IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 3 September 2007   (all times are UTC)

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00:20
<paza>
hi, is there anyway that i could force user's x-session to logout after certain time of idling ?
00:25
<ari_stress2>
interesting paza
00:25
but how do we define idle?
00:33
<paza>
no keyboard or mouse input
00:34
just like to make sure that terminals are not in "locked" mode if they are not in use, but they log out and bring new login screen
00:36
ari_stress2: if user is actually left irc or setiathome running, it's not an issue there's a screen application if you need to do that
00:39
<sbalneav>
paza: What happens if you've got an OpenOffice.org document open with 3 hours of unsaved work in it, and you walk away to answer the phone?
00:40
<paza>
not my problem if we put it like 2 hours of nothing
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00:41
<paza>
basicly I just want to prevent sessions running over night that we could safely turn off the terminals
00:41
<sbalneav>
Why not just kill sessions after hours with killall before shutting down the terminals?
00:42
<paza>
so there's no support on the server side but some custom script ?
00:43
<sbalneav>
No, by default, linux, like unix, doesn't care how long you stay logged in.
00:43
So if you'd like to implement an administrative decision like that, you'd need to write something up.
00:46
<paza>
I suppose it would be useful if you have several "shared" terminals like in school, that the terminals don't get locked up if users don't remember to log out and it becomes locked because of screensaver
00:47
<Q-FUNK>
sbalneav: about autodetection, try to see if purging xserver-xgl solves it. here, it solved a bunch.
00:47
<sbalneav>
Q-FUNK: ok, I'll try that tomorrow
00:47* Q-FUNK just woke up
00:49
<sbalneav>
paza: there's a command, xprintidle
00:50
one assumes you could start a background job on login, checking xprintidle periodically
00:50
once the number of idle ms's has passed you could issue a killall.
00:51
I think you'd have some angry users on your hands, but it wouldn't take that much to implement.
00:51
:)
00:51
<paza>
sbalneav: well, the policy is "no unattended terminals, PLEASE"
00:52
<sbalneav>
Well, your policy at your site, is, of course, yours to implement.
00:52
<paza>
sbalneav: it seems to be impossible for people to understand polite request not to do that, so it will be forced
00:53
it's stupid, rude and unpolite, but it seems that sometimes users don't understand any other means
00:53
<sbalneav>
Dude, no need to explain to me, it doesn't affect me :)
00:53
xprintidle is what you could use to implement that.
00:54
<paza>
so it seems
00:54
:D let the games begin !
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02:37
<ari_stress>
i'm back
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02:53
<LeD>
Hi everybody.
02:53
Has anybody run into problem where switching between different windows in client is slow.
02:53
?
02:54
The applications itselfs run smoothly.
02:56
<ari_stress>
i havent encountered it
02:56
has it just happened recently? or from the beginning?
02:58
<LeD>
From the begin.
02:58
<ari_stress>
mm
02:59
<LeD>
But before server crash which make us reinstall everything this did happend.
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03:01
<ari_stress>
does it happen on all the clients or few of them?
03:01
<LeD>
All of them.
03:02
<ari_stress>
is there any suspicious reading in 'top' ?
03:03
<LeD>
Top does not show significant processing.
03:04
<ari_stress>
or maybe it's the client that is not powerful enough?
03:04
specifically the graphic adapter
03:04
<LeD>
But they did work fine before server crash...
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03:06
<ari_stress>
oh
03:07
<LeD>
There might have been some options which I didn't but in the reinstalledserver, because I didn't make the first install.
03:07
<ari_stress>
i see
03:07
maybe you can contact the first person who installed it
03:09
<LeD>
yep
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03:35
<ari_stress>
wb ogra
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05:03
<cyberorg>
hi guys, nbd-client stays stuck at "Negotiation:" where do i look to get it working?
05:04
nbd-client serverip port /dev/nbd0 works from normal OS, but stays stuck trying to do the same in initrd
05:06
ogra, ? ^^
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06:10
<ogra>
cyberorg, thats ubuntu gutsy ?
06:10
<cyberorg>
ogra, nope, suse :)
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06:11
<ogra>
right ... which nbd-server version do you use tere ?
06:11
<cyberorg>
2.9.5
06:12
i can use it from another machine, but initrd just hangs at "Negoraition:"
06:13
<ogra>
hmm, the handling of inetd connections was fixed in 2.9.4, so that should be fine
06:13
<cyberorg>
both initrd and the server have same version
06:13
<ogra>
any traces in your logs ?
06:13
<cyberorg>
ogra, it is not started via inetd, it standalone mode
06:13
<ogra>
aha
06:13
well
06:13
try using the nbdrootd script from inetd then :)
06:14
its in the gutsy source in the server dir
06:14
<cyberorg>
from xinetd?
06:15
<ogra>
we dont use xinted, its not freely licensed
06:15
but yes, from inetd
06:15
have a look at server/ltsp-update-image ... specifically at the update-inetd stanza
06:15
<cyberorg>
hmm, we use xinetd, not sure how to adapt it for that
06:16
<ogra>
you need a config entry that starts nbdrootd for connections on port 2000
06:16
<cyberorg>
ok
06:16
/bin/nbd-server 0 $1 -r -C /dev/null - what is $1 here?
06:20
<ogra>
see -update-image
06:20
<cyberorg>
ok
06:26
!paste
06:26
<ltspbot>
cyberorg: Error: "paste" is not a valid command.
06:26
<cyberorg>
@paste
06:27
<makghosh>
!ltspinfo
06:27
<ltspbot>
makghosh: Error: "ltspinfo" is not a valid command.
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06:33
<cyberorg>
ogra, /usr/bin/nbd-server 2000 /srv/kiwi-ltsp -r seems to have worked, rebuilding initrd and testing
06:36
ogra, all the clients use the same nbd export?
06:38
<ogra>
you can use more than one by defining nbdroot or nbdport on the kernl commandline (given you use our initramfs scripts)
06:39
i.e. you can add nbdroot="<serverip>:<port>" to your pxelinux.cfg/default file for different arches or specifically adjusted images
06:40
(ltsp-update-image will care for that in later iterations, currently that part needs to be done manually)
06:40
<cyberorg>
ok
06:41
is there any limit of simultaneous connections to nbd?
06:41
<ogra>
no
06:41
well
06:41
your servers ram i guess :)
06:41
<cyberorg>
yeah, that is as usual :)
06:41
<ogra>
i think there is a limit of nbd devices on te client side
06:42
but that could be adjusted if you would need more than 15 :P
06:42
(for 14 swap connections and one root or whatever :) )
06:44
<cyberorg>
we anyway don't need more than 15 partitions ever, new libata thing
06:46
<ogra>
libata != nbd :)
06:46
nbd doesnt care for ata restrictions
06:47
<makghosh>
do we have ltsp 5 for fedora 7 specifically?...let apart that ubuntu i386 package
06:48
<cyberorg>
yeah, but it creates a virtual limit in out head that we shouldnt go beyond that
06:49
<ogra>
makghosh, nope, fedora hasnt inversted much work yet ... they have started onece but dropped it again and i dont know if they even made public what they had
06:49
(that was back in 2005)
06:50
makghosh, we'd appreciyte *any* contribution to the bzr tree to get fedors support in though ...
06:50
*fedora
06:51
<monteslu>
makghosh, take a look at the k12osn mailing list. Vagrantc has gotten started on fedora
06:51
<ogra>
monteslu, thats unlikely
06:51
<makghosh>
ogra: hmmm.....i would like to put ltsp 5 in fedora repository......
06:51
<monteslu>
ogra, did you see his post?
06:51
<ogra>
monteslu, vagrantc wouldnt touch rpm'S (he's the debian maintainer=
06:51
<monteslu>
I'll dig it up, on e sec
06:51
<makghosh>
monteslu: yep....i'm checking it out
06:51
<ogra>
monteslu, yes he pointed the list to his branch (which is wrong as well, he should have pointed them to the upstream branch instead)
06:52
<monteslu>
ogra, and that's more than anyone else has done with fedora
06:53
<ogra>
monteslu, well, i talked to warren togami about it :)
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06:53
<ogra>
monteslu, and fedora knows where our code is
06:53
be sure :)
06:53
its just that no *fedora dev* has done anything yet
06:53
<monteslu>
yeah, but redhat hasn't seen the light yet
06:54
<makghosh>
ogra: i need a source package for ltspinfo.....i checked out the ltsp-ltspinfod.tar.gz but it had only one binary file
06:54
<monteslu>
the edubuntu stuff is getting better and better, redhat would be crazy to just let ubuntu have all the fun
06:54
<ogra>
makghosh, wait fo sbalneav or jammcq to show up, no idea whare that old stuff is
06:54
monteslu, well, canonical invests a *lot* to get that going ...
06:55
<monteslu>
as should redhat
06:55
<ogra>
(starting off with pying me fultime to take care up to shipping all the devs to conferences for free etc)
06:55
indeed
06:55
<monteslu>
very cool
06:56
<ogra>
but redhat doesnt yet ...
06:56
<monteslu>
they talked a good game 3 or so years about thin clients
06:56
<ogra>
warren is aware of the need and tried to get fedora devs intested ... but that didnt work out either yet
06:56
so all we can do is wait until someone steps up
06:56
<monteslu>
i should find that old press releasse
06:57
<ogra>
like opensuse does currently
06:57
there is at least some community pressure thanks due to people like cyberorg
06:57
so it wont be ignored ...
06:58
i guess having some initiative even from non devs for fedora would draw some attention
06:58
<makghosh>
ogra: actually my local lug, dgplug is introducing LTSP 4.2 in one of its school projects......i was actually trying to use ltsp 5 if possible
06:58
<monteslu>
I've been trying to think of a way to post it on the dev list, but I think referencing the old press release might do it :)
06:58
<makghosh>
i Fedora 7 ofcourse
06:58
s/in
06:59
<monteslu>
makghosh, use edubuntu
06:59
<ogra>
makghosh, so get started on an implementation, make some devs aware of teh need :)
06:59
yeah, or use edubuntu
06:59
<monteslu>
I've been doing k12ltsp for years, but ltsp5 is the way to go
06:59
<makghosh>
monteslu: yeah....edubuntu is cool
07:00
<monteslu>
some frustrations at first, but it was just with things like sudo and gksudo and synaptic... all good now
07:00
<ogra>
yeah, its a bit strange in the beginning :)
07:01
<makghosh>
ogra: i actuallly have been using fedora for quite some time...so i introduced ltsp with fedora....also it has got lots of scope for development
07:01
:)
07:02
<monteslu>
makghosh, but you'll have trouble improving ltsp4.2, all the development is on ltsp5
07:02
notably local devices
07:02
<cyberorg>
ogra, not really a pressure, suse devs promptly oblige when we put in little requests about what we want
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07:03
<cyberorg>
the thing is we being non-developer types don't exactly know what we need
07:03
for example, last week i requested nbd root, and this week we have it in kiwi.
07:03
<ogra>
but you make constant noise
07:03
thats the most important thing here
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07:04
<makghosh>
monteslu: yeah....actually we had these localdev problems......but now they work fine...tested flash drives, cdrom, fdisks
07:04
<cyberorg>
we just need all the init scripts and udev/hal thing working now
07:05
<ogra>
hal isnt used anywhere yet
07:05
expect that for next release :)
07:05
<cyberorg>
there is not much in terms of code that we have put in, but here is what i work on http://cyberorg.kicks-ass.org/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=.git;a=summary
07:05* ogra wants to port the whole client to hal next round
07:05
<cyberorg>
just scripts to put everything together
07:05
<makghosh>
monteslu: lately i was actually working for a shutdown module in fl_teachertool: [http://arindamghosh.wordpress.com/2007/08/29/shutdown-module-in-fl_teachertool/]
07:06
<monteslu>
makghosh, that using ltspinfod ?
07:06
<makghosh>
monteslu: yep.....exactly
07:07
<monteslu>
there's some talk on the edubuntu list of putting the shutdown stuff back in ltsp5
07:07
<cyberorg>
makghosh, are you in india?
07:07
<ogra>
monteslu, ldm2 will offer such functionallity soon
07:08
<makghosh>
cyberorg: yeah...
07:08
<cyberorg>
makghosh, i am in Baroda :)
07:08
<monteslu>
here's the January 15th, 2005 redhat press release : http://www.cbronline.com/article_news.asp?guid=5F760468-7288-48C3-AB6B-592B99A41CBA
07:08
"stateless linux"
07:08
guess it was smoke an mirrors
07:08
<ogra>
monteslu, the ldminfod stuff isnt really convincing, i dont like to open additional ports on the client ... especially for such critical stuff like shutdown etc ... we'll rather make ldm monitor a user owned dir on the server
07:09
<makghosh>
cyberorg: wow...that's cool....i'm from durgapur,WB :)
07:09
<monteslu>
ogra, why not just execute stuff through ssh?
07:09
<cyberorg>
makghosh, might as well be in another country, completely on opposite end :)
07:09
<monteslu>
I would like to see more than jus shutdown
07:09
<ogra>
monteslu, well, thats another option, but needs fiddly key setup
07:10
<monteslu>
how about reading stuff in /dev and /proc ?
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07:10
<monteslu>
would help with printer setup too
07:10
<ogra>
parts of that will be possible through the hal implementation
07:10
<monteslu>
client meminfo would also be nice
07:11
<ogra>
we'll run a hal client in future setups that will export all device related stuff we can into the users session and make it possible to interact more with the HW
07:11
<monteslu>
ogra, then have that as addons to thin client manager ?
07:11
<ogra>
so such stuff will be taken care of, its just a matter of manpower and time
07:11
no
07:11
thin-client-manager is a session control tool
07:12
<makghosh>
cyberorg: he he :) i am active member of ilug-cal and ofcourse my local lug, dgplug
07:12
<ogra>
ltsp-manager might get that part
07:12
<monteslu>
haven't seen ltsp-manager
07:12
<ogra>
its not done yet
07:12
<cyberorg>
makghosh, http://groups.google.com/group/VGLUG this is the group i run, i have posted about ltsp there
07:13
<ogra>
monteslu, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/ that was a first mockup (quite old already)
07:13
the plan is to have all hardware and settings control for the cliets in there ...
07:13
while session control should stay in TCM
07:14
<makghosh>
cyberorg: seeing it
07:14
<monteslu>
ogra, how about a tab to write lts.conf entries?
07:14
<ogra>
monteslu, thats exactly what ltsp-manager does :)
07:14
in a gui way
07:15
<monteslu>
would rock
07:15
<ogra>
there weill be a tree with all currently running clients on the left
07:15
so you can do individual settings with it as well ...
07:15
<makghosh>
monteslu: cyberorg: actually we can always include shutdown, reboot as well as terminal info....i mean i can extend my GUI for this
07:17
<monteslu>
makghosh, I have my own version of the old tkinter teachertool that did that as well.
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07:17
<monteslu>
it also read hardware info in a little popup
07:17
but not as usefull now that I've got only two types of thinclients
07:18
used to have a ton of old p90s and what not
07:19
<makghosh>
monteslu: that's cool...but last night i talked with robert, developer of fl_teachertool....he said that using ltspinfo can be accesed by non-root users...which actually creates problem....non-root users can shutdown other terminals at their will which should not be allowed
07:20
<monteslu>
makghosh, it was definetly a problem. Good thing non of the kids ever noticed it was running :)
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07:21
<makghosh>
monteslu: he he :) if in a school environment if kids get to know about ltspinfo....what a tandem it will create ;)
07:22
monteslu: but in edubuntu as u pointed out ltspinfo works only from root user....
07:23
<monteslu>
i'm not sure if the ltspinfo daemon is even part of it on edubuntu
07:23
i think it was dropped completely and the functionality being implemented in a different form
07:24
<cyberorg>
ogra, i am trying to use a plain dir via nbdroot, it does not work, do we have to use squashfs image?
07:24
<ogra>
you have to use an image in any case for nbd
07:24
doesnt need to be squashfs though
07:25
but plain dirs wont work
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07:25
<ogra>
(you could use an iso or ext2fs image as well ...)
07:25
<makghosh>
monteslu: no if i install ltsp in it actually only then we can have ltspinfo....i think the change is that ltspinfo can be accessed by root user only
07:25
<cyberorg>
ogra, hmm, i was hoping to get plaindir working :(
07:25
<makghosh>
monteslu: i mean in edubuntu
07:25
<ogra>
cyberorg, then you need to use nfs
07:25
<cyberorg>
is that nbd limitation?
07:26
<ogra>
yes
07:26
nbd is exporting images or swapfiles as block devices
07:26
nfs is exporting dirs as filesystems
07:26
<burnerx>
hi
07:27
<ogra>
(well, thats not quite right, but you get what i mean, nbd operates on a way lower level)
07:27
<burnerx>
what should i beware of ... for making my first ltsp server ?
07:27
<monteslu>
makghosh, you could be right. I jus didn't see any ltspinfo stuff in edubuntu, so figured it was dropped all together
07:27
<ogra>
burnerx, depends on the distro you use
07:28
<burnerx>
well, i downloaded Edubuntu today
07:28
<ogra>
make sure to have a server with two network cards then ... it will set up everything automatically for you
07:28
<burnerx>
which is better K12LTSP or Edubuntu?
07:29
i tried to install Edubuntu in vmware... will that cause me a problem?
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07:29
<makghosh>
monteslu: hmmm...
07:29
<Guaraldo>
morning
07:29
<ogra>
burnerx, well, i heard there are probs with networking in vmware
07:30
so better use a real server if you can
07:30
<burnerx>
oh okay
07:30
i guess i will reformat tomorrow at work
07:30
also... the dhcp part
07:30
<monteslu>
vmware is great for testing the stuff, but you need horsepower on the server
07:30
<burnerx>
is there something i should becareful of ?
07:31
<ogra>
and if you are *really lazy* and have money, just buy it preinstalled ;) http://system76.com/product_info.php?cPath=29&products_id=62
07:31
<monteslu>
burnerx, k12ltsp is probably more polished, but all the cool new stuff is in edubuntu. I've switched to edubuntu this year after several on k12ltsp
07:32
<burnerx>
oh okay
07:32
thanks ogra, but i rather do this myself
07:33
<makghosh>
cyberorg: i am checking ltsp things in the VGLUG group....its very big so i'm taking time :)
07:33
<ogra>
burnerx, indeed :)
07:33* ogra just loves to point out that you *can* get it preinstalled :)
07:34
<burnerx>
i been reading about ltsp for awhile, i really want to get a simple setup going
07:34
a server with couple thin clients going
07:35
<cyberorg>
makghosh, big? :)
07:35
<ogra>
burnerx, then edubuntu is the best to try
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07:36
<burnerx>
thanks ogra
07:36
i'm coming back if i got problems
07:36
!!!
07:36
<ltspbot>
burnerx: Error: "!!" is not a valid command.
07:37
<burnerx>
ops!
07:37
btw, is there any tutorials out there ?
07:38
<makghosh>
cyberorg: ..actually scanning thru KWIKI-LTSP and other ltsp messages
07:39
<cyberorg>
ah, ok
07:40
<ogra>
burnerx, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuFAQ links some docs
07:41
<burnerx>
thanks a bunch
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08:08
<cyberorg>
ogra, got the nbdroot working, clients now boots of squashfs image :)
08:09
nice ldm2 login screen and can work off on the server :)
08:11
<ogra>
:)
08:11
cool
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08:25
<schreik>
Hi
08:25
Need help
08:26
I want to connect to ltsp from Terminal that have Ethernet card that does not support EtherBoot but has HDD
08:26
Is it possible to install kernel with ltsp client to this machine and connect to server?
08:26
Can you advice something on that?
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08:27
<Q-FUNK>
the card probably supports etherboot, but the bios doesn't provide support. in that case, you need a boot floppy
08:27
<sbalneav>
Morning all
08:27
<Q-FUNK>
hiya Scott!
08:27
<sbalneav>
hey hey
08:28
<ogra>
!s
08:28
<ltspbot>
ogra: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:28
<sbalneav>
!seen ogra
08:28
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: ogra was last seen in #ltsp 1 second ago: <ogra> !s
08:28
<ogra>
:P
08:28
<sbalneav>
lol
08:28
hey dude!
08:28
<ogra>
beating you :)
08:28
he<y hey
08:28
<sbalneav>
I guess it's not labour day there in Germany!
08:28* ogra pushes his recent changes
08:28
<ogra>
nope :)
08:28
i'm fighting with debconf (still)
08:28
<sbalneav>
I've done a ton of minor fixes, sync with my tree
08:29
<Q-FUNK>
they call it the teutonic slavery day
08:29
<ogra>
done already :)
08:29* Q-FUNK ducks
08:29
<sbalneav>
cool.
08:29
everything I did look ok to you?
08:29
<ogra>
but not packaged/uploaded yet
08:29
yes
08:29
<schreik>
I have 3COM 920-ST03 (40-0664-003) network card in Celeron 800 computer. Bios does not support network boot. Network card seems does not support that too.
08:29
<ogra>
i found some uglyness in ltsp-update-image just now
08:29
<schreik>
there is no such model in rom-a-matic.net
08:30
<ogra>
we'll need better handling for the PXE stuff ... and its surely no "Error:" if the port exists in inetd.conf :)
08:30
i made that an "Info:"
08:30
<Q-FUNK>
schreik: check which driver gets loaded when you boot the card using a normal Linux distro. it should tell you which rom-o-matic image to use
08:30
<sbalneav>
and, don't bother with ltspfs-nodm anymore. I merged into ltspfs-upstream
08:30
<ogra>
i can jump on that after the udeb works ...
08:30
<sbalneav>
ok
08:31
<ogra>
hope you didnt bump the upstream version then
08:31
we'd need an UVF exception if you did
08:31
<Nikopoika>
schreik: you can propably use some other nic's boot rom, i'm using a single bootrom-floppy with 2 different 3com cards and it works fin
08:31
<Q-FUNK>
sbalneav: I noticed this morning that most X problems on my laptop disappeared after I purged xserver-xgl. maybe it would help for -amd too?
08:31
<ogra>
lol
08:32
Q-FUNK, you used xgl ?
08:32* ogra wouldnt even hope for remote stability with that
08:32
<Q-FUNK>
ogra: it used to be pulled by -all, afaik
08:32
<ogra>
never
08:32
its universe
08:32
<sbalneav>
umm, well, the packaging's separate from the code, so I just took -nodm, which really was the upstream, and put it in the proper place.
08:32
<ogra>
ok
08:33
i'll see how t get it in without paperwork :)
08:33
but forst the udeb *sigh*
08:33
*first
08:33
d-i is a mean beast
08:33
<Q-FUNK>
purging xgl solved the gtk2 problem i had been experiencing since friday, but not the broken dpms and the impossibility to switch vcons
08:34
<sbalneav>
sbalneav@edubuntu:~$ sudo -i
08:34
[sudo] password for sbalneav:
08:34
root@edubuntu:~# chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/
08:34
root@edubuntu:/# dpkg -l | grep xgl
08:34
nada, not there.
08:34
<ogra>
sbalneav, there is a CC meeting going on bwt, pkern (gobby author) is going fr membership ... i'f he's up (not sure they get to him) it might make sense to help cheering ;)
08:35
<schreik>
So, is it possible to connect ltsp-server via installing boot image on HDD without etherboot?
08:35
<sbalneav>
is it going on now?
08:35
<ogra>
started 30min ago
08:35
<sbalneav>
ubuntu-meeting?
08:35
<ogra>
but i'm not sure they'll do membership
08:35
yep
08:36
<sbalneav>
in
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09:03
<sbalneav>
ogra: did you guys get to skip tribe 6?
09:03
<ogra>
sbalneav, yup :D
09:03
so i have at least chances to get the installer stuff ready
09:03
<sbalneav>
heh
09:04
I'm looking forward to fix-it-friday.
09:04
<ogra>
as you might have seen i call ltsp-update-image separately in d-i now ... with its own progress bar etc
09:04
oh, right, i havent merged that part yet, heh
09:04
sorry
09:05
<sbalneav>
nope, I've merged what you've done so far...
09:05subir has quit IRC
09:05
<ogra>
right
09:05
<sbalneav>
waiting for more ogra-y goodness.
09:05
<ogra>
i didnt merge any code of that to the tree yet :)
09:05
only the base in ltsp-build-client to suppress image building
09:07
i stepped back from direct piping to the progress and just read a logfile i write to now ... seems to work ...
09:07plamengr has left #ltsp
09:07
<ogra>
s/progress/progress bar/
09:08
<sbalneav>
I thought you'd end up with something like that.
09:08
<ogra>
well, its not proper, but there is no better solution apart from redoing ltsp-build-client completely
09:08plamengr has joined #ltsp
09:09
<sbalneav>
Hey, any old port in a storm, eh?
09:13
<ogra>
heh
09:13
indeed
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09:23
<ogra>
hrm ...
09:36
<sbalneav>
So, think we can bribe pkern with our cheers if he adds a vi mode to gobby?
09:36
<ogra>
sure
09:36
especially if you send a patch with it :P
09:37
<sbalneav>
:P Sure, I'll stop working on edubuntu and get right on that :)
09:38
<ogra>
i wonder if i should install sobby as a default dep of edubuntu-server
09:38
(sobby is the standalone server )
09:38
<sbalneav>
Would help to increase the spread of gobby
09:39
Gobby's included in the addon cd, yes?
09:39
<ogra>
well, we'll have gobb yinstalled by edubuntu-desktop anyway
09:39
no, in the default install
09:39
but i didnt plan for the server yet (in ltsp setups you will connect to localhost anyway)
09:40
(doesnt need a server)
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10:24
<GiantPickle>
Howdy folks. Long time no type (for me that is)... I'm wondering if I can long into a session on my ltsp server from my laptop that is not set up as a thin client... ie... I run my laptop as a standalone system and I'd like to connect to a session on my ltsp server, is this possible and if so, what terms to I search for/read up on?
10:25
<sbalneav>
GiantPickle: What version of ltsp?
10:25
<GiantPickle>
methinks 4.2, but I'll have to check
10:26
yeah... 4.2
10:26
<sbalneav>
just start up another X session on a free tty, with -query <ipofltspserver>
10:26
<GiantPickle>
ah... very fun... lemmie give that a try...
10:30
sbalneav: thanks... I'm doing something wrong, but at least I know what to look for.
10:32
<sbalneav>
ogra:I have to go upstairs and start in on breakfast, add my cheers for pkern if they get to him
10:32
I'll check back in a bit
10:33
<ogra>
oki
10:33
might still take a while
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11:21* tux_440volt will be back soon: Gone away for now.
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11:35
<sbalneav>
just came back and saw pkern was up, and jumped in.
11:35
<ogra>
perfect :)
11:35
if he goes for MOTU/main he can care for gobby himself :)
11:36burnerx has quit IRC
11:36
<sbalneav>
i think you and I are really the only ones who consistently use gobby at the uds's
11:36
<ogra>
nah
11:36
others do as well and i know makr does
11:36
*mark
11:36
<sbalneav>
ah, ok
11:37
last time, 50% of all the documents on the gobby server were ours :)
11:37
<ogra>
meh, my hack for the udeb doesnt wor with ltsp-build-client :(((((((((
11:37
<sbalneav>
oh, suck.
11:37
<ogra>
yeah
11:37
debconf doesnt like me
11:37
its all so evil :/
11:45
oh, meh ...
11:45
i was missing a plugin
11:45* ogra links the debconf-frontend plugin
11:46
<ogra>
lets see if that fixes it
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11:49
<sn9_>
ogra: "* fix sync range handling in x config script" <-- no, it's broken!
11:49Clown-MG has joined #ltsp
11:49
<ogra>
sn9_, ?
11:50
<sn9_>
you put a = where a tab should be
11:50
<sbalneav>
sn9_: line #?
11:50
<sn9_>
hang on, i don't have line numbers turned on in less
11:50
<ogra>
hrm
11:50
i had fixed that already
11:51
<sbalneav>
or paste a bit
11:51
<ogra>
but you are right, must have come in with a merge i didnt notice :/
11:51* ogra curses loudly ... debconf still fails with fd errors
11:52
<ogra>
i guess there is no way around a rewrite of ltsp-build-client :(
11:52Q-FUNK has quit IRC
11:52
<sbalneav>
ogra: Do we need this for gutsy, or can we leave it for Hairy?
11:53
<sn9_>
the vsync is needed for gutsy
11:54
<ogra>
i need it to fix the d-i bug i have to have done on thursday, yes
11:54Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC
11:54
<sbalneav>
sn9_: still haven't seen a line numner or line paste
11:54
<sn9_>
ok, paste it is:
11:54
<ogra>
sbalneav, its a bug i already had fixed ...
11:54
<sn9_>
sed -i -e '/Section "Monitor"/,3aVertRefresh='$X_VERTREFRESH'\nHorizSync\t'$X_HORZSYNC'' $INPUT_FILE
11:54
<ogra>
there is a = in a line from Gadis patch that shouldnt be there
11:57
<sbalneav>
changed in mine
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12:00* ogra gives up on debconf for today ... seems i got no luck
12:00
<ogra>
11h poking in the dark ... no outcome ... what a day ...
12:00* ogra goes for beer
12:00
<sbalneav>
I've pushed that fix
12:01
<ogra>
thanks
12:01
next upload still waits for the udeb to be fixed
12:01
<sn9_>
the vsync? thanx
12:03
sbalneav: you did put a \t, right? otherwise it'll end up being "VertRefresh75-85"
12:04
<sbalneav>
check my branch and see :)
12:04
<sn9_>
url?
12:04
<ogra>
ergh
12:04
<sbalneav>
https://code.launchpad.net/ltsp/
12:04
<sn9_>
tnx
12:04
<sbalneav>
scotts-gutsy is mine
12:06
<ogra>
merged and pushed
12:06
<sn9_>
good, thanx
12:07
wrt the \t
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13:18
<sn9_>
is there some reason why X_DEVICE_OPTION_xx was dropped in ltsp5?
13:33
and has anybody else noticed X respawning for no apparent reason every two and a half minutes or so?
13:34
<pablo-uy-mvd>
hi! im getting gdm_slave_xioerror_handler: Fatal X error -
13:34
Restarting
13:34
how could i fix this? what is the cause?
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13:38
<petre>
in the dhcpd.conf, should the default gateway (option router) be the ltsp server or the real network gateway out to the internet?
13:39
ltsp 4.2, btw
13:39
<sn9_>
if you want access to the real gateway, then that's what it should be
13:39
but there has to be a route to it already
13:40
<petre>
my problem is I've got a single-nic server; clients are okay, but fat clients can't connect to internet
13:40
they're being routed throught the ltsp server, and iptables is causing trouble I think
13:40highvoltage has quit IRC
13:40
<sn9_>
is the real gateway on the lan?
13:41
<petre>
yes
13:41
so setting it to the real gateway seems logical
13:41
this server's been up for a year or two though
13:42
but I think I had iptables off
13:42
now I've turned it back on (after a change for samba purposes)
13:43
but the fat clients now can't get to the internet
13:43
I could turn iptables back off but I'd rather not
13:43
so, I'm thinking that if I change the default gw setting in dhcpd.conf, those clients will not try to go through the ltsp server
13:44
<sn9_>
if iptables is running on the single-nic server, clients' ability to connect to the gateway should not be affected
13:44
<petre>
clients=thin clients?
13:44
<sn9_>
if the option points to the gateway, that is
13:44
yes
13:44
fat clients, too
13:45
<petre>
ok, I'll try changing it
13:45
tx
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14:31
<sbalneav>
sn9_: The X respawning, is that while you're logged in?
14:32
<sn9_>
while ctrl-alt-F2'ing to a shell
14:33
<sbalneav>
So, you're logged in, control alt f2 to a shell, and 2.5 minutes later, you're logged out on the graphical session?
14:35
<sn9_>
i haven't ruled much out yet; still trying various things to rule stuff out
14:36
<sbalneav>
Well, to answer your question, no, I haven't observered that behaviour
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15:52
<bartolomeo80>
hello
15:53
please help me with a problem setting up cups
15:58
i have configure a printer in a thin client but i can only print once
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16:00
<bartolomeo80>
i already setup lts.conf adding the mac address of the thin client having the printer
16:01
then i setup cups adding a new printer and i print a test page
16:02
but after that, no more print jobs are executed
16:08
hello
16:08
please help me
16:08
16:10
in the error_log each action appears as unauthorized
16:10
fernando do you speak spanish, help me please
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16:51
<gonzaloaf_work>
hi, which are the closed or pay solutions that do the same job that ltsp?
16:52ltsp-sid has joined #ltsp
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17:11
<sbalneav>
gonzaloaf_work: In the linux or windows world?
17:13ltsp-sid has quit IRC
17:16
<sbalneav>
gonzaloaf_work: ping
17:17
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, in both
17:17
<sbalneav>
Windows has citrix and Windows terminal server
17:18
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, I'm just doing a document, something like a benchmark for university, but I'm really glad with ltsp 4.2
17:18
<sbalneav>
Linux, only one I know of is http://www.2x.com/
17:18
but they actually use a lot of our stuff
17:19
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, ok thanks I will try all of them to compare.. then my conclusion will be to use ltsp :p
17:20
sbalneav, now another subject: the only way to turn on a PC using WOL is with the wakeonlan command?
17:20
<sbalneav>
Don't know much about wake on lan, but I've heard of that command.
17:21
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, ohh ok
17:21
<sbalneav>
I know you can buy tcp/ip controlled power bars as well.
17:25
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, power bars?
17:28
<sbalneav>
Yeah, you know, power strips. usually 4-6 power outlets in a row
17:45
<sn9_>
gonzaloaf_work: most bioses can be set to power on on wol
17:46
<gonzaloaf_work>
sbalneav, but my clients are far away from me, around the university
17:46
<sn9_>
check the bios
17:47
the solution is likely there
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21:00
<sbalneav>
Evening all
21:00
<sutula>
vagrantc: I'm trying your suggestion for bug #422962. Do I need audiooss?
21:00* sutula sees ltsp-server recommends it
21:00
<vagrantc>
i doubt it
21:01
recommends, or suggests ?
21:01
sometimes, i've had luck with sound "just working" in gnome.
21:01
sbalneav: heya :)
21:01
<sutula>
vagrantc: recommends
21:02
vagrantc: Maybe I don't know what should be working. Gnome sounds (via ESD) seem to work, but not much else does.
21:02
<vagrantc>
sutula: i wouldn't recommend using nas, so ...
21:02
sutula: yeah, so far ESD is the default "just works" stuff
21:03
haven't figured out how to get all alsa output to go via pulseaudio in debian yet.
21:03
but that seems like the way to do it, since a lot of stuff will support alsa
21:04
<sutula>
vagrantc: Is that the mechanism that's working with 5.0.8?
21:04
<vagrantc>
sutula: it's what ubuntu uses ...
21:04* sutula isn't seeing the ESD port environment variable, nor the /dev/audio or /dev/dsp files on the client
21:04
<vagrantc>
ESPEAKER or PULSE_SERVER ?
21:05
sutula: ESPEAKER and PULSE_SERVER should be set by default when you log into the server.
21:05
/dev/dsp doesn't necessarily need to be there
21:05
though, if debian doesn't autodetect your sound hardware ... there's not much LTSP can do.
21:06
most likely, you'd need to configure some additional sound modules to load...
21:06
<sutula>
vagrantc: Hmmm...so I'm getting gnome sounds (login, logout, etc.), but neither variable shows in a shell
21:06
<vagrantc>
that's really, really weird.
21:06* sutula thinks so too
21:07
<vagrantc>
i don't know how it would know to use the remote sound without those variables being set.
21:07
sutula: if you could add to the report, and then experiment with a few things ... that would be great.
21:08
<sutula>
vagrantc: OK, I'm using "SCREEN_07 = startx"; is that changing things?
21:08
<vagrantc>
sutula: oh, yes.
21:08
<sutula>
vagrantc: I can get rid of that and use the no compression option
21:08
<vagrantc>
sutula: local sound and local devices are not supported at all.
21:09
sutula: yes, use the LDM_DIRECTX stuff
21:09
<sutula>
vagrantc: OK, I'll pull it and try again
21:09
<vagrantc>
sutula: pull it ?
21:09
<sbalneav>
vagrantc: Does debian use ldm2?
21:09
<vagrantc>
though, apparently local sound works with startx, at least somewhat
21:09
sbalneav: not yet
21:09
<sutula>
vagrantc: remove it
21:09BadMagic has quit IRC
21:10
<sbalneav>
If you need any help to get it going, let me know.
21:10
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: probably will upload to debian experimental or unstable soon, though.
21:10
sbalneav: yeah, i've got a branch that has ubuntu and debian branches merged ...
21:11
sbalneav: http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/vagrant-debian-experimental/
21:11
sbalneav: i *think* it would be safe to merge for gutsy.
21:11BadMagic has joined #ltsp
21:11
<vagrantc>
but no guarantees
21:11
<sbalneav>
I'll maybe make a second checkout.
21:11
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: there's one change i know ogra doesn't want, and i'm ok with reverting it
21:11
<sbalneav>
just in case :)
21:11
<sutula>
vagrantc: Another problem I had was with the pieces of code that try to avoid calling debconf-communicate in ltsp-client-setup
21:11
<sbalneav>
Which, the links?
21:12
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: one of the debconf questions changed from "note" to "error"
21:12
<sutula>
vagrantc: Whenever more than one parameter was trying to be set, that didn't work...I called debconf-communicate for each and that works (slowly)
21:12
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: there's a thread on pkg-ltsp-devel abou tit
21:12
<sbalneav>
ah, ok
21:13
<vagrantc>
but it has a lot of translation updates, too.
21:13
<sutula>
vagrantc: ...and then the default keyboard wasn't selected so X wouldn't start :(
21:13
<vagrantc>
sutula: well, future versions may ditch that whole approach
21:15
<sutula>
vagrantc: Given those symptoms, it seems like the backports stuff is probably relying on some new functionality in some of the X packages, maybe
21:15
<vagrantc>
sutula: i don't think so
21:16
sutula: but i haven't tested it much
21:17
<sutula>
vagrantc: Would you expect to have to do anything besides what was listed on the Debian wiki? I did that and dexconf dies because the keyboard layout wasn't defined
21:18
<vagrantc>
sutula: i've done many installs with nothing different than described in the howto ... and they all worked
21:18
sutula: but i haven't had to use any special X keyboard layout stuff
21:18
<sutula>
vagrantc: Did the server have X installed?
21:18
<vagrantc>
defaults of xorg/us keyboard layout work
21:19
sutula: no
21:19
most of out ltsp 5.0.8debian3 installs at freegeek are running in minimalist xen instances, actually.
21:19
<sutula>
vagrantc: Hmmm...that's the default I'm hoping for, but I have to set "us" in lts.conf to get it to work
21:19
<vagrantc>
just nfs, tftp and dhcp
21:19
sutula: peculiar.
21:23
<sutula>
vagrantc: OK, going through ldm (I think that's what it's called), I see ESPEAKER and PULSE_SERVER, and at least ESD apps work
21:24
<vagrantc>
sutula: ok, that's some progress ...
21:25
sutula: we can at least document that, document how to configure KDE to use ESD, and document use of esddsp for everything else ...
21:25
in the long term, i'd like to hook alsa into pulseaudio, though ...
21:27
<sutula>
vagrantc: So for the bug, it seems like the ESD part "just works" with 5.0.8
21:27
vagrantc: ...but it appears sound is an art still
21:28
<vagrantc>
sutula: right, it's not as smooth as i would like, but it's a start.
21:28
<sutula>
For example, the volume control applet in gnome says "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found"
21:28
...but the pop-up itself is accompanied by the gnome alert sound :)
21:29
<vagrantc>
sutula: try installing libgstreamer-plugins-pulse0.10-0
21:29
on the server
21:29
<sutula>
vagrantc: not the chroot?
21:29
<vagrantc>
sutula: yes, on the server itself
21:29
not the chroot
21:33
<sutula>
vagrantc: What's the option to skip the encryption/compression? This is too slow.
21:33
<vagrantc>
sutula: LDM_DIRECTX=True
21:34
sutula: i've also got another URL for packages i'm working on for debian experimental, if you want ...
21:34
:)
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21:35
<sutula>
vagrantc: I'll wring these out a little more...maybe I can find something definite on the other two problems I had and let you know
21:35
<vagrantc>
sutula: so the stuff in /etc/hosts.allow worked fine for you ?
21:35
<sutula>
vagrantc: Yes
21:35
<vagrantc>
sutula: i was working on confirming it yeterday, but didn't have enough time
21:35
first chance i had to try
21:36
<sutula>
vagrantc: It appeared to time out in exactly 2 hrs
21:36
<vagrantc>
2 hours ... not ideal, but could be worse.
21:36
i.e. not at all.
21:36
<sutula>
vagrantc: It'll work
21:36
<vagrantc>
sutula: debian-edu has some really ugly scripts that seem to work ...
21:37
but they're really ugly. this is a nice one-line option.
21:37
<sutula>
vagrantc: It'd be nicer if your shell script could arrange for it to be set somehow
21:39
<vagrantc>
we could add it from ltsp-build-client ... but i have mixed feelings about that ...
21:39
<sutula>
vagrantc: Right...can the script that's starting nbd do something?
21:40
...as the client boots?
21:40
<vagrantc>
sutula: well, as long as the client properly shuts down, everything is fine
21:40
sutula: the problem is when the client looses power ... so the fix has to be server-side
21:41
i'm not sure of any other way to set the keepalive stuff
21:42
<sutula>
vagrantc: I see...well, it's an easy fix to document for now, then you can file upstream bugs :)
21:43
<vagrantc>
already filed a few bugs on nbd with the debian maintainer ... talked with him a fair bit at debconf7
21:43
<sutula>
vagrantc: Would he be receptive...it seems like it should be the default, or at least a conf parameter of that package
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21:46
<vagrantc>
sutula: well, the problem is that it is outside of nbd's scope ... it's actually set in the inetd (which by default is openbsd-inetd)
21:47
sutula: getting -a timeout fixed for nbd-server would be nice ... but apparently that is a major rehaul of the package.
21:48
<sutula>
vagrantc: OK. On the pulse stuff, the libgstreamer-plugins-pulse gets me a working volume control, but am still not seeing many apps produce sound. I'm wondering if there are other pulse things I should be installing.
21:49* sutula sees a pulseaudio - PulseAudio sound server, but suspects that's not it
21:50* sutula wonders about:
21:50
<sutula>
pulseaudio-module-gconf - gconf module for PulseAudio sound server
21:51
pulseaudio-module-zeroconf - Zeroconf module for PulseAudio sound server
21:51
<vagrantc>
sutula: pulseaudio-utils includes padsp ... so you can call a program like: padsp foo
21:51
and foo should use pulseaudio
21:52
<sutula>
vagrantc: That would be a start...other ideas?
21:52
<vagrantc>
sutula: look at how ubuntu has configured sound and see if we can replicate it on debian ?
21:52
sutula: alsa is configured to use pulseaudio somehow ...
21:52
and nearly everything speaks alsa
21:57
<sutula>
vagrantc: good idea...wasn't there another person who was spearheading the Ubuntu stuff, or are you doing both packages?
21:57
<vagrantc>
sutula: ogra's the main person on ubuntu at the moment ... sbalneav is also actively involved
21:58
<sbalneav>
I'm sort of more upstream when it comes to LTSP
21:59
I'm writing the binary bits, and I rely upon ogra and vagrantc to handle the heavy packaging lifting.
21:59* sutula had hernia surgery Friday, so can understand :)
22:00
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: so .. is there a plain ubuntu theme ?
22:00
<sbalneav>
I think ogra's got one in there.
22:01
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: it's not in the bzr branch ... you mean got it in some other package ?
22:01* sbalneav checks
22:02
<sbalneav>
heh, no he doesn't.
22:02
I'll let him know.
22:03
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: oh, also ogra won't like my change to switch the next-server option for dhcpd.conf to be uncommented by default
22:03
sbalneav: because upstream dhcpd makes that a required option, i propose that ubuntu do something in debian/rules since their patched dhcpd doesn't require it.
22:04
<sbalneav>
hm, bit of divergence there.
22:04
<vagrantc>
rather than making the upstream default incompatible with upstream dhcpd
22:04
there's a fair number of debian/ubuntu-isms in a lot of the new code ...
22:05
which probably is discouraging to folks to try and implement for other distros
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22:06* sutula finds http://developer.novell.com/wiki/index.php/Feisty/HOWTO:_PulseAudio and thinks he needs to study that :)
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23:46
<burnerx>
hello?
23:48
i got a question...
23:49
i just installed Edubuntu 7.04
23:49
install when smooth and now lookin at the desktop
23:49
what is the quickest way to test the thin client ?
23:51
<Nikopoika>
you choosed to install ltsp packages while installing edubuntu?
23:51
<burnerx>
i didn't have to select
23:51
it installed by itself
23:51
<Nikopoika>
aa yes
23:51
<burnerx>
i have two NICs, one is DHCP, another is static with 192.168.0.254
23:52
these are the settings i am looking at
23:57
can i use my laptop and try to connect to the ltsp?