IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 5 November 2009   (all times are UTC)

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00:13
<sbalneav>
!vagrant++
00:13
!vagrant++
00:13
!karma
00:13
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Highest karma: "jammcq" (8192), "sbalneav" (7), and "dtrask" (7). Lowest karma: "Ahmuck" (1), "moxie" (1), and "brendan" (1). You (sbalneav) are ranked 2 out of 13.
00:14
<sbalneav>
!karma vagrantc
00:14
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: vagrantc has neutral karma.
00:14
<sbalneav>
!vagrantc++
00:14
!vagrantc++
00:14
<vagrantc>
heh
00:14
<sbalneav>
!karma vagrantc
00:14
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Karma for "vagrantc" has been increased 2 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 2.
00:14
<sbalneav>
Have a couple free ones on me
00:14
You deserve it.
00:14
<vagrantc>
jammcq must have written a for loop or something :)
00:15
<sbalneav>
Nah, I caught someone --'ing him
00:15
I put a stop to it :)
00:15
<vagrantc>
pfft.
00:15
does it have negative ratings?
00:16
<sbalneav>
Oh, yeah
00:16
You can put someone in the -
00:16
<vagrantc>
i bet this group's too nice to really get too neative
00:16
<sbalneav>
Hope so :)
00:16
Hey, you got a multi-bin printer at freegeek? Like an hp4250 or equiv?
00:17
<vagrantc>
no idea
00:17
probably seen some come through over the years, but no idea if anything on hand and working at the moment ...
00:17
<sbalneav>
ok
00:17* vagrantc remembers the klicky keyboard debts
00:17
<sbalneav>
if you had one handy there, I was gonna ask you to test something for me tomorrow.
00:18
didn't WANT one, just wanted to test a cups bug, see if it bites debian
00:18
<vagrantc>
i so wish i had a chance to set up an LTSP test lab at freegeek.
00:18
<sbalneav>
You had one there, didn't you?
00:18
you had terminals anyway
00:19
<vagrantc>
yeah, we've got a few terminals ... though fewer with each passing year, it seems.
00:19
<johnny>
do people use em?
00:19
<vagrantc>
but i was thinking a lab running LTSP on sparc, mips, mipsel, armel, etc. all the wacky stuff
00:19
<johnny>
i wish we had more.. but we ran out of space
00:19
<vagrantc>
johnny: yeah, they're used constantly... people also complain about them constantly :(
00:20
<johnny>
so.. why fewer then :)
00:20
that doesn't make any sense :)
00:20
<vagrantc>
but they're mostly logged into a single-proc xen instance with only 2G of ram and a 3GHz proc
00:20
<johnny>
you'd think you would have something better than that coming through..
00:21
<vagrantc>
i'm contemplating switching away from xen as there's a bug that doesn't allow us to take advantage of multi-proc xen instances
00:21
<johnny>
to kvm?
00:21
<sbalneav>
vagrantc: What do they complain about?
00:21
<vagrantc>
well, the server's got 5G of ram ... and we've got some dual 2.4-3.6GHz xeons ... but they don't really cut it.
00:22
johnny: yeah, kvm would be nice, if we actually got enough hardware that supported it
00:22
<johnny>
vagrantc, how about more powerful clients?
00:22
do more local apps?
00:22
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: "it's so slow i keep making typing mistakes"
00:22
<johnny>
even your lower bound machines should be able to handle it these days?
00:22
<vagrantc>
johnny: yeah, basically that's my next plan ... switch to fatclients.
00:23
can probably get a couple labs with 1.8-2GHz procs, and 512-1G of ram.
00:23
<johnny>
altho those probably don't tend to come with tons of ram..
00:23
luckily you have plenty of extras
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00:23
<vagrantc>
or maybe as low as 1.4GHz.
00:24
<johnny>
i could use some more ram for some slightly old machines
00:24
<vagrantc>
the lowest end stuff that took pc-133 ram.
00:24
<johnny>
i think the ones we have are slightly better
00:24
it's just not stuff you can easily buy
00:24
<sbalneav>
how fast are the thin clients?
00:25
<johnny>
i need to get one of you free geekers to rummage for me and send me a few :)
00:25
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: the ones most used are 1GHz ... some 800MHz.
00:25
<johnny>
i'll pay postage
00:25
<sbalneav>
my desktops are only 1ghz
00:25
via's
00:25
<johnny>
i have a lshw report for each somewhere..
00:25
<vagrantc>
these are just compaq deskpro EN's mostly.
00:26
we've got a few boxes of genuine thin-clients i want to try out ... but that would probably kill the whole switching to localapps idea.
00:26
<johnny>
i think if i had 512 in each i could just run local apps
00:26
and not run a seperate server just for ltsp
00:26
for only 3 pcs..
00:27
<vagrantc>
the fatclient trick that nubae and stgraber worked on seems pretty good ... though i wonder what quirks i'll encounter when actually deploying.
00:27
<sbalneav>
Well, heading to bed.
00:27
night
00:27* vagrantc waves
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03:14
<_Shane>
I have just updated my LTSP Server's X server from xorg-1.5 to xorg-1.6 and now all my clients start up with a US style keyboard. Previously all keyboards were properly recognised as UK keyboards. Can anyone suggest any settings or files to look at?
03:17
<alkisg_work>
Distro/version?
03:17
<_Shane>
Gentoo 10.0
03:18
<alkisg_work>
I've no idea, unless gentoo uses consoletools like ubuntu :)
03:18
You can select a custom keyboard layout from lts.conf, though, if you can't solve it "properly" then it's a solution...
03:19
http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/LTSPManual.html#keyboard
03:20
brb
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03:56
<Appiah>
hm
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04:36
<_Shane>
As per my problem earlier, it appears that setxkbmap was missing from /usr/bin on the ltsp chroot. Installing this file appears to have solved my problems.
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05:06
<Peste_Bubonica>
Hi all
05:07
Can I boot a ethernet card, with RPL? I have a old PC, that I want to use as client of my ltsp server, but the card uses a novel RPL protocol
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05:31
<alkisg_work>
Peste_Bubonica: does it have a floppy/cd/hard disk? it'll be much, much easier if you use gpxe (etherboot.org)
05:34
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg_work, understood... theres any support from RPL?
05:34
many older cards uses it
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05:35
<alkisg_work>
There's some really old documentation in ltsp.org, so I think it'll get you some time to make it work...
05:35
http://www.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/RPL
05:35
If you can get it to work, it'd be nice if you updated the wiki as well.
05:36
Ah, and this documentation is about the microsoft style, not the novell one :(
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05:55
<Peste_Bubonica>
alexqwesa_, I will read about! many thanks
05:58
<Appiah>
rpl? how old is the client Peste_Bubonica ?
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06:08
<Peste_Bubonica>
Appiah, Is a SiS M810 motherboard
06:08
with a SiS 900 onboard... a PC from 2002...
06:09
I think that is better to buy a new ethernet card with pxe
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06:38
<scottmaccal>
Morning all.
06:39
squarepeg: working Mac LTSP today?
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07:11
<kdegel>
morning
07:20
<Peste_Bubonica>
Appiah, it works... i overwrite the flash module of the card, inserting a gpxe bios :)
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07:27
<Peste_Bubonica>
Appiah, it is not exactly what ive trying to do, but works: http://etherboot.org/wiki/amibios
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08:27
<Appiah>
Peste_Bubonica: aha ok
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08:32
<palichis1>
hello, I have a problem with my ltsp server, I can not login in my clients to the server machine, anyone has any idea
08:33
<Gadi>
palichis1: did you change the IP address after building the client?
08:33
<palichis1>
Gadi: no
08:34
<Gadi>
can you ssh to the server IP as the user you are trying to login as?
08:36
<palichis1>
Gadi: I do not have consoles on my clients
08:36
<Gadi>
well, you can first try from the server
08:36
open a terminal window on the server
08:36
and try to ssh to the server IP as the user
08:40
<palichis1>
Gadi: i have "permission denied"
08:41
<Gadi>
that would be the problem
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08:41
<Gadi>
is ssh server installed on that machine?
08:41
what distro?
08:41
<palichis1>
ubuntu 9.10
08:42
yes, ssh server is installed
08:42
<Gadi>
run: ifconfig and make sure the IPs are as you expect them to be
08:43
if you cannot ssh to the server, then ldm will not work
08:43
so, you need to fix that
08:43
<palichis1>
yes, they are correct
08:44
<Gadi>
ps -efw|grep sshd
08:44
is sshd running?
08:45
if so, ls /home
08:45
does the user have a home directory?
08:45
<palichis1>
yes sshd is runing, and yes i have a directory of user
08:46
<Gadi>
ok, sudo tail /var/log/auth.log
08:46
does it tell you why sshd is not allowing your user to login?
08:46
are you using LDAP or local authentication?
08:47
<kdegel>
speaking of LDAP, Gadi, have you dealt with AD authentication?
08:48
<Gadi>
yup - I wrote the wiki howto
08:48
on UbuntuLTSP
08:48
<sbalneav>
Morning all
08:48
<kdegel>
ahh ok
08:48
I'll have to chec kit out
08:48
kind of wondering how we are going to lock down the desktops with AD logins
08:49
<Gadi>
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ActiveDirectoryIntegration
08:50
<Appiah>
morning
08:50
or good evening :D
08:50
<palichis1>
Gadi: does not say anything the auth.log
08:50
<kdegel>
ahh yes, I have run across that page
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08:51
<Appiah>
no way to manage the lockdown via AD today
08:51
as I know...
08:51
you will have to lockdown the profile
08:52
<palichis1>
Gadi: but te gdm of client say: no response from server: restarting
08:53
<kdegel>
I've been wondering how to get a new user to log in and get the custom background and such that seems easy to set up via local logins, not so much on domain logins
08:53
<sbalneav>
palichis1: then you're not able to ssh into the server. Have you tried from another full workstation on the network to ssh into that server?
08:54
<Gadi>
palichis1: as soonas you fix ssh access, you will fix everything
08:54
so, forget about the clients
08:54
and focus on that
08:54
kdegel: custom backgrounds are a gconf thing in gnome
08:55
you can set them system wide on a particular server
08:55
with gconf-editor
08:56
<palichis1>
sorry, was my mistake .. yes I access the server ssh .. user misspelled
08:56
<kdegel>
Gadi: ahh so even with domain logins, cool
08:56
<palichis1>
but my clients not login
08:56
<kdegel>
haven't gotten that far in this project yet, just things that are still on my mind
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08:57
<sbalneav>
palichis1: Did you upgrade this ltsp server from a previous version? Of is this a new install of Karmic?
08:57
<Gadi>
palichis1: for good measure, run: sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys; sudo ltsp-update-image
08:57
<sbalneav>
s/Of/Or?
08:57
<palichis1>
sbalneav: is this a new install of Karmic?
08:57
<Gadi>
oh, yeah - good question
08:58
<sbalneav>
Gadi: I'm thinking he might have a jaunty chroot
08:58
<Gadi>
palichis1: yeah, so, is this a fresh install?
08:58
<sbalneav>
palichis1: yes. That's what I'm asking. Did you install Karmic fresh, and build a new chroot, or did you upgrade from Jaunty?
08:58
<FrozenZia>
Hello - n00b question probably, but that's why I'm here: any way to use a Sun Ray thin client with Edubuntu LTSP?
08:59
<sbalneav>
FrozenZia: no.
08:59
<FrozenZia>
=o(
08:59
<Gadi>
sun rays are not really computers
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08:59
<palichis1>
Gadi: yes is fresh
08:59
<Gadi>
:)
08:59
<FrozenZia>
Alrighty then. Tx!
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09:00
<sbalneav>
palichis1: then what I'd do to test is add "SCREEN_02=shell" to your lts.conf file, so you can get a login shell
09:00
<palichis1>
sbalneav: is a fresh instalation the hdd is formated
09:00
<Gadi>
palichis1: right
09:00
<sbalneav>
palichis1: so you built a brand new chroot with ltsp-build-client?
09:00
<Gadi>
as in not an update from 9.04
09:01
hehe - maybe this is just easier:
09:01
palichis1: do: sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp/i386; sudo ltsp-build-client --arch i386
09:02
and get some coffee
09:02
:)
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09:06
<palichis>
Gadi: sbalneav: tanks it's run.. I run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys; sudo ltsp-update-image
09:07
<Peste_Bubonica>
hi all... ive finished the installation of ltsp, and the guest machines are booting sucefully
09:07
<alkisg>
Peste_Bubonica: what did you do with the RPL thing?
09:07
<Peste_Bubonica>
after load, the x server starts, and comes a blue screen, with ltsp.org information, asking by login...
09:08
alkisg, nope.. does not works... the rpl daemon for linux is very old... the last version is about 2001
09:08
alkisg, it not compiles.. :(
09:08
<alkisg>
Ah :(
09:08
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, anyway, ive replaced de rom of my ethernet card
09:08
with success
09:08
<alkisg>
Heh, nice ;)
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09:08
<alkisg>
Now you can boot even from http!
09:08
<Peste_Bubonica>
now, I have a SiS900 with a gPXE loader builtin... totally diskless
09:09
im using tftp
09:09
:)
09:09
but yes... is possible to build a rom with this support
09:09
alkisg, the problem, is... i cant do anything on the system...
09:09
i cant login with any user...
09:09
ive created one, but when I loging, the X restarts, and ask for login again
09:11
<alkisg>
"ive created one" ==> on the server, not on the chroot, right?
09:13
<Peste_Bubonica>
on the chroot
09:13
it is wrong?
09:13
<alkisg>
No you should use a "server" user to logon
09:14
<Peste_Bubonica>
hmmmmmm
09:14
<alkisg>
No users should be created on the chroot
09:14
<Peste_Bubonica>
im newbe... sorry by this... let me try!
09:15
alkisg, if I wanna use a gnome, or windowmaker window manager, I need install it on the chroot right?
09:15
<alkisg>
Nope. Everything goes on the server
09:15
So if e.g. you have installed the server using the ubuntu server CD, you won't be able to logon
09:15
You'll need to install ubuntu-desktop on the server first.
09:16
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, im using gentoo
09:17
<alkisg>
Sorry, but I hope you get what I mean
09:17
<Peste_Bubonica>
understood... sure :)
09:17
<alkisg>
You need an environment on the server
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09:18
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, the chroot enviroment is used for what so?
09:19
only to give a user a system that can be connected to the server?
09:19
<alkisg>
Yes
09:19
With one exception: localapps. If one has very strong clients, he can install more apps on the chroot.
09:19
(that's more advanced stuff, for later ;))
09:19
<Peste_Bubonica>
is because that that I cant login on X... i dont heve xorg-x11 on the server... only in chroot
09:20
<alkisg>
(but well if you use gentoo I don't think you'll find localapps difficult :D)
09:20
<Peste_Bubonica>
many thanks by tips... im compiling a xorg now... for tests...
09:20
<alkisg>
Good luck!
09:20
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, I hope so :)...
09:20
thanks by the patience with a newbe
09:21
a newbe with a horrible english :P
09:22
<alkisg>
Don't worry we're many people here that we're newbies _and_ speak horrible english :D
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09:25
<sbalneav>
alkisg: btw, I patched supybot last night, drevil's back in business.
09:25
<alkisg>
!s
09:25
<ltspbot>
alkisg: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
09:25
<alkisg>
Yeah!!!!! ;)
09:25
<sbalneav>
ltspbot: status
09:25
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: I am connected to freenode as ltspbot.
09:25
<sbalneav>
!karma
09:25
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Highest karma: "jammcq" (8192), "sbalneav" (7), and "dtrask" (7). Lowest karma: "Ahmuck" (1), "moxie" (1), and "brendan" (1). You (sbalneav) are ranked 2 out of 14.
09:26
<FrozenZia>
Peste - probably no help, don't know, but I just got my 1st thin client working minutes ago. I installed edubuntu 9.10 with LTSP server option on machine A with 2 network cards, then took machine B on the same network and booted it via NetworkBoot -- it automagically started LTSP and asked 4 username. I created a user on the server, then used that username/pw to log on to machine B - it just worked! (sorry, but I was amazed)
09:26
<alkisg>
!sbalneav++
09:26
!karma sbalneav
09:26
<ltspbot>
alkisg: Karma for "sbalneav" has been increased 8 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 8.
09:26
<alkisg>
!karma sbalneav++
09:26
<ltspbot>
alkisg: sbalneav++ has neutral karma.
09:26
<alkisg>
Urm... :(
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09:27
<sbalneav>
there's no relationship between the userids. any "thing" can have karma
09:27
so you just asked for the karma of "sbalneav++"
09:27
ltspbot: karma LOL
09:27
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: LOL has neutral karma.
09:29
<alkisg>
But how can I give you a karma point for fixing supybot?
09:30
<sbalneav>
You did
09:30
with the !sbalneav++
09:31
karma adds are silent
09:31
!alkisg++
09:31
!karma alkisg
09:31
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Karma for "alkisg" has been increased 1 time and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 1.
09:31
<alkisg>
Aaah!!! ok :)
09:31
<sbalneav>
Have a karma
09:31
<alkisg>
!alkisg--
09:31
<ltspbot>
alkisg: Error: You're not allowed to adjust your own karma.
09:32
<sbalneav>
karma karma karma karma karma chameleon
09:32
you come and go
09:32
you come and goooooooo
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09:32
<alkisg_karma>
!alkisg--
09:32
<alkisg>
!karma
09:32
<ltspbot>
alkisg: Highest karma: "jammcq" (8192), "sbalneav" (8), and "dtrask" (7). Lowest karma: "alkisg" (0), "Ahmuck" (1), and "moxie" (1). You (alkisg) are ranked 15 out of 15.
09:32
<sbalneav>
Lovin was easy if your colours were like my dreams
09:32
<alkisg>
;)
09:32
<sbalneav>
red gold and green
09:32
red gold and green
09:33
<alkisg>
8192??? someone's stealing...
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09:33
<sbalneav>
I caught some miscreant doing a -- on jammcq
09:33
I'm sorry, but there's just some things I won't stand for :)
09:34
and jammcq gets infinite karma for starting LTSP
09:34
Hey, I gotta get SOME perks for running the bot :)
09:34* alkisg wonders and which number the karma overflows and goes back to negative numbers... :D
09:34
<alkisg>
*at
09:34
<sbalneav>
well, it uses sqlite for the db
09:35
so, I think the karma's a 32 bit integer.
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09:36
<sbalneav>
Hey Chuck
09:37
How's the new abode coming?
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09:40
<squarepeg>
trimming..
09:41
on the phone..
09:42* lupine_85 lols hard at the way ltsp-localapps talks to ltsp-localappsd
09:42
<lupine_85>
talk about awesome
09:42
<squarepeg>
mt wife is painting stuff before it goes up..
09:43
yes he is
09:43
Gadi Rocks too 8~)
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09:45
<sbalneav>
lupine_85: You mean via the X atoms?
09:45
<lupine_85>
yeah
09:45
makes me :D
09:45Brian_H has quit IRC
09:46
<sbalneav>
Well, it's a simple solution to the problem.
09:46
<lupine_85>
oh, absolutely
09:46Selveste1_ has joined #ltsp
09:46
<lupine_85>
and I don't really know enough about x properties to say whether it's a good idea or not
09:47
it just struck me as funny
09:48* lupine_85 is just cleaning up and finalising our brand-new 'desk4' - LTSP server for 10 people
09:48shawnp0wers has joined #ltsp
09:48
<sbalneav>
they're just a way to store arbitrary bits of information in the X server's memory.
09:48
<lupine_85>
it's been such a smooth setup, it's awesome
09:48
<sbalneav>
they mostly get used for storing properties for windows, etc.
09:49
but they can be used for literally anything. And since they can... we did.
09:49
<lupine_85>
aye
09:49* lupine_85 packs firefox, flash and java into the ltsp chroot, calls it a day
09:52
<tarzeau>
heh
09:52
lupine_85: you use ltsp with nfs homes?
09:52
<sbalneav>
I do.
09:52
<tarzeau>
lupine_85: ff 3.5.3?
09:52
sbalneav: so do we. does it crash often for you?
09:52Brian_H has joined #ltsp
09:53
<tarzeau>
did someone install thunderbird 3.x yet?
09:53
<lupine_85>
tarzeau: not really sure. and 3.5, ayer
09:53
<sbalneav>
does *what* crash? NFS? the LTSP server?
09:54
<tarzeau>
sbalneav: firefox
09:54
<lupine_85>
ah, no. We use sshfs
09:54
<sbalneav>
tarzeau: no, not really.
09:54
<lupine_85>
presumably that could end up being a bottleneck...
09:54
<sbalneav>
every once in a while. But we don't use a lot of flash, which is the biggest troublemaker.
09:56Selveste1 has quit IRC
09:56
<tarzeau>
ok
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10:10
<dro>
Ok guys I am having sound issues today with a different type of box
10:10Selveste1_ has quit IRC
10:10
<dro>
the other day Gadi suggested that I run: sudo ltsp-localapps xterm and in the xterm session type "alsamixer -c0" except ubuntu doesn't use alsamixer so I tried gnome-alsamixer but that little program isn't working
10:11
is there a way to find out what audio channels are being used so i can control the volume of them in lts.conf ?
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10:12
<sbalneav>
dro: Why not just install alsamixer in the chroot
10:13
<dro>
sbalneav: i tried sudo apt-get install alsamixer but that was invalid, so thats why I tried gnome-alsamixer
10:13
<sbalneav>
are you SURE alsamixer isn't there by default?
10:13
<dro>
trying to run alsamixer gives me a file not found error
10:14
<sbalneav>
then THAT would indicate that sound's not even loaded on that workstation
10:14Patina has joined #ltsp
10:15
<sbalneav>
probably the sound card's not being detected.
10:16
<dro>
when I don't use a lts.conf the sound works great
10:16
but my lts.conf uses a rdesktop screen script, so I need to figure out which audio channel it's using to set the volume
10:16
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, it does no run yet...
10:17
<dro>
so far I've tried VOLUME=100 and HEADPHONE_VOLUME=100 which has worked for all my other stations
10:17
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, I need to have a running xorg config on the server? like video configuration, this things?
10:17Patina has quit IRC
10:17
<alkisg>
Peste_Bubonica: no, the files are only needed for the clients
10:17
But for gentoo, johnny is your man ;)
10:17Patina has joined #ltsp
10:18
<Peste_Bubonica>
alkisg, :)...
10:19
johnny, are you there?
10:19
alkisg, only one more thing... my ltsp server is a XEN domU
10:19
it can change anything?
10:20
<alkisg>
I don't think so, but then again, I've never used xen - others here have, though, so wait for more experienced persons...
10:21staffencasa has joined #ltsp
10:21
<Peste_Bubonica>
ok... many thanks again alkisg
10:21
<dro>
alkisg: wanted to let you know that my 9.10 proxydhcp setup is working like a champ
10:22
<alkisg>
dro: nice! is the wiki page ok?
10:22
<dro>
alkisg: the fix for ltsp-update-kernels I believe is wrong, I haven't checked since you last updated it
10:22ogra has joined #ltsp
10:23
<dro>
alkisg: I say it's wrong not because I tried it, but because you told me it was wrong lol and to use something different
10:23
<alkisg>
Ah ok, the new version should be ok
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11:10
<Peste_Bubonica>
how can I configure a window manager default for the users? With the default configs, im getting only the Pure X on start
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11:18
<FrozenZia>
Ok, I had my very 1st client up and running just fine, I *think* the only change I made to the server was to install iTalc, went to restart the client, and now it can't get the tftp connection to work...?
11:19
I'm getting this "PXE-E11- ARP timeout" message.
11:20
<sbalneav>
Do you have another dhcp server on your network that may be serving the thin client an address, but not the tftp files?
11:20
<FrozenZia>
Do I need to do ltsp-update-image after every change to the server?
11:20
sbalneav: yes, that's possible.
11:20
<sbalneav>
No, shouldn't need to.
11:20
<FrozenZia>
Or rather, yes, there is.
11:21
I guess I need to add something in the dhcp.conf file of the other server 2 tell it 2 leave this thin client alone?
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11:23
<sbalneav>
The typical way that *I* recomment to people is to use 2 nics in an ltsp server. One that connects to your backbone infrastructue, and one that serves your thin clients on it's own switch.
11:24
that way, you never have to get duelling dhcp servers.
11:25
<FrozenZia>
I actually *have* 2 nics, but am using the same switch right now -- was just trying things out (possibly causing headaches all over our smallish network...)
11:26
<sbalneav>
s/possibly/almost certainly/g :)
11:26
<FrozenZia>
=o)
11:27
*short* of investing in a new switch, is there a "good" way to do this?
11:27
<lupine_85>
we use a single DHCP server - it's not the one on the LTSP server :D
11:27
you can use option next-server to get the LTSP clients booting
11:29
<sbalneav>
"Investing"? A 24 port dlink switch is like, $150 :) But yeah, buggering about with your existing dhcp server to set the next-server option's the only "other" way to do it.
11:29
<lupine_85>
(mind you, all our LTSP clients and other machines are in the same IP subnet and on the same LAN. all publicly addressable)
11:29
well, except that there's a firewall in the way
11:30
really no need to have two DHCP servers, or two NICs
11:30
(mind you, if you don't have gigabit, you could end up flooding the LAN that way)
11:31
<sbalneav>
I'd say there is.
11:32
<lupine_85>
what does it get you?
11:32
<sbalneav>
X is a very "chatty" protocol. Lots and lots of small packets.
11:32
Your regular data network's probably trying to send nice big stuff, like NFS packets, HTTP, file transfers, etc.
11:33
By moving thie thin clients off onto their own switch, you isolate all that traffic on it's own collision domain.
11:33
<lupine_85>
well, if your infrastructure can't handle it (read: cheap switches, and/or 100mbit internet, and/or not Qos), then trying to put it on will lead to problems, yes
11:34
<sbalneav>
That description accounts for better than 90% of all people who try LTSP
11:34
<FrozenZia>
so for instance (I'm still reading/learning) - could I not disable the dhcp on the ltsp server, let the "normal" dhcp server assign the ip address, then use pxelinux.cfg to..... (hmmm, not enuf info to form coherent question... perhaps I should keep reading...)
11:35
<lupine_85>
FrozenZia: you'd have the one DHCP server that gives your LTSP clients and other clients an IP address, then also tells the LTSP clients to get a TFTP boot from another server - the LTSP one. the boot proceeds from there
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11:36
<FrozenZia>
ok - so "next-server" just tells the client "fine, you have your address, now go bother that guyover there for the rest of the info you want...."?
11:36
<lupine_85>
ayeaye
11:36
sbalneav: our office network (plain gigabit, halfway decent switches) handles VoIP, ten busy developers and LTSP without breaking a sweat.
11:38
sbalneav: since we have a star toplogy with duplex ethernet, we also have no collision domains as far as I'm aware
11:38
at least, if memory serves. it's been 8 years or so
11:38
<FrozenZia>
And disabling the dhcp server portion of the ltsp server is done how?
11:38
And thanks for the thoughts on network configuration!
11:39
<lupine_85>
generally you'd just do /etc/init.d/dhcpd (or dhcp3-server) stop then remove it from the default runlevel's setup
11:39
(/etc/rc2.d or /etc/rc5.d)
11:39
<FrozenZia>
right. tx.
11:39
<lupine_85>
check with your distribution to be sure
11:40
some setups will have the LTSP clients on one (private or double-NAT) IP subnet and the LTSP server and other machines on another (public or single-NAT)
11:40
I'm not sure how you'd play with that setup with a single DHCP server, and I'd not want to
11:41* lupine_85 wonders if you still get bus networks outside of the usual decades-old educational establishments with no IT budgets
11:42
<FrozenZia>
Is the ltsp server suppsed to be running tftpd?
11:42
<lupine_85>
yep
11:43
that's how it provides the initial kernel and stuff (and what the next-server in the dhcp response points at)
11:43
<FrozenZia>
'cuz one of the 1st things I tried was to restart it, and got a message that the daemon is disabled.
11:43
(tftpd-hpa)
11:43
<lupine_85>
that's what I have, yeah
11:43
<korcan>
anyone using karmic yet?
11:43* lupine_85 probably still counts as a rank ltsp amateur, incidentally
11:44
<lupine_85>
korcan: just finished upgrading the office ltsp network to it:)
11:44
<korcan>
what is the prefered method to upgrade? apt-get dist-update?
11:44
lupine_85, any issues?
11:44
<lupine_85>
well, we didn't upgrade
11:44
got new hardware, installed onto that, migration is in progress
11:44
<korcan>
lupine_85, fresh install?
11:44
<lupine_85>
no, none. remarkably easy to set up
11:44
yeah
11:44
well. the thin clients don't seem to shut down properl
11:45
they turn off the nbd mount before they issue the hardware reboot commands by the looks of it
11:45
<alkisg>
FrozenZia: tftp is started from inetd in Ubuntu. To see if tftp is running, do: netstat -nap | grep :69
11:45
<korcan>
lupine_85, what are you using for thin clients?
11:45
<lupine_85>
random machines
11:45
we're planning on moving to nVidia ION-powered clients at some point
11:46
(we tried some via openchrome/unichrome devices at one point - never again!)
11:46
awful chipset is awful
11:47
<FrozenZia>
alkisg: tx - found it!
11:47
<alkisg>
FrozenZia: also, there's a way to use a different dhcp server without specifying next-server: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
11:47
We use it in many schools here.
11:47
<korcan>
lupine_85, look at the intel atom boards we built our own with the intel johnstontown boards (Dual video)
11:47
<lupine_85>
ah, good old dnsmasq :D
11:48
<alkisg>
Yeah, Simon rocks ;)
11:48
<lupine_85>
korcan: the nVidia ION stuff uses Atom CPUs - and we sell Atom 330s as a hosting platform
11:48
Atom = win :)
11:48
<korcan>
nice :)
11:48
<lupine_85>
('though I'd still rather be trying to sell ARM hosting. nobody would buy it though, I suspect)
11:49
<korcan>
anyone do a dist-upgrade yet to karmic?
11:50
<alkisg>
Not me personally, but I've heard of many teachers here who did.
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13:16
<Peste_Bubonica>
Anyone already have problems halting or rebooting the clients? I got this error: INIT: no more processes left in this runlevel
13:16
and so, I need to reset the client
13:16
some process of halt is done, like down some daemons, but ive got an error on savecache, and latter, this message
13:17vagrantc has joined #ltsp
13:20
<sbalneav>
I beleive there's a patch that's in the works for this.
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13:29
<Peste_Bubonica>
sbalneav, it is happening in a distro specifically?
13:29
sorry by this english
13:30Egyptian[Home] has quit IRC
13:31
<Gadi>
Peste_Bubonica: are you talking about from the ldm login screen?
13:31Egyptian[Home] has joined #ltsp
13:31
<Gadi>
or more generally?
13:36
<Peste_Bubonica>
Gadi, even when I try to restart or shutdown
13:36
my logins is working fine now
13:36
:)
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13:37
<Gadi>
Peste_Bubonica: well, there is a current bug in ldm that it uses "poweroff -p" and "reboot -p" instead of "poweroff -fp" and "reboot -fp"
13:38
the former cause a normal shutdown sequence through init
13:38
the latter perform a forced halt/reboot
13:38
you want the latter
13:39
<Peste_Bubonica>
sorry... but, what is the latter?
13:39
"latter"
13:39alexqwesa_ is now known as alexqwesa
13:39
<Gadi>
former = first one
13:39
latter = last one
13:40
in other words, "-p" => goes through init
13:40
<dro>
Peste_Bubonica: here is a smiley that explain: 1<x( 2>)
13:40
<Gadi>
"-fp" => simply halts/reboots the system
13:40
<dro>
the 1st one is a x cuz it tastes bad, and the 2 is a pacman eating the 2
13:41
<Peste_Bubonica>
Gadi, oh... sorry... I dont know some terms...
13:41
Gadi, many thanks... it works...
13:41
Gadi, exist some way to fix it? changing some script on ldm?
13:42
<Gadi>
you need to grab the source
13:42
and recompile
13:42
its in greeter.c
13:42
<Peste_Bubonica>
oh... my chroot enviroment was builded by a script on gentoo...
13:42
but i will try
13:45* Lns wakes up from underneath the buffet table
13:47Ahmuck_ has joined #ltsp
13:48
<Ahmuck_>
i've got an unusual problem. i have users that are in /media and it doesn't appear they are bieng released after logout. their folders are there
13:50
usb camera's are not mounting in ubuntu ltsp 9.10
13:50
<Gadi>
users dont live in /media
13:50
only their media
13:51
<Ahmuck_>
i assume this may be all devices in usb?
13:51
<Gadi>
usb cameras have 2 modes: "usb storage" and PTP
13:51
only the former will currently work
13:51
<Ahmuck_>
Gadi: their media? so if every user creates media, a folder will be listed there indefinitely?
13:52
<ogra>
Gadi, liar
13:52
<Ahmuck_>
prior to 9.10, iirc, the usb cameara used to mount
13:52
<ogra>
ogra@osiris:~$ ls /media/sofa/
13:52
couchpotato
13:52
<Ahmuck_>
/media/someone will always be there if they have media?
13:53
<Gadi>
Ahmuck_: hmm... actually, no it should be cleaned - if we still run ltspfsmounter all cleanup
13:53
do the users logout cleanly?
13:53
<Ahmuck_>
hrm, it doesn't appear to be happening. could this be because of improper logout/shutdown
13:53
<ogra>
no
13:53
<Ahmuck_>
Gadi: not always. sometimes they just use the on/off button
13:54
<ogra>
then they keep the dirs
13:54
<Ahmuck_>
this would be expected user behavior
13:54
<ogra>
add a cron script
13:54
<Ahmuck_>
so improper logout would keep the dir in /media?
13:54
<ogra>
yes
13:55
<Ahmuck_>
is there a way to add this to an ltsp installation as an automatic feature?
13:55
<ogra>
the last thing ldm does on logout is umounting the local devices
13:55
if you just kill ldm by pulling the plug it cant do that
13:55
as i said, write a cronscript that checks /media against logged in users
13:55
<Ahmuck_>
does the server know if the user is logged in or not based on random pings to client?
13:56
<ogra>
the server does know it with the who or w command
13:56
<Ahmuck_>
i wouldn't know how to write a cron script
13:57
<Gadi>
Ahmuck_: before you go too crazy, what is the problem with a bunch of extra empty directories?
13:57
aside from the poor housekeeping awards
13:57
<Ahmuck_>
it's annoying. /media is used for usb camera, usb devices, etc. on the server side
13:57
<Gadi>
;)
13:58
<Ahmuck_>
though i've began to wonder if this might be part of the problem with users unable to start firefox
13:58
<Gadi>
dont you usually access those thru Places -> Computer?
13:58
<Ahmuck_>
on the server, yes
13:58
<Gadi>
or do you actually browse to /media?
13:58
<Ahmuck_>
unfortunately, those the camera is not mounting on the client
13:59
i do
13:59
<Gadi>
ah, ok
13:59
yeah, so an hourly cron job might do you some good
14:00
<Ahmuck_>
Gadi, one of the issues i noticed is that even if the client logs back in, and then out the directory is still there. this makes me wonder if this is what's causing firefox to refuse to open with a statement that it is already open
14:00
<Gadi>
are the dirs mounted or just empty?
14:01
<Ahmuck_>
it doesn't appear their mounted, as i've tried to umount them. as far as empty, i've only tried to access them user side, and they are locked
14:02
<ogra>
Ahmuck, FF doesnt do anything in /media
14:02
<Gadi>
right
14:02
<ogra>
that cant affect it
14:02
<Ahmuck_>
it appears that there are cdrom and floppy directories there
14:02* Gadi has had wonky cases on his home PC where firefox will be running but have no window open
14:02* CAN-o-SPAM too
14:03
<Gadi>
usually when the kids are doing flash things with popups
14:03
<CAN-o-SPAM>
ive had trouble with thunderbird acting similarly, won't populate the window
14:03
<Ahmuck_>
Gadi: does this persist after loging out and logging back in?
14:03
<Gadi>
the firefox thing? I dunno - I usually open a terminal and do a pkill firefox
14:04
kids are the most demanding of users
14:04
;)
14:04
<Ahmuck_>
pkill by name?
14:04
<Gadi>
what dya mean?
14:04
<ogra>
unlikely that it could survive a killed X server
14:05
so logout would clean it in Gadis case
14:05
<Gadi>
right
14:05
<Ahmuck_>
a reboot doesn't clear it
14:05
server reboot
14:05
<Gadi>
in your case?
14:05
<ogra>
a server reboot doesnt clear running processes ?
14:06
<Ahmuck_>
yes
14:06
<Gadi>
hold the phone
14:06
<Ahmuck_>
a server reboot won't clear the firefox hangup
14:06
<Gadi>
is it a firefox localapp?
14:06
<Ahmuck_>
um, i'd have to check. i don't recall
14:07
<Gadi>
thats the only way I could see the process hanging around - if its on a machine that isnt actually turned off
14:07
;)
14:07
<Ahmuck_>
heh, all the machines get turned off
14:07
it goes away after about 3 days
14:07
<Gadi>
ok, so thats weird
14:08FrozenZia has joined #ltsp
14:08
<ogra>
sounds like a /tmp issue or so
14:09
<Ahmuck_>
i've just been providing alternate logins
14:09
<FrozenZia>
Hullo again - trying to get my next-server line right in my dhcp server, so that it sends my client to the right tftp server...
14:10
currently have something like:
14:10
next-server 192.168.0.154;
14:10
option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386";
14:10
if substring( option vendor-class-identifier, 0, 9 ) = "PXEClient" {
14:10
filename "opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0";
14:10
} else {
14:10
filename "opt/ltsp/i386/boot/nbi.img";
14:10
}
14:11
<Ahmuck_>
pastebin
14:11
<FrozenZia>
Doesn't seem to be working
14:11
<Gadi>
FrozenZia: yuck - you have tftp server serving up the rootfs of the server?
14:11
give me the IP, I'll take ur porn for free
14:12
<Ahmuck_>
btw, i just deleted the folders in the /media directory
14:13
<Gadi>
Ahmuck_with rmdir?
14:19
<vmlintu>
Are there any pulseaudio tweaking examples around? I'm trying to figure out where to start to change the alsa channel on the thin client that is controlled by gnome-volume-control-appet. Now it control's Master channel, but I'd need it to control Master Mono or Master and Master Mono at the same time..
14:22
<Ahmuck_>
Gadi: sudo nautalis
14:22
click, delete
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14:50
<fasthans>
hi. any positiv or negativ experience with LTSP under karmic 9.10
14:51
I still have a problem with a cups printer under 9.04 that is showing up only after 15 seconds on the clients
14:52
<Ahmuck_>
what printer?
14:52
<fasthans>
an HP network printer
14:52
<Ahmuck_>
using hplip?
14:52
<fasthans>
I am not sure
14:52
<Ahmuck_>
sudo aptitude search hplip
14:53
<fasthans>
when the client starts gimp as localapp and wants to print, the printer dialog shows this printer only after about 15 seconds
14:53
I cannot test now. the server is at school.
14:54
could it be a routing problem?
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15:10
<rjune>
!seen jammcq
15:10
<ltspbot>
rjune: jammcq was last seen in #ltsp 2 days, 0 hours, 25 minutes, and 1 second ago: <jammcq> sbalneav: how about you and I go to Dallas to UDS and bang a few heads together?
15:16
<_UsUrPeR_>
-hey all. I'm working with the ltsp-cluster server installation instructions for 9.10 located at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSP-Cluster
15:16
and I'm having a problem starting nbd server
15:16
here's a pastebin to the error: http://pastebin.com/m1d9140e9
15:16
can anybody point me in the right direction?
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15:19
<FrozenZia>
Ok, help a fool? 2 network cards in my ltsp server - how do I determine which address is serving up the tftp?
15:19
<_UsUrPeR_>
FrozenZia: it's all determined in /etc/ldap/dhcpd.conf
15:20
though technically tftp should be working on both interfaces....
15:20
<FrozenZia>
Or perhaps in /etc/inetd.conf in my case? (Edubuntu 9.10)
15:21
<Gadi>
_UsUrPeR_: nbd-server should not run as a service - it is run out of inetd
15:21
FrozenZia: tftpd also runs out of inetd and will serve up on all interfaces
15:23
_UsUrPeR_: do not run the nbd-server service - keep it off -> if you cannot reach the NBD server, then your inetd is screwed up - did you happen to accidentally install xinetd?
15:23
<FrozenZia>
Still having next-server issues, and at this point am not sure which address to put there, 'cuz everything looks right, but it's still not working.
15:23
<Gadi>
FrozenZia: did you fix what you pasted earlier?
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15:23
<FrozenZia>
Yeah.
15:23
<Gadi>
!pastebot
15:23
<ltspbot>
Gadi: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
15:23
<_UsUrPeR_>
Gadi: have been following along with the instructions here https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSP-Cluster
15:24
Gadi: so no. I have not installed xinetd... unless it came in a package I did not notice.
15:24* _UsUrPeR_ checks dpkg
15:24
<Gadi>
_UsUrPeR_: you mean the ones that include: sudo update-rc.d -f nbd-server remove
15:25
;)
15:25
<_UsUrPeR_>
:O
15:28
<Gadi>
which reminds me.... Go Yankees!
15:28
:D
15:28
bbiab
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15:32
<alkisg>
FrozenZia: did you put the clients on a seperate switch?
15:33
Or do you use a different dhcp server than the ltsp server?
15:33
<FrozenZia>
alkisg: no, don't have the seperate switch. I shut down dhcpd on the LTSP server, and
15:34
am trying to use next-server option...
15:34
<alkisg>
So if you install tftp-hpa (*not* the daemon) and try to get a file from the server with tftp, does it work?
15:34
<adrienn>
hello everyone! Can you help me figuring out why the option "MOUNT_LOCAL_REAL_HOME" in lts.conf doesn't respect the rights on the files? If I want to open a file in a localapp vlc, I have access to everybody's folders.
15:34
<alkisg>
(or, netstat -nap|grep :69)
15:36
<johnny>
perhpas an nfs option?
15:36
<FrozenZia>
alkisg: that netstat does show that it should be running.
15:38
<alkisg>
FrozenZia: so what settings do you have in that remote dhcp server? Can you upload the dhcpd.conf from there?
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<adrienn>
sorry johnny, where you answering my question?
15:53
<johnny>
yes
15:55
<adrienn>
I'm trying to understand the related script, and what it does is that it mounts the server home on top of the user one with this : sshfs -o allow_other,nonempty,ControlPath....
15:56
shouldn't that keep the rights on the folders?
15:57
<johnny>
not sure
15:57
you'll have to ask an expert i guess
15:57
/me pokes Gadi
15:58
<adrienn>
thank you for the advice ;-) I have to go though but I'll come back tomorrow if I'm still stuck.
16:05* Gadi has never seen that lts.conf param before
16:05
<Gadi>
must be a hack
16:05
:)
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<adrienn>
I found it in the doc : https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/GetMoreFromLocalApps
16:08
and I have to go ;-) Bye
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16:09
<Gadi>
a title like that would totally be flageed as spam
16:10
:)
16:10
More apps more pleasure
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16:10
<CAN-o-SPAM>
hah
16:11
<Lns>
Gadi: speaking of spam on the wiki, you mind taking your 3 month old promotion bit out of the "Hardware Resources" section? ;)
16:11
<Gadi>
:P
16:11
ok, but I mightscrew it up
16:11
<Lns>
i think you're smart enough to figure it out ;)
16:12* Gadi thinks you give him too much credit
16:13
<Lns>
haha.. always the humble one
16:13* Lns loves rebooting servers remotely...oh, the excitement and anticipation of seeing the "Login: " pop up!
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<Lns>
ty Gadi :)
16:15
Since you all declared me the "ubuntu ltsp wiki guy" I must enforce my trout-slapping upon all
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16:17* Gadi loves a good trout-slapping
16:19
<Lns>
awww, /slap doesn't work on xchat =p
16:19* Lns slaps Gadi with a large trout
16:19* CAN-o-SPAM cheers
16:19
<Lns>
damn..i need a script for that!
16:20* CAN-o-SPAM slaps Lns with a larger Michigan trout :)
16:20
<Lns>
fish scales hurt like bleeding!
16:21
<CAN-o-SPAM>
just dont reach in the pacific and throw one of those jellies at me
16:21
<Lns>
ha
16:21
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Lns: don't know if you surf, but i heard there was some 9' swells up around your area 2 weeks ago
16:21
<Gadi>
ok, so this whole thread has gone from the perverse to the bizarre
16:22
<Lns>
Gadi: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noodling ...hasn't even started. =p
16:22
CAN-o-SPAM: yeah, there were. Exciting times! But just not big enough...they just told us to stay away from the beach is all
16:22
<CAN-o-SPAM>
saw a tv special on that, i'd love to see it in person
16:23
<Lns>
wait, ' as in feet? nah...it was more like 2' i think
16:23
if you're talking about the waves from the earthquake not too long ago
16:23
<CAN-o-SPAM>
ah it might have been even more north than you
16:24
i was at San Onofre (socal) where they were 5' and b-e-a-utiful
16:24
<Lns>
wow, nice! I don't surf, always wanted to though
16:24
<CAN-o-SPAM>
but im back in MI and it's lookin like snow, so i better not get too excited
16:24
<Lns>
up here the water is so freggin cold it's hard to justify it ;)
16:24
<CAN-o-SPAM>
see ya'll later
16:24
wetsuit ;)
16:24
<Lns>
bye CAN-o-SPAM =)
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16:25* Lns gets back to configuring nagios
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16:36
<FrozenZia>
Alright - in case anyone was curious as to what happened with my next-server issue: seems I have some flaky hardware or something. I rebooted my LTSP server, and it came up sorta weird - didn
16:37
't recognize my other network card, but TFTP was answering again...
16:37
did another boot, and things looked a lot more normal -- the next-server thing seems to be working -- my client gets to the point where the little gray ubuntu logo is in the middle of the screen
16:38
at that point, though, nothing.
16:38
It just seems to hang there.
16:38
<johnny>
remove quiet and splash
16:38
from the pxelinux.cfg/default file
16:38
<FrozenZia>
why's it hang there?
16:39
<johnny>
remove those things i mentioned so you can see
16:40
<FrozenZia>
ah.
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16:51
<FrozenZia>
hmmm... well, not sure what to make of that...
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16:51
<FrozenZia>
we've got a kernel panic not syncing, before that a bad variable name...
16:56
<Gadi>
FrozenZia: in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
16:56
add: nbdroot=<ip_of_ltsp_server>:2000
16:56
to the end of the line
16:56
and reboot the client
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<FrozenZia>
Gadi: didn't seem to have any effect.
17:06
Last thing b4 things start going awry (I think) is along the lines of:
17:08
eth0 configured at 192.168.0.105:192.168.0.102:192.168.1.1:255.255.254.0:
17:10
' /init: export: line 14: [IP ADDR]: bad variable name
17:13
Oi, but I gotta get some sleep. =o( tx in advance if anyone can help out. This is a situation where I just set up a brand new LTSP server, just hooked it up and it worked, but I hadn't realized it was running a dhcp server, and that was causing problems with our other dhcp server. So I've disabled the dhcp daemon on the ltsp server, but am now having troubles getting the client to boot up.
17:14
That is to say, I already had the client working at least twice today, before I started trying to get rid of my duplicate dhcp server.
17:14
g'night!
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<sbalneav>
Evening all
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21:03
<sbalneav>
Quiet in here
21:03* sbalneav looks around
21:04
<sbalneav>
toooooo quiet....
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