IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 22 July 2009   (all times are UTC)

00:00
<stgraber>
will let it build and test it tomorrow if possible, then I hope to have time to look at that udhcpc script and some additional cleanup (I still have some work for the d-i part ...)
00:01
anyway, time for some sleep now, meetings all day tomorrow ...
00:01
<alkisg>
thanks, stgraber :)
00:01
Good morning all
00:02* vagrantc watches the storks sillouhetted by the sunrise
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00:41
<sbalneav>
alkisg: Can you give my sabayon ubuntu11 a try?
00:42
<alkisg>
sbalneav: sure, is it in your ppa?
00:42
ok, installing...
00:45
<sbalneav>
yep
00:48
<alkisg>
sbalneav: nah, still hanging at "edit" without generating any error logs...
00:49
sbalneav: these are the last lines of strace before hanging: http://pastebin.com/f2bfbdd6b
00:53
<sbalneav>
Try creating a /root/sabayon-debug-log.conf with the following lines.
00:53
[debug log]
00:53
max lines = 1000
00:53
enable domains = user-profile;storage;panel-delegate;gconf-source;files-source;mozilla-source;proto-session;usermod;dir-monitor;user-db;cache;admin-tool;sabayon-apply;sabayon-session;pesselus;depreciated
00:53
the last line's all one line.
00:55
strace's not gonna give you much with Sabayon. It's a python program, so it'll be hard to tell what's "sabayon" bits and what's python housekeeping.
01:01
<alkisg>
sbalneav: still no log. I think it's waiting on some socket.... connect(5, {sa_family=AF_INET, sin_port=htons(6001), sin_addr=inet_addr("127.0.0.1")}, 16
01:02
Xephyr :2 -query <my-ip> works fine, btw...
01:06* sbalneav shrugs
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01:06
<sbalneav>
Well, try to think of anything that may be unusual with your config.
01:07
I'm heading to bed.
01:07
1am here.
01:07
<alkisg>
OK, thanks man
01:07
I'll try it in a "just installed" environment
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01:17
<Ahmuck>
ltspfsd dies ?
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02:07* nubae is installing cluster ltsp, following documentation at wiki.stgraber.org, can one use more than one machine with openvnz, or is that thought for just one machine?
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04:51
<tarzeau>
vagrantc: you're at DEBCONF?
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04:52
<vagrantc>
tarzeau: yes
04:53
tarzeau: are you?
04:53
<tarzeau>
no, i'm in zurich. what would i do in the desert of nowhere in spain?
04:53
<vagrantc>
drink wine :)
04:53
<tarzeau>
i'm a water man, i need rivers, the sea and lakes
04:53* vagrantc has learned to appreciate many bioregions, though comes from a water rich area
04:55
<nubae>
vagrantc, u are next door to me then... I am working for Guadalinex, Andalucia's linux distro
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04:57
<vagrantc>
nubae: i think i visited some of the guadalinex sites in sevilla
04:58
<nubae>
oh nice
04:58
<vagrantc>
nubae: i've got some time to kill post-conference ... would you be up for meeting up?
04:58
<nubae>
vagrantc, sure thing
04:58
<vagrantc>
nubae: where you at?
04:58
<nubae>
would u be up for checking out Sevilla?
04:58
I'm in Sevilla
04:58
<vagrantc>
nubae: sure... i've been there before ... not hard to get to.
04:59
i think it's not hard to get to from caceres
04:59
<nubae>
yeah, its very close
04:59
lots of fiestas around Sevilla now too
04:59
though its hot, really hot
04:59* vagrantc needs to find some cheap places to stay, too
05:00
<nubae>
there is a hostal I was staying at until recently for 30 euros a night
05:00
no AC though :-)
05:00* vagrantc would hope to find a bit cheaper ...
05:01
<vagrantc>
nubae: are you usually in sevilla, or are you traveling as well?
05:01
<nubae>
yeah there might be something more central, I picked this place cause it was close to work... and now rent a studio, so I'd invite u, but have no room unfortunately
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05:01
<nubae>
right now project requires that I stick around Sevilla
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05:02
<nubae>
I can check around for something cheap though
05:03
<vagrantc>
that'd be great ... i need to be back in madrid on august 11th, and the conference ends on the july 31st ... but between then... i've got some time to kill
05:03
<nubae>
http://www.sevillaurbany.com/ 15 euros
05:04
<vagrantc>
heh. that's the one i stayed at a couple years ago ... heh
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05:04
<nubae>
hehe
05:05
for 20 euros there is pension gravina
05:06
http://www.hostales-sp.com/hostales-pensiones-sevilla/documentos/pensiones-sevilla-pension-gravina-17.asp
05:06
and has internet accesss
05:06
<vagrantc>
pension probably comes with food i'm not likely able to eat...
05:07
<nubae>
says it doesnt: No disponemos de servicio de desayunos
05:07
<vagrantc>
hm
05:08
urbany wasn't bad
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05:08
<nubae>
u have to share a room there maybe though, if u dont mind, and not sure about internet access
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05:13
<vagrantc>
nubae: it had internet 2 years ago ... for the prices i'm looking for, pretty much have to expect to share a room :)
05:14
<nubae>
yeah
05:19
<alkisg>
AFAIK, mkxauth isn't available in Ubuntu. What else can I use to copy all the user xauthority files to mine (==teacher==root) so that I can broadcast video on their displays?
05:20
I could do xhost +server, but I'm looking for something more elegant
05:21
<nubae>
anyone tried out ltsp-cluster? I'km installing the openvz templates and the installer is dying when I try to install the jaunty template
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05:24* alkisg looks at xauth merge...
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05:26* alkisg dances the "succesfully tricked totem into broadcasting video to all students" dance! :)
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05:29
<nubae>
nice
05:29
<alkisg>
Yup, the teacher has all the totem interface so he can pause/resume the video, and the students only have a window which they are able to resize
05:30* alkisg prepares a "start-gstreamer-broadcasting" script...
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05:47* alkisg thinks that with the istanbul gstreamer plugin, this should also make it possible for the teacher to broadcast his desktop with much, much more fps than with italc...
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08:01
<ogra>
stgraber, meh, you broke ltsp
08:01
at least the installer
08:01
stgraber, Filename: pool/universe/u/udhcp/udhcpc_0.9.8cvs20050303-2.1_i386.deb
08:02
... makes ltsp-client-core uninstallable
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08:13
<stgraber>
ogra: thought it was approved ... didn't check to see if it was moved to main ...
08:14
<ogra>
well, we wont have A3 ltsp then i guess
08:14
<stgraber>
well, d-i will fail yes ... it'll work if built manually afterwards though
08:15
<ogra>
do we have universe on in the chroot ?
08:15* ogra cant remember
08:20
<alkisg>
I think so, yes (with the alternate cd)
08:20
<stgraber>
ogra: we do
08:20
otherwise I'd have seen the udhcp issue
08:21
<ogra>
ah, i think we added it when xubuntu moved to universe, right
08:21
<stgraber>
I didn't have the time to boot a thin client for testing but I had the time to generate a chroot to make sure it built fine
08:41
<sbalneav>
Morning all
08:42
<cliebow>
Scottie!!
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08:51
<_UsUrPeR_>
has anyone had any luck getting ekiga to run via ltsp-localapps?
08:52
^^^ addendum: Ubuntu 9.04
08:52makghosh has quit IRC
08:52* _UsUrPeR_ has had ekiga running in 8.10
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09:00
<sbalneav>
Morning cliebow
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09:21
<etyack>
Morning sbalneav
09:28
<sbalneav>
morning etyack!!
09:28
moquist: That you?
09:28
<johnny>
sbalneav, i think i know somebody you're working with.. or may work with
09:28
the folks at parit
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09:30
<sbalneav>
Yup, I know a few folks from ParIT
09:30
Mark Jenkins the best
09:32
<johnny>
jamie campbell contacted the other day about how we work at red emma's
09:33
neat that i know somebody you know IRL
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09:39
<sbalneav>
Free Software's a small, small world.
09:39
Getting smaller, it seems :(
09:40
<bieb>
may be small.. but good people.. :D
09:44
sbalneav: Scott.. I am running apt-get update now.. I will let you know when sabayon is updated and I can test it
09:44
<sbalneav>
ok
09:45
<bieb>
Sabayon will help me create multiple images/profiles to run correct?
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09:47
<denisesballs>
hey guys, is it default for ltsp to NOT have a separate chroot anymore? I did the ubuntu LTSP server install and it seems that the chroot is only for the boot process
09:48
<johnny>
that's how it has worked the entire time
09:48
from boot to the login screen
09:49
<denisesballs>
i thought it was common to have the entire terminal / inside a chroot?
09:49
<johnny>
nope
09:49
well that is still the case really.. the chroot is the terminal root
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09:49
<johnny>
what happens after login is all on the server /
09:49
<denisesballs>
interesting. but you can do that, correct? have a separate chroot for terminal users?
09:50
<johnny>
why?
09:50
if you want to go through alot of hassle i guess
09:50
<denisesballs>
ive just heard of people doing that
09:50
<johnny>
the best thing for that would be to run the ltsp server as a virtual machine
09:50
<denisesballs>
i dont see the point
09:50
<bieb>
but do you have to create a second chroot for local apps? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPLocalAppsJaunty
09:51
<johnny>
bieb, no
09:51
you an install them in that chroot
09:51
altho you could have a second chroot if you wanted a fatclient like nubae's scxript
09:51
where everything works local
09:51
<denisesballs>
bieb:, that what was confusing me, specifically this page - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UpdatingChroot
09:52
<johnny>
that's for boot process stuff
09:52
that document i mean
09:52
<denisesballs>
ok, i couldnt tell for sure
09:52
<bieb>
johnny: so from that localapps doc.. do you just start with #2?
09:53
<johnny>
yeah, you can do that..
09:53
altho for testing.. it'd be a good idea to leave your chroot pristine until you're sure
09:53
and use a seperate one
09:53
<bieb>
I see
09:53
the only local app I am thinking about running is Firefox
09:53
<denisesballs>
so is that document specifically for doing a chroot like i was saying johnny?
09:53
<johnny>
no
09:54
you can do all that stuff in the regular chroot
09:54
<denisesballs>
what i meant was, is that document showing how to setup the separate chroot, like i asked originally?
09:54
<johnny>
sure.. probably for testing
09:54
so it doesn't clobber your current working one
09:55
<denisesballs>
ahhh, i see
09:55
<johnny>
the most popular use case for a completely seperate chroot is for the fat client addition
09:55
if you have some really powerful clients
09:55
and want to run all apps locally
09:56
with some terms, but not others
09:56
<denisesballs>
ok cool
09:56
<johnny>
but most people don't do that
09:56
<denisesballs>
i have a question for a case i just noticed, not sure if you can help
09:57
i noticed that if you disable sound (SOUND=False) flashplayer crashes firefox. can you think of a more graceful way to address that without just enabling sound again?
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09:58
<johnny>
uhmm.. create a fake sound device maybe?
09:59
<sbalneav>
denisesballs: Probably a null sound sink
09:59
Or, my favorite, ditch flash :)
09:59
<johnny>
hmm.. so perhaps we should change what SOUND=N does
09:59
<sbalneav>
no
09:59
<johnny>
you don't think so? i think it might crash other apps?
09:59
<denisesballs>
this might be a specific case, since my server is 64-bit, i had to install the beta 64-bit flashplayer, and the machines are i386
10:00
<johnny>
nah
10:00
<sbalneav>
If someone actually doesn't WANT sound, say on a low ram thin client, we want to have a way to stop pulse from starting.
10:00
<johnny>
unless it's the beta actually
10:00
err the beta causing the problem
10:00
<denisesballs>
but i traced it to flash looking for pulse and not finding it, want the CLI output from FF crash?
10:00
<johnny>
but there is no public bug tracker iirc
10:00
denisesballs, that won't help.. ther'es not much we can do
10:00
you should create the null sink i guess
10:01
<Lumiere>
btw guys
10:01
if you're having problems with audio in pulse
10:01
take a look at earcandy on lp
10:01
<johnny>
i posted that here btw Lumiere :)
10:01
lns was excited about it
10:01
<Lumiere>
yea
10:01
that fixed my flash sound issues
10:01
instantly
10:01
<denisesballs>
i actually dont want them to be able to have sound, these machines dont even have sound cards
10:01
<Lumiere>
denisesballs: ah
10:02
<denisesballs>
is there document on the null sound sink? thats a new one to me
10:02
<Lumiere>
denisesballs: remove the alsa and pulse audio packages ;)
10:02
<denisesballs>
thats it?
10:03
<johnny>
if they don't have soundcards.. you could just leave SOUND=T .. that's what i do..
10:03
but i guess my machines are powerful enough for it not to matter
10:03
<denisesballs>
we're having issues on our current setup where artsd pegs the CPU pretty often
10:03
that was my solution to that
10:03
<sbalneav>
If Flash crashes when sound isn't enabled, then that's a flash issue, and a bug should be filed with them.
10:03
<denisesballs>
even though arts is deprecated i think and we're gonna move to gnome
10:04
sbalneav: ever tried to get adobe to fix a bug? especially for a beta product? not gonna happen anytime soon
10:05
Lumiere: is that really all i need to no is remove alsa and pulse? isnt flash still gonna look for a sound device?
10:05
i thought we were gonna trick it somehow
10:05
<johnny>
artsd yuck.. they still use that?
10:05
<denisesballs>
i think artsd is deprecated now
10:05
i just wanna avoid something similar in the future
10:06
<sbalneav>
denisesballs: yes, flash will still look for an audio device, and crash, I'd assume.
10:06
<denisesballs>
yeah don't think that's gonna help then
10:06
<johnny>
will creating the null sink actually be any better than just leaving SOUND=T ?
10:07
i don't think it will
10:07
<ogra>
it should play sound to /dev/null then
10:07
<johnny>
sure.. but will it uses any less resources?
10:07
<sbalneav>
How about using one of the free flash alternatives? If you're just looking for youtbe, there's a gstreamer greasemonkey script that works fine.
10:07
<ogra>
but will still provide the alsa interface for the apps
10:07
<johnny>
the machines don't have any sound cards anyways ogra
10:07
and it works fine with SOUND=T
10:07
<ogra>
the machines dont matter
10:07
the sessions do ;)
10:08
<johnny>
sure.. but will it uses any less resources?
10:08
seems like it will still send the same data
10:08
<denisesballs>
is i create a fake sound device sound will be disabled but probably only flash will use it so it will use less resources overall, but not when flash is, no?
10:09
<ogra>
but to /dev/null on the server
10:09
<johnny>
ah.. /dev/null on the server.. ok so that would be a bit better
10:09
<ogra>
right
10:09
<denisesballs>
is there a document i can follow to try it out? never done that before
10:09
<ogra>
you need to create an ~/.asoundconf.asoundrc for every user
10:09
or some such
10:10
<johnny>
oh.. so you're just not going to send to pulse at all
10:10
it won't even get to pulse null sink
10:10
<ogra>
~/.asoundrc.asoundconf actually
10:10
<sbalneav>
denisesballs: alsa docs, prolly
10:10
<johnny>
can't you just set it globally in /etc/asoundrc ?
10:10
<denisesballs>
i was gonna say the same thing
10:11
or create /etc/asound.conf
10:11
<johnny>
yeah.. whatever it is called
10:11
<ogra>
no, not in ubuntu
10:11
<johnny>
oh
10:11
<ogra>
its ignored
10:11
<johnny>
weirdobuntu
10:11
<ogra>
and it wouldnt help anyway
10:11
because the pulse session writes the user config
10:11
<johnny>
ah
10:11
<ogra>
which overrides system
10:11
<johnny>
i always get confused about what happens with sound on ubuntu
10:12
<ogra>
we stick as close to upstream as possible
10:12
thats the prob
10:12
its in bad condition so they move fast
10:12
both, alsa and pulse
10:13
<denisesballs>
i'm not sure what to look for
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10:13
<ogra>
http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/alsa-lib/pcm_plugins.html
10:13
pcm.name {
10:13
type null # Null PCM
10:13
}
10:14
<denisesballs>
yep, see it
10:14
<ogra>
your config file should have these two lines:
10:14
pcm.!default { type null }
10:14
ctl.!default { type null }
10:14
<denisesballs>
k, let me try that
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10:18
<denisesballs>
/usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf shows in ubuntu "files ["/etc/asound.conf" "~/.asoundrc" so i think i can create /etc/asound.conf globally, no?
10:19
<johnny>
denisesballs, it's ignored as ogra said
10:19
<ogra>
no, because a user config will be created on login
10:19
user config overrides system
10:19
<johnny>
well.. overridden perhaps :)
10:19
<denisesballs>
:q
10:19
ah i understand
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10:21
<denisesballs>
where do all these files come from, not /etc/skell right?
10:21
skel*
10:22
<ogra>
nope
10:23
some autostart stuff
10:24
<denisesballs>
where can i adjust that then?
10:25
hmm...it did stop it from crashing, but the video doesnt play now, just has a spinning loading icon although the progress bar is moving
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10:27
<ogra>
you can create a file in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/
10:27
would be one option
10:28
<denisesballs>
i'
10:29
i'm more curious where it pulls everything for the first time login, like /etc/skel would be. im gonna need to put a lot of stuff in there
10:29
<ogra>
look in /etc/skel
10:29
it pulls in everything you find there
10:30
at user creation time though, not at first login
10:30
<denisesballs>
that only has the Examples folder though, what creates the Videos Pictures Desktop etc folders?
10:31
<ogra>
the scripts called from /etc/X11/Xsession.d/ or via the xdg autostart mechanism
10:33
sbalneav, gnome wasnt "patched" it was just designed better to monitor /media ;)
10:34
<denisesballs>
this doesnt appear to be a solution, but good idea guys
10:34
<ogra>
??
10:35
<denisesballs>
the flash thing
10:35
<ogra>
oh
10:35
<denisesballs>
it doesnt crash, but video doesnt play
10:35
<ogra>
did you uninstall pulse ?
10:35
<denisesballs>
no, should i?
10:35
<ogra>
try that
10:35
i think flash tries to use pulse by default instead of alsa if its installed
10:36
<denisesballs>
well it did stop from crashing though, so that setting must help
10:36
<sbalneav>
ogra: There were some custom patches to deal with the /media/userid links originally, though.
10:36
<ogra>
sbalneav, to omit *all* devices from showing up
10:37
else you see all ltspfs mounts on the server
10:37
indeed, thats patched, but by design gnome always monitored /media and will go on doing so
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10:40
<denisesballs>
sbalneav: that worked!
10:40
<_UsUrPeR_>
has anyone had any luck getting ekiga to work in 9.04 localapps?
10:40
<denisesballs>
and it overwrote my .asoundrc.asoundconf too, so its not even using htat setting now
10:42
<sbalneav>
ogra: So, my point stands. :) There's some fancy footwork in gmome that other desktops can/should do to get similar functionality :)
10:43
<ogra>
no, the complaint was that nothing shows on the desktop in the other systems :)
10:43
gnome was only patches because it showed to much ;)
10:43
*patched
10:44
the point is that gnome initially designed it right while xfce and KDE didnt
10:44
<denisesballs>
ogra: meant to say that to you. also, it still complains saying *** PULSEAUDIO: Unable to connect: Connection refused ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:1207:(_snd_pcm_hw_open) Invalid value for card
10:44
if i try adding the null sink, it stop complaining but video doesnt play again
10:44
so basically just uninstalling pulse stops firefox from crashing, and i can still have sound disabled
10:45
<ogra>
try setting SOUND=False in lts,conf
10:45
<denisesballs>
its been like that the whole time
10:45
<ogra>
then PULSE_SERVER wont be set
10:45
<johnny>
ogra, that's the start of the problem
10:45
<ogra>
ah
10:45
<johnny>
if SOUND=F flash crashes firefox
10:45
<sbalneav>
ogra: So, really, we're only arguing about *implementation details*. I vote we continue this conversation at the pub.
10:45* sbalneav passes ogra a Heffeweisen
10:45
<denisesballs>
johnny, but with pulse uninstalled it does not
10:46
<johnny>
well go with that then :)
10:46
<denisesballs>
yeah, great
10:47
do you guys recommend the gnomewatchdog?
10:48
<ogra>
sbalneav, yummy ...
10:48* ogra hands sbalneav a pilsner urquell ...
10:48
<sbalneav>
Ooooh
10:48
*LOVE* that beer
10:48
<ogra>
just because i love so much how you pronouce it :)
10:48
<sbalneav>
hard to get around here.
10:48* ogra has a sixpack in the kitchen
10:49
<ogra>
though i'm not allowed beer ... but i wont tell my doc
10:49
<sbalneav>
You say tomato, I say tomahto, bottom line is, the beer tastes just as good no matter how you say it L)
10:49
:) even
10:49
<ogra>
heh
10:50
<sbalneav>
A german not allowed beer?
10:50
That's like a canadian not allowed... er, beer.
10:51
A tragedy!
10:51
<bieb>
ahhhhh german with no beer.. thats badddddd
10:52
<ogra>
well, i switched to red wine :)
10:52
just keep some beer around for special days
10:52* CAN-o-SPAM wonders how often "beer" is mentioned in the free software world
10:53
<bieb>
free as in....
10:53
:D
10:53
<sbalneav>
CAN-o-SPAM: Constantly.
10:53
<bieb>
ogra what is bad with the beer for you??
10:53
<sbalneav>
Free Software programmers are machines for turning Beer, Lobster, and Steak into lines of code.
10:53
<ogra>
my doc found gout indicators in my blood
10:53
<CAN-o-SPAM>
anyone had the opportunity to have a good ol' "mitten state" brew ... called Bells Oberon?
10:54
<ogra>
so i have to stick to a special diet
10:54
along that i have a very high blood pressure ... so i'm not allowed fat and salt
10:55* ogra lights another cigarette ... :P
10:55
<bieb>
ogra: sorry to hear that... I was off beer for awhile when I was first diagnosed with diabetes.. but talked to one Doc that said.. "it's ok to have a beer on occassion, just don't go out and get hammered"
10:55
<ogra>
yeah
10:55
<bieb>
so I see that Today is July 22nd and that is a special occassion... cause July 22nd wont be here again til next year... :P
10:56
<ogra>
well, the diet isnt doing me bad ... i cook a lot more now
10:57
<bieb>
I have done pretty well with the diet too.. lost 23lbs over the last 9 months
10:59
<CAN-o-SPAM>
LTSP Beers From Around The World - "Keynote" Session at LTSP BTS October, 2009 Maine, USA :)
10:59
<bieb>
I am just hoping the beer and lobster in Maine are the low carb variety.. :)
11:00* ogra lost about 10kg since he started in march
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11:33
<ogra>
funny, i thought i had seen that commit from vagrantc_ already
11:39
<Ahmuck>
customized menus by user, possible?
11:40
<vagrantc_>
ogra: i think i pondered adding it, but since it didn't actually fix the issue, i decided to wait ... now that i have a better handle on what's wrong, i feel more ok about adding that
11:43
<ogra>
yeah, it just felt like a dejavu, but bzr disagrees
11:43* Ahmuck reading the docs
11:44
<Ahmuck>
will ltsp store client configurations in a file automagically. ie, upon boot reads the hardware and stores it by mac address?
11:46
<vagrantc_>
no
11:46
autodetects every time
11:47
<Ahmuck>
is lts.conf case sensitive?
11:49
NBD_SWAP can be used from the local client?
11:49Lns has joined #ltsp
11:51
<Ahmuck>
what is nasd?
11:51
<sbalneav>
The old KDE sound daemon
11:52IBC_jkenney has joined #ltsp
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11:52
<IBC_jkenney>
does anyone know of where i can get benchmark information on the pro's and cons of running e17 and gnome on thin clients versus server overhead?
11:53lejo has joined #ltsp
11:54
<sbalneav>
IBC_jkenney: I don't think I've ever seen any solid benchmark stats on LTSP server load, let alone with a config that specific.
11:56
<Ahmuck>
lts.conf is case sensitive? "VARIABLE = Value" vs. "variable = value"
11:57
<sbalneav>
yes
11:58
<denisesballs>
do you guys know if nspr bug is still an issue? http://lns.wikidot.com/nsprupdate
11:58
using 8.04.3 LTS
11:58
found the link on here https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/Firefox3Optimize dated 2009-02-03
11:58* Lns looks on the bug report
11:59
<IBC_jkenney>
sbalneav thanks for the response i'm still looking I wanted to too which used less resources to run but i think they are all about equal
11:59
<Lns>
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bug/269188
11:59
denisesballs, looks like alexander sack (asac) is working on it. Maybe you can ping him in #ubuntu-mozillateam
11:59
<denisesballs>
Lns: I did read that, but couldnt tell if the package in 8.04.3 was still affected
11:59
oh ok
12:00* Lns should maybe clean up his wiki, there's a lot of reeeeeeeeeally old info in it
12:00
<ogra>
well, the hardy task for nspr on that bugreport clearly states "in progress"
12:00
<Lns>
ogra, nobody looks at that stuff ;)
12:01
<ogra>
alex does
12:01pbhat has joined #ltsp
12:01
<Lns>
hehe
12:01
he's been so awesome helping out with that issue
12:01
<ogra>
he just also maintains network-manager, thunderbird, etc etc and does the whole SRU stuff for all of them
12:01subhodip has quit IRC
12:02
<johnny>
ahh.. the myspace transport works
12:02
<ogra>
thats a massive workload, so he wont work on each bug all the time every day
12:02
<johnny>
neat
12:02
now if only i could get the facebook one to work..
12:02
<Lns>
ogra, as a dev, can you enlighten me as to the standard process of going through bugs that are assigned to you? Maybe just a quick summary of the workflow process?
12:03
<ogra>
that really depends on the bug ... or do you mean the triaging process ?
12:04
<Lns>
not necessarily triaging, just going to fix them...what kind of timeline do you give yourselves, is there a standard process, or is every dev different in handling things? Are there "required times" to have certain things done, etc?
12:04
<ogra>
https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ogra/+assignedbugs
12:05
<johnny>
required times.. probably only when fixing blocker bugs..
12:05
<pbhat>
I am using ltsp 4.2 on Opensuse 10.3. There is no ltsp5 for opensuse 10.3.I want to get sound on the workstations.What steps should I take?
12:05
<ogra>
i cant speak for voluntary devs
12:05IBC_jkenney has quit IRC
12:05
<ogra>
the way we do it in my team is that we discuss the bugs and try to identify their impact
12:06
based on that assign a prio
12:06
and based on the prio i try to demote time to them
12:06
<Lns>
pbhat, might want to check #kiwi-ltsp (that's it, right?)
12:06
<ogra>
we review the buglist every week in a teammeeting
12:06
yes, go to #kiwi-ltsp
12:06
<Lns>
ogra, gotcha.. that helps, thank you =)
12:07
<johnny>
ltsp4 isn't kiwi is it?
12:07
<ogra>
if you look at my assigned lists there are also upstream bugs
12:07
<pbhat>
Lns,I have checked kiwi-ltsp and chatted with them.But they do not support opensuse 10.3
12:07
<johnny>
then you are stuck
12:07
nobody really supports ltsp 4
12:07
<ogra>
i.e. all the USB Imagewriter stuff is stuff i do in my sparetime ...
12:07
so they rot a bit longer usually
12:07
<pbhat>
i am successfully using ltsp 4.2
12:07
<ogra>
until i find a free weekend
12:07
<johnny>
obviously not.. no sound :)
12:08
i'm just glad i never had to touch 4.2..
12:08
<Lns>
ogra, so with upstream bugs, you basically wait for their team to fix?
12:08
<ogra>
gah, i just notice that stgraber missed to mention both bugs in the package changelog ...
12:08* ogra goes to close the two ltsp bugs on that list
12:09intelliant__ has quit IRC
12:09
<ogra>
Lns, thanks for making me look at the list ;) i would have missed them :)
12:09* Lns remembers trying 4.2 a few years ago...yikes, that was a project, haha
12:09
<johnny>
Lns, i think that is dependent on the bug..
12:09
<Lns>
ogra, hey no prob. =p
12:09
<ogra>
Lns, no, these are bugs where *i* am upstream
12:09
<Lns>
aah
12:09
<ogra>
usb imagewriter is my petproject
12:10
<Lns>
i was just reading about that and how ubuntu installs get on it =) nice to know i'm 'in' with the ubuntu people, haha
12:12
<ogra>
heh
12:12
well, usb-imagewriter is just a gui for dd, nothing more
12:13
(dont confuse it with usb-creator)
12:13
<Lns>
ooooooh
12:13
nm =p
12:13
<ogra>
for ARM we cant build isos ...
12:14
<Lns>
ogra, you've always had great graphics in your programs
12:14
<ogra>
so something to write the .img files to SD or USB key was needed (depending how your board boots)
12:14
i worked as graphics artist for some years
12:14
<Lns>
oh wow
12:15
<denisesballs>
do you guys think gnome watchdog is necessary? referring to this - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/GnomeWatchdog
12:15
<ogra>
taught the advertisement agency how to use gimp back then to make the better web graphics (about 1997-99)
12:15
<Lns>
heh! nice
12:15
<pbhat>
lns,ogra,I just need steps to take for sound on WS
12:16
<Lns>
denisesballs, i use it all the time, it works well..not sure about > 8.04, but i'm sure it couldn't hurt
12:16
brb
12:16
<denisesballs>
cool, thanks Lns, just trying to sort through the up to date stuff, and out of date stuff
12:17
<ogra>
Lns, the functionallity moved into LDM
12:17
no need to install it separately
12:17* ogra fails to remember the lts.conf option
12:18
<denisesballs>
ogra: you aren't referring to gnome watchdog right?
12:18
<ogra>
i am
12:19
<denisesballs>
login manager kills orphaned processes?
12:19
<ogra>
right
12:20
<Lns>
ogra, how does it do that if it runs on the client?
12:21
(that's awesome that it got integrated btw)
12:22
<ogra>
on login it checks for processes
12:23
<Lns>
ah
12:23
so potentially there are processes running up until a user logs in a subsequent time (from their last session) ?
12:23
<ogra>
it even has an option to ask you if you actually want to be able to be logged in multiple times (in which case it indeed would find old processes)
12:23DaZ- is now known as DaZ
12:23
<ogra>
right
12:24
<denisesballs>
(01:18:08 PM) ***ogra fails to remember the lts.conf option
12:24
<johnny>
the rain happens
12:24
<denisesballs>
does that mean it needs to be enabled?
12:27
<Ahmuck>
is the current ubuntu repo of saybon and pessules in ubuntu usable?
12:28
<Lns>
Ahmuck, probably not, i heard you should be using sabayon from vagrantc's svn
12:28
<bieb>
actually sbalneav just put up a build yesterday evening in his PPA
12:29
<Lns>
bah
12:29
sorry wrong guy. why do i always get them confused =p
12:29
<bieb>
lol
12:29alkisg has quit IRC
12:29
<bieb>
I am going to be downloading the newest sabayon here in a few to test it out for scott
12:31
<ogra>
LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION
12:31
there it is ...
12:31
sbalneav, ^^^ is that in the recent docs ?
12:31
LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION_PROMPT is the option to make it ask
12:33
<denisesballs>
ogra: sorry, is that default then, or must it be enabled?
12:33
<ogra>
you need to set it to True
12:33
<denisesballs>
ok, cuz i do not remember seeing that in http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/LTSPManual.html
12:33
<johnny>
that's because it doesn't liste all the options
12:33
<ogra>
by default we assume the session behaves and exits cleanly :)
12:33
<johnny>
only the lts-parameterse.txt does
12:33
lts-parameters.txt does
12:34
<ogra>
lts-parameters.txt.gz :P
12:34
<johnny>
quiet you
12:34
<ogra>
*g*
12:34
<johnny>
hmm.. soon i will use my new irc transport..
12:34
and can stay in this room without freenode freakin out on my nickserv enforcement
12:34
<denisesballs>
if you dont set LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION_PROMPT, but do set LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION, will it just kill the processes? i really dont wanna leave that option to the users
12:35
<ogra>
yes
12:35
<johnny>
i stopped idling in here because freenode would go down, and i'd get a contsant nick cycling
12:35
which was annoying for all
12:35
since my current transport doesn't do nickserv
12:35
but my new one will :)
12:35
<ogra>
so did you get your new laptop ?
12:36
<johnny>
nope... this one is still as loud as ever..
12:36
even without gentoo on it..
12:36
if i want a new laptop.. i'm probably gonna wait til i can buy something like the thinkpad x300 orwhatever
12:37
this one is servicable until then..
12:37
<ogra>
get ARM :)
12:37
<johnny>
i want an arm netbook
12:37
a super portable computer
12:38
but i still need something that can run a few games on a bigger screen
12:38* ogra wants a leg netbook, but that will still take an aeon
12:38
<ogra>
so i'll go with arm as well for now :)
12:38
<johnny>
leg?
12:38
<ogra>
the things you stand on ?
12:38
<johnny>
oh
12:38
those things
12:38
<ogra>
you can bend them in the middle
12:39
<johnny>
so.. are we gonna implant the chip then?
12:39
<ogra>
and they have flat things at the bottom
12:39
<johnny>
can the arm processor run on human bioenergy ?
12:39
<ogra>
if you make it small enough ...
12:39
wont be fast though
12:39
25Hz or less i'd bet :)
12:40
<johnny>
might want to supplement that big goopy thing above the torso..
12:40
<ogra>
heh
12:41
anyway, i know about two vedors aiming for getting them to market this fall
12:41
<johnny>
ultimately.. for a netbook.. i want an ssd :)
12:41
<ogra>
they will have SSD
12:41
or internal SD with a fast bus
12:42
<johnny>
i'm using 27G in total on this laptop
12:42
<ogra>
the HW they will use can do either
12:42
<johnny>
including OS
12:42
with lots of music and various pictures..
12:42
i'm guessing i'd be happy with someting in the 160G for long trips wit lots of video
12:42
<ogra>
then SD isnt yours :)
12:43
<johnny>
i thought they were making them that big now
12:43
<ogra>
and SSD is expensive at that size
12:43
<johnny>
sure.. for now
12:43
<ogra>
they do
12:43
<johnny>
intel just cut the prices by a pretty significant marging
12:43
margin*
12:44
<ogra>
well, i would get a sandisk if i were you
12:44
they are extermely fast
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13:07* Lns still likes his eee 701
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13:18
<Ahmuck>
link to the new sayboyon?
13:20tux_440volt has quit IRC
13:28
<Lns>
Ahmuck, can't find it myself, sbalneav would surely know
13:28dorimar has quit IRC
13:29
<bieb>
Ahmuck https://edge.launchpad.net/~sbalneav/+archive/ppa
13:29IBC_jkenney has joined #ltsp
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13:30
<IBC_jkenney>
I asked this earlier but does anyone know the performance pro's and cons between enlightenment and gnome on LTSP Server
13:30dorimar has quit IRC
13:33
<Lns>
IBC_jkenney, you're the first person that i've heard mention enlightenment and ltsp in the same sentence ;)
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13:41
<denisesballs>
what we were talking about before, do you guys know where to customize what Directories get created when a user logs in for the first time?
13:41
<Lns>
denisesballs, /etc/skel ?
13:42
<denisesballs>
no, they arent copied, they are created - Music, Templates, Videos etc.
13:42
the only thing in skel is Examples which is just a symlink
13:43
<Lns>
ah
13:43
not sure about that one
13:43
<bieb>
sbalneav: Scott you here? or lunch?
13:43
<johnny>
i know they are related to ~/.config/user-dirs.dirs
13:44
/etc/xdg
13:44
that's what you're lookin for
13:44
it gets created by an application that runs on login
13:44
<denisesballs>
/etc/xdg/user-dirs.defaults
13:44dorimar has joined #ltsp
13:44
<denisesballs>
nice!
13:44
thanks johnny, you guys are very helpful
13:44
<johnny>
it's what we do :)
13:45
i've been involved in this gnome/freedesktop stuff for quite some time.
13:46
<denisesballs>
yeah but not ALL irc rooms are such :-/
13:49subhodip has joined #ltsp
13:49
<denisesballs>
that was it, awesome
13:50* Lns notes the conversation for future use ;)
13:50IBC_jkenney has quit IRC
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13:56
<denisesballs>
i'm actually migrating an existing environment using ltsp 4.2 w/KDE, over 100 users, all integrated with LDAP
13:56
gonna be a fun project :)
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14:07
<IBC_jkenney>
which window manager is everyone using for a 250 thin client deployment
14:08
i am looking at E17
14:08
and gnome
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14:22
<Ahmuck>
denisesballs: how are you migrating you users?
14:23
i'm interested
14:23
i need to fallback to ubuntu ltsp server 8.10
14:23
<denisesballs>
havent quite mapped it all out yet, but its a little bit easier since all the homedirs are NFS mounted
14:26
<Lns>
IBC_jkenney, what dist?
14:26
what will these users be doing?
14:28
<IBC_jkenney>
standard office stuff
14:28
running openoffice
14:28
and mozilla and thunderbird
14:28
ubunto jaunty 9.04
14:29
"ubuntu"
14:30
<Lns>
IBC_jkenney, i think gnome might have better integration / features for that kind of env
14:30
jmho though
14:30
never really got too into enlightenment
14:31
<IBC_jkenney>
well i have been testing it and it keeps crashing and locking up which isn't a good sighn
14:31
what about xfce
14:32
<Ahmuck>
xfce seems to work ok iirc
14:32
when i tested it
14:33
<Lns>
IBC_jkenney, are you referring to e17 or gnome?
14:33artista_frustrad has quit IRC
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14:35
<denisesballs>
anyone use pidgin for IRC? just curious
14:35
<bieb>
me
14:35
denisesballs: I use Pidgin for IRC..
14:35
<denisesballs>
have you seen in any of the plugins a flood protector like xchat has? to stagger big pastes so you dont get booted?
14:35makghosh has joined #ltsp
14:36
<sbalneav>
irssi for the win
14:36
<denisesballs>
sbalneav: i knew that was coming
14:36
<bieb>
denisesballs: I haven't looked for any plugins like that
14:36cliebow has quit IRC
14:37
<bieb>
sbalneav: I udated sabayon.. it still crashes.. will pastebot in a sec
14:37
<sbalneav>
Different error this time?
14:37
<denisesballs>
i have them all installed, but none seem to do the trick. seems like a pretty common feature
14:37
<ltsppbot>
"bieb" pasted "Sabayon 2.25 error" (67 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/451
14:37
<IBC_jkenney>
pidgin is terrible use xchat
14:38
<denisesballs>
pidgin does everything else, plus you can be on 5 different services at once
14:38
<bieb>
uh oh.. sounds like the vi vs emacs war is now about chat programs.. :D
14:38
<denisesballs>
haha
14:38
people still use emacs? :-X
14:39
<bieb>
denisesballs: not only can you be on 5 different services.. you can be on multiple accounts on each service.. I have 2 yahoo accounts that are open all the time
14:39
<denisesballs>
yep
14:40
<sbalneav>
bieb: hmm
14:40
<bieb>
sbalneav: same thing I said
14:41
<sbalneav>
A lot of those rmtree's should be fixed up to remove errors.
14:41
Let's make a quick hack
14:42
edit /var/lib/python-support/python2.6/sabayon/protosession.py
14:42
<bieb>
ok
14:42
<sbalneav>
go to line 82
14:42Sarten-X[bikinis has joined #ltsp
14:42
<sbalneav>
there should be a shutil.rmtree(blah) line there
14:42
see it?
14:43
change it to:
14:44
shutil.rmtree (temp_homedir, True)
14:44
save, and re-run
14:44
<bieb>
ok
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14:48
<Lns>
sbalneav, can you teach me how to edit a wiki? =)
14:48
<sbalneav>
Sure! :)
14:48
<Lns>
hehe
14:48
<sbalneav>
I think you know, however :)
14:49
Passionate enough? :)
14:49
Or should I have gone more over the top? :)
14:49
<Lns>
You rock Scottie..I love your posts
14:49
It was perfect. Pure FOSS wisdom
14:49
<sbalneav>
I'm never afraid to say what's on my mind.
14:50
<Lns>
I need to copy some of this stuff, it would make a great open source community manifesto
14:50
<sbalneav>
I understand where people are coming from, but writing software can't be made idiot proof.
14:50
<Lns>
and shouldn't be.
14:50
<sbalneav>
Someone has to learn *something*, like I said.
14:51
<Lns>
that's the diff between linux users and other users. You have to learn *something*
14:51
<Lumiere>
can anyone download from sourceforge at the moment?
14:51
<Lns>
people are way too used to being spoonfed from the "magic computer box"
14:51
<sbalneav>
And I'm no good in packaging, but I'm the first person to admit that *I*'m the idiot. It's not that packaging is too hard, it's that I'm too dumb.
14:52
<Lns>
maybe not that you're too dumb, but it's just not what you focus on
14:52
and don't have the time/patience/motivation to focus on it
14:52Sarten-X has quit IRC
14:53
<sbalneav>
Nothing against Ace, I like the guy. And I'll *gladly* teach him anything I know...
14:53
but if you make 100% of your income off stuff that I give away for nothing, then complain that editing a wiki's *too much work* for you to learn... I mean, c'mon :)
14:54Ahmuck has quit IRC
14:54
<Lns>
I think we all get into that mode sometimes.. it's frustrating because there still isn't enough people to make the machine totally foolproof. we need more contributors all around
14:55
<sbalneav>
And that's my point.
14:55
The *only* way things will get better is if people actually chip in.
14:55
We've already got maxed out pepole.
14:55
<bieb>
sbalneav: it still fails.. it is not generating anything "worthwhile" in the error log again
14:55
<sbalneav>
Gadi's got his own business to run,
14:56
vagrant's already doing yeoman work
14:56
ogra, even though he's not even PAID to work on LTSP any more, *STILL* hangs around and contributes,,,
14:57
Lns: Was it you who said to that one guy, "we have to become the change we wish to see.."?
14:57
because that's it in a nutshell.
14:57
bieb: Ah, perfect, so we've improved it to the point where it doesn't fail noisily, it just fails quietly :)
14:57bobbyC has quit IRC
14:58
<sbalneav>
The maddening thing is, on my box here at work, it works perfectly.
14:58
On my box at home, it's doing the same thing as yours.
14:58
it's soooo depressing.
14:58
<Lns>
sbalneav, haha...no, that was some famous person who said that
14:58
<sbalneav>
yeah, but you or someone else quoted it a while back.
14:58RobertBerger has joined #ltsp
14:58
<bieb>
yeah... the same type error we ere getting the other day.. just says "got fatal error: sabayon-session exited with a FATAL ERROR (exit code 1)"
15:00
<sbalneav>
Does anyone know if there's a way to have python trace what it's doing, similar to sh -x
15:00
<Lns>
I run my own biz as well, but i consider doing this stuff part of what is necessary for my business to thrive (keeping in close contact with those in the community, contributing) because..i mean, it's a community. It's a no brainer, especially if I expect to make money off of providing services for users.
15:00
<sbalneav>
hmmm
15:00
lemme giggle that
15:00
<Lns>
Not to mention I love seeing projects such as ltsp become better
15:02
<sbalneav>
http://www.dalkescientific.com/writings/diary/archive/2005/04/20/tracing_python_code.html
15:02
meh, not ideal, as I'd have to hack up the code to get the tracing in.
15:02
<bieb>
Lns: I hear that.. I love seeing this project getting better. I haven't looked at LTSP in almost 4 years... it has come a long way..
15:03
<Lns>
It sure has!
15:03johnny has joined #ltsp
15:04
<Lns>
And all because a bunch of people are devoted to community effort. The world as a whole needs more of what's going on here.
15:04
<bieb>
what I am trying to do is learn it and understand it so that next year when the legal education conference that I attend comes around I will do a presentation on LTSP for Law School labs and hopefully get more schools looking at open source and linux as a whole and a way to augment what they already do/provide
15:05
<Lns>
bieb, keep in contact with me and the others who work with schools. We are starting to really build in numbers, and the collaboration we can do as a team can make some big changes for education.
15:05PerlStalker has joined #ltsp
15:05
<Lns>
nubae (not in here right now) is one of them, i know there are a ton of others too.
15:06
Education needs us right now.
15:06
<bieb>
Lns: I work for a Law School...
15:06
<Lns>
ok...i work for an elementary school =)
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15:08
<sbalneav>
Hmmmm
15:09
gksu "python -m trace --trace /usr/bin/sabayon" might be promising
15:09
<bieb>
Lns: my problem is basic.. I am not a programmer, never have been. I have always been the "tech support" guy that could fix student laptops and other stuff of that nature. I have dabbled in Linux for a few years now. And I have been able to convince my boss to replace our labs with thin clients (disklessworkstation 1520's)... I tend to have conceptual issues when reading some of the docs.. I am not sure how things should tie together.. and on top of that
15:10
<alkisg>
Heh, sbalneav, and I was gonna ask you if there was something similar to sh -x in python :)
15:10
<Lns>
bieb, i'm in the same boat as you..ianap
15:10
i like to say that i write documentation, but i mostly blurb about what i've done and people like it
15:10
<bieb>
but as I said.. I have Notepad++ open all the time on my machine and I am building an LTSP "How I did it" so I have all the links that worked, and other things I had to do to get it to work
15:11
<sbalneav>
bwsyfbo? :)
15:11
<Lns>
whaa
15:11
<bieb>
I'll bite.. what is bwsyfbo?
15:12
<sbalneav>
"But What's Stopping You From Becoming One" :)
15:12makghosh has quit IRC
15:12
<alkisg>
sbalneav: http://pastebin.com/f129e578c
15:12
<Lns>
sbalneav, I'm too tied up to be able to take the time to really get into it..i keep wishing i could, but i feel that's just not my forte
15:12makghosh has joined #ltsp
15:13
<sbalneav>
alkisg: yeah, you're.... unique
15:13
<alkisg>
Heh
15:13
<Lns>
Alright I'm out to meet with a videographer about making a vid for open source/thin client tech in schools.. be back tomorrow probably =)
15:13
<alkisg>
Bye Lns
15:13
<sbalneav>
You haven't got some kind of firewall on the box, have you?
15:13
<Lns>
*cheers*
15:13
<bieb>
later Lns
15:13
<sbalneav>
I think you're crashing when it's looking for the X server by scanning 127.0.0.1
15:14
<alkisg>
sbalneav: nope. But I wonder why there are 2 protosession.py: /usr/share/python-support/sabayon/sabayon/protosession.py / /var/lib/python-support/python2.6/sabayon/protosession.py ==> which one is the one?
15:14makghosh has quit IRC
15:15
<sbalneav>
alkisg: netstat -anp | grep 600
15:15makghosh has joined #ltsp
15:15
<johnny>
what's up with /var/lib/python-support
15:16
i don't even know what that is for
15:16* sbalneav shrugs
15:16
<sbalneav>
Packaging :)
15:17
alkisg: You *should* have something listening on 6000
15:17
<alkisg>
Hmmm pidgin? http://pastebin.com/f6a8d48c9
15:18subhodip has quit IRC
15:19* alkisg closes pidgin, retries and 'll brb...
15:19alkisg has quit IRC
15:20
<sbalneav>
Should be X
15:21alkisg has joined #ltsp
15:21
<alkisg>
Nope, no change
15:21subhodip has joined #ltsp
15:22
<alkisg>
sock.connect (("127.0.0.1", 6000 + display_number)) ==> maybe this should be non-blocking?
15:22
(to try the next display if the #display_number is in use?)
15:23
<sbalneav>
You use gnome or KDE?
15:23
what's your X process line look like?
15:23
<alkisg>
gnome...
15:24
more or less default installation, nvidia drivers,. ...
15:24
<sbalneav>
ps -ef | grep /usr/bin/X
15:24makghosh_ has joined #ltsp
15:24
<alkisg>
/usr/X11R6/bin/X :0 -br -audit 0 -auth /var/lib/gdm/:0.Xauth vt7
15:24
<sbalneav>
Hm
15:24
<alkisg>
..autologin...
15:24
<sbalneav>
You haven't got nolisten tcp on there.
15:25
<alkisg>
It *is* unchecked in the dialog
15:25
<sbalneav>
What happens if you telnet localhost 6000
15:25
<alkisg>
Trying ::1...
15:25
Connected to alkis.
15:25
Escape character is '^]'.
15:25
But I think it starts from 6001
15:25
Where I get:
15:25
Trying ::1...
15:25
Trying 127.0.0.1...
15:25
...and it just hangs there
15:26
<sbalneav>
yeah, that's what it should do.
15:26
just ctrl-]
15:26
<alkisg>
OK, but with 6001 ctrl+] doesn't do anything...
15:27
<sbalneav>
What's your display number?
15:27
env | grep DISPLAY
15:27
<alkisg>
:0.0
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15:28
<alkisg>
Oooops sorry killed pidgin instead of sabayon
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15:31
<sbalneav>
X *should* be on 6000
15:32
at least for display 0
15:32
<alkisg>
sbalneav: can socket.create_connection(address[, timeout]) be used instead of socket.connect, so ensure that it returns after some timeout?
15:32
<sbalneav>
Sure.
15:32
<alkisg>
"A value of None indicates that new socket objects have no timeout. When the socket module is first imported, the default is None."
15:33
<sbalneav>
but it strikes me that there's better ways to find a free display number than that :)
15:33
<alkisg>
Heh
15:33
<sbalneav>
the *proper* way to do that would be to just cycle through XOpenDIsplay(), and try until you get a success.
15:33* alkisg is only familiar with windows api :(
15:34
<sbalneav>
Maybe the better way to solve that would be to fix that "properly"
15:34
<alkisg>
Sounds good to me :)
15:34
<sbalneav>
I'll have a look at that tonight.
15:35
<alkisg>
I'm just wondering if sabayon is worth all the trouble you put yourself in to make it right...
15:35
Maybe it's just architecturaly wrong, and that's why they abandoned it?
15:36
<sbalneav>
Heh.
15:36subhodip has quit IRC
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15:37
<_UsUrPeR_>
sbalneav: just updated sabayon (aptitude update/upgrade). No dice. Still freezes on edit.
15:37
<sbalneav>
I think it makes sense. It's a nice, intuitive way to set up desktop defaults.
15:37
<_UsUrPeR_>
I'll try a purge/install
15:37
<sbalneav>
the code... needs some work though.
15:38
My intention is, once I learn it, to become an upstream contributor.
15:38
<alkisg>
Sure... but is it maintainable, or you'll need to go through the same stuff every time e.g. the gnome panels change?
15:38
<sbalneav>
It's an important piece of technology for LTSP.
15:38
it NEEDS some love.
15:38
Well, if it's not maintainable now, that's just a case of giving it enough love. :)
15:39
<alkisg>
I'd hate to see you wasting your love in something that doesn't pay back :)
15:39
<sbalneav>
Like I said in my post: I got 39 years :)
15:39
It's a huge hole that lots of LTSP users *need* filled.
15:40
Unless I start from scratch... it's the best game in town, at the moment.
15:40
<alkisg>
39 years left? Heh, where did you get this, from the "find out when you'll die" sites that my students visit? :P :D
15:40
<ltsppbot>
"_UsUrPeR_" pasted "sbalneav: error after trying new sabayon update" (51 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/452
15:41* alkisg didn't see sbalneav's post
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15:43
<sbalneav>
alkisg: read edubuntu-users :)
15:43
I ranted again :)
15:43
Scott "Ranty McRant" Balneaves, that's what they call me :)
15:44
_UsUrPeR_: Ah, now you're getting alkisg's error.
15:44
<pem725>
for what it is worth Scott, your point was a fine one. How can I help?
15:44
<_UsUrPeR_>
sbalneav: yeah. Valiant effort from you.
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15:44
<bieb>
sbalneav: where can I find that rant?
15:45
<sbalneav>
Oh, lordy lord. What do you want to help with? :)
15:45mikkel has quit IRC
15:45
<pem725>
wiki, dhcp, tftp docs
15:45
actually anything that you think needs attention that is core to the ltsp
15:45
<alkisg>
bieb: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2009-July/005427.html
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15:46
<bieb>
alkisg: thanks.. I was wondering if edubuntu-users was the name of the posting.. or if it was forum/blog
15:46
<pem725>
since I use LTSP for my lab at work, I figured my students and I could easily contribute to the documentation.
15:46Jachim has joined #ltsp
15:47* alkisg just tried deathclock.com but it hanged and didn't show me a result... maybe I won't die after all :)
15:47Jachim has left #ltsp
15:47
<bieb>
or maybe your time of death passed??? :0
15:48
<alkisg>
Braaiiiins..... /me smells braaaaiiinsss
15:48
</zombie mode off>
15:48* vagrantc_ took a long siesta
15:51
<alkisg>
Ooops, Sunday, February 11, 2046 :( I only have 37 years to contribute...
15:52bobby_C has joined #ltsp
15:53
<bieb>
Wednesday, June 8, 2039
15:53
:(
15:53
<_UsUrPeR_>
sbalneav: I'll have a ton of time for testing tomorrow if you want to set something up for sabayon.
15:54
<bieb>
only 942+million seconds left
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16:08
<sbalneav>
Sorry, got called away. "regular" job
16:08
:)
16:09
pem725: Well....
16:09
!docs
16:09
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "docs" is For the most current documentation, see http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
16:09
<vmlintu>
May I ask what are you going to use sabayon for?
16:09
<pem725>
OK
16:09
<sbalneav>
If one, some, or ALL would like to learn some docbook....
16:09
We could always use more cleanup/organization of the upstream docs
16:09
ORRRR
16:10
as a cool lab project, how about a wiki->docbook or docbbook->wiki converter?
16:10
vmlintu: Well, LTSP isn't going to use it, per se
16:10
but lots of people who USE ltsp would like to use sabayon to manage profiles.
16:11
<pem725>
scott, I will look into the wiki <-> docbook conversion
16:11
<vmlintu>
profiles being different looking desktops for different user groups?
16:13
<sbalneav>
vmlintu: You got it!
16:13
pem725: That would be awesome.
16:14
One of the things we'd *love* (on edubuntu, and here on LTSP too) would be to have:
16:14
the docbook pages get turned into wiki pages
16:14
let people *edit* the wiki pages,
16:14
pull the changes out, re-apply 'em to docbook
16:15
The reason why you still want the docbook is, so they can be packaged up, and shipped with the OS.
16:15
<alkisg>
Doesn't moinmoin already have a wiki to docbook exporter?
16:15
E.g. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP?action=show&mimetype=text/docbook
16:15
<vmlintu>
sbalneav: I never managed to get sabayon working properly, so now there's a pile of scripts creating the gconf xml files on the fly and a pam module assigning the profiles to different groups..
16:15
<alkisg>
(missing 4suite... but it seems possible)
16:15
<sbalneav>
that way, people in developing countries can get access to docs without the need for internet.
16:16
<pem725>
alksig: yes, moinmoin has a docbook exporter.
16:16
<sbalneav>
alkisg: We looked at that, last time I looked, it was "borken"
16:16
<alkisg>
ouch
16:16
<sbalneav>
And, it didn't go the other way.
16:16
i.e. docbook to wiki
16:16
<alkisg>
Well, that'll only be done once, so it's isn't really a big harm...
16:17
while wiki => docbook will be done a lot after the initial conversion
16:17
<sbalneav>
So, if you can get something going in moin (double-plus bonus points for commits upstream), I'd be glad to run a "upstream doco moin" server.
16:17
<bieb>
http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Meta:Tools/Wiki_conversions/DocBook_to_Wiki
16:18
<sbalneav>
Here's the upstream doc bzr:
16:18
bzr branch lp:~ltsp-docwriters/ltsp/ltsp-docs-trunk
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16:19
<sbalneav>
vmlintu: You write this stuff yourself? I'd be interested in seeing.
16:21
<bieb>
Found this info:
16:21
For conversion from tex and wiki to docbook, TLDP has some tools here http://tldp.org/downloads/ wt2db can also handle text to docbook conversion to some extent.For conversion from man pages to docbook, you can use this tool. http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/doclifter/ It has link to some what stable and old distribution. I wrote a patch for this to add some more functionality. You can get the patch and the devel version at http://www.cise.ufl.edu/~ppadala/
16:24
<vmlintu>
sbalneav: it started as an experiment to get things working somehow, but now it's been in real use for some time. There are too many hardcoded things to send it anywhere, but the plan is to polish it and make it separate from everything else..
16:26
sbalneav: Basically it creates the gconf xml from ground up and forgets all debian/ubuntu defaults. There's a template with variables that one can configure for each profile.
16:26
sbalneav: The good thing is that once the template works, ubuntu updates usually won't change the behaviour..
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16:27
<sbalneav>
Interesting,
16:28
I'd like to get Sabayon working, since it's more "end user" oriented, but yours sounds something more along the lines of what I'd like to use.
16:28RobertBerger has joined #ltsp
16:28
<sbalneav>
If you're willing, send me a tarball
16:28
sbalneav@ltsp.org.
16:28
Anywho, Off home for the day. Back on tonight.
16:28
<vmlintu>
The pam module is actually a script that sets a bunch XDG_ env parameters to point to the directories where the generated files are
16:29
<bieb>
sbalneav: talk to you later
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16:49
<moquist>
sbalneav: indeed it is
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18:04
<vagrantc_>
ogra: i've managed to reproduce your qemu-arm-eabi with the 0.11.0-rc0-1 of qemu with a static build.
18:06
ogra: unfortunately none of the other architectures seem to work
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18:21
<vagrantc_>
ogra: well, looks like it supports: i386, x86_64, arm and ppc, at least in theory. although ppc didn't work for me
18:24
http://www.qemu.org/status.html lists both x86_64 and powerpc as "testing" for userspace ... so that's no surprise ...
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