IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 5 February 2009   (all times are UTC)

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00:18
<alkisg>
I've found a way (with gst-launch) to project a video to all student PCs simultaneously. But the teacher will need access to the students' xservers, probably with xauth. Where's the best place to do something like xauth +teacher ? In the chroot init scripts, when xsessions start... And what would be the right xauth command line? (I'm guessing with "xauth ... generate ... untrusted")?
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01:24
<alkisg>
OK, `xhost +server` is good enough for my needs. But, where should I put it so that it runs after X is started but before students logon?
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02:02
<alkisg>
Answering to myself, /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/xinitrc.d/I00-xauth seems good enough. Putting `xhost +server` in there enables the teacher to run any program and display its output to the students PCs.
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03:17
<shamino>
I just did distribution-update to my ltsp-enviroment (Hardy to Intrepid) and now clients stop on error "Disconnecting: que, disconnect, sock, done"
03:18
i build a new client-image with ltsp-build-client but no help
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03:31
<shamino>
this one is similar: http://www.nabble.com/random-clients-stall-out-at-Error:-Ioctl-1.1a-failed:-Bad-file-descriptor-td20858391.html
03:32
do i have to enable NAT?
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03:40
<shamino>
from syslog: Read failed: Inappropriate ioctl for device
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07:05
<ScorpKing>
Ryan52: you around?
07:07
i'm still unable to install a different usplash theme for the clients that boot off the server. did anyone here managed to change the usplash theme?
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07:24
<Blinny>
How can I run a script on user logout?
07:26
<ScorpKing>
no idea but it migh be in the manual
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07:39
<ScorpKing>
ok so i think my problem with usplash themes might be the nbi image. does that get updated when initramfs is updated in chroot?
07:40
i see that only /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/initrd.img-2.6.24-16-generic is updated and the rest of the files stays the same. is it save to replace those file with the ones from chroot?
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07:45
<shamino>
Blinny: /etc/gdm/PostSession/Default i guess..
07:47
<Blinny>
shamino: I thought LTSP used ldm
07:49
<ScorpKing>
it does
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07:51
<Blinny>
Won't /etc/gdm/PostSession/Default be run as root?
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08:22
<Blinny>
Let me qualify that then
08:23
How can I run a script that has access to $USER on user logout?
08:23
<Gadi>
Blinny: waht distro are you on?
08:24
*what
08:24
or, better yet, when you run: ps -ef|grep Xsession
08:24
on the server
08:25
do you see a "kill -1" in the process command?
08:26
<Blinny>
Yes.
08:26
I'm working with dmaran to do a rsync on login & logout to try to do some /home/$USER filesystem synchronization
08:27
<Gadi>
Blinny: well, two comments:
08:27
<Blinny>
All ears
08:27
& eyes (;
08:27
<Gadi>
1. You *may* be able to do something on logout if u add a script to the end of the Xsession.d/ scripts
08:28
(like: Xsession.d/99-something)
08:28
not sure
08:28
2. Even if you do, it doesn't handle unclean logouts
08:28
<Blinny>
Right.
08:28
<Gadi>
it is often time better to try to cleanup upon login first and then rsync again
08:28
<Blinny>
We're thinking of an rsync && sleep 2 m script that we'll set up to run while user is logged in.
08:29
That may be a better idea. Dig.
08:29
<Gadi>
that could work, too
08:29
a daemon that rsyncs periodically
08:29
<Blinny>
Something like that, yah.
08:30
<Gadi>
with most of our LTSP scripts, you'll notice few logout type scripts
08:30
because you *know* people will not logout cleanly
08:30
or the power will be cut
08:30
<Blinny>
Yah, I'd noticed that.
08:30
<Gadi>
or something
08:32
<Blinny>
We'll re-think. Thanks Gadi. You've always been ridiculously helpful. Cheers mate.
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08:38
<Gadi>
Blinny: my pleasure - thats what Im here for - to be ridiculous
08:38
:)
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08:44
<Blinny>
heh
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08:51
<Blinny>
If I write this 'rsync every 3 minutes' script, will it be killed on logout by gdm or something?
08:51
I'm thinking (psuedocode) "if user is logged in, rsync then sleep 3m; fi rsync then quit"
08:51
I could nohup it
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08:56
<cyberorg>
would bash completion be possible with ltsp-localapps command?
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09:02
<warren>
cyberorg: no, and that wouldn't belong upstream if someone wrote it
09:02
<quickslip>
does anyone know how to install openoffice 3.0 using yum install ?
09:02
need to know the package name
09:02
<warren>
cyberorg: for security reasons it doesn't do PATH execution either, you need the full path
09:02
<cyberorg>
warren, ok
09:03
<warren>
quickslip: Fedora 10?
09:03
<quickslip>
F9
09:04
warren: Fedora 9
09:05
<warren>
quickslip: I think "yum groupinstall office" will install most of what you want.
09:05
<quickslip>
warren: Will try it out and let you know - thanks
09:09
<ltsppbot>
"Blinny" pasted "rsync script" (8 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/239
09:10
<Blinny>
Gadi: I'm thinking of nohup'ing this script in, say /etc/X11/Xsession.d/95-rsync-users
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10:04
<cyberorg>
Gadi, warren our kiwi developer has implemented AOE root, would you guys be interested in it?
10:05
<warren>
cyberorg: root filesystem is put into an image file that is exported over ethernet as a block device?
10:06
<cyberorg>
warren, yes
10:06
<johnny>
so.. any bench vs nbd?
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10:07
<cyberorg>
johnny, i just got a client booted, from what i read, big advantage is less overhead on the server
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10:07
<Gadi>
is nbd much overhead?
10:08
on a squashfs image that is hardly accessed?
10:08
<alkisg>
What about disconnecting / reconnecting? Can aoe cope with that?
10:09
<cyberorg>
alkisg, don't know, just booted first client, all the stuff i read seems to praise it a lot
10:10
Gadi, i used same squashfs image we have for kiwi-ltsp, losetup and then exported the loop device for AOE
10:11
<alkisg>
cyberorg: can you see memory consumption (for aoe) on the client, so that we compare it with nbd?
10:11
<cyberorg>
alkisg, yes i plan to do that, but i dont have many clients to test :(
10:12
<warren>
more interesting is what kind of access control there is available on the aoe server side
10:12
nbd has none
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10:13
<cyberorg>
http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/5100-10878_11-6106721.html
10:15
<warren>
cyberorg: does this mean you need a separate eth interface for aoe?
10:15
<cyberorg>
warren, no
10:16
i liked the part where i didnt have to change anything in our ltsp image :)
10:17
<Gadi>
seems like AoE on a stateless client is a good solution for network booting a Windows OS (that knows not from small kernels and usch)
10:18
but, relative to what we do now, its hard to see that it scales more
10:18
especially since you export a file as block device anyway
10:18
remember, nbd exports a block device, as well
10:19
<johnny>
it's in the name..
10:19
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Gadi: have you ever had any requests for AoE w/ an LTSP setup? We have ...
10:19
<Gadi>
one thing it may allow you to do is let the nbd image live on a Windows server
10:19
<johnny>
CAN-o-SPAM, how many know what they are talking about?
10:19
<cyberorg>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATA_over_Ethernet has nice overview also
10:20
<CAN-o-SPAM>
johnny: 0
10:20
<johnny>
hehe
10:20
just tryin to get some realism in here :)
10:20
<CAN-o-SPAM>
i agree ... i'm glad it's being discussed
10:20
<Gadi>
CAN-o-SPAM: and...
10:20
oh, *requests*
10:21
I read deployments
10:21
:)
10:21
sorry
10:21
no, its never come up
10:21
<CAN-o-SPAM>
right ... like ... we would like to use LTSP & AoE, can you help?
10:21
<johnny>
and they want to use AoE why?
10:21
<CAN-o-SPAM>
b/c they think its better, faster
10:21
<Gadi>
better than NFS, prolly
10:21
<johnny>
so it's just a checkmark on a "we can do all this" list
10:21
<Gadi>
better than nbd, questionable
10:22
<CAN-o-SPAM>
well i checked around couldn't find a single customer using it ... but also had two requests for it within 2 weeks ... odd
10:23
<Gadi>
now, that I am familiar with - seems the requests for things come in pairs
10:23
:)
10:23
<warren>
Gadi: they can repopulate the earth that way.
10:24
<Gadi>
now, if you were to put /opt/ltsp/i386 on its own hard drive partition, and export that over AoE and mount it, then I could see a benefit over NFS
10:24
<cyberorg>
CAN-o-SPAM, that would be even
10:25
<Gadi>
(or roll it up in an ext3 file image that can be loop-mounted and edited while exported at the same time)
10:25
<warren>
Gadi: you mean export the raw partition even though it is mounted elsewhere?
10:25
<Gadi>
yeah
10:25
<warren>
how is that a good idea?
10:25
<Gadi>
so you could get the benefits of NFS (realtime editing)
10:25
<warren>
no
10:25
<Gadi>
without the overhead of NFS
10:25
<warren>
no
10:26
<Gadi>
no?
10:26
<warren>
Gadi: say you mounted ext3 read-only, undefined behavior would happen because the underlying blocks change without it knowing.
10:27
<Gadi>
you mean if it were mounted in two places at once, one ro and one rw
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10:27
<Gadi>
ah, I thought AoE would be intelligent enough to handle that
10:28
<alkisg>
cyberorg: does each client need it's own AoE disk?
10:28
<etyack>
what about a clustering file system?
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10:29
<cyberorg>
alkisg, i hope not
10:29
but it is possible to give one to each
10:30
<alkisg>
Ah, I found it in wikipedia: "The AoE protocol provides a mechanism for host-based cooperative locking."
10:31
<etyack>
GFS?
10:32
<warren>
Gadi: the filesystem itself is not intelligent to handle that
10:32
Gadi: you would need to use a cluster filesystem
10:32
GFS or ocfs
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10:50
<dberkholz>
cluster-nfs is coming soon too, fwiw
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11:10
<PMantis>
Hi guys!
11:11
If I do a bunch of updates to an LTSP 5 server, should I run ltsp-update-* and ltsp-build-client, etc?
11:13
<johnny>
a bunch of updates?
11:13
if you didn't upgrade the distro, you don't need to run build-client
11:14
and, if you didn't upgrade the chroot, you don't need to run ltsp-update-image
11:25
<huey>
anyone know of a way to set it so the monitors dont turn off?
11:25
<johnny>
don't you want to save power?
11:25
a little..
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11:26
<huey>
not for these
11:26
they need to stay on all the time
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11:37
<etyack>
huey, set X_BLANKING = 0 in lts.conf.
11:38
<huey>
sweet thanks :D
11:50
hrm, its still doing it
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12:09
<Lns>
CAN-o-Lunch: lol.
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12:40
<CAN-o-SPAM>
hey Lns
12:40
<Lns>
CAN-o-SPAM: what's the good word
12:40
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Lns: find any new clients to use LTSP lately?
12:41
<Lns>
not yet! I've got a lot of work for myself with my existing schools, I need to do some business back-end restructuring (mainly moving to an LLC, and finding someone to help with LTSP clients) before I can look for more.
12:42
<CAN-o-SPAM>
sounds ... fun?
12:42
<Lns>
Both of those are high on my priority list though.
12:42
lol...well the outcome will be fun, that's for sure
12:42
<CAN-o-SPAM>
heh
12:42
<Lns>
How's biz for you?
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12:43
<CAN-o-SPAM>
good
12:43
i'm trying to find ways to get some more logo submissions for the design contest at the moment
12:43
it's slowed down a bit and my hopeful goal was to be able to consider 100 logos
12:43
<Lns>
how about sending a reminder to the lists?
12:43
putting a big banner on your index page>?
12:43
<CAN-o-SPAM>
it might have more value coming from a new sender *wink* *wink*
12:44
<Lns>
lol...this is your thing man! and I want my logo to win so i get that free TC, so it's not in my best interest ;)
12:44
<CAN-o-SPAM>
but i'm still thrilled with the results, contacting a professional logo design company usually gives you 3 - 10 logos for roughly $300, which you can review and edit once or twice
12:46
<Lns>
right...and it's better to get the community involved like that, it strengthens the relationship
12:46
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Lns: do you employee people too? or just you?
12:46
<Lns>
I have one tech that's taken over most of my windows-based clients
12:47
Which is really nice, so I can back him up, and focus more on LTSP deployments/support
12:48
<CAN-o-SPAM>
hmm, not the first consulting wiz i've heard of recently adding someone to handle windows and spend time elsewhere
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12:48
<Lns>
Well, after 12 years of doing it myself with my company (and previous jobs) I'm pretty much done chasing my tail.
12:49
I don't want to clean up one more spyware/virus infested computer for as long as I live.
12:49
<CAN-o-SPAM>
why? i LOVE regedit ;)
12:50
<Lns>
Regedit really is kind of nice... but, ... no. =p
12:51
I'd rather spend my time engineering fun things for Linux such as automatic client shutdown and wake-on-lan than spending that same time trying to get a windows box to function the way it should in the first place
12:55
<Blinny>
Amen, my brother.
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13:56
<alkisg>
Any way to get a list of the clients IPs with netstat? (Ubuntu = nbd)
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14:05
<johnny>
alkisg, why not just look at your dhcp leases :)
14:05
hehe
14:05
<alkisg>
johnny, I don't have any :)
14:06
<johnny>
huh?
14:06
<alkisg>
dhcp = cheap router
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14:06
<johnny>
ah. mine uses linux.. so i get it from that :)
14:06
<alkisg>
...and the leases could be old leases... how could you tell the new ones from the old ones/
14:06
?
14:07
<johnny>
hmm.. i wonder if you can get a list of active ssh connections
14:07
<alkisg>
E.g. if a client shuts down, the lease is still valid, but nbd disconnects and it's invalid
14:07
netstat -ntap | grep :2000 gives me the list, but I don't think that's a good way to do it
14:07
<johnny>
hmm.. the thin client manager thingy gets me a list too
14:08
it just depends on what you want to do with it
14:08
<alkisg>
Playback a video to all clients :P
14:09
I've put xhost +server to the initscripts, so the teacher can execute arbitrary commands to the clietns... So with gst-launch-0.10 I can play a video to all the x-servers
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14:11
<johnny>
anybody seen sbalneav ?
14:11
<cliebow>
Gadi, if testing a cgi script and want to pass variables in at commandline to replace param values..what is syntax?
14:12
<Gadi>
cliebow: command line? you mean URL?
14:13
?param1=value1&param2=value2...
14:14
like that?
14:14
<cliebow>
well no..guess il just comment out $name=param('name') and hardcode $name for testing i guess
14:14
;
14:15
trying to pull userPassword from ldap using Net::Ldap:Entry and cant get it right..
14:15
<Blinny>
Gadi: We've got some slick scriptage working for rsync'ing all over hell's half acre. Working well. Thanks for the 'not on logout' tip.
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14:15
<Gadi>
Blinny: great!
14:16
does hell's half acre have an outdoor pool?
14:16
:)
14:16
cliebow: I feel like you're always trying to pull something from LDAP
14:16
<cliebow>
i am..
14:17
but revisiting every six months i forget
14:17
senior moments..actually senior weekends
14:21
<alkisg>
Argh, ok, here's the result - a bad way to get the list of TC IPs if using nbd: netstat -np 2>&- | grep '\:2000 .* ESTABLISHED' | cut -d ":" -f 2 | cut -d " " -f 6
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14:41
<re-G>
if I install ubuntu 8.10+ltsp5+crunchbang desktop, will it work out of box?
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14:43
<johnny>
crunchbang?
14:43
huh?
14:43
<re-G>
johnny: huh?
14:44
<johnny>
you said crunchbang
14:44
not me
14:44
<re-G>
crunchbang desktop is nice :P
14:44
<johnny>
what is it?
14:45
if it's not gnome or kde.. it may not work out of the box.. depending on what underlying services it uses
14:45
<Lns>
Nice to see that *box is still being used in a lot of places :)
14:45
johnny: http://crunchbanglinux.org/
14:45
<johnny>
probably not
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14:45
<johnny>
it probably won't work if it's a *box , unless they've heavily evolved since i recall last
14:45
re-G, but it's their fault if it doesn't.. not ours
14:46
<re-G>
johnny: yes of course
14:46
<johnny>
i doubt anybody here knows
14:46
i would never want to give openbox to any users tho
14:46
that would be mean
14:46
<Lns>
lol
14:47
"What the..."
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15:08
<epsas>
hmm -
15:09
so i want to evaluate modern LTSP distributions
15:09
does anybody have reccomendations for a couple that I should definately check out?
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15:19
<CAN-o-SPAM>
epsas: i'd recommend Ubuntu & K12Linux
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15:36
<epsas>
CAN-o-SPAM - Thanks!
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16:07
<re-G>
CAN-o-SPAM: do you have any new thought about wlan-ltsp?
16:13
<CAN-o-SPAM>
re-G: honestly, been swamped haven't had anytime to test what you've done
16:13
how is it going for you?
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16:15
<CAN-o-SPAM>
re-G: i have to go sorry, send me e-mail regarding any updates. i'll look for it. thanks again.
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17:09
<epsas>
hmm
17:09
where can I find Ubuntu's LTSP offerings?
17:12
ahh - i see it is a part of the alternate installer. thanks
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17:24
<Ahmuck>
fwiw, pdf in firefox and pdf printing is crashing ltsp clients
17:25
i'm not so sure that firefox with multiple tabs is crashing the thin client as well
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21:17
<kaos01>
im using LTSP and trying to use XF86CONFIG_FILE = with no luck
21:19
i have XF86CONFIG_FILE = /etc/xorg-test.conf and the file in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/xorg-test.conf
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22:08
<sbalneav>
!docs
22:08
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "docs" is For the most current documentation, see http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
22:08
<sbalneav>
kaos01: It's X_CONF=
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22:31
<kaos01>
mmm, still not having any luck
22:53
<sbalneav>
kaos01: Since you added the xorg-test.conf file, did you rebuild the image?
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