IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 4 March 2020   (all times are UTC)

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03:18
<alkisg>
!install
03:18
<ltspbot>
install: To install LTSP: https://ltsp.org/docs/installation/
03:18
<alkisg>
map7: you may also just use the ppa, I've tested it from jessie to bullseye
03:18
And if you don't like custom sources, you may remove it after installation
03:19
Regarding ltsp5 and usb, it should work without lts.conf options
03:19
(on fat clients, that is)
03:28
foxhoundv: x2go has an option to select the session, so the users may select any available session, kubuntu etc
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05:29
<map7>
alkisg: Thanks. Got USB working had to add some permissions through polkit https://gist.github.com/map7/b5ca8988660dca5479b5b2247f040a30
05:29
works through thunar now no problem.
05:29
little different than thin clients as that was handled by ltspfs
05:32
<alkisg>
map7: I guess you're missing some packages and you had to do that
05:32
Fat clients are like disked machines, you shouldn't have to do such things
05:33
But chroots do miss packages that normal desktop installations have (and that's why I'm recommending VMs instead of chroots nowadays)
05:34
<map7>
alkisg: Cool. I'm going to give LTSP 20.1 a go under Debian Buster.
05:34
<alkisg>
map7: which desktop environment, btw?
05:35
<map7>
XFCE4
05:35
<alkisg>
Can you use chrootless, or is it not appropriate in your setup?
05:35
<map7>
I could give it a go
05:35
just 'ltsp image /'?
05:35
<alkisg>
You should be able to boot clients in less that an hour, including server installation then
05:35
Yup
05:35
Just follow ALL the installation steps
05:35
!install
05:35
<ltspbot>
install: To install LTSP: https://ltsp.org/docs/installation/
05:36
<alkisg>
As some things are different than ltsp5
05:36
<map7>
Cool, I'll give it a go, thanks.
05:36
<alkisg>
np
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15:35
<foxhoundv>
alkisg Hello and good day. I have a question to run by you just to know if it's possible. Would it be possible to run a windows image on Ubuntu LTSP?
15:39
<quinox>
you can run virtualbox on a booted image (I put in flash drives in my computers specifically for Docker and virtualbox), it's a very pleasant experience
15:39
you can also run a remote desktop client on Linux that will connect to a Windows machine somewhere else
15:40
(my experience is that rdp from a VM windows to another windows is super smooth, but RDP directly from Linux to a Windows machine is mediocre at best)
16:01
<foxhoundv>
quinox Thanks for the reply. I am currently running Ubuntu LTSP which houses Rasbian images for my RPi's though to run certain software, a Windows environment seems to be needed.
16:08
<||cw>
foxhoundv: windows doesn't natively support any remote disk methods for the "root", so it's not that simple
16:08
quinox: I use freerdp from lstp to windows VMs, if the hardware is core2 and the screen less than full HD it feels native
16:09
I don't think I have any with full hd though
16:09
mostly 1280x1024
16:10
/rfx +clipboard +fonts -wallpaper makes a big difference
16:10
+clipboard is proabbly not needed, that's from my local script
16:34
<alkisg>
!cheap-client | echo foxhoundv:
16:34
<ltspbot>
foxhoundv: cheap-client: https://www.gearbest.com/tv-box-c_11262/?attr=2081-1279
16:34
<foxhoundv>
||cw ok, thanks for the info. So it should work fine remoting into a VM Windows Environment correct?
16:34
<alkisg>
foxhoundv: in general, these are much faster than rpi4's, and some also have windowss
16:34
Remoting into windows is doable, but you need a windows server for multiple users, or a crack of a windows dll
16:35
For a single user it's easy
16:35
Another approach is to have PCs as clients, not raspberries, and have them run VMs of windows, on top of ltsp netbooted linux
16:36
E.g. I have schools that boot ltsp on diskless i3 PCs, and optionally run a windows VM (the same for all students) after login
16:37
Of course if you can make your software run under wine, that's the best option
16:38
<||cw>
foxhoundv: yeah, what I have is basically VDI with ltsp as the thin clients. I use ltps's mac address based client options to set what client remotes to what VM
16:40
<alkisg>
||cw: does that perform any better than just "running a VM on thin clients", i.e. plain xorg session and run vbox inside it?
16:40
I don't have a server good enough to run 12 instances of windows, so I never tried that
16:40
<||cw>
alkisg: on p3/p4 clients, yes, I haven't really pushed it to faster clients
16:40
<alkisg>
||cw: no I mean, you're using rdp over xorg, wouldn't plain xorg be faster?
16:41
In both cases, the VM runs on the server and the screen is transferred...
16:41
<||cw>
have you ever tried running a VM on a 2Ghz p4 with 512MB ram?
16:41
<alkisg>
Thin client
16:41
I.e. the VM would run on the server
16:41
Thin login
16:42
LTSP_FATCLIENT=False
16:42
You login, you're on the server
16:42
You just run the VM. No rdp involved.
16:42
<||cw>
oh, no, in that case I'd be runnign a VM in a VM, I'm all virtual here
16:42
my ltsp is a VM too
16:42
<alkisg>
Gotcha
16:43
<||cw>
the only non-hypervisor server i have runs backup, and it's already frequently loaded
16:43
<alkisg>
It's a big downside if the users can't run VMs inside their sessions though
16:43
It beats the benefits of a virtualized ltsp server
16:44
Anyways, no thin clients anymore, so the idea is moot now...
16:44
<||cw>
yeah, my thins aren't really thin, even back when I was using ltsp4, they are just rdp clients booted ltsp
16:45
the clients never open a session to the server
16:45
user session that is, they just run xfree locally
16:46
and xfree is the DE, there's nothing else.
16:46
<alkisg>
So if you set up an nfs server on windows, you won't even need a linux server :D
16:47
<||cw>
technically, yeah. I have linux VMs for many other reasons though
16:48
and i still need something to build the client on
16:49
<foxhoundv>
alkisg The only problem with running the software in Wine that I can see is that the software has a DB in a windows environment. I don't know how well it will work.
16:49
The software is called Switched on Schoolhouse
16:49
You create a Teacher account on a specific PC, then install the student version on different PC's
16:50
They connect to the DB built into the Teacher PC
16:50
Basically to save progress and grades
16:52
<alkisg>
https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=6067
16:52
Says "garbage", at least for their old 2009 version
16:54
<foxhoundv>
Yeah, I saw that yesterday which is why I was thinking if I could take the LTSP Client RPi's and remote into a Windows 7 environment I could get it to work fine
16:54
<alkisg>
What server did you say you have, and how many clients?
16:54
E.g. 24 GB RAM?
16:55
<foxhoundv>
I have 64GB RAM and I am running 2 RPi's right now
16:55
<alkisg>
Then sure, that'd work
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17:03
<foxhoundv>
alkisg I did have one other thought for a side project. Would it be a good idea to use Client RPi's to connect to an LTSP image of Ubuntu MATE for RPi's?
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17:04
<Teridon>
Frog
17:04
wrong window :(
17:13
<quinox>
as long as that's not your mail password :)
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17:25
<alkisg>
foxhoundv: sure, although it's best to focus on fat clients, not on thin clients
17:26
So, it would be best to have a simple server with 300€, and the clients also with 300€, able to run the OS diskless but as fat clients with their own CPU
17:26
Either linux or windows or whatever
17:27
If money is so much an issue, even those cheap-clients with 100 euros will do
17:29
E.g. try to watch youtube (a) on rpi4 = fine, or (b) over rdp = awful
17:30
Between 2010 and 2030, remote desktop isn't / won't be a good choice, after 2030 it will be again a good choice as we'll have CPUs capable of compressing multiple vp9 streams real time :)
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17:46
<foxhoundv>
There won't be any youtube watching over RDP. it will be a closed network with no outside access
17:50
<alkisg>
Just scrolling in calc or writer can require gigabytes of traffic too
17:50
!thin
17:50
<ltspbot>
I do not know about 'thin', but I do know about these similar topics: 'thin-client-deprecation'
17:50
<alkisg>
!thin-client-deprecation
17:50
<ltspbot>
thin-client-deprecation: The new LTSP doesn't support thin clients (remote Xorg), but it does support low-spec netbooted clients with remote desktop (xfreerdp, x2go etc). Read more in https://github.com/ltsp/community/issues/32
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23:31
<map7>
Everytime I add the following to my lts.conf file for LTSP5 and rebuild my fat-client fails with a kernel panic
23:32
FSTAB_1="192.168.200.4:/home/data /home/data nfs defaults,nolock 0 0