IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 23 April 2012   (all times are UTC)

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05:23
<alkisg>
vagrantc: I'm using a recipe which builds on your https://code.launchpad.net/~vagrantc/ltsp/ldm-debian-packaging - is it easy for to remove "chmod +x debian/ldm/usr/share/ldm/ssh-hostchecker" from debian/rules so that I request a new build and see if it works?
05:24
<vagrantc>
i don't know anything about launchpad recipes
05:24
<alkisg>
*for you
05:24
vagrantc: you don't need to; I just need you to update your branch to reflect the ssh-hostchecker removal, if you don't mind
05:25
<vagrantc>
ssh-hostchecker is going away? good...
05:25
<alkisg>
I removed it from trunk, but I'd prefer to build on launchpad instead of locally, and if you updated the packaging tree it would make it easy for me to build without uploading a branch of my own
05:26
https://code.launchpad.net/~alkisg/+recipe/ldm : lp:~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ldm-trunk
05:26
nest ldm-debian-packaging lp:~vagrantc/ltsp/ldm-debian-packaging debian
05:26
It means "merge trunk with the packaging and build the result"
05:29
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it might make sense to add -o CheckHostIP=no
05:30
<alkisg>
True, we could put that in ldm options
05:30
I also experimented with putting "*" in front of the ssh keys, and nothing was checked, hostname nor ip
05:30
<vagrantc>
evil.
05:31
<alkisg>
But checking at least the hostname is wiser :D
05:31
<vagrantc>
yeah, ssh-hostchecker allowed for MITM attacks with multiple servers.
05:32
alkisg: i can push it now, although it may be some time before launchpad mirrors the branch
05:33
<alkisg>
Aah I thought it was the other way around
05:33
vagrantc: please do though and I'll test later on when it's available
05:34
<vagrantc>
for the debian-specific parts, i host on debian servers as the primary location
05:34
launchpad just has a few mirrors
05:34
<alkisg>
So now it's a matter of policy, if one uses hostnames both in ltsp-update-sshkeys <hosts> and in LDM_SERVER, then he doesn't need to run ltsp-update-sshkeys when he updates their IP
05:34
But if he puts IPs there, he does
05:35
<vagrantc>
and the default case uses the ltsp default of "server" which automatically gets added to /etc/hosts
05:35
<alkisg>
Yup
05:36
<vagrantc>
i swear i suggested we do that at the BTS, but instead we got ssh-hostchecker :(
05:36
<alkisg>
Haha, better late than never
05:37
<vagrantc>
and especially before debian freeze
05:37
<alkisg>
Next I'll commit a client-side utility, "ltsp-cleanup-image" or something
05:38
Which removes users etc, will be called from the server when ltsp-update-image --export-root is executed
05:39
(thanks btw!)
05:42
<vagrantc>
launchpad should say how long till next mirror
05:42
er, pushed ldm-debian-packaging ...
05:43
<alkisg>
Last mirrored: 3 hours ago Next mirror: in 2 hours
05:43
Nice!
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12:41
<elias_a>
muppis: Do you happen to know Janne Karjanlahti in Pomarkku? He is taking care of the LTSP of Nakkila high school.
12:42
<muppis>
elias_a, nope.
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12:45
<elias_a>
muppis: Have I told you about Educoss-list? Do you know it?
12:45
<muppis>
elias_a, yes you have told. Sorry, but haven't you joined to it.
12:46
<elias_a>
muppis: I run the list. I just wanted to makes sure you know about it.
12:47
All Finns check out this years workshop:
12:47
http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Ty%C3%B6paja_2012
12:48
It is already 2.5.2012 so you have to hurry if you plan to travel to Töysä in Ostrobothnia...
12:49
<muppis>
Traveling is not the problem, schedule is. Already planned that week. :(
12:50
<elias_a>
Ok.
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13:27
<mealstrom>
hi, how to correct configure printer to all users, that is shared via smb?
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13:47
<dobber>
anyone have problems with skype eating too much memory ?
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13:51
<mealstrom>
i've got shared printer (smb) on host machine. how to share it to ltsp-clients ?
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14:16
<brunolambert>
dobber: Skype is an alcoholic when it comes to memory, even on a normal workstation.
14:17
<dobber>
memory spikes to 4gb and skype crashes
14:18
<brunolambert>
I've seen Skype eating almost 8GB
14:19
<dead_inside>
then why use it?
14:21
<brunolambert>
because it works and when not opened 24/7 for days, it does not take too much memory.
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14:29
<mealstrom>
brunolambert: make a script to restart skype at midnight
14:30
how to fix cupsd with apparmor at name="/rofs/usr/lib/libcupsmime.so.1" . (operation OPEN denied)
14:30
&
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16:24
<talntid>
I have a currently-deployed 30-agent LTSP setup... It's in production right now, and load averages are 30-70
16:25
things are laggy. Can I get some suggestions as to what I should do? It seems firefox/flash may be eating up the resources.
16:25
server has 8gb memory. 6core 2.65ghz
16:27
also willing to pay for some consulting time, if someone wants to go that route, and knows their stuff :)
16:27
http://pastebin.com/0bqkJmXA
16:31
<dead_inside>
if each of the 30+ agents has firefox/flash open and you are using thin client setup you need a hell of alot more ram
16:31
like 6 times as much ram
16:31
<talntid>
I can move it to a server with 64gb ram
16:31
or, I can offload it to localapps with some help, maybe? :)
16:31
each thin client is a 2.6ghz, 1gb ram
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16:32
<dead_inside>
you might get away with running firefox and flash locally
16:33
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTSPLocalAppSetup
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16:40
<||cw>
or even switch to fat a client setup, a client with those specs would do well enough
16:41
<dead_inside>
if you go the fat client route make sure to use network swap, end users can fill up 1G of ram quickly on their own
16:42
<talntid>
what is suggested more, fat client, or localapps?
16:42
try localapps first, and if not, move to fatclient?
16:42
<dead_inside>
either options has their advantages, its really up to you
16:45
<talntid>
when i set localapps=firefox..
16:45
so I also need to set localapps=plugin-container?
16:46
<dead_inside>
no you just need to be sure flash is installed in the client image
16:47
only firefox needs to be in localapps=
16:47
<talntid>
k
16:47
<dead_inside>
you also have the option for using the 64G ram server and staying with thin cleints
16:50
<talntid>
yeah, but I am using that for other VM's... I -could- move it there, but.. I didn't buy that for this
16:55
<dead_inside>
oh i see
16:57
<talntid>
just did firefox as localapp and installed flash. will reboot the clients and see what happens
16:59
<dead_inside>
sweet
17:00
<talntid>
man this sucks trying to run commands on this thing.. lol
17:00
on the update-image... takes forever since loads are high
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17:11
<GodFather>
knipwim, ping
17:15
<talntid>
can I uninstall firefox on the main server, to... ensure they can only access the localapp?
17:15
i have all my users dropping off right now... then I'll have one login, check to see localapp works, then have them all log back i
17:17
<dead_inside>
i would not recommend uninstalling firefox on the main until you are sure the localapp is the route you want to go
17:18
<talntid>
how do i know if it's running local?
17:18
<dead_inside>
on the client
17:19
open a terminal
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17:19
<dead_inside>
ltsp-localapps xterm
17:19
this will open an xterm window
17:19
run top
17:19
and see if firefox is running
17:25
<talntid>
localapp works
17:26
<dead_inside>
then i would have everyone log in and try it and see how it affects the real load
17:26
if your server load dropped and your users are happy then you have found your solution
17:26
<talntid>
well, if everyone logs in, they'll open it using the firefox link on their desktops
17:26
<dead_inside>
that should work
17:26
<talntid>
they won't know to open "ltsp-localapps"
17:26
on the desktop, it opened it on server
17:27
then ltsp-localapps got it working on the client
17:27
<dead_inside>
if they are using gnome and you have localapps menu set in your lts.conf their link should work
17:27
LOCAL_APPS_MENU = 'True'
17:27
<talntid>
lemme check that
17:28
<dead_inside>
gnome will rewrite their menu for firefox to make it run locally
17:29
<talntid>
there was a local apps menu in the config. asking my monkey to see if it shows up in the system
17:30
<dead_inside>
if it was in the config he should be able to open firefox like normally and it will run it as local on it's own
17:30
<talntid>
firefox on the server is... firefox-2 I think
17:35
loads looking good so far
17:36
<dead_inside>
whats the load at, usually you want the number to be less then the total number of cpu cores on the server
17:37
<talntid>
10:36:56 up 11:30, 27 users, load average: 3.74, 4.56, 17.17
17:37
and it's got 7 cores assigned
17:37
this is during the "flood" of everyone logging in, too.
17:45
settling down to... .load: 5.37, 5.10, 12.29
17:51
<dead_inside>
thats much better then it was, how is the performance of the clients
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17:54
<talntid>
checking
17:54
i uninstalled firefox on the server :)
17:54
top - 10:54:51 up 11:47, 27 users, load average: 4.84, 5.52, 9.33
17:55
getting even better
17:56
they are a little slow when opening firefox, I don't know if that's normal
17:56
but when firefox is open, everything seems pretty snappy
17:58
<dead_inside>
yes it will be slow opening firefox, it has to suck the firefox program from the server on to the client, but if the lag goes away once it is open you should have your solution
17:58
and it did not cost you anything
17:58
<talntid>
yeah :)
17:58
I used to have 800mhz, 256mb ram wyse clients
17:58
upgraded to the lenobo s50, 2.6, 1gb ram
17:59
looks like it was the right choice for localapps
17:59
<dead_inside>
indeed
17:59
<highvoltage>
that's nothing. I used to have a 48k ZX Spectrum!
17:59
<dead_inside>
ouch
17:59
<talntid>
top - 10:59:19 up 11:52, 28 users, load average: 3.59, 4.93, 8.16
17:59
<dead_inside>
did you use links instead of firefox highvoltage?
18:01
<talntid>
before localapps: http://pastebin.com/0bqkJmXA after localapps: http://pastebin.com/cYJ6St4d
18:01
<alkisg>
I think at that time people downloaded the internet in cassettes and used a text editor to surf
18:01
<talntid>
haha
18:04
wow. load: 2.89, 4.05, 6.97
18:05
looks like that helped a LOT
18:05
thanks guys. :)
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18:17
<talntid>
I'v got a bunch of "ica" stuff running - not sure what that is...
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18:26
<slackish>
talntid: citrix?
18:27
<talntid>
I don't use citrix..
18:27
but my processes show ica...
18:30
<slackish>
italc-client: /usr/bin/ica
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18:34
<H0ax>
Hello all. I have ltsp on debian linux. I boot fluxbox and than xfreerdp to the windows terminal server. Someday the client starts to "beep" if you press any key. You can to type but with annoying beep sound. Restart of the client solves the problem for some time.
18:36
<talntid>
ah, yeah, I did have italc
18:36
I'll delete that
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19:01
<alkisg>
H0ax: they beep in xfreerdp only, in fluxbox too, or in real console too?
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19:06
<||cw>
H0ax: is the thin client only using rdp, or do they do local stuff with fluxbox too?
19:07
most of mine that rdp don't use a window manager/desktop at all, just rdesktop full screen
19:34
<[GuS]>
Hi Guys, is there a way to install User VNC server (http://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/X11VNC) in LTSP?
19:35
<talntid>
http://wiki.centos.org/HowTos/VNC-Server
19:35
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2007-July/001317.html
19:35
https://wiki.edubuntu.org/InstallX11VncOnLtspClients
19:36
if you still have questions, let us know :-)
19:42
<alkisg>
[GuS]: x2go is usually much better than vnc
19:43* talntid notes that
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19:44
<[GuS]>
talntid: seems that you didnt got what i need :P
19:44
<talntid>
hmm?
19:44
<[GuS]>
I need, like i do with x11vnc, to use the current user sesión, not a new vnc server...
19:45
alkisg: ok, i will check that...
19:45
<alkisg>
So why don't you use x11vnc?
19:46
<[GuS]>
alkisg: but how in the thin client?
19:46
<alkisg>
How do you use it in a normal machine?
19:46
There's no difference...
19:47
Are you basically looking for a way to assist your users? Or is it something else?
19:47
<[GuS]>
alkisg: it is, since it will open the connection of the server, instead of the user in the client
19:47
<alkisg>
If x11vnc is ran from the user session, it will show the user desktop
19:48
<[GuS]>
alkisg: i think i am not explaning myself well..
19:48
<alkisg>
Please mention the whole scenario
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19:48
<[GuS]>
alkisg: I use x11vnc with a normal desktop, runing the current user session, and not a new one. So the user can show what is doing in his desktop.
19:49
So, i want to do the same, but in thhis new case, is about a ltsp thin client
19:49
<alkisg>
There's no difference in those 2 cases
19:49
A normal desktop user runs x11vnc. It publishes his desktop in port 5900.
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19:50
<alkisg>
A thin client user runs x11vnc. It publishes his desktop in port 5900 of the server.
19:50
If another port is needed, you can specify it...
19:50
...
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19:51* [GuS] back...
19:52
<[GuS]>
alkisg: if i do that, vnc connects to the current user in the server, and not on the thin client
19:52
<talntid>
alkisg, you are not explaining what the END GOAL is very well.
19:52
er, [GuS]
19:52
<[GuS]>
?
19:53
<alkisg>
[GuS]: you probably have another vnc server running on the server, and don't notice that x11vnc on the client runs in 5901
19:53
[GuS]: run x11vnc on a client and post the last few lines
19:53
<[GuS]>
alkisg: i dont have any other vnc running
19:54
Never mind guys, i keep searching...
19:55
<talntid>
[GuS], you know you have to install the x11server in the chroot of the thin client image, right?
19:55
/opt/ltsp/....
19:56
<alkisg>
No he doesn't
19:56
<[GuS]>
talntid: i dont need to do that...
19:56
<alkisg>
Only if he tries to run it as a localapp, which isn't necessary
19:56
<[GuS]>
exactly....
19:56
<talntid>
right
19:56
<alkisg>
[GuS]: x11vnc -noshm also helps sometimes
19:56
<[GuS]>
As an example, in a normal desktop, i do x11vnc -display :0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth -rfbauth /home/user/.vnc/passwd to start the VNC on the current user sesion
19:57
<alkisg>
But you shouldn't ever be able to run x11vnc from a thin client and see the server screen
19:57
That would be a major security issue
19:57
So you're clearly doing something wrong, but if you don't provide the x11vnc output we can't help
19:58
<[GuS]>
If i issue that same command on the client, will start vnc of course, but in the current user sesion of the server where LTSP lies...
19:58
<alkisg>
The clients don't use gdm to login
19:58
That command makes no sense in LTSP
19:58
And also you shouldn't need to specify the display or xauthority
19:58
<[GuS]>
I know, is why i am asking alkisg howto...
19:59
<alkisg>
Just run x11vnc from the client
19:59
Without specifying anything
19:59
<[GuS]>
alkisg, that will run on current sesion? are you sure?
19:59
<alkisg>
Yes
19:59
<talntid>
that's how I do it.. I don't specify anything..
20:00
<alkisg>
You may only need -noshm, if you try to access that display from another thin client
20:00
or from the server itself
20:00
*if you try to access that VNC display...
20:01
(10:56:57 μμ) [GuS]: As an example, in a normal desktop, i do x11vnc -display :0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth -rfbauth /home/user/.vnc/passwd to start the VNC on the current user sesion ==> also there you don't have to do that
20:01
You only need to run x11vnc
20:01
Maybe you are trying to run that command from somewhere else? From ssh maybe?
20:01
That would explain why running x11vnc is not enough in that case...
20:02
<[GuS]>
Yes, from console..
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20:03
<[GuS]>
Have to go now... thanks.
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20:03
<alkisg>
OK, don't run it from console
20:03
<ogra_>
to late :)
20:03
<alkisg>
two late :P
20:04
<talntid>
three late!
20:04
<dead_inside>
am i late?
20:04
<alkisg>
Nah you're right on time, here, take my sit...
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20:05
<talntid>
seat.
20:09
<dead_inside>
i am sure he did not mean seat, no one could fill alkisg's seat
20:09
he is the ltsp god
20:14
<talntid>
haha
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22:03
<wcchandler>
anybody hear of the raspberry pi? I'm trying to set one up as a thin client...
22:04
I can get it to nfs boot, but I don't think that should be necessary. It *has* to have an sd card to boot... so I might as well keep a lightweight image on there, right?
22:05
there's a nice debian image that I'm going off of but I can't seem to get the ltsp-client stuff to install... :/ and I'm not sure it's really necessary.
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22:06
<wcchandler>
do you guys have any ideas on how to approach this? I feel like I might be going backwards or the wrong way or something :/
22:09
<slackish>
wcchandler: Are you keeping a list of problems and their solutions that you encounter? As soon as I get my pi, I'll be attempting the same thing.
22:09
<wcchandler>
slackish
22:09
yeah, for the most part
22:10
I have a txt doc that I throw stuff on occassionally
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22:11
<wcchandler>
I've built an arm environment on debian squeeze but that was before I realized I might as well just keep the image on the SD card...
22:11
but even then, when I'd boot I got about ~5 different issues that kept it from getting to an LDM
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22:12
<wcchandler>
I hunted down some small things but for the most part I thought I was reinventing the wheel, especially considering somebody already fixed ~80% of these quirks on the released debian image
22:14
right now I'm thinking of installing ltsp-server onto the pi, then mounting the rootfs to /opt/ltsp/armel over nfs and running ltsp-chroot on it or ltsp-build-client or something... then just copy pasting the rootfs onto the SD card
22:15
in theory that should work, right?
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