming soon, mes ami!
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| 09:55 | <fgiraldeau> Will be there
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| 09:55 | <sbalneav> I know!
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| 09:55 | Looking forward to seeing my favorite (now 2 favorite, I guess) residents from La Belle Provence!
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| 09:56 | You guys had any frost yet in Montreal?
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| 09:56 | <fgiraldeau> It's only about 2000km appart
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| 09:56 | not yet
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| 09:56 | <sbalneav> We had a killing frost this morning. My flowers are looking wilted.
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| 09:57 | <fgiraldeau> but leafs are almost all changed color
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| 09:57 | doh
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| 09:57 | that's life after all
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| 09:57 | <sbalneav> Life in Canada :)
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| 09:57 | <fgiraldeau> don't know which kind of gov. we will get ;)
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| 09:58 | hehe
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| 09:58 | anyway
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| 09:58 | that's a pleasure
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| 09:58 | do you need help for ldm?
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| 09:58 | i'm a bit disconnected since a while
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| 09:59 | <sbalneav> Well, there's some bugs I'd like to fix, what I'd really like to focus on, for myself anyway, this hackfest, is spit and polish
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| 09:59 | <fgiraldeau> I saw local apps working with clean sshfs
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| 09:59 | that's pretty good
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| 09:59 | <sbalneav> there's some nagging bugs, I'd like to try to close a few of them.
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| 09:59 | <fgiraldeau> ok
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| 09:59 | <jammcq> fgiraldeau: hey, looking forward to seeing you in Maine
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| 09:59 | <fgiraldeau> there a few usability issues to work on
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| 09:59 | <jammcq> Scotty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 10:00 | <fgiraldeau> yeah, I will be there, I realy appreciated it last year.
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| 10:00 | <sbalneav> Hey jammcq, you big star
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| 10:00 | <fgiraldeau> And with graber, we are working hard to make clustering stuff mainstream
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| 10:01 | everything has been moved on launchpad and bzr, so, it should streamline the cooperation
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| 10:02 | <sbalneav> Tres Bien!
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| 10:02 | <dmorar> Hi
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| 10:02 | <sbalneav> (With you around, I can brush up on my French!)
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| 10:02 | Hello
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| 10:02 | <dmorar> im getting really poor performance on 5.0, would you help me to determine whats causing it?
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| 10:02 | im running hardy
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| 10:03 | kubuntu
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| 10:03 | <fgiraldeau> sbalneav: great! I do the same with my english
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| 10:04 | <sbalneav> Define "Poor performance": Slow apps, slow drawing, etc. It would help if you told us 1) What kind of clients (memory, cpu, etc), 2) What kind of server (cpu memory), 3) how many clients 4) What programs you're wanting to run.
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| 10:05 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i have slow apps... i have mostly celeron 1Ghz with 512 RAM clients, and a core 2 duo with 4 Gb RAM running kubuntu 8.04, there are 15 clients
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| 10:06 | i want to run normal apps, openoffice and mozilla firefox... some users will use rdesktop to connect to a windows machine
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| 10:07 | <sbalneav> dmorar: first thing I'd be checking is ram on the server
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| 10:07 | <cyberorg> dmorar, add LDM_DIRECTX=True to lts.conf
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| 10:07 | <dmorar> i had a Slackware LTSP 4.2 setup, and it worked like a charm, this new deployment is pretty slow, so i think something must be wrong
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| 10:07 | sbalneav: i can run the apps on the server on full load
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| 10:08 | and i always have 500 RAM free
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| 10:08 | LDM_DIRECTX=Y its ok
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| 10:09 | <ogra-maemo> does your server have an ati or nvidia card ?
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| 10:09 | <sbalneav> What does the output of the "free" command say?
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| 10:09 | <dmorar> ogra-maemo: no
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| 10:10 | sbalneav: what field?
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| 10:10 | <sbalneav> Just paste the whole output to the pastebot
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| 10:10 | !pastebot
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| 10:10 | <ltspbot`> sbalneav: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
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| 10:12 | <ltsppbot> "mighty-d" pasted "FREE" (4 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/13
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| 10:14 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i have to restart X, be back in ten seconds, please excuse me for this...
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| 10:15 | <dmorar> Hi, im back
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| 10:16 | <sbalneav> ok, you're not running out of memory, so that's good
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| 10:16 | when you say "slow apps", how are they slow? Slow to launch or "laggy" on the screen?
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| 10:18 | <dmorar> sbalneav: everything is slow, i can type faster than i see the words on the screen
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| 10:18 | <sbalneav> Where do you have the lts.conf file?
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| 10:19 | <dmorar> on the tftpboot
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| 10:19 | <sbalneav> It should be in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386
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| 10:19 | <dmorar> yeah, there it is
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| 10:19 | <sbalneav> what's its permissions?
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| 10:19 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i think lts.conf is working
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| 10:20 | world readable, only write access for root
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| 10:21 | <sbalneav> ok, easy way to find out, on a thin client, what's the value of environment variable DISPLAY in a terminal?
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| 10:24 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i cant see a DISPLAY variable in the terminal of the clients
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| 10:24 | even if im logged in through ld
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| 10:24 | m
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| 10:24 | ldm
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| 10:25 | <sbalneav> So, if you log into a terminal, open up a kterm, and type echo $DISPLAY, you get nothing?
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| 10:25 | <dmorar> ahh ok, wait
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| 10:27 | <dmorar> sbalneav: ok, i get DISPLAY=MYIP:6.0
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| 10:28 | <sbalneav> ok, so ldm_directx is working
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| 10:28 | So you launch, say, openoffice, and you type, and nothing appears on the screen for a bit?
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| 10:28 | <dmorar> sbalneav: it appears but too slow,
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| 10:29 | the system itself feels slow, even to launch a popup menu on the deskto
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| 10:30 | <sbalneav> Well, then I'd look at a couple of things
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| 10:30 | <frin> what smaller distributions do support ltsp 5?
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| 10:30 | <sbalneav> 1) Bad network card in the server, dropping packets
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| 10:31 | <frin> afaik arch linux doesn't support local apps
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| 10:31 | and/or sound
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| 10:31 | <sbalneav> 2) switch dropping packets
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| 10:31 | 3) some tuning necessary.
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| 10:32 | I had some problems with network buffers, I increased some buffer space on my servers, and it solved it.
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| 10:32 | <dmorar> sbalneav: how do i do that?
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| 10:33 | <sbalneav> I added the following to my /etc/sysctl.conf:
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| 10:33 | net.core.wmem_default = 524288
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| 10:33 | net.core.wmem_max = 524288
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| 10:33 | net.core.rmem_default = 524288
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| 10:33 | net.core.rmem_max = 524288
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| 10:33 | then did a sysctl -p
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| 10:33 | Now, that's going to set some network buffers to 512k
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| 10:34 | <ogra-maemo> sbalneav, is that hardy ?
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| 10:34 | <sbalneav> ogra-maemo: yup
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| 10:34 | <ogra-maemo> i wonder if it helps other people seeing issues
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| 10:34 | <sbalneav> Might, this might be an interesting test.
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| 10:34 | Now, that was with 40 people on a box
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| 10:34 | <ogra-maemo> the current discussion on ltsp-discuss isnt really fun
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| 10:34 | <sbalneav> You might not want to go for 524288
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| 10:35 | ogra-maemo: Well, it's the same old problem.
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| 10:35 | <ogra-maemo> no, poeple complain about hardy specifically
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| 10:36 | <sbalneav> right, but who from the user community helped us with any testing when hardy was in beta? :)
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| 10:36 | <dmorar> sbalneav: ok, i run sysctl -p, does the changes has been applied or i need to restart something else?
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| 10:36 | <ogra-maemo> not many, but i always feel bad bedcause i also cant invest as much time as before
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| 10:37 | <ogra-maemo> so i usually search for the failure on my desk first
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| 10:37 | <sbalneav> dmorar: do a sysctl -a
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| 10:37 | <nubae> maybe the topic should be updated on #edubuntu
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| 10:38 | <sbalneav> if you see the net.core values, then they should be good.
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| 10:38 | <dmorar> ok, im going to run the test
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| 10:39 | <sbalneav> brb, workping
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| 10:40 | back
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| 10:42 | <dmorar> sbalneav: its still slow
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| 10:43 | <sbalneav> Well, lets quantify how slow
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| 10:43 | What are we talking about for the delay?
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| 10:43 | 2 seconds?
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| 10:44 | <dmorar> hmmm give me a second
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| 10:45 | sbalneav: almost 20 seconds
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| 10:45 | to run calc
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| 10:45 | i can run calc on the server in 8 seconds
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| 10:47 | <sbalneav> Ok, that's fairly sizeable.
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| 10:47 | So, something's wrong here, definitely.
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| 10:47 | can you paste the entire contents of your lts.conf file to the pastebot?
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| 10:48 | <dmorar> sbalneav: ok,give me a second
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| 10:49 | <ltsppbot> "MIGHTY" pasted "LTS" (7 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/14
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| 10:51 | <sbalneav> Seems reasonable.
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| 10:51 | By way of comparison, OpenOffice.org Calc launches in 3 seconds here, and I get no lag in typing.
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| 10:52 | <dmorar> sbalneav: :(
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| 10:52 | <sbalneav> What kind of video card are in the clients?
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| 10:52 | <dmorar> i810
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| 10:53 | <sbalneav> And 512 megs per client, you said?
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| 10:53 | <dmorar> yes, there are some with 256
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| 10:54 | <sbalneav> Should still be reasonable.
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| 10:55 | Maybe try setting the XSERVER variable explicitly.
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| 10:56 | can't remember if it's XSERVER=i810 or XSERVER=intel
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| 10:56 | hold on... lemme check
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| 10:57 | yeah, try XSERVER=intel in the lts.conf file, see if that helps. Also, what kind of network switch do you have?
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| 10:58 | <dmorar> sbalneav: actually i have intel_agp modules loaded
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| 10:59 | sbalneav: i have a catalyst from cisco, but i dont think its the switch because as i said, it worked perfectly on 4.2
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| 11:00 | <sbalneav> Well, 4.2 used a really old X server, and used NFS for the root. There's a much newer X now, and we use root over NBD, so a lot's changed.
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| 11:01 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i know, but i would discard switch because it doesnt matter if its X or SSH to ir
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| 11:01 | to it
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| 11:02 | <sbalneav> I don't discard anything when I'm trying to troubleshoot :)
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| 11:02 | <dmorar> sbalneav: you are right
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| 11:03 | <sbalneav> So, is it any different with XSERVER=intel?
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| 11:03 | <dmorar> do you want me to run any test on the switch
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| 11:03 | sbalneav: no :(
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| 11:03 | sbalneav: im starting to think you might be right and the problem could be more network related
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| 11:03 | <ogra-maemo> the NIC drivers are also massively different between 4.x and 5
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| 11:04 | <sbalneav> right
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| 11:04 | what kind of nic's are in these boxes?
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| 11:05 | <dmorar> e100
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| 11:05 | <sbalneav> that should be an ok nic
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| 11:05 | <ogra-maemo> yeah
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| 11:06 | <sbalneav> Wonder if there's some kind of bandwidth throttling going on in the switch.
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| 11:06 | Got a "dumb" switch you could throw in to eliminate?
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| 11:07 | Or better still, got a crossover cable you could plug one of the terminals directly into the server
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| 11:07 | <dmorar> sbalneav: ok, give me a second i have this non-administrable switch i can plug
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| 11:07 | <sbalneav> That would eliminate a whole raft of possiblities
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| 11:07 | try the crossover cable first, if you got one.
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| 11:08 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i cant use cross over cable because of phisical space limitations
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| 11:08 | * ogra-maemo remembers issues with dhcp on cisco switches | |
| 11:09 | <sbalneav> ok, well, unmanaged switch is the next best thing
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| 11:11 | <dmorar> ok, its the same :(
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| 11:12 | <sbalneav> ok, interesting.
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| 11:13 | Can we get the output of ifconfig -a?
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| 11:13 | <dmorar> on the server?
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| 11:14 | <sbalneav> Yeah
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| 11:14 | I want to see if it thinks we're dropping packats.
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| 11:14 | <ltsppbot> "MIGHTY" pasted "ifconfig" (30 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/15
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| 11:15 | <sbalneav> Which is the one with the terminals hanging off of it>
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| 11:15 | ?
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| 11:15 | <dmorar> 2.1
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| 11:15 | 192.168.2.1
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| 11:15 | eth0
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| 11:16 | <sbalneav> ok, lets see how it thinks it's connected, mii-tool eth0
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| 11:16 | it's only one line, so just past it here
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| 11:19 | <dmorar> eth0: negotiated 100baseTx-FD flow-control, link ok
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| 11:19 | the unmanaged switch is 100
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| 11:19 | <sbalneav> Hmmm
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| 11:19 | "flow-control"
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| 11:20 | root@lemans:~# mii-tool eth0
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| 11:20 | eth0: negotiated 100baseTx-FD, link ok
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| 11:20 | Lemme check something....
| |
| 11:20 | leio has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:20 | <sbalneav> Yeah, should be ok
| |
| 11:21 | So, doesn't seem to be a network problem
| |
| 11:21 | Doesn't seem to be a hardware problem
| |
| 11:21 | Out of curiosity, what happens if you log in via Gnome?
| |
| 11:22 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i dont have gnome
| |
| 11:22 | edubuntufan has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:22 | <dmorar> via kdm?
| |
| 11:22 | using SCREEN06=startx ?
| |
| 11:23 | <sbalneav> Ah, ok
| |
| 11:23 | No, via ldm, I was wondering.
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| 11:23 | <edubuntufan> Hi, do we have some active users on now?
| |
| 11:23 | <sbalneav> yup
| |
| 11:23 | <dmorar> i dont understand what you are asking me to do
| |
| 11:24 | <sbalneav> dmorar: It's ok, you don't have gnome, so no problem
| |
| 11:24 | What's the load average on this box? I'm assuming low?
| |
| 11:25 | <dmorar> sbalneav: what do you mean by load average?
| |
| 11:25 | <sbalneav> uptime
| |
| 11:25 | 11:24:00 up 2:31, 8 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
| |
| 11:25 | root@lemans:~#
| |
| 11:25 | Loadaverage in this box right at the moment's 0 :)
| |
| 11:25 | <dmorar> 11:29:39 up 1 day, 14:46, 13 users, load average: 0.16, 0.56, 0.65
| |
| 11:26 | <sbalneav> Yeah, you're coasting.
| |
| 11:27 | Here's one of my boxes:
| |
| 11:27 | root@sputnik:~# uptime 11:25:56 up 29 days, 14:10, 44 users, load average: 0.99, 1.01, 0.97
| |
| 11:28 | <dmorar> sbalneav: which os are you running on this box?
| |
| 11:28 | <sbalneav> Hardy
| |
| 11:28 | <dmorar> and which clients hardware?
| |
| 11:28 | <sbalneav> Gnome desktop, Firefox + thunderbird + OO.o
| |
| 11:29 | desktop hardware's a Via Eden 1ghz processor with a gig of ram. It's the new little E10000 board, I think.
| |
| 11:29 | so, it's not excessively powerful hardware. Via display chip.
| |
| 11:30 | ogra-maemo: does ubuntu still cut ppc cd images?
| |
| 11:31 | <dmorar> im really sad, i dont know what to do, everything should be working fine...
| |
| 11:31 | :(
| |
| 11:31 | <sbalneav> Yeah, I'm not sure what's holding you up.
| |
| 11:31 | hmm
| |
| 11:32 | what's the contents of your /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf file.
| |
| 11:32 | <cliebow> sbalneav: i believe they do...in community...
| |
| 11:33 | japerry has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:33 | <ltsppbot> "mighty" pasted "dhcp" (34 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/16
| |
| 11:35 | <sbalneav> Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
| |
| 11:35 | "option domain-name-servers 192.168.1.5;
| |
| 11:35 | Does the ltsp server actually port forward from eth0 to eth1?
| |
| 11:36 | I wonder if the client's trying to do some dns lookup.
| |
| 11:36 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i havent seen this
| |
| 11:36 | let me fix it
| |
| 11:36 | pscheie has quit IRC | |
| 11:36 | <sbalneav> On eth0, all you have is the thin clients?
| |
| 11:36 | * dmorar hopes this fix it | |
| 11:36 | <dmorar> sbalneav: yeah
| |
| 11:36 | its a dedicated switch and card for thin clients
| |
| 11:36 | <sbalneav> theoretically, they shouldn't NEED dns, since they only talk to the server,
| |
| 11:36 | pscheie has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:37 | <sbalneav> why not remove all the dns stuff for them.
| |
| 11:37 | Subhodip has quit IRC | |
| 11:37 | <sbalneav> Usually, a dns timeout's like, 15 seconds
| |
| 11:37 | 15 + 8 = ~20
| |
| 11:37 | <cliebow> ?
| |
| 11:38 | <sbalneav> Well, he said it was around 20 seconds to launch calc on the thin client
| |
| 11:38 | <dmorar> it could be
| |
| 11:38 | <sbalneav> it was less than 8 on the server
| |
| 11:38 | <dmorar> ok
| |
| 11:38 | lets see how it runs
| |
| 11:38 | <sbalneav> so he's got just about the right amount of excess time there that might be explained by something with dns :)
| |
| 11:41 | <dmorar> sbalneav: should i set access to a dns server ?
| |
| 11:41 | or is this unnecessary
| |
| 11:42 | Quiliro has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:42 | <sbalneav> dmorar: Should be unnecessary on a thin client.
| |
| 11:42 | don't forget to restart dhcp3-server
| |
| 11:44 | <dmorar> sure
| |
| 11:48 | Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC | |
| 11:49 | Egyptian[Home] has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:52 | spectra has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:54 | * sbalneav waits anxiously to see if dmorar's problem is fixed | |
| 11:54 | <dmorar> sbalneav: nothing yet,
| |
| 11:54 | im starting to consider a reinstall
| |
| 11:55 | <ogra-maemo> what do you expect that to solve ?
| |
| 11:55 | <dmorar> ogra-maemo: i dont know
| |
| 11:55 | <sbalneav> Yeah, you don't want to go through the trouble of a reinstall, just to find the same thing.
| |
| 11:56 | SOMETHING's causing the slowdown :)
| |
| 11:56 | So, you redid the dhcp, and still slow, or you're still working on it ?
| |
| 11:56 | <dmorar> sbalneav: i was thinking on deploying hardy 64 bits to solve the 3.5 GB ram issue
| |
| 11:56 | sbalneav: its still slow
| |
| 11:57 | sbalneav: however i found that its getting slower and slower and slower, it takes for ever to load initrd on boot
| |
| 11:57 | <sbalneav> I don't use 64 bits, and I have 8 gigs in my servers
| |
| 11:57 | install the linux-image-server package
| |
| 11:58 | so initrd takes a long time?
| |
| 11:58 | then that HAS to be a network problem somewhere
| |
| 11:58 | because you're still in the pxe bios just doing a tftp at that point.
| |
| 11:58 | <dmorar> sbalneav, ok, im going to see what i can do to the network, maybe its something i havent seen
| |
| 11:59 | <sbalneav> Yeah, I'd look there. If the pxe boots taking a long time it's either:
| |
| 11:59 | 1) the network, or
| |
| 11:59 | 2) the network card in the server.
| |
| 11:59 | so it's something low level.
| |
| 11:59 | Maybe try a different network card in the server.
| |
| 12:00 | okiedoke, I'm gonna head off for lunch.
| |
| 12:00 | be back in an hour.
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| 12:02 | johnny has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:03 | <Hyperbyte> I'm looking for more information on getting sound to work with LTSP under Fedora 9
| |
| 12:03 | <ogra-maemo> Hyperbyte, wait for warren to be around
| |
| 12:03 | <Hyperbyte> Tried a few howto's, but I haven't managed to get it to like me yet...
| |
| 12:04 | <warren> Hyperbyte: it should just work automatically
| |
| 12:04 | Hyperbyte: what application?
| |
| 12:04 | Hyperbyte: I have run into a few rare client chipsets where sound doesn't work for reasons I don't know.
| |
| 12:04 | <Hyperbyte> warren: well, anything basically... all applications (including Gnome's hardware->sound settings) report ... um... damn, I should've written this down (left work a few hours ago)
| |
| 12:05 | Unable to open stream?
| |
| 12:05 | I haven't found any details errors yet (but that's probably because I'm not sure where to look)
| |
| 12:06 | <dmorar> thanks sbalneav for all your time
| |
| 12:06 | * dmorar is going to lunch | |
| 12:06 | <Hyperbyte> Anyway, I got the impression it required some additional configuration... but it should work with sound out of the box?
| |
| 12:07 | Including under Fedora 9 (with a default of PulseAudio I believe)?
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| 12:07 | elisboa has quit IRC | |
| 12:07 | <ogra-maemo> client sided we all use the same setup, so its likely to be a driver issue
| |
| 12:08 | client sided we all use the same setup, so its likely to be a driver issue9
| |
| 12:08 | err
| |
| 12:08 | dmorar has quit IRC | |
| 12:08 | <ogra-maemo> (it works flawless in ubuntu and debian)
| |
| 12:08 | <Hyperbyte> Well, the server does play audio fine...
| |
| 12:08 | * ogra-maemo pokes his folable kbd | |
| 12:08 | elisboa has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:09 | <Hyperbyte> And it has the same hardware as the client (for now anyways)
| |
| 12:09 | <ogra-maemo> check your env in a gnome terminal if you are logged in on a thin client
| |
| 12:09 | it should have PULSE_SERVER set
| |
| 12:09 | <Hyperbyte> *writes down*
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| 12:09 | Anything else I can check when I'm at work tomorrow? :)
| |
| 12:09 | <ogra-maemo> and that should point to the client ip
| |
| 12:10 | <Hyperbyte> Or where I should start debugging?
| |
| 12:10 | <ogra-maemo> no idea, i'm no fedora user, but that variable definately needs to be set in a session to make it work
| |
| 12:11 | <Hyperbyte> Okay...
| |
| 12:11 | Does this work both ways btw?
| |
| 12:11 | <warren> Hyperbyte: it should work automatically if the client sound driver is working
| |
| 12:11 | <Hyperbyte> I mean, is the microphone from the client picked up by the server?
| |
| 12:11 | <warren> Hyperbyte: microphone i'm not sure
| |
| 12:11 | <ogra-maemo> no
| |
| 12:12 | <Hyperbyte> Oh, that's a pity.
| |
| 12:12 | <ogra-maemo> we dont have and capture setup in the config
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| 12:12 | *any
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| 12:12 | <warren> Hyperbyte: the ONLY cases where I've seen sound fail with default configs is where the hardware itself is to blame
| |
| 12:12 | <Hyperbyte> So for softphones I have only one solution and that is to include it on the thin client?
| |
| 12:13 | <warren> Hyperbyte: I'm told by pulseaudio's author that it should be possible to get microphone working. Just nobody researched how to do it yet.
| |
| 12:13 | <johnny> gentlemen
| |
| 12:13 | warren, you feeling better yet?
| |
| 12:13 | <Hyperbyte> warren: pity. :) Would be nice if I could centralize softphones as well.
| |
| 12:14 | <warren> johnny: I was, but then I pushed myself WAY too hard with high blood pressure and anxiety attacks for 3 days straight and I got worse.
| |
| 12:14 | <johnny> warren, sounds like you need a hug
| |
| 12:14 | <warren> johnny: I should have scheduled my big presentation for next week instead of yesterday.
| |
| 12:14 | <johnny> *HUGS*
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| 12:14 | <warren> awww
| |
| 12:14 | <Hyperbyte> <3
| |
| 12:14 | <ogra-maemo> Hyperbyte, you really want to do that through localapps
| |
| 12:14 | <warren> Hyperbyte: you are not listening
| |
| 12:15 | <ogra-maemo> the network lag will kill it
| |
| 12:15 | <warren> Hyperbyte: it is theoretically possible with our existing software, it is likely only a config problem.
| |
| 12:15 | * johnny comes to BOS to sit next to warren to tell him to chill out | |
| 12:15 | <warren> Hyperbyte: someone needs to research it
| |
| 12:15 | <ogra-maemo> still, you dont want softphones over the net
| |
| 12:15 | <Hyperbyte> warren: well, I suppose if you're going to nitpick you could argue anything is possible technically. :)
| |
| 12:15 | <warren> yeah... that's likely true
| |
| 12:15 | <ogra-maemo> it will get choppy, eats way to much bandwith
| |
| 12:15 | <johnny> mmmmm
| |
| 12:15 | bandwidth
| |
| 12:15 | <warren> you're better off with a soft phone as a local app
| |
| 12:15 | <Hyperbyte> warren: I'm afraid it's over my head though, so that's why I mean it's not possible for -me- right now. ;)
| |
| 12:15 | <ogra-maemo> yeah
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| 12:16 | <Hyperbyte> But local app it is then!
| |
| 12:17 | Any recommendations about a softphone that works good with LTSP?
| |
| 12:17 | Lns has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:17 | <ogra-maemo> warren, btw, didnt you have a devicemapper way of using union filesystems ?
| |
| 12:17 | <Lns> damn Nick Kendall
| |
| 12:18 | <warren> ogra-maemo: we don't have any union filesystems
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| 12:18 | <ogra-maemo> without requiring a driver
| |
| 12:18 | no, but you said when you started implementing ltsp that you could achieve the same through device mapper
| |
| 12:18 | <warren> oh
| |
| 12:19 | <ogra-maemo> i have no idea how that would work, but that could be the way for tweh localapps stuff for you then
| |
| 12:19 | * ogra-maemo has never used dm and its not really loved in ubuntu | |
| 12:19 | <warren> ogra-maemo: our livecd uses this: ext3 (for full xattrs) within a compressed squashfs image. dm-snapshot makes the ext3 read-write with block-level changes going either in ramdisk or an optional overlay file.
| |
| 12:20 | <ogra-maemo> right, so you could replace the ext3 with a tmpfs
| |
| 12:20 | <warren> no
| |
| 12:20 | <ogra-maemo> ansd the squashfs with the mounted sshfs
| |
| 12:20 | <warren> no
| |
| 12:20 | <ogra-maemo> why ?
| |
| 12:20 | <warren> dm-snapshot works at the BLOCK level
| |
| 12:20 | <ogra-maemo> ah
| |
| 12:21 | <warren> We have no filesystem level union
| |
| 12:21 | <ogra-maemo> thats a shame
| |
| 12:21 | i guess fedora is the only one not adding that
| |
| 12:21 | <johnny> yay!
| |
| 12:21 | <warren> because it isn't suitable for upstream
| |
| 12:21 | <johnny> people are using my jabber server
| |
| 12:22 | <ogra-maemo> warren, excuses
| |
| 12:23 | keeping technology away from your users because linus doesnt like it ...
| |
| 12:24 | <Quiliro> hey johnny
| |
| 12:25 | <johnny> ogra, don't you mean cuz al viro does't like it? :)
| |
| 12:25 | <Quiliro> created subdirectory gNewSense and modified files from Ubuntu directory
| |
| 12:25 | Its ready
| |
| 12:26 | <johnny> Quiliro, so does it work?
| |
| 12:26 | :)
| |
| 12:26 | <Quiliro> downloading finnaly packages
| |
| 12:26 | had a public key problem
| |
| 12:27 | dont know how to do that so I used ec.archive.gnusense.org instead of archive.gnusense.org
| |
| 12:27 | Pascal_1 has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:28 | <Quiliro> i hope that solves my public key problem :-)
| |
| 12:28 | its about to finish downloading
| |
| 12:28 | I: Validating tcpd
| |
| 12:28 | I: Retrieving tzdata
| |
| 12:29 | tell you in a inute johnny
| |
| 12:29 | *minute
| |
| 12:29 | <stgraber> sbalneav: btw, I just had to set two variables and I now have LDM autologin working with ltsp-cluster. That was way too easy, I initially planned to spend the whole day on that feature :)
| |
| 12:29 | <Quiliro> ltsp-cluster!!! can that be done?
| |
| 12:29 | <johnny> Quiliro, it's in progress
| |
| 12:29 | Q-FUNK has quit IRC | |
| 12:30 | <Quiliro> so i can have one machine run openoffice for all the other machines and another running gimp for all the other machines and so forth?
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| 12:30 | <johnny> i don't think that is what it would be like
| |
| 12:31 | <Quiliro> then what's it for?
| |
| 12:31 | <johnny> i could be wrong tho
| |
| 12:31 | to make sure one machine being down doesn't kill your ltsp install
| |
| 12:31 | <Quiliro> balancing servers?
| |
| 12:31 | oh
| |
| 12:31 | <johnny> that is at least one feature of it
| |
| 12:31 | <Quiliro> cool
| |
| 12:31 | <johnny> if you search ltsp-cluster you can find more info
| |
| 12:31 | <Quiliro> redundancy
| |
| 12:31 | <johnny> i personally don't know anything
| |
| 12:31 | about anything :)
| |
| 12:32 | <stgraber> we have load balancing of application servers
| |
| 12:32 | https://wiki.stgraber.org/LTSP-Cluster
| |
| 12:32 | <johnny> i'll let mr smarty pants answer the questions
| |
| 12:32 | <stgraber> and https://launchpad.net/ltsp-cluster for the Launchpad projects
| |
| 12:32 | <Quiliro> can a server be also a workstation?
| |
| 12:32 | <johnny> mine is..
| |
| 12:32 | but it wouldn't work well in a cluster
| |
| 12:33 | <stgraber> yes, in our setup we usually use standard rack servers so having a workstation in the datacenter would be ... weird :)
| |
| 12:34 | johnny: btw, will you be at LTSP BTS ?
| |
| 12:35 | <johnny> stgraber, i'd love to.. if i can afford it
| |
| 12:35 | <stgraber> ok, you could have a live demo of ltsp-cluster then :)
| |
| 12:35 | <johnny> stgraber, i currently deploy as public internet terminals on ubuntu
| |
| 12:36 | stgraber, i also have created the gentoo support for ltsp..
| |
| 12:36 | * ogra imagines stgraber will come with a 19" cabinet hooked to his car :) | |
| 12:36 | <johnny> since i run gentoo myself
| |
| 12:36 | <ogra> and a trunk full of clients
| |
| 12:36 | <johnny> ogra, that's you.. with a backpack full of classmates :)
| |
| 12:36 | <stgraber> ogra: hehe, no :) Our test server is a standard tower running OpenVZ with all the services as VMs
| |
| 12:37 | we can run 4-5 clients with that without much trouble
| |
| 12:37 | <ogra> johnny, not doing classmates anymore, my current focus is samsung Q1 :) http://www.umpcportal.com/2008/09/ubuntu-mobile-edition-news-and-first-boot-video/
| |
| 12:37 | <stgraber> ogra: I'll also likely have a MSI Wind or similar as thin client so no need to bring some of ours :)
| |
| 12:37 | <johnny> ogra has all the fun
| |
| 12:37 | <ogra> all the fame as well :)
| |
| 12:38 | <johnny> you're certainly famous in my book
| |
| 12:38 | not sure about anybody else's :)
| |
| 12:38 | <ogra> heh
| |
| 12:38 | well, the guy who did the review praises me a lot in the review
| |
| 12:39 | <johnny> did you move your blog ?
| |
| 12:39 | <ogra> which totally wasnt intentional ... especially since i only changed the themeing and setup of ubuntu desktop a bit :)
| |
| 12:39 | <johnny> iirc you had your own domain previously
| |
| 12:40 | <ogra> i still have the domain, but when the server broke with a HW failure i didnt find the time to rebuild it (it lastet 4 years without me touching it)
| |
| 12:40 | so in the end i decided to set up a wordpress account
| |
| 12:41 | i didnt use the server for more than blogging anyway anymore
| |
| 12:44 | exodos has quit IRC | |
| 12:46 | <Lns> ogra: I wouldn't mind one of those Q1s for testing on my end ;)
| |
| 12:47 | <ogra-maemo> heh
| |
| 12:47 | * ogra-maemo is currently getting mobile devices from all sides | |
| 12:47 | <Lns> pretty cool video. Good luck with dev on that!
| |
| 12:48 | <ogra-maemo> well, the image was only created to attract people
| |
| 12:48 | * Lns has a 701 eee that he totes around w/Ubuntu 8.04 | |
| 12:48 | Pascal_1 has quit IRC | |
| 12:48 | <ogra-maemo> so we get more devs and some community
| |
| 12:48 | <Lns> visuals are always helpful
| |
| 12:48 | <ogra-maemo> it runs fine on eeepcs
| |
| 12:49 | i have a lot of eee users in the community that use my image
| |
| 12:49 | <Lns> cool, i'll have to try it on a usb drive =)
| |
| 12:49 | <ogra> yeah
| |
| 12:50 | <johnny> so.. seahorse == teh awesome
| |
| 12:50 | what a nice little utility
| |
| 12:50 | <Lns> johnny: it really is nice - good luck educating normal users on how to use it effectively though ;)
| |
| 12:51 | ogra: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-mid/intrepid/current/ubuntu-mid.img is the image?
| |
| 12:51 | <johnny> Lns, the neat part is the avahi sharing too :)
| |
| 12:51 | Lns, would you rather tell people to run ssh-keygen and ssh-copy-ids ?
| |
| 12:51 | or click 3 buttons? :)
| |
| 12:51 | <ogra> Lns, yeah, note the browser is currently broken
| |
| 12:51 | * ogra compiles it atm | |
| 12:52 | <Lns> no worries, just wanted to play with the ui
| |
| 12:52 | Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp | |
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| 13:13 | K_O-Gnom has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:14 | <sbalneav> back from lunck
| |
| 13:15 | <Lns> real quick, i'm a part of the 'fuse' group and a usb thumbdrive works fine on my TC, but no blank USB-DVDRW disc comes up. TC dmesg says "Driver 'sr' needs updating - please use bus_type methods".. clues?
| |
| 13:16 | <johnny> Lns, but does a real dvd or cd show up?
| |
| 13:16 | not a blank
| |
| 13:16 | <Lns> johnny: lemme check
| |
| 13:17 | <johnny> not that i have any insight to your problem.. just something good to start your troubleshooting journey
| |
| 13:17 | <Lns> ;)
| |
| 13:18 | Nope, regular CD (quickbooks installation) doesn't come up either, no additional dmesg output
| |
| 13:19 | i'm guessing i need to use bus_type method =p
| |
| 13:20 | <johnny> lol
| |
| 13:20 | <Lns> reading this: http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net/msg35060.html
| |
| 13:21 | Ah, I remember this thread now
| |
| 13:24 | Pascal_1 has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:24 | vagrantc has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:25 | <Lns> domm it, /me needs to wait for d/l to finish before rebooting his tc for shiny new udev rules
| |
| 13:28 | <Quiliro> sudo ltsp-build-client --debug > terminal_server.txt
| |
| 13:28 | why don't I get all my debug messages in terminal_server.txt ?
| |
| 13:29 | <johnny> i don't know
| |
| 13:29 | maybe you need to do sterr redirection too
| |
| 13:29 | <Lns> Quiliro: i'm no bash expert but don't you have to redirect stdout and stderr too?
| |
| 13:30 | Pascal_1 has left #ltsp | |
| 13:30 | <Lns> Quiliro: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Bash-Prog-Intro-HOWTO-3.html
| |
| 13:32 | <Quiliro> thks lns
| |
| 13:33 | <Lns> np
| |
| 13:35 | * Lns loves ACLs | |
| 13:35 | <Quiliro> so what I would have to do is:
| |
| 13:35 | sudo ltsp-build-client --debug 2>&1 > terminal_server.txt
| |
| 13:36 | krishna has quit IRC | |
| 13:36 | <Lns> looks sane to me..again i'm no expert though :)
| |
| 13:36 | <Quiliro> i'll see what happens
| |
| 13:37 | thks again
| |
| 13:37 | <vagrantc> Quiliro: i think you'll have to actually do > terminal_server.txt 2>&1 ... as confusing as that is
| |
| 13:38 | <Lns> vagrantc: 2>&1 after the descriptor?
| |
| 13:39 | <vagrantc> i believe so.
| |
| 13:39 | play around with it and see what happens.
| |
| 13:39 | <Lns> but...but...the arrow is going the wrong way! :p
| |
| 13:39 | <vagrantc> it's counter-intuitive, yes.
| |
| 13:40 | CAN-o-SPAM has quit IRC | |
| 13:40 | <Lns> actually that makes sense now that you think about it
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| 13:41 | <Quiliro> didn't work
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| 13:41 | <Lns> you're just defining stderr to go to the same file descriptor as stdout - and you've already defined stdout..so you're just defining stderr.
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| 13:42 | Quiliro: did you try ltsp-build-client --debug > terminal_server.txt 2>&1
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| 13:43 | <Quiliro> it's weird....i get some of the debug messages
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| 13:43 | <vagrantc> Quiliro: also, try with DEBUG=true ltsp-build-client
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| 13:44 | --debug will miss some of the stuff, since someone re-implemented it as a plugin
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| 13:44 | so it doesn't kick in until the debug plugin is loaded
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| 13:44 | <Quiliro> http://pastebin.com/m2017d139
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| 13:45 | that is the way the forst part goes without redirection
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| 13:48 | _UsUrPeR_ has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:49 | <Quiliro> *first part
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| 13:51 | <_UsUrPeR_> y helo thur!
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| 13:54 | * ogra sighs about crazy huge browser sourcepackages | |
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| 14:06 | <stgraber> vagrantc: hey, you may also want to upload this patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/53253/
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| 14:06 | just updating the doc for the lts.conf option I added
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| 14:07 | <Quiliro> sudo ltsp-build-client --debug &> terminal_server.txt
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| 14:07 | sudo ltsp-build-client --debug > terminal_server.txt 2>&1
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| 14:07 | sudo ltsp-build-client --debug 2>&1 > terminal_server.txt
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| 14:07 | <vagrantc> ogra: any reason to not make stgraber a committer?
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| 14:07 | <Quiliro> I tryed those 3 commands
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| 14:07 | <jammcq> Quiliro: I think you need to redirect > to a file, THEN do the 2>&1
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| 14:08 | <Quiliro> none gave me the same output as sudo ltsp-build-client --debug
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| 14:08 | <vagrantc> jammcq: that was the second one pasted
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| 14:08 | <jammcq> oh
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| 14:09 | * jammcq 's tunnel vision couldn't see that far to the right | |
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| 14:09 | <ogra> vagrantc, none at all, i would actually appreciate :)
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| 14:09 | <Quiliro> http://pastebin.com/m2017d139
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| 14:09 | <vagrantc> Quiliro: debug doesn't really do much at all
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| 14:09 | Quiliro: how important is it?
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| 14:10 | <Quiliro> i want to know why im getting this error that my public key is not includd
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| 14:11 | <johnny> it's not your public key.. it's the public key for the repository
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| 14:11 | but that's apt stuff that i don't know much about
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| 14:11 | there's a way to work around it.. but it would be better to fix it
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| 14:12 | <Quiliro> what should i do?
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| 14:12 | to fix it?
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| 14:13 | <johnny> look it up
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| 14:22 | <Quiliro> I have no idea of what to search for
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| 14:24 | <johnny> search for that eror message with the word debian
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| 14:24 | or apt-get
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| 14:42 | <Quiliro> thks johnny
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| 14:48 | <stgraber> vagrantc, ogra: hehe, yes that would make some things a bit easier :)
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| 15:15 | <vagrantc> stgraber: what's the unawr in your patch? :P
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| 15:15 | +LDM_RUNONCE boolean unawr Make LDM to run once and exit (used by ltsp-cluster)
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| 15:15 | ???
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| 15:27 | <cliebow> jammcq: cant seem to dte any rise resetting pw for the wiki..i dont know where it is sending notification..prob downeast.net which i no longer have..
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| 15:43 | <Lns> Anyone remember my earlier USB DVD-RW mounting issue?
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| 15:44 | I'm still having issues after following http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net/msg35061.html
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| 15:44 | <mighty-d> Hi
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| 15:44 | sbalneav,
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| 15:44 | sbalneav, ping
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| 15:44 | <Lns> I can mount the disc manually, but it doesn't help in Gnome
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| 15:45 | <stgraber> vagrantc: oh, that's a good question :)
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| 15:45 | that should be "unset"
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| 15:45 | looks like my fingers were 1 letter off
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| 15:45 | <vagrantc> yeah, i eventually noticed that
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| 15:46 | <Lns> awww, is it true localdev doesn't have CD/DVD-R support (writing a CD/DVD) ?
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| 15:47 | <vagrantc> stgraber: so, is ltsp-cluster* on it's way to ubuntu proper? is it likely to be useful on debian as well?
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| 15:48 | <stgraber> we have it on Launchpad now with the packaging in a separated branch. we'd like to have it included in Jaunty and I guess it could be worth adding to Debian as well
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| 15:49 | I don't think we have any thing Ubuntu-specific so that should work just fine
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| 15:49 | <vagrantc> stgraber: cool. i'd like to look into it more sometime :)
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| 15:53 | <stgraber> vagrantc: we'll be at the hackfest with a demo/hacking server :)
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| 15:53 | <vagrantc> stgraber: i haven't wholly ruled out the possibility of getting there, but it doesn't seem real likely
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| 15:56 | <stgraber> hmm, ok.
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| 15:58 | <ogra> stgraber, welcome to the team :)
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| 15:58 | (you got mail)
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| 15:59 | <jammcq> ogra: did you get your plane tickets yet?
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| 15:59 | <stgraber> ogra: great, thanks
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| 16:00 | <ogra> jammcq, nope, i'll care for that tomorrow, i was hoping for an answer from warren about driving, but wil look for a ticket/car package
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| 16:00 | <jammcq> k
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| 16:14 | <Lns> Does anyone think that an #ltsp bot that alerts the chan when someone posts to a mailing-list (ltsp-discuss/-developer) would be useful? I think that'd be so cool.
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| 16:14 | <FuriousGeorge> hey all
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| 16:16 | <vagrantc> Lns: i think that would be a lot of noise.
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| 16:16 | Lns: if it were on a separate channel, maybe not so bad.
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| 16:16 | <Lns> vagrantc: only 8 posts today...
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| 16:17 | <vagrantc> but when there's an active thread, you might get hit with a lot.
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| 16:17 | <Lns> vagrantc: I guess so, I don't think it'd be that annoying, compared to the benefit of being able to troubleshoot something in almost realtime after someone posts if you wish to
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| 16:18 | <vagrantc> if it's really low traffic, i suppose.
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| 16:18 | i'd hope people actually post useful subjects
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| 16:19 | <Lns> well, I think most of the posts are pretty useful already
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| 16:19 | (besides me always ranting of course)
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| 16:19 | <vagrantc> i meant subject headers
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| 16:20 | <Lns> vagrantc: ah
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| 16:20 | <vagrantc> i.e. if the topic changes but ed
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| 16:20 | gah
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| 16:20 | <Lns> That's kind of a list issue anyway..
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| 16:21 | <vagrantc> yes, but to have it be posted in irc would just be annoying
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| 16:21 | <Lns> it can always be ignored, I just thought it would be beneficial to people to be able to monitor (and be exposed to) the list while here as well
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| 16:21 | <vagrantc> yeah, would especially help with folks like me who aren't on ltsp-discuss :)
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| 16:21 | fie_wr0k has quit IRC | |
| 16:21 | <Lns> eeeexactly ;)
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| 16:22 | hrm..you do put up a good point though
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| 16:23 | about a separate chan...would that be a good idea anyway, to separate dev from support?
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| 16:23 | <vagrantc> if it actually posted a URL to the posting/thread or some such, and had some mechanism to avoid flooding the channel...
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| 16:23 | <Lns> vagrantc: yeah that's what I meant, posting a URL
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| 16:23 | one-stop-ltsp-shop ;)
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| 16:34 | <FuriousGeorge> im having a minor client side hardware emergency
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| 16:34 | my thin clients dont have ps2 ports, and few barcode scanners work with l;inux
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| 16:35 | so i did what i thought was a wise failsafe: i got a ps/2 bardcode scanner, and a usb->ps2 adapter
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| 16:35 | funny thing is, it works with keyboards, but not barcode scanners
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| 16:36 | ive tried it with kubuntu linux and gentoo as the ltsp server, no difference
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| 16:36 | curiously, it works fine on the local side, both keyboard and mouse
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| 16:37 | <FuriousGeorge> similarly, usb keyboards work fine on the client side...
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| 16:37 | err, works on local side: keyboard and barcode scanner
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| 16:38 | so i thought I would stop and ask here on the way to the mailling list
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| 16:38 | does anyone have any thoughts in that?
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| 16:38 | * Lns always thought most barcode scanners acted exactly like keyboards | |
| 16:39 | <FuriousGeorge> Lns: actually
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| 16:39 | its something between lstps and the usb->ps2 adapter
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| 16:39 | did i mention that keyboards dont work on the client side either
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| 16:40 | wait a second, yes they do
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| 16:40 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: an adapter shouldn't require anything software-side at all..hence being a self-enclosed device
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| 16:40 | <FuriousGeorge> shoot, it started working
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| 16:40 | on gentoo
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| 16:40 | but didnt work on *buntu, on the client side
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| 16:41 | there is something wierd with this ps/2 adapter and kubuntu
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| 16:41 | im sure *buntu in general
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| 16:41 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: it's all Linux underneath... ;)
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| 16:42 | <FuriousGeorge> sure but there are fundamental differences, for instance, in gentoo, i plugged it in, had the module built into kernel, and it just works, client side and server side
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| 16:42 | in *buntu the usb_hid modle is external, and didnt work until i rebooted
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| 16:42 | probably something to do with how kubuntu is using hotplug
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| 16:42 | sure these are just 'default' differences
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| 16:42 | even though in *buntu discourages custom kernels
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| 16:43 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: i'm really not sure :(
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| 16:43 | <FuriousGeorge> im just making conversation at this point tbh
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| 16:43 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: why would you say that?
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| 16:43 | (discourages custom kernels)
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| 16:43 | <FuriousGeorge> i heard somewhere if you build a custom kernel its not supported
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| 16:43 | whatever ;supported' means
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| 16:44 | <FuriousGeorge> probably if you have a kernel related problem, and you go to the mailing lists with your custom kernel, they may tell you you are 'up the creek'
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| 16:44 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: supported as in by Canonical probably
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| 16:45 | <FuriousGeorge> i could be wrong
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| 16:45 | <Lns> well yeah, for good reason
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| 16:45 | <FuriousGeorge> Lns: im not insulting
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| 16:45 | <Lns> but it's not like you're 'not allowed' to build a custom kernel in ubuntu ;)
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| 16:45 | <FuriousGeorge> or disagreeing
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| 16:45 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: i know
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| 16:50 | <FuriousGeorge> ok, well, im'm going to have to go to the mailing list with this... tbh, the fact that it works on gentoo is a huge releif
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| 16:50 | Lns: cuz as you say 'its all linux underneath'
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| 16:51 | i be ti just need a custom kernel ;)
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| 16:51 | *i bet i
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| 16:53 | <Lns> FuriousGeorge: I wouldn't go through the trouble - if it's a module you're missing (I can't see which one, but of course i'm no kernel expert) I'm sure it's available to modprobe
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| 16:54 | <FuriousGeorge> Lns: im not missing a module, im just thinking inductively
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| 16:54 | on gentoo the module is built in, and it works, on kubuntu its external and doesnt
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| 16:56 | <FuriousGeorge> but i could be wrong
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| 16:56 | i also see that in getnoo it only works when i use a non usb keyboard
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| 16:56 | in the built in pigtail
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| 16:57 | iow, the barcode scanner has a female ps2 din where you are supposed to put your existing ps2 kb
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| 17:07 | <johnny> try just setting CONFIGURE_X=F
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| 17:09 | <vagrantc> stgraber: since you were just added to the committers ... please be careful when using push/pull ... it can rewrite revision history.
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| 17:09 | adding "append_revisions_only = True" to ~/.bazaar/bazaar.conf should help avoid that danger.
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| 17:11 | <stgraber> vagrantc: yeah, I have quite a lot of other bzr branches and had that kind of issue in the past :)
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| 17:12 | <vagrantc> stgraber: i like to bring it up whenever someone new comes on... since it's very unexpected behavior.
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| 17:14 | <johnny> why is there there?
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| 17:14 | why isn't that the default rather*
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| 17:17 | <vagrantc> johnny: apparently it's considered a feature rather than a bug
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| 17:18 | johnny: i've filed bug reports about it, but the response has been that that's expected behavior.
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| 17:18 | it's probably my biggest dislike of bzr.
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| 17:22 | <Lns> Hey, shouldn't there be a running nbdswapd process if you have it enabled?
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| 17:23 | provided a TC is turned on obviously
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| 17:24 | <warren> ogra: I'm driving to Maine
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| 17:24 | ogra: from Boston
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| 17:41 | <Lns> Holy crap, all this time i thought i was using nbd_swap but i don't think i ever updated my chroot to reflect the bugfix re: port number ...ugh!
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| 17:46 | hey ogra, can you tell me real quick if https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/235772 fix *only* requires the ltsp-client-setup script to change port # to 9572? I'd rather just update that then rebuild the chroot
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| 17:55 | "While it is easy to just upgrade your client chroot to the recent package set, it is recommended to rather recreate the chroot to take advantage of all new features (some of them are set up during chroot creation, so you won't see them with a plain package upgrade)." What kinds of things are we talking about?
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| 17:58 | ogra: you might want to take a look at this too, I'm not sure, but I just created a new chroot and the default NBD_SWAP port is still 9210....
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| 17:58 | s# grep NBD_PORT /opt/ltsptest/i386/etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup
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| 17:58 | NBD_PORT=${NBD_PORT:-"9210"}
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| 17:58 | <vagrantc> Lns: set NBD_PORT to whatever you need in lts.conf
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| 17:58 | Lns: then you wouldn't need to update the chroot
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| 17:59 | <Lns> vagrantc: i know...but i mean the bug was never fixe
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| 17:59 | d
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| 17:59 | this is a huge deal for people that experience crashes
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| 17:59 | thinking their nbd_swap is working
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| 18:00 | maybe i did something wrong, but i don't think so..the weird thing is my *own* server has the correct 9572 port in the chroot script
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| 18:00 | but all of my clients (all 7 of them) reflect 9210
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| 18:00 | <vagrantc> sounds like the chroot is more recent than the image?
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| 18:00 | <Lns> vagrantc: no, my server works fine
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| 18:01 | but in re: to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/235772 - after building a brand new chroot from scratch, the script still reflects 9210
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| 18:01 | unless the packages were cached somewhere
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| 18:01 | but i would sure think it'd get updated none the less
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| 18:02 | <vagrantc> Lns: look in the package itself ...
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| 18:02 | <Lns> vagrantc: not sure how to do that :( not sure which package it is
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| 18:03 | <vagrantc> Lns: dpkg-deb -x ltsp-client-core_*.deb ~/ltsp-client-core
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| 18:03 | you'll need to grab the package, of course...
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| 18:04 | dpkg --root=/opt/ltsp/i386 -l ltsp-client-core
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| 18:04 | should show you which version you need to download ...
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| 18:04 | dget ltsp-client-core should download whatever version you have available on the server
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| 18:05 | <Lns> ok, thx
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| 18:06 | <vagrantc> dget is in the devscripts package
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| 18:09 | <Lns> vagrantc: ok i found the issue, i'm still at ubuntu6 not ubuntu7 (i presume that's the issue anyway)
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| 18:13 | ah, yes...ubuntu7 package has the fix...but now, why aren't my servers updating to that, they have -updates in sources.list
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| 18:16 | <vagrantc> Lns: does /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list* have it?
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| 18:16 | <Lns> vagrantc: no, but it's a brand new chroot dl'ed from scratch
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| 18:17 | and the server is updated
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| 18:17 | <vagrantc> Lns: well, apparently it doesn't add -updates in the chroot
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| 18:18 | <Lns> vagrantc: OIC - it updates during ltsp-build-client
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| 18:18 | rathre downloades update packages
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| 18:18 | blargh..fat fingers
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| 18:18 | <vagrantc> Lns: whatever ltsp-build-client uses to create the sources.list is where the chroot will pull it's packages from.
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| 18:19 | <Lns> vagrantc: right... so, the only 2 lines that i've ever seen by default in the chroot sources.list on ubuntu is:
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| 18:19 | deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy main restricted --AND-- deb http://security.ubuntu.com//ubuntu hardy main restricted
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| 18:20 | Maybe I'm thinking too radically but shouldn't we be pulling -updates by default for things like this?
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| 18:20 | <vagrantc> it should follow the conventions that a typical ubuntu install follow...
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| 18:21 | i.e. whatever normally gets in sources.list should probably be in sources.list
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| 18:21 | <Lns> hrm... ok
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| 18:21 | well i'll definitely be adding -updates to my own
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| 18:21 | <vagrantc> Lns: file a bug about it
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| 18:22 | <Lns> i will actually
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| 18:22 | it's a good idea IMHO
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| 18:23 | <Quiliro> I was successfull with ltsp in gNewSense
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| 18:23 | added new directory gNewSnse
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| 18:23 | and edited some of the scripts
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| 18:23 | and then sudo ltsp-build-client --accept-unsigned-packages
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| 18:24 | <Lns> holy crap, 58 new packages in a hardy chroot after adding hardy-updates only
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| 18:24 | <Quiliro> i have to try to use a workstation
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| 18:25 | we will have ltsp at 12800ft high at a native american community in Ecuador
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| 18:38 | <Lns> alright...just filed the bug. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/277331
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| 19:01 | <Lns> 'Night all
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| 19:14 | <jammcq> hey chuck
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| 19:42 | <cliebow> jammcq!!
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| 19:42 | wasnt paying attention
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| 19:42 | * cliebow freecell | |
| 19:52 | <Quiliro> i have made a new directory for gnewsense
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| 19:52 | <jammcq> cliebow: hey
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| 19:52 | <Quiliro> where can i upload it
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| 19:53 | the scripst have been modified
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| 19:53 | /usr/share/ltsp/plugins/ltsp-build-client/gNewSense
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| 19:58 | johnny
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| 19:58 | do u know where to publish?
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| 19:58 | upload
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| 19:59 | <Ryan52> Quiliro: if you want it included in upstream, it's probably best for you to branch the bzr repo, and push your own with the needed changes somewhere. then you can email the ltsp-developer list and ask somebody to pull from it...
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| 20:02 | <Quiliro> ryan52: i guess i don know how to do that.... :-(
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| 20:02 | <Ryan52> bzr branch lp:~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk
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| 20:02 | cd ltsp-trunk
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| 20:02 | # add your stuff
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| 20:02 | cliebow has quit IRC | |
| 20:03 | <Ryan52> bzr add path/to/stuff/I/just/added/here/
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| 20:03 | bzr commit -m "Add support for gNewSense"
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| 20:03 | then you have to go to launchpad and make an account and a repository, and "bzr push" to where launchpad tells you to.
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| 20:04 | there are probably much better instructions on launchpad...
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| 20:05 | <Quiliro> i really didnt understand...sorry :-(
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| 20:05 | <Ryan52> anyway, I doubt anybody would really mind if you just sent made a tarball and emailed that to the list.
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| 20:06 | <Quiliro> i can do that !
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| 20:07 | cliebow has joined #ltsp | |
| 20:11 | <Quiliro> ryan52: may i send it to your email and you upload it?
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| 20:12 | <Ryan52> no, I don't do that.
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| 20:13 | ltsp-developer AT lists DOT sourceforge DOT net
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| 20:13 | that's the email list.
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| 20:14 | <Quiliro> ok
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| 20:14 | thksd
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| 20:23 | <Quiliro> ryan53: i just sent the email
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| 20:40 | <Quiliro> ryan52: i just sent the email
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| 20:41 | <Ryan52> I haven't gotten the email from it yet...maybe an "admin" person has to approve it or something like that...
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| 20:59 | <Ryan52> sbalneav, ogra: can I commit that ldm-fix-input-field-location.patch?
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| 20:59 | * Ryan52 just remembered about that | |
| 20:59 | * Ryan52 fears committing without permission :P | |
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| 22:40 | <warren> Ryan52: that didn't already go in?
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| 22:40 | Ryan52: If you're certain it wont break anyone just go ahead.
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| 22:41 | Ryan52: we need people to trust their own judgment, if we've chosen to trust our judgment to let them have commit access.
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| 22:44 | * johnny trusts Ryan52 | |
| 22:44 | * johnny doesn't trust warren tho.. not whatsoever | |
| 22:44 | <johnny> lol
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| 22:45 | <Ryan52> heh
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| 22:45 | okay, I'll commit it then.
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| 22:45 | <warren> johnny: That is a good sign of your character and judgment. I wouldn't trust Warren either.
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| 22:46 | <johnny> hehe
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| 23:33 | <FuriousGeorge> hey all. my thin client is usb only, and i need to make a barcode scanner work under linux, soi have a ps/2->usb adapter... the keyboard half of this adapter only works on the server. and doesnt work on the client...
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| 23:33 | <FuriousGeorge> unless, i bring it home to my gentoo based ltsp server and client
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| 23:34 | there its plug and play, so what im trying to say is ive controlled for the distro, and the problem seems to correlate with that
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| 23:35 | here is another piece of evidence, for whatever its worth: in *buntu, while it works, the computer must be restarted
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| 23:35 | <johnny> huh?
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| 23:35 | <FuriousGeorge> and the main difference i can see is that in gentoo its built into kernel (usbhid), while in *buntu its an external module
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| 23:36 | <johnny> no.. that shouldn't be a problem
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| 23:36 | <FuriousGeorge> johnny: i have a laptop which i havent tested on yet, so far the behavior has followed every *buntu computer ive used
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| 23:36 | kubuntu 8.04.1 actuallty
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| 23:36 | <johnny> didn't you say it worked on the server?
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| 23:36 | <FuriousGeorge> yes, but only after a reboot
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| 23:37 | i have some *buntu computers laying around, i need to verify
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| 23:37 | <johnny> did you try my suggestion of setting CONFIGURE_X=F ?
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| 23:37 | maybe xorg will do a better job of figuring it out
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| 23:38 | your problem will probably be resolved in ubuntu ltsp for intrepid
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| 23:38 | since newer versions of xorg require hal now
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| 23:39 | <FuriousGeorge> johnny: when did you suggest configure_x=f?
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| 23:41 | <johnny> last time you were here?
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| 23:41 | a few hours ago?
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| 23:43 | <FuriousGeorge> oh, i went afc... unfortunately, the place is closed, so i cant try anything tll tomorrow
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| 23:44 | <FuriousGeorge> i just double verified, and i plugged the ps/2->usb adapter in to an already booted kubuntu and it didnt work on a desktop with intel chipset of some sort
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| 23:45 | let me try on my laptop, which has an older kubuntu on it
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| 23:50 | ok, more evidence: in *buntu, the adapter starts working, without a reboot, if i hit the capslock key
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| 23:50 | johnny: that directive you gave me was for lts.conf?
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| 23:50 | <johnny> yes
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