IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 25 January 2015   (all times are UTC)

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05:33
<alkisg_web>
!kvm
05:33
<ltsp`>
kvm: Virtual thin client: kvm -vga vmware -ctrl-grab -no-shutdown -kernel /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/vmlinuz -initrd /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/initrd.img -append "ro init=/sbin/init-ltsp root=/dev/nbd0 ip=:10.160.67.10::"
06:07
<alkisg_web>
!learn kvm-ipxe as "Virtual thin client: kvm -vga-vmware -ctrl-grab -no-shutdown -kernel /usr/lib/ipxe/ipxe.lkrn -append 'dhcp net0 && set net0.dhcp/filename /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 && set net0.dhcp/next-server 10.161.254.11 && chain ${filename}'`
06:07
<ltsp`>
The operation succeeded.
06:07
<alkisg_web>
!kvm-ipxe
06:07
<ltsp`>
kvm-ipxe: "Virtual thin client: kvm -vga-vmware -ctrl-grab -no-shutdown -kernel /usr/lib/ipxe/ipxe.lkrn -append 'dhcp net0 && set net0.dhcp/filename /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 && set net0.dhcp/next-server 10.161.254.11 && chain ${filename}'`
06:27
<alkisg_web>
!kvm
06:27
<ltsp`>
kvm: Virtual thin client: kvm -vga-vmware -ctrl-grab -no-shutdown -net nic,model=virtio -net user,tftp=/var/lib/tftpboot,bootfile=/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0
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08:01
<gdi2k>
Wondering about home directory hard disk performance for fat clients: we had a situation recently where 20+ users logged in at the same time (after a power outage) and it caused things to slow to a crawl. I checked system stats and found CPU and network bandwidth were low, but IO was very high on the partition housing the home directories (spinning disk, not SSD). It took users minutes get back up and running. Do you think that moving home directories to SSDs w
08:01
ould fix this, or is there something else going on?
08:30
<alkisg>
Example: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=730587
08:30
If you're hit by that bug, you get GB of temp files inside the home dir
08:30
That would make things crawl, yup
08:31
I've seen 4-5 similar bugs producing GB worth of files under $HOME in the past years...
08:31
But sure, SSD is better for /home than traditional disks, and NFS is faster/lighter than SSHFS, when it doesn't hang :)
08:47
<Hyperbyte>
Hey Alkis, how are you? :-)
08:51
<alkisg>
Hi Jan
08:56
<Hyperbyte>
Everything going ok in Greece?
08:56
<alkisg>
It's elections day, we're all OK, but EE is a little nervous about the results... :)
08:57
<Hyperbyte>
EE?
08:58
<alkisg>
Sorry, greek initials there, I meant EU
08:58
<Hyperbyte>
Thought so. :-)
08:58
<alkisg>
What's the feeling about Greece and Greeks there?
08:58
<Hyperbyte>
Which side of the debate are you on?
08:59* alkisg has heard teenagers hating Greece and saying things like "you owe us money, give us our money now" etc...
09:00
<Hyperbyte>
Which teenagers?
09:00
I mean, where from?
09:00
<alkisg>
For example, Germany, but it's only from there...
09:01
<Hyperbyte>
Honestly, Dutch people are very good at complaining and whining, but very quickly done with matters as well.
09:01
There's been some complaining about Greece in the past, but mostly in a jokeful way really...
09:02
And now everyone is like 'oh whatever...'
09:02
<alkisg>
I don't think the "debate" result matters that much, since I do think that the whole world/EU/etc economy isn't based on if people actually work hard or not... I think it's prearranged that all countries should have a debt
09:02
<Hyperbyte>
In fact, I didn't even know there were Greek elections today until you told me.
09:03
Headlines this morning: slippery road conditions cause accidents, Greece votes and Feyenoord - Ajax football match this afternoon.
09:03
<alkisg>
I was very unsure about what to vote today, exactly because I don't think that anyone of them can make a difference
09:04
Hehe, if we made it to the headlines it means we're making people worry...
09:04
<Hyperbyte>
Nah, media is covering it like any other elections.
09:05
<alkisg>
I'm only worried about economical accidents, e.g. if people get too scared with the "negotiations" and pick up all their money from the banks and the bank system here collapses etc...
09:05
Hyperbyte: unrelated... are you still using LTSP at work?
09:05
<Hyperbyte>
Yessir.
09:06* alkisg hasn't heard any issues from Jan in the last year and was worried :D
09:06
<Hyperbyte>
Although it's not really my work anymore. ;-) But they still hire me as freelance IT manager.
09:06
Well, I think I've gotten quite good at the whole Linux/LTSP thing. :P
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09:06
<alkisg>
True, I believe you have
09:06
<Hyperbyte>
Remember when I started out with LTSP, it was the first time I ever did anything with GUI's on Linux.
09:06
<gdi2k>
alkisg, many thanks for your input. We had a situation where the sshfs process of one particular user hammering server IO as shown by iotop and I couldn't figure out what process was causing it (no iotop on client image). Maybe that bug is the culptit. Would you recommend switching to NFS?
09:06
<alkisg>
gdi2k: no, just troubleshoot that issue
09:07
<Hyperbyte>
And I also hadn't done anything with Ubuntu before... so it took a while to get my bearings, but eventually you've done a few setups and then it becomes second nature.
09:07
<alkisg>
gdi2k: e.g. I've seen some issues with .xsession-errors growing to several GB, that were *NOT* sshfs specific, they would also happen with nfs or even local storage
09:08
Hyperbyte: but you'd still prefer rhel/centos etc if ltsp was supported OK there, right?
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09:08
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, plus, since about a year and a half, there's a new server at work (a real beast) that runs all other servers (fileserver, terminalserver, directoryserver, etc) all virtualized. Since then it's been -rock- solid and very very stable.
09:08
<gdi2k>
alkisg, yes, understand. will try and track that down... I have moved one user to the root SSD to see if the overall user experience is better / more responsive. If it is we may move to SSDs anyway...
09:09
<alkisg>
gdi2k: check /home/username for recently modified files, their size etc
09:09
Don't bother with ssd or other filesystems until you actually pinpoint the issue
09:09
<gdi2k>
alkisg, will do, thanks
09:09
<alkisg>
np
09:09
<Hyperbyte>
And fast, too.. the virtual host server is so powerful, the thin client server actually runs faster now that it's virtualized.
09:10
I was warned here by someone that LTSP thin client servers don't like to be virtualized, because it causes lag. But I did it anyways and had no issues.
09:10
So, that helps too. Dealing with virtual servers is a lot easier than with physical ones.
09:11
So, no issues. :-)
09:11
<alkisg>
Which virtualization technology? xen?
09:11
vmware?
09:11
<Hyperbyte>
qemu-kvm
09:11
<alkisg>
cool
09:12
<Hyperbyte>
Mind you though, this is a really beefy server with Intel NICs, so that probably helps a lot.
09:12
But still, I haven't seen an increase in lag, not even a little.
09:13
As for RHEL/CentOS... I'm still a big fan of those distros for servers, because no matter what anyone says or tells you - it doesn't get more stable than that. I haven't ever ran into a single bug or stability issue yet with RHEL/CentOS official packages.
09:15
Thing is, that stability comes at a cost, because you have older (and less) software in the main repositories. Of course you can add third party repositories to get recent software, but that kinda defeats the purpose of the distro.
09:15
So, no, I don't think RHEL/CentOS would be my first choice for LTSP in an environment where people need to do a lot of daily things and share/receive a lot of data with/from people.
09:16
I do want the latest GIMP and the latest LibreOffice and the latest Thunderbird/Firefox...
09:16
<alkisg>
Ah, no backports available there?
09:17
<Hyperbyte>
So you could go with Fedora, which has bleeding edge versions of everything... but keeping up with the insane release schedule of the distro is almost impossible. Their releases have like 1, 1.5 years EOL for updates?
09:17
<alkisg>
Nah fedora is only for personal use, I wouldn't want to maintain a work environment in that distro
09:18
<Hyperbyte>
I have it on a few servers, very important ones too...
09:19
But those are servers running a pretty extensive CRM, for which I like to have all the latest versions and features.
09:20
And sure there are backports for CentOS, but like I said... it kinda defeats the purpose of the distro. RHEL is a bit like "if it ain't broken, don't try to fix it".
09:21
If you do want the latest versions of everything, you could use third party repositories (like the one provided by document foundation itself), but that doesn't really match with the distro's philosophy I think.
09:22
I could still introduce bugs, because those packages aren't as thoroughly tested as the ones RedHat provides.
09:22* alkisg is fighting with the repositories of his WDmycloud disk...
09:22
<alkisg>
They're pointed to debian jessie, but programs from there refuse to run mentioning 64k page issues
09:23
<Hyperbyte>
Oh, also - now that I have everything virtualized, I couldn't care less what distro my LTSP server runs. :P It's just LTSP running on there, so...
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19:24
<pingufan>
Hello. Please, help. I was running LTSP on openSUSE 12.3 x64 for months. With an update, the clients suddenly stopped working. They say that something is not supported while booting the kernel, then they reboot. I have no idea about how to fix that.
19:25
<vagrantc>
pae?
19:25
cmov?
19:25
<pingufan>
Yes.
19:25
<vagrantc>
a lot of distros are now defaulting to requiring PAE extensions...
19:25
<pingufan>
PAE. But it gets into the boot menu and starts booting the kernel.
19:26
<vagrantc>
you could see if there's a legacy non-pae kernel available instead ... i'm not familiar with openSuSE enough to say
19:26
<pingufan>
Is it possible that the kernel in the booted image is too old?
19:26
<vagrantc>
more likely too new
19:27
<pingufan>
I talk of the client's kernel.
19:27
<vagrantc>
yes.
19:27
it boots the kernel from the server, and the updates may have pulled in a new kernel.
19:27
that new kernel may no longer support your hardware
19:27
!kiwi-ltsp
19:27
<ltsp`>
kiwi-ltsp: for kiwi-ltsp related questions, you can also ask in the #kiwi-ltsp freenode IRC channel, or visit http://en.opensuse.org/LTSP
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19:28
<vagrantc>
sorry i can't be more help, have to go
19:28* vagrantc waves
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19:28
<pingufan>
Where could I get a newer kernel (the i386 file)?
19:35
<Hyperbyte>
pingufan, what distro?
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19:44
<pingufan>
openSUSE 12.3 x64
19:44
Sorry, I was afk for a moment.
19:46
Hyperbyte: Can you help me, please? I am working under pressure and cannot get it working again since several weeks. I can only get this working again or insert a HDD into every client. I'd prefer the first.
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20:26
<Hyperbyte>
pingufan, ltsp-update-kernels should do it?
20:27
<pingufan>
I will try it. I am currently not there, but I can connect by ssh.
20:28
Should I save some config files before I do that? (I have a DHCP which does lots more than LTSP needs.
20:30
Oh my god... errors appear. http://pastebin.com/cXwbjLK7
20:32
I wonder why it mentions kiwi-ltsp-suse-12.2, but the system is ruinning 12.3.
20:32* Hyperbyte shrugs
20:32
<Hyperbyte>
I have no experience with kiwi-ltsp nor opensuse
20:32
<pingufan>
:D But it was worth a try.
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