IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 30 November 2011   (all times are UTC)

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06:30
<alkisg>
Gadi: we could handle NBD_SWAP from the initramfs.d scripts inside the real file system, no need to do it in ltsp_nbd..
06:31
So I think that the only reason to keep ltsp_nbd is nbd-proxy, maybe we could make that part optional, as it's not even used by default now
06:40
Btw, suse had some patches to fake RW support for squashfs... if we had that, we'd no longer need aufs/overlayfs, nbd-server -c would suffice
06:41
(nbd-server -c suffices now if one uses an ext4 or even a compressed btrfs image)
06:42
And, with the `nbd-server -c` case, we could probably just have a /swap file in there, no need for NBD_SWAP either...
06:44* alkisg wants to test squashfs vs compressed btrfs, if btrfs is close enough then ltsp-update-image and overlayfs won't be needed anymore
06:50
<alkisg>
Yoe: hi... about the ltsp/nbd interaction... I think the best place would be for you to source a script of us after configure_networking
06:51
This way we could even contact the ROOTSERVER and get lts.conf or whatever else we need
06:51
(before the mounting)
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06:54
<alkisg>
Yoe's local-top/nbd calls configure-networking, then `run-parts nbd-scripts.d` so it sources our hooks, and we have 2 hooks there, one for usual ltsp and one for nbd-proxy, which would mount itself the nbd root and then set NBDSERVER=127.0.0.1 for local-top/nbd to do the second mount
06:56
*NBDROOT
06:58
Or, yet another method that would add the flexibility we need... if local-top/nbd looked for a kernel parameter for where to find the nbd-client executable
06:59
So we could have nbd-client=/sbin/nbd-client.ltsp, or nbd-client=/sbin/nbd-client.proxy
06:59
And those script would get the nbd-client parameters and do whatever they wanted without having to have any other "interface" with local-top/nbd
07:00
(or better yet, from an environment variable, if defined, not from the kernel command line)
07:01
OK, yeah, so here's my final suggestion:
07:01
Yoe does this in local-top/nbd:
07:01
NBD_CLIENT=${NBD_CLIENT:-/sbin/nbd-client}
07:01
$NBD_CLIENT $nbdsrv $nbdport $nbdrootdev -persist
07:02
We don't need anything else from him
07:02
We do this in initramfs-tools/conf.d/ltsp:
07:02
NBD_CLIENT=/sbin/nbd-client.ltsp
07:03
And that takes care of -proxy too, conditionally. It even has access to lts.conf, to decide if it wants to do it or not.
07:03
So we *only* need that in initramfs, plus the init-bottom hook that calls our initramfs.d scripts, done.
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10:22
<gvy>
hi folks
10:23
working on updating ALT patches for 5.2.x, there are NBD/NFS root questions -- anyone around? :)
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11:24
<Yoe>
gvy: can't say I can help, but you can ask :-)
11:26
<bakytn>
gvy, just ask
11:28
<knipwim>
cool, improved ALTLinux support
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11:52
<bakytn>
Hey guys! My goal is to have a single app launched in LTSP (firefox) so when people boots they would see the only Firefox application
11:52
So I have create my own screen.d script called "firefox" in (/opt/ltsp/i386/user/share/ltsp/screen.d)
11:52
it works however I am having issues.
11:53
here is the contents
11:54
http://pastebin.com/RaaSCt3C
11:55
and firefox.sh (just a tweaked version of rdesktop.sh) http://pastebin.com/30k6zEHQ
11:55
I'm setting SCREEN_07=firefox and it works fine
11:56
the problem is when I mouse over on the main menu cursor becoming like "X" (you know X Window Systems cursor)
11:57
and when I am trying to select any menu item - menu closes
11:57
can you look at my short scripts and tell, what's the problem?
11:57
the Firefox is the latest one version 8.0
12:00
:)
12:00
<ogra_>
you need a window manager ... why dont you just use the kiosk mode, it does exactly what you want
12:01
<bakytn>
ogra_, how to use it?
12:01
ogra_, I saw the script...called kiosk but didn't get it
12:01
<ogra_>
ltsp-build-client should have a mode for this, there should also be documentation on the ubuntu wiki
12:02
<bakytn>
I have "kiosk" script in screen.d
12:30
yeah, using kiosk and getting the same issue
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12:40
<ogra_>
with ltsp-build-client ?
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12:41
<ogra_>
iirc it actually installs a wm and sets it up properly
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12:43
<bakytn>
ogra_, I don't remember did I use ltsp-build-client with kiosk option but I had "kiosk" script and after adding of ltspkiosk user I was able to launch firefox
12:43
with the same issue :D (it's okay, not a big problem though..)
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14:17
<mgariepy>
good morning everyone
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15:54
<dobber>
i just broke my production ltsp installation :(
15:54
after booting i get to busybox ;(
15:56
<chrisjrob>
done anything in /etc/fstab or grub?
15:56
since the last boot
15:56
?
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15:56
<dobber>
i copied my client image to a new directory
15:57
set LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS=false
15:57
chrooted to the new directory
15:57
and updated the system to new ubuntu
15:57
<chrisjrob>
ah, it's the clients that are getting busybox
15:57
<dobber>
during the upgrade procedure, clients stopped responding
15:57
i don't know why
15:58
<chrisjrob>
is /etc/exports showing he right location?
15:58
<dobber>
yes
15:58
but nbd server did not have a config file
15:58
instead inetd was configured
15:58
and i don't remember useing inetd
15:59
i reconfigured nbd-server, stoped inetd
15:59
update image, update kernels
15:59
reboot the client
16:00
<alkisg>
How did you copy the image? With what command?
16:00
<dobber>
and i get No init found, try passing init=
16:00
and busybox
16:00
alkisg: cp -a /opt/ltsp/i386 /opt/ltsp/11.10
16:00
chrooted to 11.10
16:00
mount -t proc
16:00
<alkisg>
I don't think that copies devices nodes, does it?
16:00
<dobber>
and dist-upgrade
16:00
it does
16:01
<alkisg>
And now you have 2 chroots, one working ok, and another one not?
16:01
<dobber>
no
16:01
i did not touch the original
16:01
it "should" work
16:01
but it does not
16:02
pls, give me ideas, because 8 ppl are not working atm :(
16:02
<alkisg>
Erm I'm not sure I get it, let's speak about your end goal instead
16:02
Why do you want 2 chroots?
16:02
<dobber>
i wanted to make a new client image with new ubuntu
16:02
without touching the server at all
16:02
<alkisg>
Ah, you thought that dist-upgrade would get you a newer ubuntu version?
16:03
<dobber>
yeah
16:03
<alkisg>
Well, it doesn't :)
16:03
You should be running dist-upgrade on normal upgrades
16:03
apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade ==> that's normal maintainance
16:03
<dobber>
yes
16:03
<alkisg>
It doesn't give you a newer distro version, it just installs the updates
16:04
<dobber>
i changed apt.sources to a newer version
16:04
<alkisg>
To get a newer distro version, you'd need do-release-upgrade or something
16:04
But
16:04
<dobber>
anyway
16:04
<alkisg>
You can't do that on ltsp chroots :)
16:04
<dobber>
why does my old installation does not work ?
16:04
that's more important nwo
16:04
now
16:04
<alkisg>
Because ltsp-build-client modifies your chroot, and if you upgraded it, it would stop working
16:04
<dobber>
i did not upgrade the original chroot
16:05
only the copy
16:05
<alkisg>
So. Are we at a point where you only have 1 chroot, the original one, and you want to get it working?
16:05
<dobber>
yes
16:05
<alkisg>
Which version are you using? 11.04? 10.04?
16:05
<dobber>
i removed the new version now
16:05
10.04
16:05
<alkisg>
OK, please revert your changes to nbd-server
16:05
I.e. delete the config file, and put back the inetd entry
16:05
<dobber>
ok
16:06
<alkisg>
Stop nbd-server, and restart openbsd-inet, or, to be sure you have a correct setup, reboot your server and check what's running
16:07
<dobber>
9571 stream tcp nowait nobody /usr/sbin/tcpd /usr/sbin/ldminfod
16:07
9572 stream tcp nowait nobody /usr/sbin/tcpd /usr/sbin/nbdswapd
16:07
2000 stream tcp nowait nobody /usr/sbin/tcpd /usr/sbin/nbdrootd /opt/ltsp/images/i386.img
16:07
ok client booting
16:08
i mean , downloading image now
16:09
ok booted up
16:09
tryed to login
16:09
no respons from server
16:09
<alkisg>
!ltsp-update-sshkeys
16:09
<ltsp>
alkisg: ltsp-update-sshkeys: If you changed your server IP, you need to run ltsp-update-sshkeys, and if you're using NBD (Ubuntu) you also need ltsp-update-image afterwards
16:09
<dobber>
ltsp-update-sshkeys ?
16:10
up and running
16:10
i guess i blamed the LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS not working...
16:10
<alkisg>
Wow, you must have a fast server :)
16:10
<dobber>
because the upgrade procedure wanted me to restart openbsd-inetd
16:10
and i tought that somehow it got out of chroot
16:10
in panic mode
16:11
<alkisg>
It's somewhere in the docs, that ltsp doesn't support chroots distro upgrades
16:11
We hope it will in ltsp 6
16:13
<dobber>
what do you mean does not support ?
16:14
oh, the ltsp server a different version that the ltsp client
16:14
?
16:14
<alkisg>
I mean that if you try to upgrade your chroot from 10.04 to 10.10, it will break
16:14
No, different versions are supported. Just not chroot upgrades
16:15
If you want to build a 11.10 chroot from the start, and continue to have 10.04 on your server, you can.
16:15
<dobber>
well, if i create a chroot from scratch ?
16:15
aha
16:15
well, that's my goal then
16:15
<alkisg>
Just remember that if you're not using fat clients, you'll still have a 10.04 desktop
16:15
<dobber>
i don't want to upgrade the server
16:16
<alkisg>
The chroot doesn't have gnome etc, those are on your server (if you're using thin clients), so your users won't get any newer programs
16:16
<dobber>
ahm.. let me remind myself what was a fat client
16:16
<alkisg>
!fatclients
16:16
<ltsp>
alkisg: fatclients: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
16:17
<dobber>
so i have to copy all gnome files to the chroot and run it from there ?
16:18
<alkisg>
Ermmmm not exactly
16:18
Thin clients is LTSP as you know it
16:18
Fat clients is another possible setup that LTSP offers
16:18
If you switch to using fat clients, then you don't even need X on your server
16:18
But that's a different setup from what you have now
16:19
(and you don't even need a multicore server, any cpu at 1ghz will do)
16:19
Are your clients good enough to work as fat clients?
16:19
<dobber>
yes
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16:19
<alkisg>
Then yes, you could try building a fat chroot
16:20
<dobber>
they are old desktop systems that ran windows xp, then domain controler, then ltsp
16:20
good cpu, ram and video
16:20
<alkisg>
old desktops? How much ram?
16:20
<dobber>
i don't think there is lower than 2gb ram
16:20
<ogra_>
Gadi, poke
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16:20
<alkisg>
Ah ok then, not so old. When I hear "old" here I'm thinking 256 MB RAM :)
16:22
<ogra_>
hey bfiller !
16:22
Gadi, meet bfiller :)
16:22
<bfiller>
hey guys
16:22
<Gadi>
bfiller: hi
16:22
<alkisg>
dobber: I think that fat clients have a problem in 11.10, a package needs to be un-blacklisted for the installation to work ok. It's been solved in the meantime, but not backported.
16:22
<dobber>
alkisg: after i build my fat client, i setup it the same way with tftpd ?
16:22
<alkisg>
Yes
16:22
<dobber>
how big does it get ?
16:23
<alkisg>
You mean the NBD image? 1-2 Gb, depending on if you enable compression
16:23
It's not loaded in the client RAM, don't worry about its size
16:23
<dobber>
so in every reboot, they should download 1-2gb ?
16:24
<alkisg>
No. Imagine booting from a 500Gb live usb disk. Does it need to be downloaded?
16:24
<dobber>
no
16:24
<alkisg>
The clients only read the sectors they need each time
16:24
<dobber>
ok, i'm talking blindly right now
16:24
let me read the docs
16:24
<alkisg>
So you can boot a 64MB RAM client from a 2 Gb NBD image
16:24
Yup
16:26
<dobber>
i can craft a pxe config to dual boot thin and fat client, right ?
16:26
<alkisg>
You don't need to, the same fat image can boot both thin and fat
16:27* alkisg goes back to studying, bbl...
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16:44
<gvy>
Yoe, thx :)
16:45
ogra_, maybe you could actually help -- the question is regarding stuffing nfsroot into pxelinux.cfg/default (or whatever that way) in {server/ltsp-,client/}update-kernels
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16:46
<gvy>
from my reading of these scripts after they've been split there's no place where BASE is there and that config gets populated
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16:47* gvy stares at "256M" numbers and sighs
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16:48
<gvy>
the quick-and-dirty updated mockup didn't actually finish booting on 16M client -- udev rules got too beefy, need to look there and prune 'em a bit to avoid OOM
16:48
something like 18M VM was fine though :)
16:52
<matrix3000>
18M VM?
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17:05
<gvy>
yup
17:05
18 megabyte RAM virtual machine
17:11
<Gadi>
gvy: the client's /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels writes the pxelinux.cfg/default file on the client. the server's ltsp-update-kernels will copy that over to the tftproot on the server
17:12
s/client/chroot/
17:13
<gvy>
Gadi, erm, then I'd amend the update-kernels generated config with ltsp-update-kernels, right?
17:13
(didn't get or find so far what was the need to split the script except that it was pretty hefty already :)
17:14
<Gadi>
if you want to add different boot options to be auto-populated, you can add them to the chroot's /etc/lts/update-kernels.conf
17:14
sorry, /etc/ltsp/update-kernels.conf
17:14
brb
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17:25
<gvy>
Gadi, ah, thx
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18:43
<dobber>
alkisg btw, thank you very much for the help
18:43
(again)
18:47
<alkisg>
dobber: you're welcome
18:48
<dobber>
how is the financial crisys in greece treating you ?
18:49
<alkisg>
Well, the teacher salaries dropped by about 300€, but luckily my wife's a teacher too, so we don't have a problem yet
18:49
Other families where only one parent works do have problems though
18:50
<dobber>
i hope it gets better soon
18:51
not that we are ok, our governmnet is run by ex mafia :)
18:52
<alkisg>
Haha
19:01
<andygraybeals>
alkisg, my girl was wondering about you and the finances over there the other day.
19:01
i will tell her.
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19:14
<BonaC>
...
19:15
Does LTSP download a specific kernel to the server computer?
19:15
I mean after I installed LTSP, my security camera went haywire.
19:15
?
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19:16
<andygraybeals>
impatence
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19:19
<BonaC>
Hi!
19:20
Does LTSP download a specific kernel and/or software to the server computer and replaces the original kernel/software?
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19:20
<BonaC>
I mean my security camera went haywire about an hour ago - right after I tried the LTSP again
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19:21
<BonaC>
Now V4L2 throws EIO-errors and stuff
19:22
"libv4l2: error dequeuing buf: Input/output error
19:22
"
19:27
<dobber>
BonaC it will not vhange the server kernel
19:27
where is your kamera
19:28
<BonaC>
My camera is on top of the server, plugged to the rear USB ports
19:28
If you want it precise. :)
19:29
It seems it started working again after I replugged the cam
19:29
Derp
19:30
How I should have known
19:30
But still
19:30
So
19:31
The Thin Client will actually have it's own kernels or does it use the ones on the server?
19:31
Or is it just "kernel"?
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19:35
<markit>
BonaC: the ltsp creates a chroot and if you use ubuntu a nbd image, nothing on the "host" server is touched
19:36
the client uses the one tfpt provides it, that is separated from the host kernel
19:36
or something like that
19:40
<dobber>
right
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20:07
<vagrantc>
Yoe: oh, yeah.
20:07
Yoe: it looks more feasible to make it easier to use nbd or nfs without much difference now
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20:08
<alkisg>
Next step is to also use the same syntax for nbd, as defined in rfc2224 for nfs, and to also use root-path from dhcp :D
20:08
<host>:<port>/<url-path>
20:09
With square brackets for ipv6
20:12
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i already convinced Yoe to add an nbd*=dhcp option that uses rootpath
20:14
<dobber>
you want to add options to dhcp server?
20:14
instead of tftp/initrd ?
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20:19
<dobber>
ltp-update-image would require to change dhcp config?
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21:15
<Gadi>
Yoe: what do you think of this patch to your nbd script? http://pastebin.com/7zWaReXe
21:16
it would enable it to support the colon-delimited syntax in addition to commas and allow for a different NBDCLIENT script (also, it should enable setting an nbdname from option root-path)
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