IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 4 November 2007 (all times are UTC)
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| 01:53 | <mwright1> hello
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| 01:53 | just wandering if anyone here has tried ltsp server with a xen kernel
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| 05:09 | <cyberorg> vagrantc, hi, scrolled up yesterdays discussion, tarballs break up look good
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| 05:10 | <vagrantc> cyberorg: cool
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| 05:10 | <cyberorg> vagrantc, you pinged?
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| 05:11 | <vagrantc> cyberorg: just wanted to make sure all the active folks working on ltsp knew that that important conversation was happening
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| 05:12 | <cyberorg> we would only know if it is best when we have first tarballs, we can always improve if required :)
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| 12:13 | <Q-FUNK> re
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| 12:13 | how was the meeting in Maine?
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| 12:16 | <cliebow> Q-FUNK, tight now it is just three of us..Gadi warren and I
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| 12:16 | others are out riding around
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| 12:16 | <Q-FUNK> ok
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| 12:16 | any interesting developments?
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| 12:17 | <vagrantc> depends on what you mean by interesting
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| 12:17 | <cliebow> well..mostly ironing out how to set up ltsp as upstream
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| 12:17 | * vagrantc finds that very interesting | |
| 12:17 | <cliebow> it is but no earthshattering discoveries 8~(
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| 12:17 | )
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| 12:18 | my job is to listen a lot..
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| 12:50 | <Q-FUNK> so RH and the others could have amore clear set of upstream tarballs to package?
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| 12:50 | <vagrantc> that's part of it
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| 12:51 | it's also splitting out different code bases into separate tarballs
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| 12:52 | i.e. split ldm out of the ltsp code
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| 12:58 | <Q-FUNK> I think that's of secondary importance
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| 12:58 | for instance, RH's main complaint was that there doesn't seem to be regular upstream tarball releases at ltsp.org anymore, because everything is SO ubuntu-centric
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| 12:59 | <vagrantc> sure
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| 12:59 | manu__ has joined #ltsp | |
| 12:59 | <vagrantc> it's even been an issue at times with debian/ubuntu relations, even though they're much closer
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| 13:19 | sbalneav has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:19 | <stgraber> hi sbalneav
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| 13:19 | <sbalneav> Afternoon all
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| 13:19 | Hey stgraber!
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| 13:19 | Are you still in Boston?
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| 13:19 | <stgraber> nope, back in Switzerland
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| 13:20 | <sbalneav> Cool! Good flight?
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| 13:21 | <stgraber> yes, I even have my baggage this time :)
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| 13:29 | <sbalneav> Bonus!
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| 13:48 | <warren> sbalneav, http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/ltsp-upstream.tar.bz2
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| 13:52 | masus has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:53 | <masus> hi all , new debian ezch ltsp-server installation with next-server but the clients cant login
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| 13:53 | can anybody help
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| 13:53 | "login failed"
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| 13:54 | <vagrantc> masus: i can help in a few minutes
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| 13:54 | <masus> ok thanks
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| 13:54 | jammcq has joined #ltsp | |
| 13:54 | <jammcq> hello kidz
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| 13:57 | <masus> hi jammcq
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| 13:58 | <jammcq> masus: hey
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| 14:01 | <sbalneav> jammcq!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 14:02 | Dude, where the heck are you!
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| 14:02 | <jammcq> Scotty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 14:02 | <sbalneav> We've been looking for you for hours!!!!
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| 14:02 | <jammcq> i've been BUSY
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| 14:02 | <davidj> ha!
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| 14:06 | <vagrantc> masus: ok ... so ... what version of ltsp do you have installed: dpkg -l 'ltsp*' | egrep ^ii
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| 14:06 | <masus> ii ltsp-server 0.99debian11 Basic LTSP server environment
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| 14:06 | pbx:~#
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| 14:06 | * vagrantc turns the mental clock back a year ... | |
| 14:07 | <vagrantc> masus: have you run ltsp-update-sshkeys ?
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| 14:07 | <masus> yes i have
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| 14:07 | <vagrantc> masus: you get a message saying "login failed" ?
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| 14:07 | <masus> yes
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| 14:08 | i have add these -> next-server 10.0.0.1; option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386";
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| 14:08 | <vagrantc> masus: dpkg --root=/opt/ltsp/i386 ldm 'ltsp*' | egrep ^ii
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| 14:08 | masus: if you're getting a login screen, dhcp is working fine.
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| 14:09 | <masus> i get a long message
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| 14:09 | <vagrantc> masus: dpkg --root=/opt/ltsp/i386 ldm 'ltsp*' | egrep ^ii
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| 14:09 | <masus> Options marked [*] produce a lot of output - pipe it through `less' or `more' !
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| 14:10 | this is the last lint of the message
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| 14:10 | <vagrantc> masus: where are you seeing this message ?
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| 14:10 | <masus> dpkg: need an action option
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| 14:10 | <vagrantc> masus: dpkg --root=/opt/ltsp/i386 -l ldm 'ltsp*' | egrep ^ii
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| 14:10 | sorry
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| 14:10 | <masus> ii ldm 0.99debian11 LTSP display manager
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| 14:10 | ii ltsp-client 0.99debian11 LTSP client environment
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| 14:11 | <vagrantc> masus: do you have an /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf ?
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| 14:11 | <masus> no
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| 14:11 | <vagrantc> ok.
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| 14:11 | masus: i really don't ever recall that version of ldm reporting any error messages ...
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| 14:12 | <masus> i see the kdm login page
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| 14:12 | <vagrantc> ah.
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| 14:12 | <masus> but always after i type my user and pass
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| 14:12 | <vagrantc> that's clearer
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| 14:12 | <masus> i get the message login failed
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| 14:12 | <vagrantc> masus: did you install kdm ?
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| 14:12 | <masus> yes
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| 14:13 | may i miss something ?
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| 14:13 | <vagrantc> masus: are you trying to log into the thin client or the server ?
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| 14:13 | <masus> client
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| 14:13 | <vagrantc> masus: or rather, why did you install kdm ... ?
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| 14:13 | <masus> what i have to install ?
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| 14:13 | <vagrantc> what are you trying to do ?
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| 14:14 | <masus> hmmm
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| 14:14 | how to explain
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| 14:14 | <vagrantc> a "normal" ltsp5 install uses ldm to log into the server. so why did you install kdm ?
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| 14:14 | <masus> oooh
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| 14:14 | so i have to install ldm ?
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| 14:15 | <vagrantc> masus: sounds like ldm is installed, but kdm will take priority if it's installed and you haven't told it to use ldm
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| 14:15 | <masus> it"s not important fopr me kde gnome or xfce
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| 14:15 | or ldm
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| 14:15 | <vagrantc> masus: did you do anything else to the chroot ?
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| 14:16 | <masus> no
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| 14:16 | only to /etc/exports
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| 14:16 | <vagrantc> masus: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/ apt-get remove kdm
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| 14:16 | masus: and reboot your thin client
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| 14:16 | <warren> sbalneav, http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/Makefile
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| 14:16 | sbalneav, non-functional example to insert for now.
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| 14:16 | <masus> ok i'll try
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| 14:17 | <vagrantc> warren: what are these *.spec files ?
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| 14:18 | <warren> vagrantc, that's the rpm spec file, the actual Makefile would pull it from some file in dist/
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| 14:19 | <vagrantc> warren: ah, got it.
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| 14:32 | <masus> vagrantc: after i remove kde , i can login but not a desktop
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| 14:32 | howto with kde desktop ?
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| 14:33 | <vagrantc> masus: on the *server*, apt-get install kde
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| 14:34 | <masus> first chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
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| 14:34 | or without
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| 14:34 | <vagrantc> NO.
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| 14:34 | <masus> hmmm
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| 14:34 | ok
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| 14:34 | <vagrantc> i always am explicit if something needs to be done in the chroot.
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| 14:35 | unless you're doing something weird, you usually don't install anything in the chroot
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| 14:36 | only thing you mess with in the chroot are occasionally configuration files
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| 14:36 | like lts.conf
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| 15:12 | <masus> vagrantc: thanks
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| 15:12 | it's working fine now
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| 15:12 | by all
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| 15:34 | <jammcq> laprag: hey
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| 15:34 | how are we feeling today?
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| 15:34 | <laprag> we have been feeling better
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| 15:34 | apt punishment though
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| 15:34 | <jammcq> you missed a wonderful breakfast and sight-seeing tour
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| 15:35 | <laprag> yeah
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| 15:35 | apt-get install feelbetter
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| 15:35 | <jammcq> file not found
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| 15:36 | <laprag> so are we doing something organised?
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| 15:37 | <jammcq> ummm
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| 15:37 | well, some of us are working (or thinking about working) on printing
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| 15:38 | we're also thinking about ordering the pizza
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| 15:38 | <laprag> ok, i'll read up on the webpage about status of printing
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| 15:38 | <jammcq> I'm not sure it's even there
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| 15:38 | <laprag> oh
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| 15:38 | <Gadi> there's a webpage?
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| 15:38 | <laprag> yes?
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| 15:42 | <jammcq> there's a webpage ?
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| 15:42 | who wants pizza ?
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| 15:42 | * jammcq proposes that all bts guys not on irc get no pizza | |
| 15:42 | <jammcq> sbalneav: you there?
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| 15:43 | * laprag seconds jammcq | |
| 15:44 | * laprag supports pizza | |
| 15:44 | <sbalneav> Present!
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| 15:44 | <laprag> scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 15:44 | <jammcq> sbalneav: you getting hungry?
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| 15:44 | <sbalneav> Yes
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| 15:44 | Pizza
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| 15:44 | * Gadi 's kingdom for a decent monitor | |
| 15:44 | <sbalneav> apt-get install pizza
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| 15:45 | <Gadi> sbalneav: do you have ur classmate around?
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| 15:45 | * Gadi doesnt mean jammcq | |
| 15:45 | <jammcq> moquist: hey, you want pizza?
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| 15:48 | <aep> pizza? oO
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| 15:50 | <laprag> sbalneav: is there a bot in the channel these days?
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| 15:53 | <Gadi> !s
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| 15:53 | <ltspbot> Gadi: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 15:54 | <Gadi> laprag: yes
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| 15:54 | :)
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| 15:55 | <Q-FUNK> pizzaa!!!!
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| 15:56 | <laprag> Gadi: OK!
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| 15:56 | !s
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| 15:56 | <ltspbot> laprag: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 15:56 | <laprag> !h
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| 15:56 | <ltspbot> laprag: Error: "h" is not a valid command.
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| 15:56 | <laprag> ltspbot: ping
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| 15:56 | <ltspbot> pong
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| 15:57 | <laprag> ltspbot: help
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| 15:57 | <ltspbot> laprag: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
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| 16:01 | <vagrantc> ltspbot: factoids --search values
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| 16:01 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: No keys matched that query.
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| 16:01 | <vagrantc> ltspbot: factoids search --values
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| 16:01 | <ltspbot> vagrantc: 'ltsp', 'sbalneav', 'icewm', 'frappr', 'wiki', 'debian', 'edubuntu', 'dhcpd', 'greyscreen', 'ltsp42', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'localdev', 'checklist', 'muekow', 'bestltspdistro', 'serversize', 'wireless', 'sound', 'topics', 'integration', 'lts.conf', 'pastebot', 'bootfloppy', 'ltsp5', 'tarball', 'download', 'monkeys', 'ogra', 'nfs', 'nfsnotresp', 'js', 's', 'troubleshooting', (1 more message)
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| 16:23 | <jammcq> ogra: hey
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| 16:23 | did you make it to the bus on time?
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| 16:25 | <moquist> jammcq: mmm, pizza sounds good.
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| 16:25 | <jammcq> zackly what I was thinking
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| 16:42 | <moquist> sbalneav: ldm isn't segfaulting for me after 3 bad password attempts. Or, if it IS SEGFAULTing, I don't know how to tell. The greeter is relaunching, in any case.
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| 16:44 | sbalneav: I don't see anything suspicious in ldm.log on the client or syslog on the server.
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| 16:44 | sbalneav: this is a totally stock gutsy edubuntu install.
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| 17:00 | GNet-User has joined #ltsp | |
| 17:00 | <GNet-User> hello to everyonee
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| 17:01 | i came here for info i've read a magazine and it says that i can come here
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| 17:02 | what is a thin client?
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| 17:03 | how much it costs?
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| 17:06 | noone available? what's going on?
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| 17:07 | ok thanks for the nothing! bye
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| 17:07 | GNet-User has left #ltsp | |
| 17:07 | <vagrantc> a thin client is a simple computer that boots off the network
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| 17:07 | pfft.
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| 17:11 | <cliebow> vagrantc: take this pizza..
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| 17:18 | <ogra> mmm, pizza
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| 17:19 | <vagrantc> all i have is vegetables and eggs.
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| 17:19 | <ogra> jammcq, nope, we decided to not get in a hurry and rather rearrange the luggage to fit the drum kit in
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| 17:19 | and in the end we were in plymouth 30min before the bus :)
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| 17:20 | <jammcq> heh
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| 17:20 | was the bus at 1pm or 4pm ?
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| 17:22 | <ogra> 2
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| 17:23 | * ogra needs to go downstairs, they are meeting up for dinner ... | |
| 17:23 | <ogra> bbl
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| 17:23 | ...
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| 17:24 | <sbalneav> vagrantc: If all you've got is veegetables and eggs, I smell a vegetarian omlette in the making!
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| 17:25 | <jammcq> hmm, salmonchanted omlette ?
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| 17:30 | <jammcq> GodFather: BOO !!!
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| 17:30 | <GodFather> hi
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| 17:41 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: i attempted a fritatta, but ended up with scramble
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| 18:00 | <sbalneav> GodFather: Boo!
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| 18:00 | vagrantc: Either way, you got a meal.
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| 18:37 | <davidj> "Holy $%%&, I got it right the first time" -- Scotty
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| 19:16 | <moquist> Gadi: tfile=`tempfile`; echo /usr/bin/ssh -S $control_file \$* > $tfile; ... rm $tfile
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| 19:17 | <moquist> cliebow: !!!!!!!
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| 19:17 | <cliebow> Hay!1
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| 19:35 | <Gadi> moquist: eh. I still like mattssh ;)
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| 20:23 | <warren> http://f3dora.org/paste/407
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| 20:26 | <vagrantc> warren: nice! i've been meaning to figure out how to set up that sort of thing with qemu
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| 20:29 | <warren> instead of qemu-kvm, the same syntax works with qemu
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| 20:32 | <vagrantc> i figured
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| 20:33 | i've used the slirp-style networking for years, but it doesn't really test the full configuration
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| 20:33 | <otavio> vagrantc: hi
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| 20:33 | <laprag> i made it just a little late into irc, could you please repost warren?
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| 20:33 | <vagrantc> otavio: sounds like we're finally getting some real upstream tarballs and such for ltsp :)
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| 20:34 | <Gadi> http://f3dora.org/paste/407
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| 20:34 | (thats for u, laprag)
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| 20:37 | <otavio> vagrantc: WOW! Finally
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| 20:37 | vagrantc: awesome!
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| 20:37 | <vagrantc> :)
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| 20:38 | some of it's a little over my head- i'm not real swift when it comes to Makefiles
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| 20:38 | <otavio> ?
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| 20:39 | <vagrantc> i'm not real good with make
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| 20:41 | otavio: and i'll really have to figure out dpatch or quilt now :)
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| 20:41 | <otavio> vagrantc: it's easy
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| 20:41 | vagrantc: :-)
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| 20:41 | vagrantc: ask for help if need
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| 20:43 | * otavio is not good with perl | |
| 20:48 | <vagrantc> otavio: i'm really hoping to see ltsp 5.0.39debian1 hit lenny before we do the major package split ... but the buildd's keep changing state ... or build the package but never upload it ...
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| 20:50 | <otavio> vagrantc: which arch?
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| 20:50 | <vagrantc> otavio: arm has been built twice now (once today, and once about a week ago), and hppa finished building on october 26th ... and powerpc keeps moving back into dep-wait
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| 20:51 | otavio: even though the package that the buildd is waiting on has already progressed into lenny
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| 20:52 | otavio: as far as i can read from the logs, nothing looks bad on any of the arm/hppa builds ...
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| 20:53 | otavio: http://buildd.debian.org/pkg.cgi?pkg=ltsp
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| 20:53 | m68k is slow, but that's not an issue for lenny
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| 20:54 | * vagrantc wonders if we shouldn't ignore some architectures | |
| 20:55 | <vagrantc> otavio: i guess we can upload the package split to experimental first ...
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| 20:56 | <sbalneav> otavio: You're gonna have to repackage everything though.
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| 20:56 | bzr get http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/jetpipe
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| 20:56 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: but it will be so much nicer :)
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| 20:56 | <sbalneav> bzr get http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/ldm
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| 20:56 | bzr get http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/ltsp
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| 20:56 | bzr get http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/ltspfs
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| 20:57 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: did you just start totally new branches ?
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| 20:57 | <sbalneav> Everything's broken ATM, but structure
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| 20:57 | s there.
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| 20:57 | Heck no.
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| 20:57 | I ruddy spent most of my day doing bzr mv bzr del
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| 20:57 | <vagrantc> so you forked off the existing branches ?
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| 20:57 | <sbalneav> yup
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| 20:57 | <vagrantc> heh
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| 20:58 | <sbalneav> ldm was the biggest pain in the ass
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| 20:58 | <vagrantc> yeah, i already ran through some of that
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| 20:58 | <sbalneav> since I had to fork the ltsp tree as a whole, and delete everything non ldm related.
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| 20:59 | All upstream stuff
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| 20:59 | is in the "dist" directory
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| 20:59 | make dist in all of them makes a tarball
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| 21:00 | "debian" dir is there, but either unpopulated or wrong for all four
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| 21:00 | so there's a metric sh*tpot of work left to do.
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| 21:01 | * vagrantc notes the need to merge the debian branch | |
| 21:02 | <sbalneav> You'll not be wanting to merge anything for a while.
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| 21:03 | part of localapps has landed in ltsp as well: xrexecd
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| 21:04 | gtkgreeter and ldm got merged together,
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| 21:05 | vagrantc: how fast could you do an example debian rules thingy in, say, jetpipe?
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| 21:05 | Which is pretty simple.
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| 21:05 | <otavio> wow
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| 21:06 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: quickest way would be to use cdbs, probably
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| 21:06 | pwd
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| 21:06 | ls
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| 21:06 | <sbalneav> If you could show me that one, I could probably split up the peices from the "old" ltsptree, and split out ldm, and patch things up for ltspfs, ldm, etc.
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| 21:06 | <vagrantc> but i know some people express reservations about cdbs
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| 21:07 | <sbalneav> I'm tired, and my back hurts. Wahhh
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| 21:07 | I know I know
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| 21:08 | "Want a little cheese to go with that whine?"
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| 21:08 | :)
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| 21:08 | <jammcq> heh
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| 21:08 | * vagrantc spent an extra 4 hours thinking vagrantc broke freegeek's mailing lists only to discover something else broke mail altogether at the same time | |
| 21:09 | <otavio> vagrantc: I like cdbs a lot
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| 21:09 | <vagrantc> otavio: me too.
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| 21:09 | <otavio> vagrantc: and personally use it here at work a lot
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| 21:09 | <sbalneav> What's cdbs
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| 21:09 | <otavio> vagrantc: personally I'd be ok to use it for all ltsp related packages if you don't mind to
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| 21:10 | sbalneav: a layer above debhelper to packaging Debian source
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| 21:10 | <sbalneav> Will that be ok with Oli?
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| 21:10 | <vagrantc> otavio: i'd be happy to do so for debian, but i'd like to try and check in with the ubuntu crowd if there are objections
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| 21:10 | <sbalneav> ogra: You there?
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| 21:10 | <otavio> sbalneav: you could see it as: dpkg-* -> debhelper -> cdbs
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| 21:11 | <otavio> ogra: :-)
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| 21:11 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: it's essentially a kitchen-sink of building debian packages
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| 21:11 | <davidj> warren: ping
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| 21:11 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: rather than all that craziness in debian/rules you normally see, you can trim it down to just a few lines
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| 21:11 | <sbalneav> OK, so enlighten me. Do it in jetpipe.
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| 21:12 | <otavio> sbalneav: the nicest thing about cdbs is that it's very powerful and easy to use for teams since we can write "helpers" that fit well on it and makes all set of policies possible without much hassle
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| 21:12 | <warren> davidj, ?
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| 21:12 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: so ... to get a source tarball ... ?
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| 21:12 | <sbalneav> make dist in the root repo
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| 21:13 | <vagrantc> wow, .bz2 makes a big difference
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| 21:13 | <jammcq> Gadi: ping
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| 21:13 | <otavio> sbalneav: what's jetpipe?
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| 21:13 | <vagrantc> half the size
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| 21:13 | <vagrantc> otavio: for supporting printing with thin clients
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| 21:13 | <Gadi> jammcq: pong 1 serving 0
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| 21:13 | <otavio> ah
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| 21:13 | davidj has joined #ltsp | |
| 21:13 | <davidj> query warren
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| 21:13 | ping
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| 21:13 | <sbalneav> it's the little hpjetdirect widget we supply to make a printer appear on the network.
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| 21:14 | might be useful for something else, so packaged separately.
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| 21:14 | <vagrantc> also, hopefully we'll only update it once in a great while ...
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| 21:14 | <sbalneav> right.
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| 21:15 | it's fairly simple
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| 21:15 | so the Debian stuff should go in the "debian" dir in the root of the repo
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| 21:15 | <otavio> sbalneav: I'd say to _not_ put debian/ theer
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| 21:16 | <vagrantc> otavio: it won't be in the tarball
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| 21:16 | <otavio> sbalneav: leave it outside and on debian/ubuntu only
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| 21:16 | <vagrantc> otavio: just in the bzr repo
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| 21:16 | <sbalneav> it won't be in the tarball that way.
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| 21:16 | <otavio> vagrantc: neither on it
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| 21:16 | <davidj> warren: BUS=="usb", SYSFS{product}=="Palm Handheld*|Handspring *", KERNEL=="ttyUSB*", NAME="ttyUSB%n", SYMLINK="pilot", GROUP="usb", MODE="0666"
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| 21:16 | <otavio> vagrantc: keep it separated
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| 21:16 | upstream / distros
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| 21:16 | <sbalneav> I want it in there.
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| 21:16 | <otavio> sbalneav: why?
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| 21:16 | <vagrantc> as an example
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| 21:16 | <sbalneav> Because.
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| 21:17 | That's where I want it.
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| 21:17 | * vagrantc kind of likes the idea | |
| 21:17 | <otavio> sbalneav: you'll be able to merge the branch there .. see no problem
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| 21:17 | sbalneav: usually, isn't good to have packaging files on upstream repository
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| 21:18 | sbalneav: mostly since it can get outdated
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| 21:18 | sbalneav: and so it lose its value
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| 21:18 | sbalneav: besides, it confuses who gets the source
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| 21:18 | <sbalneav> We discussed this yesterday between vagrantc, ogra, warren togami, jammcq, and mysel
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| 21:18 | <otavio> sbalneav: since it looksto be part of it
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| 21:18 | <sbalneav> it's an upstream decision
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| 21:18 | and that's the way it's gonna be.
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| 21:18 | You wanted upstream
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| 21:18 | you got it.
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| 21:19 | <otavio> sbalneav: oh .. :(
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| 21:19 | sbalneav: I would like to have been invited to this discussion
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| 21:19 | <davidj> I think there's going to be a "fedora" directory, too
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| 21:19 | <warren> otavio, there will be a fedora directory
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| 21:20 | otavio, although within dist, not outside it like debian.
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| 21:20 | <vagrantc> within dist ?
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| 21:20 | <warren> (ogra wanted it outside for some reason)
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| 21:20 | <sbalneav> You weren't around, vagrantc was.
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| 21:20 | * vagrantc would like it outside | |
| 21:20 | <otavio> well ... it has been decided without me so I doesn't look that I'm helping discussing it
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| 21:21 | * otavio goes to something else | |
| 21:21 | <vagrantc> hrm.
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| 21:21 | <warren> otavio, what exactly do you dislike about this?
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| 21:22 | <vagrantc> warren: i definitely don't like the idea of some distros including code in dist and some outside ...
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| 21:22 | <otavio> warren: the plugins dirs I agree since they're required to be used all around the distros but _packaging_ is really _specific_ so it ought to not be on upstream
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| 21:22 | warren: and you'll end up diverging the code anyway
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| 21:23 | <warren> otavio, LTSP-5 is useless on all distros without distro-specific plugins within the upstream tarball.
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| 21:23 | <otavio> warren: since in sometime in future you'll disaagree with upstream and keep patches
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| 21:23 | <warren> otavio, without those plugins it can't do anything.
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| 21:23 | <otavio> warren: plugins is OK
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| 21:23 | warren: packaging and specific things no
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| 21:23 | <warren> oh
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| 21:23 | <vagrantc> warren: packaging and plugins are totally different
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| 21:23 | <warren> otavio, you mean the debian directory shouldn't be here
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| 21:23 | <otavio> warren: neither fedora .spec
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| 21:23 | warren: neither what ever _not_ part of tarball
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| 21:24 | <warren> otavio, I think I understand
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| 21:24 | <otavio> warren: upstream repository _need_ to reflect what's the tarball
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| 21:24 | sbalneav: sorry but this is the way _I_ see it
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| 21:24 | <otavio> sbalneav: as you said, _you_ are the upstream ... do whatever you want
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| 21:25 | <warren> otavio, I think there is a disconnect here
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| 21:25 | * jammcq thinks so too | |
| 21:25 | <otavio> sbalneav: and wasn't polite to decide it without even talking to me
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| 21:25 | <warren> otavio, yes, .spec wont be in upstream's bzr
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| 21:25 | otavio, the equivalent debian/ubuntu to rpm's .spec probably shouldn't either.
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| 21:26 | <otavio> sbalneav: I think I had some important participation on what's now LTSP 5
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| 21:26 | sbalneav: it would be repect to ping me
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| 21:26 | <warren> otavio, however I think ogra failed to make a distinction between the packaging recipe and distro specific plugins.
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| 21:26 | <sbalneav> otavio: It was well publicized we were going to be doing this this weekend.
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| 21:26 | <otavio> sbalneav: since we have been asking for it for more then a year
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| 21:26 | <warren> otavio, ogra is the one that wanted the debian directory out of dist
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| 21:26 | <sbalneav> And vagrantc was aware, I assume that debian developers communicate.
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| 21:26 | <warren> otavio, I suspect *a* debian directory containing debian/ubuntu specific plugins belongs in dist
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| 21:26 | <otavio> warren: plugins or packaging?
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| 21:27 | <warren> otavio, but the packaging recipe doesn't belong upstream
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| 21:27 | <sbalneav> And vagrantc WAS there, and was in on this decision, so Debian was represented.
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| 21:27 | <otavio> warren: on plugins there're two: one for debian and another to ubuntu
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| 21:27 | sbalneav: it's not Debian
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| 21:27 | sbalneav: but upstream work
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| 21:27 | sbalneav: and some code was written by me and vagrant
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| 21:28 | sbalneav: so looks logical to at least send an e-mail or ask vagrant to ping me
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| 21:28 | warren: exactly
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| 21:28 | <warren> otavio, I think the fundamental disconnect is made by ogra's misunderstanding, there is no need for anyone to be upset.
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| 21:28 | <vagrantc> otavio: sorry, i should have told you sooner
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| 21:28 | <warren> otavio, we simply need to disconnect the "debian" directory idea of plugins vs. packaging
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| 21:28 | plugins belong in dist, upstream
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| 21:28 | <jammcq> otavio: ya know what.... I should have invited you to LTSP-bts-2007. I take full responsibility for you not knowing that we'd be working on this stuff this weekend
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| 21:28 | <warren> packaging doesn't
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| 21:29 | <otavio> warren: yes. you got it
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| 21:29 | <jammcq> and for that, please accept my appology
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| 21:29 | <otavio> warren: plugins is distro support and it belongs to upstream
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| 21:29 | warren: packaging and specific patches doesn't
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| 21:29 | <warren> right ok
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| 21:29 | <otavio> warren: and specific patches _will exist_
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| 21:29 | <warren> in the distro's packaging
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| 21:29 | * vagrantc tries to get jetpipe to build | |
| 21:30 | <otavio> warren: there're a bunch of rpm based distros that will use fedora with patches above
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| 21:31 | <warren> otavio, or they are welcome to create their own distro-specific plugins dir in upstream's bzr
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| 21:31 | <otavio> warren: yes
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| 21:31 | warren: but they'll first use fedora as basis
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| 21:31 | <warren> muwhahahahha
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| 21:31 | <otavio> warren: like ubuntu was done when we wrote it in 2006
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| 21:31 | <warren> oh
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| 21:31 | * warren quit. | |
| 21:32 | <otavio> warren: it was first made as changes and then we split it in another plugin dir
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| 21:33 | <vagrantc> the plugins allow for multiple distros to take a look at what other distros are doing, while still remain separate ...
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| 21:34 | <otavio> well .. I think I've make clear what I think ... now I'm gona work on debian-cd
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| 21:44 | <otavio> jammcq: ok, np
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| 21:45 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: ok, got a quick and dirty debian dir for jetpipe
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| 21:45 | sbalneav: it's got some templates left in it, but i think you get the idea
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| 21:49 | sbalneav: there's a bazillion other ways to do it
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| 21:49 | <sbalneav> ok, lay it on me.
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| 21:50 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/jetpipe-debian-dir
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| 21:50 | <sbalneav> ldm is so broken.
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| 21:50 | * vagrantc heads for a sauna | |
| 21:50 | <jammcq> you touched it last
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| 21:50 | <sbalneav> Do I merge that with jetpipe? (just being clear)
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| 21:50 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: it's just the debian dir ... not any of the dist stuff
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| 21:51 | sbalneav: so you could: bzr get http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/jetpipe-debian-dir debian
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| 21:51 | sbalneav: from within your unpacked source dir
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| 21:51 | <sbalneav> ah, ok
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| 21:52 | <vagrantc> sbalneav: here's a simple class i taught a while back: http://wiki.freegeek.org/index.php/Basic_Debian_Packaging
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| 21:52 | <cliebow> v agrantc: thank you
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| 21:54 | <moquist> Gadi: moquist@majen.net
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| 21:54 | <vagrantc> we could maybe use the autotools cdbs rules ...
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| 21:54 | <otavio> vagrantc: it's good since it uses it in cross compiling compatible ways and like
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| 21:55 | <vagrantc> otavio: if i wasn't leaving in 5 minutes, i'd play with it a little more :)
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| 21:55 | * vagrantc isn't real autotools savvy either | |
| 21:55 | <vagrantc> that's why there's things like cdbs :)
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| 21:56 | <moquist> sbalneav: would you like a break to answer questions I have that you've probably already answered for yourself, or would that just be an unwelcome distraction?
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| 21:56 | <vagrantc> night all
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| 21:56 | * vagrantc waves | |
| 21:56 | <Gadi> moquist: sent
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| 21:56 | <jammcq> g'nite
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| 21:56 | <moquist> Gadi: k
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| 21:56 | * Gadi waves to vagrantc | |
| 21:56 | <Gadi> and blows kisses
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| 21:56 | * moquist does the wave | |
| 21:56 | <Gadi> and wishes you were here
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| 21:56 | <davidj> vagrantc: 'night!
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| 21:57 | <moquist> vagrantc: buh-bye
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| 21:57 | <vagrantc> Gadi: another time...
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| 21:57 | <Gadi> vagrantc: bring the sauna
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| 21:57 | ;)
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| 21:57 | <vagrantc> heh
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