IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 23 August 2007   (all times are UTC)

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00:26
<mystafa>
hi4all!
00:27
<sn9_>
10x
00:27
<mystafa>
i'am trying to connect printer to the client... when i plug it into server, client see it and print's, but when i unplug it and set it into client it's not working..
00:28
<sn9_>
right
00:28
<mystafa>
can anyone help me to configurate it?
00:28
client support's installing a new printer? or i must install it on a server first>
00:28
?
00:29
<sn9_>
are you sure it's worth it? a printer on the server is considerably easier
00:29
<mystafa>
i see.. but i want to setup it at the client
00:30
but when i plug it on client, it doesn't see
00:30
lts.conf is configured
00:32
oh...someone help me ;-)
00:35
<LaserJock>
haha, it's funny to start up an app on the thin client and see my laptop CPU respond
00:36
<monteslu>
mystafa, which OS, version, etc ?
00:37
<mystafa>
monteslu debian 4, ltsp 5
00:37
<monteslu>
this probably still is valid: http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/handbook/C/ltsp-client.html
00:38
look at the printer variables for a specific client
00:38
<mystafa>
monteslu i read it ;-)
00:38
<monteslu>
then using the cups admin tool, add the printer to that clients IP
00:38
<mystafa>
monteslu don't working...
00:38
<monteslu>
how do you have the printer defined on the server?
00:38
<mystafa>
monteslu should i setup printer at server first?
00:39
monteslu on the server it works
00:39
<monteslu>
it needs to be setup on the server as a printer connected to a print server
00:39
the client becomes the print server
00:40
<mystafa>
hmm... i must setup at the server first, right?
00:40
<monteslu>
well, both :)
00:40
don't need to plug it into the server though
00:40
you've already proven you have right driver and it can print
00:41
<mystafa>
argh... but when i plug it in to a client, server doesn't see it, and dmesg says nothing
00:41
<monteslu>
right, becuase it isn't part of the server's hardware
00:41
<mystafa>
yes..
00:41
and escape?
00:42
<monteslu>
where are you checking dmesg ?
00:42
<mystafa>
on the client and on the server
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00:43
<monteslu>
when you define the printer on the server are you selecting the networking/tcp ip type of printer?
00:43
<mystafa>
no
00:43
as a local
00:43
<monteslu>
you need to, it's not local
00:44
<mystafa>
ok...
00:44
<monteslu>
the server is local, the thin client is remote
00:44
<mystafa>
but!
00:44
<monteslu>
it takes some getting used to :)
00:44
<mystafa>
can i setup it without plugging printer to the server? can i?
00:44
<monteslu>
yup
00:45
<mystafa>
but client doesn't see it ;-) and /dev/usb/lp0 not created
00:45
and server doesn't see it
00:45
when i plug printer to the client
00:45
<monteslu>
are you running a SCREEN_8=shell or simlilar so that you're actually on the client's command line?
00:46
if you pull up a console from within X, you are still on the server
00:46
even though you're typing on the client
00:46
<mystafa>
no... in lts.conf i don't write any SCREEN's options
00:46
<monteslu>
ok, now we're getting somewhere
00:47
<mystafa>
?
00:47
<monteslu>
when you log in from a thin client and pull up a command line, you're actually on the server
00:47
<mystafa>
should i write to the lst.conf SCREEN_8=shell?
00:48
<monteslu>
wait, lemme double check that syntax
00:48
<mystafa>
ok
00:48
<monteslu>
SCREEN_08=shell
00:48
do that for that client
00:48
<mystafa>
i must put it in to lts.conf?
00:48
<monteslu>
yup
00:48
<mystafa>
ok...will try
00:49
<monteslu>
restart the client after your done
00:49
<mystafa>
ok.
00:49
i have a one question - for what it?
00:50
<monteslu>
it should come back up looking normal, but then you'll be able to use ctrl-alt-f8 to actually be on the client's OS
00:50
if you just log in graphically everything you see is coming from the server
00:51
you can also use ctrl-alt-f7 to get back to the graphical log in
00:51* mystafa rebooting the client
00:52
<mystafa>
wah... now i can't login in console ;-)
00:52
<monteslu>
and I'm not sure /dev/usb/lp0 will be the right one, it might be something like /dev/usblp0
00:52
<mystafa>
i think about it
00:52
<monteslu>
well, I'm going off what I know about edubuntu, some things could be slighlty different
00:53
you can always undo the change to lts.conf and reboot the thin client
00:53
<mystafa>
monteslu i'am connected as root in console
00:53
tty8
00:53
<monteslu>
good
00:53
<mystafa>
what should i do now?
00:53
try to install?
00:53
<monteslu>
well, no you're actually on the client, check if the printer device is there
00:54
s/no/now
00:54
<mystafa>
ok..
00:54
<monteslu>
and you can check dmesg too
00:55
<mystafa>
connected
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00:55
<mystafa>
as devlp0
00:55
as you say
00:55
not as /dev/usb/lp0 ;-)
00:55
what should i do now?
00:55
startx and configured it?
00:55
<monteslu>
fix that in lts.conf
00:56
<mystafa>
ok
00:56
khm.. but i have it in /dev/usb/lp0 =)))
00:57
<monteslu>
then reboot the client, then add the printer as a network printer, and print
00:57
<mystafa>
ok.. i will try
00:58
i have another one question
00:58
when i write SCREEN_8=shell
00:58
<monteslu>
well, I'm not sure of the the actual /dev entry, that stuff seems to be different in different distos and kernel versions
00:58
<mystafa>
i can't login
00:58
should i write SCREEN_0=startx>
00:58
?
00:59
<monteslu>
maybe SCREEN_07=ldm
00:59
<mystafa>
ok..
00:59
but why i can't login on the console?
00:59
<monteslu>
that stuff could be different between distros
00:59
<mystafa>
by the root, and by the user
00:59
<monteslu>
becuase its just the OS on the thin client
00:59
<mystafa>
ok..
01:00
<monteslu>
its just used to connect to the server
01:00
<mystafa>
trying to reboot
01:00
<monteslu>
the printing stuff should probably be better documented :)
01:00
<mystafa>
yeah ;-)
01:01
i will write a wiki ;-) on russian ;-)
01:01
<monteslu>
do english too!
01:02
<mystafa>
ok! ;-)
01:03
<sn9_>
i could help with the русским переводом, if you'd like
01:04
<mystafa>
gnome-cups-manager doesn't see it :(
01:04
01:04
<monteslu>
mystafa, you sure you selected network printer?
01:04
<sn9_>
can't read that -- it's not utf-8
01:04
<mystafa>
monteslu i don't choose anything write now... i think that cups must see it as local, no?
01:05
sn_9 a tak budet lu4she? ;-)
01:05
<sn9_>
[Wed 22 Aug 2007 10:59:58 PM PDT] ! <mystafa> sn9_ ñïàñèáî (-:
01:05
that's what i saw
01:05
<mystafa>
monteslu ok..i will choose network now
01:06
<sn9_>
and i hate volapük encoding
01:06
<mystafa>
monteslu choose cups or HP? i have a np1020
01:06
sorry hp1020
01:07
<monteslu>
the driver should be the same that you used when you had it connected to the server
01:07
did you get to the screen that asked you for the printer's IP ?
01:07
<mystafa>
monteslu a host? yes i have it... should i write IP of client?
01:08
<monteslu>
yup
01:08
does it have a port number listed?
01:08
<mystafa>
yeah... 9100
01:08
<monteslu>
perfect
01:09
<mystafa>
doesn't print :(
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01:11
<monteslu>
mystafa, probably something about the device setup in lts.conf
01:11
you may need to wait for the debian expert to get here
01:11
or switch to edubuntu
01:11
<mystafa>
should i setup printer as CUPS(IPP)?
01:11
i set up it as HP
01:12
<monteslu>
no, the thin clients just use tcp/ip like a regular print server
01:13
I can't remeber the name of the guy doing the debian work, but ask maybe ogra or sbalneav or jammcq
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01:14
<mystafa>
monteslu ok... thank you!
01:14
<monteslu>
wish I could help more
01:14
<mystafa>
very very much ;)
01:14
<monteslu>
lemme know if you get it working, I'm always in here
01:14
<mystafa>
monteslu ok!
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02:32
<ogra>
sn9_, hey ...the current squashfs image in gutsy is currently 148M big how small do you need it (we simply dont focus on diskspace but it should be easy to cut down by just removing stuff from the chroot and updating the image)
02:38
<sn9_>
if you could get it that size without compression, that would be something
02:38
resorting to unionfs is quite kludgy
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02:42
<ogra>
well
02:43
getting a usable ubuntu commandline system will at least need 80-100M uncompressed
02:43
and bewfore you moan, recent debians are not smaller either :)
02:44
<sn9_>
an ltsp client system does not need to be usable beyond being able to use the ltsp client
02:44
<ogra>
(and i doubt you would get a redhat in a smaller footprint with recent versions of the packages)
02:44
<sn9_>
X -query, and the like
02:44
<ogra>
well, we rely on the hardware detection and autofonfiguration features of the distro with ltsp5
02:45
so all tools to do that need to be around
02:45
we also want a 100% upgradeable client setup, so not using standard packages is a big nono
02:46
security upgrades etc need to be possible
02:46
<sn9_>
the server can be told what hardware the clients have. autodiscovery is nice, but not crucial
02:46
<ogra>
that indeed pushes the requirements
02:46
<sn9_>
standard packages are a must, i agree
02:46
<ogra>
well, after all its only diskspace
02:46
<sn9_>
just not as many of them
02:47
<ogra>
you are the first person i see in my 2.5 years of ltsp development i do now thats complaining about that
02:47
so its notr a common thing ;)
02:47
but solvable easily ...
02:47
<mystafa>
ogra!!
02:48
;) i'am so glad to see ya
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02:48
<mystafa>
can you help me to plug ma printer to the client (debian 4.0 + ltsp 5)
02:48
?
02:49
<ogra>
sn9_, pull a tarball and just drop everything you dont need and thats not kept in by a dependency ... the amount of time you will invest wont be higher than building LBE
02:49
<sn9_>
i will see how small i'll be able to make T2
02:49
T2 looks like it might be a suitable LBE replacement
02:49
<ogra>
and i'd really suggest to take a look at the squashfs solution
02:50
it saves you 30-50% space
02:50
and acts about twoce as fast as nfs in the current implementation we use in the recent ltsp
02:50
*twice
02:50
<sn9_>
i considered it even before i knew i couldn't still use LBE
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02:51
<ogra>
mystafa, you should only need to add PRINTER_0_DEVICE=<your_printer_device_here> to your lts.conf that should suffice
02:51
<sn9_>
the squashfs would still be exported over nfs, no?
02:51
<ogra>
no
02:51
we use nbd
02:51
<sn9_>
nbd?
02:52
<ogra>
we used nbd since over a year for swapping and didnt see any stability issues yet, so the squashfs uses that as well
02:52
one less port you need open on the server :)
02:52
nbd == network block devices
02:52
<sn9_>
oh
02:53
<ogra>
its bad for failover setups though since its not stateless ... so we kept the option to easily switch back to nfs
02:53
<sn9_>
that changes everything
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02:53
<ogra>
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWithoutNFS
02:54
<sn9_>
of course, squashfs isn't upgradeable, either
02:55
<mystafa>
ogra i interested how setup printer after plugging... cause in console, at the client i see it, and have a /dev/usb/lp0... but what next? do - localhost:631?
02:55
<ogra>
that should be /dev/usblp0 not /dev/usb/lp0 (in the lts.conf at least)
02:56
sn9_, ltsp-update-image does that for us
02:56
<sn9_>
wonderful
02:56
<mystafa>
ogra ok...i will set it. but what i need do next?
02:56
<ogra>
sn9_, atm we still keep the client chroot in /opt/ltsp/i386 ...
02:57
<sn9_>
and is all this possible with feisty, too? or is gutsy required?
02:57
<ogra>
so we can do changes in tehre and quickly rebuild the image from it
02:57
<mystafa>
ogra must i set in the lts.conf module = usblp?
02:57
<ogra>
thats gutsy only
02:57
<sn9_>
:(
02:57
<ogra>
the changes are to massive to quickly backport then
02:57
*them
02:57
mystafa, thats ltsp5 ?
02:57
<mystafa>
yeah
02:58
<sn9_>
but you said nbd was there for a year
02:58
<ogra>
you shouldnt need to do anything beyond setting the device in lts.conf to /dev/usblp0
02:58
<mystafa>
only /dev/usblp0? and what about PRINTER_0_TYPE = U?
02:58
<ogra>
that will export the printer via jetdirect to port 9100 of the thin client
02:58
<mystafa>
great..
02:58
<ogra>
you dont need TYPE ...
02:58
<mystafa>
goood
02:58
and go to the browser set up by CUPS?
02:59
<ogra>
in your user session, open the tool to configure printers and add a new one ... püoint to the IP of the client (you should see that in the bottom right corner in the login manager) and yoiu should be fine
03:00
<mystafa>
ogra thank you very much! i will try it now
03:00
IP:9100?
03:00
<ogra>
i'm working on some hal integration for printers for the next release ... then you wont have to do anything but plug it in dsuring a session and it will get autoconfigured
03:00
yeah, <IP>:9100
03:01
i think thin client hal integration will be my big project for gutsy+1 :)
03:09
<mystafa>
ogra when i'am running gnome-cups-manager... it says to choose: cups(ipp),windows(smb),unix(lpd) or HPjetdirect... i should choose CUPS?
03:10
<ogra>
"<ogra> that will export the printer via jetdirect to port 9100 of the thin client"
03:11
<mystafa>
and? ;-) what choose?
03:11
<ogra>
read my sentence again ?
03:11
find the matching words ....
03:11
<mystafa>
ok... hpjetdirect? ;-)
03:11
ok ok ;)
03:11
<ogra>
yeah ;)
03:13
<mystafa>
msut i reboot the client?
03:13
must*
03:13
<ogra>
no
03:13
you should be able to print a testpage from gnome-cups-manager
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03:15
<mystafa>
ogra nothing at all :( he says that testpage is sended, and that's all
03:16
<ogra>
the IP is the right one ?
03:16
and you picked the right printer driver ?
03:16
<mystafa>
yes. ip-adress of client. yeah..
03:17
<ogra>
did you reboot the client since you added the lts.conf entry ?
03:17
<mystafa>
i downloaded it from official site... debian have some problems with hp1020
03:17
yeah
03:17
<ogra>
for reading that a reboot is needed ...
03:17
<mystafa>
i will say what i have in lts.conf
03:17
<ogra>
!pastebot
03:17
<ltspbot_>
ogra: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
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03:19
<ltsppbot>
"mystafa" pasted "LOCAL_APPS = Y SCREEN_8 = shel" (1 line) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/285
03:19
<mystafa>
agrh
03:20
not all ;)
03:20
SCREEN_7 = startx MODULE_02 = "usb-storage" MODULE_03 = "sd_mod" LOCALDEV = Y PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0
03:28
may be i must set SCREEN_7=shell for printing?
03:28
it's says here http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/handbook/C/ltsp-client.html
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03:36
<ogra>
no
03:37
as the comment says, its for a headless printserver
03:37
(SCREEN_07=shell will keep X from starting)
03:38
<mystafa>
i can not remove this line in my conf?
03:38
<ogra>
btw, localdev isnt supported if you use insecure stuff like SCREEN_07=startx
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03:39
<ogra>
you dont need to load usb-storage and sd_mod, udev will care for that
03:39
<mystafa>
i see it now ;-) what should i do? set SCREEN_05=startx?
03:39
ok
03:39
<ogra>
nothing
03:39
dont use startx at all
03:39
<mystafa>
in that way i can't startx
03:39
<ogra>
ldm will start
03:39
which is our default display manager
03:40
startx will use XDMCP ... which means passwords go in cleartwxt through xyour network ... even my mother could sniff them for there with a 10 minute intorduction
03:40
<mystafa>
ok.. what we have at the end? LOCAL_APPS = Y SCREEN_8 = shell LOCALDEV = Y PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0
03:41
<ogra>
btw, your lts.conf has no liebreaks ?
03:41
*linebraks
03:41
<mystafa>
have
03:41
it has it
03:41
<ogra>
ok
03:41
<mystafa>
it's not normal?
03:42
erase it?
03:42
<ogra>
no
03:42
<mystafa>
emm...
03:42
<ogra>
but you paste oit without linebreaks all the time, that made me wionder
03:42
<mystafa>
stop ;)
03:42
i have linebreaks ;)
03:42
<ogra>
it needs a [default] section as well (above the variables)
03:42
<mystafa>
it have it
03:43
i will remove linebreaks
03:43
<ogra>
only leave PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0
03:43
no!
03:43
<mystafa>
ok...
03:43
<ogra>
dont remove linebreaks, its fine
03:43
<mystafa>
ok
03:43
<ogra>
just wipe all the other stuff
03:43
<mystafa>
but what about #comments?
03:44
can i leave it?
03:44
<ogra>
LOCALDEV should default to True anyway, LOCAL_APPS isnt supported at all ... the ODULE liens are moot since udev cares ... the only line thats really useful in your file is the PRINTER_0_DEVICE
03:44
sure
03:44
comments are fine
03:44
<mystafa>
ok...will try now
03:45
lts.conf is set an root:root it's normal?
03:46
<ogra>
yup
03:46* mystafa rebootinf the client
03:46
<mystafa>
*rebooting (-:
03:48
now i don't have a console
03:48
only X at starting
03:49
but LOCALDEV is really working ;)
03:50* mystafa trying to print
03:50
<ogra>
you can set SCREEN_02=shell
03:50
<mystafa>
ok
03:50
<ogra>
that will ive you a shell on second console
03:50
<mystafa>
printing not working at all :(
03:51
<ogra>
is that a plain etch, or did you build from the backported packages ?
03:51
<mystafa>
lstp-buid-client from backport
03:51
<ogra>
could be that the original etch packages didnt have the jetpipe printer tool included
03:51
it should be there then
03:52
<mystafa>
may be i have some net problems? with access to this port?
03:52
<ogra>
ls /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/sbin/jetpipe
03:52
does that return anything ?
03:52
<mystafa>
one sex pls
03:52
wah ;)
03:52
<ogra>
heh
03:52
<mystafa>
sec*
03:52
;))
03:53
return this line
03:56
ypu know... when i set SCREEN_2=shell the X don't start
03:57
<ogra>
thats a debian bug then ... it should start
03:57
<mystafa>
ok..
03:58
<ogra>
try to set: SCREEN_02=shell and SCREEN_07=ldm then
03:58
<mystafa>
what i should do with printing? it's not working yet :(
03:58
ok
03:58
<ogra>
one piece at a time :)
03:58
<mystafa>
;-)))
03:58
ok
03:58
<ogra>
lets see that we get you proper X and shell access
03:58
the lets debug ;)
03:59
<mystafa>
oh ;-)
03:59
you know... i think that i know where problem
04:00
you see...when i'am going as root on the client,i have SOUND,when a login as client sound is off
04:00
i think that problem it rights
04:00
on some files or conf
04:01
what do you think?
04:01
<ogra>
one piece at a time :)
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04:01
<mystafa>
ok ;-)
04:01* mystafa booting with new lts.conf
04:01
<ogra>
good
04:02
<mystafa>
X is started... but i have some problems with console
04:03
it logins as root, but when you say any command, it's think that i'am trying tot log in
04:04
<ogra>
weird
04:04
<mystafa>
;-)
04:04
<ogra>
ok, other approach ... remove both SCREEN_XX lines again
04:04
<mystafa>
ok
04:05
<ogra>
then issue the following (as root on the server):
04:05
chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
04:05
<mystafa>
one sec
04:05
<ogra>
that will set a rootpw in the thin client
04:05
<mystafa>
must i reboot the client? i reboot it now ;)
04:05
<ogra>
then reboot the client, tty1 should have a login prompt ...
04:06
there log in as root with the password you just set
04:06* mystafa set new passwd and rebooting
04:06
<mystafa>
it's started X ;)
04:07
to which tty i should go?
04:07
one ;-)
04:07
i see
04:07
sorry ;)
04:07
logged!!
04:07
what next?
04:08
<ogra>
ps ax|grep jetpipe
04:09
see if jetpipe runs at all for the printer
04:10
<mystafa>
yes..
04:10mikkel has joined #ltsp
04:10
<ogra>
its running ?
04:10
<mystafa>
it says /dev/usblp0 9100
04:10
<ogra>
great
04:10
<mystafa>
i think so ;)
04:10
<ogra>
so the client side is fine then
04:10
<mystafa>
wooh
04:10
;-)
04:11
<ogra>
if you run ifconfig, does the IP match what you have set in gnome-cups-manager ?
04:11
<mystafa>
yes
04:11
address is right
04:11
<ogra>
hmm, then it must be the driver
04:11
the transport seems to be fine all over
04:11
<mystafa>
must i'll try to log in as a user and try to print?
04:12
<ogra>
from a desktop session, yes
04:12
<mystafa>
ok
04:12
may be reinstall printer
04:12
?
04:12Egyptian[Home] has joined #ltsp
04:12
<ogra>
you can try that, not sure about the debian setup for HP printers, in ubuntu it "just works" :)
04:12Egyptian[Home1 has quit IRC
04:13
<ogra>
probably you need hplip installed on the server to have the right drivers around
04:13
thats something ubuntu has by default
04:14
<mystafa>
not working...
04:14
mmm..
04:14
you know
04:14
i reinstall the firmware on the server
04:14
and it's works
04:14
but not do this on client
04:14
should i?
04:15
<ogra>
yeah, install it in the chroot
04:15
<mystafa>
the default firmware has a bug... and ubuntu has it too ;)
04:15
<ogra>
chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 (as root)
04:15
<mystafa>
mmm
04:15
<ogra>
then install what you want ...
04:15
if you are done, hit ctrl-d
04:15
<mystafa>
ok!
04:16
<ogra>
thats the way to modify your thin client install
04:18
<mystafa>
chroot takes me to the client side, right?
04:18
i can give this command from server,yes?
04:20* mystafa says `yes` ;-)
04:25
<ogra>
yeah
04:25
you need to run it on the server
04:26
all you will have on a booted client is readonly or tmpfs, it will vanish on next reboot :)
04:29ari_stress has joined #ltsp
04:31
<mystafa>
ogra hm.. i can't do `apt-cdrom add` at the client
04:32
it says that can't mount.. but it mount it. i can see cd-rom at the desktop
04:32
<ogra>
weird, works here
04:32
you probably need to mount /proc in the chroot
04:32
(and unmount it again before you exit it)
04:34
<mystafa>
with which options i must mount it?
04:35
<ogra>
mount -t proc proc /proc
04:35
and later umount /proc (dont forget that before hitting ctrl-d)
04:36
<mystafa>
ok
04:36* ogra goes afk for a while
04:37
<mystafa>
ogra thank you very much!
04:40Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC
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04:52
<mystafa>
how i can copy all stuff which i have on a server to the client? i can't compile sources ;-)
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05:32
<mystafa>
hm... how i can mount cdrom at the client? i see it in a desctop, but not see in /media
05:32
and /etc/fstab is clear
05:32
what should i do?
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05:38
<Envite>
Hola a todos desde España
05:38
<mystafa>
Hola!
05:38
(-^
05:43
<Envite>
Hola :)
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05:47
<mystafa>
mounting of /proc doesn't help
06:02Q-FUNK has quit IRC
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06:17
<mystafa>
anybody here?
06:19
oh :(
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06:53* ogra sends summoning thoughts in sbalneav's direction
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07:01
<jakobsg>
How can I see who is logged on which clients in LTSP 5
07:02
Like I could with LTSP 4.2 with the w command
07:02
<ogra>
jakobsg, in ubuntu/edubuntu just use thin-client-manager
07:02highvoltage has joined #ltsp
07:02
<jakobsg>
ogra, I'm using kubuntu, but I guess it should still work
07:02
<ogra>
sure
07:03
<jakobsg>
Can I see it from the commandline aswell
07:03
<ogra>
(someone pinged me about writing a QT frontend for it for gutsy+1 ;) )
07:03
<jakobsg>
cool
07:04
<ogra>
there is python-tcm (teh backend), that could give you userlists like they appear in the UI ... and you can indeed grep through the processlist for LTSP client and wrap your own scripts around it
07:04
<jakobsg>
Mostly I manage the LTSP server remotely by ssh, it would be nice if there was a w - like command
07:04
<ogra>
*LTSP_CLIENT i meant
07:05
<jakobsg>
yes, I know, just w and last commands are nice to have
07:06
<ogra>
well, ssh doesnt use any ttys for security reasons ... the w command only checks for tty based logins afaik
07:06
reven though it seems to work fine with the new ldm in gutsy
07:06
<jakobsg>
OK, thanks
07:07
<ogra>
but we changed the login procedure with that so its completely different to feisty ...
07:09
<jakobsg>
OK, that will be interesting. I'm soon gonna be looking at a solution for making usb devices appear on the desktop in kde
07:10
<ogra>
you will need to havk up ltspfsmounter for that i guess
07:10
*hack
07:10
i'm working on a proper siolution so KDE can have the same love as gnome gets atm, but that wont be there before gutsy+1
07:10
<jakobsg>
I need to know if there is gonna be any change in the udev/fuse approach used at the moment
07:10
<ogra>
http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/ltspfs-hal-root.png
07:10
no
07:10
that part wont change
07:11
i will change the server sided stuff a lot and create virtual hal devices instead of bind mounting the ltspfs dirs into /media (since KDE and xfce dont monitor /media properly as gnomevfs does)
07:12
but we wont change udev and ltspfs on the client side
07:12
<jakobsg>
OK, that's nice. Is that a hal approach working
07:12
<ogra>
its only a fake device for ltspfs .. it will become the root device for all ltspfs mounts later
07:13
<EXP2>
i have investigated my problem with invisible mouse pointer. It happens only those machines that have nvidia graphics. there is a possible solution to that by making a custom xorg.conf to those clients, but how can i do it?
07:13
<ogra>
EXP2, thats ubuntu or debian ?
07:14
note that in ubuntu the restricted modules arent installed, it could be that the binary nvidia driver works better there
07:14
<EXP2>
ubuntu 6.06/4.2 and 7.04/5 both have same problem
07:14
<ogra>
you would need to install linux-rerstricted-modules in the chroot and add XSERVER=nvidia to your lts.conf
07:15
but note, the restricted modules mount a tmpfs that will eat 15M of your ram (teh reason why we dont have it in teh default client install)
07:15
<EXP2>
ok
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08:01
<klausade>
can I use a ltsp5 client as printserver like with ltsp4.2?
08:01
<ogra>
sure
08:02
even with less hassle sinc eyou only need PRINTER_X_DEVICE
08:02
no additional options required
08:04
<klausade>
ogra: so I only need PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/lp0 for my parallell printer, and PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0 for usb?
08:05
<ogra>
well, if you have both on there, one should be PRINTER_1_DEVICE
08:05
but yes
08:05
it should start a jetpipe process for every printer
08:06
by default the 0 listens at port 9100, 1 listens on 9101 etc etc
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08:10
<monteslu>
ogra, any idea why print servring for thin clients has become unreliable in ltsp5 ?
08:11
<ogra>
monteslu, id didnt ?
08:11
i havent got a single bug open about it and itr works for me, so it cant :)
08:11
if people file bugs we'll fix them
08:11
<monteslu>
it was rock solid in ltsp4, but the server stops responding after a while in ltsp4
08:12
<ogra>
i dont see such behavior here and havent heard of it yet
08:12
<monteslu>
I thought I was doing something wrong, but just saw a post on the edubuntu list
08:12
<ogra>
if you file a bug we'll look into it ;)
08:12
<monteslu>
I'll help, but there's no docs that I know of on what makes that part work
08:12
and no logs that i can see to help debug
08:13sbalneav has joined #ltsp
08:13
<ogra>
s!
08:13
<monteslu>
but I'll definetly file a bug
08:13
<ogra>
monteslu, thanks
08:13
<sbalneav>
Morning everyone!!!!!!
08:13
Ogra!!
08:13
<ogra>
monteslu, i think sbalneav did some work on jetpipe, but that was related to something else
08:13
<monteslu>
no worries, sorry if it came out condescending about the print system :)
08:13
<sbalneav>
How's it going dude!
08:13
<monteslu>
waddup scott
08:13
<ogra>
sbalneav, you just threw away all my inputattach code, sniff
08:14
<sbalneav>
what?
08:14
For which?
08:14
<ogra>
it was in the configure_x function of the initscript ... a bit hidden
08:14
for serial mice
08:14
<sbalneav>
Oh!
08:14
Well, it wasn't being called, I just figured I'd clean up.
08:14
<ogra>
actually i even think we shouldnt have the MOUSE related stuff in configure-x.sh at all
08:15
<sbalneav>
sorry.
08:15joris_ has quit IRC
08:15
<ogra>
nah :)
08:15
my fault, i wanted to move it out of that function since ages :)
08:15
<sbalneav>
I thought all of that had moved to the uber-sexy configure-x.sh
08:15
Hey, one problem I ran into with configure-x.sh, with the thincan.
08:15
<ogra>
tell me
08:16
<sbalneav>
the Xorg -configure dies on it, which is ok, we can't expect everything to work...
08:16
but the script hangs at that point on a grep, with nothing but an "aborted" message.
08:16
<ogra>
meh
08:16subir has quit IRC
08:17
<ogra>
btw ...
08:17
<sbalneav>
We should probably wrap the Xorg -conf in a status check, and issue a nice message.
08:17
<ogra>
ogra@laptop:/media/disk-2/isos/edubuntu$ apt-cache search openchrome|grep xserver
08:17
xserver-xorg-video-openchrome - X.Org X server -- VIA display driver
08:17
:D
08:17
for the T1220
08:17
<monteslu>
is jetpipe the server app for print serving ?
08:18
<ogra>
monteslu, jetpipe is just making /dev/lp<something> available on port 9100
08:18
its about 10 lines of code
08:18
<monteslu>
hmm.. so no loggin then?
08:18
<ogra>
(the license in the code is longer than the program itself ;) )
08:18
<monteslu>
logging rather
08:18
<ogra>
well, its a python script
08:18
if it dies it should thow out a traceback
08:19
<monteslu>
where does it throw it to?
08:19
<ogra>
you might be able to see it on conmsole on the client while it happens
08:19
not sure though
08:19
<sbalneav>
Yep, jetpipe's the one.
08:19
<monteslu>
nothing being displayed
08:19
<ogra>
nbeyoind that you can start it manually as well from client console and wait until it dies
08:19
<monteslu>
port 9100 just quits responding
08:20
cool, I'll try that
08:20
<ogra>
just run it with: jetpipe <device> 9100
08:20ari_stress2 has quit IRC
08:22
<monteslu>
unfortunately I'm not at the school yet, but will be in about an hour.
08:22
<sbalneav>
ogra: Does most of the cleanup/organizing work I've done seem sane?
08:22
<ogra>
sbalneav, yup, great work
08:23
<sbalneav>
I'm not expecting much to change now, other than bugfixes.
08:23
<ogra>
even though i have linewraps everywhere now :P
08:23
<sbalneav>
You don't like lines to break at 79?
08:23* ogra uses to work on a fullscreen terminal window at 1024x768 ... no 80 char width here :)
08:23
<monteslu>
ogra, do I have to be approved on the group to be able to file a bug?
08:24
<ogra>
sbalneav, i'm joking, thanks for sorting that :)
08:24
<sbalneav>
Oh, you're one of *THOSE* poeple :)
08:24
<ogra>
yeah
08:24
liewraps are for ipaq users :P
08:24
<sbalneav>
Ooooohhh, them's figtin' words :)
08:24
err
08:24
fighting, even
08:25
<ogra>
monteslu, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+filebug doesnt work for you ?
08:25
<sbalneav>
I still got an 80x24 wyse character terminal in my office here. If it won't display on that, it ain't proper code :)
08:26
hehehe
08:26
<ogra>
heh
08:26
<monteslu>
ogra, there's no link to that page on launchpad
08:26
<sbalneav>
Actually, want to know the VERY FIRST terminal I ever logged into a Unix box on?
08:26
<ogra>
where did you look ?
08:26
<sbalneav>
Decwriter III
08:26
<ogra>
thats a pin printer ?
08:26
with keyboard ?
08:27
<sbalneav>
http://vt100.net/docs/tp83/chapter14.html
08:27
yep.
08:27
hardcopy baby, oh yeah.
08:27
<monteslu>
nevermind, there's already a few bug reports
08:27
<ogra>
whee
08:27
<monteslu>
and a fix on 8/8/2007
08:27
<ogra>
save the trees !
08:27
<sbalneav>
This was '83
08:27
<ogra>
monteslu, bug # ?
08:28
<monteslu>
130472 110609
08:28
<ogra>
i know sbalneav did some jetpipe fixing, but that didnt seem related
08:30
you didnt say it dies on the first page
08:30
<monteslu>
only been printing one page at a time :)
08:31
<ogra>
heh, ok
08:31
i should also have asked for your definition of unreliable ;)
08:31
try the fix from the bugs and see if it helps
08:32
the second has some code in it afaik
08:32
<monteslu>
will do.
08:32
this stuff doesn't cant get added to 7.04 ?
08:34
<ogra>
unlikely
08:34
will depend on my time
08:34
which gets less and less with every release
08:35norita has joined #ltsp
08:37
<ogra>
sbalneav, btw, see that ? http://system76.com/product_info.php?cPath=29&products_id=62
08:37
<monteslu>
ok, replied to the list with the 2 links to launchpad
08:37
<sbalneav>
WOW
08:37
COOL
08:37
Edubuntu pre-installed.
08:37
\o/ for system 76
08:37
<ogra>
someone should tell them to offer a second NIC for the edubuntu option :)
08:37
<sbalneav>
heh
08:38
<norita>
Hi, Ogra, I just wanted to thank you for your help (yesterday you told me about alsa and dsp). Now it works :-)
08:38
<ogra>
now they only need to seel clients as well and we can recommend bundled products to schools ;)
08:38
<sbalneav>
Oooh, one other thing we need to solve as a quick bug...
08:38
<ogra>
norita, \o/
08:38
<sbalneav>
In the ltsp_config script, for setting up the default SERVER variable.
08:39K_O-Gnom has joined #ltsp
08:39
<sbalneav>
We scan /proc/mounts for nfs, and extract the ip address from there, but that doesn't work for nbd mounts.
08:39
<ogra>
oh, right, thats mdz's old code
08:39DonSilver has quit IRC
08:39
<sbalneav>
so you just end up with the default 0.254 address.
08:39
<ogra>
yeah
08:39
<sbalneav>
Want me to dig into that today?
08:40
<ogra>
i remember he initially used /proc/commandline for it...
08:40
if you like to :)
08:40
i'm busy testing
08:40
<sbalneav>
Sure, I'll figure something out.
08:40
yeah, you concentrate on tr5
08:41
once that's out of the way, we'll pull in all my stuff, and test the snot out of it.
08:41
<ogra>
well, my amd64 is broken since some time, so i'll only be able to do server and desktop for x86
08:41
yeah
08:41
i'll do a big merge on the weekend
08:41
throw it at the wall and see if it sticks :)
08:43
<sbalneav>
bwahaha
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08:56
<Gadi>
ogra: ping
08:57SORMANOV has joined #ltsp
08:57
<SORMANOV>
hello all
08:57
how much LTSP clients can a 10/100 Ethernet network support ?
08:58mikkel has quit IRC
08:59
<sbalneav>
!sizing
08:59
<ltspbot_>
sbalneav: Error: "sizing" is not a valid command.
08:59
<sbalneav>
!topics
08:59
<ltspbot_>
sbalneav: "topics" is To get a list of topics, type ltspbot: factoids search --values
08:59
<sbalneav>
ltspbot_: factoids search --values
08:59
<ltspbot_>
sbalneav: 'ltsp', 'sbalneav', 'icewm', 'frappr', 'wiki', 'debian', 'edubuntu', 'dhcpd', 'greyscreen', 'ltsp42', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'checklist', 'muekow', 'bestltspdistro', 'serversize', 'wireless', 'sound', 'topics', 'integration', 'lts.conf', 'pastebot', 'bootfloppy', 'ltsp5', 'tarball', 'download', 'monkeys', 'ogra', 'nfs', 'nfsnotresp', 'js', 's', (1 more message)
08:59
<sbalneav>
ah
08:59
!serversize
08:59
<ltspbot_>
sbalneav: "serversize" is http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/ServerSizing
09:00
<sbalneav>
SORMANOV: see that page, basically, the answer is: it depends.
09:00
If you're just doing word processing, and a little light web browsing, answer is: a lot.
09:01
I run 100 meg switches, and I run 40 terminals on them.
09:01
<Gadi>
sbalneav: hey
09:01
morning
09:01
<sbalneav>
Hey gadi
09:01
<Guaraldo>
morning.
09:01
<sbalneav>
How's it going?
09:01
<SORMANOV>
sbalneav, how much switches ?
09:01
<Gadi>
you wouldn't happen to have a few mins to test something for me, would you?
09:02
<sbalneav>
I could try, but here at work I don't have a gutsy box set up, but I'll do what I can, sure!
09:02
SORMANOV: I gang together 2 24 port switches.
09:03muh2000 has quit IRC
09:03
<Gadi>
well, I just need an LTSP server (that you can manipulate) and 2 clients (virtual or otherwise)
09:04
I would like you to set a very small range of IPs in dhcpd.conf for only 2 workstations
09:04
boot the 2 workstations to a login screen
09:04
and then cycle the power on one of them and see if it boots
09:04
<sbalneav>
ok, I'll see what I can do.
09:04
<Gadi>
let me know if that is something you can try for me
09:04
thanks
09:05
<sbalneav>
dhcpd eating leases?
09:05
<Gadi>
well, I am trying to track down a bug that is rearing its head again for me
09:05muh2000 has joined #ltsp
09:05
<Gadi>
this is on a ltsp4 deployment, but it prolly doesnt matter
09:05
<sbalneav>
ok, I'll pop down to our training room in 5, and run that. You gonna be around for 1/2 hour?
09:06
<Gadi>
the dhcp server sees the first dhcp request as coming from a different client than the second
09:06
and when the second lease is active, and the client reboots, it wont issue a PXE lease
09:06
even to the same client
09:06
--> yes, I'll be here
09:07cliebow has quit IRC
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09:12
<sbalneav>
ok, heading down now.
09:12
<Gadi>
thx, sbalneav
09:19
<monteslu>
beat you by twenty minutes to the list, sbalneav :)
09:19
...though you actually did the fix
09:20cliebow has joined #ltsp
09:36
<sbalneav>
Gadi: OK, done.
09:36
Here's what I did:
09:36
Ubuntu 6.10 server
09:36
Stock dhcpd.conf, except for range 20-21
09:37
stopped dhcp server
09:37
cleaned out /var/lib/dhcp3
09:37
started server
09:37
no leases existing
09:37
turned on two terminals
09:37
both booted.
09:37
cycled one, then both.
09:37
both continued to boot.
09:38
3rd terminal couldn't lease an IP.
09:38
Seems expected behaviour here.
09:38
<Gadi>
and none are specified, right?
09:38
<sbalneav>
right.
09:38
pure dynamic.
09:38
<Gadi>
can you send me your dhcpd.conf, dhcpd.leases files and the version of dhcp3-server?
09:39
oh, and is this ltsp4 or 5?
09:39
<sbalneav>
5
09:39
<Gadi>
ok
09:47
sbalneav: you have my email addy, ya?
09:48
<sbalneav>
Gimme it again, just in case
09:48
<Gadi>
gadi@ltsp.org
09:48
<sbalneav>
duh
09:48
<Gadi>
;)
09:49
<sbalneav>
Yesturdae i cuddent evin speel develupir an todae i are 1.
09:50
<Gadi>
lol
09:51
<chupacabra>
lol
09:51
<ogra>
:)
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10:10
<monteslu>
what the command to check the lts config from a client?
10:11
i thought it was ltspconfig or something like that, but I dont see it
10:12
<sbalneav>
getltspcfg -a
10:12
<monteslu>
thatś the one, thanks
10:12
<sbalneav>
getltscfg -a
10:13
sorry, extra p
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10:13
<monteslu>
what does PRINTER_0_TYPE=U do?
10:13
seems like its not necessary
10:15
<sbalneav>
No, the type isn't being used at the moment.
10:16
<monteslu>
there plans to do so?
10:16
<sbalneav>
It used to be used to differentiate serial devices, which needed tty parms, and parallel/usb, which were simpler.
10:17
I did some preliminary stuff on serial printers, but to be perfectly honest, since we dropped support for them, nobody's squaked.
10:17
<monteslu>
heh, havent used one since 1989
10:17
<ogra>
POS people will want them at some point
10:17
<monteslu>
point of sale, or piece of.... nevermind
10:18
<ogra>
well, they want these little matrix printers and infrared scanners ...
10:18
and ltsp suits them perfectly i guess
10:18
<sbalneav>
yep
10:18
<ogra>
so we should have support for their stuff at some point :)
10:19
<sbalneav>
What I was wondering was is if we could just use the stty command ahead of time.
10:19
so, in the startup, do:
10:20
stty 9600 -parenb blah blah tty stuff > /dev/ttyS0
10:20
then jetpipe /dev/ttyS0 9100
10:20
<staffencasa>
sbalneav, btw... You helped me last week with a Screensaver issue stemming from the --kiosk plugin. I figured out what it was. Metacity wasn't being installed, so I added it to the 000-base configuration file and voila!
10:20
<ogra>
sbalneav, sounds like a good plan :)
10:20
<sbalneav>
Well, it would be simple. Few lines of code at the best.
10:21
Gotta find the time to do it tho' :)
10:21
gutsy +1 :)
10:21
<monteslu>
I could hook that up if you want, been chomping at the bit to do some ltsp development
10:22
thogh I have not serial printer :)
10:23
guess you might want bitrates and whatnot as parms in lts.conf
10:24
<sbalneav>
Well, the old method was kind of bulky, I thought.
10:24
<ogra>
well, we should find the broadest default and go with that, but have options to override
10:24
<sbalneav>
If we were going to do it with tty, I'd like something like:
10:24
<Gadi>
interesting... sbalneav, your leases have 'next binding state free', and mine have 'next binding state expired'....
10:24
also, yours have no uids....
10:25
<sbalneav>
[ -n "$PRINTER_0_STTY" ] && stty $PRINTER_0_STTY $PRINTER_0_DEVICE
10:25
<Gadi>
ogra: initramfs is using klibc's ipconfig to set ip, right?
10:25
<sbalneav>
then people could just say (in lts.conf)
10:25
PRINTER_0_STTY = "blah"
10:25
<ogra>
Gadi, yop
10:25
<sbalneav>
PRINTER_0_DEVICE=/dev/ttyS0
10:25* Gadi wonders if it send uid....
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10:26
<ogra>
sbalneav, why not just check for /dev/ttyS in the variable
10:26
<sbalneav>
That too.
10:26
I'm talking ex-tempore.
10:26
:)
10:26
<ogra>
so you dont need to have PRINTER_0_STTY
10:26
and we put in sane defaults
10:27
<sbalneav>
Well, you'll need something to override the defaults for insane serial devices, but yeah, a standard 9600 8n1 would handle most things.
10:28
For the people with the barcode printer that prints at 300 baud, 7e1 and RTS/CTS handshaking. :)
10:28
<ogra>
indeed, i didnt say we should prevent overriding :)
10:29
<sbalneav>
right, but agreed, a nice sane default for a ttyS would be awesome.
10:30
Then, configuring 3 sane printers would be as easy as: PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/ttyS0, ...1...=/dev/lp ...2..=/dev/usblp0
10:31
SCREEN_07 = shell, and you've got yourself the world's most complicated print server :)
10:32
<monteslu>
screen_07 being ldm made it the most complicated one
10:32
<ogra>
yeah
10:32
you dont like ldm ?
10:32
<monteslu>
I spend a good bit explaining it to someone last night :)
10:34
ldm is fine, itś the print server concept on a thin client that needs a pretty diagram in the docs I think
10:34
<ogra>
ah, right
10:35
<monteslu>
maybe printing in general should get a separate page in the edubuntu handbook ?
10:35
<sbalneav>
Probably should.
10:35
<ogra>
yeah
10:36
<sbalneav>
Please tell me you're volunteering to write it! :)
10:36
<monteslu>
absolutely
10:36
<ogra>
printing in gutsy changed drastically though
10:36
(on the desktop side)
10:36tux_440volt has joined #ltsp
10:36
<monteslu>
dang
10:36
<sbalneav>
Did it?
10:36
<ogra>
gnome-cups-manager is gone
10:36
<monteslu>
what replaces it?
10:36
<sbalneav>
Geez, I haven't even tested a printer in gutsy yet,
10:36
<ogra>
there is a new (pretty scary imoho) tool
10:36
<sbalneav>
What'd they replace it with?
10:37
<ogra>
sytem-config-printer or so is the name
10:37
<sbalneav>
ah, I'll have to check it out.
10:37
<monteslu>
that sounds like a fedora comman
10:37
d
10:38
well, as long as its still cups I can document it
10:38
I aslo want a page for multi-server intalls
10:38
load balancing
10:38
local devices with mutliple servers
10:46
<Gadi>
so, I have been playing with dhcp failover a bunch, and it seems like it is not 100% compatible with diskless nodes. Has anyone here played with it?
10:46
<ogra>
Gadi, dtrask and moquist
10:46
<Gadi>
ah, ok
10:46
<ogra>
actually dtrask just sent a howto to the edubuntu mailing list
10:46
<Gadi>
I know that failover has a prereq of not allowing bootp clients
10:47
it seems the leases in a regular dhcp server have 2 states: active and free
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10:49
<Gadi>
yeah, his range is: range 10.0.7.1 10.0.9.252;
10:49
which is huge
10:49
so, he prolly never sees IP conflicts
10:50
or never runs out of leases
11:01
<monteslu>
dtrask didnt actually post his conf file
11:02
Im still waiting for it
11:02
<ogra>
its in the wiki
11:02
<monteslu>
oops
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11:07
<Gadi>
i think some of my woes stem from the fact that this ltsp4 which makes the dhcp client request with dhcpcd which passes a clientID by default
11:07
I am trying to figure out how to disable that
11:07
I think it confuses the dhcp server
11:07
and evidently, ltsp5/ipconfig does not send a clientID
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11:36
<sbalneav>
brb
11:36sbalneav has quit IRC
11:46
<sn9_>
!monkeys
11:46
just wondering...
11:46
!s
11:46
<ltspbot>
sn9_: "monkeys" is SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
11:46
sn9_: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
11:48sbalneav has joined #ltsp
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11:55
<vagrantc_>
ltspbot: factoids search --values
11:55
<ltspbot>
vagrantc_: 'ltsp', 'sbalneav', 'icewm', 'frappr', 'wiki', 'debian', 'edubuntu', 'dhcpd', 'greyscreen', 'ltsp42', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'checklist', 'muekow', 'bestltspdistro', 'serversize', 'wireless', 'sound', 'topics', 'integration', 'lts.conf', 'pastebot', 'bootfloppy', 'ltsp5', 'tarball', 'download', 'monkeys', 'ogra', 'nfs', 'nfsnotresp', 'js', 's', (1 more message)
11:56
<vagrantc_>
that "1 more message bit" part actually contains lots more entries ...
11:56putty_thing has quit IRC
11:56
<vagrantc_>
!frappr
11:56
<ltspbot>
vagrantc_: "frappr" is a new mapping service using Google maps. There's a map of LTSP users around the world at http://k12ltsp.com
11:58
<vagrantc_>
!js
11:58
<ltspbot>
vagrantc_: "js" is Lumiere!!!!!!!!
12:02
<cliebow_>
heh!
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12:37
<Gadi>
hey, guys - just wanted to report that I think I nailed that dhcp bug
12:37
in ltsp4, dhcpcd issues a clientID by default
12:38
it seems dhcp3-server consequently treats dhcp request #1 and #2 as coming from different clients
12:38
I patched dhcpcd to not send a clientID by default
12:38
and all is better, so far
12:39
so, in case it ever comes up even in ltsp5, never send a clientID with the second dhcp request (ie the one frominitramfs)
12:39
bbiab
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12:50
<sn9_>
Gadi: a much easier way to handle that issue is with class definitions in your dhcpd.conf
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12:53
<Ryudo>
hi all , the terminal mount chroot (/opt/ltsp/i386) over nfs or sshfs ? (LTSP5)
12:56
<Gadi>
sn9_: I have class defs
12:56
doesnt matter
12:56
the only other work around is with specified workstations
12:57
<sn9_>
not really
12:57
<Gadi>
do tell
12:57
<sn9_>
all the clients send the same client-id, right?
12:57
<Gadi>
nope
12:58
every client sends 2 dhcp requests
12:58
1. PXE - no client ID
12:58
2. initramfs - with client ID
12:58
and the default client-id = MAC address
12:59
<sn9_>
the client-id from the initramfs is the MAC?
12:59
<Gadi>
yup - in ltsp4
12:59
because it uses dhcpcd
12:59
which uses MAC addy by default for client id
13:00
<sn9_>
when i ran wireshark on ltsp4, the client-id was the uname
13:00
not the MAC
13:00
<Gadi>
are you thinking class id?
13:00
there is class id and client id
13:00
2 diff things
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13:02
<sn9_>
then ignore the client-id in your dhcpd.conf, and use the class-id, like i did
13:03
<Gadi>
thats not the problem
13:03
its in the way dhcp handles the leases
13:03sepski has quit IRC
13:04
<Gadi>
in any event, its not something you'd notice unless you maxed out your range
13:04
and you had lots of clients rebooting
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13:05
<sn9_>
oh, so it's a performance thing?
13:06
<Gadi>
no. say your range had 5 IPs. and you boot 5 thin clients. All come up fine. But, you go to reboot one of them, and it won't boot - 'no free leases'
13:07
problem is, all leases are taken by clients, in this case the second dhcp client of each thin client
13:07Ryudo has quit IRC
13:07
<Gadi>
when the PXE request comes in from that fifth client, it is seen as a '6th' client
13:07
because it has a different clientID (in this case none) than the one with the lease
13:07
<sn9_>
not using a much wider range than you need is asking for trouble
13:08
<Gadi>
sn9_: yeah, especially if the use case is broken
13:08Blinny has joined #ltsp
13:08
<Gadi>
but, by not passing a clientID the second time, both dhcp requests appear to the server as from the same client
13:09
and the problem is resolved
13:09
in ltsp5, ipconfig is the client and not dhcpcd
13:09
and ipconfig sends no clientID by default
13:09
so, there's no issue
13:09
<Blinny>
I have three LTSP 1225e's from disklessworkstations.com - One that I received a few months ago that I've been testing boots immediately. Two I just ordered & received in the mail take 12 seconds to d/l the tftp kernel.
13:09tux_440volt has quit IRC
13:10
<sn9_>
yes, but editing dhcpd.conf is a much quicker solution than mucking about in dhcpcd
13:10
<Blinny>
Both are etherboot.. and when I wireshark port 69 on the server, the conversation is exactly the same.. just one takes a lot longer.
13:10
<Gadi>
sometimes you dont have the luxury of a boundless range
13:10
:)
13:11
<sn9_>
you have sixteen million clients?
13:12
<Gadi>
sixteen million and three
13:12
but who's counting?
13:12
:)
13:13
<sn9_>
that's still less than 0xfffffc
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13:30
<sbalneav>
ogra: Still around? Got a second to discuss an idea?
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13:54
<Blinny>
Forgive me for trying again
13:54
I have three LTSP 1225e's from disklessworkstations.com - One that I received a few months ago that I've been testing boots immediately. Two I just ordered & received in the mail take 12 seconds to d/l the tftp kernel. Both are etherboot.. and when I wireshark port 69 on the server, the conversation is exactly the same.. just one takes a lot longer, through the same switch port/cable/everything. Anyone know what could cause this?
13:55
<sbalneav>
What are the rev's of etherboot in them?
13:55
<Blinny>
How do I check that?
13:56
<sbalneav>
Durned if I know. jammcq would, though
13:56
<Blinny>
Heh
13:56
lspci shows the same thing, spot-on. I know that's just hardware though.
13:57MeBadMagic has joined #ltsp
13:57
<Blinny>
Ah. Shows in bootup screen.
13:57
Testing
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14:07
<Solifugus>
Question: Does rdesktop work in full-screen mode, over LTSP?
14:08
<vagrantc_>
Solifugus: sure
14:09
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: ok.. because some years ago when I last tried it, it didn't.
14:09
<vagrantc_>
well, maybe i misunderstand what you mean
14:09
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: the screen would work but not keyboard/mouse
14:09
<vagrantc_>
you can configure LTSP to boot directly to rdesktop
14:10
but i honestly have no experience with it. i know people do it.
14:10BadMagic has quit IRC
14:10
<Solifugus>
i suppose i need to try it out...
14:10
<sn9_>
i did it with ltsp4, and will try with 5 asap'
14:11
simple as pi
14:11
<Solifugus>
sn9_: your keyboard/mouse worked using rdesktop in full-screen mode?
14:11
<sn9_>
yes
14:11
<Solifugus>
ok.. that means they must have fixed it at some point (I last tried it about 5 years ago)
14:12
<sn9_>
if they work in X, they work in rdesktop, as rdesktop requires X
14:12
<Solifugus>
sn9_: yes.. but somehow it didn't seem to be using X for keyboard/mouse at that time.. it took them from the server...
14:13bengoa has joined #ltsp
14:13
<Solifugus>
sn9_: back then, evolution didn't work over remote X, either.. certain parts did and many parts didn't...
14:13
sn9_: some developers appearantly coded in ways that were'd exclusively using X.
14:14
s/were'd/were not/
14:14
<sn9_>
that's not really possible
14:14
oh, _not_ exclusively
14:14* vagrantc_ has seen evolution working since 2000 using remote X
14:15
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: seriously? 5 years ago, I had a cyber cafe and it worked on the server, but only partially worked on the LTSP clients.
14:16
<vagrantc_>
Solifugus: i seen it with my own eyes.
14:18
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: ok.. i believe you.. i just wonder why it didn't work for me.
14:18
<vagrantc_>
i've seen precious few X programs that didn't run over remote X ...
14:19
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: now i am making a plan for this organization to migrate their labs to thin clients.. it needs to be on redhat enterprise..
14:19
because they only support windows or redhat enterprise
14:19
<vagrantc_>
features like sound don't work, sure. and maybe performance issues (though rarely)
14:19
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: i had sound working great
14:20
<vagrantc_>
sure, you can get sound working.
14:20
<Solifugus>
recently, i tried edubuntu server but got in a lot of trouble when it automatically started serving dhcp anonymously...
14:20* vagrantc_ patiently awaits RHEL to join the ranks of LTSP5 distros
14:21
<Solifugus>
vagrantc_: what's new and better about ltsp5 ?
14:21
<sbalneav>
!ltsp5
14:21
<ltspbot`>
sbalneav: "ltsp5" is ltsp5 is The next version of LTSP, and the future of Thin Client computing on GNU/Linux. http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Ltsp5
14:21
<vagrantc_>
it inherrits all of the host distro's infrastructure for packages
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14:39
<Blinny>
sbalneav: Yeah, the etherboot revs are the same. So is the bootrom version.
14:39
(it didn't take me that long to test, I just got called away to other matters)
14:39
<sbalneav>
Got me then.
14:40
<Blinny>
K. I'll bug jammcq next time I see him.
14:40
Thanks though.
14:41
Cheers.
14:42Blinny has quit IRC
14:45
<vagrantc>
hub/switch differences ?
14:47Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp
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15:01
<lns>
Hey has anyone had any success with thin-client-manager? I launch mine, with a logged-in LTSP user, and it just locks up - can't do anything, don't see any processes, have to force quit.
15:02
running on Ubuntu Feisty
15:07K_O-Gnom has joined #ltsp
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15:14
<Ryudo>
hi all :D
15:15
anybody know how i make my terminal's autologin in ltsp5 ?
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15:26
<trinity9393>
afternoon all
15:27
<monteslu>
lns, it locks up on me as well with one admin user, but not another
15:27
not sure why yet
15:27
on thing I've seen is you sometimes have to wait a while for it to fully load up
15:28
<sn9_>
corruption in the ~ dir?
15:28
<monteslu>
possibly
15:28
but i didn't even notice a .thin_client_manager folder
15:29
didn't spend a whole lot of time on it yet :)
15:29ltspbot` has quit IRC
15:30
<lns>
hmm
15:30
yeah i see it takes a loooong time for anything to happen
15:30
like ~5-10min
15:31
course i'm runnign the server on a via epia 800mhz board...but still, it shouldn't take that long for a simple program to show status
15:31
even openoffice/ff doesn't lag like that
15:31
<sbalneav>
Ryudo: What are you running? Feisty or gutsy?
15:32
<Ryudo>
feisty
15:34
<sbalneav>
You'll need a replacement ldm
15:34
<trinity9393>
is gutsy the newer version?
15:34
<sbalneav>
!ldm
15:34
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "ldm" is You can find the updated ldm that supports the LDM_DIRECTX parameter for bypassing ssh encryption at http://alburg.net/ldm
15:34
<sn9_>
trinity9393: feisty fawn == 7.04, gutsy gibbon == 7.10
15:34
<sbalneav>
then, on a workstation by workstation basis, you can set LDM_USERNAME and LDM_PASSWORD
15:34
<trinity9393>
ok
15:35
worth upgradeing ?
15:35
<sn9_>
not released yet, btw
15:35
<sbalneav>
Still under development.
15:35
Will be released october
15:36
<trinity9393>
well im asumeing that
15:36
<monteslu>
sbalneav, does LDM_DIRECTX break local devs?
15:36
<lns>
!thin-client-manager
15:36
<ltspbot>
lns: Error: "thin-client-manager" is not a valid command.
15:36
<sbalneav>
monteslu: nope.
15:36
<vagrantc>
monteslu: nope.
15:36
<Ryudo>
sbalneav
15:36
<lns>
anyone have a url for the dev status of thin-client-manager?
15:36
<trinity9393>
but in relation to LTSP is it worth upgradeing?
15:36* vagrantc smiles
15:37
<Ryudo>
the new ldm is writing in C ?
15:37
<trinity9393>
as in what is fixed and what is new
15:37
<sbalneav>
Ryudo: The one in gutsy is, yes.
15:37
<whiprush_>
sbalneav: someone forgot to put all the ltsp improvements in the tribe5 release notes.
15:38
<Ryudo>
http://alburg.net/ldm <=== i replace the old code of feisty LDM for it ?
15:38
<sbalneav>
trinity9393: lots of stuff fixed, and improvements. Check out my tree on launchpad for info.
15:38
Ryudo: yup
15:38
<trinity9393>
becuse right now im doing development on setting up a thin client solution for small business for resale and im running into a lot of issues
15:38
<sbalneav>
make sure you chmod 755 it.
15:38
<Ryudo>
and the parameters LDM_USERNAME and LDM_PASSWORD i set in lts.con ?
15:38
<trinity9393>
launchpad?
15:39
<sbalneav>
Ryudo: yup
15:39
<monteslu>
lns https://launchpad.net/tcm
15:39
<Ryudo>
sbal its great man
15:39
:D
15:40
<sbalneav>
whiprush_: I can write code, I can write docs, or I can write release notes. :) They're in order of my preference.
15:40
<whiprush_>
sbalneav: I wasn't saying as a dig on you or something.
15:40
<sbalneav>
Nah, nah, didn't take it that way.
15:40
<monteslu>
what would be cool is remote booting a bunch of thin clients and having them get LDM_USERNAME/LDM_PASSWORD for just that next session
15:40sepski has joined #ltsp
15:41
<lns>
monteslu, thx!
15:41
<sbalneav>
Just an opportunity to make a joke. :)
15:41
<monteslu>
would be great for the kindegarten and preschool kids
15:41
<whiprush_>
sbalneav: people still need to be reminded that ltsp is core goodness, and should always be mentioned.
15:41
<sbalneav>
yep
15:41
<whiprush_>
sbalneav: burgundavia is on vacation, so let's blame him.
15:41
<Q-FUNK>
ltsp love
15:41
<sbalneav>
ok
15:41
<Q-FUNK>
:-P
15:42
<sbalneav>
Hey! Q-FUNK, just the guy I wanted to talk to!
15:42
<Q-FUNK>
:)
15:42
<sbalneav>
Guess what I got booted last night?
15:42
<Q-FUNK>
it works out of the box now? :D
15:42
<sbalneav>
No, not quite.
15:43
running Xorg -configure :1, on that little geode craps out.
15:43
<Q-FUNK>
oh?
15:43
<sbalneav>
So, I had to create a custom xorg.conf file.
15:43
<cliebow_>
lns:ogra knows there is a buggy in there..he was talking about the fix a cfew days ago
15:44
<sbalneav>
and, I can't seem to get it to display in anything more than 800x600
15:44
I'm supposed to use the xserver-xorg-video-amd driver, yes?
15:44
<Q-FUNK>
now, that it odd, given how it supports up to 1600x1200 on TFT or even larger with CRT.
15:44
yes, -amd
15:44
<sbalneav>
Hmm
15:45
Bog standard xorg.conf, just set up "amd" as the driver.
15:45
the "rtv" driver that comes with the -amd package had some linkage error.
15:46
<lns>
cliebow, oh cool. ok...if there's anythign I can do to help it along, that'd be great...i've got 7 schools to set up ubuntu LTSP servers (30-40 thin clients each) and this tool is going to be great for that. Seriously, anything I can do (besides coding).
15:46
<Q-FUNK>
sbalneav: yeah, that tv driver has been known to not work from time to time
15:46
<sbalneav>
That was what killed the Xorg -configure.
15:46
<Q-FUNK>
sbalneav: but amd should work
15:47
<cliebow_>
lns:Cool..i am still using my bastatrdized teachertool for just that..
15:47
<sbalneav>
What time is it in your neck of the woods?
15:47
Also, it didn't detect a sound driver, either, so we need to figgure that one out.
15:48
However, that aside (!) I was watching youtube videos on it, and browsing the web (albeit at 800x600) and it was pretty snappy.
15:48cliebow_ has quit IRC
15:49
<Q-FUNK>
it's 23:45
15:49
sound driver should be detected by udev
15:50
<str4nd>
to elokuun 23. 23:47:13 EEST 2007
15:51
Hmm...
15:51
<sbalneav>
So, in 7ish hours, it should be 7 am there
15:51
Any chance I could ask you to be an early riser, and pop on at 7 your time, and we can step through a few things?
15:52
It'll be 11 pm my time
15:53
<trinity9393>
sny work being done in regards to music cd's
15:53
<Q-FUNK>
sbalneav: I tend to be up around 8:00
15:56
snd_cs5535audio
15:57
<sbalneav>
Well, pop in as soon as you can. I'll stay up 'till I pass out :)
15:57
<Q-FUNK>
heh, ok
15:57
<sn9_>
trinity9393: they should work if you put them in the server
15:57
<sbalneav>
OK, off to catch the bus.
15:58
I'll be on later.
15:58
ciao
15:58sbalneav has quit IRC
15:59
<trinity9393>
oh they do but for what im working on i need the terminals cdrom to be able to play music
15:59
i found some interesting things abiut doing something with cdfs but its a bit vauge
16:00
<sn9_>
the sever can play on the terminals
16:00
<trinity9393>
i know that
16:01
i need to be able to pay a music cd on the terminal from the terminals cdrom drive
16:01
<sn9_>
then you need to run a player locally
16:02
i would recommend mplayer
16:03
<trinity9393>
im gona have two models of thin clinet
16:03
<sn9_>
you could control that from the X session on the server
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16:04
<trinity9393>
one with cd and floppy and one with just a usb slot for usb keychains
16:04
<sn9_>
floppy?
16:04
<trinity9393>
all of this needs to be transperent to the app
16:05
yea people want floppy suport
16:05
i dont know why
16:05
<sn9_>
i have a usb floppy drive
16:06
<trinity9393>
well i was thinking about going in that direction too
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16:06
<sn9_>
you could pass one around whenever someone wants to use it
16:06
<trinity9393>
and just haveing one model that did only usb
16:06
<monteslu>
I bet the people that want floppy support have no idea that they can buy a thumdrive with a 800 floppy capacity for less than ten bucks
16:06
<sn9_>
cd over usb is ridiculous, though
16:07
<trinity9393>
and they can but the cd and floppy seprately and use usb
16:08
<sn9_>
you could have a single model with cd and usb
16:08
<trinity9393>
the thinclient hard ware im useing for the usb only is the size of a walkman
16:08
<sn9_>
oh
16:08
forget cd, then
16:08
just have them rip all their cd's to usb sticks
16:09
<trinity9393>
its basicaly a box this network k/m/v and usb and sound and a parallel port
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16:20
<trinity9393>
im createing a comercial product to sell to customers so im trying to make it as little intrusive to how they do things now as posable
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16:28
<sn9_>
anything new to them is by definition intrusive
16:28
hmm, i thought the edubuntu cd was a livecd -- that's a disappointment
16:29
<monteslu>
i thought it was a little strange
16:30
didn't ubuntu have a live cd installer a couple versions back?
16:30
<sn9_>
i'm talking about edubuntu, though
16:31
<monteslu>
same here, thought it was strange edubuntu didn't have a live cd installer
16:32
or at least a graphical one
16:34
<vagrantc>
i don't think the edubuntu-server have a livecd installer, but i'm pretty sure that the desktop install is a livecd ... haven't just used it days ago
16:34
er, having just used it ...
16:38
<sn9_>
i'm referring to the shipit cd
16:38
it is not live
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16:54
<vykarian>
hi all!
16:55
<sn9_>
hello
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17:23
<vykarian>
does anybody know where find documentation about kernel compiling?
17:23
the wiki/documentation at ltsp.org is off for that
17:23
<sn9_>
what info regarding kernel compiling are you looking for?
17:24
<vykarian>
I should hack a ltsp kernel for the discontinued rtl8139 driver
17:25
8139cp || 8139too works
17:25
<sn9_>
"discontinued" ??
17:25
<vykarian>
yeah
17:26
remember when u called modprobe rtl8139 instead 8139cp/8139too ?
17:26
i need that old rtl8139 driver
17:26
<sn9_>
why?
17:26
the too is just fine
17:27
<vykarian>
because the 40 NICs that somebody just bought me only work with that
17:27
i already forced the dhcpd.conf option-129 to NIC=8139too/cp
17:27
and that just don't work
17:33
<sn9_>
what model are they?
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17:44
<vykarian>
my fw was rebooted =\
17:44
sn9_ thats a RTL8139D
17:44
but thats documentation says that it uses the rtl8139 instead too/cp
17:45
does somebody knows where I can find a mirror of LTSP Documentation?
17:45
<sn9_>
there are options to enable the D in either cp or too, i forget which
17:45
but the option is off by default
17:46
<vykarian>
options where?
17:48
<sn9_>
kernel config
17:48
<vykarian>
in my linux it works fine
17:49
i already hacked a regular kernel
17:49
to use rtl8139
17:49
I picked up the rtl8139.c code from a 2.4
17:49
and created a patch for 2.6.20
17:49
so, in my linux i have rtl8139, 8139too and 8139cp
17:50
the only thing that I need is the LTSP documentation
17:50
to port that regular kernel to ltsp stations
17:55
guess I need something like ltsp_initrd
17:57
<sn9_>
is this a genuine realtek, or a hangzhou silan?
17:59
<vykarian>
man
17:59
thats even worse
17:59
<sn9_>
the hangzhou silan has a different driver, sc92031.ko
17:59
<vykarian>
I'm hating that.. wondering about a bomb.. i received 40 of those
18:00
yeah, but that isn't that case.. that was my first guess
18:00
<sn9_>
lspci should tell you
18:01
<vykarian>
thats a genuine realtek..
18:01
there is no sense
18:01
<sn9_>
there is also "Rsltek 8139D"
18:02edgarin has joined #ltsp
18:02
<vykarian>
fouuuuuuuund
18:02
<sn9_>
try the sc92031 driver anyway -- it's in recent kernels
18:03
<vykarian>
wiki miraculously came back from dead!
18:03
and the kernel_kit is available for download
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19:19
<vagrantc_>
hey, if sbalneav shows up, i've got a few patches for him: http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/ubuntu/vagrant-gutsy
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21:09
<sbalneav>
Evening all
21:20mystafa has joined #ltsp
21:20
<mystafa>
morning for all!
21:21
ogra, are you here? ;-)
21:25
<sbalneav>
No, it's like 4 in the morning for ogra
21:27
<Lumiere>
he just never logs out
21:27J45p3r has quit IRC
21:28
<mystafa>
;-)
21:28
i have a two questions ;-)
21:28
<Lumiere>
sbalneav awaits them ^^
21:29
<mystafa>
^^
21:30
why when i get a chroot to the /opt/ltsp/i386 i don't see any stuff? i have directories, some stuff... but! when i trying to compile the source, the client says that i don't have a gcc... on the server i have it. and i thought, that client can take all packages from server
21:30
this is the first question ;-)
21:30
and about printing :(
21:30rcy has joined #ltsp
21:30
<mystafa>
oh! sorry... i don't say what i'am using ;-)
21:31
Debian 4 + LTSP 5
21:31
<sbalneav>
mystafa: First, what source are you wanting to compile? Why would you compile something in the chroot?
21:31
Isn't there a package for it you could just install?
21:32
<mystafa>
sbalneav i'll try to compile a patch for my printer
21:32
wait a sec.. i'll tell you about printer
21:32
when i plug the printer to the server.. it see it... and cups says that printer is plugged. when i plug it in to the client - the cups is silent
21:33
<sbalneav>
Well of course
21:33
cups doesn't know about the printer on the client.
21:33
<mystafa>
sbalneav and what i must do? ;-) i want to install printer on the client
21:33
<sbalneav>
cups only looks at printers where the cups is running, on the server.
21:34
You set up the parameters in lts.conf
21:34
<mystafa>
yeah..
21:34
ogra helps me tomoroww
21:34
<sbalneav>
and then manually add a jet direct type printer in cups.
21:34
<mystafa>
yes
21:34
i'll do it
21:34
<sbalneav>
thats it.
21:35
<mystafa>
hm... you see... i don't understand, how client must install it, when it doesn't see it ;)
21:36
i'll do all steps which is writed on a wiki.. client says - printing... and that's all..
21:36
printing not happened
21:36
<sbalneav>
What kind of printer is it?
21:37
Wait, were you the one with the whacky windows printer?
21:37
<mystafa>
sbalneav i'll have an hp1020
21:37
<sbalneav>
yeah
21:37
I don't think you're going to get that to work, myself.
21:37
<mystafa>
why?
21:38
<sbalneav>
it needs special drivers and stuff, and we don't have any of that plumbing in LTSP.
21:38
If it's a "normal" USB printer, that you can just plug in, and start sending data to /dev/usblp0, then it will work.
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21:38
<sbalneav>
You can probably GET it to work, if you spend a lot of time at it.
21:39
<mystafa>
yeah... but you see.. this printer needs a new firmware. i've got it. but i can't complie it on the client 'cause it doesn't have a gcc and all stuff ;-)
21:39
<sbalneav>
but it's not going to work "out of the box", like, say, an HP laserjet 4000 or something.
21:39
ok
21:39
so install gcc in the chroot.
21:39
chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
21:39
<mystafa>
hmmm...one more question
21:39
<sbalneav>
apt-get install gcc build-essentials, etc etc etc
21:40
<mystafa>
i'll try to mount cdrom, to get all stuff
21:40
o nthe client
21:40
on the client. sorry
21:40
but...
21:40
<sbalneav>
Why wouldn't you just compile all this stuff on the server, and just COPY it into the chroot?
21:40
<mystafa>
when a take a cd, on the client, at the desktop, i see it. but on the /media
21:41
sbalneav hmm... it's idea! but ;-)
21:41
<sbalneav>
yeah, that's where things mount, under /media
21:42
<mystafa>
i dont' understand one more thing. at the server i have all stuff... do i have it on the client? i ask it, because, when i'am going chroot, i don't see anything. `ps -e` on the client says nothing
21:43
do client takes all daemons, services, from server when i start it?
21:43
for example...
21:44
at server, i have cupsd. but at the client i don't see it.
21:44
<sbalneav>
What do you mean, "at the client"?
21:45
When you're logged in graphically on the client?
21:45
<mystafa>
when i'am going chroot
21:45
<sbalneav>
When you do a choot /opt/ltsp/i386?
21:45
<mystafa>
yeah
21:45
<sbalneav>
Well, #1, when you're in the chroot, are you doing a "mount -t proc proc /proc"?
21:46
<mystafa>
no
21:46
<sbalneav>
and then unmounting it before you exit the chroot.
21:46
and 2, no, cups isn't installed in the chroot.
21:46
<mystafa>
but client must have it?
21:46
isn't so?
21:46
<sbalneav>
what's in the choot (/opt/ltsp/i386) will be "/" when the client's running
21:46
No, because you don't run cups on the client.
21:47
<mystafa>
i see...
21:47
hm
21:47
ok. will try to explain
21:47
one sec
21:47
<sbalneav>
we have a little tiny program called jetpipe that makes the thin client look like an hpjetdirect print server.
21:48
<mystafa>
when i'am going chroot - i see _the client stuff_, i'am right?
21:48
and what do "mount -t proc proc /proc"?
21:49
<sbalneav>
right
21:49
lets you run "ps -ef " while in the chroot.
21:49trinity9393 has joined #ltsp
21:49
<sbalneav>
You'll see the SERVER's processes, because you're ON the server.
21:49
<mystafa>
sbalneav nothing
21:50
sbalneav i'am now a chroot and run ps -ef, and it says nothing
21:50
<sbalneav>
Then you didn't do the mount
21:50
<mystafa>
what gives mount -t proc proc /proc?
21:50
yeah!
21:50
it works
21:51
but what it gives me? ;)
21:53
<ltsppbot>
"sbalneav" pasted "chroot" (22 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/286
21:54
<sbalneav>
it gives you the SERVER's processes, because you're ON the server.
21:54
The chroot is just a mini installation of linux that sits on the server.
21:55
you can maintain it by chrooting into it, runnin apt-get commands, etc.
21:55
but that's what gets mounted by the clients.
21:55
<mystafa>
great... thank you! i'll understand it ;-) and one more question... i which situation i must do it?
21:56
<sbalneav>
Think about it a little bit. Time to do a little reading on your own.
21:56
<mystafa>
;-) sbalneav, ok!
21:57
sbalneav one more question about `mounting`
21:58
i plug the cd to the client, at the desktop i see it. but when i look up at the `/media`, there was - nothing. trying to to mount /media it says error
21:58
<sbalneav>
Something's not right with your localdevs
21:59
!checklist
21:59
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "checklist" is The checklist for debugging problems with local device access is at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev#Troubleshooting. Please work through all 12 steps, record the results, and paste the results to the pastebot at http://pastebot.ltsp.org
21:59
<sbalneav>
hmm
21:59
not that one...
21:59
!localdevs
21:59
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Error: "localdevs" is not a valid command.
21:59
<sbalneav>
!localdev
21:59
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "localdev" is (#1) Information regarding using pluggable devices and cdroms with LTSP can be found at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev, or (#2) for ubuntu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EnableLTSP5LocalDevices, or (#3) for debian-edu: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/HowTo/LocalDeviceLtspfs, or (#4) http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
21:59
<sbalneav>
http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
21:59
<mystafa>
ok! thanks!
21:59
<sbalneav>
run through that, it should help
21:59
<mystafa>
but.. i see it on the desktop. all local devices ;-)
22:00
<sbalneav>
So, they're working?
22:00
they should be in /media/<userid>
22:00
<mystafa>
yeah.. but i can't do `apt-cdrom add` it says that it doesn't see it
22:00
<sbalneav>
you shouldn't have to "mount" anything, the system does it for you
22:00
put the cdrom in the server
22:01
you don't want to have the cdrom in a thin client for an apt-cdrom.
22:01
<mystafa>
sbalneav !!!
22:01
sbalneav put it on the server, then going to chroot?
22:02
and run `apt`
22:02
?
22:02
<sbalneav>
no
22:02
<mystafa>
:(
22:02
do it on the client? `apt`
22:02
<sbalneav>
no
22:03
what is it you want to get off the cdrom?
22:03
<mystafa>
agrh ;-)
22:03
sbalneav gcc and all devs
22:04
<sbalneav>
So you can compile some source?
22:04
<mystafa>
yup
22:04
<sbalneav>
to put a binary in the choot?
22:04
You didn't listen to what I said before, did you.
22:04
listen carefully.
22:05
<mystafa>
sorry.. i understand
22:05
<sbalneav>
compile your source
22:05
get your binary
22:05
copy to /opt/ltsp/i386/wherever
22:06
that's going to be WAAAAY easier than trying to install an entire development environment in the choot.
22:06
to accomplish exactly the same thing.
22:07
<mystafa>
sbalneav ok ;-) thank you for you patience!
22:07
sbalneav you'll do a good thigs ;-)
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22:32
<ryudo_>
!ldm
22:32
<ltspbot>
ryudo_: "ldm" is You can find the updated ldm that supports the LDM_DIRECTX parameter for bypassing ssh encryption at http://alburg.net/ldm
22:32
<ryudo_>
!kiosk
22:33
<ltspbot>
ryudo_: Error: "kiosk" is not a valid command.
22:35
<ryudo_>
!list
22:35
<ltspbot>
ryudo_: Admin, Alias, Channel, ChannelLogger, Config, Factoids, Google, Internet, Misc, Owner, Seen, Status, and User
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22:48
<mystafa>
sbalneav must i set in lts.conf for printer /dev/usb/lp0 or /dev/usblp0?
22:49
<sbalneav>
Don't know
22:49
What does debian use?
22:49
Ubuntu's /dev/usblp0
22:49
<mystafa>
sbalneav when i plug the printer it creates /dev/usb/lp0
22:49
<sbalneav>
Well, then what do you thing you should use?
22:50
<mystafa>
;-) /dev/usb/lp0
22:53joris has quit IRC
22:53
<mystafa>
sbalneav about mounting.. something strange. when i'am going as root on the client and put the cd, in /media i have directories, but from user, i don't have it
22:55
<sbalneav>
Have you added the user to the fuse group
22:55
like that debug wiki page I pointed you to TELLS YOU
22:55
DUDE
22:55
START READING
22:55
<mystafa>
sbalneav the user IS ON the FUSE GROUP
22:55
<sbalneav>
yeah?
22:56
<mystafa>
yup
22:56
i see that i'am asking stupid questions for you?
22:56
<sbalneav>
No, but you're asking questions WITH NO CONTEXT.
22:57
How about saying: "I read the page, I've checked steps 1 throuh 5, and things seem ok, but this part isn't working"
22:57
<mystafa>
sorry to this..
22:57
ok. i will do it on the future
22:57
...from now
22:57
;-)
22:57
<sbalneav>
Paste the results of all the steps in the wiki page.
22:57
<mystafa>
ok
22:57
<sbalneav>
There's a complete debug procedure there.
22:57
if you follow it, it should tell you where the problem is.
22:58
<mystafa>
ok
23:02
<sbalneav>
So, for example, what do you have for step 2?
23:02rafaelfeito has joined #ltsp
23:03
<sbalneav>
mystafa: What do you have for step 2? Paste the single line result here.
23:04
<mystafa>
fuse 39828 10
23:05
sorry it's a 3 step
23:05
ii ltspfs 0.4.3+debian2+0.edu.0.etch.0 Fuse based remote filesystem for LTSP thin clients
23:05
<sbalneav>
what's the perms on /dev/fuse?
23:06
<mystafa>
crw-rw---- 1 root fuse 10, 229 2007-08-17 09:36 /dev/fuse
23:06
<sbalneav>
ok, so looks fine.
23:07
so, is the thin client on?
23:07
Is the thin client on?
23:08
<mystafa>
yes
23:08
<sbalneav>
ok
23:08
so as a regular user
23:08
type this:
23:08
<mystafa>
it's on a fuse group
23:08
<sbalneav>
ltspfs 11.22.33.44:/tmp ~/foo
23:08
where 11.22.33.44 is the ip address of the client
23:09
and ~/foo is some empty dir in your home directory
23:09
What does it do?
23:09
Just return silently?
23:10
<mystafa>
one sec pls
23:10
which address i must set?
23:11
<sbalneav>
where 11.22.33.44 is the ip address of the client
23:11
<ryudo_>
sbalneav you know how i change the floppy icon in Desktop terminal ? to change the name floppy0 to other name
23:11
ltsp5 version
23:11
<sbalneav>
I don't know what address your thin cklient is.
23:11
<mystafa>
sbalneav it says `failed to access mountpoint`
23:11
<rafaelfeito>
i've heard about libflashsupport... pulse audio. In ltsp4.2 what's the better solution for flash+firefox+sound ??
23:12
<sbalneav>
ryudo_: it picks the icon based on the name.
23:12
you'd have to look in /opt/ltsp/i386/lib/udev/add_fstab_entry, and change how it assigns the name
23:13
rafaelfeito: There isn't a good one for ltsp4,2
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23:14
<sbalneav>
mystafa: paste me the exact command you used?
23:14
<ryudo_>
thx sbal ! :D
23:14
i look this
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23:15
<rafaelfeito>
sbalneav: really? nothing works?? there is no way of doing this in 32MB thin clients?
23:16
<sbalneav>
That's why we went to pulse audio in ltsp5
23:16
It was purely to get flash going.
23:16
mystafa: Paste the command you used?
23:17
<mystafa>
ltspfs IP:/tmp ~/foo
23:17
it says that `no such file or...`
23:19
<sbalneav>
you used the word IP?
23:19
<mystafa>
no ;-))))))
23:19
<sbalneav>
ok, does ~/foo exist?
23:20
<mystafa>
no
23:20
<sbalneav>
man
23:20
<mystafa>
sbalneav you don't say that i must create it
23:20
<sbalneav>
yes I did
23:21
and ~/foo is some empty dir in your home directory
23:21
<mystafa>
:(
23:21
<sbalneav>
you could use ~/foo, or something else you already had, or....
23:21
somethin
23:21
then mkdir ~/foo
23:21
<mystafa>
command gives an empty line
23:21
ltspfs commnad
23:22
command*
23:22
<sbalneav>
ok
23:22
mount | grep foo
23:22
paste the result
23:23
<mystafa>
ltspfs on /home/test/foo type fuse (rw,nosuid,nodev,user=test)
23:23
<sbalneav>
ok, fine, so you're mounting
23:23
fusermount -u ~/foo
23:24
<mystafa>
empty line
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23:24
<sbalneav>
Thats fine.
23:24
You have a cdrom on the client, right?
23:24
<mystafa>
yes
23:25
<sbalneav>
You're using ldm?
23:25bazz has quit IRC
23:25
<mystafa>
yes
23:25
<sbalneav>
OK, so you stick in a cdrom, and nothing happens, that right?
23:26
<mystafa>
happens
23:26
<sbalneav>
Nothing?
23:26
<mystafa>
it's mounted. i can see it on a desktop
23:26
<sbalneav>
ok so it's working!
23:26
<mystafa>
but in /media - nothing
23:26
<sbalneav>
as user
23:26
<mystafa>
yes
23:26
<sbalneav>
mount -a
23:26
<rafaelfeito>
sbalneav: about floppies and ltspfs, how could I advice a user if none floppy are mounted?
23:26
<sbalneav>
paste the results
23:26
<mystafa>
;-) i se
23:26
*see
23:26
:)
23:27
<sbalneav>
you see what?
23:27
<mystafa>
that `only root can do that`
23:27
<sbalneav>
So, you're logged in as root right now?
23:27
<mystafa>
no..as a user
23:28
<sbalneav>
sorry
23:28* mystafa rebooting the client
23:28
<sbalneav>
mount, not mount -a
23:28
mount, and paste the results
23:28
rafaelfeito: This for 4.2?
23:28
<mystafa>
one sec.. i reboot the client..
23:29
<sbalneav>
If you're seeing the cdrom, and you can see the files, it's mounted SOMEWHERE
23:29
<rafaelfeito>
sbalneav: yes, and for ltsp5 too
23:29
<sbalneav>
for ltsp4.2,
23:29
!checklist
23:29
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "checklist" is The checklist for debugging problems with local device access is at http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev#Troubleshooting. Please work through all 12 steps, record the results, and paste the results to the pastebot at http://pastebot.ltsp.org
23:30
<sbalneav>
what kind of floppy is it? regular 1.44 on the floppy port?
23:30
<rafaelfeito>
yes
23:31
<sbalneav>
Is the kernel recognizing it?
23:31
for ltsp5, got "floppy" in the /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/modules?
23:34
<rafaelfeito>
yes, in ltsp4.2 works fine when a floppy is on drive at client, but if no, an user could open the directory where should be mounted (something like ~/Drives...)
23:36
and for user, this directory seems to be a empty floppy (but isn't a floppy, it's just the mount point of ltspfs)
23:37
<sbalneav>
right
23:37
that's normal
23:37
<rafaelfeito>
when there isn't floppy in drive
23:37
<sbalneav>
there's no way to detect if a floppy's in the drive or not.
23:37
so the icon's always there.
23:38
That's normal
23:38
<rafaelfeito>
yes!exactly
23:38
<sbalneav>
that's the way it is.
23:39
<rafaelfeito>
but, here, many people use floppy yet...
23:39
<sbalneav>
ok
23:39
well, they can use it.
23:39
<rafaelfeito>
and quality it's not too good...
23:40
<sbalneav>
you said it works if the floppy's in the drive
23:40
so what's the problem?
23:40
mystafa: You still here?
23:41
<rafaelfeito>
right, but if a bad floppy (that not could get mounted ) was inserted
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23:43
<rafaelfeito>
a student for example put his/her homework on empty directory (but, remember that's not mounted, is only a directory)
23:44
thinking that s/he saved on floppy
23:44
<sbalneav>
yup
23:44
that's floppys
23:44
There's not really much that can be done.
23:45
floppies, basically, suck.
23:45
<rafaelfeito>
i agree
23:46
i think in put something like ".floppynotmounted" on mountpoint :)
23:46
<sbalneav>
Local machines have hal, to handle polling the floppy for errors, but we don't have hal available to us with ltsp.
23:47
<rafaelfeito>
but, like you say, the directory should be empty for ltsp mount
23:47
<sbalneav>
rafaelfeito: Well, you can always modify ltsp to do that :)
23:47
mystafa: Still here?
23:48
<rafaelfeito>
great \o/ and thanks for "free software" :)
23:50
do you know where i can modify this behavior?
23:50
<sbalneav>
For which, ltsp5 or 4.2?
23:50
<rafaelfeito>
4.2 for now
23:51
<sbalneav>
in the udev scripts in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/udev/rules.d
23:51
ltsp something
23:52
I stopped working on 4.2 a year and a half ago, so I've forgotton most of it.
23:53
<rafaelfeito>
thanks... and what could be consequences of this change?
23:53
<sbalneav>
You could break it horribly so that localdevs don't work at all.
23:53
so make backups.
23:53
before you change things.
23:57
<rafaelfeito>
i use 4.2 yet only because we have, in school, thinclients with 32MB, and when i test doesn't "fit" very good :P
23:58
but i expect that should be better in gutsy, by your work
23:59
<sbalneav>
32 meg clients work pretty good now