IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 17 February 2007   (all times are UTC)

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00:31
<mathesis>
se vagrantc
00:31
what is the line add in dhcp.conf
00:32
include /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf
00:34
<vagrantc>
mathesis: include /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf ;
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00:34
<vagrantc>
or ... gah. i don't remember.
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00:35
<vagrantc>
mathesis: maybe include "/etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf" ;
00:36
<mathesis>
i am testting in debian
00:37
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I think the one with the quotes around it are correct (not sure about the actual file name though ;))
00:39
<vagrantc>
mathesis: i haven't tried it with dhcp3-server in a while, i've mostly been using dnsmasq
00:39
mathesis: so i am not sure.
00:41
<nick125_lappy>
(least the quotes around the filename are correct according to the man pages for dhcpd.conf)
00:41
<vagrantc>
ah, good.
00:41
nick125_lappy: you wouldn't happen to be the same person posting to the nmosug list, would you?
00:42
<mathesis>
vagrantc, como es la configuracion de la segunda tarjeta de red
00:42
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I actually am...
00:42
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: i'm not really getting what you're saying in the "pxe vs ltsp" thread ...
00:43
mathesis: en dhcpd.conf ?
00:43
mathesis: o ?
00:43
<mathesis>
interfaces
00:44
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: From my (apparently wrong) understanding of the typical usages of PXE and LTSP, PXE is used more as a "fat" client (where the client does the processing, and the server simply provides files), while LTSP is more as a "thin" client (where the server does really everything, and, the client is just a frontend)..
00:44
<mathesis>
iface eth0 inet static
00:44
address 192.168.0.1
00:44
netmask 255.255.255.0
00:44
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: most LTSP installations use PXE to boot... sooooo...
00:44
<mathesis>
its correct vagrantc ?
00:44
<vagrantc>
mathesis: si, mas o menos
00:45
<mathesis>
wait i back
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00:45
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: Yeah, I realised that *after* I sent that reply...
00:46
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: heh. ok.
00:47
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I couldn't think of another word to describe diskless clients
00:47
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: it's tricky. "network computer" "diskless workstation" ... but all of these have, at some point, been used to describe thin-clients, too.
00:47
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: Yup
00:48
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: "diskless fat client" is probably the best i've heard so far.
00:48
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: For the project that was being described on nmosug-l, I think diskless thin clients would be best though...and, I think for most of those types of setups would work well as thin
00:48
<vagrantc>
of course, there's always the really sharp person who makes some snickering joke about dickless clients
00:49
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: Has anyone tried clustering together LTSP hosts (as in the LTSP servers)?
00:50
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: yeah, if you want to focus on re-use ... though people are starting to even treat 1GHz machines as slow ... which would make for slick "diskless fat clients"
00:50
nick125_lappy: there's some folks who've done openmosix + ltsp ... i tend to avoid invasive kernel patches whenever i can.
00:50
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I was thinking of getting 2-3 1.0-2.0ghz machines, clustering those together (though openmosix or something) and using those to server 20-50 thin clients
00:52
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: might work decently. though you might do just as well to have each machine run a complete installation, and somehow load-balance ...
00:52
nick125_lappy: that way, if one of them fails, you don't loose processes on other machines ...
00:53
i'm a big fan of the Keep It Simple Stupid philosophy.
00:54
if you really wanted to do something like openmosix, i would think you'd want to make use of all those idle cycles on the thin-clients ...
00:54
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I was thinking of that as well, use the thin clients as a cluster
00:56
<vagrantc>
but it's been a while since i've really maintained more than a single thin-client for LTSP development. trying to get the core ltsp stuff in debian solid before embarking on fancy stuff like clustering :)
00:57
my thin-client is actually more powerful than my "server" (except for ram)
00:58
<nick125_lappy>
I've really wanted to play with thin-clients, but, I've never had the time (nor enough machines to do anything too useful)...
00:59
<vagrantc>
i find even in environments of 2-3 computers thin-clients can be useful. in portland, oregon there's a cafe with 3 public terminals and a server. they can abuse the terminals to no end, and they're relatively easy to replace.
01:00
<nick125_lappy>
I really like the scalability aspect of thin-clients. Need another computer? It would probably take 20 minutes to setup a new machine, once you have the hardware
01:00
<vagrantc>
yup.
01:00
or less
01:02
<nick125_lappy>
It would be incredibly inexpensive as well (if you use used computers, it would probably cost...$45-$60 for an "okay" client, but, you don't need much)
01:02
<vagrantc>
or, even less, if you just take people's junk and process it, like freegeek :)
01:03
<nick125_lappy>
too bad there isn't a freegeek here in NM :/
01:03
<vagrantc>
yeah, i've tried to stir up some interest...
01:03
but i'm not the real go-getter sort of person.
01:04
it's one thing to write some free software, it's another to run a nonprofit.
01:04
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: I would think we could possibly get enough interest to actually start one here..
01:04
I'm pretty sure theres enough old hardware here
01:04
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: the key is finding a small group of people with just enough spare time to make it happen :)
01:04
yeah, hardware is almost never the shortage
01:05
<nick125_lappy>
And, there's a need for something (most people just throw their old computers in the trash)..
01:05
I have too much spare time :p
01:05
<vagrantc>
or in the acequia
01:05
nick125_lappy: time to make your wishes come true, then :)
01:06
<nick125_lappy>
Meh, I don't have enough power myself to do much..
01:06
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: ah, you've realized the most important part is networking :)
01:07
<nick125_lappy>
*nod*
01:08
If we started a freegeek in albuquerque, I think one thing that would be interesting would to get 20-30 machines, set them up in a room, and, sort of open a public computer lab (where people can come to browse the web, do their homework, and most importantly, learn about open source)
01:08
<vagrantc>
yes! and that way we could keep it on-topic by installing LTSP :)
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01:09
<nick125_lappy>
All the machines would run LTSP
01:09* vagrantc notes there is a freegeek channel on freenode
01:10
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: Want to talk in PM then? :)
01:10
<vagrantc>
nick125_lappy: no, just come on over to freegeek :)
01:10
nick125_lappy: i mean, the irc channel
01:10
<nick125_lappy>
vagrantc: of course
01:18
<Elive_user99>
vagrantc, you can shared dhcpd.conf
01:18
<vagrantc>
Elive_user99: hmmm?
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09:08
<ybanafa>
Hi All .. I'm using sarge64bit, Can I install ltsp-4.2 or 5 ?
09:08
<cliebow>
certainly 4.2..
09:09
<sepski>
yes, but unless your client is also 64 bit, you must make a 32 bit chroot
09:09
<cliebow>
you'd i think have to build the client on a 32 bit machine
09:09
<ybanafa>
do I have to install lib32 ?
09:09
<cliebow>
unless you have 64 bit vclients 8~)
09:09
is there an echo??
09:10
<ybanafa>
all of them sarge64bit
09:11
we will use it for technical-training .. is there any issue or note about sarge64bit ?
09:11
<sepski>
you have 64 bit cpu's as thin clients ? what brand/model ? :)
09:11
<ybanafa>
intel P-D 920
09:12
<sepski>
so why use them as thin clients instead of diskless workstations ?
09:13
<ybanafa>
sorry the Server intel P-D 920 , client Celeron-D I do not have No but em64t
09:13
<sepski>
so why use them as thin clients instead of diskless workstations ?
09:14
<ybanafa>
all the client loaded with XP for daily use/training
09:15
sarge64bit faster then sarge32bit 20-40%
09:17
<sepski>
ybanafa, your not aswering my question
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09:18
<ybanafa>
sepski : all the client loaded with XP for daily use/training ..
09:19
we XP & Linux at the same time .. do u have any other solution
09:19
<sepski>
so why use them as thin clients instead of diskless workstations ?
09:20
ltsp thin client runs the applications on the server, only displaying the image on the clients. so the client only need 100mhz and 16 MB ram
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09:21
<sepski>
such a fast computer can be booted with ltsp5 or similar diskless workstation where only the root fs of the machines are on the server, the cpu is used as normal
09:22
with ltsp5 the same server can act as both a server for thin clients and as a server for diskless clients. depending on what interface on the server the client is connected to
09:29
<ybanafa>
we have one training class with 10Celeron+512MB Ram we train & teach Windows products Now we will start Teaching Linux and our budget & the place too tight we have one new PD-920 with 1Gig-ram & 120g harddisk
09:30
can we use LTSP ?
09:31
<sepski>
ofcourse
09:31
<ybanafa>
what u recomand ?
09:31
<sepski>
but i would do it as diskless workstations and not as thinclients
09:32
<ybanafa>
u mean I have to creat floppies to boot to the server ?
09:33
<sepski>
no you must install a linux on the server.
09:33
and the clients boot from network when they are going to be used in a linux enviorment
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09:34
<sepski>
if you want to get started easy, i'd recoment debian-edu or edubuntu, cd's to install on the server.
09:35
then you can do something like http://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/HowTo/LtspDisklessWorkstation to enable diskless workstations,
09:35
i think the procedure is very similar for edubuntu
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09:38
<ybanafa>
sepski : thasks .. I'l read the doc. & give it try
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09:46
<cliebow>
why not just use etherboot floppy when you want to switch?
09:47
<sepski>
cliebow, becouse f12 during boot is easier ? :)
09:48
<ybanafa>
whats f12 ?
09:49
<sepski>
to the right of F11 on my keyboard. and many bios's use that button for enabeling pxe boot
09:49
(instead of booting on the harddrive)
09:50
ybanafa, personaly i'd make the clients pxe boot allways. and have a pxelinux meny where you can select localharddrive (windows) or booting from network (linux)
09:50
afk
09:55
<ybanafa>
Thanks .. I have to run & I'll be back after give all option try next week
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10:28
<cliebow>
sepski: Cool..i was just wondering about a dual boot setup for pxe
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10:33
<sbalneav>
Morning all
10:33
<jammcq>
SCOTTY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
10:34
<sbalneav>
hey hey
10:41
It said it was confirmed, but I re-confirmed it.
10:41
<cliebow>
Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
10:41
<sbalneav>
hello cliebow
10:42
<jammcq>
how many talks did you submit ?
10:43
sbalneav: pablo says you are all set now
10:43
<sbalneav>
cool
10:43
just the one.
10:44
I can do more if they need filler :)
10:44
<jammcq>
no, I think they have way more proposals than slots
10:44
he was just wondering if you had submitted more than one, but only confirmed one
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10:45
<mistik1>
morning guys
10:46
<sailli>
is any one running suse enterprise server with ltsp and guest windows on thin clients
10:47
<mistik1>
the last time I did that was with win98 and it was not really with ltsp at the time
10:47
<jammcq>
mistik1: howdie to you
10:48
<mistik1>
jammcq: cool morning in GA ;)
10:48
<jammcq>
"cool" what is cool? it's 18F here
10:48
<sailli>
hi
10:48
<mistik1>
gladly no such thing as snow
10:49
39.5F is cold here
10:49
<jammcq>
heh, don't even ask sbalneav what the temp is up in winnipeg
10:49
<mistik1>
I am more merciful than that ;)
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10:52
<sailli>
jammcq: did u tryed virtualziation with thin clients with ltsp on *any* os
10:54
<jammcq>
sailli: nope, I've not tried virtualization.
10:54
<mistik1>
I used win4lin to provide windows back in 2.95 days
10:55
maybe you could try with qemu or something
10:56
that would not give you access to things like the local devices on the thin-client though
10:56
<sailli>
jammcq: i was using ltsp for 2-3 friends about 1 or may be more back with version 3 where i can see more dtls on version 4 's feature
10:56
mistik1: thanks
10:56
<mistik1>
You would probably need some more scripting to pass the ltspfs mounted drives to the running qemu session via the monitor interface
10:58
<sailli>
ok
10:58
thanks
10:58
<mistik1>
np
10:59
<ogra>
sbalneav, hey hey, i'm nearly dont with an ldm greeter 100%imlemented in cairo
10:59
<mistik1>
that's something I may look into at a later date once this ltsp5 stuff is on a roll
10:59
<sbalneav>
What's cairo?
10:59
<ogra>
a vector drawing engine ...
10:59
<sbalneav>
cool
10:59
<ogra>
way smaller than gnomecanvas
10:59
and faster i hope, havent tried it on a client yet
11:00
<mistik1>
ogra: what other deps would that pull in for ldm?
11:00
just cairo?
11:00
<ogra>
but fill svg support for the themeing ... no more heavy bitmaps that need to go over the net
11:00
mistik1, it would pull in librsvg but drop gnomecanvas ...
11:01
<mistik1>
ok
11:01
<ogra>
smalle mem footprint, faster rendering
11:01
*amaller
11:01
gah
11:01
<mistik1>
I get it
11:01
<ogra>
*s m a l l e r
11:01
but i dont :)
11:01
<mistik1>
Its a fancy speeling morning
11:01
<ogra>
evening for me :)
11:02
<jammcq>
pscheie: ping
11:02
ogra: !!!!!!!!!
11:02
<ogra>
i' pondering a right click menu that offers a server selection ... so you can input a different server
11:03
<mistik1>
jammcq: one question I never asked is, why did you decide that going back to the method ltsp escaped from was a good idea
11:03
I remember back in the old days we were heading away from the whole distro for the client method that was popular at the time
11:04
<ogra>
mistik1, it lowers source maintenance costs ...
11:04
<mistik1>
Dont get me wrong, I agree ;)
11:04
<ogra>
you leave the maintenance of the system to the distros and can concentrate on actual ltsp development
11:05
<jammcq>
mistik1: we came to the conclusion that we just couldn't keep things updated properly, and distros wouldn't ship our bits
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11:20
<ace>
hi all
11:20
!seen ogra
11:20
<ltspbot>
ace: ogra was last seen in #ltsp 15 minutes and 54 seconds ago: <ogra> you leave the maintenance of the system to the distros and can concentrate on actual ltsp development
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13:00
<lar1>
I have LTSP up and running. Thanks. I'm wondering what is the best way to connect a client that boots from its own hard disk and is sometimes a regular (low power) workstation? The client would already be running Xfce on ubuntu on x86.
13:01
I have tried
13:01
sudo X -query xxx.yyy.zzz.aaa :1
13:01
which works, but is there a way to avoid using sudo?
13:04
<ogra>
lar1, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPMultiboot ?
13:05
<lar1>
Thanks. That's a step in the right direction. I'm thinking more that the users would boot and get Xfce, then if they want, connect to LTSP.
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13:17
<lar1>
thx bye
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15:06
<erdinc>
hi everyone
15:08
jammcq u there?
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17:30* erdinc bye aLL..
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17:31
<jamie>
Can any one help me. I am trying to install an older kernel on ltsp as the latest one on edgy does not seem to support the sound balster module on the sff very well. How do I do this please
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18:08
<cliebow>
!seen cliebow
18:08
<ltspbot>
cliebow: cliebow was last seen in #ltsp 7 hours, 27 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <cliebow> Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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19:58
<Shingoshi>
ogra: I meant to yell at you yesterday. But I forgot. So here it is!
19:58
Happy Birthday to you. Happy Birthday to you.
20:00
Happy Birthday dear Ogra, Happy Birthday to you.
20:01
Now you
20:01
Now you're one more closer to being an old fart!
20:01
ogra: ^^
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20:54
<mistik1>
dberkholz: You around
20:55
jammcq: ogra, working on porting the ltsp init scripts
20:55
<jammcq>
hey, cool
20:56
<mistik1>
we dont have the debian x config tool so I'm rewriting that configure_x() func for gentoo
20:57
So far I think i'm gonna use mkxf86config+hwsetup for the X detection and do string replacements for the defined stuff from lts.conf
20:58
These debian guys have done some very neat work here and I am going to keep as much of it that makes sense for this distro
20:59
<jammcq>
I think the goal is that as much of that stuff should go back into upstream LTSP
20:59
as possible
21:00
currently, there really isn't an "upstream LTSP"
21:00
but we'll be fixing that soon
21:00
<mistik1>
No problem
21:00
I'll do what I can and we can work on merging later
21:01
<jammcq>
I think that's a good approach
21:02
<mistik1>
I hope dberkholz gets some free time soon, he seems very handy with portage tools
21:02
<jammcq>
yeah, he's a sharp guy
21:02
<mistik1>
yea
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21:09
<necronz>
wer
21:09
;-=+`  '+=-;
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21:10
<jammcq>
hmm, interesting
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23:00
<nick125_lappy>
hey vagrantc
23:05
<vagrantc>
hi
23:09
<mistik1>
wheee
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23:09
<mistik1>
Yea baby, X autoconfig will work great
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