IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 8 February 2015 (all times are UTC)
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| 09:04 | <I-Punkt> Hi. Ubuntu 14.04 with ltsp-server-standalone and dnsmasq. i followed this way https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp -> The Server works good. Also the Thin-Clients can work with the Programms and in Network we see all shares. But if the clients open firefox, they cant use the internet. no DNS. The help on these webside dont work. can someone giv me a hint, a howto or something like this?
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| 09:09 | markit has joined IRC (markit!~marco@88-149-177-66.v4.ngi.it) | |
| 09:18 | alkisg has joined IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg) | |
| 09:21 | <alkisg> I-Punkt: what's the output of this? egrep -rv '^#|^$' /etc/dnsmasq.*
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| 09:22 | <I-Punkt> oh, no. i dont sit on this maschine at the Moment. i hoped i get a hint to think about.
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| 09:23 | <alkisg> Did you read the paragraph there about DNS?
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| 09:23 | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp#DNS_issues
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| 09:24 | <I-Punkt> i used the two workarounds. but nothing works.
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| 09:25 | <alkisg> I think you did something wrong while following those instructions, so you need to come here when you're working on that server, and troubleshoot it
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| 09:25 | For example your lts.conf might have the wrong syntax
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| 09:26 | <I-Punkt> ok, you give me hope. i come back with the running maschine. u think we can solved it?
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| 09:26 | <alkisg> I think so :)
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| 09:27 | <markit> lol
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| 09:27 | <I-Punkt> afk
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| 09:27 | * alkisg waves to markit | |
| 09:27 | <markit> alkisg: btw, ltsp6 will integrate ltsp-pnp or they will keep be 2 different stuff?
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| 09:27 | <alkisg> It's not 2 different things
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| 09:28 | There are many ways to configure an ltsp server, ltsp-pnp is just one method of the many
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| 09:28 | and it's integrated
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| 09:28 | <markit> in ltsp5 already?
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| 09:28 | <alkisg> E.g. you run `ltsp-config dnsmasq` to create the configuration file (while there's no ltsp-config isc-dhcp-server yet)
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| 09:28 | Yes, it's in ltsp5 since 2 years
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| 09:29 | <markit> I've always considered pnp be a "radical different way" of doing stuff, a sort of "hack"
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| 09:29 | <alkisg> I don't know why you thought that...
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| 09:29 | * markit is strange | |
| 09:29 | <alkisg> The dnsmasq parts might even become the defaults of ltsp in some future release
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| 09:30 | The "no chroot" part is just 1 command, so it won't matter if it ever becomes default or not
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| 09:30 | <markit> alkisg: has dnsmasq solved it's issues? I remember you suggested isc-dhcp
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| 09:30 | <alkisg> I.e. instead of `ltsp-build-client` one runs `ltsp-update-image -c /` immediately...
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| 09:31 | You don't remember well ;-/
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| 09:31 | dnsmasq has an issue as a dhcp server
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| 09:31 | <markit> yep
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| 09:31 | <alkisg> But we're not using it as a dhcp server
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| 09:31 | <markit> is what I use it for
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| 09:31 | <alkisg> It's fine as a proxydhcp server
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| 09:31 | <markit> (useD)
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| 09:31 | <Hyperbyte> ooh hi
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| 09:31 | <alkisg> Hey Jan
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| 09:31 | isc-dhcp doesn't even support proxydhcp server
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| 09:31 | So dnsmasq is a good default for ltsp
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| 09:31 | <markit> "The dnsmasq parts might even become the defaults of ltsp in some future release" <--- so only as proxydhcp ?
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| 09:32 | <alkisg> Yes, it's the least intrusive method
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| 09:32 | Btw, dnsmasq would work fine in the internal subnet, since it manages the leases there
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| 09:32 | So unless someone wants dnsmasq to handle a big network with a lot of unrelated static IPs etc, it's fine
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| 09:34 | <markit> alkisg: ehm, maybe I'm lost. I've a 2 interface server config, and I dropped dnsmasq as dhcp server (just for the client net) because, as far as I remember, was not reliable as isc, is it right or wrong?
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| 09:34 | <alkisg> Basically, wrong
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| 09:34 | <markit> :)
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| 09:38 | <alkisg> http://irclogs.ltsp.org/?d=2012-04-17 mentions the problem
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| 09:38 | <vmlintu> markit: if you have a lot of dhcp requests, dnsmasq ends up dropping some of them
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| 09:39 | <markit> vmlintu: define "a lot", I've at most 30 clients
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| 09:39 | <alkisg> vmlintu: with --no-ping, dnsmasq can handle any number of clients in the internal subnet without waits
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| 09:39 | The problem starts if you put unknown IPs in the dnsmasq managed network
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| 09:40 | <vmlintu> yes, the --no-ping helps, but it does have side effects
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| 09:40 | <alkisg> Like?
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| 09:40 | <vmlintu> markit: something like >10 clients booting exactly at the same if I remember correctly
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| 09:41 | alkisg: the unknown IP problem that you already mentioned
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| 09:41 | <alkisg> LTSP clients can't have unknown IPs though
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| 09:41 | OK of course we agree, that's why I mentioned about the internal subnet etc etc
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| 09:41 | It depends on the use, but proxydhcp + internal subnet support is good enough to have as a default
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| 09:42 | <markit> "unknown IPs"? what is the "ping" stuff?
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| 09:42 | <vmlintu> markit: before dhcp server hands out an ip, it should ping it to make sure that it is not used
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| 09:43 | <alkisg> The problem is that dnsmasq is not good enough to do that in parallel
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| 09:43 | <vmlintu> markit: two devices using the same ip doesn't really work, so that's a safeguard
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| 09:43 | <markit> mmm should be sysadmin responsability to have set a unused range for dhcp, no?
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| 09:43 | <alkisg> But if all you have in the internal network is just ltsp clients, then there's no problem at all if you use --no-ping
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| 09:43 | <markit> or isc-dhcp does it too?
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| 09:43 | I see
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| 09:44 | <alkisg> isc-dhcp pings in parallel, while dnsmasq pings, waits for a reply, and then handles the next client
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| 09:44 | So if you have 10 clients booting, and each one needs a 3 sec timeout for the ping, they'd need to wait 30 seconds for an IP, and they'd probably timeout
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| 09:44 | <markit> ah, funny, NEVER thought there was a "test ping" in dhcp protocol or standard behaviour
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| 09:44 | <alkisg> But with --no-ping they'd be served instantly
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| 09:45 | It says "should", not "must" in the protocol
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| 09:45 | It's not obligatory
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| 09:45 | <markit> even because M$crap antirivus firewall often drop ping requests
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| 09:45 | (that is a nightmare for troubleshooting networsk)
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| 09:46 | <alkisg> I don't think it's an actual igmp ping request, maybe it's something arp-like
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| 09:46 | "who has ip xxx", not "ping xxx"
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| 09:46 | <markit> ah, much better and effective
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| 09:46 | <alkisg> But it's been a long time since I read the protocol, I'm not sure
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| 09:46 | <markit> chatting with you is an enlightment experience
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| 09:47 | <vmlintu> This reminds me that I need to dig in to isc-dhcp again soon to get dynamic dns updates working a bit better..
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| 09:47 | <alkisg> vmlintu was very nice to bring this up in 2012, yup thanks again,
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| 09:47 | * alkisg wonders if we should put --no-ping as the default in ltsp-server-dnsmasq.conf... | |
| 09:47 | <alkisg> vmlintu: thoughts about that? ^ I know you're not using it, just asking your opinion...
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| 09:48 | <I-Punkt> ..stay tuned. the server is on the way to mee ;-)
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| 09:48 | <alkisg> The default ltsp-server-dnsmasq.conf generated by ltsp-config dnsmasq, puts dnsmasq in proxydhcp mode for external subnets (so no pings there), and in normal dhcp for the internal subnet,
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| 09:48 | i.e. 192.168.67.1
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| 09:48 | ...I think --no-ping would make sense there for the 192.168.67.1 subnet
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| 09:49 | markit: it looks I was wrong, man dnsmasq says IGMP request for ping
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| 09:50 | *ICMP
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| 09:50 | <markit> ah, so bad :(
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| 09:50 | (well, no problem for ltsp, just general consideration)
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| 09:51 | <alkisg> Related chat with me and dnsmasq's developer back in 2012: http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.network.dns.dnsmasq.general/5707
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| 09:51 | "Why is using --no-ping risky for LTSP? DHCP clients will still do address-in-use checks and dnsmasq handles DHCPDECLINE messages resulting from those checks happily."
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| 09:52 | "I've had reports of successfully netbooting hundreds of machines with --no-ping set."
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| 09:52 | <vmlintu> alkisg: hard to say.. in our environments the biggest problems came from printers that usually have really bad dhcp clients that usually never renew their leases
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| 09:53 | * alkisg wonders if ipxe and the pxe stacks send DHCP_DECLINE messages when they see that that address already exists | |
| 09:53 | <markit> "DHCP clients will still do address-in-use checks", never known about that... I always thought that having static or already in use IP inside a dhcp range was a sure source for duplicated ips
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| 09:53 | <vmlintu> alkisg: we usually place network printers in the same subnet as the clients and use dhcp for them with dynamic dns
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| 09:54 | <alkisg> vmlintu: did you try --no-ping and saw issues? or is it just speculation currently?
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| 09:54 | <markit> vmlintu: dynamic dns with GNU/Linux? I thought only very recent bind9 can do, developed due to samba4 needs
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| 09:56 | <alkisg> Well, time to go, bb guys
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| 09:56 | <markit> by alkigs
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| 10:00 | <vmlintu> alkisg: it was years ago, so I cannot remember all the details anymore.. we did test --no-ping and decided to switch isc-dhcp
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| 10:01 | markit: we are running our own scripts that read mac addresses and hostnames from ldap and update dhcp accordingly
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| 10:01 | markit: https://github.com/opinsys/puavo-ltsp/blob/master/bootserver/sbin/puavo-update-ddns
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| 10:21 | <I-Punkt> I am back. the server is here now. But the owner install a pure new ubuntu 14.04. Can we do the steps now to install a terminalserver wit one nic proxydhcp now?
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| 10:22 | i would do the steps from https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp now
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| 10:27 | oh no, now im alone :-)
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| 10:48 | <I-Punkt> Im on this point now i wrote about one hour ago. The thinclient has dns-problems. in firefox i try to open google.de and error page come. if i try 173.194.44.88 for example, the googlepage opens well. Can someone help me now?
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| 10:51 | <markit> I-Punkt: never installed ltsp-pnp, but if you can reach internet, seems the dhcp is giving you the wrong dns
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| 10:51 | opening a shell in the client, the content of /etc/resolv.conf is?
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| 10:52 | <I-Punkt> lets try. moment please
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| 10:52 | * markit remembers that 14.04 uses resolver, maybe is more complicated then | |
| 10:57 | <markit> I-Punkt: I've probably to leave soon...
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| 10:58 | <I-Punkt> ok, no problem. you can leave. i restarted the server but now i get a erro on client. tfpt open timeout. but i run 5 minutes before. noooo
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| 10:58 | it was running 5 minutes ago
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| 10:59 | i give up
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| 11:00 | <markit> strange, ok, bye see you later maybe but I'm not that good in troubleshooting, your hope is alkisg
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| 12:57 | <sayantan> s
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| 12:57 | hi
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| 12:57 | I'm Sayantan
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| 12:58 | I want to use HP t200 Zero client (SMSC Based) with LTSP. Can I do that?
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