IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 30 May 2014   (all times are UTC)

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01:54
<alkisg>
Does anyone disable the zeitgeist package in his LTSP installations in order to save server CPU and RAM?
01:55
It's supposed to monitor user activity... /me hates all those services that run by default and waste precious resources...
01:55
Hyperbyte: ltsp-update-kernels sees that you have an i386.img but not a chroot
01:55
It doesn't know where you got i386.img from, it doesn't know you're using ltsp-pnp
01:56
So it just copies to the tftp, the kernels that are inside i386.img, not the ones from /boot
01:56
That's the same since the beginning of ltsp-pnp, it's not something new that started in 14.04...
01:56
So just run ltsp-update-image to create a new i386.img
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09:00
<engblom>
After the latest update I did to wheezy running ltsp, it is not possible to use USB-sticks anymore. Do anyone of you know any fix or workaround for this?
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14:02
<Faith>
anyone knows how can I manipulate the username on LDM?
14:03
<||cw>
what do you mean
14:03
manipulate how
14:04
<bennabiy>
alkisg: http://ftp.heanet.ie/mirrors/linuxmint.com/stable/17/ early bird special if you wanted to try your greek again
14:05
<Faith>
I am having the slash issue with LDM, I want know where it is going wrong
14:05
example, user DOMAIN\user
14:06
<bennabiy>
Are you authenticating using SAMBA?
14:06
Faith ^
14:06
<Faith>
samba and winbind
14:07
<bennabiy>
Hmm. Perhaps someone else has more experience with that...
14:07
What is happening? Also, what Distro, architecture etc, are you using?
14:07
The more info you can put out there, the more likely someone can help you
14:07
<Faith>
ubuntu server 12.04 amd64
14:08
when I do on the server: ssh DOMAIN\\user@localhost
14:08
it is work
14:08
when I try this on LDM, in the logs I saw that it makes the ssh connection
14:09
but LDM did not find the user with the 2 slashs and logout
14:09
I use 2 slash, cause 1 is for the scape
14:10
I try 'DOMAIN\user', DOMAIN\\user, theses two works on ssh, but not on LDM
14:12
I was looking the shell files on the chroot, to try manipulate the username, but I didn't find where
14:13
do you know where the username from LDM is manipulate?
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14:16
<alkisg>
!screen_02
14:16
<ltsp`>
screen_02: To get a root shell on an Ubuntu thin client: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ClientTroubleshooting#Using_a_shell_SCREEN
14:16
<alkisg>
Faith: try ssh from there ^
14:16
bennabiy: ty, I'll try it sometime in the future, unfortunately too busy this month
14:24
<Faith>
the ssh works
14:25
<alkisg>
Faith: run `tail -f /var/log/ldm.log` from screen_02, then switch to vt7, and retry to login from ldm
14:25
Then switch back to vt1 and check the log...
14:31
<Faith>
what is the site that I can paste the log?
14:31
<Ark74>
pastebin?
14:31
<alkisg>
!pastebin
14:31
<ltsp`>
pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
14:32
<Faith>
tks :)
14:38
http://pastebin.com/msdH5RSy
14:38
DOMAIN\\usuario is my domain user and 'sti' is a local user on LTSP server
14:39
you can see from log that the domain user can make the ssh but fails on ltsp-localappsd
14:41
<alkisg>
Yup looks like a bug
14:41
!ltsp-bug
14:41
<ltsp`>
ltsp-bug: To file a bug report for upstream LTSP, go to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp
14:42
<Faith>
I will open a report there
14:42
tks :D
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15:08
<Faith>
alkisg, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/1324971
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15:12
<alkisg>
Faith: btw, does it work with DOMAIN//user ?
15:12
Or, can you set another separator?
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15:13
<Faith>
I didn't try another separator, I just try what is work in ssh
15:14
I try 'DOMAIN\user' also, with quotation
15:14
it has the same result
15:16
<alkisg>
Faith: ah, did you say 12.04?
15:16
Can you pastebin your version of X01-localapps ?
15:17
<Faith>
yeah, wait a minute
15:24
alkisg, http://pastebin.com/esb0gLzm
15:24
<alkisg>
Ah ok that's the old version
15:24
I rewrote that script, it should work now...
15:25
!greek-schools-ppa
15:25
<ltsp`>
greek-schools-ppa: https://launchpad.net/~ts.sch.gr/+archive/ppa/ supports LTS Ubuntu releases with newer LTSP versions, bug fixes etc
15:25
<alkisg>
This does have a newer version, but warning: don't just add it
15:25
<Faith>
if I cannot just add, what can I do?
15:25
<alkisg>
You would need to remove the ltsp packages, purge /etc/ltsp, and then add it...
15:25
and then install the ltsp packages...
15:26
Some things were changed after 12.04 so the upgrade isn't very smooth
15:26
nbd config is different, etc
15:26
!ltsp-source
15:26
<ltsp`>
ltsp-source: at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/files
15:26
<alkisg>
You can find the latest versions of files there
15:26
Maybe you can start from there,
15:27
i.e. try the newest X01-localapps from there
15:27
<Faith>
I try the new ubuntu 14.04, but I couldn't make it join the domain, that's why I am using 12.04
15:28
can I try just replace the X01-localapp on chroot?
15:28
<alkisg>
Yes, try it: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/view/head:/client/localapps/ldm-rc.d/X01-localapps
15:29
Faith: ping me if it works... I rewrote that script to make it 100 times faster, but I think I also solved the issue you mentioned, with weird characters in AD, LDAP etc
15:29
<Faith>
I am going to lunch now, after that I will try, and say if it works
15:30
<alkisg>
ok
15:30
<Faith>
thank you :)
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17:12
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: Why does debian not implement some type of ppa?
17:13
<||cw>
there's a few launchpad ppa's that support debian
17:13
debian itself doens't feel it needs it, since you add apt sources all you want
17:13
and it's really not that hard to make a repo
17:14
<bennabiy>
Hmm.
17:15
<||cw>
you can also add ubuntu ppa's as long as the dependent library versions are good
17:15
and you can add debian repo's to ubuntu as well
17:15* ||cw <3 apt/dpkg
17:16
<bennabiy>
heh, yes
17:17
I just wondered what their reasoning was behind not having something like ppa / launchpad
17:17
<||cw>
extra work?
17:18
<bennabiy>
heh
17:18
<||cw>
it's hard enough for them just have a stable release ever 4 years
17:18
<bennabiy>
tre
17:18
true
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17:40
<alkisg>
Faith: if it works, write it in the bug report and close it
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17:56
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: at this point, primarily lack of time and energy.
17:58
bennabiy: it's been discussed regularly over the last two years, and it always comes down to "ok, who's going to do the work?"
17:59
launchpad PPAs are kind of ugly to use on debian... since they're actually built for some other distro entirely. not a big fan of that approach.
18:07
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: exactly. That is why I wondered about a debian friendly one
18:07
It would be nice to have the sanity checking at least that launchpad does for ppas
18:08
Isn't launchpad opensource? How much work would it be to set up the same thing, just debianized?
18:08
launchpad / soyuz (sp_
18:08
etc
18:09
<vagrantc>
the build infrastructure is... different.
18:10
<bennabiy>
well, I guess if it comes about, it comes about. Till then the machine rolls on
18:10
<vagrantc>
i have at various points considered an autobuilder for LTSP images, but I never really found the time for it.
18:17
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: How long have you been involved in debian related things, more than just a casual user?
18:25
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: funny you should ask ... it's pretty much 10 years as of this month.
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18:31
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: wow, that is great
18:32
I think 10 years ago I was mostly using slackware
18:33
maybe some redhat
18:35
<vagrantc>
i've been using debian for around 14 years? before that it was primarily slackware based variants and originally redhat
18:35
<bennabiy>
yes
18:36
I remember sitting in my basement marvelling that the redhat 5.0 disk came with doom installed
18:41
vagrantc: what do you do for an occupation?
18:41
if you dont mind me asking
18:45
<championofcyrodi>
i can get doom to run on anything.
18:45
i love doom
18:46
<BuckO>
@championofcyrodi .. no you can not .. your food blender does not run it :D
18:46
<championofcyrodi>
thinking about configuring an alias on all client images 'deathmatch' to throw the user into a deathmatch arena w/ rocket launchers and username
18:46
@BuckO: not yet...
18:46
the idea behind the deathmatch is to resolve disagreements over software integration and development.
18:47
if you lose the deathmatch, then your wrong. Can't be any worse than most CM practices.
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18:53* bennabiy doesn't game any more... been over 10 years
18:55
<BuckO>
@bennabiy .. you must be 75 then :D
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19:04
<bennabiy>
33
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19:12
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: i've done system administration, but recently started doing free software related consulting
19:13
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: hence #ltsp?
19:14
;)
19:15* bennabiy is trying to figure out how to read "free software related consulting"
19:15
<bennabiy>
free - software related consulting .... or free software - related consulting
19:16
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: consulting in supporting development and use of "Free Software" ?
19:17
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: gotcha :) sorry to put you on the spot like that. I appreciate the work you do
19:17
I guess you could say I do the other version, free consulting of supporting development and use of free (and not free) software
19:17
among our communities
19:18
<vagrantc>
my business model so far has been contribute to free software projects for over a decade... and eventually people want to pay me to do something specific
19:34
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: I appreciate that.
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20:15
<gbaman>
vagrantc: if I was to copy the LTSP squashfs generated image onto the pi SD card, how would I point the kernel and initrd to it?
20:15
is that even possible?
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20:30
<gbaman>
any ideas vagrantc?
20:31
<vagrantc>
i have lots of ideas, but no idea what ideas you're asking me about :P
20:32
<gbaman>
vagrantc: if I was to copy the LTSP squashfs generated image onto the pi SD card, how would I point the kernel and initrd to it?
20:32
is that even possible?
20:32
<vagrantc>
should be possible, sure
20:32
just dd the file to a partition on the card
20:32
<gbaman>
thats the easy part :)
20:32
<vagrantc>
alternately, put it on the fat partition and write a bunch of initramfs hooks to mount it as a loopback device
20:33
gbaman: root=/dev/mmcblk0p2 init=/sbin/init-ltsp boot=local
20:33
gbaman: you'll need to tell it what the LTSP server is somehow...
20:33
<gbaman>
that an environmental variable?
20:34
like SERVER?
20:34
<vagrantc>
yeah
20:34
or LDM_SERVER ...
20:34
<gbaman>
wasnt far off :)
20:35
that in theory should make it crazy super fast...
20:35
<vagrantc>
SERVER should work in theory, but there were soe lingering bugs with how that played out ... not sure if they're resolved
20:35
SD cards are crazy suport slow...
20:35
super
20:35
<gbaman>
vs 100mbit ethernet?
20:35
<vagrantc>
it's a math problem.
20:36
<gbaman>
think we were hitting 30mb/s with the SD interface?
20:36
maybe 25..
20:37
where as ethernet is basically 10mb/s
20:38
<vagrantc>
long as you're doing the tests
20:38
you do have the maintenance overhead of supporting many images...
20:38
well, many SD cards...
20:39
<gbaman>
not if they sync
20:39
a question was brought up about kids brining SD cards home
20:39
<vagrantc>
and now we get into alkisg's ideas about caching files locally automatically
20:39
<gbaman>
still does not fix the user accounts..
20:39
hmm
20:39
haha
20:40
<vagrantc>
use a usb card reader to support cards brought from home.
20:41
your booting SD cards should be glued in place, far as i'm concerned :)
20:41
<gbaman>
question is, could we support caching user accounts that have logged into the pi previously...
20:44
<vagrantc>
the answer is, of course!
20:45
how much work would it be is a more interesting question...
20:45
<gbaman>
haha
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20:47
<gbaman>
it is the taking SD cards home that is the big thing I am pondering right now
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20:48
<gbaman>
can we easily bypass LDM?
20:48
wait, yes we can..
20:49
ctrl alt f1?
20:49
<vagrantc>
at which point, what's left of LTSP in your setup :P
20:49
<gbaman>
hmm
20:50
my thinking was we copy the image every so often to SD card, when they are in school connected to main network, always working on most up to date version
20:50
when they log off, it copies last user to SD card inside the OS stored on there
20:50
hmm
20:51
the key thing is kids need to be able to work at home...
20:51
preferably still use same OS..
20:51
<vagrantc>
you're doing fatclients?
20:51
<gbaman>
yes
20:51
then take work home
20:51
work on
20:51
bring back in and it sync
20:52
<vagrantc>
you'd need to store some random bits on the SD card on the fat or a third partition, since squashfs is a read-only filesystem
20:52
<gbaman>
true
20:52
and do want to keep it that way
20:52
<vagrantc>
er, not random bits ... but the authentication data.
20:52
and probably the homedir?
20:53
<gbaman>
could we trick LDM?
20:53
to act as normal with a local login?
20:53
<vagrantc>
this gets back to the LDM password hash idea that someone was recently working on...
20:54
<gbaman>
?
20:58
<vagrantc>
you would need to cache the hash of the password locally in order to be able to authenticate when the server is not available
20:58
<gbaman>
ok
20:58
<vagrantc>
normally, with LTSP clients, the client itself doesn't have access to the password hash of the user.
20:58
so things like screen lockers don't work.
20:59
so the idea is to hash the password from the user-supplied password during the LDM login, to be able to get local password access to work.
20:59
this would be needed for your setup as well
21:00
<gbaman>
ok, so basically something needs to go and generate the entered password hash to compare
21:01
speaking of LDM, any chance you could fix the pci error every time it starts on a pi?
21:01
<vagrantc>
unless it's ok for passwordless logins or something when not connected to the server, but that has some security implications...
21:01
gbaman: should be fixed in recent LTSP versions
21:01
<gbaman>
not version in Ubuntu repo?
21:02
<vagrantc>
you're running ubuntu on your rpi?
21:02
<gbaman>
no?
21:02
Ubuntu server
21:02
ohh
21:02
ignore that
21:02
<vagrantc>
it's a client-side issue :P
21:02
<gbaman>
*Not one in Raspbian repo
21:03
which normally isnt far behind..
21:03
will get version number
21:04
Version: 2:2.2.11-2
21:04
Ubuntu Version: 2:2.2.13-1
21:04
hmm
21:04
little out of date
21:05
ahh, Wheezy Version: 2:2.2.11-2
21:05
which would explain why, main wheezy is behind
21:06
<vagrantc>
wheezy was released about a year ago, frozen long before that.
21:07
<gbaman>
does it not get updates?
21:07
point releases?
21:07
<vagrantc>
so it's at least a year and a half behind.
21:07
gbaman: just security updates and major bugs.
21:07
gbaman: does it actually break, or is it just noisy?
21:08
<gbaman>
so your patch won't get in till jessie?
21:08
noisy and annoying
21:08
causes no real issues
21:10
<vagrantc>
not a point release candidate, then
21:10
<gbaman>
so wont get fixed till Jessie?
21:10
<vagrantc>
yeah, it should be fixed in jessie
21:10
<gbaman>
..
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21:11
<gbaman>
sigh..
21:11
<vagrantc>
it's actually in ltsp
21:11
<gbaman>
what is?
21:11
the bug?
21:11
<vagrantc>
the bug
21:11
not that that changes the release cycle
21:12
<gbaman>
could use the ppa...
21:13
<vagrantc>
i don't think you'll find a build for raspbian
21:13
ppa only builds for x86, no?
21:14
<gbaman>
oh..
21:14
:(
21:14
assuming I cant just patch it on every client with a single line change somewhere?
21:14
<vagrantc>
if you really need to fix it, fix it in your build script
21:15
<gbaman>
is a tad scary to new users, makes them think something is wrong
21:16
<vagrantc>
https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/revision/2426
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21:16* vagrantc wonders if there are overrides for screen-session.d
21:17
<gbaman>
i miss github and its nice web interface..
21:18
<vagrantc>
nope, no overrides
21:19
<gbaman>
no idea what you are talking about, but ok
21:19
<vagrantc>
gbaman: you might be able to work around them by setting XSERVER= and X_VIRTUAL_AUTO=
21:21
depends on how the shell processes it...
21:23
gbaman: XSERVER=fbdev (assuming that's what the RPI uses) and X_VIRTUAL_AUTO=false in lts.conf might work around it
21:24
<gbaman>
just tried your earlier command btw with armhf.img on the second partition
21:24
failed complaining it was read only
21:25
<vagrantc>
gbaman: did you specify init=/sbin/init-ltsp ?
21:29
<gbaman>
specifiy?
21:29
* specify
21:29
cmdline.txt - http://pastebin.com/7aAjxqKM
21:31
<vagrantc>
hrm.
21:31
wonder what's complaining about the read-only stuff then
21:32
maybe init-bottom/ltsp isn't kicking in and setting up the aufs...
21:32
<gbaman>
incoming screenshot
21:33
or not..
21:33
it has decided it no longer likes my monitor...
21:34
<vagrantc>
gbaman: so, you did dump the image to /dev/mmcblk0p2? did it successfully mount the image, just complain that it was read-only? does it drop you to a debugging shell?
21:34
<gbaman>
dropped into debugging shell
21:35
assuming it is /dev/mmcblk0p2
21:35
second partition
21:35
<vagrantc>
mount | grep /root
21:35
<gbaman>
working on getting screen working..
21:36
weird...
21:37
changed some options, now I have hugely massive font...
21:37
but a screen :)
21:37
working on it
21:38
ok, screen fixed
21:39
ok, partition is right
21:39
<vagrantc>
watch out for the sharks
21:40
<gbaman>
incoming screenshot
21:40
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1122948/temp/ltsp-8.JPG
21:42
<vagrantc>
gbaman: my bet is it failed to mount the partition
21:42
except that it did
21:42
<gbaman>
yeah..
21:42
<vagrantc>
gbaman: it says its an ext4 filesystem ... ?
21:43
<gbaman>
thats the data partition
21:43
then inside that is armhf.img?
21:43
<vagrantc>
gbaman: did you dd if=armhf.img of=/dev/mmcblk0p2 ?
21:43
<gbaman>
no?
21:43
thought the point was to copy the file onto that partition like the server
21:44
<vagrantc>
in order for this to work the easy way, you'll need to dump the image to a partition
21:44
<gbaman>
dumping..
21:44
<vagrantc>
otherwise you'll have to also implement loopback device mounting
21:45
in ubuntu, they have loopback mount stuff implemented, but not in debian...
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21:46
<gbaman>
back, wrong cable :)
21:48
vagrantc: have you btw giving Raspi-LTSP a try out yet? Am currently looking for as much feedback as I can get
21:49
and have made it super simple under Ubuntu 14.04 :)
21:50
<vagrantc>
gbaman: i have not, no.
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21:51
<gbaman>
You should give it a go, would be interested in your opinion
21:51
https://github.com/gbaman/RaspberryPi-LTSP
21:51
as you can see from the Ubuntu installation bit, is really really simple
21:52
and requires very little user interaction :)
21:52
<vagrantc>
my experiences of requiring very little interaction roguhly translates into uninstallable
21:53
<gbaman>
well of course I would recommend running it in a VM :)
21:53
it was designed solely to set up a Raspberry Pi LTSP network
21:53
<vagrantc>
sure
22:02
<gbaman>
but would be interested in what you thought
22:02
and any suggestions you had
22:02
seeing as it has mainly been pi community members and 1 school using it
22:03
would be good to get someone who knows what they are on about to have a look though, seeing as I am sure you could suggest some changes
22:03
knowing the Linux ecosystem
22:05
and Ubuntu 14.04 in a vm only takes 15-20 mins to install, then you download and run Raspi-LTSP, it explains what it is going to do and runs a full install. At the end it then asks a few questions for configuration and that is it
22:06
it also gives you the option not to run a full install and just load the menu
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