IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 11 January 2011 (all times are UTC)
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| 02:00 | <gnunux> bonjour
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| 02:01 | sorry ...
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| 02:01 | hi
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| 02:13 | <alkisg> ΚαλημÎρα from Greece too
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| 02:23 | <hahlo> alkisg: are you from greece?
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| 02:23 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 02:24 | <hahlo> ok we just wait here some comenius guests (students + teachers) from greece
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| 02:52 | seems that usb-creator doesn't work when I run it from fatclient, in the end always got some error file not found
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| 05:03 | <arvin_> Guys, just for shits and giggles, if you would give your best guess, how many LTSP clients would you be able to sustain on a minimal Ubuntu server (running stand alone LTSP with only essentials) and rdesktop + X as the only things running, on a generic 16GB RAM server?
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| 05:04 | <muppis> arvin_, how about CPU?
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| 05:05 | <arvin_> Wait, let me check some HP rackmounts.
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| 05:07 | <muppis> But if you calculate about 512 MB per user, then any of G6 series HP will be fine.
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| 05:07 | <arvin_> Holy crap
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| 05:07 | 512MB per user
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| 05:07 | That's way too much for a slim X + rdesktop.
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| 05:07 | I was counting max 128MB.
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| 05:08 | If even that.
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| 05:08 | <muppis> Then do the math.. If you enough power on client to run that X + rdesktop.
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| 05:08 | <arvin_> I read somewhere that a regular LTSP installation should consider 192MB as a reasonable load.
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| 05:08 | Well yeah I can do the math, but you guys have the experience.
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| 05:08 | That's what I'm after. :)
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| 05:09 | <muppis> 192 is safe good.
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| 05:09 | <arvin_> You know what would be an insanely useful utility?
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| 05:09 | A tool that would show different resouce loads per user.
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| 05:10 | Though I suppose that would be slightly complex.
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| 05:11 | The thing is, as long as the client is only running rdesktop, the load should be very consistent.
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| 05:11 | So just by knowing one client load, should give me a very good idea of the rest.
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| 05:12 | <muppis> I use Gnome system monitor. Give enough info.
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| 05:15 | <arvin_> Yeah but the server doesn't have GNOME installed. :)
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| 05:15 | Though I see your point.
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| 05:15 | I suppose I have only one real way of finding out. Stresstest.
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| 05:16 | <muppis> That's good also.
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| 05:16 | <arvin_> The thing is, 32MB plus minus will make a big difference in the end.
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| 05:17 | <muppis> You can start at 128, so you see quickly if that is too low.
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| 05:18 | <arvin_> Yea
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| 06:36 | <hahlo> what I should put ARCH= if fatclient machine is x86_64?
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| 06:47 | <muppis> hahlo, is that something special or just regular 64bit PC?
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| 06:49 | <hahlo> regular i5 machine
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| 06:49 | 64bit pc
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| 06:51 | <muppis> amd64
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| 06:53 | <hahlo> ah I should put AMD64 instead of i386
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| 06:53 | with big letters?
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| 06:53 | <muppis> Well, if you don't need use that same chroot in 32 bit machines.
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| 06:53 | Small is default.
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| 06:53 | <hahlo> no I try to build for 64bit client
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| 06:53 | ok
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| 06:58 | <gsouque> hi
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| 07:02 | <gsouque> i have a ltsp server running ubuntu 10.04. and sometimes some thin-client refuse to boot. The thin-client have the ubuntu boot logo but gdm never start.
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| 07:04 | <alkisg> gsouque: remove "quiet splash" from /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default and see what error message it produces
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| 07:04 | (when it fails to boot)
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| 07:07 | <gsouque> ok
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| 07:10 | it's fail after Starting LTSP client
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| 07:10 | <alkisg> Any error messages?
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| 07:11 | <gsouque> no
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| 07:11 | <alkisg> And sometimes it boots and sometimes it doesn't?
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| 07:11 | <gsouque> sometime it's work sometime not...
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| 07:11 | mybe a X org issue?
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| 07:12 | <alkisg> Wait 3 minutes to see if a message will come up about hanged processes
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| 07:12 | (while the client is still hanged)
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| 07:12 | I.e. don't reboot/poweroff the client
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| 07:13 | "sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't" usually means networking issues...
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| 07:17 | <gsouque> hum
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| 07:18 | <alkisg> Still no messages?
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| 07:19 | <gsouque> i still waiting
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| 07:19 | i have an other issue :when booting the thin client the message "missing parameter in configuration file" appear just before the boot of the client
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| 07:19 | <muppis> | |
| 07:20 | <elias_a> muppis: 69€?
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| 07:20 | <muppis> elias_a, sure.
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| 07:20 | <elias_a> Dirt cheap.
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| 07:20 | <alkisg> Oooh last year I bought 1 Tb with that money, good deal
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| 07:21 | gsouque: that's not an ltsp message, did you install anything extra in the chroot?
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| 07:21 | <muppis> | |
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| 07:21 | <elias_a> muppis: What brand?
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| 07:22 | <muppis> elias_a, Samsung
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| 07:23 | <elias_a> Should be a quality product.
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| 07:23 | <mgariepy> good morning everyone
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| 07:23 | <gsouque> i now have some errors
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| 07:24 | <elias_a> mgariepy: Good afternoon! :D
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| 07:24 | <gsouque> rsyslogd blocked for more than 120 seconds
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| 07:24 | sshd blocked for more than 120 seconds
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| 07:25 | etc...
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| 07:25 | <alkisg> gsouque: sshd?! Anyway, maybe it's yet another nbd-proxy problem, try this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/589034
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| 07:26 | <gsouque> i have a ssh server running on the thin client
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| 07:26 | <mgariepy> elias_a, i assure you it's morning ;P
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| 07:26 | <alkisg> Good morning mgariepy
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| 07:31 | <muppis> elias_a, already got Samsung's 2 X 1TB and 1 X 2TB
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| 07:46 | <robehend1> Mornin all
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| 07:48 | <elias_a> mgariepy: You must be walking upside down if it is morning :)
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| 07:49 | <mgariepy> elias_a, yeah almost, canada is upside down ;)
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| 07:53 | <robehend1> what can you expect, when milk comes in bags
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| 07:55 | <gsouque> alkisg:i have followed the solution from the launchpad bug report and it's seems to work !!! i have done 5 boots with no erros. Thanks you very much for your help!!
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| 07:56 | <robehend1> gsouque: ooo the nbd proxy fix?
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| 07:59 | <robehend1> say, for Fat Clients, do i just do the standard ltsp-build-client --fat-client?
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| 07:59 | finally got a machine that i think might work for it
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| 08:04 | <_UsUrPeR_> robehend1: if I recall, yeah
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| 08:04 | it's pretty easy
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| 08:05 | <robehend1> cool. i'm curious on how performance will be.
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| 08:05 | <_UsUrPeR_> been a while since I experimented with fat clients, but there wasn't much to change
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| 08:05 | there's a lot of weird foibles that are fixed by fatclienting
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| 08:05 | <robehend1> which is what i'm hoping for ;)
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| 08:05 | <_UsUrPeR_> especially issues between localapps and server apps
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| 08:06 | I.E. opening word spreadsheets from firefox/google email
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| 08:06 | <robehend1> ltsp-remoteapps fixed alot of my issues, but its still hit or miss
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| 08:06 | <_UsUrPeR_> things like that
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| 08:06 | yeah
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| 08:06 | <robehend1> plus i ended up running most of the common apps, like OpenOffice and Firefox, as localapps anyways
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| 08:06 | <_UsUrPeR_> ok, speaking of local vs server applications, I have a doozyt
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| 08:06 | err doozy
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| 08:06 | <elias_a> mgariepy: Thought so :)
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| 08:06 | <robehend1> kill it with fire?
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| 08:06 | <_UsUrPeR_> I am running eclipse as both a localapp and server application
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| 08:07 | as a localapp, it works fine
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| 08:07 | as a server application, the program fails to run, stating that "the workspace is in use or cannot be created"
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| 08:07 | the workspace is a directory created in the user's home dir
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| 08:07 | <robehend1> hmm
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| 08:08 | <_UsUrPeR_> inside of the directory, which is created upon running, it creates /home/<user>/workspace . inside there, it creates a .metadata dir, and inside the .metadata dir, it creates a .lock file
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| 08:08 | deleting the .lock file does nothing
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| 08:08 | <robehend1> thats weird.
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| 08:08 | only time i've had issues similiar to that was on Mac OSX
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| 08:09 | <_UsUrPeR_> disclosure: All user home directories are nfs shares, and I am running this on an LTSP cluster
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| 08:09 | though neither of those really should matter that much
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| 08:09 | <robehend1> one of these days, i'm going to sit down and play with LTSP cluster. i'm quite curious on it
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| 08:11 | <_UsUrPeR_> robehend1: it is a good thing
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| 08:11 | <robehend1> _UsUrPeR_: just as a thought, could you take a test users workspace folder and just give it 777? should show if its a permission issue
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| 08:12 | <_UsUrPeR_> robehend1: no dice
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| 08:12 | same problem
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| 08:12 | <robehend1> hmm. anything in logs? though i'm not sure which one i'd be for that
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| 08:12 | <_UsUrPeR_> neither am I
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| 08:13 | <robehend1> kill it with fire?
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| 08:13 | out of curiosity, why would you want to have it as both a server and localapp?
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| 08:25 | <robehend1> for fat-clients, is the system loading the OS into a ram-disk, or is it actually using local storage?
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| 08:28 | <hahlo> when tried to build client got an error: "W: Failure trying to run: chroot /opt/ltsp/amd64 mount -t proc proc /proc"
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| 08:29 | is it possible to build 32bit server to 64bit client?
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| 08:29 | <robehend1> yes
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| 08:29 | lts-build-client --arch i386
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| 08:30 | er, ltsp, not lts
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| 08:30 | <hahlo> otherway around my server is i386 and fat client will be amd64
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| 08:31 | <robehend1> hmm, interesting. Technically, it should work, since the 64bit code would only be run on the fat client..
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| 08:32 | <hahlo> I got that above error is it related to architechtures?
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| 08:32 | <robehend1> very well could be. I've never tried doing it the way your asking, though. Is there a reason you want 64bit fat clients?
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| 08:34 | <hahlo> I just thought to put stronger hardware on client side it is i5 with 6gb ram, I could use pae kernel in i386 too could I?
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| 08:35 | <robehend1> mhmm, and find increased stability
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| 08:37 | <robehend1> is there a way to install a fat client without it install, say, openoffice and such into the chroot?
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| 08:38 | <Gadi> hahlo: you cannot build a 64-bit client on a 32-bit system because the system cannot run the chroot's binaries
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| 08:38 | <hahlo> ah ok
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| 08:38 | <Gadi> hahlo: and we don't have much in the way of cross-compiling support
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| 08:38 | or "cross-building" in this case
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| 08:38 | :)
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| 08:39 | <hahlo> Gadi: but I could use pae-kernel in fatclient image could I?
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| 08:39 | <_UsUrPeR_> hmm. ok, his appears to a write issue to nfs from the client
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| 08:39 | <Gadi> sure - you can use whatever kernel you like
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| 08:39 | <hahlo> ok thanks
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| 08:39 | <_UsUrPeR_> I am able to write to the user's nfs-shared home directory from the console, but cannot write to the user's home dir with firefox, or openoffice
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| 08:40 | <Gadi> I forget the command line option to do so...
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| 08:40 | <_UsUrPeR_> stranger still, it creates the file name, but cannot put data in the file (i.e. it will create a file with the name, but it is 0 bytes)
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| 08:40 | <hahlo> now that my image build failed what I should do to clean up and start over?
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| 08:41 | <Gadi> sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp
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| 08:42 | <hahlo> ok
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| 08:46 | <Gadi> hahlo: quick-and-dirty: if you are running Ubuntu, edit: /usr/share/ltsp/plugins/ltsp-build-client/Ubuntu/020-kernel-selection
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| 08:47 | <hahlo> yes thanks
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| 08:47 | <Gadi> hahlo: change "generic" to "generic-pae"
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| 09:04 | <_UsUrPeR_> running a 10.10 ltsp server here
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| 09:04 | err 10.04
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| 09:04 | why does dhcp3-server not automatically start?
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| 09:05 | I see it in /var/log/messages - dhcpd writes leases to the files
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| 09:06 | then it's shut off, and I have to manually start dhcp3-server :/
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| 09:06 | <robehend1> well, thats just plain weird. i've always had the issue of it starting, cuz i forget to remove it ;)
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| 09:19 | <evil_root> lol agreed robehend1
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| 10:09 | <_UsUrPeR_> ok, so I figured out one problem, and am on to another
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| 10:09 | I was having problems writing to the directory, because the nfs server sharing out the users home dir was also mounting the directory :D
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| 10:10 | now that I have fixed that ussue, I am having problems logging in :/
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| 10:10 | I enter a username and password, and my client creates the user directory from skel, then sits there
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| 10:10 | no errors, no restarting X
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| 10:10 | nothing about passwords or the inability to write to the directory
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| 10:10 | it just... sits there :/
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| 10:33 | <evil_root> _UsUrPeR_ can you ssh to the ltsp app server using that username/pass
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| 10:52 | <alkisg> gsouque: if you want put a comment on the bug report saying that removing nbd-proxy solved your booting problems
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| 10:59 | <moobyFR> Hi
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| 11:00 | <evil_root> hi
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| 11:00 | <moobyFR> I want to use LTSP for providing both acces to several Linux server (X11) or RDP server (windows
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| 11:00 | Apart definint an entry for each VT, is another way to do that ?
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| 11:01 | <gsouque> alkisg: ok i will do this i also had to put the new version of nmb_ ltsp_nbd and regenerate the initrd file
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| 11:02 | <alkisg> gsouque: About ltsp_nbd and generating the initrd, unfortunately that's required on lucid, but what do you mean with "nmb_" ?
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| 11:03 | * alkisg hopes nbd-proxy can move into an ltsp-cluster* package... | |
| 11:05 | <gsouque> alkisg: sorry just a copy and past error ...
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| 11:05 | <alkisg> np
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| 11:06 | <robehend1> alkisg: say, when you have a chance, I've got a few questions on fat-clients
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| 11:06 | <alkisg> robehend1: shoot, it's beer time over here... :D
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| 11:06 | <gsouque> alkisg: is this required on 10.10 too?
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| 11:06 | <robehend1> alkisg: ha not fair, i havent even gotten lunch yet
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| 11:06 | <alkisg> gsouque: only the pxelinux.cfg/default part, putting nbd_proxy=false there
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| 11:06 | <gsouque> ok
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| 11:07 | <robehend1> alkisg: basically, I finally got some clients that I can make into fat-clients. I understand I build it just by using the --fat-client switch. But I can find little to no documentation on how they work. Do I need to have hard drives in the machines? Does it load the whole thing into a ramdisk? Will it use the /homes from the server, or do I need to setup an nfs export, so students get the same homes on fat and thin clients?
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| 11:07 | <alkisg> !fatclients
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| 11:07 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "fatclients" :: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
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| 11:08 | <alkisg> Did you read that?
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| 11:08 | <robehend1> yes
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| 11:08 | showed me how to use fat-clients, but i guess I'm wondering more of the thought behind em
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| 11:08 | <alkisg> OK then you'll need to put your questions + answers there :D
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| 11:08 | Hard drives => no
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| 11:09 | Whole thing in a ramdisk => no, as in thin clients it's just a networked disk, reading only the parts it needs each time
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| 11:09 | Use the /homes of the server => yes, by default with sshfs, but if you want you can also use nfs easily
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| 11:09 | <robehend1> any reason to?
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| 11:10 | <alkisg> Some apps don't work well (or at all) with sshfs
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| 11:10 | <robehend1> makes sense
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| 11:10 | <alkisg> googlechrome needs some weird workarounds, evolution, googleearth etc
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| 11:10 | It's a locks issue, sshfs doesn't support them
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| 11:11 | <robehend1> well that makes sense
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| 11:11 | <alkisg> students get the same homes on fat and thin clients => sure most labs here are mixed, they have e.g. 6 fat and 6 thin clients
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| 11:11 | <robehend1> nice. thats what i was hoping.
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| 11:12 | if i have say, localapp firefox on the thin clients, and then some fat clients, would their bookmarks be present in both?
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| 11:12 | <alkisg> Normal bookmarks? Or are you doing something weird with them?
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| 11:12 | <robehend1> normal bookmarks. Kids cant seem to remember a web address to save their life
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| 11:13 | <alkisg> All /home/username is accessible (a) directly on the server on thin clients (b) with sshfs for localapps or fat clients (c) with nfs if you specify NFS_HOME for fat clients
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| 11:13 | And since the bookmarks are under /home/username, they're there too
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| 11:13 | <robehend1> hmm nice
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| 11:13 | i wasnt sure were firefox stored them, to be honest
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| 11:15 | <alkisg> /home/username/.mozilla/firefox/profile.default/places.sqlite
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| 11:15 | You can even edit that with an sqlite3 script
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| 11:15 | <robehend1> alrighty, final question
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| 11:15 | er, maybe 2 final questions ha
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| 11:16 | the --fat-client tag installs all kinds of software, evolution, open office, etc. Is there a way to pick and choose, or am I just basically building a thin client with local-apps then
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| 11:17 | <alkisg> The easiest way would be to let it install what it wants, and remove stuff you don't want later, but if you want you can also "transform" a localapps chroot to a fat chroot with 3-4 commands inside it
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| 11:17 | <robehend1> oh, how do you do that
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| 11:17 | <alkisg> /usr/share/ltsp/plugins/ltsp-build-client/Ubuntu/030-fat-client
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| 11:18 | E.g. disable network manager and gdm
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| 11:18 | <robehend1> hmm
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| 11:18 | <alkisg> and touch $CHROOT/etc/ltsp_fatchroot
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| 11:19 | <robehend1> hmm, alright
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| 11:19 | since this is a new server, ill just do the standard fat-client install and get rid of the crap ;)
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| 11:19 | <alkisg> robehend1: what exactly do you want to remove? I didn't see anything that bothers me...
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| 11:20 | (other than adding a few MB on the chroot, which doesn't matter speed-wise)
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| 11:20 | <robehend1> wanting to remove transmission, gnome-terminal, empathy, the vnc and rdp client, gwibber
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| 11:20 | <alkisg> Ah, for policy reasons, ok
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| 11:20 | <robehend1> yep
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| 11:21 | while most of them are blocked at the firewall by port blocking, i figure its not nice to tease
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| 11:22 | * alkisg uses a club for that, it's more effective :P | |
| 11:22 | <robehend1> ha, if only
| |
| 11:22 | darn public school and there lack of corporal punishment
| |
| 11:22 | i should move to Texas.
| |
| 11:23 | <evil_root> um....
| |
| 11:24 | texas is capital punishment
| |
| 11:24 | <robehend1> i thought some k-12 still had the paddle there.
| |
| 11:24 | coulda swore i read an article
| |
| 11:24 | <evil_root> nope, its texas, they just electrocute people they dont like
| |
| 11:24 | <robehend1> ah
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| 11:24 | well, you know, that might work for a few students
| |
| 11:24 | <evil_root> indeed
| |
| 11:25 | but i will never go back to that dam state, scares the hell out of me
| |
| 11:25 | <robehend1> eh, i could see that, ya
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| 11:32 | alkisg: with fat-clients, if down the road i need to add a program, say pidgin, is it just like installing local-apps? e.g chroot /opt/ltsp/fatty apt-get install x ?
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| 11:32 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 11:32 | <robehend1> hmm, nice
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| 11:32 | <alkisg> robehend1: you don't need 2 chroots, you can use the same (fat) chroot for thin, localapps + fat clients
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| 11:33 | <robehend1> i did see how you can put that in the lts.conf setup
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| 11:33 | <alkisg> Easier to configure + maintain
| |
| 11:33 | <robehend1> i'm just building a seperate chroot for testing it out before deployment though
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| 11:33 | <alkisg> Clients can be fat or thin automatically based on their RAM
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| 11:33 | FAT_RAM_THRESHOLD, default = 300 if I remember well
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| 11:33 | <robehend1> how do you do localapps if you have thin and fat clients in the same chroot though
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| 11:34 | like, say, firefox
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| 11:34 | <alkisg> If it's a thin, it'll use any localapps you have
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| 11:34 | <robehend1> oh thats right, i have to define the localapps in the lts.conf
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| 11:34 | <alkisg> Nope
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| 11:34 | <robehend1> ok, then i'm confused
| |
| 11:34 | <alkisg> Erm, all available apps would be made local, so yes you'd need to define just a few of them, so that not all local apps are used
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| 11:34 | By default you don't need to define the localapps
| |
| 11:34 | <robehend1> ah ok
| |
| 11:35 | now it makes sense
| |
| 11:35 | i wouldnt want a thin-client with 256 ram trying to load gimp ;)
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| 11:35 | <alkisg> Right
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| 11:36 | <robehend1> also, with a fat-client, when you click on something in the firefox download window, i'm assuming it'll open up according to it's mime-type?
| |
| 11:36 | <alkisg> Fat clients behave exactly like standalone installations (except for any sshfs quirks)
| |
| 11:37 | So yup
| |
| 11:37 | <robehend1> hmm nice
| |
| 11:37 | i've had good luck so far with using remoteapps, but noticed a few quirks yet, sadly
| |
| 11:37 | namely, it'll work great when downloading the file right in firefox and using ltsp-open to open it, but if i went into the downloads window and attempted to open, wouldnt go
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| 11:39 | <alkisg> File a bug for that, I'm sure it's easily fixable
| |
| 11:39 | * alkisg doesn't use neither localapps nor remoteapps, just thin+fat clients | |
| 11:39 | <robehend1> sneaky snake
| |
| 11:40 | <alkisg> Although gnome-about-me should probably be ran as a remoteapp on fat clients...
| |
| 11:40 | ...to allow the users to change their passwords
| |
| 11:40 | <robehend1> can you tell certain programs to be remote apps in a fatclient?
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| 11:40 | <alkisg> afaik yes, like usual, but I've never tried it
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| 11:41 | <robehend1> hmm. i ask cuz of gimp, and letting it use the power of the server would be handy
| |
| 11:41 | <alkisg> Hmmm not sure there, I think gimp behaves better on 512 RAM than on a thin client
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| 11:42 | <robehend1> i'm more worried about rendering, as the kids are using these damn 14 megapixel cameras that produce jpg monstrosities of images..
| |
| 11:42 | and the teacher doesnt want them to scale it down..so their all working in 4400 by 5600 images..
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| 11:42 | <_UsUrPeR_> ok, got it figured out -- nfs v4 fixed all the problems we were having
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| 11:42 | <alkisg> Ouch
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| 11:43 | <robehend1> exactly
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| 11:43 | LedHed has joined #ltsp | |
| 11:44 | <alkisg> Well I suppose all it would take is a ltsp-remoteapps gimp "$@"
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| 11:46 | <LedHed> I have several LTSP clients, and their time drifts. Is there a way for them to get time from the LTSP server, or should I just install ntpd on the client image?
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| 11:47 | <alkisg> Install ntpd on the ltsp server and use TIMESERVER in lts.conf
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| 11:47 | <robehend1> alkisg: ha, i never thought of that
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| 11:53 | <LedHed> alkisg, thanks
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| 11:55 | Da-Geek has quit IRC | |
| 11:55 | <LedHed> alexqwesa, I already have TIMESERVER set in ltsp.conf and ntpd running on the server
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| 11:55 | but the clients dont sync time
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| 11:56 | <alkisg> LedHed: (it's alkisg, not alexqwesa) distro/version?
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| 11:56 | <LedHed> oops. Sorry. Damn auto complete
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| 11:56 | alkisg, Ubuntu
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| 11:56 | 10.04
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| 11:57 | <alkisg> !SCREEN_02
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| 11:57 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "SCREEN_02" :: to get a root shell on an Ubuntu thin client: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ClientTroubleshooting#Using%20a%20shell%20SCREEN
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| 11:57 | <alkisg> Get a root shell, and from there, try: ntpdate $TIMESERVER; hwclock --systohc --${HWCLOCK:-"utc"} --noadjfile
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| 11:58 | (put your server ip instead of $TIMESERVER)
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| 11:58 | <LedHed> TIMESERVER = 10.1.1.251
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| 11:59 | oh
| |
| 11:59 | on the client
| |
| 11:59 | sorry
| |
| 11:59 | <alkisg> Yup
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| 11:59 | To see if there are any error messages etc
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| 11:59 | <LedHed> echo $TIMESERVER returns a blank line
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| 12:00 | <alkisg> Yes, that's normal, just replace it with your server ip
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| 12:00 | But on a root shell, not on a gnome terminal, read the above link
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| 12:01 | Also, if your client time is "correct" but exactly 2 hours more or less than expected, it might be a utc issue, not a timeserver issue
| |
| 12:01 | Erm, some number of hours, not 2 hours
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| 12:02 | NixGeek has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:02 | <NixGeek> I installed LTSP on an xubuntu box, adn tried to boot another computer over the netork. It gets to the ubuntu screen with the loading dots, but then doesn't load (or it loads extremely slowly, I left it for an hour)
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| 12:03 | <LedHed> alkisg, ok, I did as you said, I suspect that synced the time with my time server, and updated the RTC in the bios.
| |
| 12:03 | but how do I get them to sync on a regular basis?
| |
| 12:03 | cron.hourly?
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| 12:03 | <alkisg> LedHed: that command is ran automatically on boot
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| 12:03 | <LedHed> alkisg, they never get rebooted
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| 12:03 | <alkisg> Ah
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| 12:04 | !lts.conf
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| 12:04 | <ltspbot> alkisg: "lts.conf" :: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
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| 12:04 | <alkisg> See the CRON* lts.conf variables there
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| 12:04 | <LedHed> thanks
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| 12:05 | <alkisg> NixGeek: remove "quiet splash" from /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default, reboot the client and watch for any error messages
| |
| 12:11 | <NixGeek> I'm getting "udhpc[331]: sending discover... (break) udhpc[331]: sending select for 192.168.1.5...
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| 12:11 | udhpc[331]: recieved DHCP NAK" over and over again
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| 12:11 | <alkisg> So your dhcp server is configured to send a NAK to this client
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| 12:12 | What are your dhcpd.conf settings?
| |
| 12:12 | (NAK = ignore the ip offer you just got, I'm the authority and the other dhcp server that send you that offer is a rogue one)
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| 12:13 | <NixGeek> http://dpaste.com/307160/
| |
| 12:13 | <alkisg> And do you have another dhcp server around?
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| 12:13 | <NixGeek> my router
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| 12:13 | <alkisg> That's not a correct setup
| |
| 12:14 | If you want to continue using your router as a dhcp server on the same subnet, can you at least configure it to provide a boot filename?
| |
| 12:14 | (and remove the dhcp3-server from the ltsp server)
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| 12:15 | <NixGeek> I don't know, but I doubt it. it's pretty, um, basic. Next upgrade for me is a new router that supports dd-wrt or tomato
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| 12:15 | <alkisg> Then this will come in handy for your setup: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
| |
| 12:16 | <NixGeek> thnak you!!
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| 12:28 | <robehend1> random question. anyone know of any good handbooks for Gimp? I have the official docs, but I'm looking for an "idiots guide" for my art teacher
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| 12:33 | <NixGeek> alkisg: I follwed the guide to the letter, and now It won't even show the ubuntu screen
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| 12:34 | <_UsUrPeR_> Can anybody tell me where the /etc/hosts file is written from in ltsp-cluster?
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| 12:34 | <alkisg> NixGeek: at what point does it stop? last lines?
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| 12:34 | <_UsUrPeR_> It's over-written on client boot
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| 12:35 | <NixGeek> alkisg: it can't even find the server
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| 12:36 | <alkisg> NixGeek: you mean that it doesn't load the kernel?
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| 12:37 | dr_data has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:37 | <NixGeek> I mean the serer is not being found byu the client...
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| 12:37 | kesou has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:38 | <alkisg> NixGeek: how are you booting the client? pxe? gpxe? etherboot?
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| 12:38 | <NixGeek> PXE
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| 12:38 | <alkisg> NixGeek: on the server check /var/log/daemon.log, do you see the offers that dnsmasq sends to the client there?
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| 12:39 | <Gadi> NixGeek: and the router is on the same switch as the client with a running dhcp server?
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| 12:40 | <NixGeek> I'm thinking about purging everything and restrting
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| 12:40 | <alkisg> NixGeek: for a dhcp problem? I don't think purging will solve anything..
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| 12:41 | <NixGeek> i messed up alot of things, I'm a bit new to thin clients, but I have like 4 or 5 old computers and I wanted to see if I could get them running as thin clients.
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| 12:41 | Pweg has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:42 | <NixGeek> wait a second, the last line of my daemon.log is dhutdown was requested
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| 12:43 | and I have the server and client connected to the router, directly, no switches
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| 12:44 | <alkisg> alkisg@alkis:~$ grep dnsmasq /var/log/daemon.log
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| 12:44 | Jan 11 20:19:28 alkis dnsmasq[1136]: using nameserver 10.160.31.1#53
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| 12:44 | etc etc, lines like that, which say that dnsmasq actually gets the client request
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| 12:46 | <NixGeek> http://dpaste.com/307234/
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| 12:46 | <alkisg> No client requests there
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| 12:47 | Can you pastebin your /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp.conf?
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| 12:48 | <NixGeek> http://dpaste.com/307239/ I'm sorry about all of this, it'll probably be some stupid thing on my end. I hope I'm not being to much trouble
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| 12:49 | <alkisg> NixGeek: and your server ip is?
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| 12:49 | <NixGeek> 192.168.1.8 static ip
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| 12:51 | <alkisg> DId you restart dnsmasq after putting that configuration file?
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| 12:51 | <NixGeek> I restarted the entire server
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| 12:52 | <alkisg> So you have a line like this in your daemon.log ? Jan 11 18:07:52 alkis dnsmasq-dhcp[1136]: DHCP, proxy on subnet 10.160.31.10
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| 12:52 | <NixGeek> no, and I just tried restarting it and I got this: dnsmasq: failed to create listening socket: Address already in use
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| 12:53 | <alkisg> Did you remove dhcp3-server?
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| 12:53 | As the wiki page says?
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| 12:54 | <NixGeek> yes, I just checked again also
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| 12:55 | <alkisg> sudo netstat -nap | grep :69
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| 12:55 | <NixGeek> udp 0 0 0.0.0.0:69 0.0.0.0:* 2374/in.tftpd
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| 12:58 | <alkisg> Ah sorry, I meant 67
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| 12:58 | sudo netstat -nap | grep :67
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| 12:58 | <NixGeek> nothing
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| 13:01 | <alkisg> sudo service dnsmasq restart
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| 13:01 | kesou has quit IRC | |
| 13:01 | <alkisg> Any errors there?
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| 13:01 | (the problem is your configuration, there's something wrong with it and dnsmasq doesn't start)
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| 13:02 | <NixGeek> dnsmasq: illegal repeated keyword at line 9 of /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp.conf.save
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| 13:02 | <alkisg> Remove that file, you can't have the same configuration twice
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| 13:02 | I assume your editor made a backup file there...
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| 13:03 | <NixGeek> that would probably be it
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| 13:03 | okay, let me try to boot
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| 13:06 | It getting to the ubuntu screen now, but when I look at the output (if you press the esc key, it lets you see the outout) I'm getting it's sending discover 3 times, and then getting no lease and failing
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| 13:07 | <alkisg> Read the wiki page again, the section about IPAPPEND 3
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| 13:09 | <robehend1> alkisg: wth fat clients, do I need to do all my likewise-open and pam mounts in the chroot, or will they still pull from the server as well. I'm still waiting for the image to finish, hence asking instead of trying
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| 13:09 | <alkisg> Authentication is done on the server as with thin clients, so afaik no.
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| 13:10 | What pam mounts?
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| 13:10 | <robehend1> alkisg: i have pam mounts setup to automatically mount samba shares according to active directory group membership
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| 13:10 | <alkisg> Under /home/username/somewhere?
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| 13:11 | <robehend1> but since it ties in with likewise, i'm thinking it should go
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| 13:11 | yep, under their home
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| 13:11 | <alkisg> Well, if localapps can see that, then fat clients will also see that dir locally
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| 13:11 | Not sure if NFS will, though
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| 13:12 | (sshfs should be ok)
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| 13:12 | <robehend1> i'm hoping i can get by with sshfs
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| 13:14 | <alkisg> But I wonder if it would be faster to mount those locally...
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| 13:14 | it would, but how much faster...
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| 13:16 | <robehend1> hmm
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| 13:16 | i may have to test it
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| 13:16 | how does the user interact with the local file system? are commands issued as root, or as the user
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| 13:22 | <alkisg> As the user
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| 13:22 | <robehend1> hmm. it should mount fine then, as long as likewise passes the auth token
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| 13:30 | <NixGeek> I followed that part of the wiki page before, and now I did it again, and It's still sending the discover 3 times and then failing. here is what "sudo ltsp-update-image --force"'s output was. http://dpaste.com/307342/
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| 13:33 | <alkisg> NixGeek: pastebin your /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
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| 13:34 | <NixGeek> http://dpaste.com/307356/
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| 13:35 | <alkisg> NixGeek: remove the autoconf=dhcp part
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| 13:36 | <NixGeek> okay, now try to boot the client?
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| 13:36 | <alkisg> udhcpc has some known problems, fixed in later versions, that should work around the problem
| |
| 13:36 | Yes
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| 13:39 | <hahlo> where is lts.conf in ubuntu 10.10?
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| 13:40 | <alkisg> /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
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| 13:40 | (unless you upgraded and your tftp setup is broken and you're using /srv)
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| 13:41 | <hahlo> thanks I thought I looked that place, is it possible that it doesn't exist?
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| 13:44 | <robehend1> yes, its possible. just create it
| |
| 13:47 | <hahlo> ok thanks
| |
| 13:58 | <dr_data> I have two machines that I want to run as fat clients, with identical installs. Unfortunately, one has nvidia graphics and the other fglrx (ati/amd). Do I have to have two entirely different images for these to use the appropriate binary blobs on each?
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| 14:03 | <Gadi> dr_data: do nvidia and fglrx conflict?
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| 14:03 | ie, can you not install them concurrently?
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| 14:04 | if all you need to do is select the correct driver (ie it doesnt autodetect), you can set XSERVER=nvidia in lts.conf for the appropriate machines
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| 14:05 | or you can have separate static xorg.conf files and do X_CONF=/path/to/file
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| 14:08 | <robehend1> i've had good luck with Nvidia drivers being detected now. pretty much everything but the ION 2, so far
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| 14:09 | komunista has joined #ltsp | |
| 14:10 | <_UsUrPeR_> hey all. I have ssh killing my proc on one of my ltsp servers. When running top, sshd is pushing ~25% of my processor.
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| 14:11 | <robehend1> try ldm_directx = true ?
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| 14:11 | <_UsUrPeR_> I have LDM_DIRECTX = true set
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| 14:11 | <Gadi> _UsUrPeR_: stop scp'ing porn
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| 14:11 | <_UsUrPeR_> fffffffffffffff
| |
| 14:11 | * _UsUrPeR_ shuts off the torrent | |
| 14:11 | <robehend1> Gadi: man gotsa do what a man gotsa do
| |
| 14:11 | <_UsUrPeR_> srsly dude, you work hard, you play her
| |
| 14:11 | d
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| 14:11 | err hard
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| 14:11 | <robehend1> i like your first way better
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| 14:12 | <_UsUrPeR_> heh
| |
| 14:12 | anyway, any hints?
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| 14:13 | <Gadi> _UsUrPeR_: trace the children of that process
| |
| 14:14 | may lead you to the real culprit
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| 14:14 | vagrantc has joined #ltsp | |
| 14:15 | <_UsUrPeR_> Gadi: hmm
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| 14:15 | ok
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| 14:21 | <robehend1> ls
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| 14:22 | <m4xx> lawl
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| 14:23 | <robehend1> dont mock my failure of dual monitors ;)
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| 14:25 | <m4xx> my new fav quote: <_UsUrPeR_> srsly dude, you work hard, you play her
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| 14:28 | <NixGeek> alkisg: If your still on the channel, thank you SO MUCH!
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| 14:28 | <muppis> How I get local hdd mounted in client?
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| 14:28 | <m4xx> rob, you can always get a usb to vga converter, or dvi splitter if that's what the output is on your mobo
| |
| 14:29 | <robehend1> m4xx: i will, one day. after i gain the idea to clean off my desk enough for 2 monitors..
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| 14:29 | so, 2012.
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| 14:29 | <vagrantc> muppis: LOCALDEV_DENY_INTERNAL_DISKS=false in lts.conf
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| 14:30 | <muppis> vagrantc, thanks. That's missing from manpages.
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| 14:30 | <vagrantc> local disks are disabled by default for some data integrity reasons (i.e. booting a laptop with suspendd to disk)
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| 14:30 | muppis: what version of ltsp-docs do you have installed?
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| 14:30 | <muppis> vagrantc, looking at website.
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| 14:31 | <robehend1> ok, weird. Just built a new chroot, made sure that it's export is in inetd.conf , added the right port to pxelinux.cfg/default, but i still get the "error: failed to connect to nbd server" message
| |
| 14:31 | <vagrantc> added to bzr:
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| 14:31 | 104 Vagrant Cascadian 2010-02-14
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| 14:31 | document LOCALDEV_DENY* lts.conf parameters.
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| 14:32 | muppis: which website?
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| 14:32 | <muppis> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/karmic/man5/lts.conf.5.html
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| 14:32 | First founded with Google.
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| 14:33 | <vagrantc> note "karmic"
| |
| 14:33 | look for one with a more current version
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| 14:33 | muppis: or just install ltsp-docs and use "man lts.conf"
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| 14:34 | then you *should* get a version appropriate to whatever you have installed
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| 14:35 | <muppis> I noted that afte i asked.. Thank you anyway, now I got little wierd looking Gnome, but local hdd mounted. :)
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| 14:41 | <muppis> Just for curiosity, I checked effect of LDM_DIRECTX. Incredible.
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| 14:41 | <robehend1> oh? how much better throughput?
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| 14:42 | <muppis> robehend1, yes.
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| 14:42 | <vagrantc> muppis: yes, dropping encryption will obviously have a huge impact
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| 14:42 | <muppis> Can play youtube -videos without any lag.
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| 14:42 | <robehend1> without local apps?
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| 14:43 | <m4xx> ok, who broke it?
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| 14:43 | <muppis> m4xx, I didn't do it.
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| 14:43 | robehend1, yes.
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| 14:43 | <robehend1> wow. i may have to try that, for my curiosity
| |
| 14:43 | <muppis> This client is C800 / 256 RAM. Server is C2D E6300 / 1 GB RAM.
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| 14:44 | <robehend1> c800..not familiar. Celeron?
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| 14:44 | <muppis> robehend1, old school one, at time of Pentium III. :)
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| 14:44 | <robehend1> ha oh wow
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| 14:46 | <_UsUrPeR_> woof
| |
| 14:46 | that's some old stuff right thur
| |
| 14:48 | * alkisg hides his amd k6 @300 Mhz/64 ram :P | |
| 14:49 | <robehend1> i had one of those laptops
| |
| 14:49 | <muppis> But hey, my previous home server was dual Pentium III with 1 GB RAM. Turn off no longer than 3 months ago. :)
| |
| 14:49 | <robehend1> i wont admit to my pore celeron with 256 megs ram thats my home server at the moment.
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| 14:49 | <m4xx> 300 or 333?
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| 14:50 | <robehend1> alkisg: quick way with a fat-client to make sure its *actually* a fat client?
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| 14:51 | <alkisg> robehend1: open a terminal... if it says @server, it's on your server, if it says @ltspxx, it's a fat client...
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| 14:51 | 300
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| 14:52 | * alkisg also has a debian squeeze ltsp server with 128 ram, 400 mhz :D | |
| 14:52 | <robehend1> wait wait wait, the server has that?
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| 14:52 | jeebus
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| 14:53 | <muppis> I had K6-2 at once..
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| 14:53 | <alkisg> Just for testing, sure, but clients can boot from it :)
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| 14:53 | <robehend1> i hope not many
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| 14:54 | <robehend1> is fat client performance supposed to be extremely slow? Cuz ya..i'm noticing it is..
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| 14:54 | <muppis> I think I might switch back my old homeserver to get C2D to better use..
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| 14:55 | <alkisg> robehend1: no, it's supposed to be exactly the same as a local installation with a disk as fast as your network speed
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| 14:55 | <robehend1> ah, that explains it. i'm on a 10 meg uplink here right now ;)
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| 14:56 | <alkisg> Caching will help if a client has enough ram
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| 14:56 | <robehend1> through a...*shudder* hub...
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| 14:56 | <alkisg> So opening Oo or firefox the second time should be much faster...
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| 14:56 | <robehend1> ya, noticed opening terminal was much better the second time
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| 15:03 | <dgroos> Hi hi
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| 15:04 | <robehend1> heloo
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| 15:04 | hey, another minnesotan!
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| 15:04 | <dgroos> ya hey!
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| 15:04 | <robehend1> celebration!
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| 15:04 | <dgroos> Indeed! Where you from?
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| 15:04 | <_UsUrPeR_> robehend1: about fat client performance: I didn't notice any differences when using it
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| 15:05 | <robehend1> up by fargo
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| 15:05 | _UsUrPeR_: I traced it down to my horrendous 10 mb/s link up back here in da cave
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| 15:05 | <_UsUrPeR_> lol oh
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| 15:05 | that will do it
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| 15:05 | <robehend1> so waiting for the kids to get out in 4 minutes, will go test on the actual network ha
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| 15:05 | <dgroos> Cool. I drive by there when bringing my daughter to the U of Manitoba... from Mpls.
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| 15:05 | <robehend1> nice to see another one in the state is looking at linux :D
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| 15:08 | <alkisg> robehend1: ah btw, re-enabling compression for fat chroots in /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf makes your "network disk" about 3 times faster
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| 15:08 | <robehend1> alkisg: any downside?
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| 15:08 | <alkisg> No
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| 15:09 | (ah maybe nbd-proxy has problems with it, disable it if you have it enabled)
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| 15:09 | <robehend1> already did ;)
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| 15:09 | nbd-proxy disable is part of my standard "makin a new chroot" list
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| 15:10 | <muppis> Ok, it's time for me to get some sleep. Doing something so nasty that you guys don't like it at all..
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| 15:10 | <robehend1> umm..enjoy?
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| 15:11 | <muppis> robehend1, I'll enjoy from sleeping, but not this where I had to put my hands on.. (Ok, I tell. Had to install XP.)
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| 15:11 | <alkisg> Boooo
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| 15:12 | <muppis> Doing it without CD drives in machine..
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| 15:12 | <alkisg> /kick muppis, and stay out
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| 15:12 | <muppis> alkisg, heh. Please, it is just for a week. And I always can boot machine to LTSP. :)
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| 15:13 | But now time for some sleep.
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| 15:13 | Good night and stay in, it's cold out there.
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| 15:17 | <robehend1> haha see ya
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| 15:17 | _UsUrPeR_: getting out of the cave and onto a network with sane speeds was all the difference
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| 15:18 | <_UsUrPeR_> that makes sense
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| 15:18 | <robehend1> only thing i have to fix now is the one custom image i used to make a menu..that i stored on the server, and now the menu isnt pulling the right icon
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| 15:28 | <dgroos> my room's invaded with students looking for help on projects... after school... I'll be back!
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| 15:38 | <robehend1> wow, students wanting help. not fair.
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| 15:45 | <robehend1> so, if i made a menu in say, Sabayon, and created a custom menu with a custom icon which i saved in /usr/share/icons/students/ on the server..any way I could bring that icon to a fat client so it works?
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| 15:56 | ooo, nvm, got it
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| 16:06 | <dgroos> robehend1: well, to tell the truth, about half of those here were here because they weren't doing their work in class :)
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| 16:06 | alkisg: thanks for your cool ideas on ways to do the computer-tables.
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| 16:06 | <alkisg> dgroos: did you decide to implement one of them?
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| 16:07 | <dgroos> Your idea about making a cluster of nodes, 1 per table, connected wirelessly, sounded the best (of course I don't know if it is possible).
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| 16:08 | I wonder, can you connect low-power computers into a cluster ltsp server via wireless?
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| 16:10 | Oh yea, and then the clients would be connected via ethernet cable to these nodes.
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| 16:11 | like, 1 node would have 2-3 fat clients connected to them.
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| 16:14 | <alkisg> Right, and you don't even need switches, 2-3 nics on those nodes would suffice
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| 16:20 | <dgroos> Right, so clever!
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| 16:21 | Then, with some kind of multi-seat software that works on LTSP fat clients, I could have 4 clients fit into 1 table with only 2 recycled computers and 1 node.
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| 16:21 | <alkisg> Erm, don't mix too much, you'll get an administrator's headache :D
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| 16:21 | <dgroos> More than I have? :)
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| 16:22 | Right.
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| 16:22 | So, alkisg, you know that you can create a cluster via wireless? Or is that a pretty sure?
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| 16:24 | <alkisg> I believe so, it's not booting over wireless, it's just communication after they boot... shouldn't matter if it's wired/wireless
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| 16:25 | <dgroos> Makes sense. Isn't stgraber "Mr. Cluster"?
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| 16:39 | <dgroos> stgraber: ping
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| 16:40 | <neil_d> I have a new ltsp setup! but the client logins are not reliable... the correct name and password sometimes get refused by the server... is there anything that can be done about this?
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| 16:47 | <dgroos> neil_d: I've never seen that problem in my 2+ years of using thin clients in my classroom. Though you can't believe how many times my students repeatedly mistype their username/password combo.
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| 16:47 | Have you seen any patterns?
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| 16:49 | <neil_d> dgroos: i am using ubuntu/lucid
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| 16:50 | <dgroos> That's what I'm using in my classes this year as well.
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| 16:50 | Last year Jaunty, the year before that Hardy. I really like Lucid--much more stable in several respects, esp. than hardy.
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