IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 1 January 2009   (all times are UTC)

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07:03
<laga>
hey. does anyone know where /usr/lib/ltsp/configure-x.sh has gone in ubuntu and if there's a replacement? i suppose it got phased out in favor of configless X.
07:03
i used to call configure-x.sh from my mythbuntu-diskless init scripts, that's why i'm wondering
07:07
<warren>
laga: see ltsp-trunk, it was replaced
07:07
not a single script now
07:08
<laga>
thanks, i'll take a look
07:16
<ogra>
laga, we default to configless X now ...
07:17
to use the replacement scripts you need to force CONFIGURE_X=true
07:17
<laga>
hum
07:17
so i guess i can just remove the configure-x.sh call.
07:18
<ogra>
yes
07:18
<laga>
i'll look into the new scripts anyways.. but it's not that bad because our xorg.conf is persistent
07:19
<ogra>
even on new installs ?
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07:20
<laga>
ogra: oh. well, it's not if it's configless :) but if someone adds their own xorg.conf, it'll stay
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07:20
<ogra>
right
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07:20
<ogra>
but there is no mechanism in ubuntu that creates any meaningfull device or monitor entries anymore
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07:21
<laga>
ogra: vim. :)
07:22
and between hacking a config to include CONFIGURE_X=true and firing up nvidia-settings or vim, there shouldn't be a big difference for my users
07:22
i'll remove the call to configure-x.sh. wee :)
07:22
<ogra>
go ahead :)
07:22
happy new year btw
07:22
<laga>
thanks, frohes neues auch dir :)
07:23
<ogra>
danke :)
07:29
<laga>
ogra: i assume intrepid also had the same configless X setup?
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07:40
<njeudy>
hi ..
07:41
I'm french user and i try to install ltps-cluster on my server ..
07:41
but i have a problem . an someone help me ?
07:41
I have a conflict with ldm and ltsp-cluster-client
07:43
i use ubuntu intrepid for testing this.
07:50
<rjune_>
ogra: Happy New Year!
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08:41
<petre>
ogra, ping
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12:27
<petre>
warren, ping
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14:19
<D_Eagle>
i am trying to setup a ltsp server in ubuntu(8.04) (hardy), every thing went fine, but whenever i try to boot client computers, there occurs kernel panic in client computer
14:20
and when i tried thru my laptop, it ends into busybox
14:20
any idea?
14:21
I am the co-ordinator of setting up an e-library in rural area of Nepal... and i am stuck because of this problem here
14:22
<laga>
it'd help if you could capture the log messages
14:22
and the kernel panic
14:23
<D_Eagle>
log messages from syslog?
14:23
<laga>
from the client
14:23
<D_Eagle>
ok, a moment
14:24
/init: .: 1: can't open /tmp/net-eth0.conf
14:24
kernel panic - not synching: attempted to kill init!
14:28
<laga>
ah
14:28
it probably doesn't recognize the ethernet card then
14:29
<D_Eagle>
laga: also i tried in another computer (my laptop), and my laptop ends in busybox
14:30
<laga>
well, probably a different problem then on your laptop :)
14:30
i've gotta go, i hope someone else will be able to help you
14:31
<D_Eagle>
ya possibly
14:31
okay anyway thanx
14:31
:)
14:34
<alkisg>
D_Eagle: is it possible that you have another dhcp server running apart from the ltsp one?
14:34
e.g. a modem / router
14:35
<D_Eagle>
alkisg: no there isn't
14:35
<alkisg>
any error messages before entering busybox?
14:36
<D_Eagle>
in server syslog.. only thing it showed was "link down"
14:37
<alkisg>
I don't know, but I think you should try with a newer kernel. E.g. with Ubuntu 8.10...
14:38
<D_Eagle>
well there are few error msg before entering into busybox
14:39
<alkisg>
Like?
14:39
<D_Eagle>
filename: /ltsp/i386/nbi.img
14:39
Error: connect: connection refused
14:39
mount: Mounting /rofs on /root/rofs failed: Invalid arguement
14:40
<vagrantc>
sounds like nbdrootd might not be set up in /etc/inetd.conf
14:42
<alkisg>
D_Eagle: did you run ltsp-build-client?
14:42
<D_Eagle>
there is a line with "/urs/sbin/nbdrootd" in /etc/inetd.conf
14:42
yes
14:42
<vagrantc>
D_Eagle: pgrep -l -f inetd
14:42* vagrantc washes some clothes for the new year
14:43
<D_Eagle>
5056 /usr/sbin/xinetd -pidfile /var/run/xinetd.pid -stayalive -inetd_compat
14:44
vagrantc: this was the output i got
14:45
i solved the kernel panic problem by adding its ethernet model in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/initramfs-tools/modules, now it also ends in busy box
14:46
<johnny>
you shouldn't be running xinetd
14:46
<D_Eagle>
oh
14:49
i am rebuilding litsp client, hope it helps :)
14:49
johnny: thanks :) and happy new year 2009 !
14:57
<vagrantc>
D_Eagle: you just need to configure xinetd to do the same thing that /etc/inetd.conf does for nbdrootd ...
14:57
i think fedora uses xinetd by default ... could probably get an exampel from them
14:58
though i'm surprised xinetd and openbsd-inetd are allowed to co-exist
14:59
ah, it provides inet-superserver, which is an alternate dependency: openbsd-inetd | inet-superserver
14:59
we should probably just go ahead and ship xinetd configuration snippets...
14:59
well, at least i will do so for Debian :)
15:00
<D_Eagle>
well, i just removed xinetd.. ;) i am not sure which one to use
15:01
<vagrantc>
on Debian and probably ubuntu, openbsd-inetd is the preferred default daemon, though any that use /etc/inetd.conf should work
15:01
xinetd does something entirely different
15:02
<johnny>
i rely on the xinetd snippets
15:02
<vagrantc>
actually, xinetd behaves much more like debian services tend to be, with configuration snippets everywhere
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15:07
<D_Eagle>
ok now i got squashfs error, means i need to ltsp-update-image?
15:09
i am still getting squashfs errors :S
15:11
ok BrB
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15:17
<jammcq>
happy new year #ltsp
15:18
<vagrantc>
jammcq: huzzah!
15:19
<Ryan52>
happy new year, jammcq
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16:15
<TheProf>
Hello and Happy New Year! I hope everyone is well. I've set up a new LTSP server based on CentOS 5.2 and one thing I am stuck on is how to upgrade the stock OpenOffice from version 2.3 to version 3. I attempted following the guidelines online: download the zip from OO.org, unzip, go into the RPMS folder, and run rpm -Uvh *.rpm
16:15
However, I receive a bunch of errors as follows:
16:15
<johnny>
this isn't the right channel for that
16:15
join #centos
16:15
<TheProf>
java >= 1.4.2 is needed by (installed) openoffice.org-core-2.3.0-6.5.4.el5_2.i386
16:16
<johnny>
yes.. you would have to ask them
16:16
<jammcq>
it's not like this channel is too busy to help answer his questions
16:16
<TheProf>
johnny: I wasn't sure if the issue was because it was an ltsp server
16:16
<johnny>
no.. it isn't :)
16:16
<jammcq>
and there's plenty of folks in this channel who know about stuff like that
16:16
<johnny>
it's specific to t their packaging
16:16
<TheProf>
so it's multiple people running the same instance.
16:16
<jammcq>
and this channel has always tried to be helpful when possible about a whole range of things outside of the strict 'ltsp' topic
16:16
<TheProf>
This is very true :)
16:16
<johnny>
jammcq, you got an answer jammcq ?
16:17
<jammcq>
umm, nope
16:17
but, it doesn't annoy me that questions like that are asked
16:17
<johnny>
the centos people are more likely to be able to answer their packaging issues
16:18
<TheProf>
I guess my reasoning for asking here are two-fold:
16:18
1) I am still new enough to not be able to tell if a problem is LTSP-related or not.
16:18
<jammcq>
I'd say prolly 90% of the time I go looking for answers in a channel devoted to a specific topic, I get ignored.
16:18
<johnny>
if it has to do with any packaging
16:18
<TheProf>
2) I've found from past experience that the folks here are often more capable than in other channels by virtue of the fact that LTSP is something a little tricky
16:18
<johnny>
then it is not ltsp related
16:19
<TheProf>
But certainly I don't want to cause any issues so I'll jump over into CentOS and see what comes out of that.
16:19
<johnny>
you're not causing issues
16:19
<alkisg>
I installed OOo 3.0 in Intrepid. Worked fine for a week until some updates were downloaded from the internet which broke it... I had to uninstall it. And I didn't really see what the fuss is all about with OOo 3...
16:19
<johnny>
just that they are more likely to tell you how to find the java rpms and whatnot that you need
16:20
alkisg, the presenter mode is awesome
16:20
and did 2.3 support docx?
16:20
<alkisg>
yes, it did
16:20
<TheProf>
alkisg: for me the issue relates to the acceptance of the entire LTSP system.
16:21
<johnny>
they need OOo3?
16:21
<TheProf>
I'm converting a bunch of XP machines over to LTSP, so I need to make it as 'seamless' as possible.
16:21
<johnny>
why was 2.3 not good enough?
16:21
<TheProf>
My thinking was that it would interact with docx more
16:21
<alkisg>
Well, for me it didn't have anything to do with LTSP, it just broke (found some bugs in launchpad about problems with the packages)
16:21
<johnny>
alkisg, so it could be ubuntu specific?
16:21
<alkisg>
Sure, it's just packaging
16:22
But if centos also doesn't have official packages.... :)
16:22
<TheProf>
I sorta assumed that it would be more stable, run faster, etc. etc. Since it was a significant enough change for them to renumber it to version 3
16:22
<alkisg>
I heard that the number change was decided by the marketing team
16:22
<TheProf>
if that's the case it worked well :)
16:22
<alkisg>
Yeah! :D
16:23
<TheProf>
the end user isn't savvy enough to tell that their inability to do X or Y isn't due to the specific version of OO, but by the Linux OS itself.
16:23
<stgraber>
TheProf: hmm, and what about KDE4 (4.0) ? was it more stable, faster, ... ? :)
16:23
<johnny>
TheProf, things won't be seamless if you maintain OOo
16:23
<TheProf>
So to mitigate against that I thought to upgrade to the latest and greatest.
16:23
<johnny>
outside of the packaged rpms
16:23
you're more likely to cause issues for your users
16:23
<TheProf>
stgraber: I'm still waiting for E 17 to be developed :)
16:24
<johnny>
lol e17
16:24
<stgraber>
version number are usually either marketing thing or due to a massive rewrite, in the first case it usually makes no difference and in the second it's usually worse (at least at the beginning) :)
16:24
<TheProf>
johnny: that's a fair point.
16:24
<jammcq>
when was e16, like 8 years ago?
16:24
<johnny>
TheProf, i'd suggest having a couple users beta test it
16:24
<TheProf>
yup
16:24
<johnny>
instead of pre upgrading
16:24
until you're sure you need it
16:24
<TheProf>
If people have seen both versions, I guess the most crucial thing is support for the new Office 2007 filetypes.
16:25
<johnny>
until you can find official packages
16:25
<TheProf>
Is that supported anywhere?
16:25
<johnny>
you won't know until you open up typical documents
16:25
the outcome is different depending on the features used in the documents
16:25
<alkisg>
OOo 2.4 supports docx
16:25
<johnny>
i'd suggest trying 10-20
16:25
<TheProf>
johnny: are you referring to specific 2007 formatting or the entire filestructure?
16:25
alkisg: OK that's what I meant.
16:26
<johnny>
specific any formatting
16:26
for any office document
16:26
from 2000 on
16:27
you won't know if open office will fit your needs even for those documents until you try
16:27
<TheProf>
johnny: I understand.
16:27
<jammcq>
I see an interesting thing emerging in this conversation. a channel devoted to OOo would generally encourage people to upgrade to the latest version. But, here in #ltsp land, we've got the kind of in-the-trenches experience to guide people on the best way to go
16:27
<TheProf>
johnny: I wasn't clear if it would even open a .docx file
16:27
<jammcq>
the OOo channel would never tell you to NOT use version 3.0
16:27
<johnny>
alkisg just said 2.4 will
16:27
jammcq, sure they would.. if it is related to native packaging
16:27
<TheProf>
Yes that's where I got the answer
16:27
<johnny>
native packaging is always preferred
16:28
otherwise people can screw up the install too easy
16:28
and cause even more issues
16:28
<jammcq>
but is native packaging of 3.0 better than native packaging of 2.4 ?
16:28
and take stgraber's comment about kde 4.0
16:28
apply all the native packaging you want to 4.0 and it's still a long way from being anything near stable
16:29
kde that is
16:29
<johnny>
sure.. but the kde project said that 4.0 wasn't meant for end users
16:29
the openoffice people say that 3.0 is
16:29
<jammcq>
the people here are generally involved in total deployment issues and have a better sense of what makes a successful deployment in the real world
16:29
<alkisg>
I think OOo 3.0 is stable enough, there weren't any biiiig changes to justify instability, like kde 3 => kde 4...
16:29
<TheProf>
Just did as was recommend and downloaded a test .docx file. Ends up that Centos 5.2 only has 2.3 in the repository
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16:29
<TheProf>
Ergo it will not open .docx
16:30
<jammcq>
whereas, if you have specific technical questiosn, then the official support channel would likely be better than here
16:30
but, back to my original comment... It sure doesn't bother me if people ask questions that aren't strictly #ltsp questions
16:31
<TheProf>
Another issue is that most people who are deploying LTSP often are new to linux entirely, like me.
16:31
I came across it specifically to resolve an issue of a lab in a school/church
16:31
so the learning curve was/is steep.
16:31
And I need to cater to a whole audience and their needs rather than just me.
16:32
<jammcq>
welp, i'm gonna go crawl back under my rock. have fun
16:32
<TheProf>
And, as someone once mentioned before, asking in the specific channel often is received with silence.
16:32
<johnny>
as it is often here
16:33
if you come at the wrong time
16:33
<TheProf>
That is understandable.
16:33
<johnny>
the real problem i have with these questions is not when it is quiet.. but specifically when it isn't :)
16:34
i hope you have personally installed linux on a standalone desktop ?
16:34
<TheProf>
Thanks to people's feedback here, I now know that I do need to upgrade the installation, but only to 2.4 not 3
16:34
johnny: Yes I have several times.
16:34
<johnny>
good
16:35
personally.. i don't trust centos or rhel.. packages are always too old for what my users expect
16:35
they may be super stable or whatever.. but they don't have the necessary features in the distro often
16:35
and then the upstream project wont support your super old release
16:35
<TheProf>
johnny: I actually had the lab running on FC6 or 5 for a long time. only upgraded to centos 5 last week.
16:35
<johnny>
ouch
16:35
<TheProf>
but of course it's a tradeoff based on the speed of how FC moves.
16:35
<johnny>
my uses would hate linux if they had to deal with software that old
16:35
and ugly
16:36
<TheProf>
and I'm not confident enough to be able to do big upgrades like version jumps -- if it ain't broke..etc.
16:36
so I waited til Christmas break backed up and wiped everything
16:37
So all that's left is this OO docx thing and I'm reading for school
16:37
<alkisg>
TheProf: I've opened a lot of .docx with my 2.4, so I'm sure about that. But I'm reading some comments on the internet saying that 2.3 also supports .docx. Did you right click on a .docx file and select "Open with Openoffice?"
16:37
e.g. http://www.formatds.org/openxml-docx-suport-in-openoffice/
16:37
<johnny>
or just open it the manual way .. :)
16:37
<TheProf>
alkisg: I did not no. I noticed that the system recognized the doc automatically. i will manually open it as you suggest
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16:39
<TheProf>
alkisg: I tried both right-click and manual open
16:39
it does not work
16:39
<alkisg>
ok
16:39
<TheProf>
it asks you for which filter to use
16:40
so it doesn't recognize that type.
16:40
<alkisg>
Probably packaging differences
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16:40
<alkisg>
(in the link I posted above there's a how-to for manual installation of the plugin for 2.3, but I guess it should be safer to go to 2.4...)
16:41
<TheProf>
alkisg: that was exactly what I was typing to ask you :)
16:42
<alkisg>
I don't have much experience with Linux, so don't take my advices too seriously! :P All I know is that 2.4 in Intrepid reads docx!
16:42
<TheProf>
good enough - I'll try to find the rpms for it and see what happens. at worst I can roll them back
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16:48
<TheProf>
2.4.2 is the most recent one prior to 3 - later on in 2008 so it probably handles .docx no problem
16:49
These things become as important as the LTSP setup itself for end user acceptance. Otherwise they lump 'my docx file won't open' with 'linux is horrible'-- a conversation I've had over and over.
16:49
<alkisg>
mine is: openoffice.org 1:2.4.1-11ubun OpenOffice.org Office suite
16:50
<TheProf>
hmm..it is possible since ubuntu is suppose to be very user friendly they may have packaged it with some sort of docx capability.
16:50
<alkisg>
Yeah, I know, but the funny thing is that they also complain about office 2003 not being able to read .docs ;)
16:51
<TheProf>
weird!
16:51
<alkisg>
Then I suppose you could follow the manual installation of the plugin
16:51
*.docx
16:51
<TheProf>
It's a big file so it's still downloading.
16:52
hopefully - the installation instructions are those for version 3
16:52
<alkisg>
Gotta go... good luck TheProf, and good night everyone.
16:53
<TheProf>
alkisg: thanks for the help
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16:57
<TheProf>
Can you believe it -- exact same error as before.
16:58
Doesn't seem to have anything to do with the version I'm upgrading to. Alright off to visit centos.
17:23
posted half hour ago but not a peep from the Centos folks. the channel seems dead.
17:24
maybe Openoffice has a channel?
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17:42
<johnny>
TheProf, try bak at different times
17:43
<TheProf>
johnny: Thanks. I am talking to someone in the OO channel so perhaps that will work.
17:44
<johnny>
uggh. i can't get cgit to wor k:(
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19:39
<TheProf>
So I posted in both CentOS and OpenOffice channels and got nothing.
19:39
not a peep from anyone in Centos - the channel might be closed for New Year's day :)
19:40
I knew there was a reason I came to this channel for Linux questions -- people generally here are able to resolve issues.
19:40
Even though Centos has over 300 people in it.
19:41
<johnny>
personally, i don't really see a reason to use centos
19:41
rhel perhaps..
19:41
due to the support
19:41
ubuntu stays a bit farther ahead of the game on the desktop side
19:42
i am using fedora10 right now tho
19:42
<TheProf>
johnny: from what I thought rhel and Centos were suppose to be identical
19:42
<johnny>
yeah.. except the support contracts
19:42
<TheProf>
of course - they need to cover their costs somehow.
19:42
<johnny>
sure.. just saying that's the only reason i'd ever use rhel
19:43
<TheProf>
the nice thing is that the ltsp system is fully integrated with Centos.
19:43
<johnny>
otherwise it seems better support is to be had with plain ubuntu
19:43
ubuntu was the first distro to have ltsp5
19:43
if it weren't for warren from fedora/redhat.. centos/rhel would have zero support :)
19:43
<TheProf>
yes it's still version 4-something with centos
19:44
<johnny>
that version is relatively unsupported
19:44
<TheProf>
I am a little lost now with what to do.
19:44
<johnny>
gentoo does not hardly even allow it, due to all the security issues
19:45
it will completely disappear from our repositories as soon as i can get ltsp5 merged in
19:45
<TheProf>
sure - having less versions to maintain is an excellent goal
19:45
<johnny>
nobody maintains ltsp4
19:45
as an upstream project
19:46
that is why it has security issues
19:46
<TheProf>
it's just the ease of dropping in a CD and booting up a fully-functional LTSP server with specific educational software already on it is hard to beat.
19:46
<johnny>
that's ubuntu
19:46
btw
19:46
or k12linux
19:46
<TheProf>
that's exactly what I'm using
19:46
k12linux
19:46
sorry if I wasn't clear
19:46
<johnny>
cuz you were talking about centos distributing ltsp4 :)
19:46
<TheProf>
the K12ltsp based on EL-5
19:47
<johnny>
aha
19:47
ok
19:47
don't the k12linux guys have hteir own channel?
19:47
or not?
19:47
maybe they just tell the people to come here now
19:47
as far as your problem.. your best bet would just be to come back later
19:47
like during the daytime :)
19:47
<TheProf>
i think they do yes. It's not as active and I think it's more about education with respect to ltsp. But it's a good idea to check it also
19:48
<johnny>
instead of fighting on
19:48
just come back when people are active
19:48
focus on other issues for now instead
19:48
<TheProf>
Sounds good - I will do so.
19:48
Thank you very much.
19:49
<johnny>
it seems all the serious education/business projects are most active during usa/europe business hours
19:50
<TheProf>
I thought to take a risk as it's a holiday so maybe people would be around
19:51
<johnny>
nope.. :)
19:51
even sites like slashdot are less active during holidays
19:51
guess even geeks have to visit their families :)
19:51
and get drunk
19:51
<TheProf>
:)
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<kingsley2>
Hi
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<kingsley3>
Ugh, more net problems. But, I'm back again.
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<Ryan52>
I thought bzr had a stash command...do I need to install somethin special?
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