IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 6 March 2011   (all times are UTC)

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03:39
<markit>
hi, anyone has some idea about what could be the reason for a client to "froze" (not black screen, just mouse/keyboard not responding, but you can kill X with ctrl+alt+rsys+k)
03:39
(thin client with swap activated over NBD, kubuntu 10.10)
03:45
<alkisg>
Press alt+ctrl+f1 to switch to the console, leave it for 5 minutes and check for any messages
03:47
E.g. it could be a network issue, nbd-proxy etc
03:48
<markit>
alkisg: thanks, but these issues are so random...
03:49
<alkisg>
Right, when you see one
03:49
<markit>
it happens almost at every lesson, but in a range of multiple clients
03:49
<alkisg>
markit: have you disabled nbd-proxy?
03:49
It's on by default
03:49
<markit>
mmm I disabled time ago when there was an issue
03:49
<alkisg>
If you updated your kernels since then, it's been re-enabled
03:49
grep proxy /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
03:49
<markit>
then I probably never enabled again, but could be that in the upgrade process (from 10.04 to 10.10) was re-enabled again
03:50
<alkisg>
What does this return?
03:50
<markit>
I'm not at school at the moment
03:50
<alkisg>
Right, so it's possible that this is the problem
03:50
<markit>
so disable the proxy is a good idea? I thought was fixed
03:50
<alkisg>
It's been disabled by default in newer ltsp versions exactly because it was causing networking problems
03:50
No, it hasn't been fixed
03:51
<markit>
I see, thanks a lot
03:51
<alkisg>
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/589034
03:51
!nbd-proxy
03:51
<ltspbot>
alkisg: Error: "nbd-proxy" is not a valid command.
03:53
<markit>
so I have to disable every time I upgrade the kernel?
03:53
<alkisg>
!learn nbd-proxy as Ubuntu 10.04 and 10.10 use a wrapper called nbd-proxy, which is causing networking problems for some people. See https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/589034. It's been disabled by default in 11.04, see http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/revision/1803
03:53
<ltspbot>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
03:53
<alkisg>
markit: read the bug report
03:53
Hmm let me verify that I indeed put a method there
03:53
Yup, I did
03:53
<markit>
:)
03:54
<alkisg>
Comment #13, it was asked too frequently here so I put it there
03:54
<markit>
btw, I was a school last time when I faced the dbus problem during upgrade. Is still an issue for future upgrades? If so, could you give me the issue number? I was not ablet to take note
03:55
<alkisg>
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/552404
03:55
markit: I fixed it for Lucid, but someone needs to verify that the fix is working in Maverick
03:55
So if you want it fixed, test the fix from maverick-proposed, and comment on the bug report
03:56
(I won't be using maverick at all)
03:56
<markit>
I applied manually the fix, and worked fine
03:57
(added the || true or whatever in that line)
03:57
<alkisg>
That's not enough though
03:57
The ubuntu maintainers need verification that the version in maverick-proposed is working
03:57
If they get the verification, THEN they'll publish it in normal mavirick-updates, so that it's fixed for future upgrades
03:57
<markit>
I'm a debian guy that sometime installs kubuntu... what is maverick-proposed? a new repository?
03:57
<alkisg>
Otherwise maverick will stay broken
03:58
Yes, read the bug report, there's a link there on how to test
03:58
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/EnableProposed
03:58
<markit>
fabolous, I could test in my VM that is almost the same setup that I have at school
03:58
<alkisg>
Right
03:59
It should still display an error, but the installation/upgrade should succeed
03:59
<markit>
I'm really gratefull to your work for ltsp and your constant help
03:59
hope one day that you will need help in some aspect I master, lol
03:59
<alkisg>
np, someone helped me too when I got here, I hope you can help others as well
03:59
<markit>
are you interested in virtualization and Proxmox? :)
04:00
yes, that's the spirit, but in any case you are much higher than average
04:01
if every nation had an 2-3 alkisg that contribute to ltsp, schools would be much further in adopting GNU/Linux
04:01
<alkisg>
2-3 years ago there were only about 10 schools in greece using linux, now I think/hope they're more than 200
04:01
<markit>
that's stunning!
04:01
<alkisg>
And I hope they'll be many more in 2-3 years ahead
04:02
<markit>
yes, but if you go too far, M$ monopoly will try harder to stop you
04:02
maybe with some "incentive" $$$ to government
04:02
that's the depressing situation
04:02
but we can't stop because of this :)
04:02
<alkisg>
If they ever start giving free licenses for all their programs to teachers and schools, then I'll be willing to listen
04:02
Until then, I don't care what they do
04:03
<markit>
free of cost is not freedom
04:03
<alkisg>
For english lessons, they're giving free books and CDs to teachers
04:03
<markit>
they can give you free of charge, kill GNU/Linux and then in a short time squeeze you money again
04:03
<alkisg>
markit: as a developer, sure, I value free software
04:03
<markit>
or just wait until students are graduated so they will want to use M$crapware at work
04:03
etc.
04:04
and they are in position to control whatever you do
04:04
<alkisg>
As a teacher I don't mind much about closed source software, as long as the money for it doesn't come out of my pocket
04:04
<markit>
I've seen that in italy the "magic board" is controlled by software that is free, but not Free. You have to register to the site and get a code
04:04
<alkisg>
Don't worry I know the tactics they can use :)
04:04
<markit>
you depend on them totally... is a suicide for a nation
04:05
:)
04:05
alkisg: btw, as a teacher you shuld value freedom even more than as a developer, OMHO
04:06
I don't want my children become dumb "consumer"
04:06
<alkisg>
It's a big subject, it's difficult to express my opinion on it correctly with 2-3 sentences
04:06
<markit>
and IT knowledge be out of their possibility, because the source is secret
04:07
alkisg: yes, you are right, I'm sure you are in a correct position, so we can quit this conversation
04:07
:)
04:07
<alkisg>
But I assure you I value FLOSS a lot, both as a developer and as a teacher
04:07
Don't only think MS for closed source software
04:07
<markit>
is just that I'm facing this position at my school, and make teachers value freedom in IT is not easy, they look at you like you were a strange hippy
04:08
<alkisg>
We could e.g. be teaching some software about dentists
04:08
If the company can't make money out of the FOSS model, then I wouldn't want that company closed just to have some FOSS program
04:08
FOSS isn't for all companies
04:09
<markit>
probably not, but take the example of the "magic board" in Italy
04:09
they are based on closed source software, AFAIK
04:09
<alkisg>
I wouldn't buy a board that doesn't support linux
04:09
<markit>
probably our government has put a lot of money to have "free" licenses for all the schools
04:10
it does support linux, with a proprietary version of that program that runs (should run) on linux
04:10
but if italian government had took all this money
04:10
to pay local developers to produce a good software that is GPL
04:10
it would have spent money much wiser
04:11
the magic board producer could get money from the hardware
04:11
<alkisg>
I don't think those companies would object to making their software compatible with linux
04:11
They make money from hardware mainly
04:11
<markit>
in fact is compatible, but is not Free
04:11
you still depend upon their license
04:11
<alkisg>
So why would you care?
04:11
Do you care if the software in your mp3 player is open/closed?
04:12
<markit>
see above :) is not Free software, if is broken they will not fix fast (they value M$version more)
04:12
<alkisg>
There are some stuff that we just want it to work, without doing anything development related with them
04:12
<markit>
I do care if every software I use is not Free software
04:12
<alkisg>
Have 10 years guarantee
04:12
<markit>
I don't run non free software on my workstation
04:12
<alkisg>
What about your washing machine?
04:12
Etc etc
04:12
<markit>
my washing machine does not have all my value data
04:13
<alkisg>
And you store data in your boards?
04:13
<markit>
is not connected to internet
04:13
<alkisg>
Neither are the boards
04:13
We just want them to be able to interface with linux
04:13
<markit>
mmm misunderstanding here
04:13
<alkisg>
If the guarantee that for the next 10 years, I don't care if their software is open source or not
04:13
<markit>
I'm talking about the software that is run on the PC
04:13
that is used to create lessons etc
04:13
<alkisg>
There's a driver for the boards on the PC
04:14
Ah I don't know about that software
04:14
I was talking about the driver
04:14
<markit>
"Active Inspire 1.4"
04:14
<alkisg>
LibreOffice Impress, works for me :P
04:14
<markit>
I thought no special driver was needed
04:15
mmm I don't like proprietary drivers as well
04:15
tons of troubles if you upgrade the kernel
04:15
<alkisg>
For many boards, linux doesn't even see the hardware
04:15
<markit>
urgh :(
04:15
<alkisg>
That could be part of the guarantee
04:15
For the driver, I just care that it works, not the development model
04:16
If they get some algorithm to have better performance, i'd understand if they keep it closed source for some years until they make some profit
04:16
Like nvidia vs nouveau
04:17
If nvidia went open source, what's to prevent intel from getting their algorithms?
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04:50
<markit>
sorry, had to run to bring home my children, now dinner time :)
04:52
about nvidia, they are right, so I avoid purcase their hardware and buy amd instead, or Intel, or whatever vendog is a good FOSS citizen
04:53
so is their choice to not do business with FOSS, but the problem is foss people not caring about freedom and buying nvidia hardware
04:53
that's sad and suicide
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11:33
<Nubae>
join #edubuntu
11:33
oooops
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00:00--- Mon Mar 7 2011